>> from the heart of where innovation, money, and power collide, from silicon valley and beyond, this is "bloomberg technology" with caroline hyde and ed ludlow. caroline: live from new york, i am caroline hyde. jackie: i'm jackie davalos. caroline: apple to spend $500 billion in the u.s. and boost hiring as it seeks relief from trump's tariffs.

plus, microsoft cancel some leases for u.s. data center capacity, according to td cowen. how's the company's ai computing strategy changed? and a look at how elon musk's orders are dividing the trump administration. we were down on friday. we continue on the lower side. dig into what is the point higher and the drags more broadly. apple has been bouncing around on the back of its news that we are currently up 0.6% on the juggernaut to invest billions in the u.s., but less than $40 billion per year on increase on previous spending habits. we will discuss. microsoft the put word of the day come off by more than a percentage point. this is as microsoft is potentially in an oversupply

position coming to its data center capacity. a friday note saying they are avoiding leases in the u.s., checking on the fact that there may be a pullback. the note saying they may be reallocating from the u.s. from abroad. microsoft has thus far declined comment on this particular note, but they reiterate their spending target. let's talk it through with one of analyst on those notes, td cowen's michael elliott. talk to us about the nuance. what have you discovered? michael: so i would flag are you that, going back to september of 2024, we started to identify a slight pullback on the part of microsoft. that continued to october of 2024. as we highlighted in a report in january, we did see microsoft

take a step back on things they were working on. this is a continuation of that. we are seeing them pare back on some of the incremental leasing activity they were previously contemplating. but as we think about the activity of micro soft, they are still active, we are just seeing a shift in the location in which they are looking to take capacity. there has been taught from the microsoft ceo around the need to generate revenue, and we are seeing them look for capacity in and around their existing cloud availability zones. i will leave it to you to interpret without potentially means, but we are still seeing them active in the market, and in areas where we have seen leases be impacted, it has to do with power delays at the facility level rather than a wholesale pullback.

jackie: our own bloomberg intelligence analysts noted this morning that this report, along with satya nadella's comments on a podcast, suggested that they are shifting their strategy more towards renting then building from crash -- scratch. how do you view this strategy? michael: can you hear me? jackie: yes. how would you view this strategy? michael: historically, we have seen a mix of data center leasing and self builds be done. the two of them are part of the greater market around data centers. we have seen more leasing historically out of the third-party data center operators with microsoft that historically, and that is a function of the accelerated demand needs associated with ai. over time, do we think that microsoft could shift more to a soft build -- self build strategy? there is a potential for that.

but one of the messages i want to be clear for your viewers is we are still seeing broad demand strength in terms of overall data center demand. we see market soft is in the market, we are seeing oracle be very active, particularly on the heels of the stargate project. in terms of google, they are ramping demand, same with meta. all in all, strong data center demand. jackie: that is td cowen's analyst michael elias. let's look at other stories today. apple planning to hire 20,000 new workers and produce ai servers in the u.s. that is along with a $500 billion investment over the next four years. -- break down what apple's plans are. >> apple's has not ramped up capex so far, because they believe in going out and renting

some of this stuff from other cloud providers, whether that is aws, google, or the other vendors out there. it seems to me, because of the importance for ai for their products and services, they want to do some of this in-house. they talked about ai servers, so that could be an area. second, it could be the ai models itself. the third is semi conductors manufacturing -- not manufacturing but designing, and then using those designs to get manufacturing. caroline: the crux for many years how much -- for many is how much things have changed, or not? certain analysts would note tim cook being a good politician. or is this a general change in direction for apple? anurag: it is a little bit of both. the bigger dollar amount is a bit staggering, to be frank.

some of that will go into a fund , into r&d, so some may not go down to the cap the way an analyst would look at it, because it could be an operating expense, for example. but the ai server part definitely hit. there is an impact on the free cash flow line for investors. but it is a mix of both. there is a need for more high-tech stuff in the u.s., but it is difficult to do the low-end stuff. but ai servers and ai related investments are of importance. jackie: do you have a sense of how much this is just service to fend off, perhaps, some of the threat of tariffs for the company? anurag: from the ai side, they are a bit behind. i do not think anybody would say apple would have one of the leading large language models or even small in which models.

