you just need the right professional to help you take charge. ♪ this this portfolio morphed in to something than rather to protect the firm, created potentially new, larger risk. as a result we have let a lot of people down and we are very sorry for it. >> dimon in the rough. did he hit it out 069 rough smartly or not? dimon on the hill. i'm tyler math son at cnbc xwloebl headquarters. >> i'm sue herrera at the new york stock exchange. it is the story that all of wall street is watching today and most of the nation, as well. jamie dimon testifying before the senate banking committee. investors watching the testimony this morning word by word and

the stock tick by tick, up 3.5%. i was at the jpmorgan post. the volume is heavy right now. since releasing details of may 10th, shares are down overall about 20%. mary thompson just speaking with mr. dimon. she was the first to get him after the testimony. she responded to her question about the volcker rule. >> i think the very important part of volcker is finish the rules. we have the widest, deepest, most transparent markets in the world. those capital markets are one of the engines that built -- helped build this wonderful country of ours. let's be thoughtful about volcker. >> mary joins us now and literally just finished the interview with mr. dimon. nicely done by the way, mary. >> thank you. >> you covered a variety of topics. what struck you perhaps as the

most significant in this wide-ranging discussion? >> well, i think, nlg, the fact that he is -- he is as he has before taken responsibility for it. there were no excuses for to happen. within the cio they had gotten a little bit complacent and made changes and he said there is going to be a memo coming out. this is going to be made public on that he actually signed off on changes to how this group measures risk. it's var. again, this is an area of question in large part because the measure was changed in january and then changed back in april once the trading losses were discovered. we are going to know more details on july 13th, but again, some progress has been made with this trading loss. again, the 2 billion he acknowledged, the loss remains i think what the bank has done so far or hopes to have done is contained future losses on this trading loss. guys? >> mary, one of the thing this is's interesting as you spoke to him was what he didn't say and

it wasn't because you weren't pushing him. he pushed him to tell us more about what the ultimate loss or hit may be. he wasn't ready to do that. he wasn't ready to say whether more people were going to lose their jobs and he wasn't ready to say anything about what this has done to his own reputation. he's a rather for as strong a character as he is, he comes across as a rather self effacing one. >> certainly. i mean, he was very open from the beginning when they revealed this loss, tyler, saying it was a stupid mistake. you know? and today in the testimony he said the buck stops here. as far as disclosing how large the loss could be, it could be that the bank still doesn't know at this point or give away anything that they have done in trying to reduce their risk because it might provide some advantage to some of their competitors and certainly as a ceo of a bank trying to manage a large what could be a potentially even larger loss you

don't want to provide anyone with insight. as far as if anymore heads roll, keep in mind they're still reviewing the cio office and that could result, you know, depending on the information that they or maybe the board through the independent review undertakes, that could result in further firings. you don't want to say, no, we won't fire anyone from here on in. you could end up eating your words and given he's had to eat the tempest in the teapot words with the london whale on april 13th rvegts, i'm sure he doesn' to make the same mistake again. >> andrew, i want the lay the question on the table and maybe i shouldn't say it but was this hearing a tempest in a teapot? >> it may have been well been a tempest in the teapot. the big headlines that came to

me is he did say they're likely to do claw backs. the idea they had misinformation in the firm and shared it with regulators and a question of regulators to see through that misinformation, of course. but, you know, at the end of the day, jamie dimon lay the blame at his own feet, said that he and the firm was complacent. take a listen to this piece of testimony. >> first error we made was that the cio unit had done so well for so long that i think there was a little bit of come place ensy and maybe overconfidence. it had its own risk committee and supposed to properly overview and vet all the risk. i think that committee itself while independent wasn't independent minded enough and should have challenged more frequently, more rigorously this credit portfolio. >> the other piece i thought was interestinging he said repeatedly that he didn't believe this was nefarious and a question, was it a hedge, a

proprietary trade or the group trying to make money? they may have been. but ultimately, he still believes that internally the intent was to hedge the position even though that was not the result. >> and you know, guys, i'm going to pick up on that and bring in jeff who was with us yesterday and has a buy on the stock. jeff, one of the kree points in the system for me is when mr. dimon was asked about differentiating between a hedge that was put on and proprietary trading. and he said and i'm paraphrasing, certainly, that you can't draw line delineating the two completely. i wonder if that comes back to haunt him as they try to decide whether or not this was a hedge or whether it was proprietary tr trading and what is your reaction to that? >> i think that's a statement of fact. that's a big problem with the volcker rule.

