>> this is "bloomberg technology." ♪ caroline: live from new york, i am caroline hyde. jackie code this is "bloomberg technology." caroline: government and tech leaders to say no pairs the ai summit as french resident mccall tells the companies very on stargate was a plus president

trump says elon musk joseph may have found "irregularities at the treasury department." tennis byd, -- china's byd. first, let's check in on the markets. the nasdaq which is higher but tesla is one of the points contributed to the downside. we will dig into what byd means for competition in china. nvidia lending is power to the points that moved to the higher side. we will dig into the ai track. move onto a key stock you have to watch. this is record high and 16% for 16 straight days. if we see meta hold onto these smaller gains, it would be 16 straight days of gains and a lot of it is fueled by a exuberance for meta. paris, all about ai. the summit is now underway, bringing together almost 100 countries and over 1000 private

sector and civil society representatives, including prime minister of india. we also have openai. this as francis said to announce a total of $113 million investments nai projects in the country. tom mackenzie is standing by. rather akin to stargate, about private sector commitments in france, tom. >> it is. if a fire had not been lit under the feet of policymakers in your prior to deepseek and stargate, it certainly has been in recent weeks. this is macron's response. currently have some from alphabet speaking. the commitment from macron around 113 billion u.s. dollars is in part an answer to stargate. it is also in part answer to the innovation now coming out of china and an attempt by france in europe to position itself to close the gap. macron has been clear, this is

catch up for europe. yesterday say we need to invest, invest, invest. along with the 100 $18 billion u.s., also a general catalyst driving plans for about $150 billion in say it kaput to play in france, in europe alongside other investors to drive and build out infrastructure to layer is well on top of the industrial sector of europe. that is where they think the opportunity is. key questions around implementation and regulation and whether or not we have the data, the chips, and the talent to really compete versus u.s. and china. jackie: this is an ambitious effort on behalf of the europeans but i am curious because they usually also have been those to be at the forefront of regulation, something that private companies and some investors don't really love. have you gotten a sense from the executives you have spoken to about how that balance is

playing out right now there? >> that is very much a live debate. to what extent europe should regulate when it comes to ai. it will start to take hold this year. it will be largely fully implemented by 2026. the door is open. to what extent they can tweak the regulation going forward is a question mark but clearly between europe's approach and u.s. approach, president trump ripping up ai regulation, is stark. some would say having the guardrails and place in europe is at least beneficial, at least there is the guardrails in place, at least there is a tract follow. you do have a disparate landscape in the u.s. of a state by that potentially could pose problems for u.s. ai companies trying to navigate the state-by-state regulation. the other question is to what extent you can leverage -- europe can leverage talent.

it does have software you talent, energy as well. we do not have semi conductors or companies like nvidia so that remains a challenge. but hoping at the end of the summit they come through the proposal that can meet some of the challenges and really get to grips on the implementation of this. jackie: that is tom mackenzie. thank you. something that came out of one of his interviews at the summit earlier today, the head of google's questioning the notion china's deepseek actually spent less than $6 million to develop its ai system. >> it is a very impressive model . i think the team is probably the best team i've seen come out of china. that said, i think a lot of the claims are exaggerated a little bit misleading. caroline: brad erickson for more on the ai landscape. the so-called race between u.s. and china. when you hear of deepseek, it

seems as though people are questioning the overall amount, therefore, do you like amazon committing to $100 billion come at microsoft more than 80, similar out of meta for example? >> i think for the moment, that the revenue growth to support those investments. people are right to question the long-term return on invested capital equation, which is really where the debate has shifted. i think for the moment, we are in this moment where we don't know how big this technology can become. i think we lean on those statements such as the risk of underinvestment is far greater than the risk of overinvestment. i think that is a prudent way for these companies to be treating this for the time. caroline: investors thus far giving them a pass. look at meta shares, shorten your 16 day run to the high. many say the commitment has been sinking -- the commitment to leading into ai even as the announcement who is to be hit by

the job cuts today. talk about some of the thesis around meta outperforming the other big tech players here. >> 16 game hitting streak is a pretty impressive. i would say meta is a two key things going for it. one, they have arguably the greatest amount of revenue coverage is what we call it. when you look at their marginal revenues, they tested $27 billion year-over-year in 2024 -- they just did $27 million year-over-year in 2024. that is the first part. the second part is they have a heck of a great narrative on all the ways ai can affect their products both now and in the future. i think the market, what the market is telling you right now is they really believe in meta's strategy nai giving it the most work to the upside in the future for this model. jackie: brad, i want to talk

