and just a bit outside. snoop dogg's first pitch missing the mark boy a lot. it is thursday june 9th and "squawk box" begins right now. live from new york where business never sleeps, this is "squawk box." >> good morning everyone. welcome to "squawk box" here on cnbc. i'm becky quick with joe kernen and andrew ross sorkin and the dough back above 18,000 first since april. and the s&p 500 also climbing. just 12 points from its all-time closing high. dow is riding higher but still about 2 percent away from all-time highs. and red arrow this is morning. dow futures down by about 47 points frs s&p futures off by about 7. nasdaq down by 14.

overnight in asia, the markets in china, hong kong and taiwan all closed for dragon boat festival. and early trading in europe, also red arrows. the dax is the biggest decliner. down 1.25% the cac and ftsi boat down 1%. wti down but still well above $50. and george soros front page this morning. a bearish soros is lured back to trading again. getting back into the game. soros recently directed a series of big bearish investments, semiing stocks and buying gold in shares of gold miners. and in an article he warns the

falloff from ununwinding of chinese investments likely will have global implications. soros is worried that continued inflation in china will hurt the u.s. and others. and he say s telling the jou if britain leaves it could unleash a general exodus and the disintegration of the european union will become practically unavoidable. soros's best known trades of course he bet against the pound in 1992 in a trade that led to $1 billion in profits. >> we know what the market's done. >> some of his bets in gold have done well. >> druckenmiller. 8%. >> little more in some of the gold minors.

>> maybe the miners. talking to gartman in this a second because, you know, i didn't buy the stupid stuff. >> he tried. >> i had to open an account. it took a week to get the papers in. >> they do this online now joe. >> no no i'm buying maple leaves. i i don't want to buy i want things i can actually hold. so finally in a position to buy on the employment day you. get 38,000 and gold goes up 40 frickin' dollars or something. >> i actually trade frickin' dollars? >> huh? yeah. and the china thing. so now soros thinks the flows are headed the other way is this. >> his concern is the china slowdown1 means slowdown1 for er where.

past performance is no guarantee of future performance. >> and he's not been an active trader for a long time. something like $30 billion but sees things from macro. >> 30 billion dollars is a good number to say i've got tom past performance. i will acknowledge. because gold now. i'm not sure it backs off. in a period of rising interest rates. when you are at zero you figure interest rates are going up some day. which would not be great for gold. but the thing is gold ran up to 2,000 before we got full on qe one two and three and then einhorn and others got in saying we're going to get -- and as we got to qe one two and three the rest of the world followed it came back to 1200 so it is way ahead of the consensus thinking. but if the fed can't get out if they are feckless and in effective and can't get out then

they lose control. >> -- in effective. >> right and then they lose control and gold does go up. so i don't think i'm going to have another chance. >> you will have plenty of chances. >> below 1200? >> doubt that. >> that's what i want. >> 1275, come on. >> i can't chase it. when i want -- i was asking can we -- >> see this is ego. this is psychological. >> i was only doing it to like play with the maple leaves anyway. you know, put a light there and visit shining on my face. and have like a video. and the sound of it. you have felt it before, haven't you? >> what? >> gold. you have felt coins and bouillon. there is a reason for 4,000 years people have treasured it. it is treasure. >> a friend and i had bought some gold.

we were on the border trade in chicago and we had a vile of it. to protect ourselves and we put it in our coat pocket and it pulled our coat down and ripped our coats and we're trying not to look conspicuous in chicago trying to get it to our lock box. it was really quite funny. >> treasure isn't treasure if there is no gold. i don't think. a buried treasure without gold. better be some nice jewels. and the jewels need to be set in gold. anyway. >> you need to use one as the ball marker. that is classic thing to do. >> as what what. >> a ball marker. >> sports thing little lady. don't even concern yourself. get some -- i do that on purpose. >> touching all this stuff. >> you should talk. anyway, president obama is -- yeah. did you see? >> i just noticed. >> well it's nice. it's good. sacred and holy and glowing.

obama is expected to meet with bernie sanders today. i think the bern's got too hang in there, dude. hang in there man. you are the one who's energized the whole campaign. it is crooked. >> -- journal saying that. >> it is crooked. what do you think? >> -- your talking points. >> why do you think? hang in there bernie. you deserve more. it is unacceptable. it is rigged it is not fair. >> earned the right to say whatever he wants. >> yeah. no reason to get out. you lost in every possible metric and there is no reason for you to be still doing this. there isn't. she's got the delegates. she's got more votes. i -- but hey i agree with you buddy. hang in there. the meeting will be just divide and conquer. will be at the white house today at 11:15 a.m. eastern. president back from jimmy fallon i guess, and expected to push the candidate from vermont to embrace hillary clinton for the

nominee of the party. and -- conservative radio talk show host hugo hewitt the latest to ham ter nominee saying the rnc these to dump trump. and while all this is going on president obama took some time to come into new york for the only late night show really worth appearing on jimmy fallon the tonight show. >> the main role i'm going to be playing in this process is to remind the people that this is a serious job. this is not reality tv. >> president also slow jammed the news and you can watch that when the show airs tonight. so i was talking one of the producers dennis or whomever. thinking i might have a kindred soul in you as i say this but trump had about a tw week period where the same people that are now saying you got to get out, they were the same people all along saying he's not going to be the nominee. this isn't going to happen.

we've got to find someone else. for two weeks they have sort of had, you know, when he became the presumptive nominee. there was almost like a brief honeymoon. but the people that you -- mark kirk. even paul ryan. paul ryan was controversial for not going right away. so far week or so. hugh hewitt. never been a trump fan all along. >> seems like he's been -- >> rubio. >> every night at dinner we have a great debate over -- >> i'm not saying one way or another. but it is a binary choice, dennis. so who is your choice? take my ball home or -- deal me another hand? >> deal me another hand. -- >> [ inaudible ]. >> okay. anyway, the dump trump thing at this point it is the same as the

trump will never be the nominee. he is going to go to the convention and get the nomination and then it is the damned the torpids come what may for the republican party. >> probably expectations that once me became the presumptive nominee that maybe he could tone things down. >> hasn't proven to be the case. >> well there are people who think that the people that were behind him the most want him to -- and he's still going to say things that make them think well he's not going to turn into the politician. >> and by the way, donald trump got where he is by not listening to any of the people who told -- >> exactly. and i still looking back on it and the books will be written. but the idea that there can be 17. and some of the most qualified and guys with really four years ago they were begging to get in like chris christie or jeb bush. >> that was a problem. so many choices. >> jeb bush never got more than

4 or 5%. staggering. >> i was a strong kasich fan but no charisma. >> what are you like a rhino or something? the democrats are the ones that loved kasich. >> i would suggest to you that you party -- it's not my party. the republican party. >> no that. is so broken. this just reflects how broken the whole thing is. >> and you say that with not a hint of irony. nominating -- you have the only thing that energized your party as you would say it is the 74-year-old socialist. he's the guy that's really exciting at this point. >> and a 69-year-old socialist. >> succeeding a 58-year-old socialist. >> the extremists on both sides have somehow managed to pervert the whole system. that's what happens. >> nothing do with the parties. it has to do with people voting for those people in the country that are -- in a place that is

not very positive right now. regardless of that "new york times" -- >> left behind and feel like they have been ignored by washington. >> each day comes by becomes more and more monarchy. draghi addressing a economic forum in brussels this morning. draghi has argued monetary policy alone can't end the regions economic malaise. >> joining us right now or who has been sitting here with us for a while a dennis gartman and great to see you. we just had this talk about the ecb and the central banks and that is probably the central theme driving just about every market now. >> driving everything. central banks have taken the central position. they are on the center stage every day. draghi's comment this is morning i thought were very serious. if you look at the euro after