right now, they have said they will use openai for their particular products, like you ask siri a question, and it uses ai. down the road, they could use other models as well. but they should be making an effort to put their own. models in there as well. that's not easy. you can understand how much money it has taken openai to come up with these models. if they are serious about ai in their products, they will have to spend some money. caroline: bloomberg intelligence's anurag rana, thank you. let's get all of this and the context of ongoing -- ipek ozkardeskaya is with us from swissquote. we think about ai spend and what is happening in china and alibaba in the context of china and u.s. relations. how much of this is a concern going forward? ipek: right now, we obviously have a world that has shifted

its focus on geopolitical tensions. so the technology war is just going to get more heated up from this point on, especially, we found last year the chinese delay was accumulating, but this year, with the chinese coming back on the international platform with new ai models. there will be potential for this chip for an trade war and geopolitical tensions to take another turn. for apple, it looks, and the actual context of things, more of a political decision to us. we believe the geopolitically led motivations and business investments could eventually destroy long-term -- medium to long-term value for a company like value. jackie: what does this mean for earnings coming up this week?

nvidia, major infrastructure player, chipmaking. now you have tariffs as an added layer of uncertainty. what are you expect in on that front later this week? ipek: well, we expect nvidia to post strong earnings later this week. we actually believe that the high concentration of big tech names in nvidia's client book will turn into something positive for nvidia, at least in the short term and in the context of geopolitical tensions. nvidia has made around 50% revenues off big tech western companies that continue to spend big on ai. we think nvidia is in quite a protected position from the geopolitical tensions point of view. jackie: nvidia was hit pretty hard earlier when deepseek came out onto the scene. how much of those concerns have died off at this point? ipek: we were talking about deepseek a lot, and it comes down to the same thing i just

said. the concentration of big technology in nvidia's client book will eventually turn into a positive thing. that will protect nvidia from cheaper options like deepseek is pretending to have. that said, deepseek is believed to have cheaper models of nvidia ships to build its own model, which means nvidia is not necessarily hit negatively. it is just that its most premium chips could see their own demand plateau. but even that come in the short term, we think big technology companies in the u.s. have got nvidia's back covered. in the medium to long-term, these big tech companies are working on their own ships, and that is a risk factor. caroline: it feels as though the pressure on nvidia spills over from friday when we are worried about computer capacity demand.

the note from td cowen, the issues on whether microsoft is in some sort of overcapacity state, just wonder whether the numbers wednesday will put that to rest or not? ipek: we think will be strong. we estimate revenues will be closer to the top range, closer to 40 billion u.s. dollars -- $40 billion u.s. we also think that the forecasts are going to be optimistic due to the stargate projects and new pledges from they technology companies to continue spending on ai. this said, the overall market conditions look less favorable than they did last year, it in the sense investors may become pickier on profit margins, on the concentration on big technology clients, competition, but also on supply chain and capacity constraints. caroline: will we fall further?

it feels as though china and a few capacity is just going to keep pushing pressure on these valuations. ipek: definitely. we also think investors are starting to see potential in china, and with high valuations in u.s. technology stocks and the valuation gap, there is the potential for more funds to feed into chinese technology stocks, even more so as major risks are fêted. the first is that the chip war delayed ai progress of chinese technology companies but has not stopped the second is the winning risk of government, where xi jinping actually showed his support to chinese big tech technology leaders. jackie: what is the time horizon investors should keep in mind if we are really going to start seeing signs of china starting to catch up to american ai players? ipek: in terms of efficiency and most efficient models, we are

not there just yet. we need to wait at least a few quarters, two to three quarters, in order to see what the chinese ai models are worth. in terms of business and revenues, it is not the best models, the most efficient models that will make the biggest revenues. it is how these ai tools will feed into services. in a sense, chinese technology giants, like alibaba and tencent, they have huge platforms, they have huge truth china and beyond china. that could eventually turn their ai tools into profits, without them being as efficient as u.s. peers. jackie: that's ipek ozkardeskaya . coming up, elon musk's federal worker order is dividing the trump administration. caroline: ipek was just singling out alibaba. down more than 10% on its adr, slumping, upping its own spending on ai, 53 billion

dollars. the key is president trump, the latest executive order deepening investor concerns over the pressure on china. a government committee to curb chinese spending on tech, energy, and other strategic american sectors. this is "bloomberg technology." ♪ to work across your company. they deal with the small stuff that bogs you down. agents like secret agents? you know... i once played a secret agent. - oh... - oh i miss that one. i heard you were great. i was great.