about open source technology now that we are on the topic of meta . you highlight startups desire to want to build more end specific applications on top of already existing ai. i am curious how that shift is better for investors? are open-source companies better than close source companies? >> there's a debate as to whether the closed source guys actually do decide to open things up because the improvement of their models or improvement of distribution over time most of clearly, meta's open-source strategy -- i don't want to call it a wolf in sheep's clothing but there is an aspect where they are looking to leverage sort of developer intel of the world to be able to them potentially pull in those innovations in the model and use them for internal purposes, which would never see the light of day. that benefits their products longer-term. i do think that is definitely a

part of their strategy. it is smart from our perspective. i think that is at this point how they are leveraging open-source so well. like you said earlier, the market is really buying into that. jackie: one of the things were looking at closely as the paris ai summit. we have had a few of these summits over the last couple of years ever since chatgpt hit the scene. i am curious as an investor if anything that comes out of that really affects your long-term thesis? because we are talking about big sums of money being poured into the space now from the europeans. >> absolutely. it is kind of funny how this is following the history of tech. u.s. innovates, china replicates, and europe regulates. that is the famous saying. yeah, certainly from a sovereign ai perspective from the country's recognize there is a huge opportunity to modernize and make better use of the treasure trove of data they all

have posted on the flipside, there is civil society impact here. what does that you do jobs? does that make people more productive or straight up take jobs and remove or dislocate industries in an adverse way for macro economies? those are giant questions that are certainly being discussed. i think from this point, our perspective, where we are covering these internet names, they are making all the investments to push the industry and, frankly, the world forward with this innovation. we have to be behind it at this point. caroline: you get the infiltration not over -- only the large language models, but think of like interest numbers and how generative ai has fed into that story. we get the news from other sources that lyft will be eyeing robotaxis within 2026. where the names we have not factored in yet?

>> i think certainly autonomous vehicles, you hear about particularly around synthetic data so for instance real-world miles and then model them out into other situations that you could not possibly capture in testing the people driving around and accidents that could come up just as an example. that obviously benefits we think the ride hailing names. there will be others. you mentioned digital ads. one of the best sectors where you can apply ai. web design is another sector. companies like go daddy most of those companies are making it easier than ever to go out and start a website, and grow off of that. those are some of the ones we like. jackie: brad, we as a big tariff news out of washington today. how does that weigh into how you are looking at tech names going forward, especially given all this talk about ai

infrastructure -- which will require perhaps some of these critical materials? >> we will reserve judgment on what the ultimate outcomes of those are given what we have seen over the past few weeks. but i think the impact would align with what the macro impact would be to which is if you raise costs, certainly not going to be a good thing for these companies that are building out, certainly meta, amazon, google being the three biggest bricklayers in this industry. caroline: capital markets internet analyst brad erickson, great to get some time with you. coming up, doge may affect irregularities in the treasury department according to treasure -- president trump. more on that next. this is "bloomberg." ♪

pres. trump: there could be a problem. you've been reading about that, treasuries. that could be an interesting problem because it could be a lot of those things don't count. in other words, some of that stuff we are finding is very fraudulent. therefore, maybe we have less debt than we thought of was have think of that. jackie: president trump speaking in air force one head of yesterday's super bowl attended saint elon musk's doge they found irregularities at the treasury department. for more, mike shepard joins us. what do we know exactly what trump was referring to and what the potential implications could be on the treasury market? cook this is one of the great mysteries that emerged from that air force one conversation with reporters. he raised the prospect of

irregularities somewhere in the treasury department but offered no specifics nor have we heard from the cost-cutting team over at treasury now that is being led by doge, by executives from this u.s. digital service that doge is working with. we don't know what they're referring to. is that government contracts, excessive spending on certain contracts? we don't know even whether it refers to the treasuries market itself the way the president was discussing in that moment. we do know scott bessent, the treasury secretary, sought during his interview to offer reinsurance has that everything would normal operationally at treasury despite whatever doge might be doing. caroline: and how much doge can do when judges weigh in and try to hold some of the activity is a question mark. so too is laying bare some of

the operations of other units and thinking about consumer financial protection bureau seems to be skeletal too. >> that's right. that is one of the latest targets of this cost-cutting initiative sweeping through the government. doge is going agency by agency. the consumer financial protection bureau was the latest target over the weekend. essentially, they have shuttered operations, employees have been told not to come into the office. of course this does coincide with elon musk's own efforts to turn x into a platform for all different types of services, not just social media and communication but also turning into a place where you could do transactions financially. the doge team has gotten access to some sensitive data are reporting has shown, including bank examination records and other information that is

