names in talk radio. while he's away, we asked some of his big-name radio colleagues to help us out. tonight, radio talk show host and length end john batchelor joins us on the show. >> my pleasure. >> stop us if you heard this before. the president is attacking private equity. is it starting to backfire? people are questioning his record on public equity. it is a case of presidents in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. iran getting closer to the ultimate goal of a nuclear state. is the white house doing enough or putting us on a collision course with iran? and we're watching the chaos in the eurozone, are we forgetting about another looming threat, one that has the ability to drag down the entire world economy? i'm talking about a dysfunctional china. first up, though, despite ongoing pressure from fellow democrats to stop the attacks on free enterprise, president obama is still at it. take a listen to his latest jab

at romney and private equity. >> investors walk off with big returns and working folks get stuck holding the bag. now, that may be the job of somebody who is engaged in corporate buyouts. that's fine. but that's not the job of a president. that's not the president's job. >> good political rhetoric for the campaign trail, but is the president throwing stones in a glass house? "the washington post" says obama has his own not so pretty record in public equity. the white house has invested billions of taxpayer money in private businesses that have since either failed or are failing, leaving taxpayers on the hook. here is cnbc contributors, jared bernstein, and carly fiorina,

former hewlett-packard ceo. and john batchelor. what do you think about the strategy by the president to attack private equity? is it a good one? >> no, i don't think it's a good one. it's clearly backfiring in his own party. it's a bad strategy for two reasons. i frankly find it breath taking that a president asked us to believe as a community organizer and untenured law professors and a junior senator who hadn't completed a single term that he was qualified to be president, when mitt romney wasn't qualified to be president. and his record is totally fair game. it's poor. not just that taxpayers lost money, but thousands of people lost their jobs. >> jared, response to that? >> first of all, the clip that you played from the president was actually revealing, i don't hear this as an attack on private equity. in fact, what he said is private

equity is in the business of maximizing profits and that's fine. and if anyone disagrees with that, speak up, because that is the business. where i think mitt romney got himself into trouble, trying to cast himself as a job creator. and everyone on this panel knows that when it comes to private equity if someone says, maximize profits, or increase jobs, you know, the goal is the former, not the latter. now, listen, on the public equity thing is very misleading, that's not at all what the department of energy or the white house has done with this stuff. it's much more like venture capital and why should the government be involved in venture capital? totally different than private equity. in these cases and the reason is, in these cases, it's because there are no private firms that will come in and bid on -- on -- >> that i find extremely hard to believe, jared. >> that's not true. >> i'll finish in a second. think back to the internet, gps, larry kudlow's beloved frank d,

the government needed to be first movers. >> you cannot possibly compare solar and internet. but go ahead. i'm sorry. >> i think you can. >> dianne feinstein, winner in the senatorial race, much criticized your record at hewlett-packard, because you dealt with the changing marketplace, jobs overseas, massive layoffs in california, just these last days that are impacting the people of silicone valley and your whole state. i heard nothing from the president in his visit to san francisco these last hours where he picked up a lot of money to be re-elected, but did not speak to the pain of silicicon valley. why is it necessary for meg whitman, a colleague of yours to make these layoffs? why is that the success of private equity? >> first of all, i'm not here to attack or defend meg whitman. i've been gone from

hewlett-packard for a long time. to respond to your specific point, first of all, to jared's comment, a business doesn't set out to create or destroy jobs per se. a business is in business to behavior products to a customer, and to do well in the process. in the process of that, jobs are created. secondly, california is sitting with a 12.4% unemployment rate, not because of silicon valley, because of hewlett-packard, because of bad public policy and decisions that plagued that state for almost 25 years now. businesses are leaving in droves. the tax rates continue to go up, while the tax base erodes, bu e budgets are deteriorating. >> excuse me, jared, mr. bernstein, i want to give you a

chance. creative destruction is healthy for the business cycle. the president is not being articulate, nor is his campaign. mr. rendell of pennsylvania cause the tone wrong. do you believe that the president's campaign tone in attacking private equity is wrong? >> i don't think he's attacking private equity. i think he's actually making a very similar point to the one carly just made and you just made. he's very much tipping his hat and saluting creative destruction. what he's saying, however, when are you president, the kind of business model that carly very clearly laid out, is not the model that had to be foremost in your mind. >> why is governor rendell unhappy? why is he unhappy? that's an important state, pennsylvania. >> john, you asked me a question. i cannot speak to governor rendell's happiness. although i will tell you, governor rendell a big advocate of infrastructure investment, very much part of what we're talking about investments in clean energy infrastructure, and the whole point here is that the

