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and we welcome you to "power lunch" for this thursday. i'm bill griffeth. stocks have been higher today although we're coming off the highs now. roughly 30 of the s&p 500 companies have been at new 52-week highs today. goldman sachs, google and apple among some we'll be talking about. >> we begin with breaking news. >> straight to steve liesman. >> thank you, michelle. the federal reserve out with its

flow of funds report for the second quarter which tallies household, corporate and government debt. it shows household increased. this is the first gain since '07 and household debt falling 1.5% in the second quarter. how did we get here? mortgage debt fell 1.5%. consumer credit falling 6.5%. what about business? their debt decline, the largest decline for business since 1992. what about the federal government? they increased. 28%. not as high as it's ever been, but pretty high. household stock values, up. these are equities. now what about real estate? they were also up for

households. 324 billion or 1.8%. first gain since the first quarter of 2006. this is important when it comes to 2006. it's the first rise of homeowner real estate equity. in other words, how much equity homeowners have in their homes. that is up to 43%. the derleveraging continues. sue? >> steve, michelle and i both have questions for you, but net-net, how do you think that the credit market and equities market are going to view it? >> i think it's a net positive. home equities are higher. home values have stopped declining. that helps as well. and consumers are not borrowing as much and are getting their balance sheets in order. this hurts retail and others as well, but bottom line is if the consumer has to get their finances in order, this is continuing a pace. >> and this is data the fed has

collected for years, comes out once a month. >> a quarter. >> we didn't really start paying attention to it until the first time in history during this downturn, we saw a decline in household net worth. that had never happened before. that spoke to the depts of just how bad this economy was. >> i've always followed this, if you don't mind. >> but we didn't -- >> but it did not grab the markets attention until household net worth started falling. then it became something to follow. it's happening and whether or not the pace is right, what we don't know where that magic level is where people are going to feel comfortable and maybe keep debt levels the same. i will tell you that 43%, the average home ownership equity, that number has been as high as

60%. >> very quickly, just to simplify because that's how i operate, we lay this increase in their net worth to increase in stock prices and real estate values. is it that simple? >> looks like 1.1 trillion of the two came from households, real estate, and about 324 from stocks. >> that helps, too. >> thank you, steve. stocks are trying tor a fourth straight day of gains. right now, the dow jones marching toward 10,000. bob pisani kicks it off at the new york stock exchange. first increase in household net worth since for a long time. is that going to help out the market? >> it's good news, but it's not moving the market. particularly for real estate and equities situation.

folks, nine out of ten days, we've only really been down one or two days in september. right now, the s&p 500's got a great record going. about 5%. straight up here. airlines are having one of the best weeks in a long, long time and we've had good news here. united and delta raised guidance. they're getting serious about improving profitability. we've had great moves up today and throughout the week on the airlines. fedex, while their earnings were in line with the guidance last week, the revenues were $20 milli million on the light side. trader talk. how are we looking at the nasdaq? >> just turned negative. just about a point here. we've been up and down over the

flat line. not too much convection either way. yahoo! is off the highs of the day. up about 12% in a week's time. that's a very strong move to the upside. i also want to point out apple and google. touched on 52-week highs again today. every day, new highs, seeing a lot of strength. oracle, still negative. research in motion down 1.7%, but a bi-rating with citi. sharon at the nymex. >> oil prices are basically flat now. down maybe about three cents are so, still above $72 a barrel. but heating oil is really rallying. seems like the market is anticipating we're going to have greater demand for heating oil. due to el nino, we could see more winter storms and so perhaps that's the reason why or perhaps the fact that products

are down. we're also looking at natural gas sell-offs. we did get that report from the energy department showing an increase in natural gas. storage levels were now at the highest levels we've seen in some time. rick santelli in chicago. >> i always try to look for the other side. the conversation about what the quarterly fed report had said about credit is all interesting, but i remember very clearly on the 8th of this month, they released july consumer credit, a very specific area in terms of climbing. it was down 126 billion. look at the three short-term charts. if you look at the next chart, t-bills, that program runs out

tomorrow. the three-month bill race -- and a bit of volatility around the philly fed. back to you. >> thank you very much. stocks have been struggling right now to remain positive. one of the areas where we've seen moves are the blue chips. coke, for example, hitting new 52-week highs. what's compelling the move in that sector? guys, good to see you. bruce, i'm going the start with you. this report from the fed on the increase in net worth. it occurs to me that if people start feeling better about themselves financially, that wealth affect could at some point kick in. that's good for stocks, too, isn't it? >> i think it's a very strong positive. housing is central to a recovery. the fact we have stability in

the housing market now, or so it appears, is a big plus. not only for the economy, but the stock market as well. >> i think that's absolutely right. housing is a bedrock of the recovery and i always look forward to the third and fourth quarter earnings results. typically fourth quarter. if it increases, you're getting analysts' estimates. >> there are a lot of people who feel this market has advanced in a pretty decided way and that a p pullback is probably necessary for it to continue to go higher, but what type of a pullback will it be and on that, where would you put your money? >> well, the first year of a bull market, pullbacks are generally very shallow and short lived. they average about 5 or 7%, so that's not really very much. i think one of the characteristics of this rally this year has been that the average investors have fought this market all the way up.

still at this peak, investors remain skeptical and concerned about the market. until that shifts, stock prices are going to continue to go up and then your raexs will be limited. >> so if you're putting new money to work, where is it going? >> the three sectors we've liked since the beginning, terribmate consumer discretionary. >> so you want liquid names. what would those be? >> liquidity is really at a premium now. i sense clients' desire for liquidity. >> gentleman, thank you both. when we come back, we will take the other side, as rick

said. a retail train wreck could be coming. that's a prediction coming out of a survey. also ahead this hour, a cnbc exclusive with the head of the biggest hotel group in the world. it's intercontinental hotel. plus, should sugary products be taxed. >> now these doctors are weighing in. the new england journal of medicine >> very good. get ready for the "fast money halftime report." you're watching "power lunch" on cnbc. esesesesesesesesesesesesess

dow jones is down about 11 points, but there are a number of key stocks in the retail sector hitting new 52-week highs. in addition to that, the gentleman who's the chairman of the new congressional panel has promised a no holds barred investigation into last year's economic collapse, including calling several witnesses that may include members of citigroup, bear stearns, fannie mae and freddie mac. retail train wreck.