closely guarded, that is very sensitive. the consumer financial protection bureau does scrutinize banks and other financial services companies for the way they interact and intersect with consumers. this agency exists as its name would suggest to protect consumers. their other financial regulators but this is one that is really geared to look out for the average american. it's return since its inception in 2011, roughly $21 million in improper payments or improper charges back to consumers from these institutions. caroline: mike sheppard, thank you for that. doge gaining a key ally we understand in the u.s. with veteran tech employee tom krause who has been appointed special government employee and will serve as fiscal assistant secretary treasury. he is also the sea of cloud software group which saw deep cost cuts -- ceo of cloud

software group which saw deep cost cuts. talk is through who he is and is deep cuts in the private sector. >> we are learning more information about tom krause, the doge pick at treasury by elon musk. he currently holds two jobs. one at treasury and one as ceo of cloud software group. cloud software group was formally known as citrix systems and that company got acquired for 16.5 early in dollars and equity leveraged buyout in 2022 -- $16.5 billion in equity leverage buyout in 2022. the impact of those cards on the security of citrix products. there is a net scala, security appliances, that have been at the center of a number of major hacks in recent years.

we looked at to try to quantify the level and extent of the cuts to the security department at citrix and in impacts to the security of those appliances. we found the cuts were deep across the company, including the security department, and this may be why he was selected by caroline:'s -- by musk's doge . his background is cost-cutting and also according to sources we have spoken with, running incredibly profitable companies. this is his specialty. jackie: jordan, your reporting raises an important question about employing private equity tactics come this cost-cutting, in sensitive sectors. take that into washington where krause has more influence. what has the agency said? the treasury department, as well as maybe even the company he is still employed by which i found super surprising? >> the treasury department says things are operating normally

while the doge team conducts its work was up the weekend, krause and other staffers were temporarily stopped from accessing data and using the data. however, whether reporting finds is this is a strategy come a time-honored strategy, among private equity companies to load up companies with debt, buy them lots of debt. you have to cut lots of costs in order to repay that debt. in terms of the potential impact on the federal government, it depends on who you talk to. we have spoken to folks and included their commentary in our story that they ultimately krause to be a positive thing in terms aggressively finding ways to be more efficient. we have also spoken to other industry experts, security experts, government experts who say applying a private equity approach to government could potentially have very serious and very unexpected consequences, especially when

you're talking about cutting not just thousands of employees that were cut at citrix but potentially tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands or more. jackie: jordan robinson, thanks for joining us. comingns to integrate software from deepseek step more on that, next. this is "bloomberg." ♪

jackie: tesla challenger byd plans to integrate software from deepseek and is also offering a new driver assistance features and almost all future models at no additional cost to buyers. let's bring in craig for more. before we get into some of these new features, but we know about how byd is incorporating this new deepseek technology? >> it is still a little unclear how exactly this is going to work, but there is some support

here and i think the combination of two names -- hard to think of two that are any bigger in the tech and auto spaces. deepseek very much has come lately where as byd i think has been the last few years just the sort of talk of the auto industry in terms of how quickly they've grown and just how big of ambitions they have. the one knock they may be had against them is they don't necessarily bring a ton of driver assistance technology to the table. they are trying to address that and also do so in a way that is very sort of consistent with what their approach has been just to the industry in general which is really surprising. caroline: we are just showing a chart on the 20% of the last four trading days. what is it about this cheaper autonomous option that is just leaving competitors for dust? it must be a big pressure for tesla. >> i think that is a big part of

it. when you measure byd up against tesla or some of the ev startups in china that have leaned into driver assistance technology, byd has not really had as much to offer. there has been a knock against the byd offerings that if you're going to have to settle, you're not going to be able to have this latest and greatest in lane keeping or what have you. i think there was a real sort of opportunity for byd to address that in a more aggressive way. you mentioned the run-up in the stock. all it took was invite of an event and it was sort of reminiscent of how tesla over the years has been able to get investors really excited just by setting a date on the calendar for new product event that they have something to share. caroline: thank you so much.

