above as you stream over. see, i own that. why don't i own that? >> tomorrow we'll be talking about stocks, bonds, commodities and ranches. thanks for watching "street signs". >> and jolly ranchers, as well. "closing bell" begins right now. biggest julian robertson. starts right now. >> hi, everybody, good afternoon. welcome to the "closing bell." i'm maria bartiromo at the new york stock exchange. >> this just feels right. >> we're back. back together. >> i'm bill griffeth. seems to be the question the stock market is asking today, was john boehner bluffing? which john boehner do we believe? the one last week who was telling republicans, we are told, that he would not let the government default but he was talking very tough over the weekend on the political talk shows. so, which way do we go here? >> feels like the market is, in fact, worried at this point. we're looking at this market trade down today.

double digit losses. at this point, up until now, you really didn't see much of an reaction that people were somewhat complacent. >> we aren't seeing the reaction we saw in august of '11 but getting closer. >> we'll talk about investing in this market, my exclusive interview with julian robertson. we'll get his opinion on how to play this market, against specific names he says will make money right now. including ones you may never have heard of. wait until you hear what he has to say about apple and the late steve jobs. i have to say, bill, i was taken aback by his comments on apple and why he would not be putting money in apple today. >> i was shocked when i heard about it myself. i just ran into him recently. he's 81 years old. he is -- he looks terrific. >> stronger than ever. >> very vigorous. >> very much focused on this market, investing. >> absolutely. glitchgate continues for the new health care law. you know it's bad when even

"saturday night live" makes fun of the website problems. we'll show you that. and also get into what the broader impact of these massive rollout problems could be, still to come. >> that was a good "snl," i have to say. >> dow jones industrial average off the lows but still down 80 points. dow at 14,992. nasdaq under selling pressure. also off the lows, nonetheless down 21 points and 0.5%. a decline of seven points on the s&p 500. what are they saying on the floor, is john boehner bluffing? >> they don't think he's bluffing. they think he's trying to hold the right wing side of his party together. it's going to go right to the brink. one thing's for sure f you look at the s&p 500, we've been here all afternoon, a decline right at the open. we were down around 1674.

1670 as the low on thursday. low volume. three to one declining to advancing stocks. major sectors here, cyclicals being damaged a little more than the rest of the market but not dramatically so. down 0.7% on average. financials are some of the weaker spots in the market. somewhere rate sensitive stocks doing better. rates have come down so utilities, riets were on the upside, but some of the other ones like telecom stocks doing a little better as well. take a look at the banks because i'm interested in banks because they'll be starting earnings this week. we'll get wells fargo and jpmorgan reporting on friday. alcoa is tomorrow. more importantly is the banks. we had a couple problems with the banks this quarter. the first one, of course, being the trading activity has been generally down, particularly on fixed income. mortgage activity is down. a lot of talk that big banks like jpmorgan, mike have higher

legal reserves. most of us already know that. while banks may have underperformed a little bit this quarter, at least most of them seem to be having expectations they're going to hit their numbers so far. again, numbers will start coming in on friday. guys, back to you. >> bob, thanks so much. let's talk about putting money to work here. if boehner is bluffing, is this your opportunity to get into the market? joining us on "closing bell exchange," john manly from wells fargo fun, bob kizer and our own rick santelli. thanks for joining us. bob, i want to kick it off with you. we want to talk about the debt ceiling and john boehner commentary and also about earnings as we approach this season. what are you expecting in terms of third quarter earnings? >> current expectations are 3%. if you extrapolate usually the street beats expectations, we should be at 5% or 6%. >> expectations have been coming down. >> but that's a normal tendency. that's just the way the game is