how do you differentiate client trades and by definition a market maker positioning yourself around that flow and committing capital? >> i think the spirit of the law is you shouldn't do that anymore but banks keep positions themselves around flow in they're allowed to trade and that's a big problem. >> jeff, as i look at the stock chart right now, it seems to be signaling something and one of the things that a dummie like i could infer from it is that the worst is over for jp morgan in this episode. do you agree? >> i think jamie handled himself well today and set people at ease and the panel members were civil and may be the difference between the house and the senate but i think, you know, we found out that they will be -- he seemed to emphasize solidly profitable in the quarter. i think that was productive. and he took a lot of the blame,

he talked about claw backs. he is as critical as ever about the same parts of the regulatory environment he's been critical of and jp morgan's going to keep taking risk. they're not just going to shut down because they made a mistake. there's good things to like for the stock. unfortunately, the markets are volatile and at least as i look at it i'm surprised if the $2 billion loss isn't bigger and he headwinds to come. >> mary? >> i want to add i asked, sue, mr. dimon about that quote he gave in the hearing. >> yes. >> meaning that it was hard to distinguish a bright line of prop trading and hedging and i said but you've said this was a hedge. he repeated that. they still believe it's a hedge. they don't believe that anything nefarious happened at the cio. my question to jeff is that he says that the complacency occurred only in the oversight of the cio's office but when you see it in one area of a company,

is it possible that complacency is happening at other areas of the company that are doing well, too? and where would you be concerned about jp morgan in the event they don't have proper oversight elsewhe elsewhere? >> that was the big surprise to on this to me. traders and the investment bank, it seems like they're very well managed. they have a tight system and to have one thing to fall out of the umbrella is concerning. i'm comfortable with the risk but i mean it does definitely open the company to criticism and jamie to criticism that the one big portfolio managed to not be under the umbrella and a most important part of risk investment is a system in place to catch everything. can't be dependent on one business or unit. i don't think there are other big losses lurking within jp morgan we don't know about. >> one thing i found that's

interesting, though, he did defend and sing the praises to a certain extent of ms. drew and how she had guided the company through other financial storms very aptly. mary, were you surprised by that? >> no, i think, you know, he had placed a lot of trust in her and the business had done very well so i think, you know, he'd want to acknowledge that the business did well. however, he is repeatedly said without naming her directly that the strategy that was put in place to basically reduce this hedge that they had put in place in order to protect the bank from any kind of credit event is poorly vetted and supervised and read between the lines that that would fall at ms. drew's feet. >> andrew, let me turn to you. it occurred to me that to the point that mary was just making that he had placed a lot of trust in that chief investment officer's office and in miss drew and i heard him say at one

point something that reminded me of john kerry's famous line that i was for it before i was against it or against it before i was for it. he said that the office made billions of dollars before it lost billions of dollars. >> i have to tell you. i give jamie dimon in this particular case credit. people talk about whether he's lost kretd bltd credibility wit. the jamie premium has come up with the company but ultimately we may look back at the experience a year or two from now and talk about lessons in leadership because when you think about what he's saying of ms. drew, he is not throwing her under the bus. there is something to be said of a ceo at a time of blood lust in this country and in the press and elsewhere about these issues to actually come out and say, you know what? she made a mistake. i made a mistake. whatever. and i think there is something to be said about that and i think all too often we don't

reflect upon that enough. >> but i think coming out of this, we don't reflect on past mistakes consistently because complacency is often one of the reasons companies get in trouble. and that's what happened here. >> boy, that's absolutely the truth. you think it will work because in to the future because it worked so well in the past. before we bring in jim orio is the thought of in that hearing room you heard a lot of anger toward bankers from senator menendez and murkly of oregon, senator reid and others and wasn't just about this trade but mortgage workouts and so on and so forth and as you said, andrew, it is the -- what's in the air right now and certainly in that hearing room to my ears, at least. let's bring in jimmy orio to ask the question i asked a moment ago. do you think the worst is over for jp morgan's stock? >> no. i don't, actually.