his comments it gave up almost 70 immediately. he's made it abundantly clear there is not much more they can do. i think he's wrong. they can go to helicopter money and i think they should be doing that. i don't think they have a choice and i think that is where they have to go and will go but putting froern politicians to do something. >> -- constitutes that. >> that was a very important change. >> and -- helicopter. >> and there will be more. >> --? >> exactly that. >> so they have started. >> they have started. >> okay. >> and you think this is necessary because the economy is falling apart there? >> yes. i think they have very real problems over there. the chinese circumstances weighing on europe. europe itself is weighing on europe. the brexit vote -- i hate that word brexit -- is weighing on europe. and mr. soros i think is correct if that vote goes the way it might be feared -- and it doesn't look to two that way. but if that goes that way on the periphery more and more

countries will say if england is out i'm out. >> a foreign defense minister who said he thinks the problem is the vote itself. even if they vote to stay in they will be voting to stay in and they will get better concessions from the eu and that every other nation will come back and want to renegotiate their terms of staying in as well. >> i think it is lose lieu. i think europe finds ints itself in a terrible untenable position. and remember the uk is only voting to stay in the political union and they have never been in the monetary union. a lot of people misunderstood that. they are not vote fog get or out of that. >> so if draghi dumps more money, what does that do to our central bank? do we raise rates here. >> no. >> and japan's negative interest rates and europe -- >> the real problem is negative interest rates. and what people don't understand is what happened in japan after

they took money to negative levels, you want to take money out. it is going to cost me to keep it in and cash is really deflationary. and that is what people are missing. it doesn't get lent. >> relent again. and there in creates the inflation. japan strangely enough has to get back to positive constitutional rights and i don't know if they have the courage to do that. >> soros thinks the way to play is to buy gold and gold miners. maybe silver miners as well. what do you buy? >> i think the way is looking at currency and circumstances are. i want to own gold in the currencies that are probably most likely to weaken up. i want to old gold in euro terms. eventually in yen terms but right now i want gold in euro terms. i think the gold with make its way easily back to parity with the u.s. dollar. so gold in euro terms gets very strong. >> and paper entries on your account statements that show

your ownership in gold when you -- >> yes. >> really? that will work good. when you go to the border guard and say i need to get out of here and the zombie. look i've got it right here. >> everybody should own a little physical gold. >> what is a little? >> 5%. >> 5% of your assets? >> yeah. >> think about that for a guy like gartner. >> that's buck and a half. >> if you are looking at things and you think that gold is a way to play it. but look a lot of people aren't going to go heavily into these positions. we've seen stocks hold up pretty well. s&p is within all-time highs and dow is only 2% off the levels. if we're in an environment like this and the fed is not going to be raising rates this is the best place the put the money. >> and the term tina. there is no alternative. and sadly that is the operative formula right now. when will it stop?

whenever it stops. the market has been strong. it will eventually stop and when it does it won't be pretty. but if you have faded it. and i have tried to fade it every once in a while and every time you fade it it blows up in your face. >> you are assuming it won't always be tina. and it might always be tina like in japan they may never raise. >> how many have you known who have tried to stell jgb short? everyone you know and it's been 25 years of that sort of activity. >> with negative interest rate. >> should be be surprised they have gone to negative constitutional rights. i think it is a bad decision but it is a long protactive move. and. >> thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me on. >> are you going to favorite my tweet. >> no. it wasn't the nicest tweet. if it was a nice tweet and i liked the tweet i would give it a little heart. >> that was not said with

malice. that was said with knee jerk. >> knee jerk. >> would you ever tweet they laughed so hard that my face hurts? >> i tweeted i went to the jerry seinfeld show last night. >> and somebody tweets because their face hurts i'm going say really does because killing me. >> that was -- you expect him to like it? >> no but i would never tweet that. you know someone is going to tweet it is killing me. >> no i don't that. >> you have to -- >> there are a lot of nice people on the street who say very nice things about my face. >> if you tweet my face hurts, someone is going to -- yes. it is killing me. glad you got to see jerry seinfeld. >> unbelievable show. >> but it is really not out there until you have experienced it. now it is actually worth talking about it. >> it is. >> you've seen it. you have experienced -- >> how many times do i have to

hear about the water -- >> there is a new show i just watched called the wire. and i looked, 2004. >> exactly. >> coming up. it's disney's world. what a great show. i love the way they portrayed the newspaper though. >> he's back to the wire. >> and the seinfeld. both. >> a flu magic kingdom about to open in shanghai with --. check out this day in history as we head to break.

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welcome back to "squawk box." shanghai disney set to open next week. here a first look at the park. >> why is this park important for disney's ambitions in china? >> china represents a great market for the walt disney company. because our stories are not only known here but they are universal in appeal. they touch hearts all over the world no matter the country or culture. so this is i think a great

reminder for disney and a growth market as well. and this is an extremely important step or the biggest step actually we've ever taken anywhere to grow that market. >> how does this park help other parts of the business in this market? >> well it clearly will serve as sort of a booster rocket for people who's preex appreciation of disney. the knowledge that disney is in fact universal in appeal to people. the appreciation of knowledge of characters and stories. an immersive park experience, the disney way is something that people remember for the rest of their lives. and that goes a long way in terms of not just creating word of mouth in terms of people interest for and passion for our broaden and everything it stands for. and everything that bears its name. >> what is disney doing differently in this park compared to others around the world. >> to begin with we eliminated

main street. even our story telling here started in mandarin and translated to english so we could we work and it understand it instead of starting in english and translating to mandarin. that way it is much more authentic in terms of language and story telling or much more distinctive in that sense. the architecture. putting a chinese tea house right in the center of this park in grand form. disney town, using architecture that is sort of old shanghai architecture. when people see it, ah, i recognize that. i like that. so there is a tremendous amount here that is very distinctly chinese. and and we're not expecting people to come in and say wow that is very chinese. we're expecting people to leave with the sense that they

experienced something that was very much disney but very much felt like theirs and very much felt like home. >> some are openfully criticizing you saying disney won't be successful here longer term. what do you say about that? >> pricing and the experience and the pricing of the parks that those who are criticizing us are offering reflects exactly what they are offering to their people. >> and right after that interview bob uygur talk me on one of the new rides here. an entirely new ride called tron. a roller coaster where you are bending over on bikes and take a spin through different lit tunnels and uygur said it was really important to bring some new technology here to the park. and the caribbean also got a new remake. with new visual technology and a

new pulley system to bring the boats around. and other thing about the park is how many of the rides are based off disease's nedisney ic franchises. in china a lot of people didn't grow one more traditional characters. but they do no jack sparrow and darth vader from "star wars" and others. and there is a place called the aisle with treasure cove and an area completely dedicated to pirates. >> you are in front of what? right behind youlet. >> i'm in a place called disney town. yeah well there is a fountain actually but i'm in a place called disney town and it is next to another area called mickey avenue. and this is another way in which the disney really changed the

park. because in most parks in the states in europe, you have main street usa it is a replica of a small town in the united states. uygur told me he didn't think that was going to resonate so instead they have disney avenue. and it is a way to introduce all of the characters and their back stories to the chinese people. such as mini or daisy. some of these characters aren't really as well known over here. but i think one other thing that was interesting was something that i think surprised the disney folks themselves. and that is the popularity of the turkey leg stand. disney fans all -- and in china that turkey leg is going all over social media. people wait for two hours for it here. >> it is popular here too but i haven't seen anybody waiting in a two hour line. thank you very much. >> they are calling it a chicken

thigh because people here love dark meat and don't really know turkey very well. >> giant chicken zl i've seen it at the park. >> yeah. >> and i remember someone who was with us got one. and i couldn't do it. i couldn't do it. >> ive never had one. >> you feel like henry the 8th. who walks around carrying a turkey leg gnawing on it? who you feel like, you know. >> better then some giant thing of cotton kaebd or something. >> it likes look -- joining us now anthony di-clemente. i love uygur because he has a way of saying things. you know exactly what he was saying. we're charging this, you get that. there. it was a weighing saying we're disney and we know how do this z people are going to pay too have the disney experience. >> and disney planting the

disney brand flag in china and the bigger picture theme is not only theme parks but of course the content, technology, consumer products and the disney monetization machine. >> do you have any doubt it doesn't work in shanghai. >> i think it is going to work great. the question we're getting most is how big could it be? there are 350 million income qualified people within a three hour car trip to the park. the population of the united states basically which can get there. and people have said a hundred thousand can get through the park a day. so that capacity equates to roughly mid teen, millions of tendency. maybe 50, 60 million tendency a year. comparison to the magic kingdom is about 201 millio million. >> we can come back to the park. it's happened in the face of a