played. >> john manly, what's your view of washington and where this thing goes and the impact it will have on the markets? >> i don't think anyone is really bluffing. i think they're serious. they have to demonstrate, put up a good show. i think it comes down to who gets hurt first. republicans, democrats or stock market and the american people. that's going to make this happen. >> does this go long enough that we do come up against the debt ceiling? i mean, the bond market, what would that -- >> that's a scenario we don't want to go to. i don't think it goes that far. you have to go to the brink. you have to demonstrate you're serious on this position. it's going to be a rough week or two. >> what about that, in the face of all the uncertainties, how do you want to allocate capital. what if rates skyrocket around october 17th around that debt ceiling? >> the consent is exposure to the u.s. has been an asset so far to global companies. however, it may come under pressure and become a liability. the reason is because of this uncertainty, it may actually

discourage companies from deploying capital. that's what investors want. they want cash-rich companies putting their money to good use. >> rick, are yields going to generally march higher the closer we get to october 17th if there's no deal by then? why haven't they done that to this point? do they expect there not to be some debt crisis? >> i think they think the president's bluffing. you know, i don't see any indication in a dow jones up 14%, a nasdaq up 25%, an s&p up 28 -- 18%, and ten-year note yields, most hugely affecteded after federal reserve, 260 and 265 of late, it's interesting to debate what you do with a lottery ticket should you win because the odds are probably higher that we're going to not default, meaning we -- i just don't see it. the market doesn't see it. people i talk to don't see it. i think when it comes to

washington, our channels are having a field day whether boehner is bluffing. last i looked under barack obama's name it's president, not the head of the democratic party or the head of the senate. >> it's a good point but what i'm trying to get at is how you allocate capital. gemma, that's what i asked you. we know the uncertainties and what's happening in terms of the back and forth in washington. what do you do in the meantime? would you put money into stocks right now in the u.s.? >> we're taking a breatheralloc. what we're looking for is stability. so, if you look at the environment, in an environment where there is instability, uncertainty, investors will reward companies that have reliable revenue streams. i don't mean utilities or defensives that have rallied hard. we're looking at expensive defensives. i mean, companies where you can clearly see the client base, where they'll generate their revenues from. those will be the interesting plays going forward. >> bob, you were nodding your head. do you invest based on good old

fundamentals and earnings expectations or do you have to invest based on what you think the government's going to do down the road? >> yes and yes. but let me explain that. default is not going to happen. it's unthinkable the united states is going to default on its debt. we need to get past this brinksmanship. president stated his position, he wants a clean resolution. boehner said he's not going to get one. now we know their positions and we can move forward. consumerary sec sore stor one of the best performing and expected to be one of the best two sectors for the third quarter. as long as brinksmanship doesn't get out of control, we're watching u.s. sovereign credit default swaps closely. they more than doubled in the past two weeks but beneath 50 basis point. if it gets above 50 bips you'll see a lot of anxiousness in the stock market.

>> is there a safe investment as rates go higher? >> yes. nothing is ever perfectly safe in the stock market or anywhere on earth in the future. still like cyclicals. i think the economy is starting to get better. i think we'll go to the brink but not beyond the brink and i think it will be hard to kill the animal spirit as the world economy is starting to get better. >> would you buy bonds? >> for a while i would. they're not going to go down in price right away. at some point in time they're going to go down an awful lot. they'll price us by taking longer to happen. there's no inflation. no reason for the fed to tighten. bonds don't go up in yield that way. but it's been a long run. i was a young man when this thing started, bob. >> thanks, everybody. we appreciate it. we'll leave it there. we go to a market under pressure but well off the lows, we should point out. 151 -- >> it was down 151 points. one trader was telling me how busy it was on the open this morning before things cooled off. we'll see how we do going into the close. after the break we'll talk to

congressman tim huelskamp of kansas, what he will and will not compromise and how serious he thinks john boehner said we're on the path to a default. >> don't miss my exclusive interview from tiger funds, julian robertson. he's very candid. here's a bit of what he said when i asked him why he doesn't own apple anymore. >> i came to the conclusion that it was unlikely that a man as really awful as i think steve jobs was, could possibly create a great company for the long term. >> there are other technology companies he likes very much. we'll get into that and a lot more coming up on "closing bell."

