>> from the heart of where innovation, money and power collide in silicon valley and beyond, this is "bloomberg technology" with caroline hyde and ed ludlow. caroline: live from new york and san francisco, this is "bloomberg technology." we continue to cover the aftermath of president trump's sweeping tariffs with stocks rebounding on hopes of trade deals following the biggest

route in five years. i focus on the nasdaq 100 up three point 5%. only three stocks are generally in the red on the entirety of the benchmark as their hopes of south korea, japan deals and micro perspective. ed: to the big technology names, tesla and micron. tesla based around the feud of elon musk and peter navarro. peter navarro commenting on television the tesla is not a car manufacturer it's a car assembler which prompted elon musk to call him a more on and explain that most of tesla's components from the car itself are built with items originating from the u.s.. the stock at session highs. micron, reuters reporting micron's passing on the cost of tariffs to customers its supply base but no commenter official word from micron. but interesting in the markets context. caroline: trade headlines

continuing to drive the market sprayed with optimism building for trade deals in south korea and japan but china not backing down on president trump's terror threats vowing to "fight to the end." very different tactics, talk through the latest in terms of south korea. >> with south korea they seem to be following in the steps of japan and trying to open very quickly negotiations with washington on some kind of deal that would ameliorate or eliminate altogether reciprocal tariffs that are about to take effect at midnight tonight. and those tariffs would be damaging to economies around the world and especially to the trade relationships between these two tech centers that are so important as well to silicon valley. the mood music is leading some to think what would happen to china. is china ready to also somehow approach president trump. and the president indicated in

his true social post but he was waiting for a call from beijing. the mood music as indicated it's a little bit different in china. they are sending mixed signals. the one hand they are pointing to a willingness to talk to actually have this conversation about trade. at the same time they say they're willing to fight to the end and this is a response to president trump's threats to impose even more tariffs on china if beijing follows through with its pledge to keep its retaliatory tariffs in place. ed: i'm trying to keep this focused on the technology sector. it's hard to piece it together. why are the korea headlines important. korea since $10 billion worth of chips to the u.s. every year. 80% of them memory so the micron headlines from reuters, that was the speculation of the last 24 hours, how does china react. what happened overnight was really severe just recap the wording the chinese issued. leland: when michael: michael: we think -- when we think about

the chinese they were talking about how they would fight to the end and that sends a signal to the markets into to investors and even to companies but we could be in this for the long haul. and if you are apple with so much production for example 80% of iphones are still made in china even as apple has tried to diversify its production lines it has been much tougher so the signs of a fall perhaps with some in tokyo do lend some optimism especially for producers of products. you think of sony, you think of tokyo electron and some of the more sophisticated chipmakers that they produce, all of these things are in play. china is really the big target here just because the size of the economy and the amount of trade the u.s. does with china. ed: apple exactly where we want to go, shares of apple rebounding in the session after what was basically the biggest three day drop since the 2000s.

president trump's tariff threats sending customers to this doors. panic buying of iphones ahead of speculating the potential price increases read joining us, your job is to take data, your own data third-party data, look at the case, best worst case scenario, what do you do with data reporting that there's panic buying of iphones particularly in this country? >> the thing is that may help let's say minor earnings in this but it does not take away the big risk apple has on procuring more phones down the road when the next iphone cycle comes in. there is a lot at stake right now. especially when it comes to the size of the tariffs that may hit china. caroline: ultimately may 1 when we get that fiscal second-quarter earnings likely to show this. and meanwhile they try to

navigate not current inventory but future supply-side may be coming more from india. where is that going to help them on the margin, how much can they rely on. anurag: they can bring some phones from india but the large portion india getting hit with tariffs also. if someone finds out there circumventing and trying to get from india won't have additional tariffs on that. there's a lot going on right now and almost on a daily basis we hear about some new tariffs being started but we can remember the end of the day the whole target of that is to try and open more factories in the u.s., there is some negotiation between the two countries. i don't think apple escapes this any time in the near term. caroline: for more on tech markets we go from apple to across-the-board typifies emerging.