that's the headline of a new survey by america's research group and ubs. americans are saying they are forced to cut back as their debts rise. joining us now, chairman of america's research group. good to see you. i guess the train wreck comes because of a very significant change in the response you got from consumers. 60% of those surveyed told you that even when the economy improves and their resources improve, they are not going to spend more as opposed to in previous downturns. as soon as things get better, going back to my old ways. you think we have a permanent change? >> i believe it is for two reasons. because all year, we've been intermediate consumers. even last year, i kept saying, you're seeing more and more consumers make changes.

here's one of the biggest changes. over the last 15 years, only about 21% of consumers out there said thetd to buy good quality. that's jumped to 29%. those consumers who used to be better quality customers have shifted to down and that's why 2/3 of consumers spending less are going to lower priced stores. i believe that this new frugality is going to be here for a long time because consumers just don't see anything out there improving that's going to fix their situation in the next one, two, three years. >> moments ago, the fed had this latest report on the net worth of americans out there and they pointed out the decline in debt. now, that's good for the balance sheet of the average american, but not great for the companies trying to sell them goods and services out there, right? >> here's the issue you want to keep in mind. 38% of consumers right now are concerned about their jobs.

that group is radically trying to slash all their debts they can because if they do lose their job, they won't be in bankruptcisy. the other issue is that 51% of consumers are telling us they're going to have to work five or seven years longer to recover what they lost in the market. >> are we needlessly wringing our hands on this? people have been using debt too much in this country. it can be a tool for growth, but also a wealth destruction. it's a weapon people can use to destroy their net worth. if they start reducing it, that's good in the aggregate for themselves. >> bill, i totally agree with you for one reason. consumers are now realizing the situation is much clearer. half the consumers used to get credit approved are telling us

they're not getting as much. i do think that over the next three years as consumers lower their debts, they're not going to jump back in because one, they can't get approved and i think they're accepting the fact they can't outspend their income. >> a lot of people who hold retail stocks are looking ahead to the holiday season because that's the make or break season. what kind of a christmas do you think it's going to look like? >> last year, i was the only analyst to predict negative retail sales. i predicted they would be down 2.8 and they were down 2.7. i do believe retail sales for christmas will be down 3.5 to 5%, which will be the first time in 20 or 30 years we've had negative sales back-to-back. that won't be too bad, but there

will be a loft losers out there. if you look at the data we just analyzed in august, only 35% of consumers walked into a mall at any time, with back to school, that number used to be 44, 48, and that's what i'm saying, those mall-based retailers will be struggling even more. >> great for those who have invested in that sector. thank you so much. americans love a bargain, but it's coming at a price. we'll look at the high cost of discount culture. burberry is launching its on retailer. the fashion power house wants to strengthen its relationship with core customers and attract new ones. they already have about 700,000 fans on facebook. >> that's pretty clever. okay, remember that home in

long island that had a beautiful view? it belonged to mr. madoff? it's been sold. and also, sugar rush. is a soda tax the smart way to pay for health care reform? the gold rush continues at this hour as the dollar dies.

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one stock hitting a new, 52-week high, the blue chips have been moving higher. here's coca-cola enterprises. it's higher today. goldman sachs, google and ebay also at new highs today. and we have breaking news on bernie madoff's house on long island. the u.s. marshal service confirming the house is under contract. not a closed deal yet, but at

least it is under contract and they've received multiple offers. the listing price was $8.75 million. we could not confirm reports it was sold for cash and above the asking price, but we know that's what they were asking for is catch deals without financing and with multiple offers, that might suggest that's exactly what they got. but the money that will be collected by the listen agent will go into a fund that will ultimately idealy go back to the victims. so the house on long island, the first property to be sold. >> do we think it was a function of location, location, location or bernie, bernie, bernie? >> we don't know until we know the buyer, but probably a little of both. >> that was a quick sale. >> sort of a bullet proof location out there. >> that's right. it is a prime location. very nice looking home.

he had fine tastes, as we know. >> and was it priced to sell? >> i don't know what the comps were out there. presumably, it was priced aggressively, but not necessarily too aggressively because they wanted to get more for the victims. they got multiple offers for it. >> part of the market that has been a little slow. thanks. the meltdown one year later. everyone was expecting to see wall street execs in haufs, but will two be the only poster boys for the crisis? and at 12:45, get ready for the "fast money halftime report." what are you guys watching? >> the market's hitting a snag right now. shares of general electric, to the downside.

also, we're take a position of earnings after the close. all that and much more, but first, more "power lunch" right after this. ♪ today ♪ must have been one of the strangest days ♪ everyone may face the same uncertainty. ♪ some would say that you won't find ♪ protecting yourself, however, requires good decisions. find strength and stability with mass mutual, a company owned by its policyholders. ask your advisor or visit massmutual.com.

welcome back. in the headline this is hour, stocks were in the green earlier. we have almost three companies hitting new highs. should you still trust in technology? we have a panel on that coming up at the top of the hour here. meantime, the fed is saying american households saw their wealth increase this spring. a jump by $2 trillion in the second quarter. and a lifeline with the $700 million in new capital, including 400 million from private equity firm. watch out, soda drinkers, democrats are considering taxing sugary beverages. something that could raise $15 billion in the first year. a syntax on soda, is it the bas

way to pay for health care? firing off, you guys no how it works. you get 20 seconds to make your case. >> where democrats have promised to pay for health care, this can pay for almost a quarter of health care costs. obesity, 2/3 of americans are overweight and soft drinks are the only food directly linked to obesity, diabetes and stroke. >> so cheeseburgers aren't linked? >> what a way to celebration constitution day. our latest chance to take our republic and turn it into the nanny state. no taxation without carbonation? you would have to have a massive tax in terms of soda and what's

most revealing is most level-headed democrat are dead set against this. >> not high enough to actually disinsent vise the use of it and why should we tell people what they can do with their lives? >> first of all, it's not a massive tax. >> but if it's not high enough, it doesn't reduce consumption, which is part of the effort. and it ends up being what we think people should do with their lives. >> if i can finish the point, according to the studies, it will push down use. secondly, soft drinks are basically junk. you're just drinking trash. all studies show it is linked to a whole host of issues. obesity costs this country $150

billion a year, half of which is paid for by the public. unlike the republicans, who did things like prescription drugs, the iraqi war, democrats are trying to pay for it by discouraging the con supgts sumgs of things that make people sick. >> j.d., when you look at the stats in the new england journal of medicine, the drinking of soda has gone down for the last four years in this country, and yet, it seems people are getting heavier. >> i could speak from experience put tonnage on us, soda's on the list. but to really move the needle, you would really have to take up the tax on soda, something like 1200%. that's $9 worth of taxes. there's a larger problem and i'm