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investors getting jittery that we could reach the. >> dennis: debt ceiling which could happen in a week. and china is warning us.

john harwood has all the developments for us. >> you expect to hear from your creditors at a time like this, bill, but what's happened with both sides dug in with the speaker not willing to bring a government funding bill, clean bill for the whole government, or a debt limit bill to the floor. it's left to the administration to put pressure on the congress, which is exactly what jack lew did yesterday in his appearance on "meet the press." >> we want to know the last minute to act, last dollar, getting close to the line is dangerous. we saw in 20 11 there was no default in 2011. it hurt the economy to get close to the line. we saw it in the stock market. we saw it in confidence. we saw it in investment. if we cross the line, we're going to a place we've never gone. it's very dangerous. >> as you suggested, china added is voits to those putting pressure on congress saying the united states has to act to protect investors in this situation. did have one glimmer of what i considered an opening at the

white house briefing today when jay carney, when pressed on whether or not there could be any sort of side agreement to a debt limit increase said -- seemed to draw distinction between ideological concessions when democrat as greed the senate would pass a budget or not get paid. you could have some sort of a sidecar agreement that would involve a process for a budget negotiation. again, the two sides together don't see to be joining that conversation with each other, but i think that jay carney left that door open. we could hear more about that in the next few days. >> thank you so much. joining us from capitol hill is kansas republican congressman tim huelskamp, a member of the tea party caucus. thanks for being on the program. >> thank you. >> there's word the white house would be open to a short-term debt limit increase to prevent a debt default. would you accept that? >> we'll see what the president is proposing but we've been

sitting here weeks, months, waiting for any type of offer. i'm certain the president would love to get his way for a short term. the real issue sheer we have a c.r. he wants to keep the government shut down. the dlebt ceiling is past that and we're looking for real offers and we have not had that from the senate or president. >> you're saying you will not accept that? the question is, would you accept a short-term debt deal? >> the problem in washington is too much spending. the president would like to ignore that. i see no reason to raise the debt ceiling until we solve the problem. our out of control entitlement spending and the president suggests we need to push obama care, which will make the problem worse. >> the fear is we get to the debt ceiling, we breach it, and the government can't pay its bills come october 17th, yet the markets don't seem to be anticipating that. interest rates and the bond market are still very low. does the market have it wrong? would you allow the government to stop paying its bills in

order to get across your point on the budget? >>. >> in the next five weeks there's only one major interest payment. i think the markets understand that. there's a $6 billion payment due at the end of the month. there are no other major interest rates. there will be no default. joe biden said as much in august of 2011. dave stockman with the reagan administration said as well. i think lew tried to manipulate the market over the weekend. it did not work. but at the end of the day, there will be no default. there's a question, can we get our spending under control? that's the real issue in the debt ceiling. >> let me ask on this procedural issue, are you not working toward an october 17th deadline then? do you anticipate going beyond that date that secretary lew has identified? >> i think that's entirely possible. again, there are no interest payments due between now and october 17th. the idea we'll default when there are no payments due, that is what a default is. the real issue on the c.r. is obama care and the rest is

entitlements. we need a ten-year path to balance, that's what congress agreed to in january. the president offered no planned solution to this overspending problem. >> something has to give here. somebody has to blink. are you concerned the u.s. will default? you said that's entirely possible we go beyond october 17th. does it concern you in any way if the u.s. defaults? >> i don't know about blinking. it's been seven straight days. the u.s. senate hasn't taken a vote yet. we have the government shutdown still going on. in answer to the question, i do not believe there will be a default on october 17th. we don't have any payments due to our creditors then. we have one on october 31st and a major one on november -- >> that's not a real date for you, october 17th. you don't care. you're looking toward the end of the month, then. this could go october 30th, 31 st? >> i think so. we have time to resolve the