coming up, we will be hearing from the ceo of ai startup aleph alpha. this is "bloomberg." ♪

caroline: welcome back. we've managed to shake off the latest geopolitical angst, those tariffs on aluminum and steel coming from president trump. nasdaq up 1.25%. recalling some of that selloff from deepseek, we are about halfway there. tsmc, despite that earthquake,

standing by their forecast for the first quarter and the full year and committing to ai investment. that helps the signals for nvidia. all about ai today and more on how companies and governments are approaching ai safely. let's go back to paris. tom mackenzie standing by with the ceo of german startup aleph. tom: thank you. i'm joined by the ceo and founder of aleph, jonas andrulis . jonas, start with deepseek because i've heard from some in this room that it is a sparking moment, and others saying it is a flash in the pan. jonas: first of all, it is basically a continuation of what we have seen for years. as models get better, they get more efficient will stop it is basically a confirmation of what

we've been positioning ourselves for years. for us it is a victory lap and for our customers it is a victory lap. a sputnik moment because china is in some regions, ahead of the u.s. for the very first time. tom: you are offering it to your clients now. have you tested it, are you data secure? jonas: our strategy is to include open source models. we've been doing this will all of our models. our customers, any transformation you are doing takes years and years. what is today the very best model is almost irrelevant. they just need a partner that can guarantee that they can leverage the best of open source with innovation they need for their own businesses. tom: you told me you think large language models will be demonic and the price will drop to zero. on the stage behind us, the

president of france is going to announce 109 billion euros investment to match stargate in the u.s.. is that funding misspent? is this misaligned? jonas: we need funding for our companies, for infrastructure, but what i worry is that we are getting instructed and putting too much focus on infrastructure. infrastructure is not going to save us. infrastructure investment alone will not solve digital sovereignty. what we need is value creation, innovation and the infrastructure comes almost automatically as a second order effect. tom: you pivoted from building out large language models to building generalized ai operating systems, very much focused on the enterprise. what has the response been as you reflect back on that? how are your investors feeling about that? jonas: deepseek for our investors, they were having a party because this is precisely what we've been positioning ourselves for.

we can solve the general-purpose task like writing a poem for your mother's birthday or email replies. our customers can solve that with the best of the best of open source models, but one thing customers have in common is the things that are really valuable that they care about like compliance work lows, government work lows, manufacturing, requirements engineering, all of these open source models can do it so we are adding our own innovation to solve that and everyone is winning. tom: what is that doing for revenues at aleph alpha? jonas: i can tell you that we just recently signed a 19 million contract with the german labor agency, the employment agency. these are the kinds of contracts we are currently signing and that his numbers worth getting out of bed for. tom: you are a german startup. elon musk is meddling in german politics. what lessons do you take from that? musk's supporting the afd in

germany. jonas: to be fair, we've been meddling in u.s. elections as well. tom: have you now? jonas: some german politicians have been very vocal about their preference. tom: nothing like this, come on jonas. does it underscore your desire to have sovereign ai? you have a tech mogul interfering in german politics. jonas: i don't like it, but i think there is nothing we can do about it. the u.s. is still our partners, still our friends and we need to find a solution together with the democratic countries, together with our partners. tom: openai was talking to me earlier and they said the two leaders in ai are the u.s. and the ccp. do you agree? does europe have skin in the game? jonas: that is probably correct, but this is not a zero-sum game, this is not about who is the first and everyone else is empty-handed. in davos we launched -- we were

the first team that launched an evolution of the transformer architecture and i talked to several research labs, leading research labs, u.s. researchers that are starting to look at that stop in all likelihood, the next evolution of the transformer is coming out of europe. tom: do need to be worried that we can't build out -- build our own semiconductors? you have amazon and microsoft developing their own semiconductors around artificial intelligence. is that a gap that we need to close? jonas: that is a painful gap, certainly. certainly when you look at capex, the hyper scalars have assembled, it is impossible to reach the same levels and it is equally unlikely that we will build a competitor to amd or nvidia with a snap of the fingers. it is painful, but it is a reality we have to accept and i think every money that is directed against -- building a

competitor to these juggernauts is wasted. tom: jonas, thank you very much. jonas andrulis, ceo and cofounder of aleph alpha, speaking to me just ahead of president macron's speech. . back to you. caroline: thanks so much -- back to you. caroline: thanks so much. deepseek is ramping up hiring for general intelligence roles. data experts and illegal chief. all of this recently that the chinese ai startup is looking to expand ambitions after a -- after they stunned markets with a cheaper model on par with openai. apple gets a mandate from the u.k.. the government has ordered apple to build a backdoor to access global news and data. in an undisclosed order in january, british authorities asked apple to circumvent encryption to secure user daja -- use your data in their cloud services.