private market left to its own devices will underinvest in brand new path breaking technologies. every other advanced economy has found that out and we found that out when it comes to the enter net. when it comes to so many innovations. >> that is fundamentally untrue. if there is good opportunity, people will invest, and they will make a lot of money on it. >> is that true -- do you believe it's true -- >> jared, if i may, in fact, the government's investment in the internet, which i agree with you is extremely positive, was all the way back with dar bin. the government needs to be investing in basic r & d, basic research. the solar industry is well established. in fact, what the government's poor selection of winners and losers and the solar industry did was freeze out venture capital. let the -- excuse me. let me finish. >> wait, there is a ton more r & d. there is a ton more r & d that needs to take place when it's

advanced battery, solar. >> but that isn't what he suspend the money on. >> that is what he spends the money on. >> let's you not diverge into too much detail. overall, i'm not sure the average american gets a sense what private equity is. cnbc, we talk about it all the time. you don't think it's bad for the president to do this. in the end, he looks anti business. >> i think he has to be careful not to look anti business. i think have you a point. i think what he's trying to do. if you go where he introduced this in chicago the other day, he was extremely balanced and talked about what private equity does, and discovers -- >> carly, your last word. >> i'm going to go back to my original point. apparently president obama believes being a law professor

and senator qualifies him to be president and being a business person doesn't. he believes only politicians can be president? that's a terrible campaign platform. most people believe we need to go back to more of a citizen government. where people go in and out of public service instead of staying forever, but, again, i just find it breath taking. whether or not it's an attack on business, and it's clearly being viewed that way by members of his own party. what president obama is saying he was qualified and mitt romney isn't. i find that amazing. >> jared, i'm sorry, we have to cut off? >> carly fiorina, thank you. >> john batchelor with us throughout the hour. coming up, nuclear showdown with iran heating up. iran may be closer to weapons grade nuclear capability. coming up, stocks take a late-day dive. investors can't shake euro jitters. what is the contagion effect?

we break down the european divorce scenarios. and free market capitalism is the best path to prosperity. the kudlow report coming right back. if you have copd like i do, you know how hard it can be to breathe and what that feels like. copd includes chronic bronchitis and emphysema. spiriva helps control my copd symptoms by keeping my airways open a full 24 hours. plus, it reduces copd flare-ups. spiriva is the only once-daily inhaled copd maintenance treatment that does both. and it's steroid-free. spiriva does not replace fast-acting inhalers for sudden symptoms. tell your doctor if you have kidney problems, glaucoma, trouble urinating, or an enlarged prostate. these may worsen with spiriva. discuss all medicines you take, even eye drops.

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welcome back to "the kudlow report." i'm michelle caruso-cabrera. there are a number of reports that iran is working on developing nuclear in a number of areas. here is marc ginsburg and ken timerman of news max, contributor and ceo of the foundation for democracy in iran and john batchelor. john, have you some great stats about what's happening in iran. >> within hours, the iaea, the watchdog for nuclear violations, the proliferation treaty at the u.n., told us at one facility, an unbombable facility in a mountain, they have increased the amount of sewn trifudges 50% and increased their ability to make fissile material, perhaps

accidental from 20% to 27% and most alarming of all, the last three months while talks going on, iran increased its stockpile of medium enriched fissile material. in three months, the direction is contest and war. >> even throw they are supposedly in negotiations -- >> in negotiations to stop all enrichment. >> you heard those numbers now. what should we make of these? how far are we away from iran to actually be able to have a bomb now? >> the first thing, the second round of negotiations in iran clearly failed. while negotiations have been going on, which some people believe are decoy for the acceleration of enrichment to the level that is necessary to nuclearize a weapon, the most important thing to understand here is there are stages to this, you have to first enrich enough uranium to 90%, you have to be able to create a triggering mechanism and load it

on a bomb and test it, at what point, there along this route remains to be seen. probably somewhere within six months at the earliest estimate. so the key to understand is while there may be a second round -- i'm sorry. a third round of negotiations now in moscow, the bottom line is the iranians rejected the united states and its european allies offer of compromise here and this gives them more time to continue to do precisely what john just said. >> so, ken, to john's point, it's just all been delay tactics it seems. >> that's right. the iranians have gotten us into the carpet store. that's the tactic. i wrote this in a column. once you're in the carpet store, they know you will buy the carpet. the question, what is the final price. the carpet they want us to buy is to allow them to continue to enrich uranium, that's a disaster, a huge concession that the obama administration has made. a big, big mistake. a deadly mistake.