c.r., the president and harry reid can come to the table. if you look back in august 2011, same thing. they had two weeks left after they said there would be a default. as joe biden said they never planned on a default. it was an attempt to manipulate congress. >> one of the questions out there is whether or not there are enough votes to pass a clean bill in the house right now. do you believe there are? >> i do not. we had that discussion in conference, in the republican conference late last week. the president would give the president what he wants, and continue to spend at the rate of $700 bill deficits. we can't do that. that's why we have a debt ceiling problem is they're spending too much money. there's not the votes for a clean c.r., but there are the votes there to actually continue to open up everything from our parks to nih to numerous other things. the senate hasn't had a vote in seven straight days. i don't know what they're doing. i think it's time they come to the table and negotiate. >> why not have a vote on the

debt ceiling right now, then, sir? >> we haven't had one presented from the president. >> but it comes from the house. >> the president has no proposal. why do we have to raise the debt ceiling is the fundamental question, we're spending more than we're taking in. we have to get our spending under control. that's an entitlements issue and obama care makes it significantly worse. that's what we're looking from the president and the senate, do you have a plan to deal with our spending problem, whether it's the c.r. or debt ceiling debate. right now they're two different issues. hopefully we'll finish the c.r. in the next few days when harry reid is ready to bring the senate to work. >> you're saying there's too much spending. where would -- >> no doubt about it. >> putting om care aside, where else would you like to see spending care? what are your proposals? >> we need serious entitlements reform. the house passed a budget in april to get us to balance in ten years. the president's budget never balanced. same with harry reid, they have

a budget that never balances. at the end of the day you have to balance some time. most merndz agree we should balance some time in washington. we should do that in less than ten years. that's our proposal from the house. we're waiting for something from the senate and from the president. >> are you not concerned about the warning from china, our largest debtor -- creditor nation, that we're -- >> well, they are not our largest creditor nation. the largest creditor nation today is japan, china is number two. when you only have one significant debt payment between now and november 15th, we can handle a $6 billion payment. the question is what are we going to do about obama care and all the other spending that continues to grow. >> what about rollover risk? i'm getting an e-mail here wonder being your familiarity with rollover risk. >> what we see coming out of the treasury, and it's difficult to get the full answers. they have all the books. they have all the numbers and some of those folks have been deemed nonessential twrig to get those answers. based on the current

information, there's one $6 billion payment due on october 31st and nothing until november 15th. we have five weeks to continue to discuss the future of this country. the president would make it about one single issue, default, given his additional borrowing authority. republicans say, no, the question is spending too much money. we need to talk about that. we need to have a solution. and the president's presented none to answer this problem. >> congressman, thank you for your time, sir. appreciate it. >> thanks very much, sir. >> thank you. >> heading toward the close, about 40 minutes left in the trading session here. well off the low, but we're still down 8 8 points. >> pretty tough day once again. you have next, julian robertson weighing in on this market today. >> i came to the conclusion that it was unlikely that a man as really awful as i think steve jobs was, could possibly create a great company for the long

term. >> one question that i asked him, bill, about the broader market was, at this point in time, would your instinct tell you to go short or go long? >> i can't wait to hear that. >> you'll want to hear what he has to say on that. he has a lot of names he likes but that in particular was a great answer from him. julian robertson, exclusive interview, coming next. >> forget about tapering. we'll hear from someone who says the fed may be on the verge of ramping up economic stimulus beyond what it's already doing. is d.c. dysfunction making ben bernanke do even more? that's still to come on today's "closing bell." it raises the price of fishmeal, cattle feed and beef. bny mellon turns insights like these into powerful investment strategies. for a university endowment. it funds a marine biologist... who studies the peruvian anchovy.

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stoke kicking off in red as stalemate in washington shows no sign of ending. >> let's start off with a look at bright spot in today's down market. those are the telecommunications services stock. investors are making names like at&t, verizon, windstream holdings some of the best performers in the s&p 500 today. speaking of the s&p, take a look at some names that have been cruising up and setting new 52-week highs in today's trade. look at semiconductor company micron, southwest airlines, health care services giant cardinal health care, and conocophillips and occidental petroleum, setting 52-week highs. another name languishing at session lows today is cooper tire and rubber, after the company has asked a dell dl