"star wars" franchise that we know is going to be probably huge. and shanghai. and so espn has been like the word to summarize there. and comcast is right on an all time high. and some others that are dependent on whether this cord cutting or not. they are doing better. what's -- why would espn and just the slightest down tick in ad growth, why is that hurting the stock all the way down to 98? or is it succession fears. >> i think it has to do with espn and the cord cutting fears around espn. disney trades a very high multiple. but for comcast i think some of the concerns are built in as well. the cable networks for disney had been almost two-thirds of the company. now it is less than half. the question is what's the growth rate of espn and the cable network because disney trades at the high multiple.

if it trades already in the mid 20s it is no at value stock so people look at it like nigh toad discount. and you look at the company. over the last three years, espn has really grown its operating income or the cable network segment about 6%. the other non cable network segments have grown 23%. that is a question that people have as well. so for that non est espn part of disney. >> would you ever consider spinning off espn? >> i asked that question on earnings call two quarters ago. and i don't think he's going to do it. i think the answer is there are enough synergies between espn and the other parts of the company. i question that answer because i don't necessarily see a lot of synergies. i think you could probably say that more a about other segments. >> -- abc. >> i don't see it. part of the mothership.

>> the whole secession thing that was like oh. there was a tremor when that happened. >> -- yeah. >> and anything come into that's going on there? >>, you know, there are speculative rumors people talk about other candidates for ceo. and sheryl sandberg -- >> [ inaudible ]. >> herd her say last week she doesn't want do it. >> uygur's contract got extended to june of '18 and i think he'll extend beyond that. but to buy disney a little more time. that is just my opinion. >> even if that is right don't you think -- do you think they are going to put somebody as his number two, an heir apparent or just play it out and then just replace with an outsider. >> uygur had been the coo. so -- >> that is the way like to do it. >> that is the way they have done it in the past.

somebody internal and becomes. there are some really good internal candidate asks that could happen. but would think you would want to groom that person for a couple of years. so i think for now it is bob. i think the best successor to bob is bob kind of thick. >> he's 65. and 65 is 2 new 50. >> great shape too. >> stairs. >> the versa climber. >> that's ho compare to your workouts. >> mine i don't want the talk -- i do that now. and i don't like it at all. he could at least go to 18 and like you said to 20. anyway, thanks.

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where can back everybody. the june 24th referendum that can will decide the uk's status within the european union is fast approaching but what will happen if britain votes to leave the eu? wilfred frost is here to break down the antony of the wrex. and this is complicated stuff. if they actually vote to leave that is a lot of questions. >> lot of questions. lot of uncertainty becky. the first thing to note is on the 24th of june in the instance o a brexit vote nothing legal actually happens. it is not a binding law. it is just to sflal tignal the f the british people to begin negotiations for setting the

terms for the separation. it is possible they will begin negotiations in a relaxed fashion without the two year restriction. and here are the main issues the divorce lawyers will be arguing over. the first is free movement of people. will britain be able to stem the flow of immigrants whilst minimizing the rights it loses for its own citizens on the european continent? second, free trade. ll britain get to maintain the status quo at the moment of free trade or will the eu punish them for leaving? finally will the uk be able to passport its financial services which allows eu members to offer financial services in other eu countries based on their own domestic regulation. will frankfurt and paris will hung troy grab market share from london and stop that from happening. ?

so whilst june 24th would see no immediate legal repercussions the intermittent period of uncertainty could be very damaging. and one final thing to point out. would cameron have to resign? there would be huge pressure on him to do so and that of course could delay negotiations even further. we'd have to choose a new government before we could start. two weeks to go. lots at stake in the brexit vote vogt. >> you bring up a the very good question. would there be this feeling of retribution coming from the people remaining in the eu. would they want to take pound of flesh just to raise the bar if they vote to leave and make it -- >> it is a kroushl crucial thought. and the rhetoric is of course they will because they want briton say. i wonder if the sentiment would change after it happens.

they have already decided they are our friendly neighbors. we want to be nice to them. and had scotland voted to leave the uk two years ago would prime minister david cameron had treated them like an imposed tariffs and i don't think we would have done. also we have a significant trade deficit with the rest of germany. they would want to maintain that free trade and we do have a net deficit with the rest of europe. there are certain sectors like financial services where we have a surplus and those are the areas you would have to be concerned of. but certainly there is uncertainty and as the what people are worried about. how long do those negotiations take in intermittent period. >> lot of confusion and chaos in

the meantime. you know, will of you translate beautifully but what the heck does whilst mean? it means exactly the same as while but one i tend to use. the word i definitely stand corrected on is naught instead of zero. >> sounds beautiful and you are lifting the rest of us. so we should kind of rise to that level. >> apologize for differentiating. >> speak for yourself. >> thank you will. >> whilst we go to commercial. coming up. shaking up things. we're going talk to the ceo of monogo double plgo double play

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♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ welcome back everybody. it is time for the squawk planner. weakly job less claims out at 8:30 eastern and expected to hold steady. and 10:00 a.m. april wholesale

trade. and earnings peanut butter and je jelly makers. smucker and. more. >> amazon launching a british vertex of the fresh food delivery service. competitive prices in parts of central and east london. brit season one of the most developed online grocery markets. and since we are talking all things digital this morning. we've been talking ott innovators, risk takers and inventors that make the disrupter 50 list. and mongo db is taking on big data. selsz software for processing apps and other including nbc universal. joining us now president and ceo of mongo db. good morning. >> great to be here. >> help us understand.

tech's a little tough. you run a database company. >> yes. >> how does it work what makes it different. >> this you think about the any application you use. at home work or on the mobile device. all of those need to be able to store and organize information. and that information is stored in a database. mongo db is a database designed for today's modern applications. >> how does it differ for example from what oracle does. >> people use mongo db for three reasons. one is volume. our name is derived from a term humongou humongous. we manage massive amounts of information. and second is speed. developers need a platform where they can rapidly build applications and third is cost. all in mongo db is 1/10 the cost

of legacy solutions. it's been designed to be very nimble. we also have the luxury to price the way we want. our competitors try to price more. and we're very focused on delivering high value. >> when i ask do you want to remain independent i imagine you are going to say yes. but oracle has gobbled up just about everybody around it over the years. that's been part of the business model. has larry ellison ever called you. >> i have the utmost respect for what oracle has done. having said that their license business has gone backwards the last six quarters. the market is moving away from them. they have been around 40 years. the technology is getting a little dated and we want to be the de facto solution for applications and no larry has not yet called. >> what is unique about this database that allows you to

change so quick and allow the rapid updates? and who how proprietary is that and how difficult would it be for somebody else to copp it. >> a database is complex and not for faint of heart. but met life used us to consolidate. they spent two years and $25 million with the legacy platform and failed. then they tried on mongo db and in 90 days got it working. we allow people to manipulate data in a very natural way. . and the uber of china generates about four times the size of the american market and they build their platform on mongo db. >> a lot of companies that have issues like that and don't really know that the customer is

working with this product and this product together. so that is where crow see the big opportunity. >> opportunities in two fronts. and increasing seeing legacy workloads trying to move to us. >> real quick, before we go. private market valuations, how much cash do you have on hand and will you have to go out into the market to get more cash? and what do you see happening in that space? zbl zblef. >> we've been fortunate to raise over 300 million incap capital. we have more than enough cash. two we're very patient. and imply to the question. is what kind of liquidity event and we don't comment on time lines but clearly going ipo is definitely something we would consider but only consider when we're ready. >> if you do i hope you come back. congratulations on making the list. and we should tell you don't want you to miss a little later. another disrupter, the interim

ceo of jaunt is going to be on "squawk alley" at 11:00 a.m. eastern time this morning. >> name is like really important. that is like half of getting on the list. >> i like mongo. >> mongo is you like jaunt? >> they'll run out of names and then it will be like exxon again. putting it into a computer and getting what's not used. remember the car? part somewhere. >> there was a car nova which means don't go in spanish. you have to be careful. you need something that doesn't mean anything. coming up, a treat. once reserved for state fairs and boardwalks, now available across the country. is this another turkey leg story? that's next. why is it so hard to get the ball over the plate. snoop dogg, the latest celebrity -- >> i can explain this. >> could be partaking before the game. >> i don't know. >> fall into the wild pitch club. i have to do this this month.