surprised, although i appreciate his effort to practice medicine without a license, you were talking about controlling people's lives and it's fund mentalan wong to turn our country into a nanny state. >> i don't think you can ever allow them to talk during a commercial, but i say it every day. now to charlie gasparino. the housing bubble deflates. risky financial products plumet in value. bear stearns fails, lehman goes bankrupt and millions of ordinary americans lose. so after all of that pain, who gets punished? so far, just two hedge fund managers face charges. our on-air editor, charlie gasparino, joins us now. it does not seem fair what's

going on. >> they were into two bear stearns hedge funds, they go to trial in a couple of weeks. here's the irony here. called my white collar crime sources up and said, listen. there's been a lot of talk, there were investigations whether merrill lynch disclosed proper investigations. whatever scharts, who said it was fine, he gave an interview with us just days before the place imploeded. whether citigroup, where executives were saying everything was fine. they were investigations into this. and by the way, the implosions of those firms is in the hundreds of billions of dollars in investor losses. those investigations from what i hear are either in limbo or these guys have moved on.

that doesn't mean there will be be a slap on the wrist charges. clearly not prosecution -- a good chance they won't face sec charges. while we have what the prosec e prosecutors are going to say in a couple of weeks, they're going to be the culprits of the crisis. the guys that ran those hedge funds, it's a moving target, but like a billion or $2 billion. -- that doesn't mean allen schwartz is guilty of fraud. that doe mean dick fuld is. i just hope the prosecutors took as much time combing through their e-mails as they spent with the guys who got the sort of

regulatory equivalent of the exam. i hope there was equal justice. this is an opinion based on what i know about law enforcement. i doubt they did. what these guys do is look for the low hanging fruit and tannin and chopy are about as low as you get. they were the first out of the box, not as powerful as the other guys. there's something that prosecutors give a break to these guys. when every ceo is defending their stock in ways that may be, they're true believerers, so let's move on. >> you keep holding their feet to the fire, maybe they won't. thank you very much, charlie. we'll take a break, come

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4300 hotels in over 100 countries. they have 44 million members worldwide. the most famous brand is holiday inn and it's in the midst of the relaunch. in an exclusive, we are pleased to welcome the president of iag. this comes at a time when people are very negative on the lodging industry. mostly the upper end of the lodging industry, but why did you pick this particular time and price tag? >> well, we think there couldn't be a better time to relaunch holiday inn. we've been around for 57 years and with that legacy, what customers are doing today is not

just trading on price. it's about value. and customers aren't giving up quality. we see customers trading smart today. >> what do you get for 1 billion bucks? >> when you multiply that over 3,000, 400 holiday inns around the globe, with that, what we've done is essentially reinvest the hotel experience. 57 years ago, we really invented the hotel stay. the first real coast to coast chain in the u.s. >> so it's going to look different, feel different. is that being spent on the paint, the training of employees? >> the entire of experience. we start with the arrival experience. the bedding experience, the pillow experience and of course, the bath. interestingly enough, we have

also had more sound system. customers today are looking at not just their bed, a bath and tv. it's about the entire experience. >> am i going to pay more for this? >> well, in today's environment, value, and we are see ago pricing premium now. particularly with the relaunch, we've relaunched over 1200. >> last quick question. the assessment now is that the economy is not falling anymore and perhaps we're at the bottom. is that your assessment as well? >> well clearly, we saw the consumer this summer be very resilient. it's continuing to be strong as

it went to a weekend business. as the industry heads into the fall travel period, we book the business traveler in group. >> appreciate it. still ahead, technology is on a tear. is the run coming to an end? we're going to tell you after this. -d-d-d-d-d-d-d-d-d-d-d-d-dd

welcome. we'll get to the heart of the action. stocks rolling over midday. let's get to the word on the street. you know, one pocket of strength in this market seems to be technology and in fact, if you look at the sector, briefly hit levels. apple hitting a 52-week high. what do you do here? >> patty edwards, patty's been on this thing for a couple of months and she's been bearish on the market, but the one thing she said, she's been on apple for at least $35. pete's had it called. if you like the tape, you like

apple. technology is -- >> just for a second, you want to give your snap to patty and she deserves them, but at the same time, you like apple. you do not like the tape, so therefore you do not like apple? >> the tape scares me. oracle came out yesterday. that was not a good report. that was not a good report. their margins, much better. they're running the business more efficiently, but you can't force people to buy from you and their new software licenses were down. not good. >> patty edwards, you got your shoutout from guy who looks like he's manning the starship enterprise with that hair. >> this is the very -- market. and if you look at the chart on apple, we look like we're in

nosebleed territory. i stand by my $200 targets. >> let's talk about general market. as ge rolled over, we did see the markets have resistance. looks like it's heading into resistance here. >> i think it's doing what markets do and what stocks do. they pull back and it's had a really great run. just to kind of go to guy's point, ge's such a big company with a diverse product line. i'm certainly not a buyer of ge. i'd rather see it come off a little bit. >> jim, are you seeing some protective put buying? >> ge's up 22% in three or four days. 66% in about three months. people protecting their position t. volatility's low.

implied volatility is about half. the funny thing to me, people aren't selling the shares, they're buying the puts. people like ge over all. they're just locking in profits so they can sleep. >> fedex raised its earnings. meantime, airline stocks soar. there aren't too many fans of airline stocks. if you subtract that index over the past 52 weeks, you would be up. >> a lot of it is short covering, frankly. what we tried to do is take it downstream and we took it there on july 30th. look what collins said today.