court to grant fast track service to it and apollo tire of india. apollo offered to pay $2.5 billion for cooper and now wants to renegotiate and pay less. keeper says apollo should make good on original bid and wants a trial to compel completion of this acquisition. uncertainty over the future of the merger has led investors to sell the shares. now late reports from french newspaper that ail ka tell lucent plans to cut 15,000 jobs, or 20% of its workforce, with half of the cuts coming in france. this story, this article apparently always alludes to the company possibly creating 5,000 more. we'll watch for action on alcate alcatel-lucent. >> julian robertson says there are opportunities but you need to know where to look. i spoke with the tiger

investment manager. he gave harsh criticism, apple, the late steve jobs. but first he talks about how he's investing in the market with that clock ticking down on the debt ceiling. >> i think it's not going to happen. maybe that's too much faith in the government, but i just don't think it will eventually happen. >> you mean that the u.s. will default? >> i don't think we will go further than we are now. and i think the next step will be a coming together. >> it's amazing -- >> maybe that's just wild hopes, but -- >> right, right. what are the ramifications? do you think we'll see long-term negative ramifications of, you know, day seven of the government shutdown? >> well, as i say, i don't think that they will push it to the limit. and i'm just -- i expect it to be cleared up pretty soon. >> the last time we spoke, we

talked a bit about apple. you said it was the greatest company in the world. one of the greatest companies in the world, certainly. i know you don't hold that view anymore. what's changed? >> i read the book. i read it and came to the conclusion that it was unlikely that a man as really awful as i think steve jobs was, could possibly create a great company for the long term. i just don't believe bad guys do well in the long run. and i -- and i came to that conclusion and sold the stock in january. and the stock was a good one for me. and we'll let somebody else make the money in it from now. >> it's interesting, because you read about him, his personal life, the way he treated people, and that dictated how you -- >> how can you -- how can you

create a great organization of people and be that mean a person? i mean, he basically cheated his partner, wozniacki. he refused to accept the parenthood of his child. i mean, he was really pretty terrible guy. >> but when you first invested in it, were you thinking about him, his leadership, or just this company that's innovative? >> i was thinking about what he had done. and there's no question -- i think if he were still there, i'd still be in it. i think he's one of the great geniuses of the world. eason the kind of guy i think would develop a long-standing company. >> bad culture? >> bad culture. bad principles. that's the way i felt about it.

>> what about google, is that a better buy? >> well, i think the google thing has been -- is more of a collaborative effort. and i know eric schmidt, he has different political views than >> mike: mine but he's a terrific guy. i've never had any problem with those fellows. i own google. >> the whole social media space was hot, and then google went public and it took the air out of space. i wonder if that's where we're going with this twitter thing. >> i don't know how to tweet and i don't twitter. i'll leave that to you. >> you wouldn't be a buyer of the ipo, then? >> i don't plan, that doesn't mean i won't, but i don't expect to at this point. >> you are one of the most followed person in finance. where do you see the sweet spot in the market right now? >> i don't see any particular sweet spot. but i do see sweet stocks.

that i really love and like. and think are going to do well. one is a company that probably makes that beautiful toenail polish you've got on. a company called ulta. and it has just beautiful beauty salons all over the country. >> so, this is not really a sector call, this is a specific name stock picking? >> that's really the way i'm looking at stocks primarily now. i think we're in the middle of kind of a bubble market, where it's going to take something bubble-like to happen to prick the bubble and we'll probably have pretty bad reaction to the breaking of the bubble. probably not right now. and somehow i think we'll wallow through the political and fiscal

crisis we have in front of us. and then we'll sort of see what happens. >> so, when you look at the broad averages, do you think that this market's fully valued, then? >> i think the market is reasonably -- yes, is fully valued. >> what about the federal reserve. we have this open question as far as who's going to be the next chairman. do you have thoughts on that or hopes? >> well, i really hope that it will not be the lady. >> janet yellen. >> janet yellen. i think she's just entirely to easy money. i think we've got to remember that we aren't very far from the last bubble bursting. and we're getting way bigger now. and i don't believe the people in charge of the monetary affairs are putting enough