tyler, you said anger towards banks a second ago and that's the whole trading thesis on the trade. did i expect a euphoric relief rally after this? yeah, probably. it's making me nervous. but at the end of the day, the banks have to deal with this. something else i think is very important here is the rest of the banking sector, goldman sachs and morgan stanley, did not do well even though jpmorgan is rallying. to me it means there's problems ahead. >> you are short jp morgan and short on goldman sachs. you see today as a relief rally, right? >> yes. >> thanks very much. thanks to everybody, mary, andrew, jeff hart, everybody. everybody. we thank everybody. much more on jamie dimon's testimony coming up. plus a true money player from europe. can there be a solution to the crisis? what's the right move for you? we'll talk to a very interesting fellow after this break. first, though, today's big movers.

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welcome back welcome back to "power lunch." brian shactman here. whether you like atvs or snowmobiles, the market is moving today. polar us may sales they say slower than march and april dragging down the stock almost

5% and spillover to arctic cat. that stock also down sharply. recreational vehicles, caterpillar down in some sympathy to that. not quite a competitor because it's more commercial vehicles and then came out saying we're increasing the dividend 13% to 52 cents from 46 and that's a dow component. lot of people own it. back to you. >> indeed they do. thank you very much. breaking news from right now from the bond market. more than 20 billion in 10-year notes off the auction block. rick santelli is on the case to give us a grade. >> the final record, record yield low yield at auction. 1.622. there were 21 billion, 9-year 11-months. here's the metrics. 3.09. this auction 3.06. 10-auction average indirect. this auction 42 on the nose

direct. 15%. this one 20.8! so considering all of the metrics we're pretty much spot-on. direct higher. dealers took 37%. priced through the street the low on the wi 63. that is b-plus. back to you. >> thank you. some of the senators asking on the banking committee with ties to jp morgan and jamie dimon. john carny is working on one angle but we begin with eamon javers in washington. >> that's right, tyler. you can see jamie dimon's own personal reaction as he sort of bobbed and weaved in a moment with the cnbc camera after coming out of the hearing room and truth be told the capitol hill hearings are sort of a familiar environment for jamie dimon and the hill itself is. his lobbyists have near constant

conversation with the banking committee and look at the trail personally and members of congress and the political world in general. starting with the jp morgan political action committee which has given money to all but six of the members of the banking committee. dimon personally gave money to senators corker and warner just this past cycle and given in the past to the top democrat and the top republican on this committee. he gave $55,000 to the democratic senatorial campaign committee in 2008 and supported hillary clinton in '08 and did in the end give $50,000 to the obama inaugural so dimon personally and jp morgan as a political action committee spread a lot of money around washington and should be said that the pac leans republican over the past several years and jamie dimon has ratcheted back some of his campaign contributions since that '08 cycle when he was really active. >> thank you very much. making the point of money and

politics go hand in hand. to john carny and another round of ties between the senate banking committee and dimon. >> it's not just about the money. the money is very telling but what we have in the senate banking committee is probably the worst example of the revolving door on capitol hill. the current head of the banking committee staff is a former partner at a firm that lobbied for jp morgan chase. the vice president of government relations the former banking committee staff head. so you have a guy who used to be a lobbyist is on the committee staff directing it. guy who used to be on the banking committee staff is now at jp morgan. the interrelationships between the staffers and the lobbyists is so tight that people in washington, d.c. refer to it as the banking blob. i should also add that the head of the committee tim johnson, his former banking aide is also

a lobbyist working directly for jp morgan chase. these people are really tight and i think you can sense that in the questioning of a lot of senators that there's a very close relationship to jp morgan and all the other large banks. it's not exactly an arm's length deal going on. >> john, am i mistaken? i believe the former chief of staff at the white house -- >> you're right about this. >> sue? >> ty, next the view from inside europe. first, more from jamie dimon today. >> there's some negatives to size. you know? greed, arrogance, lack of attention to detail. but if you do a good job, your clients are served and you win their business.

so anyway, i've been to a lot of places. you know, i've helped a lot of people save a lot of money. but today...( sfx: loud noise of large metal object hitting the ground) things have been a little strange. (sfx: sound of piano smashing) roadrunner: meep meep. meep meep? (sfx: loud thud sound) what a strange place. geico®. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. what ? customers didn't like it. so why do banks do it ? hello ?