didn't say great things, but good enough things. col up again today. that's huge since july 30th. that's where i would be going towards transports because i think the other one's too rich. >> brian, do you have recovery e an investor in the rails let's say? >> in the rails in particular you have to be a believer in the inventory restocking cycle if that is indeed going to occur. i know guys saying the rails are rich but in terms of a trade, they haven't participated as much over the last couple days. you might get a little bit of a pop there if you do indeed believe in that inventory restocking cycle. >> let's talk about the trade that keeps on chugging today. both hitting lower. record-closing high yesterday, the metal is up four of the last five sessions. brian, what do you say to do here? >> right. i'm still a buyer of gold. certainly up at these levels

nobody can accuse me of being columbus in this situation. i'm not discovering something new. in the gold price. so i think you can see -- you could see a dropoff to 960, 970 but i'd be a buyer right here. the thing that's happening in gold -- >> yesterday the rumor was out that at least fwof the fed governors were talking about tightening sooner than later. what's caused the runup in gold is all the stimulus has been crushing the dollar. if we get a hint that we won't be as fiscally irresponsible as we were before, there will be a break. i want to buy the dips. i think we're going to see the 960 sooner than later. >> i would disagree with you on the fact of the reason why gold ran up. gold ran up when u.s. dollar libor dropped below the china dollar libor. >> i agree with you on that. >> on a short-term trading level

we could argue back and forth. in the long-term level, i'd buy half a position here. if it drops a little bit, buy the other half 6 the position. if it rallies, i'd buy the other half. i'm a buyer. >> i'm going to blow the whistle here. we have to move on. we have things to cover. time to take your position on tom. is this a buying opportunity ahead of the results? would you get into palm over an apple? is it truly a credible competitor at this point. >> they don't have the aps. i don't think they're seeing the sales they want to. they came out with a second version of the pri. no thank you. i'd go with rimm, the cheaper alternative or apple which i still like. >> let's move on here. next trade, dollar, off its worse levels. for more, let's go to the rick

santelli on the fast line. are we doomed for dollar weakness until the federal reserve raises interest rates? that seems to be the problem here. >> i was hoping the dollar could regain footing long before that. i think jim was right, there was more than a rumor yesterday. that was an east coast letter writing service that put that story out about two fomc members that may vote towards tightening. in the real reality of the world, i don't know there are many who believe they'll pull the punch bowl away until they're absolutely 100% positive, which means they're going to wait until the horse is well out of the barn. >> what else can be done, rick, if anything by the federal reserve? to strengthen the dollar? >> just a couple of sentences. >> raise the federal reserve rates, for instance? >> a couple sentences, a little acknowledgement probably wouldn't hurt. the dynamic of so many stories pointing towards two things, "a," this is so great because the weak dollar means all clear on the western front.

talk to the irish about that in their banking industry and in terms of the carry trade, i don't know that's the planting it in that regard is a good thing. i think it will be the same ride path for a while. >> rick, thanks so much. rick santelli, out of chicago. . an announcement made today, he'll break down why he's going to run for the senator of connecticut. should you trust tech? that's when the "halftime report" continues after this. author, credit crisis caller and now senator from connecticut? peter shipp on why he's running, tonight. and the gold bugs are doing the jitter bug as the precious metal topples 1,000. is the commodity king buying it? plus, the chairwoman sits down with the biggest name in big labor as we try to trade the question, are unions good for shareholders?

on america's postmarket show, tonight. these days, wouldn't it be great if saving money happened as automatically as everything else? at bank of america, it practically does. use the bankamericard power rewards visa credit card and earn rewards like cash back with every purchase. cash you can put into savings. or even use to help pay down your credit card balance. it's one of the many ways we make saving money in tough times a whole lot easier.

welcome back to the "fast money halftime report." time now for your "power lunch" trade. we go to the negotiator. negotiator, you're looking at schlumberg schlumberger. >> they got me xooching down in this chair. i look ridiculous, i know. they don't make sense. you short schlumberger. i think the high back on june 7th was 6378. stop loss, buy it back up there. if the tape rolls over, if oil rolls over, schlumberger will roll. short schlumberger. >> got it. time now to call the close. buy or sell? yurio, kick it off. >> i'm selling. it looks like a failure. >> patty? >> i'm out, too.

>> ryan kelly? >> since everybody else is selling, i want to sell but i'll buy on the last tick. >> all right. >> clean sweep, so to you, mel. >> that does it here at the "fast money halftime report." be sure to join us tonight. up next, "power lunch" debates the high cost of culture. we have a terrific hour coming up on "power lunch." should you still trust in tech, given the run that particular sector has had? and then a cnbc exclusive, the ceo of harris corps. and a fierce face-off, abercrombie and fitch versus beyonce. it's all about the scent of money. back in a minute. a little more than half of the trading session and the dow is edging lower, jep opardizing

its winning street. andrew cuomo said four more pension firms have agreed to restrict campaign contributions. and sources tell cnbc that bernie madoff mansion is under contract. it went on sale two weeks ago and received a number of offers. that's cnbc news now, i'm courtney reagan. welcome to the second hour of "power lunch." we have fun things planned for you this hour. >> sure do. >> we've had a roller coaster day so far as courtney was mentioning there. stocks opened higher, now lower, moving to the downside, citi, caterpillar, bank of america amongst the gainers. valero is up 6% so far this session. >> good news regarding americans' bottom line. the federal reserve is out with a report saying household

network jumped by $2 trillion in the second quarter, first gain in nearly two years. >> general electric, the parent company of this network trading lower today after what has been a stellar run. will we see a spinoff involving ge's nbc universal unit? david faber has the story. >> fresh 52-week highs today, silicon valley bureau chief jim gold man has a closer look at what has been a pretty good tech rally to this point, jim. >> to say the least, bill. tech was the first sector into the recession and would likely be the first sector out. a breakout like this is taking everyone by surprise. apple grabbing lots of headlines and for good season. key fundamentals beginning to click. the aps store and the 1.5 billion downloads, more than a couple of billion dollars in revenue by some estimates. smimts that apple will see its

best mac sales ever. new ipods coming for the holidays. apple blew through a 52-week high. google is knocking up against 500 bucks a share again. while microsoft and yahoo! continue to work their deal, google's 52-week high signals that investors don't seem too concerned. there's a quiet rally under way for tech stocks that don't get much limelight, ebay, ciena, motorola on the back of its new click smartphone, edging toward its 52-week high as well. yahoo! up 12% this week alone. all of this might mean opportunity for the laggers. that still shows promise but haven't really followed suit. that's the thinking behind citi, reiterating its 100 dollar target on rimm. their time will come, some analysts say and with the fundamentals of these key

players so strong, it seems like there's still a lot of room to run for manufacture them. >> let's see. kevin landis, firsthand funds and scott kessler, director of information technology research group at standard and poors. technology is not such a mature industry that it can't be a leading indicator of economic activity. is this why we're seeing the really here? >> i think that's the basic hypothesis. let's go back to what you led off with here. there's mature tech and emerging tech. there's this changing of the guard going on. if you look at a company like oracle or a company like intel, those are mature stories. they're well into their third and forth decades. where as if you look at the alternative energy names, those are emerging. >> what sector do you want to get into right now? >> i'm more of an emerging tech guy. we're excited about getting into the solar technologies.