emphasis on moral suasion. >> my thanks to julian robertson. he's had double digit returns for several decades, done incredibly well and a real stock picker. >> he likes the nail polish companies right now. >> yes, does he. one of his names. he also likes the airlines, by the way. he's a buyer of ryan air and delta air. we have a market under pressure to the tune of 95 points. dow under pressure, technology, financials leading the way. >> still hasn't given up on blackberry. boosting shares of bbyr. we'll see if this once left for dead stock can still dial up gains for your portfolio. >> are all the glitches in the health care exchange website weakening the president's hand on the debt ceiling fight? opportunities aren't always obvious. sometimes they just drop in.

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heading lower as we go into the close. the market trying to make sense of where things stand in washington. seema mody has been keeping an eye on things at the nasdaq. that index harder hit than the dow today. >> seems like this risk off approach to trading today. we're seeing sectors like

biotech sell off. the three worst performing stocks on the nasdaq 100, all biotech. regeneron, amgen and vertex. facebook lower. apple shares topping the tech analysts. they say gross margins are likely to be better due in part to strong iphone demand. and nontech, rangold resources. lastly, blackberry. we don't know the fate of the company. reuters citing sources as reporting blackberry is in talks with cisco, google and s.a.p. that buy outspeculation seems to be helping the stock move higher. it was moved to neutral hoping a dewill come to fruition sooner rather than later. >> seema, thank you. will buy oout talks make

blackberry a buy. >> it has been since this deal was announced. we want to bring in colleen taylor from tech crunch, believing it goes higher. michael raider believes the company has bigger prisons on its hand. why would you be a buyer? >> i think this is a real sign that blackberry is taking control, assuming its power and acknowledging its worth. they already signed a letter of intext with fairfax financial. fairfax said it will keep it all together if the deal goes through. i think we all know private equity firms typically break up companies into their different parts and sell off the best performing parts. i think it's smart of blackberry to say, hey, maybe we did-k do this ourselves. >> how much is it worth, all the parts together, do you think? >> that's for the market to decide here. but right now the data by the w

$4.7 million from fairfax. it could go higher. >> michael, are we confusing the stock with the company? if there's somebody that wants to buy up the pieces, then you'll get money from the stock, but that kills the company as we know it today. what do you think's going to happen? >> look, i think by definition this stock is a $9 stock at the end of the day. that's whether you're looking at the company put together or broken apart because that's what a private equity firm is willing to pay for it. i'm not saying there aren't other strategic buyers that could come in and pay around $9 or a few pennies higher. they're obviously talking to all the big players out there. i don't think anybody's surprised that blackberry has continued to have disappointing sales and disappointing revenue and earnings quarter after quarter. i don't know anyone that's bullish on blackberry technology. everyone has an android or iphone. >> if you look at the parts, the sum of the parts, you just said it, it's worth $9. it's not even at $8.

why wouldn't i want to make a little money going up to $9? who knows if the sum of the parts makes it higher than that. >> i think historically what we've seen in the last couple of years is big tech companies like google and microsoft paying top dollars and big prices for intellectual property. google bought motorola's ivenlg i.t. for $5 billion. they'll show they'll pay top dollar to protect themselves in court. >> if you're valuing this company as a patent portfolio, i think it's worth less than $4 billion. there has to be upside to convert the user base over or long-term profitability. as a purely patent play, it's not what the market shows today. >> that's the market. thank you. appreciate your time. >> i love the camera on this thing. >> it's a good camera. >> if you lose the phone, blackberry, at least let me still use the camera otherwise

it will make a nice coaster. >> you won't use that camera if you don't use that as your -- >> i love the camera on this thing. i do. >> take a short break. 20 minutes before the closing bell sounds. the market worsens in the last half hour. 108 on the industrial average. >> the oracle of omaha has done it again. he's turned the financial crisis into a monetary windfall for his company and himself. can you learn from that for your own profitability? and is the current fiscal mess another opportunity? both sides of that issue coming up. >> and then after the bell, the glitches and opening of the health care exchange, not only frustrating millions of people, is it also weakening the president's hand with the gop? we'll take a look at that story coming up next on "closing bell." i know what you're thinking...