the next inning -- >> you better be careful what you say. >> i know how to do it. >> next inning of "squawk box" next.

the 2016 cnbc disruptor 50 list released moments ago. welcome back to "squawk box." a disruption in snacking. hostess introducing deep-fried

twinkies. the treat made popular at state fairs, carnivals and seaside board walks around the country are now available. retail giant has a one-year exclusive to sell the twinkies at walmart. they're in the frozen food aisle. these have been around for a long time. you deep fry them. >> have you ever had one? >> no. you deep fry them, put ice cream on them and wash them down with tequila. the worst possible things you could do. >> that's what snoop might have done. >> he might have done that. >> i'm helping to tee you up for snoop. >> oh, okay. 50 cent had a really rough -- >> he did. >> -- a rough pitch from the mound too. but it happened to the snoop now. epic fail at the ballpark. snoop dogg throwing out the first pitch at last night's san

diego padre's game. slid out the right side of his grip. a bit outside. actually nowhere near home plate. the wild pitch hit a spectator but there were no injuries. here it is. >> a little high. >> he now joins 50 cent and howard stern producer gary delabata. no idea who that was. some of the worst first pitches in history. whoa! there is a guy over there -- that wasn't bad. you know what, could have been an intentional walk. that's what -- they throw it out there for intentional walks. >> right. when we come back, changing the world of medical care and research with market talk in the mix, the lineup this morning includes dr. ken davis of mount sinai, peter may. glen dubin and legendary investor carl icahn. "squawk box" will be right back. stick around.

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crude oil hitting new highs for the year. energy tighten harold ham says another spike it coming. the man donald trump called the king of energy joins us live this hour. the future of health front and center. a look at how philanthropy is fueling innovation in hospitals. medical schools and beyond. we're joined by two major power players. dr. ken davis and peter may. that plus a big day for the panama canal. the wraps off a $5 billion expansion project allowing the ships the size of three football fields to pass through. the second hour of "squawk box"

begins right now. ♪ live from the beating heart of business, new york city. this is "squawk box." ♪ welcome back to "squawk box" here on cnbc, first in business worldwide. i'm rebecca quick along with joe kernen and andrew ross sorkin. take a look at the futures this morning after the dow closed above 18,000, and the s&p is within about 12 points of its all-time high, you can see the futures giving a little bit back this morning. dow futures down by 43 points. s&p off by 6.5. nasdaq down by 1. check out oil prices which pushed above $50 yesterday. down about 40 cents this morning. headlines this morning. senator bernie sanders going to meet with president obama at the white house this morning. that meeting requested by the democratic presidential candidate. this as the pressure is growing on sanders to officially drop out of the race even as he vows to stay in.

the president was in new york last night hanging out with jimmy fallon. the labor deptment is out with the weekly look at initial jobless claims in 90 minutes. also, the house will vote on a bill today to help puerto rico deal with the $70 billion in debt. that follows months of negotiations and a contentious vote by the house rules committee yesterday. if it moves on to the senate, leading democrats said they will seek significant changes to the bill. central bank speak early this morning. mario draghi addressing an economic forum in brussels warning that the euro zone is at risk of suffering lasting economic damage because of weak productivity and slow growth. he has argued that monetary policy alone cannot end the region's economic malaise. george soros is apparently trading again. getting back into the game amid a global economic uncertainty. the "wall street journal" saying soros recently directed a series

of big bearish investments. he remains skeptical of the chinese economy. he warns the fallout from unwinding unwindi unwinding of chinese investments. as for europe he says there is a good chance the european union will collapse from the weight of the migration crisis, challenges in greece and a potential brexit. he has been saying this for quite some time. now he's acting on it sort of. >> deflationary pressures. i'm going to buy gold. you must think the deflationary pressures will be so bad there will be chaos. >> like the world is ending. >> right. >> i am not a smart man, but it's like a hedge against inflation. isn't it? >> it's a hedge against inflation but it's also a situation where, look, if you get to the "there is no alternative" -- dennis gartman

said he'd buy old in euros at this point. >> i am just playing devil's advocate. when it doesn't make sense, that's usually the time to -- anyway. we have much smarter guys here to kick this around. stocks to watch. restoration hardware tumbling after reporting lower than expected quarterly results. production delays and a weak market weighed on the numbers. guidance for the full year also missing estimates. and britain's vodafone agreeing to sell the new zealand unit to sky network television for $2.5 billion. it will help to enhance the offerings. boston scientific will restructure operations hoping to cut costs by more than $100 million by the year 2020. it says it doesn't plan to significantly change its employee head count. we're happy to be joined by two special guests. two of the best and brightest from the business world and medical community. we're focusing on how philanthropy is fueling innovation in our hospitals,

medical schools and beyond. here with us is dr. ken davis, mount sinai's health system president and ceo. the largest health care system in new york and serves over 4 million patients a here. it's where henry and max sorkin were born. peter may is here, the chairman of the board of trustees and also peter's day job is as the president and founding partner of triant fund management. we have a lot to talk about in the activist world as well. she wants to talk about zika. we have to do a lot this morning. this is where i wanted to start. talking about the health care system, but when you think about your hospital system, in terms of the budget, and we're also going to have carl icahn on the show later. another one of your ben factors. how much of the budget is coming from guys like peter and karl and others relative to funding from the government and other funding coming in from people

like me and insurance companies paying to be there? >> we are a $7 billion organization, annual top-line revenues. philanthropy, in an average year, is about $250 million. so it's a small percentage of what we do but it's a big percentage of what we can do in innovation. it's the margin that we need really to preserve our core values. this is a tough business. >> in what way? let me say it this way. peter and i made a commitment a long time ago, even in the worst days of our work here at mount sinai, that we would preserve the value of taking care of everybody the same way. one of our hospitals lives at the juxtaposition of the richest and poorer zip codes in america. there is no greater economic disparate than there is across our northern and southern borders. we decided to take care of everybody the same way. that costs a lot of money to do.

>> right. >> nobody pays for that. but it's a tremendous drain on our system. and to preserve that and to preserve another key value that we're going to make sure that your grandchildren don't suffer from the same disease as your grandparents, that we are involved in therapeutics, developing new drugs, figuring out pathophysiology. to do that requires philanthropy. nobody is going to pay for that. >> i put it a slightly different way but obviously the uses ken described are absolutely correct. when you look at health care in terms of on a macro bostoasis, revenue never equals the costs because costs continue to up dramatically. one of the things we're trying to change, mount sinai to address is help moving the cost curve by population health. revenue never equals cost. the only way you can fill the gap is through philanthropy and through royalty income from the results of research.

and those are two areas that are critical to mount sinai in terms of how we're trying to build. >> peter, since i know you are in the business of asks, how has it changed over the couple years or the past year in terms of the kind of big numbers and, you know -- there are certain people who can write a really big check. is that where you try to focus energy these days? do you go after the small checks? i am curious in the world of philanthropy what's happened over the past couple of years with this. >> new york city is unique in the world of philanthropy. this city, unlike any other place in the world, really, and certainly -- and in the united states, where philanthropy is a big -- in most european countries philanthropy is not a big deal. hospitals and art institutions, et cetera, are supported primarily by the government. in the u.s. philanthropy is an important part of all of the not for profit world. new york, again, is unique, but there is tremendous competition for gifts because everybody has got a campaign.