blackrock u.s. head of the maddock and active etf's. boy have we seen some inflows and outflows. break it down what today looks like versus the last couple of trading days. >> seeing a bit of a relief rally here on volumes and corners of the market were people of been looking for buying opportunities. if you look at areas like artificial intelligence, areas like small caps, a lot of investors have been hunting for deals in these areas and other they are off 10, 20% it represents an attractive entry point for long-term investors so we are seeing people get very granular without finding opportunities for these lower valuations here. >> and they therefore think the valuation we've seen in some of these ai names, some of the chip stocks in particular that they are the right buying price. >> they are certainly at contracted valuations here and what we heard from clients for a while is one of the ai -- they see the structural disruption, they see the massive artificial

intelligence, it's really just a question, was this an area that was a little too inflated by the markets. basically 20% off since the beginning of the year, those concerns are gone. it looks a little bit different but if you still zoom out 10 years ahead there's a ton of conviction in artificial intelligence and in these valuations it's hard to pass over. ed: the trade conflict goes on indefinitely, is there a specific area of the technology industry where you want to boost your exposure. >> there is per we brought out a strategy very focused on this which is u.s. tech focused and it specifically looking to remove geopolitics from technology stocks for the tech sector has over 60% of its revenue from overseas. and if you can really isolate companies that hire, build and sell in the united states you can still get that tech exposure, that tech growth.

and limit some of the impact of supply chains. caroline: what names are we -- ed: what names are we talking about, specific supply chains you want to go into? >> if you look at the portfolio today it's under waiting several of the mag seven stocks that make up such a top-heavy amount of the tech sector. a lot of those stocks are still bring a lot of sales overseas. it's looking more domestically sometimes e-commerce companies that do a lot of that in the united states, some ai related companies are doing a lot of buying and selling in the united states re-weighting the tech sector. that top 10 looks very different than just kind of the broad tech sector. caroline: how are you currently discussing with those that are allocating toward your funds, the long-term versus short term. how are they willing to commit if they are worried about what the next headline seems to be bringing? >> it's about taking that long

term view. we've seen a lot of investors again really looking for was the target exposure the highest over the next five to 10 years. we are seeing the equity risks. if you can see that with themes artificial intelligence for long-term they should be rewarded over time. in many ways, it's opportunity hunting but also behavior and behavioral catching around being invested. caroline: it's in -- ed: it's important to remind oneself the last two years haven't ended or gone away. the ai infrastructure were the forecasts, i guess fit for you when you think about construction and clients. it's the conviction on the directory in 2024 around ai infrastructure data center

continues purdue you feel that way. >> i don't think there's a major shift. companies are planning around the long term. if you are building a data center today you believe in ai three to five years from now. what's different is you have tech companies that are flush with cash that continue to bring in new cash and they see huge potential market and they are excited to enter the space and let their capital market on the future. ed: data center, memory chips, you guys interested in that market? >> we are. we look at the entire ai technology for opportunities. looking at the bottom of that tech stack which is what is the digital infrastructure required for artificial intelligence. on top of that a lot of semiconductor companies.

we really like that digital infrastructure area right now. as we see that build out of ai. ed: jay jacobs of blackrock, thank you very much. coming up, a former u.s. treasury secretary larry summers joins us to talk tariffs and why he expects or turbulence paid a key conversation coming up. this is "bloomberg technology." ♪ only the servicenow platform connects every corner of your business, putting ai to work for people. - hr? - yeah. - it? - yeah. - r&d? - yup. omg? uh... oh, i see. uh... yeah. that's the department i work in. alright, enough of that. every corner of your business, putting ai agents to work for people.

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>> i am david westin joined by

larry summers of harvard. thank you for being back with us. we talked a week ago on wednesday, there was a lot yet to be determined. the markets have gone through an amazing amount of volatility since then. three down days, they are sharply up today. you've been explicitly critical of what president trump is announced here. do you feel better today because the markets are coming back? larry: sure, i feel better anytime instability seems to be calm. but be not confused, there was only one reason why instability is being reduced. and that is there is a growing hope in markets that a larger part of these policies are going to prove transitory and reversible. this does not reflect any kind of market endorsement of the