rivian announced they would begin selling their ev trucks, originally built for amazon to other customers. commercial vehicles can be purchased by fleets for any size with delivery slated to begin in the second quarter. we are watching shares of lyft. up 3%. could robotaxis be offered as soon as 2026? jackie: coming up, joseph might get from the center for strategic and international studies joins us to talk about how energy demand could impact ai growth. this is bloomberg. ♪ so, what are you thinking? i'm thinking... (speaking to self) about our honeymoon. what about africa? safari? hot air balloon ride? swim with elephants? wait, can we afford a safari? great question. like everything, it takes a little planning. or, put the money towards a down-payment... ...on a ranch ...in montana ...with horses let's take a look at those scenarios. j.p. morgan wealth management

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caroline: this is bloomberg technology. this is bloomberg. ♪

caroline: nokia will replace their ceo with intel's recently appointed head of ai. the surprise comes as nokia works to exit a prolonged slump in orders from phone operators. the incoming ceo joined us today. >> my focus coming in is going to be to spend time with all of our major stakeholders and one of those will be our customers and particularly our telecom customer base and how we are serving them and what we can continue to do to serve them better and drive growth. we have a strong and broad portfolio today, some of which is being touched by ai but the way i think about the ai cycle is it will be a super cycle and much like we saw with the internet, its bond mobile internet, its bond cloud. we will see the same thing with ai. jackie: let's also consider the future of ai safety regulations here in the u.s.. this as the top official at the

u.s. ai safety institute steps down. let's bring in -- talk us through what this agency was doing and how this departure potentially puts that progress at risk. >> the u.s. ai safety institute is relatively new, a little over a year old and its mandate was to try and convene some standards around what ai companies are going to be -- how they are going to be testing ai models to make sure they are safe and the test capabilities. now that elizabeth kelly, the head of the institute has stepped down and there is no replacement, it is unclear what the future of this institute will look like. caroline: just at the time when laurel leaders, leaders of companies have gathered to talk about the future of ai. it seems a pretty pivotable moment. jd vance is going to be speaking on it. >> that's right. we have the u.s. vice president

planning to have a presence at this summit. but in order to get all of these companies together to give access to their models, to test them, to see how safe each release is, you sort of need -- the argument for the u.s. ai safety institute is that you need some entity to actually be in the weeds doing this work, so who will be the leader of this institute and what their priorities will be and what kind of safety evaluations they will run is critical beyond the kind of executive level that we see jd vance taking leadership on. caroline: great reporting as ever, thank you. as governments and companies around the world announced plans to end -- to expand ai infrastructure, another question is being raised, how are they going to power at all? joseph majkut is with us. it is so interesting in this moment that france is going to be committing to a gigawatt of nuclear energy for this ai

exuberant moment. you've got leaders of microsoft saying it is all about energy that stops us building out data centers. what are we not getting about energy needs? joseph: a data center is nothing more than a bunch of chips and racks that will take models, data, use algorithms to code together intelligence, answer questions and help people perform economically productive activities. energy powers that process. electricity in particular and whew -- we look at what the leading hyper scalars and companies want to build, these are immediately going to be some of the largest electricity loads in the united states and probably the largest class of new generation capacity adding over the next five to 10 years. jackie: there is a real question about just how much of the electricity grid can actually withstand. what do we know about what buy-in we need at the local level because a lot of these

plans are coming from the federal level and it's not clear that they actually need more permission or perhaps collaboration with municipalities, states? joseph: it is important to think about the size of the challenge. to even hit medium level forecasts for how much data center energy we are going to need over the next five years, we need to build more generation capacity and we add it -- more generation capped -- more generation capacity than we added over the past 20 years. there is a role for the federal government in providing some backstops, some funding, perhaps some permitting reform or help so that we can get power to these data centers with enough speed. the reality is we don't just have a bunch of gigawatt power plants lying around ready to plug data centers into. caroline: give marks out of 10

for the current administration. joseph: i think we need to see more texture around what the current administration wants to do. president trump has said we are going to open up all the brakes in terms of permitting and look even to coal plants. i think what is important is what is going to match what the hyper scalars and the comforters -- companies want to do and what is going on in the power sector now. we look at what we expect to see, the real additions are going to be solar, wind, batteries, natural gas. i think the administration is in position to help some of that and then we need to look at long-term growth because this isn't a problem that ends in 2030 when the first few mega sized data centers come online. if this is truly the economic revolution of the companies are investing toward, we need to have a much more ready system for further growth and we want