hello ?! if your bank doesn't let you talk to a real person 24/7, you need an ally. hello ? ally bank. no nonsense. just people sense. >> welcome >> welcome back to "power lunch." brian shactman here. looking at dendreon. 7.5%, pretty good, you might say. look at the one-year. been absolutely thumped to the tune of 80% in the last 12 months. obviously, been talked about as a potential takeover target. not sure if we have the one-year there. boom, there it is. 82%. the countdown is on to the weekend election in greece. so, ahead of that, let's go around the horn to show you how the markets fared today.

greece, finished up 2%. spain up 2.25%. italy, though, down just about two thirds of 1% on the trading session. almost flat on the ftse 100 over in the uk and in germany, the dax there finished down 8 points, just over a tenth of a percent. and a new poll of economists showing it is more likely that spain will need international help to fund state operations in the next 12 months. 35 out of 59 analysts now say yes they will need that aid. two months ago 15 analysts said yes and today italy's prime minister appealed to politicians in italy to back his tough budget-cutting plan in order for italy to avoid being in danger of also needing a bailout. ty? sue, we want to get more on the crisis in europe. from a person who lives there. and is a real financial insider. on the continent. he's a real european insider

through and through live for us in new york. i can see you squirming as i describe you in such a flourish. but let me just start with a couple of things before we talk about your private equity business. greek elections are this week. how do you think they're gong to turn out? you just had an election in france. do you think greece is going to be a part of the euro two years from now? >> that's obviously the big question. it looks like the greek are realizing that leaving euro would cause more issues than would solve problems. my feeling is that greek will try to stay within the euro zone. you know, the euro needs the greek and the greeks need the dw euro. >> what about spain and france? >> i would hope same thing, right? i mean, those two countries are in very different situations. spain is obviously in a lot of

problems. unemployment is as you know very, very high. and there is a very large need for spending cuts everywhere in europe. i guess that's the issue. you know? we have been living over the last 30 years from credit and it's now time to live differently. and this doesn't happen overnight. >> it's like what's happened in the united states in some ways in some of our states. we substituted borrowing for growth, didn't we, antoine? >> yeah. the issue is that -- i mean, that's something you cannot -- i mean, that's something you can try to do but it's -- i mean, you cannot really, you know, say we're now going for growth. yeah. >> sue? >> at times like these, it's difficult for businesses to get business done because credit has been tight, because of the financial fallout in europe. how is business functioning from your perspective in terms of private equity?

are you able to do deals? what's the financing like in doing those deals? is business better in the bad times than perhaps in the good? >> very good question. is a deal done now better than a deal done on the buyout side in 2007? maybe yes. the issue is if you want to do a blo, you need the "l" and leverage is definitely not there right now in europe. deals are very tough to do, not only buying but selling. which creates another problem and that's that lps, investors and funds, are not getting money back. >> let's talk about a little bit about france, if we might. we said there's a spending problem all across europe and in france there's a new president of france. there's a new legislature in france. do you think the president is the kind of leader who will do what needs to be done fiscally

to right the budget in your country? >> it seems like mr. hollande and his friends are big spenders. i mean, his span is to increase taxes and to increase expenses. i think he should do just exactly the opposite. decrease expenses and decrease taxes and that would be a good start to go back to growth. >> so you felt sarkozy had a better formula, a better strategy? >> a little bit. i mean, it was definitely not, you know -- i mean, the situation was a bit different, cut some expenses but not as much as needed. there's still a lot of room for, you know, cutting and cutting and cutting. >> so as we look ahead, obviously, we have the greek elections coming up. look further out for me. how does the euro cry set get

resolved in your opinion or does it get revolveded in the next few years? >> i would love to have the answer. i think printing money at the end of the day will probably be the only solution. there are ovenly some pros and many cons. but that's probably the only way to get back to a better world over there. >> antoine drean, thank you very much. >> thank you very much. >> good to see you. starting today, cnbc.com as a content partnership with yahoo! finance. original content, now paired with the information and unprecedented reach of yahoo!. the partnership immediately extends the reach and analysis to now include more than 40 million online users in the u.s. one great example, stories about how to euro-proof your portfolio. check out our special series of