the great thing about health care is we are able to really attract younger people who are just starting their lives and having children at sinai or having children, you know, as you did at -- in our hospital,who want to be associated with an enterprise that's going to be part of their life forever. but in terms of dollars, you know, we try to get everybody engaged at lots of different levels. the bigger dollars obviously have more impact. >> i guess the reason i was going there with the question is, it's really a business question to some degree given that you are in the hedge fund space, activist space. given how tough it's been for the hedge fund industry and given that i assume the past couple years some of the biggest dollars you have gotten have been from that space especially in new york city, how you see it. now people talk about peak activism, if you will. i am hoping you can speak not just to the philanthropy issue

but to the business issue of where the market is and what that says about your ability then to raise funds. >> well, first of all, we're not a hedge fund. we are an investment fund. trien is -- we like to call ourselves highly engaged. shareholder larry fink described us that way. we like that a lot. we think we're different from -- >> hedge fund now an -- >> no. we don't hedge. that's not what we do. most hedge funds are hedged -- they're having -- it's not an easy time to make a lot of money in the hedge fund world today. >> against gains for their investors, kind of. >> hopefully not. >> they have been. >> well -- >> it's been a tough time. the kind of volatility that exists makes it difficult. we invest in companies. we are not portfolio managers. we invest in companies where we

see an opportunity for the company to improve by focusing on improving them -- improving on the operating side. it's a long-term view, very different from a typical portfolio management, hedge fund, long-short balance. we think of ourselves as businessmen who invest in a portfolio. back to your question on philanthropy. basically what's happened is, first of all, a -- people have generated an enormous amount of wealth over the last several years. fortunately, we live in a world where there is a good ethic to give back, and people feel a responsibility. so i have not seen any slowdown in our ability to raise funds. and in fact, we're probably going to be starting a new campaign relatively soon. >> we don't call you an activist or we won't even call you a hedge fund. when you think about activism, do you -- people talk about peak activism, the low-hanging fruit is gone. you are now investing in g.e.

that's as far from being an activist or even a constructivist kind of investment given that it truly is a, we like this company, we're long this company, and that's what the investment is. >> it's more than that. we've been following ge for a very long time. both nelson and garden, my other founding partners at trian have had long standing relationships with jeff immelt and their lead director. we followed the company. we always felt, once they got out of the credit business, the opportunity for focusing on the industrial businesses, which are the best industrial businesses in the world. they're involved in energy development, they're involved in airplane engines, things with long tails. great service revenue. but in the case of ge, we consider ourselves validation capital. so what happened with ge is they

made the announcement that they are getting out of credit. and everybody basically kind of yawned because they felt that management has been talking about a lot of those things for a long time and our involvement and our engagement in issuing our white paper and showing the things we thought they should do, has really given credibility to the move that they are making and has had a very good effect on people realizing that there are engaged shareholders who are going to essentially hold management accountable for achieving the goals. >> wasn't there a time, peter, when being able to finance the sales of your own products, you know, at advantageous rates -- you sort of had it coming and going, wasn't that a good business model? >> deregulation. >> we saw revenues going from 10 billion to 300 billion. >> it was a great business until ge game a sifi.

>> then the kind of return they could get on capital disappeared. >> it wasn't gge's fault? >> you could say regulation had a lot to do with it. >> it was a good business model for a while. >> it was a good business model. a lot of the alternative investment guys started to get into some of the products ge was selling. in our view ge has the best industrial businesses in the world, and they now are -- they had a lot of excess overhead that resulted from getting to be a gigantic conglomerate. now they are paring back on a lot of it. they're moving to boston, giving them an opportunity to slim down on the corporate offices again and focusing their management and r&d strictly on their industrial businesses and on a tremendous i.t. business that they have. >> their industrial businesses are second to none. there has been some scuttlebutt that compared to siemens or

other competitors that there are places where the quality or -- i don't know -- the service or something wasn't -- i just heard anecdotal evidence, over the years, about siemens, oh, if you go there, there was some equipment -- you think it's best in class. >> we think the three verticals that they have in terms of their power generation and water generation and their airline business, aircraft engine business as well as their medical businesses are best in class. >> and the timing long term will be okay with -- doesn't matter when you buy some of these things, i guess. there have been some unfortunate top calling in -- one of the guests, it was amazing to be able to get in before the big drop. >> it's a relatively small part of their overall portfolio. we're long-term players. we have great confidence in the company. >> it's still 30. 60 when welch was there.

>> it wasn't 30 a year ago. >> eight years ago it wasn't six. or it was six. under six. >> correct. >> that would have been a good time to buy. peter and ken will stick around. more to talk to both of you about. more from our guests after the break, including a closer look at zika and the summer months ahead. it affects this company, but not just -- just you. you're concerned. savannah is not going to brazil. >> steph curry ratings for basketball -- pretty unbelievable. the futures right now, down 45 points. 13 on the nasdaq. down 7 on the s&p. louder. something we'll show you. through small things, big things, and spur of the moment things. big things,

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back with our guest host dr. ken davis. president and ceo of mount sinai health system and peter may, chairman of the borard of trustees. authorities say zika has blanketed three-quarters of puerto rico and now it may get worse that it's prime mosquito season. this is something a lot of people have been watching closely. there have been no transmitted cases in the continental united states. new york has the highest population of people who have the zika virus in the continental u.s. >> the concern is that some of

people who come back and will be bitten by a mosquito and those mosquitos will bite other people and there you go. there is the epidemic. this is a scary time. on the one hand 80% of people don't know they get it. on the other hand, if you are a pregnant lady and you get this disease, it can be devastating. snood the . >> the best understanding is it can be transmitted at any point through the tree trimesters. i think the lack of understanding is one of the most frightening things. >> for instance, we don't know whether the number of babies affected is 1% of pregnant women who carry zika or i have seen studies saying that it could be 60%, 80%, 90%. some say 30%. every trimester seems to affect something. this is a horrible outcome. microcephaly, the small heads, this is disability for life. when the congress sits and debates whether we should do, 1.1.

1.6 billion. they don't realize the downstream costs to the economy is enormous. >> what should we be doing with the funds? >> we have to do prevention, education. we have to clean up the places for the mosquitos live. we have to be able to tell people what to do to avoid being bitten. >> it's not just congress. i sent becky something i saw yesterday that 500 million was, by the president, was taken from a zika fund and put into the u.n. climate change fund. did you know that? >> there has also been other monies moved around. there was money we kept aside for ebola which, you know, a year ago we were very, very frightened about. that's been moved to potentially for zika. >> i am not an expert on this. it doesn't stay -- people who are infected are not infected for life. >> it goes away. what we're also unsure of is how long it stays, for instance, in the bloodstream.

>> and semen, how long it can be sexually transmitted. >> a man's semen could have it for three or six months. >> is it your expectation we'll be living with this for a year or two or for decades? >> hard to know. hard to know. if it's like some other viruses like this, dengue fever, it could be -- and malaria, it could be with us for a very long time. >> west nile. >> if it's like some of the other things, it could be gone in two or three years. even if it's the best case, two to three years, we could have a lot of women exposed during these next summers -- >> are you testing now? >> we test. we have an automatic tool that asks them where are you traveling, where have you been? if they've been in the caribbean and have any kind of symptoms, we get blood drawn. >> if they haven't -- >> i have asked for a zika test as well because i am pregnant.