>> gentlemen, a couple of deadlines coming up. let's use that advisedly. july 1st, the ban on oil exports from iran goes into effect. ambassador ginsburg, does that july 1st move this story when it goes to moscow. does iran offer any concession whatsoever in order to give a fig leaf to stop that ban? >> the most important thing to remember, those in the foreign policy community will argue that iran steps up in this game of chicken to the very last moment. >> right. right. >> and then makes compromises. it's anyone's guess. the fact of the matter is why would they compromise if they can ultimately divide the united states from its european allies, throw some bone to the europeans, the president may be more adamant than european allies and so dividing up the allies here is their key to a successful negotiation. >> mr. timerman, i'll be hard on you here.

we're not talking about military interventi intervention. we're talking about zone of immunity. we know at some point, iran will have moved all of its enrichment facilities to places we cannot get at them. no matter the striped package. your estimate of zone of immunity, not enrichment now when it doesn't matter about their enrichment, because we can attack, what is it, ken? >> they are already there. look, they have been at this well over 20 years, a secret program for 20 years. i have been arguing for a long time, the best policy, most moral policy, the people of iran get rid of the regime. it's our problem, not even the nuclear weapons. we always send our young men and women to pick up the mistakes. to pick up the pieces after our politicians have made a mistake. that say disaster, that is an immoral policy. we have the opportunity still to help the people of iran, the obama administration has bargained away --

>> you are not talking about abating, are you? >> no, not at all. giving them financial assistance, training in nonviolent protests. >> it's not happening anymore now, ken. and the window is shutting on zone of immunity. marc, i come to you, because i believe in jaw jaw, but not forever. it's not about the election, it's about the zone of immunity. tell me, is it over, marc. should we accept the fact that they are a nuclear power? >> i don't agree with that. listen, i'm not naive at all about this. the fact of the matter there, are several stages they have to prove they are able to weaponize this. >> to go from 20% to 90% is a clock. you know that. they are already there. they are ready to go, marc. >> john, agree with you, but remember, there are three more stages after they reach 90%. >> yes. mr. timerman, one more time. zone of immunity, give me a date. when? right now wendy sherman in

jerusalem. the chief representative of the state department and dealing with the frustration of the israeli government. they are under axiex existentia threat. >> iran is a nuclear state today. that's something we have to understand. the iaea has found they have done cold tests on what the iaea called a workable nuclear weapon. >> mr. chairman, michelle, you are here all of the time, are the investors aware of this scale of threat? that uranium can be a bomb in moments, but israel has to move before that? >> we have talked about it a number of times. when the news broke. oil didn't respond all that much. it really -- and that would be the market where you would think people would be worried about disruptions, so i'm not so sure. i'm thinking that investors assume in the end, there will be a stalemate, but perhaps we just live with it. >> in other words, counting on

rational actors. >> exactly. >> all right, fine. ambassador ginsberg, we're rational, are they? >> no, not at all the idea that they want to protect the regime from disintegrating, no doubt about that. if the ayatollah woke up and had the bomb, he would be happy he had the bomb. the key, of course, not just an exi stential threat to israel. all options on the table, the president of the united states declared. the national security threat to the united states and the president is going to have to back those words up with deeds if, indeed, we and the israelis get to the point where that intelligence is irreversibly, irredeemably clear. >> we'll have to see. >> and it's just allowing them to buy more time. >> yes. we've learn thad much tonight. marc ginsburg, ken timerman, john batchelor stays for the rest of the show. coming up, a late-day dive

on stocks on eurozone anxiety. the fallout if greece fails. and you may want to turn your eyes from europe to china. the once-hot economy is turning ice cold. could china be the next economic heart stopper for our economy? "the kudlow report" will be right back. ck. today is gonna be an important day for us. you ready? we wanna be our brother's keeper. what's number two we wanna do? bring it up to 90 decatherms. how bout ya, joe? let's go ahead and bring it online.