reports on that topic online right now. all right. the gold market is closing right now. everybody's watching europe and watching the euro and sharon is doing the same thing for us. she is tracking the action at the nymex. >> hi, sue. the comments support the fact of the gold market and the worst is not yet come for europe's economy and perhaps part of the reason why gold is seen above the 1600 level and that weak retail sales data here in the u.s. that came out that pushed gold to the 1626 level earlier this morning and we lost those gains but still managed to eke out the highest close of the week here. we're also watching gold prices technically according to barclays in the mid year sideways trend and likely to see the trend stay around the $1,600 and why barclays is neutral on the prices and the key level is

1625 level, a close above there and then the 1640 level. in terms of other things to watch, keep your eye on the miners because in the last month or so we have definitely seen t the minors outperform gold prices and the operating cost coming down with oil prices down 20% in the last 3 months or so. back to you. >> thank you very much. now to brian shactman for a "market flash" on target. >> we talked about caterpillar raising the dividend. what do you do with cash flow? returning it to shareholders. target increasing the dividend by 20% to 36 cents a share. look at the stock. at the highs of the day right now up and a good month up more than 5% in the last 4 weeks. steve liesman takes on dimon's comments on the volcker rule and didn't know what it is. power is back in two.

all right. let's get a check of the action here on the floor of the new york stock exchange. the dow up about 15 points on the trading session, 12,589. bob pisani joins me. everyone was watching mr.

dimon's testimony. it seems like the market is treading waertd a little bit here. >> no. most traders feel he put on a stellar performance. if we close here we're at the highest levels of 11 days, the highest close of 11 days and persistent talk the fed will make an announcement next week, qe-3, the pathetic pace creates the action for fed action next week. a lot of speculation helping that. speaking of financials. gosh, jp morgan stock moving up. twice normal volume for them. elsewhere, the important thing is risk-on trades out there i'm seeing some signs of stabilization in the last couple of days. energy stocks and brent have stopped dropping. the australian dollar looks like it's trying the find a be the

tom here and even copper has stabilize a little bit. little signs of a little bit of good news here. back to you. >> ty, take it away. "power lunch" continues now. our coverage of dimon's testimony of capitol hill. ended an hour or so ago and exclusive one on one interview with mary thompson just in the past hour. let's drill down further now with greg zuckerman and neil wineberg. welcome to both of you. neil, did bankers take some bad hits today or did they come out pretty well? >> bankers came out pretty well today. you could tell that from the way jamie dimon was bobbing and weaving leaving the hearing. i think senators made the points that frankly i didn't think had a lot to do with the loss but got the points in without hitting jamie dimon and talking about mortgage losses to montana farmers and mf global and they didn't really focus most of the ammunition on jamie and he obviously handled himself quite well so i think this was a plus

and certainly the stock market has reflected that with roughly 3% gains so far for jp morgan today. >> there was rather diffuse anger at bankers i thought in the room as neil points out on everything from the mf global thing to mortgage remodifications and so forth but did you think that in some this hearing was a tempest in a teapot? >> not too many punches landed because there weren't too many punches thrown. there are things i would have liked to have heard, more about what jamie knew and when, why they didn't -- why they ignored red flags we have reported on. they went back two years. back to 2010 and 2011. with the executives within the group who are very worried about the trades. i would have liked to heard more about that kind of stuff. >> i'm sure you would have and i'm curious about that, as well. you wrote about that, indeed. perhaps we didn't get questions about the trade because they

gave mr. dimon the option of not revealing the positions as they try to unwind them. given what you know about when's on the opposite side of some of these trades, greg, how long do you think it will take jp mor again to get out of those positions and so far how do -- what are you hearing about how well they're doing at executing that? >> they could get out of a lot of them and very painful and cause a lot in the way of losses. there are hedge funds on the other side and banks on the other side and firms that made money exited the positions. jp morgan also it's believed among traders taken other positions to hedge these positions. in other words, hedge the hedge the hedge the hedge i guess. either way that protects them a little bit so -- but you have to remember in excess they're bets on corporate credit and hurt with the world worried of spain and greece and the united states. >> neil, what is the future for jamie dimon and jp morgan's