>> probably every woman who is pregnant, no matter what -- >> baseline, check it out. 80% of women, no symptoms. how big of a problem are the olympics in brazil? that is a back and forth contention. it's winter there. it's not as serious of an issue. then people are questioning the who scientists saying they have a reason to be conflicted with them talking down some things. >> just yesterday there were reports from within brazil saying that, oh, the number of new zika cases that are going to come are very small during this period. it's the winter. people are going to be enclosed in safe places. there are others who say, no, this is a real serious threat and this is how zika can escape into a larger environment. >> which side do you come down on? >> i am not an infectious disease expert. as a general way, i think that pregnant women really have to

watch out here. i would urge the side of caution. >> what does that mean? stay in? don't -- >> don't go to an environment -- >> if it were me i wouldn't go. >> you wouldn't go down there? >> sure. >> if it comes here you can't even go outside. >> as a pregnant woman you wouldn't go down there. >> right. >> what if it becomes like puerto rico and it's mosquito season and there are mosquitos everywhere. >> i have had doctors tell me not to go outside. >> you might think about delaying pregnancy. >> what if you're too late for that? >> then you have to stay inside or have long sleeves, long pants and go out with insecticide. >> that's what several doctors have told me. >> they have found the eradication of the mosquitos is effective, where they're spending the money on it. >> that seems like the best program. >> that's why the government is not -- >> is not doing that more full scale. >> for people want to bring back det. >> there is always a downside here.

we have to weigh one pesticide versus another. there is another interesting approach which is to send out genetically modified flies that mate with the other flies and they -- >> mosquitos. >> i guess you didn't see the movie. >> what do you mean? >> genetically modified flies? you're ready to try that? seriously? >> i am on board with that. >> that was a great movie. >> jeff goldblum? >> he is talking about mosquitos, not flies. >> genetically modified flies to go after mosquitos. not a good idea. >> certain people would say, are you out of your mind? >> it's not just gmo, it's what happens to other populations that rely on the mosquitos. there are particularly bad mosquitos we're worried about. >> can you hang out for a while? peter is with me. at least i have someone on my immature level. we'll come back and talk a lot more. in the meantime. remembering the greatest friends, family and fans of

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welcome back to "squawk box" this morning here on cnbc, first in business worldwide. we're about an hour away from our exclusive interview with carl icahn at 8:30 a.m. eastern time. in studio now sharing thoughts on the market and health care. peter may, trian fund management and dr. ken davis, ceo of mount sinai health system. first, a couple stories. labor department's weekly initial jobless claims report coming out in about an hour. economists looking for claims to rise to 270,000 for last week, that would be up from 267,000 the prior week. also, another change could

be ahead for diet pepsi. "wall street journal" saying new changes could be announced this week as pepsico tries to stem slumping sales. last august they eliminated aspar tame as the artificial sweetener and replaced it with suke ra lows. you might have views about that. i don't know mr. pepsi. we can talk about that in a little bit u.s. solar market installations will nearly double this year according to a report by a research firm gtm. the search largely attributed to the expiration of a federal tax credit for solar projects at the end of this year. islamic funeral prayer service will be held for muhammad ali today, the three-time heavyweight boxing champion died last week at the age of 74. the service will be held at freedom hall in his home dotownf louisville, kentucky. public memorial set for friday. free tickets for the event sold out in less than an hour. or were given out in less than

an hour. they were free. they weren't sold. at a newspaper they would agonize over that, andrew. right? >> no. you can agonize. [ laughter ] >> they're free tickets. how can they be sold out? >> you run out of seats. >> okay. well, that's -- that's different. all right. >> i think it's different. crude extending gains for another day. fresh 2016 highs. do a correction down the road. harold hamm, america's richest oil man. really? >> oh. i don't know. i never checked. >> that's awesome! he made headlines in january when no one believed you when the demise of croyude was great exaggerated. you said it was rebound to 60 a barrel by the end of the year. he joins us now. we got to 51, which was -- from 27, a big move. >> big move. >> okay. so you still -- 60 you think

might be low? >> i do. i -- you know, in looking forward, i mean basically today we have two things that affect us. used to we had three. basically opec has always been a big one for the last 40 years. today it's -- they're kind of a non-event at this time. electing not to weigh in. so we're saying we have no-pec. coming back to supply and demand. that's what we're dealing with. when you look at the curves, what's happened is we have seen declines primarily from disruption and also decline rates of horizontal fields, a little bit more than everybody thought. so we're seeing those curves cross about a quarter early. 90 to 120 days. actually, people thought it would be later in the year, and actually in the second quarter we have seen the curves cross. so moved up about 90 to

120 days. and so we're at 51 right now. 51, 52. toward the end of the year i might have been 15%, 20% conservative. >> if we went back to $100, let's say, and any horizontal drill was draftable or the hardest to get stuff became profitable in this country, how much oil could we produce? could we be self-sufficient? >> we're going to have the ability in this country to oversupply the market again. >> can we supply ourselves completely, harold? >> we can. we have said that by 2020 we could be independent in america. so we believe that. >> do you believe the democrats would put a damper on horizontal drilling? >> well, they have. >> if hillary clinton were elected, will there be a significant damper on -- do you believe her? we don't know what to believe? she says stuff -- she is dealing

with bernie sanders. when she gets elected, she may not do any of it. >> we call it death by a thousand cuts. overregulate this industry, the oil and gas industry, to curb what we do here, it's not the best thing to do for sure. we do have the ability to oversupply the market. i think producers will be very cautious going forward. >> right. in new york you have got the narrative that they're still talking about the water contamination. the obama administration is talking about leaving hydrocarbons in the ground because of climate change. if that happens for the next four to eight years, i mean, you saw what happened to the coal industry. that wasn't pretty. >> no, it's not pretty. absolutely put coal practically out of business. basically had intentions -- >> a lot of coal miners and coal companies out of business. that was a great quote. >> targets right on our back to

do the same thing. >> so you are a trump guy, bottom line. >> i am. came out for trump. so that's where i'm at. >> would you be energy secretary? >> would i be? >> if asked? >> gosh, i have not been asked to be anything. >> andrew, you're a journalist. go for it. >> he is a racist -- >> do you feel uncomfortable about any of the things that he has said? >> you know -- you know, the clinton campaign is going to try to disrupt everybody, and what he says or what -- to get people away from the two things that's really important. that's the economy and the future of america. >> right. >> so they're going to try to disrupt -- >> you feel completely comfortable with everything he's said? >> you know. i have not listened to everything that he has said. i have listened to a lot of it. a lot of -- >> his comment about the judge? >> i wasn't there to listen to that, no. regardless, people -- you know,

people are thinking about two things. they're thinking about the future of america. >> right. >> and what -- what can be done to change to get back on course, make america great again. the american people -- this is a great phenomenon going on today that he started in america. to make people believe again in our country. it's a great thing. >> you don't worry about the -- i mean, you've talked about the divisive nature of president obama before when we've been here. you don't think that some of the comments he has made -- >> we need to elect a uniter like hillary. >> i am not suggesting that. >> are you a hillary guy, ken? are you comfortable with everything she has done in terms of the email and the clinton foundation and benghazi and travel-gate and the cattle futures and -- are you comfortable with all those things? >> you know, we're not electing the almighty. we're electing the alternative. >> that works with both sides, i guess. >> here is the thing -- >> i need -- i need a hillary --

>> i'll do it. you can say hillary clinton has done terrible things. the email things were terrible. and you can still decide that you want to support. he could say donald trump has said terrible, horrible things but he hasn't said that. that's what i was trying to ask about. you're not condemning his comments. you actually agree with his comments. >> maybe actions are worse than words. >> you know what. i think there is clearly a divide in this country. >> where are you, peter? >> i don't want to get into politics. i want to see this country -- first of all -- >> you could say i want to see america made great again and we'd know what you meant. >> america is great. >> it is. >> 70% of the people don't feel like it's that great. >> a lot of people are really frustrated because there has been a huge divide between the 1%ers and everybody else. i think that has to be dealt with. that involves really changing our education systems, long-term solutions. we need a government that can start working again.

that's the most frustrating thing. whoever ends up getting elected has got to figure out how to work with congress. that's my view. >> then we have to decide what the right action that a president working in concert with congress would do at this point. whether it's more government or cutting back on some of the government we already have. >> i certainly believe the government has gone too far, but i also believe that, you know, we have to give everybody a fair shake. >> right. or at least a fair opportunity. >> exactly. >> i agree. >> harold, thank you. >> thank you. good to be here with you. >> you did well. you're fine. it was like wolf blitzer almost. >> ken langone was on yesterday, condemned what trump said and said he couldn't support hillary clinton. a completely reasonable answer too. right? >> sure. >> i am just putting it out there. when we come back this morning, it's one of the seven wonders of the modern world. 34 years in the making. 50 miles long. mary thompson joins us from

panama with looking at how the updates to the canal will reshape delivery. you see the dow down about 50 points this morning. s&p futures down by 7. nasdaq off by 13. "squawk box" will be right back. ♪ using 60,000 points from my chase ink card i bought all the fruit... veggies... and herbs