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road than a year ago. gas prices lower too, believe it or not. more than 30 million americans will drive more than 50 miles on memorial day weekend, according to aaa and jeffrey neely, the gsa regional official who caused that vegas blowout. gsa canceled 35 conferences after this broke. this is incredible. nasa and space x have completed half of the big mission. the dragon craft captured by astronauts aboard the international space station. that being a good thing. 250 miles over australia they will spend a week unloading the booty, 1,200 pounds of supplies. back on planet earth, greece casting shadows. "the kudlow report" with the michelle caruso-cabrera will be right back.

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welcome back to "the kudlow report." i'm michelle caruso-cabrera in for kudlow.

joining me is john batchelor. is an equally dangerous threat brewing farther east. do china's troubles run deeper than we think? a tipping point for the global economy? memorial day weekend, for most of us time for fun, friends, family. if you are congress, it's the beginning of yet another vacation. is the right time for folks on the hill to be taking a break? first up, the crisis in europe cast a shadow over the markets ahead of the long holiday the contagion fears grow. maybe greece leaves, maybe europe divides in two. or the entire european union falls apart. here is jared levy, dan greenhouse, and brett ahrens.

good to see you. brett, how possible is it that we see greece leave and europe fall apart? how big a deal for the u.s. economy? >> two separate questions. i mean, i think, look, greece has to leave, i mean, these guys need to call dr. laura. this is a relationship problem. a doomed relationship. it's been clearly doomed for many years, like most doomed relationships, they seem to be spending an enormous amount of time trying to avoid the inevitable. greece has to leave. no intention of paying back the money they received. the germans can't understand this, because they are not greek. >> what does that mean for the u.s. economy? >> it doesn't mean a lot for the u.s. economy, doesn't mean a lot for europe. the only problem is when they basically tie everything to that. i mean, european union has foolishly risked its credibility, drawn a line in the sand in the wrong place. tried to defend greece. >> how should american investors at home think about the situation? >> you can't ignore it everything about headline risks.

greene greece means nothing. in the grand scheme, it's nothing. a key part of the european zone and more importantly, it sets a precedent. if greece exits, the precedent set if this thing breaks apart. i can tell you this. i've seen it happen before on much smaller scales, the headline risk will send the market lower. greece will exit. it's a little while down the road, but the headline risk. >> what do you do then? >> there is nothing to do for the regular stock investor, but move to more of the sort of dividend payers, the companies that have been around, don't have a lot of international exposure, number one. and number two, not earning a lot of money in europe. a lot of exposure here in the united states. local companies like waste management might be one to look at. a lot of multinationals, you will have a problem with that's what's affecting us. the currency differential. making less money in europe. >> i have to say -- >> dan green house. your assessment of the situation and how you invest as a result?

>> i think it's btig's base case scenario slightly more than a 50% chance that greece leaves the eurozone. not nearly assured as some commentators have been articulating. not that it's better for greece in the five to ten-year time frame it would be extraordinarily disruptive for the pop you husband already on edge. and the idea that problems are solved by leaving is one which i disagree. >> okay. what do you do in terms of investing? your base case scenario, better than a 50% chance that they leave. slightly more. so if there is a lot of headline risk as jared says what do you do as an investor? >> something to be said about the fact that there is not much you can do. and at the same time, it really depends on who you are as a retail investor. shouldn't be picking individual stocks anyway. generally speaking, we've been advocating a more defensive

portfolio, that's -- that's not to say there aren't high growth companies to which you should be exposed to. but i do agree with the idea that somehow if we're talking about the break over the eurozone, equities going much lower in general. >> but, brett, i think that would mean a lot of people might want to buy treasuries and yet they yield over almost nothing, and a lot of people think there is a bubble there. >> all of this presumes -- look, we're all guessing about the future. anyone buying risk as celts by division is taking on risk. i would argue, although quite possible that that europe and equities will go lower in the short time. quite possible indeed. one thing that leaps out at me when the look at equities, large caps in europe, many of them are ekextremely good measure. tech co, with global operations

and sanofia, warren buffett traders, both trading below -- >> haven't equities been cheap for two years, three years? >> so what? buy good-quality companies at cheap valuations and it depends on your time frame. what i'm talking about people who are long-term investors buying stuff that is highly valued or fully valued. not particularly profitable long-term strategy. i wouldn't buy treasuries. i may be wrong. would someone buy treasuries. i will say, many european equities are reasonable value, and everyone is terrified of them. >> what about technology, jared? an area of the market where -- the average investor is so interested in apple, google, facebook, of course. are they in union in any way?