approach the president has followed. rather it reflects a judgment that the president might recognize the reality that markets are telling him about many of his advisers are telling him about, corporate ceos across the country. that this kind of wholesale tariff policy -- we are seeing some signs that the administration may recognize that. david: we are seeing signs, but do we have a better sense of the goals and process today than we got from the rose garden last wednesday? larry: i don't think so. i think this is fundamentally an improvisational effort. you can tell that when you knew there was a policy based on

tariff reciprocity did not use any data on the tariffs of other countries in figuring out how to reciprocate. you could tell that from the blatant contradictions between what president does presidential adviser navarro was saying and presidential advisor treasury secretary scott bessent was saying. you could tell that from the degree of division between close outside advisor elon musk and many members of the president's economic team. this is a policy, it's a hugely consequential policy, but by all appearances, it is being improvised on a daily basis and that is creating huge uncertainty. but it's only on -- only uncertainty of things going both

directions. today happened to be a day when things moved in a positive direction. i hope that the moves to back off of these policies can continue. but we will have to see. i suspect we will have volatile markets for some time to come. no one can know but my judgment is that i would be surprised if the bottom is in with respect to this phase and markets. >> how bad could it get? larry: i think the likelihood, i think it's more likely than not we will have a recession and in the context of a recession we will see an extra 2 million people be unemployed, we will

see losses in income that are $5,000 of family or more. we are very likely in the context of a recession to see markets reach levels significantly below their current levels. we could be looking at problems it will cashed -- cast a shadow forward. if we have a recession, the budget deficit will go up, accumulated debt will go up. financial distress that will affect higher risks companies and higher risk countries in the global economy. david, there is a central thing to understand about this moment of economic and financial

difficulty. to borrow a word from doctors, it is our first iatrogenic financial crisis. iatrogenic illness is when you go into the hospital and catch an infection there. it's when the people whose job it is to make things better are the active agents of making things worse. and iatrogenic illness in the like in hospitals is a major preoccupation for doctors. this is an iatrogenic economic challenge. there is nothing in the outside world that is causing this challenge, it is induced by the words and deeds of president trump and his administration.

the good news about that is it can be resolved with words and deeds of president trump if they backed off these policy errors, it will be a substantial resumption of normality. but as long as the hospital maintains unsanitary conditions, it's patients get infections when they enter and as long as these policies are being pursued we will see substantial volatility in markets, substantial recession risks, substantial damage to middle-class families. david: just to follow-up on that, is there any remedy for the patient other than for the chief dr. to back off what you just described? is there anybody else who can save us? larry: depending on what happens with other countries and how

they handle their diplomacy, it may be easier or harder for him to back off these policies, depending upon how the business community responds, there may be more or less ability to create an environment where there is a backing off of these policies. but there is nothing complicated about this. you impose huge tax increases on households in an uncertainty creating way that is also damaging to establish business business patterns. and the economy turns downwards. there is nothing subtle or sophisticated about this, this

is introductory economics. it's the kind of question that could have been on an economic -- entry economics exam for decades. suppose the president of the united states decides suddenly to impose a massive tariff tax increase on products from all over the world, what will happen to the economy? and any b student will know the answer to that is that it is a supply shock that raises prices and raises unemployment as well. and makes the economy less efficient and adds substantially to uncertainty. this isn't some sophisticated complicated thing to analyze.

david: thank you for being with us britt farmer u.s. treasury secretary larry summers. back to you. -- former u.s. treasury secretary larry summers. caroline: still the best day since august of 2024. a couple day selloff compared to yesterday. we go into the biggest movers from a points perspective. latin america exposure. coming up, president trump signals there may be a trade deal with south korea. this is bloomberg technology. ♪ ok, ladies, eyes on the tape! happy little tree that lives... who recorded over my game footage? i just love his voice. great! it's lost forever now, don! coach, relax. i've got it saved in the cloud. innovation changes everything.