caroline: elon musk has sent emails to over 2 million federal workers over the weekend, asking them to defend their work or risk losing their job. the deadline to respond by today. this order is facing pushback by other powerful figures in the trump administration, several agencies telling their employees to not respond. who is pushing back? >> we are seeing pushback from a

number of federal agencies. the fbi one of them. and the department of defense. we have also seen some agencies, like the social security administration, saying you should respond to this email, if you need guidance, let us know. this is probably the pushback, where certain agencies are saying do not do this. meanwhile, musk is tweeting very loudly about how easy it is to respond to this email, how reasonable it is. i would say this is morning of the more significant fissures we have seen -- this is one of the more significant fissures we have seen. jackie: musk did this before at twitter. there's a lot we can draw from how he handled that situation. when he did this back then, did he actually consider the responses he was getting back from employees, or did he justifier them anyway? max: this is like a slogan he used it challenge people at

twitter. most memorably, he used it in a tweet at the then-ceo of twitter, who was trying to push back deadly against musk. he said, what have you done this week? now, it has become almost a slogan. musk has made clear it does not seem he so much cares what people say. he was adjusting employees use a large language model chatbot to respond to the note. it is like he wants them to know that he is running his twitter playbook, and that playbook involves mass layoffs and this kind of super aggressive, chaos driven, let's attack the previous regime. you can also see why, if you are kash patel, the new director of the fbi, you may not love some other person stirring the pot in this way. caroline: also, there is the element of risk. the fbi does very important and

secret work that perhaps they should not have to vindicate or distribute on a note. max: the email did say please do not reveal classified information, so i suppose on some level, elon musk not about that. but one of the things we have seen from agencies and people in government and their management effective are saying do not respond to this is the risk that you sent something you should not have sent. that many jobs in the federal government will with sensitive or secret or top secret information. so that would be a concern as well. it is super unclear what the goal is, beyond just creating a pretext to let more people go. that is the thing elon musk has said over and over again he wants to do. jackie: bloomberg's max chafkin. let's get to d.c. for more on musk's impact, this time on the consumer financial protection bureau. hundreds of workers of already lost their jobs.

bloomberg's tyler kendall joins us now. this blitz at the cfpb is well underway. what kind of response has this generated from republican lawmakers? tyler: republican lawmakers have long targeted the cfpb, saying it poses undo regulations that they would like to see more streamlined. we should note there is new bloomberg news reporting that there seems to be some concern among the acting head of the cfpb, russ voigt, that he appears to be voicing concerns this process happening too quickly and that it could open it up to legal scrutiny which, if it is not upheld in court, that none of these changes end up being enacted. a spokesperson does a no such tensions exist, but it does not mean there are not still legal questions, particularly we are not quite sure what legal basis elon musk has, considering his role as an advisor to president trump to enact such wide --

widespread job cuts. it does appear he has the backing from the white house, considering last month, president trump suggested he would not mind if the cfpb would be limited. caroline: whether or not they are worried about the haphazard nature they are trying to shut off the cfpb, there is another story that the cato institute is pointing out that you are taking away the police of wall street, the police of big tech. how is wall street responding? tyler: i caught up with him on capitol hill a couple weeks ago and asked what his message to consumers would be, if there is no cfpb in place? he said, ultimately, he feels other regulators would pick up the slack, whether the sec, the occ, or the fed, and that he supports a holistic approach to financial regulators. on the other side, there are big criticizes, including senator elizabeth warren.

she is hosting a panel, forum, to look at the days -- ways forward, the remedies they could put in place to protect consumers. she did invite elon musk to join the forum, but we are not expected him to be in attendance. caroline: coming up, prosus to buy just eat. first, the world of crypto. currently at $94,500. that is well off -- robinhood falling, microstrategy some of the other crypto related names under pressure today. this is "bloomberg technology." ♪

caroline: prosus set to buy just eat in an all cash deal, making

it the fourth largest food delivery company globally. the ceo is looking for new sources of growth. >> many of the technology companies in europe should be valued more and should be investing more. this is the right price for the just eat shareholders. but at the same time, the leading company in china is a 100 billion dollar company. the leading company in the u.s. is a $100 billion company. we are investing in just eat at the right price to create a big, global leader. caroline: mongodb says it is acquiring voyage ai. it is to help mongodb build ai powered applications. tesla is preparing a software update for customers in china that will offer driver assistance, similar to the full self-driving feature.