to see the administration move toward nuclear power, we need to see investments in modernizing our grid stop those are going to be key things for long-term progress. jackie: where does this leave climate goals? when i hear of pulled -- coal powered plants, it seems like taking a step back and hyper scalars are involved. what are they going to be amenable to, especially because they have net zero goals themselves? you look at climate security, this is not just a story about the environment but it is one that has to do with national security. talk to us about where it leaves these goals. joseph: there are a lot of considerations we need to think about, especially as the government tries to support these megaprojects. i suspect we are not going to see any new coal plants in the united states. instead the hyper scalars want to see investments in clean energy. one of the things that is most helpful in that regard is that they are pretty deep-pocketed. they need to spend to build power quickly, but they also

want to spend and can make investments in the novel technologies that allow us to grow this stuff over time. i could be small modular reactors as we have already seen them restarting large reactors in the u.s.. the reality of the system today is the more we build, the easier we make it to build, the cleaner and cleaner this process is going to be for us. jackie: what is the breakdown of what that share can look like because we've heard about nuclear energy for a long time and i would like to get a better sense of what the horizon actually looks like. is it a five year or a 10 year initiative? joseph: if we move really fast, i think we can make grid upgrades and nuclear power a part of this solution set early in the 20 30's but a lot of that stuff is far from commercialization. it will take time to get there. over the next few years i don't expect to see much difference in the capacity that is added.

the u.s. build a lot of solar, we have large natural gas resources and the investments we are seeing over the last year and expect to see over the next couple of years are going to combine those two sources with battery storage and investments in green energy and other places to manage both the emerging power need, the need for stability, you want to run these facilities basically all the time, and dealing with the climate effects by making investments in renewables and other things. jackie: that is joseph majkut. thank you for joining us. coming up, the nfl takes over the entertainment world. more on that and super bowl lix next. this is bloomberg. ♪

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caroline: shares of t-mobile up today, the telecom provider has officially launched their service with elon musk's starlink network, offering text and data usage off the grid. it is free for now.

the offer is open to anyone with the service eventually costing $15 a month. t-mobile announced the program on sunday, with an ad featuring the super bowl. jackie: for more on how the nfl is dominating entertainment. lucas, viewership of almost everything on tv has plummeted but somehow, the nfl has just gotten bigger. help us understand this resilience because it is not every day we are all tuning into a nailbiter like last night. lucas: that was not the game that the nfl wanted. part of it is just live sports. you look at the television business and as the ratings for scripted shows have gone down, sports has stayed pretty resilient, whether that is football, baseball, basketball. paul has been much stronger and has gotten much bigger. i think part of it is that there are so few games, this idea of scarcity so every game in the

football season matters and whatever nba games happening this week don't really. the product is just really good. there were moments six to eight years ago where the nfl looked shaky and the ratings were going down. a lot of different reasons for that and it has fully rebounded. jackie: people work tuning the espn had at the time. trying to persuade bob iger to get out of the nfl and go big on other sports but good thing he ignored him. a lot of it is about content and about knowing the people. it's on most like you are following some sort of real-life celebrity culture. >> that was a really interesting story that john told me. he was the head of espn for a long time, a brilliant executive and he had the same feeling that i did several years ago which was he saw all the bad news around concussions and thought ok, this sport is unsafe, it's going to be on the decline but it turns out most americans do not care and to your point about

celebrity, they are way more interested in patrick mahomes or the tailor swift of it all. a couple emails i got from readers where that i did not give tailor swift enough popularity -- enough credit for the current popularity of the nfl. caroline: more love being shown for the halftime performances as well but they made some big that's on when to play shows. christmas day for example. lucas: the nfl has gradually expanded their control over the schedule. it used to be the nfl was primarily a sunday product and then there was monday night but all. they added thursday night football which is now on amazon. they are very happy with that because amazon help them reach more viewers and get into streaming and they can prime amazon to bid on international rights that they will sell down the line. this are to have more games on saturday. there is an expectation because they are playing games and other markets, they may create a new window early on sunday morning and they make shop that to a

netflix. caroline: lucas shaw, all over the nfl. that does it for this edition of technology. don't forget to check out our podcast. this is bloomberg technology. ♪

scarlet: welcome to bloomberg etf iq. more than $15 trillion global etf industry. president trump plans to slap 25% tariffs on all aluminum and steel coming into the u.s.. as gold climbs to a new record on the back of the tariff news, we speak with -- on his new etf that doubles down on precious