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>> also seeing some current downward pressure.

over the last three to four days, it can traded over the weekend. there is more buoyancy, we are rebounding there are many more tariff and trade headlines. don't go anywhere, we will be right back. this is "bloomberg technology." ♪

caroline: welcome back to bloomberg technology. i am caroline hyde in new york. ed: some markets. caroline: coming off of our highs. nasdaq still clinging to two point 5% gain. very little stocks in the red as people start to buy the dip. let's look at individual chip stocks. deals are getting done. marble selling its auto related part of the business to the german company, up 6.8% on a $2.5 billion deal.

broadcom buying back shares. the steep discount after the recent selloff. micron, reports coming is looking to pass on some of the tariff costs to customers. it is up 2.5%. let's dwell on another chip company. samsung shares climbed in london trading after the south korean tech giant reported better-than-expected preliminary results for the fiscal first quarter. also comes as president trump says the prospects for a trade deal with seoul were looking good. peter elstrom is here. fundamentals looking good. peter: samsung reports its preliminary earnings after the quarter closes. at least the preliminary numbers were very good. revenue was up 10%. operating profit was $4.4 billion. there were a couple of things playing into the results.

the legacy business is taking off quite a bit and they have new galaxy smartphone that is doing quite well at this point. samsung is showing some progress. we know they are behind in terms of ai memory chips. they're playing -- they trying to play catch-up. we may get details later on in the month. ed: the memory market is very interesting and how samsung plays it particular how it relates to china. they are catching up and are able to serve customers in china until the u.s. titans export restrictions. go with that with us. peter: u.s. administrations, first abided administration and now the trump administration has been concerned about these chips going into china being sold into china. nvidia chips are the top of the list. also the high end memory chips. they have been affected by this. samsung also get affected by this in the future and the bow

of the administration is to cut off some of these ai capabilities china is trying to build. in the meantime domestic players are competing and trying to gain some ground back. samsung has been struggling because they do have customers in china they want to sell to but most importantly for them they want to get verified by nvidia so they can sell the hbm chips nvidia needs for their ai capabilities. ed: bloomberg's peter elstrom, thank you very much. let's get more how technology investors are reacting. beth joins us now. i enjoyed the breadth of your commentary on x. some of the tariff and markets focused, others the underlying technology. given the markets we find ourselves in what is your latest thinking on the technology sector and how he will play the uncertainty of the trade war. -- how we will play the

uncertainty of the trade war. beth: nobody holding stocks is comfortable right now. tackle overweight impact tariffs. we are talking hundreds of billions in imports every year that could be impacted. ultimately the market can top on good news and bottom on bad news, meaning we are seeing smh semiconductor etf up 5% despite the threat of up to 100% or higher tariffs in china. not confirmed but we have seen some activity over the weekend in that regard. what that means is we are positioned for a bounce. we think we are in extreme oversold conditions. if you look at the sentiment reading, retail has almost never been so bearish. retail is more bearish than covid and more bearish than 2009. that means the market is oversold. we are positioned for a bounce and that bounce may or may not continue onward, meaning we

remain cautious even with positioning for a bounce. ed: have we or have we not hit the bottom in tech? beth: it is not likely we have hit the bottom. through all of the damage that was done last week and the damage we could see this year. caroline: we turn to you when io fund has outperformed most benchmarks and the other tech focused funds. do you make the most of these valuations and go very focused on individual names and withstand the volatility or do you wait for a better outcome? you wait for more clarity from the president? beth: it is a little bit of both. we layered in on friday and monday. it is clear to us probability favors that bounce. that bounce is very important for a tech investor because of the damage that was done.

you have to capture that bounce if you will compete on an annual basis like my firm. therefore capturing that bounce is key. the risk on a bounce rather than during capitulation is everything to a tech investor. de-risking on that bounce is key to the performance this year. caroline: scott bessent has time and time again said this is not a mega problem, this is a mag seven problem. the nasdaq peter in february. this is about -- the nasdaq peaked in february. we were worried about an ai infrastructure bubble. how much have you been paying credence to that or is the market getting that wrong? beth: it is a mag seven problem. behold very few mag seven stocks because of the -- is the

depreciation even accurate? will it really be a five to six year depreciation schedule? that matters because if it is not and it is more brief due to the black wall systems coming out and blackwell ultra, we can see more effects on the bottom line, meaning they are the customers. that is not typically the way the mag seven was constructed. that piece is important to understand there is a shift in how big tech was the producer but now it is the customer. ed: i saw you say the other day ai needs compute and when it comes to compute nvidia's the gold standard. do hold nvidia, how do you see nvidia's ability to continue its trajectory in this environment? beth: nvidia is the exception. nvidia is the beneficiary from all of this. very low china exposure.