reputation as the best in breed? >> i think it's still intact but certainly i think as greg pointed throughout's a lot of question that is are yet to be resolved and this is really i think what happened today, a question of people seeing in this what they want to see. the republicans are going to say that overregulation and the volcker rule and all are real problem and the democrats are going to say, a-ha, this is an example that these banks are too big to manage and nobody can get control on them so i don't think it's going to have a huge impact on the overall, the overarching debate hear of what to do with the banks. >> when he was asked about regulation, mr. dimon said he was not necessarily against regulation. he just wanted well-defined, good, well-thought out regulation and do you think that the testimony or the jp morgan events might trigger a re-evaluation of regulation pending or not? >> it will have impact on the

volcker rule and that's what they're worried about and people on the street are worried about. you could make a strong argument they'll go too far. if you have a bank you have to put the money out. especially in debt markets and as such and there's a concern and should be that the regulators go too far but that said how do you ignore what's happened here? this was -- this is the largest bank in the country. the best run bank in the country and not just $2 billion in losses and not that big of a deal but they were shocked by them and surprised by them even up to jamie dimon's level and troubling stuff to look at. >> greg, and neil, thank you very much. i almost called you neil diamond. we just talked about volcker rule and played a big role in the questioning of jamie dimon. >> all we have asked with volcker is go through the detail to make sure we get it right, we end up with the widest, best, deepest capital markets in the world.

i don't want to sit here in 20 years trying to figure out why it's elsewhere. >> i say volcker rule, i think of steve liesman. mr. dimon basically said at one point he didn't think the volcker rule is truly necessary. >> i think it's really would have been useful to find out what jamie dimon knew about the volcker rule. he said specifically -- i don't know what the volcker rule yet. >> it's not written yet. >> published in november. a proposed rule. open for comment. the idea he doesn't know what's in the volcker rule, i can't believe a senator let him get away. a lot of questions, they could have done what greg asked for. unpack the deal. find out what happened, find out what dimon knew and when and the senior management or almost a gift to say, okay, we have got this rule. would it have prevented this? appeared that the senators joined jamie dimon is not having read what's in the volcker rule. >> are in the proposed language.

>> okay. taking on new risk through a hedge would have been prohib prohibited. internal written policies required to monitor the edges. internal controls required and training and records required. didn't jamie dimon say that this trade was not well vetted and not well monitored? >> yes. >> it strikes me that the volcker rule could have prevented the hedges and trades from being made. the failure to make that point or debate that point seems like the senators and jamie dimon missed a big opportunity. >> one thing he said if i'm recalling correctly, i paraphrase here, he felt that the initial position would have passed muster with the volcker rule but then what it became, when it crossed that line which he says it is admittedly not a bright line between being a hedge to being something different it mag me if ied risk rather than mitigating it at that point it might well have run afoul.

>> the other thing is thinking about the list of that stuff there, going through the processes, like telling the kid, did you think about this? did you think about this and that? had you gone through the check process you wouldn't have done those things in the first place and not allowed it to morph in to what he talked about which is a trade that got out of control. >> thank you very much. sue? you think about it because as part of a new partnership with yahoo! we have a poll running. we're asking you, in light of jpmorgan's recent multi-billion dollar trading loss, do you think u.s. banks should be be or more less regulated? you can go to yahoo! finance and cast your vote. results so far show more at 58%, same amount of regulation at 16%, less, 23% and only 4% are unsure. time for a "market flash" right now. brian? >> i'm looking at career education.

ceco. it's down more than 6% today. might lose acredit yags at ten of the institutions. online for-profit education and campuses. the bottom line is if you don't acredkreccreditation you can't students with federal help. back to you. >> thank you, brian, very much. the latest read on the health of housing. and much more on jamie dimon's testimony on capitol hill. >> no excuses but people make mistakes. we'll make mistakes. this is far bigger than a mistake we want to make and we had -- came out of exactly wrong time and exactly wrong way but that's what happens sometimes. mistakes don't wait for perfect timing.