that doesn't mean it's not a great play for a more conservative investor to buy the blue chip techs and use that operating leverage in the recovery. >> scott, one of the things i see you point out, the reason that technology has been able to do so well, they didn't get stuck with needing to borrow cash. a lot of them were sitting on large hordes of cash. they didn't get hit by the credit crunch that other companies and sectors of the economy did. >> that's right. if you think about it, there are three primary reasons we think tech has done well. the first is the relative fundamentals. you eleaded to. this is not an area that was hit as much by, say, the financial crisis or what went on in housing. the second reason is really if you were specific in pointing out, which is these companies generally have strong financials. they generate cash and don't have a lot of debt typically to service. last, productivity gains have been significant in this economy. unemployment remains high. it seems like the people who are

working are working harder and harder and technology enables that to occur. those are three underlying reasons why tech has done pretty well this year. the s&p 500 is up about 15% year to date. >> microchip technology, mchp, the chip sector, it sounds like it's the commodity sector of technology as opposed to emerging or i have got that wrong? >> i think that's a fair comm t comment. with microchip, we like their global exposure. you're uk talking about three-quarters of revenue being derived from outside sources, outside the u.s. that will be good as the dollar falls and the economy recovers. this is a well-run company with high margins and third, the dividend is 5%. we think there are a lot of attributes here. >> let me go back to the energy play, the emerging sector there. how many of you guys in silicon

valley talk about the emerging growth of alternative energy plays out there? two questions. can you make money? it's emerging. bullet it's also very, very underwritten by the federal government in many cases. and when that goes away, then they're on their own. where is the money being made in that sector? >> all right. well, the thing to focus on here with alternative energy, it's all about cost. by the time it gets to the plug, you really don't care where the electricity comes from, right? when you look at things like subsidies, you're right to consider that absent subsidies you would throw companies into chaos, basically. but the long-term trend is this, the cost of the solar panel goes down every year. the cost that you pay on your electric bill goes up every year. the crossover point of what's called grid parody is pretty much inevitable within the next three or four years. when that hit, the demand for solar goes to the moon. >> so sun power -- what does sun

power do? >> sun power is probably the leading company with the most efficient solar panels, using conventional crystal and sili n silicon. you hear a lot about sun power that has the most efficient panels and you'll hear about first solar. those are the two big gorillas in the industry right now. >> jim gold man, one of the analysts we talked to the other day and also today, says you have to know where the exits are, the safety play is. for a long time, that was the treasury market. it certainly isn't at this point. a lot of people feel like tech may be the safety play because they don't have the debt and other things. you agree with that? what are you hearing? >> i have to, because i mean, when you look at where the industries are in the silicon valley and indeed around the world as far as tech is concerned, there are so many trends that have yet to play out. the refresh sike that'll we keep talking about with windows 7. you have holiday shopping coming up and we've all been saying it's going to be a lousy holiday

shopping season. there have been signs now that back-to-school shopping will be there for key sectors. i think you'll see that with holiday shopping as well. i.t. spending comes back. that's why oracle is still a good play. you start to see these things. you start to look at p/es today that reflect that downtrodden look at what was going to happen in 2010. as those estimates increase, we'll be looking at companies that are priced today that still might be very good deals. >> very good. >> scott, kevin, thanks for joining us today. jim, we'll see you later. by the way, i love this story. what is old is new again, google now planning to reincarnate digital books as paperbacks. what a concept. >> what? >> the company has a deal with a company called espresso book machine, to turn 2 million digital books into paperbacks on demand. google acknowledges not everyone

wants their books served up on a computer or e-reader like the kindle. in case you want to go back to old technology. >> six months ago i would have been one of those people. now i love my kindle. >> this is the moment. how many times have we discussed when is the publishing industry going to remake this horrendous model that i've never understood, they're no different than the music industry. and now google is going to come in and eat their lunch just like itunes did to the music industry. >> one thing very interesting, this is definitely a trend that's going on right now. these are printed on demand. you don't make a book and hope somebody buys it. when the order comes in, you print it, using this high-speed printing machine, make the book. >> i wonder what the cost, though, of that is. >> the costs are coming down, just like solar panels, i understand. kevin landis. it's the future. >> five years from now, i bet you'll have a solar panel on your house. >> and a printing machine in my

house. >> we wrap up the cbc all-stars. we take the realtime pulse of the markets. what happened? we had a really this morning and it's now petered out. and david faber, the latest on ge, what they may be planning for nbc universal. is a spinoff in the wings. and the lucrative business of selling seats on wrigley field roof tops. and a "power lunch" exclusive, the ceo of harris corporation on how the troop surge in afghanistan and the push for health care reform could mean big profits for his company. um bill--

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among the stocks, unusual volume, higher than normal. amerisourceberge next, hospira, valero energy, oh,ing and meredith corporation is also up. >> we lost a little strength bob but is there something fundamental or is to t that we've gone pretty far pretty fast in particular cases?

>> well, that. nine out of ten days, it would be up nine out of ten days. i notice when the dollar shows strength, the market starts drooping. let's take a look at the dollar index here, which essentially sitting at a 15-week low today. it's come off of its lows in the middle of the day. as we have done that, the stock market overall has weakened. that's the important thing with what's going on here. the important thing is the airlines which have had a terrific week. i know this has been a big story. not only have we had good comments from united and delta but we have amr with a major fund-raising effort. $2.9 billion for them. that's helped as well. finally, let me show the financials. if you're wondering why the markets have been drooping on the weak side, most of the financial names have been to the downside and are sitting at the lows of the day. rick santelli, what do you make of the dollar here? >> all i know is that you and i get paid in dollars. i'm still never going to be convinced that i want to get

paid in weaker ones. having said that, bob, i don't see any significant change. sometimes the most important thing about technicals is the type of pattern. and this pattern is very solid, the glide path is very tight in terms of ranges. but it's in one direction. it welcomes like something that could continue. of course, there's been boat loads of stories, the dollar may be the new carry trade. i don't know that any of that will help the dollar. if you look at the chart, one decent thing today, it's trying to fight for positive territory in the dollar index as we speak. the next chart, of course, is your chart, the s&ps. notice how that plays off directly into the game of the day. that is treasury yields coming down just a bit. hey, supply, whether it's duke energy or citi, this time not fdic guaranteed. we see supply as well going back to you, see an bill. >> the ball is back in pizoni's

catch. >> it's been a slow process. this weak, though, interesting one is starting. actively managed etfs, guys get in and buy and sell stocks, bonds, etfs on their own decisionmaking process. take a look at the debt tactical. harry dent, very well known in some of the economic forecasting circles. what this does, they invest in other etfs, the etf of etfs, across lots of different asset classes, internationally, nationally, equities, bonds, commodities, anything they want. it's all based on the economic and demographic research of harry dent. mr. dent had books out that were bullish on the markets. he gathered quite a following around looking at demographic trends, in particular, that baby boom spending wave theory that he popularized, as the u.s. population ages, the boomers are going to concentrate on paying down debt, saving for retirement.