they can use driver assisted features on the city streets. jackie: coming up, victoria espinel from the business software alliance will join us to talk about ai regulation under trump and more. this is bloomberg. ♪

caroline: welcome back to "bloomberg technology." quick check on the markets, they are under pressure again. we are digging into some of those key points, apple on the higher side, committing $500 billion in the next four or five years, when we get more jobs in the united states. yes, this does really surface -- focus on the service side even if it's an uptick from previous investment rounds.

are we seeing overcapacity in data center capacity for microsoft? more broadly that's what td, and asserts in microsoft as they are committed to that spend under pressure. when it comes to palantir, it's trading at its lowest since the beginning of february, still trading at 170 one times future earnings, and extraordinary valuation. with cuts coming to the department of defense, are they under pressure? the markets think so. could they indicate the ai commute -- compute demands? let's talk about alibaba, pledging more than $53 billion on ai infrastructure for the next three years, one of the biggest chinese ai infrastructure budgets as they look to become a leader in the space. mandeep singh, showing a big selloff. $53 billion seems like peanuts compared to microsoft and the others, but it is notable in china. >> when you look at a company

like alibaba, cloud business, compared to microsoft, around 80 billion, amazon, over 100 billion, it's still relatively small, but it is headed in the right direction in terms of growth. remember, cloud growth had decelerated across the board and in the case of alibaba it is picking up and is being driven by ai, so it's not surprising that alibaba and hansen will do the same in terms of wrapping up capex. they have seen the play book and the west in capex and that translating into cloud growth. jackie: it's not just about cutting a check. talk to us about the challenges they could face as they undertake this significant investment. mandeep: look, when it comes to alibaba and tends and, there's always the overhang in terms of what could happen in terms of the ccp and the changing regulations.

clearly, the threat is there. but looking at the capex opportunity that i have in terms of ramping up cloud business, it's pretty obvious that there is a lot of demand from local companies, like deepseek, to consume, you know, cloud computing. i think that is why this trend is probably one of the, probably one of the earliest i can think of, you know, if you go back in time in terms of how microsoft, amazon, and google have seen cloud growth accelerate over four quarters, i would expect something similar from these companies. caroline: but they can get access to the most powerful, most expensive chips. alibaba, look at the move today on the back of what trump is announcing, trying to curtail the chinese ability to push into chips. mandeep: look, if they are investing in capex, they are looking to source whatever compute they can get. they might not get the latest, but whatever they can get to to

build a big cluster and really ramp it up, ultimately your company is going to use open source models and is going to leverage ai. what you need is compute. as a cloud business, i think you are somewhat insulated from what's going on at the geopolitical level. there could be restrictions, but they are in the best restriction to build that large sized cluster to satisfy the needs of those companies. jackie: mandeep singh, thanks for joining us. the trump administration focus on trade continues to impact tech companies. apple is seeking relief from the tariffs on goods imported from china with more investments in the u.s. and trump signed a memorandum on friday to counter digital service taxes that some companies imposed -- countries impose. all of this as the u.s. continues to try to lead the way in ai and quantum computing. here to unpack the impact is victoria s pennell, ceo of the

business software alliance. it's pretty clear trump has declared himself pro-innovation, pro-technology. what you make of the way he's going about it? victoria: the administration has been transparent in terms of their goals around innovation and competition and it is interesting to see it in these varieties of ways. some are focused on promoting u.s. industries and protecting u.s. industries, and you are seeing this across trade and i think you will see it in the ai action plan the administration will be working on soon. we are hoping that a focus on competitiveness will be a part of it, so i think you will be seeing this in a number of areas. caroline: your role is to focus on enterprise leadership. what have we heard in terms of the latest impact on the digital service act but then also what's happening with china and the impact that has on, for example, apple? victoria: you raised the digital

service act, it's true that has more of a focus on social media companies, for example, rather than enterprise software. but there are so many impacts that the trump administration can have, including many in a positive way on enterprise software. some of the issues that are front of mind are not ones that will be impacted by enterprise. for example, speech issues. you know, there's a lot happening that's really positive from ai enterprise and ai software that will be impacted by those. on the other hand, i think the administration has a real opportunity to lead in terms of digital trade to. i think there's a real opportunity to lead in terms of ai adoption. there is so much focus and attention to building the large l and m models in that is of course important, but what we really need to have the broadest possible economic impact is

adoption across a wide range of industries, something where i think there is real potential for the administration to take the lead. caroline: companies have been really focused on consumer applications. victoria, what is it, then? the companies that you are talking with, companies that are currently trying to navigate, like the politicking that we see with tim cook. do they want clarity or actual change here? victoria: let's talk about ai regulation. speaking for enterprise software, i think they are, at a broad level, they want three things. first, we are pro-regulation. we think it makes sense. what we don't want this bad regulation. what i would characterize as bad regulation is regulation that's unworkable, addressing the wrong issues. i think that's important. second, there needs to be clarity.