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a new era in global shipping launches this month. the nine-year project to build a new lane accommodating megaships in the panama canal is close to colleagu completion. that's where we find our mary thompson this morning. mary, good morning. >> reporter: good morning to you, becky. they broke ground on the new lane back in 2009. since then it's pretty much been a 24/7 operation costing over $5.25 billion. the official opening is not until the end of the month, but we are here today for a wet run of the new locks. a ship coming in from the atlantic will pass through. these locks can raise and lower ships a third larger than those that pass through the original locks of the panama canal. that means megaa-ships carrying

over 45% of the world's cargo can now access this shortcut. ushering in a new era of global trade. >> it means a shorter route. it means a reduction of co 2 emissions. so that's good for the world. it means better prices for the people that are promoting the merchandise because they are going to get economies of scale. >> reporter: boston consulting group estimates the new lane could cut shipping costs by 30% making some east coast ports more competitive with those on the west and the panama canal competitive with the suez canal. the ships will pay tolls over the $250,000 average. profit could double to $2 billion over the next 15 years to the panamanian government. the new lane has exporters and

importers rethinking how and where to ship goods. this has set off a race among the east coast ports to make sure they're ready to accept the megaships. the west coast ports have been upgrading their facilities to make sure they maintain their edge. more on that part of the story coming up on "squawk on the street." coming up, stocks to watch this morning. quick look first at the futures before we head to a break. dow could open off 54 points. s&p off 7 and nasdaq off 14 points. squawk returns in a moment. i take prilosec otc each morning for my frequent heartburn

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only with xfinity. we are back with our special guests for the hour dr. ken davis and peter may. peter, i just want to talk to you a little bit -- you talked to nelson, i'm sure. it's not a macro viewpoint by any stretch. but you will find opportunities no matter what the backdrop. i guess we had -- i think it was welch who said we have been habituated. this is what we do for gdp growth and we don't think it's possible to escape that because it's the new normal. the world is where we are and we're dealing with exogenous factors and there is nothing we can do. is that your viewpoint? >> we don't pay a lot of attention to macro. >> at all? >> we're very concentrated portfolio.

we have six to eight investments at any one time, very big positions. we are looking for the needle in the haystack. we're looking for a really great company where we think that management either hasn't gotten it right or there are real opportunities to improve it. when you have that kind of a model, you really -- there are always companies that aren't running in the best way they possibly can. the macro doesn't have that much impact on us. >> doctor, while we have you here, i don't know what the mean or median premium increase will be this year, you are seeing united health care and a lot of insurance companies dealing with effects of the aca. is there one thing, if you were king, that you could adjust that would somehow bring down premiums, bring down deductibles, somehow make it easier for people to -- >> there is just no one thing. it's too complicated. one of the things we have to remember it, the risk was inappropriately estimated

because there was an assumption that there would be more healthy people who would be in the risk pools. >> you're saying the levels that were set, the actuarial levels. >> yes. assumed a healthier population. and because the penalties are what they are, which is relatively modest, people made a decision they would rather take the risks than pay the -- and pay the penalty. so you don't have the kind of riching po risk pool that you'd like. that's been a killer. >> so what happens? president will leave office. and then we're going to see what happens in 2017 to the premiums. i mean, how -- i've seen 40% numbers in cases. >> you can pick the 40% numbers. some numbers have been smaller than that. >> increases in insurance premiums. >> yes. >> so it's all over the place. >> do you do a catastrophic -- do you get something where you pay for most things but are covered for the catastrophic

stuff? >> what you do is change the way health care is delivered. and that's really -- that's what we're trying to do at mount sinai and what -- one of the little things that was in the -- in obamacare and affordable care act was pilot programs to create population management models. and mount sinai had one of the first. the whole idea is to change the way you emphasize taking care of people to keep them healthy rather than only taking care of them when they're sick because the incentive system today is to over-test and to do more procedures because that's how people get paid as opposed to taking care of a patient and making sure -- >> outcome versus -- >> exactly. that's the only way to bend the cost curve. >> there have been innovative programs along that line. the idea is to align the patient, the payer, and the provider of care so that they all want to do the same thing. and that same thing should be

keep people well, keep them out of the hospital, out of the emergency room and get the most efficient care possible. >> which makes total sense but it's also a prescription you have been telling us about for years. what's the catalyst to make that change happen? >> the payers. the payers have to say that the way this is going to happen is we're going to pay you for a group of people. that's all you're going to get and we're not going to pay you every time you do something. that changes the whole -- the whole paradigm. >> the biggest payer being medicare? >> medicare, medicaid. >> do we see -- is the eventual answer going to be a public option or a single-payer model? if we continue to see premium increases every year people will be clamoring for something else. bernie sanders was already running on a single payer platform. >> i think what we'll see is more and more of the payers asking for contracts that pay for a population. it won't be a single payer.

this country will never be able to agree to a single-payer system. i see that as very unlikely. i see that we'll continue to have multiple payers and those payers will sit down -- >> what about a public option? >> the public option was taken out of the aca initially. >> hillary-care could be resurrected with eight years with hillary as president. have you talked to her about that? >> i haven't talked to her about that, no. i think that the reason the -- the idea for the public option was that the overhead that the medicare provides is a lot less than the overhead that you get from private insurance. medicare's overhead is about three cents on the dollar. >> geez! >> the overhead for the private insurers by the aca is 15 or 20 cents on the dollar. so the question of whether you can have a public option is whether it might moderate what's going on in the exchanges. but it's not there. when we talk about health care, it is so emotionally charged.

and so idealogically charged. what troubles me is it's rarely enough pragmatically charged that we don't get answers that may be really the things that will work best. >> remember for years we were told by krugman and the like that the v.a. was the model for single-payer. look how well the v.a. works. >> v.a. is grossly underfunded is the problem. we have a lot of veterans who come back -- >> that was the word, that the government can do this. it was a much smaller program. >> it has to do with management. at the end of the day -- >> when does a government-run program not have to do with management. >> you're right but cms, the center for medicare -- happens to be one of the best managed government programs around. >> what is it now? 55 for medicare? 60? 65. would you take it to 55? >> i think the option for people to go medicare at 55 would be a

good option. >> raise the age on social security. >> now with the -- the president has moved left on that. now we're going to increase social security. >> so have both candidates. from both parties. >> he's not -- >> not talking about indexing it for a while. i wonder in the medicare overhead, what is medicare fraud? how does it offset the overhead. >> it's hard to put a finger on that exactly. >> wait. your expectation is that there is no fraud -- no fraud by any other payer? >> no. sure.

a morning of news breakers and breakers on "squawk box." hedge fund pioneer glenn dubin. carl icahn, the legendary investor best known for his big bets on stocks. he is also making a name for himself in philanthropy. >> we'll talk markets. the trails aials and tribulatio trump. a special hour of "squawk box" begins right now. ♪ live from the most powerful

city in the world, new york. this is "squawk box." welcome back to "squawk box" here on cnbc, first in business worldwide. i'm joe kernen along with rebecca quick and andrew ross sorkin. less than 90 minutes away from the opening bell on wall street. futures continue to be weak after what's been a couple pretty good weeks for the bulls. back above 18,000. we'll be below that if we open here this morning down 57 points on the dow. about 8 on the s&p. nasdaq indicated down just under 14. a couple of top stories to talk about this morning. oil prices pulling back a bit after hitting 2016 highs. pr ecb president mario draghi saying the eurozone is at risk of suffering lasting economic damage due to weak productivity and slowing growth. brussels this morning, draghi argued the monetary policy cannot end the region's economic

malaise. >> bernie sanders meets with the president today. i would like to be a fly on the wall for that conversation. we are continuing our change the world summit right now with one of the pioneers of the hedge fund industry. joining us right now is glenn dubin, co-founder of highbridge capital management, one of the world's largest hedge funds. he and his wife eva established the dubin breast cancer at mount sinai in 2011. thank you for being here. >> nice to be here. thank you. we are talking about all kinds of things. we'll dig into a lot of subjects. let's start with the breast cancer center, why you think that this is important and what innovations you have actually seen since the center opened. >> why don't i tell you the origin of the center, which was my wife being diagnosed with breast cancer. in 2003. here is this perfectly healthy 40-year-old woman with three

children under 7 years old being told you have breast cancer. >> what was her diagnosis? >> it was early stage and ultimately treated successfully, but you can imagine the shock. my wife is a physician. so she absorbed all this information, being told, again, you have early-stage breast cancer. she went about navigating the world of cancer treatment. >> but she had the ability to navigate that that probably a lot of people didn't have. >> yes. >> as a physician. >> even for her, it was overwhelming. >> right. >> you know, the complexity, the fragmentation of cancer treatment, going from one doctor on one side of town to the other doctor on the other side of town. >> who aren't necessarily speaking with each other and making sure what they're treating on both sides works -- >> and getting differing opinions. it was overwhelming. after being successfully treated at mount sinai she made the decision, why don't i use my experience as both a patient and my training as a physician to create a better model.