that means spending less. that means why he's negative on the u.s., europe and japan and positive on india and latin america. it's an unusual thing to say about china as well, in a recent interview, the one baby per couple will be negative for them overall. this is one of very few that are out there right now. we have power shares that have actively managed etfs it's been slow going so far in that particular area. back to you. >> got it, bob. thank you. once again, speculation swirling about vivendi's stake in universal. david faber is here to discuss the likely scenarios that may answer the vivendi company. >> why would they sell now. >> they have the option between november 17th and december 7th. >> i get the window. >> they said it is a noncore asset. they've been active in buying properties for its core business of wireless around the world. >> but you usually buy low.

>> and sell high. >> is this a a high for them? >> not necessarily a high but at the same time, they want that capital. they need that capital. it is possible that they don't sell this year. but as i reported this morning, ge is expect iing vivendi will notify of it its intention to exercise that put option on that 20% stake or at least notify them this year. nothing will take place in terms of transactions by this year. >> who buys it? do we buy it back. >> we are not going to be buying back the 20% stake according to people familiar with the situation at this point. this is seen as highly unlikely. the most likely scenario is an initial public offering. vivendi has the right to register those shares for an ipo. as you point out, ge has the right to buy back that stake, however, i'm reporting that that is seen as unlikely. another potential scenario, michelle, is that there would be a third party that would come in

and buy vivendi's stake. they might say we think we can make more selling it to a third party rather than taking it public. >> like a comcast? >> like a comcast. it's a completely noncontrolled position. it's like you and i were making an investment in whatever it might be. that being said, there still might be interesting in gaining what some people would call a foothold, even if it doesn't contain any control. an ipo seems the most likely scenario, would probably take place the middle of next year. there have been no discussions about a sale of nbc universal out of ge. that is where things stand. ge is getting ready. even if, surprisingly so, vivendi decides we're going to wait another year. ge wants to be ready for this possibility and so this dual path is being explored, ipo, more likely, possible you get it sold to a partner.

ge has the right to approve whomever it might be that vivendi approaches. >> is that why the stock has been running? >> unclear. if nbc universal, a public company, it would give visibility into the overall value of the company. >> which is what the street has been demanding for so long. >> it could be an argument positive or negative, depending on how you feel about nbc universal. >> they have been much more transparent. >> you would actually know the value. >> right. >> nbc universal would be in a position to use the currency, the stock price, the stock i should say, to make acquisitions, something it has not been able to do. ge has made the acquisitions when they came for them. the last one we did for the weather channel, ge needed partners. this day and age it doesn't want to part with a lot of cash. >> all right. i guess we're finished with questioning. >> is that it. >> when does the stock hit 30. >> if indeed they do an ipo, what is that going to do for ge stock? >> again, it will give

visibility into the overall value of nbc universal. >> they are hoping the ipo market is doing well by next year. >> this very well could become a public company within the next eight months. >> thank you, david. >> times they are a changing. walmart is making a huge comeback by slashing prices in the downturn. the dollar stores are raking it in. is there a downside to cheap in we' ? we'll talk about. >> walmart's negative, tjx, family dollar, costco is hanging on. dollar tree is hanging on. dow up 30 points. back in a moment. bull market or bear, traders are always hungry for ideas. they find them at td ameritrade. trading's all about strategy. and strategy... is all about information. so i start my trading day... with td ameritrade's morning perspective.

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starbucks, gap, coach, walgreens, reaching 5 it-week highs. retail sector doing well despite predicks that maybe it wouldn't. >> no question americans love a bargain. one look at walmart's big comeback proves the discounter's rule, the retail roosts these days. lauren weber, a self-described tightwad who washes and reuses plastic bags. pleasure to have you here. welcome to power lunch. >> tell the story about your father. >> yes. >> the example you grew up with. tell about your father, the tightwad. >> i grew up with a very frugal father. you'd probably have to call him

compulsively cheap, actually. he doesn't like to use the brakes on his car. he has a system of tapping and thrusting that he thinks is better on the brake pads. he kept the heat at about 50 degrees when i was growing up in connecticut. it gets very cold in new england. i was often to be found at the kitchen table doing my home work wearing hats and scarfs. >> no hat would thor in the shower? >> he times the showers, too. >> he didn't time them but he noticed if i was in for too long. there would be a knock on the door saying you're using too much water, lauren. >> how come you embraced these ways and didn't go the other way which a lot of people think you would have. >> i did complain bitterly as a child about my father's cheapness. as i got older and certainly as i started supporting myself, i started to realize my dad was a little extreme but all in all, he was on to something. he sent me and my brother and sister to very expensive private universities. education to him as a priority.