one of the hindrances to innovation that we have right now is the churn in the system. is regulation coming? is it not? who will it apply to? it's an enormous drag on the ability of companies to plan. the third thing we need is consistency. the thing that's even worse than lack of clarity is inconsistency across different laws being passed by u.s. states, different laws being passed by other countries that are in conflict with one another. that is even more of a problem if you are a small company, you are going to have even more difficulty dealing with those. no bad regulation, clarity, consistency, those are three things that are critical if we are going to continue to move forward. jackie: you mentioned small players, a lot of the headlines coming from big tech giants, but the policies that you are thinking about, how would that affect some of these smaller companies? would only benefit the large incumbents? victoria: i think actually the

biggest positive impact will be on the smaller companies, so that they will be held down by, for example, inconsistent regulation or unworkable regulation. there is so much happening in the ai policy space. two things i would emphasize, i think they would impact all companies, including and perhaps in particular small companies. one, at the federal level. in terms of what's happening here in washington, d.c., a focus on promoting ai adoption is something we are expecting to see. there has been support for that in the past, but we are expecting to see a lot more activity in this coming year on ai adoption. the second thing i would say is that any company that wants to understand what is happening with ai regulation right now has to be looking at what's happening in the states. the u.s. states. there is a tremendous amount of activity there. we are very focused there. colorado passed the first

comprehensive ai law last year but now there's texas, connecticut, virginia, california, they all want to be next. the states are going to move regulation and legislation. all companies, but particularly small companies, trying to deal with the regulation that's coming, trying to deal with the inconsistencies they might see, if that comes to pass it will be a big drag on innovation. caroline: great points, victoria, thank you so much for joining us. coming up, ai policy impacting investment opportunities in an early stage focus. this is "bloomberg technology."

caroline: you are looking at a live shot of the principal room, check out our bloomberg technology podcast on the terminal, apple, spotify, and i heart. this is bloomberg.

jackie: today in the vc spotlight, we take a look at the shifting ai landscape as players demonstrate potentially cheaper approaches in the trump administration focuses on u.s. competitiveness in the sector. steve from kindred ventures is here with more. there's a lot of signaling of support, but help us to understand what you are seeing from your perch at the table. is it all talk or is it trickling through to the companies you are seeing? steve: the big question right now in the industry is open source versus closed source. it's not only for model pretraining availability, but also a huge issue across the planet. there is an inevitable movement let that happening where sovereign ai is a consistent

naming asia, middle east, the u.s., and china. china sets it up a lot from station countries that are more aligned and open to u.s. models. this overall trend we are seeing right now is trickling down into who can use the models and applications in the industries in different sectors important and critical to each country and region. jackie: what do you make of who is advising the president when it comes to ai policy, david sachs is a fan of open source. do you think we could see potential action on that front where it could benefit the players in the u.s.? steve: yeah, regulation in ai is a double-edged sword. you want to promote open source to compete with closed source models because competition brings progress and it trickles down to consumers and businesses who use these models, which is good overall for everyone, but

by the same token there is the issue of putting guardrails around it so that there is safety there for national interests and industry, critical interests on health care, transportation, defense, things like that. so, it's a double-edged sword for now and i think that david sachs and his team have a good handle on the balance and are weighing that. but i think that we want to promote open source models. we want to promote developer access to these models. we also want to have some level of safety when it comes to mission-critical industries. caroline: are you therefore ok with people accessing the deepseek are one model? where are we in the geopolitics of it all? steve: there's a lot of political bluster and fear coursing around the mate -- media, but what it comes down to is that deepseek is an open source model that you can download today. the weights are exposed, you can