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he's done it again. billionaire warren buffett has reaped the benefits of buying on the dip mentality. remember during the financial crisis back in '08, berkshire hathaway invested over $20 billion in six companies alone. they were in distress situations. so far, those investments have netted him about $10 billion. >> pretty extraordinary.

really proving the buffett investing mantra. that's what he's done. when there's all this euphoria in the market, that's when he steps away. when there's fear in the market, that's when he goes to pounce. >> these were no slouches, these companies. general electric, goldman sachs. these are companies that were calling him and saying, we need the cash. remember the commercial debt market, the commercial paper market had dried up. they were not able to service their short-term debt on a daily basis. they needed cash. their companies were fine, but there was a cash flow problem. >> that was an extraordinary moment. >> he stepped in and provided the cash flow for them on a extraordinary basis. we showed the list of companies he's gotten money back on. >> wlapd this time around? we didn't have the kind of upset we had back in 2007 and 2008 and he was still able to make all this money. >> what did he say he would buy this time around? real estate, houses.

he said if there was an aggregate way to buy individual homes, that's where he would go right now. that's where he saw the real opportunity in this financial crisis. >> that's good advice. warren buffett may have made a pretty penny from the financial crisis but hank greenberg says all the regulations resulting from the crisis are hurting everybody else. he'll explain later on on the "closing bell." remember, hank greenberg was a believer in lehman brothers just a little while before it actually went bankrupt. we'll take a short break on the show. we've got about ten minutes before the closing bell sounds. this market has weakened, down 115 points on the industrial average. >> down 150 on the low this morning. with all the red arrows on wall street, is now the time to follow warren buffett as advice and buy into this market when others are fearful? we'll take a look at that coming up. i've saved $75 in checked bag fees. [ delavane ] priority boarding is really important to us. you can just get on the plane and relax. [ julian ] having a card that doesn't charge you foreign transaction fees saves me a ton of money.

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welcome back. final stretch. ten minutes away from another down day on wall street. bob pisani. the opening bell looked like it could be worse. look at the close here, bob,

closing out the triple digits. >> it's absolutely amazing. not a single constructive thing came out of washington today. nothing. and yet the markets have their losses. take a look at the dow jones industrial average. maria is right, we were down considerably. still three to one declining advancing stocks, percentage losses not nearly as great. market leaders, some big sectors that have pushed the market forward are looking a little tired today. biotech is down. health care down. airline stocks. these were the big market gains earlier but taking a little hit. the vix up a three-month high. people would ask me, when do things get significant on the vix? i say we go over 20 and people notice for sure. rate-sensitive telecom, for example, better. sort of a mixed picture. once you get rates moving to the downside, they tend to

outperform a little bit. still, the market is just sitting here. volume is very much on the light side. 400 million shares on the floor. we would normally do on a good day, 600 to 700 million on the floor. >> bob, thank you. we'll see you a little later. joining us right now, jerry webman, chief economist from oppenheimer funds. with this government shutdown are we doing real damage or psychological? >> i think it's more fear of what's going to happen. the fact we're not down further than we are, we're conditioned to think, oh, well, they'll pull off something at the last minute. >> that's always the condition. is that complacenccomplacency. should we really believe that. >> the other side of it, it's possible, we may see something valuable come out of it. entitlement reform for ee quest rags cuts. that's starting to get kicked around in the gossip mills. i don't think anybody wants to get too excited one way ort other right now. >> stocks are coming down. are they getting cheaper?