there is a semiconductor exemption to the tariffs. there would still be some impact , but by far the safest stop in the market today is nvidia. caroline: currently trading more than 5% higher. great to have you on the show. lead tech analyst at the io fun d. coming up, we will speak with dan ives. you have heard him cutting the price targets of tesla and apple. more on that next. this is bloomberg technology. ♪

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caroline: you are live shot of the principal room. check out the bloomberg technology podcast. you'll find it on the terminal as well as online at apple, spotify, and i heart. this is bloomberg.

we have some breaking news at the moment. this time is not on tariffs. we understand hackers have been spying on 100 bank regulators emails for over a year. we will be delving into the details. you have the story in front of you at the moment. hackers spying on 100 bank regulators emails showing the extent to which technology has been lapsing with key overseers. ed: the hackers had access to the deliberations of regulators who were deliberating information about the banks they oversee. clearly it is a deep report. one hundred 50,000 emails from june 2023 until they were discovered earlier this year. we will get with the team that broke that story. this is going to have repercussions. there is a lot more happening in the world as well. elon musk took to x criticize president trump top trade advisor, peter navarro, calling

him "a moron," in response to navarro statement that elon musk is a par assembler. this after elon musk's -- criticized trump's terror policy. bloomberg's caret policy is in austin -- i think we should start with the feud between navarro and elon musk. if you look at the data, third-party or tesla's own, there is support for what elon musk is saying, vehicles built in the united states source components from the united states are assembled and manufacturing in the united states nose to tail. >> definitely. this is something tesla has been promoting for a while. they say tesla's are american-made. they do this is something consumers are looking for as they get concerned about tariffs.

elon musk has not directly said anything on trump's policies but he has been speaking out against tariffs and saying trumps tariffs will impact tesla. they are not completely insulated as he knowledges tesla is more american-made than other cars. caroline: what we are trying to parse is what is happening edited ministration and white house level and who has the ear of president trump. on tariffs it feels like elon musk has not. he goes as far as not just a call peter navarro a moron but dumber than a sack of bricks. it feels like he is pressing against the trajectory here. kara: over the week on elon musk did push back the concept of tariffs. he says he wants more free open trade between europe and the u.s. he is definitely more pro-free market. it is something he has said before in the past. while tesla was initially seen

as an initial winner in the tariffs where it would be less effected, executives have said there is expected impact from tariffs on tesla. caroline: kara carlson breaking it down. let's think about president trump's tariff uncertainty changing the mind of some of the biggest bulls on wall street. dan ives writing "these tariffs are so absurd and scary to anyone of the basic understanding of the global supply chain in the u.s. tech companies operate in the way u.s. consumers live their daily lives." you also wrote in your tesla piece that elon musk needed to step up, he needed to lead. is this him stepping up and pushing back against peter navarro? dan: it is our view elon musk needs to leave the government. if you look at the brand damage, you cannot deny it. there is 20% permanent brand damage in europe, 10% at least in the u.s.. elon musk is getting calls from

fremont, from austin, from what he is hearing in china and germany. nobody is probably more plugged in along with cook than elon musk. he knows tariffs. it is a disaster across the board in our view is it since the tech industry back a decade if these tariffs hit. ed: on the other hand tesla is more insulated than the others on tariffs. what i tried to distinguish in your note is those forecast you gave on demand lost, you said 10% globally but more severe in china and the eu. that is not really a tariffs issue. it is a reputational issue of elon musk's association with trump. explain your modeling. dan: unfortunately tesla has become a political symbol around the world but in a bad way. any frustration towards trump or

tariffs globally, there is one symbol, it is tesla. elon musk went into the government in terms of doge, is at least $100 overhang on the stock. when you look at trying to model it there is brand damage, there is tariff issues. you're just trying to take stabs at it. they just came off a disastrous q1 delivery number and a someone who is been a long-term goal. we did not lower our rating, we still maintain our bullishness on robotics in the future of tesla, in my view it has been a sad few months to watch because it is brand destruction by the hour, by the date, you cannot deny it. caroline: cannot deny it but as you say you are still overweight you are still 20% upside from here. what is the recovery process? it takes a long time to build brand and equipped to destroy it? dan: there are three things.