>> it's a broad question it boils down to what sort of area are you focusing on in technology? we brought up china earlier. china is deteriorating. their imports of semiconductors and iron ore and coal. you don't want to mess around with semiconductor companies. apple, keeping with the theme of cheap relative price to earnings and with the theme of best in breed. if you are going anywhere, picking individual stocks, a company like apple interesting. couples that are build the cloud, making the processes cheap. making the way of doing business cheap, that's you what want to stick with. again, saving money, you want to look for ways to cust costs. >> and one final idea as we go to break here. >> we have a neutral on apple. we'll pie check. our analyst is concerned about the pays of subsidies going forward and not that apple is not a super attractive company from a retailing and product standpoint, but i think sort of we're a little concerned about whether or not the pace of subsidies will continue, and if

that's accurate, then there is a real concern about the stock going forward. >> let's clarify for viewers going forward. they might think you mean government subsidies. you are talking about the subsidies to make the phone cheaper. >> that's a whole other segment we'll get into. >> thank you for joining us. all right, up next, a giant drag on the horizon. china's once-hot economy, taking a turn for the worse. unnerving investors in world markets. still ahead, washington out of control as america races toward the fiscal cliff. lawmakers headed home for yet another extended vacation. how long can the economy survive this do-nothing president and congress? the free-market friday gang is here. stick around for more.

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i'm michelle caruso cab her nkc in for larry kudlow. joining success gordon chang, peter navarro, author of "death by china. good to see you. gentlemen, john batchelor comes in, highlights the article in "the atlantic" is china growing at 6%, 8%, fall below 8%? and "the atlantic" says they have no growth. zero. is it possible that china has zero growth right now? >> it's also probable. >> probable? >> yes. if you look at april, electricity production increased by 0.7% and the growth of electricity, historically outpaces the growth of the underlying economy, they can't be growing more than zero. there are other reliable indicators that say less than

zero. >> peter, i want to come to you. we are right now questioning the idea that we can trust the chinese numbers, connect this to the united states. let's do worst-case scenario. do we have a plan "b?" say they are flat? what is the worst-case scenario? >> we all have to recognize the structural imbalance in the global economy. u.s., europe and china china is a parasite the last ten years, using unfair trade practices to take away the manufacturing bases of europe and the united states. now we've got a recession in europe and very slow growth in the u.s., china remains export dependent. it's slowing down and going to collapse. how that affects the u.s. is a double-edged sword. what china needs to do is to revalue its currency. give consumers some purchasing

power, grow its domestic economy and allow u.s., europe and china to prosper. otherwise we go into the protectionist trade war scenario. these are very perilous times for the global economy. i think it's really important for everyone to understand this is not a short-term cyclical problem. it's a structural story that's going to end in china. probably with a real estate bubble collapsing worse than what we had here. >> let me connect this too. events of these last weeks that have been spectacular headlines. a princeling accused of conspiracy, murder of an englishman. an investigation that now sweeps through and charges corruption, major members. also the escape of a human rights activist. a blibd activist who finds his way to an american embassy and travels to america. gordon, there is rumor of a palace coup under way. the standing committee know there will be a changing of the guard. does this connect to the economy? >> it connects to the economy,

the communist party's legitimacy based on the continual delivery of prosperity, and once it's gone, the party has one more issue to fight over, and fighting over quite a lot recently. what happens, it prevents the party from healing at the top, and if the party can't heal at the top, anything is possible. >> gordon, back to the original. we have an investor base that assumes worst-case scenario, as growth slows to 6% in china. if it's zero, the implications for us would be enormous, no? >> you know, china has been real trouble since august and september, precipitously falling in the first quarter. zero or worse in april, and we're still here. you know, we hold the high cards in the relationship with china we are buying stuff from them. so it doesn't affect us as much as people think. of course, the shock factor, our markets will tumble. as you say, people assume 8% growth. >> tell me this. if we can't believe these