are they getting more attractive? do we look at it that way? is it a glass half full thing here? >> i think if we come back -- we all want to talk about this political stuff. i've been able to hide that on the political side. i had that for most of my 30 years in this industry. we're probably paying too much attention to the politics and not enough attention to the fact there are great companies around the world that are actually making pretty good money right now. not great money but good money. there's some valuations to be found that i think are still pretty attractive. >> let's talk about that, then. we're here entering earning season for the third kauquarter. that will probably dictate the market activity. >> i think it is but i think it will be guidance. people are concerned -- >> what kind of guidance are you expecting? >> i don't know. i think guidance will be 110 to maybe a little over. >> what does that mean? >> it means we probably have a little upside from here at current valuations. 16, 16 1/2 times earnings. we have some upside here.

we get 110 bucks average earnings, i think particularly the growthier sectors, we're all right. not great but we're all right. if people that are underinvested can move into the markets at this point. >> appreciate your time. >> take a break. come back with the closing countdown with the market heading down lower. 120 right now. >> after the bell, how do you break an impasse with what's happening with john boehner and the president when nobody blinks? we talk with someone who knows a little about negotiating, kevin o'leary from "shark tank." my doctor and i went with axiron, the only underarm low t treatment. axiron can restore t levels to normal in about 2 weeks in most men. axiron is not for use in women or anyone younger than 18 or men with prostate or breast cancer. women, especially those who are or who may become pregnant and children should avoid contact where axiron is applied as unexpected signs of puberty in children

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with think or swim from td ameritrade. the last three minutes, maria was asking me, bill, how much is the dow down since the government shutdown started? >> i was wondering. i know you have all the stats. >> very good question. here's your answer. down 1.14% on the dow. this takes us back to last week. a few zigs and zags. while that's going lower, look what's going higher. finely the volatility index, the vix, is starting to rear up. remember we always talk about 20 being the yellow flag territory. we're almost there. in the last three months. but vix is up 28%, larry cantor. what are your expectations for what's coming out of washington and its impact on the markets? >> you know, the amazing thing

is how little effect it's had. i think part of it is the market's jaded. this is the fourth or fifth team here in the last few years. and every time, the market before sold off a lot. only to get sort of a band-aid solution that kicks things off for six months or a year. i think the market's just going to look through this. the government shutdown is hitting the economy, but as soon as it's over, it will bounce back up. it's very -- however, in the next week or two, it probably gets worse before it gets better. you're getting closer to the debt ceiling deadline. the rhetoric is horrible. probably gets worse. i would be -- >> short term you want to step away here, raise cash -- >> if you're a short-term player, i think things get worse than better. the odds over the next 10, 15 days are down, not up. >> but does that present a buying opportunity for that longer term investor? >> i think so. i mean, i think what will happen is when the -- we have forgotten

about the tapering and all that stuff. what that told me is the focus is going to be on growth. that's the main reason the fed was expecting 3% growth. it's running less than 2%. if you see better growth i think we'll get into a situation where stocks do well and bonds sell off another leg. i think if the u.s. economy doesn't take off until next year, it's not going to do it. >> we have hank greenberg in the next hour. i want to talk more about growth, because that's where the focus has been in terms of owning stocks as well. where is the growth? we'll keep talking about that. larry, good to see you. bill, see you tomorrow. >> see you tomorrow. we're not getting any government reports on the economy but we'll get earnings starting tomorrow. alcoa kicks it off. what are your expectations for earnings this season? >> i think okay. it's just in the middle of a government shutdown, and waiting for lift-off in the economy, i have a feeling that it's not going to have that big of of a market effect, as it usually does. at least as we clear out from this debt situation.

>> which we're right in the middle right now. thanks, larry. we're heading to the close. we're heading back to the lows of the session. on the opening down 150. right now going out down more than 13 2 and still going lower. stay tuned. hank greenberg coming up. also, "shark tank's" kevin o'leary as well on the second hour of "closing bell." i'll see you tomorrow. and it is 4:00 on wall street. do you know where your money is? welcome back to the "closing bell." i'm maria bartiromo on the floor of the new york stock exchange. will this market deteriorate going into the close? investors getting jittery about the government shutdown debate. in the morning we had been down about 150. we came off those lows only to rally and then decline once again going into the close. down 136 on the dow, 14,936 is where the dow settles tonight. the nasdaq gives up 3