one is he has to leave government. if you look at what is happening with navarro, wondering whether is this the first step in terms of stage left. if that happens, you a brand damage. some of that is permanent but it is a scar, it is a black eye. it does not change the long-term view of tesla in terms of a thomas robotics and the broader future. the third thing is it as investors understanding what the game plan is. you have byd rising as a competitor globally. you cannot say they are not. you need a ceo, elon musk, in that seat as ceo of tesla. you cannot be spending 5%, 3%, 2% of your time there and the rest of the government. that has been the frustration. musk is tesla and tesla is musk. caroline: what does he bring back -- people feel to be

cannibalization if he brought back a lower price competitor to the model 3. the cybertruck is not selling. dan: our view is 90% of the value of tesla is autonomous robotics. it is about launching everything. they can do a core production. that is why when you look at these tariffs, tesla, apple, go across the board. it cuts the legs off u.s. tech and that has been why it is such a frustrating and uncertain time. ed: i have a question from the audience on x from mark monroe who asks if tech companies are removing guidance -- i think he means will they remove guidance? dan: any tech company that gives guidance i would be shocked. right now it is blindfolded darts. you do not know where guidance will go. we will have rallies, you see

number cuts, we have tried to cut some numbers. you put the tariffs in you will toss out q3 numbers and q2 numbers -- they will basically look at what 2026 numbers look like. wen yu worst case, base case -- when you worst case, base case, best case, that is when you look at nvidia, what is baked in, what is baked into microsoft? ed: dan ives that wedbush. thank you very much. startups pulling back on their ipo ambitions. more on that is next. this is bloomberg technology. ♪

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for now, indicating it is a temporary judgment and there is more to come. i am waiting for the story to hit the terminal. another big story in our world. that is private markets. it was supposed to be the year for ipo's among venture capitalists and startups. instead president trump's tariffs have put a pause on any ambitions to go public with the likes of stubhub pulling back on their plans. katie roof joins us. you summarize the anxiety brilliantly in the piece out overnight. when i woke up i got text messages from both sides. some said paralysis, some said there is pinnock happening but people are moving. summarize your reporting. -- some said there is panic happening but people are moving. katie: other than trump's supporters people were upset about this. there are two issues. it is delaying ipo's due to market volatility and could

bring higher costs to some of their businesses. as you know there've not been a lot of ipo's for three years and this was supposed to be that quarter. caroline: lp's are getting pretty anxious and leading -- and leaning on the vc's. what about current funding rounds? are there any areas where companies are able to raise? katie: sure. normally there is a lag effect from public market volatility to private markets where it takes a few months for things to trickle down at each stage. it also depends on the sector. obviously if there is a direct business impact, if the revenue could be hit by this, if there costs could go up because of this due to international trade, those things will have a tougher time fundraising right now or at least at the terms they thought they could get. if it is something that is not directly impacted by the tariffs

you may see things remain relatively constant from a fundraising perspective unless there is a broader issue with the markets although it seems like it has resolved a little bit so far. caroline: you quote "we are trying to triage." katie roof, thank you so much for that story. let's go to a company making news -- making moves. a company has received permission for direct listing on the nasdaq stock exchange. his company can trade in the united states as well as canada where we are expecting trading will happen shortly. the company has set all this in a press release. ed: this is the u.s. justice department will limit the kind of cryptocurrency crimes that will investigate and prosecute. the doj said it will focus on cases related to tariffs -- to

terrorism and drug cartels and other limited categories. one story we will continue to track throughout the year. caroline: all things on crypto news. the crypto show coming up at 12:00 p.m. eastern time. that does it for this edition of "bloomberg technology." checking on the markets as we continue to rally today. this is "bloomberg technology." ♪ the way i approach work post fatherhood, has really trying to understand the generation that we're building devices for. here in the comcast family, we're building an integrated in-home wifi solution

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