numbers now, can we believe any of them for the last 30 years? >> we can believe some of them. and sometimes the regime doesn't have much of a motive to dress up its numbers, but right now it does, because it can see what's happening. >> peter, the central banker, leaving office, a new guy coming in. this is not attractive right now, is this a critical factor for the american investor, changing of the guard, and the guard has daggers out. >> well, let me look at it from the investors' point of view, because this is cnbc. the truckural imbalance means for the foreseeable future, we'll have a flat to declining stock market. with china going into the toilet it will mean you will be short australia, brazil, russia, all of the commodity countries, and it's -- and it's going to mean that the dollar's probably going to strengthen and it will probably mean the long bond will

stay up with these yields that are close to zero which is just the -- to me, the fact that the long bond is where it is, is the worst possible news for america and the world. >> peter, just a moment. we're talking to sydney. you are talking about 8% growth in china. it's your economy. it's morning time. saturday morning. >> australia, i said this a long time. it's simply a colony now of china, and if china goes into the toilet, australia is certainly going to swirl down with it. >> is australia ready for this? >> no, they have no game plan. the problem, countries like canada, australia. >> gordon, finish your thought. >> the iron ore and coal exporters are in trouble. the rest of the economy will get better, australia right now has the dutch disease because of all of the commodity exports, eventually, australia will heal itself, it will take some time.

>> all righty. just a thought. >> sure. >> we're telling investors something they need to understand. but they are not hearing it from the big analysts in asia. that's a problem for them. >> the small retail investor needs to stay out of market for a while. sophisticated small retail investor needs to be short. >> because we -- sophisticated investors get in trouble in this market, right? >> no jamie dimon. >> thank you for coming in. coming up next, it's run asi. no, no, no, it's crazy to think you might see a member of congress. that was frudian and hopeful, a mefb commerce. they are out of washington for the weekend and all next week is this too much fiddling while rome burns, or is america safer actually when congress takes a break? at aviva, we do things differently. we're bringing humanity back to life insurance.

that's why only aviva rewards you with savings for getting a check-up. it's our wellness for life program, with online access to mayo clinic. see the difference at avivausa.com.

welcome back. i'm michelle caruso-cabrera in for larry kudlow. how absurd can you get? the senate on a week vacation after passing a bill which strikes the word lunatic from federal law. does the economy need congress to set aside the real rlunacy?

jennifer rubin, john mcloughlin, republican strategist poll, good to see you. are we safer when congress is on vacation or when they are working? >> i'm torn if they would have removed the lunatics from government, that bill would have been worth its weight in gold. purely a correct political speech issue in a perfect world, congress would have a budget, dealing with the fiscal cliff on the spending side and tax side, but they are not. and so as a result, at least they are not making things worse. i think we'll come to a point this year, maybe because of china, your previous guests pointed out, maybe because of the euro, where we begin to get very nervous again, about the credit rating, the tax increase and if we hit a wall in terms of growth, the president is going to want to do something. i think it's a little late,

though. this is american as facebook. in other words, if you have a good opinion of congress who are you? and the pollsters want to know your families. who are these nine or 11% who like congress? do you know them personally? are they your neighbors? >> they are the last loyal americans. they just like everything. the reality of it is, what's interesting, even though the congressional ratings are terrible as an institution, the ballot for the generic ballot for congress is close with the republicans a little ahead. it's really partisan and what michelle is talking about, the house has sent over 30 bills related to jobs. a small business tax cut to create jobs, a jobs bill that democrats signed this year that majority leader cantor passed, but the senate won't pass a budget. so what's going on right now is -- and they are going home to their district.