[ creaking ] [ male announcer ] trophies and awards lift you up. but they can also hold you back. unless you ask, what's next? [ zapping ] [ clang ] this is the next level of performance. the next level of innovation. the next rx. the all-new f sport. this is the pursuit of perfection. coming coming up, did jamie dimon turn the tables on washington? and is he more bulletproof than we ever thought? also, tough year for dell but they just announced their

first-ever dividend. smart move or a sign for bubble? we'll check out ford's new $600 million plant built here in the united states. it ee's all coming up top of th hour. back to you. >> thank you very much. housing is one of the biggest drags on the economy. today we get new data on the state of future home buying. diana olick has more. >> that's right. surprising jump of mortgage applications. this as we transition from the usually brix spring market to the usually slower summer market. re-fi applications rose. this is the third of the year fixed came up slightly off the record low to 3.88%. the mortgage bankers warn the

increase accentuated but not that total market activity is now the highest since 2009. fbr analysts says that in talking to mortgage bankers they're hearing that demand for purchase mortgages is quote through the roof and lenders are saying capacity is very constrained right now and customers told to have lots of patience which in this market is a good thing. tyler, lots more on the blog. realtycheck.cnbc.com. >> thank you very much. after this short break, grading dimon's testimony on the hill. did he come out on top? did dodd-frank financial regulation win or lose? or was this really another black eye for wall street? we'll debate it.

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take a take a look. this is off of the best levels of the day. it was up almost 3.5% but still up 2.30%. investors are voting and they seem to think that mr. dimon did pretty darn well. let's bring in neil wineberg and bob pisani. let's give him a grade on the

performance from mr. dimon. what do you think, bob? you start. >> everybody came in thinking, sue, that jamie dimon would get the living daylights beaten out of him. he didn't. he answered every question in a short, assured manner. he wasn't disrespectful. look what he did. instead of concentrating on the mistake, he admitted he went forward and ended up with policy discussions. this is a win for him. >> you agree, neil? >> he got to talk about the things that he has problems with, he doesn't like the volcker rule. thinks we have this -- hash spaghetti pile of regulation and kind of turned the agenda in what the banking industry want to talk about. >> i think it was interesting. he didn't lose his temper, wasn't cocky and a couple questions where the senators were not well informed in terms of some of the facts. and he resisted the temptation to fire back at them.

>> they don't know -- look. the congress doesn't know how to manage the trades, either. the bottom line is he answered every one of the questions. >> move on to dodd-frank. is it a fep forward or backwards for the leg lags? >> the democrats keep with the heels dug in and the republicans continue. we go back to the trench warfare here, sue. the republicans want to roll it back so i think we have really not moved the ball too far forward or back ward here. >> dodd-frank took a huge step forward with this mistake of jp morgan but the testimony today, i thought he held his ground well on the criticisms of dodd-frank. >> didn't come out as anti-regulation. just wants well thought out regulation. >> excellent performance. yes. well done performance. >> wall street, let's move on. did they pass with flying colors or at lauger heads with washington? >> dimon won but wall street

didn't. the raepation is tarnished and i think jamie dimon went a long way to helping his reputation, restore some of his reputation. >> neil, you know, there was a lot of anger at bankers in that room as ty aptly pointed out earlier this afternoon. >> that isn't going to go away. i think while he did handle himself very well, certainly, this is a big hit because dimon was considered the savviest banker in america and while there's damage control going on here today, jamie was good at it, in the end this showed that maybe these banks don't really know what's going on inside themselves and a real problem and going to be a lingering problem and when the debate heats up as to whether these banks are too big to manage and whether we can trust them, the answer's coming back to -- even jamie doesn't know. >> neither the volcker rule or dodd-frank would have prevented this issue and said he felt that way, as well. >> gentlemen, thank you very much. coming up we'll talk more jp

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brian shactman here looking at stanley black & decker. "wall street journal" says they could put up the hardware unit for sale. the market not sure how to digest it. went to positive ter tear, sue, and now pulled back half a percent. back to you. >> thanks. all right. let's take a look at where the dow jones industrial average is right now. we were holding about a 11-point gain but the dow dropped, as a matter of fact, all three indices on the down side. the dow down 19 points. the nasdaq is down 5 and the s&p 500 is down about 2 points on the trading session. ty? all right, jimmy, we haven't heard much from you this hour but what are you watching? >> a particular chart pattern that excites me and it's in costco. it has a decent-size run huff up and then days of a consolidation pattern and coiled up. ad