he taught me how to live within my means. i don't think i'm quite as extreme with him but i have never been in debt except for a few student loans which i paid off. >> you wrote the book why? this is more about how cheap when it comes to the nation, cheap is good, right? >> i use the word cheap. other people might call it frugal or thrifty. look at the load of debt that many americans are trapped under. average household credit card debt in this country is somewhere around $10,000. i think the ethic of consumer spending has proven itself to have limitations. and, you know, i notice that my father got made fun of a lot for being cheap. i started to wonder at a certain point, why do we make fun of and malign people who save money. it seems like that's a good quality. >> i know we were going to have another author out there but she couldn't make it. she's written a book about our cheap nature of society right now. we are obsessed with price and

finding the best value. it can work against us as well. for example, very briefly, a good friend of mine worked for years in the textile business where they were obsessed with cost because retailers were obsessed with price, because consumers were obsessed with price. they had to all keep bringing costs down and down and down to the point where they had to export jobs overseas. as a society, in the aggregate, we demand lower prices but we also demand higher wages and at some time, something has to give, right, lauren? >> i agree. and in fact, i quite agree with that other author who you're talking about. you know, in many ways my -- i champion cheapness but i don't mean by that buying a lot of stuff for low prices. to me it means buying less, consuming less, living in a way that's easier on your wallet and the environment. >> do you think that given what a lot of americans have been through, whether it's the loss of their home, the loss of their jobs, problems with their

particular credit, do you think that the changes that we're seeing in the american consumer are permanent? or do you think they'll go back to their old ways? >> i am a skeptic on this question. i mean, a lot of people, especially a lot of economists and analysts are saying we are seeing a see change in the american consumer, this is a seismic shift. my book deals a lot with history. throughout history we've had crises that have forced people to cut back, whether it was the american revolution, the great depression, 9/11, and each time people think this is a permanent shift and each time consumer spending bounces back spns the economy recovers. so i'm skeptical this is a permanent change. some people would be happy to hear that. i personally think we'd do better to tighten our belts in a more permanent way. >> your book costs $24.99. i think you can get it cheaper on amazon. >> i don't have a lot of control over those kinds of decisions. >> thank you, lauren. >> good luck.

>> i kind of get it, right? you point out that we are always looking for the best price and yet she's saying we make fun of people who look for the best price. >> there's a different between searching for the best price and living within your means is what she's getting it. that's what we haven't been doing for the last few generations here. we have to get back to that. >> as a result, a lot of people are going to walmart. it has been the biggest winner in this discount culture. don't miss cnbc's documentary, the new age of walmart. david faber goes inside the retailer. that's september 23rd, only here on cnbc. coming up on the half hour. we head dunn to the big floor with steven grasso. and darren rovell on the roof. >> we'll talk about my power lunch. that's coming up.

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welcome back to "power lunch." august housing starts rose by a less than expected 1.5%.

it was still the third increase in the last four months. mean while, weekly jobless claims fell by a whopping 12,000 in the latest reporting week. fedex profits fell by 53% in its second quarter. smaller shipments, lower fuel surcharges hurt revenues which fell by 20%. the stock is trading lower by about 3% right now. we have a first on cnbc with fedex's ceo at 3:00 p.m. eastern time. amr could buy a stake in jal, japan airlines. . sue? let's head to the floor of the new york stock exchange. >> did i see that headline that i could get bill's book on google instantly in paperback? did i see that headline. >> nice try, bud.

no. that one is not available. you have to buy that for real. >> all right. >> it's well worth it by the way. >> thank you. check's in the mail. >> how are we going to end up this day and is this the pause that refreshes? >> i think people have been looking for reason to sell this market and sell into this market. we've heard all the bears say the same thing, we've come too far too fast. there are still pockets on the upside. maybe today we give a little bit back. as a whole we go higher. >> for the s&p 500 you've been talking about 1060, what are you looking for? >> 1100. >> you moved. >> that's where i've been hanging my hat. >> for a little while now. >> i think we'll go to 1130-ish which the 50% retracing. >> 1130? >> yes, you have to be greedy here, bill. we came in from 1,200 to 1,000 quick. >> what happened?

we were ringing our hands in august saying, here comes september, uh-oh. the famous line of traders, the market is always set up to hurt the most people at one time. >> the shorts have been taking it. >> the shorts have been taking it. >> in the shorts. >> that brings you back to high beta stocks. that's why this rusch to cash in and buy all these high beta stocks, going to year-end chasing alpha. that's what you see. >> thank you, steve. >> i love chasing alpha. >> remember that? >> one of your favorite movies. >> by the way, the chicago cubs have not won the world series in more than a century. just a reminder there. but fans can still pack wrigley field and unique rooftops on the buildings across from the field. it's one of the unique features in chicago. that's where we find darren rovell on a beautiful day in chicago, apparently. less than an hour before

gametime, darren. >> that's right, bill. we ordered this just up. we are standing wrigley done right is one of these rooftops. we're standing here. you pay $100 to $200 to come up here. there's a lot of people up here ready. the top two floors, there's a bar downstairs and up here, they have everything you could want. they have the game across the way. i'm talking about 50 yards across the way. then everything you could want here. let's give you a little bit of a tour of what we've got here. follow me. so we have the bar. anything you want. we have casey, natalie, ashley. all right? when we talk about chicago experience, we talk about the "l" across the way here. we talk about all the food you could possibly want. i have, let's seefy can do this,

i went to northwestern. bratwurst, chicken, italian beef, hamburgers and hot dogs. we even have the poppy seeds on the rolls here. we have, obviously, the all you can eat, all you can drink. it's the ultimate experience. they're down about 15%, they say, it's he's still pretty good when you consider this is a thursday at 1:35 local time and there's plenty of people out over the way and plenty of people here. and we ordered this right up. i think i'm going to chill out and eat something. bill, back to you. >> are the cubs okay with this? >> the cubs are okay. that's a good question. since 2004, these guys have had to pay 16%, 17% of their gross revenue become to the cubs. >> that's why they're okay with it. >> that's an essential part. >> why? >> if you do advertising -- >> why? why? >> a free market question. >> why do they have to pay for the right to put people on the

building that they own? >> because there's the view of the game that's going on and the cubs think they own the rights to the game. >> oh, that's sticky. >> that's their position. >> it certainly was. in 2002 the cubs put up nets that no one could see. that's what led to a lawsuit and settlement about five years ago. >> thank you, darren, enjoy your bratwurst and the game, perhaps. >> a quick promo for you, tonight on the kudlow report, meg whitman, tonight at 7:00 p.m. eastern time, only on "the kudlow report." harris corps profits as more and more medical records go electronic as well. we'll talk to the ceo with another "power lunch" exclusive of why his company is in the sweet spot.