everybody says they are going on vacation, they are going to their district. hopefully they are getting an earful they need to create jobs. >> brian, a congress divided is attractive, era after era. democrats control one house, the white house is in the hands of another party. that's where we are right now. is that a good thing? is that what the american people want? >> i think it depends on who is in charge. sometimes it ki about a good thing. frankly, far be it for me to say a good thing about the reagan presidency. the fact is, when tip o'neil and robert berg were controlling congress and they were able to, despite their very public disagreements with reagan, able to put aside differences and work for the good of the country, that actually works. sometimes it can work, sometimes it can't. the problem here, we have an explosive hat trick of hyper partisanship, election-year politics and an absolute addiction to governing by brinksmanship. it simply cannot stand. what we got last time around with that is the credit got

downgra downgraded, and it stayed in congress and consumer confidence at an all-time low. >> i think it's more than that. we have two very different views of governing. a republican party that wants to lower taxes, keep spending at around 20%, a little less than 2 20% gdp. we have a congress that wants to build and grow the welfare state. what do the american people want? and some people have to choose. >> i could not disagree why. the most likely scenario out of the election is exactly what we got now. i think obama will be re-elected narrowly, the senate will remain in democrats' hans, house will remain in reprepublicans' hands. >> once he's not running for office might he be -- >> the pressure will be paramou paramount, not only on the president, but on speaker bainer to give up government by

brinksmanship, come together -- >> i don't think so. >> have you 30 seconds to sell the american people that a unified congress with the american presidency is a good idea. >> 30 seconds. >> obama's poll ratings, like a facebook ipo. what's going on right now, about to take over the presidency, keep the house and take over the senate. and -- >> you know what makes me nervous? the last time that happened, the republicans spent like crazy. >> it won't happen. >> that's how we got -- with you oh, no, no, no. >> 2009, unified congress, democrats and white house, they gave us two of the most unpopular years we've had for a long time, hence the tea party. and, therefore, in 2001, to 2003, i unified congress with a republican president. gave us the tax credits tearing the country apart. the example, a unified congress is the worst case.

>> i would argue that divided government we had under both clinton and republicans accept when republicans decide to go on impeachment dance and work for the good of the country. that's not to suggest i want republicans to take control of the senate. >> bill clinton is congress. really cooperated with him. it was magic? >> no, we had a decent president. a president who knew how to lead, a president who got in there, cared about the nuts and bolts of government. >> who didn't despise business. >> who didn't demonize the opposition. >> obama despises. >> clinton looks -- >> he did workfare. >> nafta. >> the defense of marriage act was clinton. >> nothing but -- >> 360 filibusters. >> are you -- republican house,

senate, white house, ka tass on fooe? >> no, not at all. are you barg 4 barring 40 cent every dollar. >> talk about optics. mr. romney in the white house, mrs. pelosi if she remains, will go on defense and they will look like the chicago bears. >> you are talking about process. you need to talk about results. too much at stake this year. we're looking right now, if nothing is done, we are looking at predicting 4% growth with 2 million new jobs. if we go off the fiscal cliff, backward no, jobs. >> the house, senate and white house. dream scenario, or catastrophe? >> it depends. >> 2013, give to up. >> you also have a senate that is probably not filibuster free, so they will be there, and you will have mitt romney, not an ideologue. probably a time in history made for this man this guy governed in massachusetts this is the guy

who was not an ideologue. he makes deals. >> that's why the base doesn't like him. >> exactly. >> and what was a liability in the primary is now a strength in the general election. >> i'm so sorry. >> bill clinton, is he available? >> i think constitutionally, no. >> in his mind, i bet he is thank you. many thanks to john batchelor. so much fun. that's it for tonight's show i'm michelle caruso-cabrera. larry back on tuesday. have a great holiday weekend. thanks for watching. [ male announcer ] when a major hospital wanted to provide better employee benefits while balancing the company's bottom line, their very first word was... [ to the tune of "lullaby and good night" ] ♪ af-lac ♪ aflac [ male announcer ] find out more at... [ duck ] aflac! [ male announcer ] ...forbusiness.com.

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hello ? hello ?! if your bank doesn't let you talk to a real person 24/7, you need an ally. hello ? ally bank. no nonsense. just people sense. yes, mr. mayor. no, i totally agree, 100%. >> mr. trump, you're going to be late for the finale. >> get me the fastest driver anywhere in the world. >> yes, mr. trump. >> i have to go now. we're doing a live finale of "celebrity apprentice." i think it's going to be amazing. you take care of yourself. bye. 15 weeks, 18 celebrities, and it all comes down to this very big moment. who will become the next celebrity