remove the censorship alignment aspects of that and hosted on u.s. data centers. one of our portfolio companies is doing, was the first company to do that and to provide apis to developers that are a safer version of deepseek that doesn't have these issues. north link is another company out of the u.k. offering within 30 minutes for you to be able to download and deploy your own version of the model on aws, gcp, and azure within 30 minutes. open source can be problematic if it comes from a country or region you don't identify with, but the good thing about open source, the strength of it, is you can download it, modify it, and make it safe for your own purposes. jackie: another one of your company was humane ai. we talk a lot about algorithms and models. what went wrong here? this was one of the few consumer applications you can feel in touch, but what went wrong for many -- what went wrong, from

your perspective? steve: look, hardware is hard. you are developing a slower, longer cycle. some really big ideas, really, game changing, seachange platforms to compete with apple, samsung, with existing operating systems, it requires a long, long journey and a lot of capital. these are the moon shots that venture capital is built for. and we embrace. we want to see more of these. we want more founders to taking shots and go for it. caroline: great to have you, steve jang. let's take a quick look at crypto, we are off by over 1%. interesting moves, citadel securities becoming a liquidity provider for crypto. all of this bet on the trumped embrace of the industry in a clear pivot for citadel.

bitcoin is currently off by 1%. coming up, more on investor interest in ai infrastructure. is it waning? is it not? we will talk to the ceo of lambda. to them, it's not failing. this is "bloomberg technology." ♪

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caroline: and embrace of open

source ai models is helping to few -- fuel interest in companies like lambda, which raise $480 million in its series d funding round. ceo stephen balaban joins us now. you are building out infrastructure and offering software tools, so how do you spend the money? stephen: thank you for having me. we will be spending this to continue to build out our infrastructure. as a company we have over $1 billion in nvidia powered systems deployed across the world and our data centers with $100 million in our cloud platform. we will continue to invest in those areas and we have started to expand above the stack with an amazing ai powered software platform that lets us host open models like deepseek, fine tuning it to remove some of the censorship, make it more aligned towards western values.

really, what we have done is also hosted that as a part of what we called lambda chat, our hosted open source models ai chat assistant. anyone can go there and get access to it. caroline: ok, so help bring us and our audience clarity on where we are in terms of capacity, overcapacity, under capacity when it comes to data centers. you got some microsoft analysts getting them up -- market wondering about it again. stephen: this is the largest technological revolution we have seen in our lifetime and it is fundamentally reshaping the way humans interact with computers, so it's a big deal, replacing all the traditional software of the past 50 years and replacing it with a sort of hybrid neural human software. that's a big deal. we will continue to see massive investments. a couple of hundred megawatts of

data center contracts being pulled out. to put that into context, it's between $4 billion and $5 billion in equipment that you are looking at. that is, you know, not really as significant if you look at every single one of these companies looking at 80 billion, 50 billion, all of these hundreds of billions being invested over the next couple of years, every year. i don't think it is as significant of a story. jackie: stephen, it's a really big check for you guys, but it is getting harder to raise as a late stage start up even when you are in town. how does that affect your roadmap? do you see going public as the next step? partnering up with a different company or larger incumbent down the line? stephen: we are building a long-lived iconic company that will be here for the next 10 years. that's our goal. we are focused on building a

small fundamental business. last year we shipped $400 billion in topline revenue. we are profitable with a positive operating cash flow. it's just back to basics, you know? all that matters is building a heavy business. in the short term it's a voting machine, the market, in a long-term it's a waiting machine. jackie: let's talk about talent. there are concerns that cuts at the national science foundation could have broader implications on the tools from where you draw from. in social media post this weekend there were mentions of concern. what are your thoughts? stephen: it's good for us as a country to continue to welcome in the best and brightest from around the world. as a company, you and eggs -- you exist within the rules and frameworks set up for you by the

sovereign entity around you. so, we are just like every other company in the world, we are folks who are faced with whatever the reality winds up being. caroline: from your perspective, what does the landscape look like in five years? stephen: with these models today, it's just starting to crack open what i call one-shoting a pretty difficult computer programming problem. flashback just a couple of years ago you could generate a very basic application, you would have to debug it as an engineer. today i can ask it to generate a full video game. i could ask it to generate, for example, the lambda chat ios application. it generates it in one shot with no errors. to me it's about applying that to every piece of software in the world. caroline: thank you for coming

on, stephen balaban. don't forget our podcast, check it out on the terminal, online, or at i heart. this is bloomberg. ♪

>> welcome to "bloomberg etf iq ." katie: happy monday, scarlett. dips in buyers right now. let's get to the biggest stories right now, a $15 billion global etf industry, investors greeted with volatility with some tech stocks remaining under pressure.