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unusual volume leaders include general electric, we're down. tesoro, in particular yahoo! and labcorp. >> just this week, the military officer tells congress there's more u.s. troops sent to afghanistan, a surge clearing the way for a possible

deployment by year end. the radio from harris corporation helps them complete their mission and does communications in the field. we have a cnbc "power lunch" exclusive with chairman and ceo of hourld lance. thank you. >> thank you for having me. >> when we saw the surge in afghanistan we wanted to know more about companies that benefit. 90% of your radios come from the u.s. government and contract. are you going to sell more radios if there's a surge in afghanistan? >> certainly the tune is there. as you might guess, the challenge is in afghanistan because the mountainous terrain is significantly greater than they were in iraq. our particular area of expertise is providing radios that communicate in that kind of environment. we certainly think that current troop deployment in their challenges plus future troop deployments are going to be a positive. >> there's a lot of talk when

there was going to be a change from a republican president to a democratic president. are we passed that period? do we have an answer to that question yet? and what's your assessment? >> i think certainly in the aggregate, defense spending has reached its limits and is going to decline. the question for companies like harris, are we positioned in a place where money will continue to be spent at or even greater than current levels. we think with our focus in communications, information technology, what we call situational awareness, all about getting information from one place to another place at the right time in a rapid session. such that people can make decisions, we think that will continue to be an area of significant growth, even when the overall budget is going to have budget pressure downward. >> i want to talk about the communication system for the first responders. this is something that -- >> different radio than the one i showed. >> that came to light after 9/11

and various first responders were not able to communicate during that disaster. we have communication systems that are now able to overcome that obstacle and this is one of them right here. right? >> that's absolutely right. the new harris unity radio takes technology we developed originally for the military. we call it multiband technology, meaning one radio can replace several radios, currently in use because of the broad spec trouble. we've taken that and applied it down into our new public safety radio which we're out marketing to state and local law enforcement and first responders, because in many markets around the u.s., you still have local police and local fire on different frequencies, state police on a different frequency yet and the national guard might come in in an area of crisis situation and they couldn't communicate. so we've taken the first responder forms and put those in our military radios. it's all about this interoperability as we call it,

seamless communication across all those different groups. >> that also goes to health care as well. the president has a big initiative, regardless of how health care looks, to digitize health records. you say that's not necessarily enough. how does that play into the bottom line? >> health records is an element of it. if you think about situational awareness in the battlefield kind of analogy, now put that into the medical analogy. we want to make sure we get the right information to the right person at the right time where they can make a decision. and so recently we've been leading a contract called the national health interconnect network. it's interconnecting washington agencies like the social security administration, veterans administration with regional health centers and insurance companies. everyone can exchange information and make it more readily available to health care providers, to benefit patients and hopefully for lower cost. >> thank you, sir, pleasure to have you with us. >> thank you. >> we'll take a break, come

back. microsoft upping the ante against apple in the digital music gadget wars. get this, now there's a zune hd music video player. can it win the battle with apple's ipod touch? the review of the new zune hd, just ahead. we're down 24 points on wall street. you are watching "power lunch," on cnbc, first in business worldwide. the panda restaurant group known for its fast food is cooking up innovative employee wellness. >> 14% body fat. >> offering free health screenings at work, thanks to a partnership with california-based huntington hospital. >> if you have screening done, particularly things like a blood pressure test and that then helps you build an overall fitness program -- >> reporter: a win/win for the company and for the hospital. dr. kurt hong says they can be

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which are you? ipod or zune? today's digital life, cnbc contributor and "new york times" technology columnist takes a look at microsoft's newest portable music player. the question is will it finally really compete with apple? ♪ >> reporter: hello there, ipod.

>> hi, how are -- come on, zune, what are you doing? >> what's the problem? >> what's the problem? you're dressed up to look exactly like me. >> don't be absurd. >> different belt buckle. >> zune, from the day you were born, everything you do has been designed to mimic me. the first zune 2006, same price, same capacity, same battery power screen size. 2007 you come up with the zune to look exactly like my uncle nano. look how you're sitting. >> this year it's completely different. >> oh, yeah, what is it? >> look. it's the new zune hd with a touch screen. look at this, i can zune in on my photos, search the web over wi-fi and the whole web page rotates. >> are you kidding me? >> that's all been in the ipod touch for years. you are incapable of original thoughts. >> ouch. >> well, i'm sorry, zune, neighbor one feature the ipod

hasn't had for years. >> how about an fm radio? the new nano has a new fm radio. the zune hd gets hd radio, much higher quality broadcasts than the same a.m. and f.m. existing stations. that's pri cool. i like to buy high definition movies from the store. if you play a dock, you can play them on your tv for hd. >> unlimited music downloading. >> it's $15 a month. >> no apps store. the ipod touch has 75,000 downloads. >> i have an apps store. there's only ten programs in it but give it time. >> you've been able to accumulate 1% of the market? >> 1.1%.

please. >> you want to know why that is? it's because the ipod is not just a misch, it's a lifestyle, economy, care adapters, docks, alarm clocks, stop watch, e-mail. you don't even have a speaker, do you? >> not exactly. no. but you can get a 16 gig zune for only 20 bucks more than your 8 gig model. >> i i'll admit it, zune, you have fresh ideas this time around. you're not bad looking. choice of colors, fancy backs. >> at least i'll give you this, zune, you got guts. >> you mean like the new tegra chip for my much brighter oled screen? >> i don't have time for this. >> there is nobody better. if you happen to read his review in today's "new york times" and jumped, you made the jump into the inside section there, you found another piece by another

reporter, that points out, when you think about it, the pc that was created to make our lives easier and more efficient out there, you get to your pc every morning with hours of productive time ahead of you and the next thing you know, you've thrown away your day on wikipedia, fantasy football, i'll throw in facebook now. we've frittered away the efficiencies that the computer was supposed to achieve here for us. >> except at christmastime when you do your shopping online. >> 100 years ago they frittered by playing cards at their desk or whatever. >> it's in your dna. >> exactly. >> a smackdown between abercrombie and fitch and superstar beyonce. >> and can chicken feet head off

a trade war? >> yes, indeed they can. you're watching "power lunch" on cnbc. [ telephone rings ] [ ring ] [ "catch the wind" plays ] what is the sign of a good decision? in the world of personal finance, it's massmutual. find strength and stability in a company that's owned by its policyholders. ask your advisor or visit massmutual.com.

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we just got word of a very important enter view that will happen on cnbc at 4:00. senator olympia snowe will be on with john harwood. the democrats in the senate hope she's the one that will get them to 60 critical votes. >> on health care. >> she's the linchpin when it comes to health care reform. >> she has the idea of coming up with a trigger for the public option, not employing it immediately but if at some point they determine the health insurance companies are not doing enough to lower costs, that would trigger the public option. it will be interesting to hear what she tells john, coming up at 4:00 eastern time. >> water cooler. empty calories? >> a little bit of both. >> exactly. we'll find out who is fiercer, beyonce or abercrombie and fitch? abercrombie has a scent