that's really the beginnings of the dubin breast cancer. >> so in terms of where we are, it seems like every week there is new information that comes out when it's concerning cancer that we are getting better and better at targeting some of these things. focusing, figuring out better treatments for am so some of th situations. what have you seen? >> obviously cancer research is paramount. but our focus at the dubin breast center, though we have an association with the tisch cancer institute where they're doing extraordinary work and research, our focus at the dubin breast center is treatment, to provide the best possible care and treatment to women who are diagnosed with breast cancer. it's very rewarding. for my wife eva, who is deeply involved. she goes to the center every day. she meets with patients. she meets with doctors. she meets with the administrators of the center. there is a real reward in seeing

this center provide help to people with cancer. >> dr. davis, obviously that's the type of philanthropic giving -- it's not just about the money, it's about the input and the involvement too. how would you say having partners like this? >> eva is a very special person, as is glenn. their presence makes a huge difference in the center. their values are communicated in what we do every day. what's very, very special about the dubin center, when you come in, is that you realize it is a lower stress environment. here are people -- >> that's saying a lot. >> that's right. i mean, here are people who come at a pivotal and an awful time in their lives. got this diagnosis that is life-threatening. and we try to produce an environment that is as caring, kind, compassionate as possible to decrease the stress levels. and eva's input into that has been critical. she had a perspective that few of us had.

the feedback we get about the dubin center, it's one of the nicest things that we do. >> can that be replicated through other areas? obviously anybody who has a critical illness -- >> we have tried to do this in the rutenberg center, use it as a model for how to deliver care. glenn put his finger on something when he talked about what it was like for eva at the beginning, when she went everywhere and care was fragmented. >> i think it's probably the basic consumer situation today, the experience that most people have when they go in with a critical care condition. >> we want every doctor to come to the dubin center. the patients don't go outside. when your mammography and testing is done, it's in the dubin center. your surgeon meets you in the dubin center. if it's radiation oncology you get that there. everybody meeting in the dubin center. it's comprehensive, integrated care that puts the least stress possible on the patients. >> i think that part is hugely

important and probably one of the cracks that most people end up slipping through in the health care system today is that you're being treated for one thing without the doctors necessarily communicating, if you have heart issues, if you have diabetes, anything else going on, a prescription that one doctor gives you, some sort of a fix that one doctor gives you can conflict with something else. how do we figure -- you would think we would be better at fixing that in this day and age of technology and medical records that are more easily accessible but we are not there yet. >> we're not. we have to do a better job of it. in an integrated health care system like ours it's easier to do that. we're all on the same medical record, we can see everybody's problems. in the dubin center you are more than your cancer. that means not just the personality issues that you bring but sometimes you have other comorbidities that have to be taken care of.

you have hypertension. you had elevated lipids. and we're able to take care of all of those things together and not forget about it. >> i guess my question is, mount sinai is the gold standard. >> we think so. >> how do we get the rest of medical centers to a similar situation? >> we have to integrate care. we have to be able to afford an electronic medical record everywhere. we have to be able to afford the kind of case managers that can coordinate care. we have to change the way we deliver care. as peter was talking about it, this is not any longer about every time we're going to do something we're going to get paid. this has to be an integrated care system from the beginning that is as efficient as possible, does things in the lowest-cost environment and is focused on quality. >> glenn, can we talk to you about the markets while we sit here. this is a critical time in health care and a critical time with the markets. central bank activities around the globe have gotten people to the point where they think

higher rates may never be coming and a lot of people questioning what that means and what they should be doing. how do you see the macro environment? >> i am kind of out of the markets for the most part. not looking on a daily basis. i could look at the environment that we're in right now, the kind of grinding market higher, zero interest rates, very little volatility, it could continue for a long time. and people are asking me because i have been involved in the hedge fund industry for so long, what will the effect be of this grinding higher market/low interest market be for the hedge fund industry? quite frankly. it's not good. i look back at my career when i started 30-some-odd years ago. it was a much different environment. first of all, the competitive landscape was dramatically different. i can count on two hands the number of real competitors that we had. obviously that's changed dramatically. but also environmentally. i have to stress that it is not

a good environment for many of these hedge fund strategists. >> you mean because of the markets? because of the additional competition from other arenas? because of regulation? >> let's look back at what i think is probably the best decade that fueled hedge fund industries' growth. 2000 to 2010. that, not coincidentally in my opinion, was the worst ten-year period in stock market history going back to the 1930s. no performance on the stock market. higher interest rates, bigger spreads, more volatility. and a less competitive environment. >> it's interesting. we hear from people today that the volatility is part of the problem. you don't sound like you agree with that. >> 14. >> relative to what we have seen in the last four or five years. >> i don't know if you saw the "wall street journal" this morning. george soros making a big bet that the world is practically coming to an end depending on how you look at it.

he thinks that between brexit. potential hard landing in china and other things -- >> it's weird. he says pound is indicating brexit is not going to happen. he is an expert on the pound. >> he is buying gold like it's going out of business. >> right. well, george soros is george soros for a reason. >> doesn't mean he'll be right but he is investing $30 billion, family money! which is more than -- we pool our -- yeah. maybe all of us could and still maybe -- even with you. maybe not. no. we leave glenn out. then we'll be -- >> thank you, joe. all my money has gone to philanthropy. >> i know that. that's good. we found out, 250 out of $8 billion. that was depressing to hear. >> saddest part about this. >> 250 of the budget -- of the budget. >> it was revenue. revenue doesn't cover the costs unfortunately. but the revenue doesn't cover

the costs, which is why you need the cushion. >> right. i guess, dr. davis, when you look at the innovations, where do you want this money to go? where are the best uses for it? where are the best practicalities? you probably have many answers. >> there are a lot of frontiers that have a possibility of major payoffs. we are seeing it in cancer now. immunotherapy is revolutionizing cancer. genomics is another part of that that's revolutionizing cancer. it's likely in 10, 20 years we have a lot of curable cancer that were unthinkable ten years ago. >> or living with. maybe not even curing. >> making it a chronic disease. absolutely right. >> we should buy some rest home stock, i think. be a lot of people over 90. >> the real question that we don't talk very much about is, how close are we to you know -- to decoding what's the biology

of aging. >> don't get me excited here, doc. >> i think it's a little beyond -- >> i know. we're just going to miss. that's the worst thing. we're going to miss it -- for a hundred thousand years men have been living and dying. we get right up to where we could have done it and we're going to miss it. that's the irony. >> the galapagos turtle lives to 120, 130. the fruit fly lives a couple of weeks maybe. so my dog will live maybe -- 15. what's the biology of aging? we're going to crack that. when we do, boy, is that going to change. dr. davis is our guest host for the rest of the program. glenn, thank you so much for joining us. coming up, carl icahn joins us live. we'll ask him about his new position at allergan. his decision to dump apple and all of his charitable giving. you're watching "squawk box" here on cnbc, first in business

worldwide.

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we do these quick breaks between -- we got to get our commercials in and everything. we have to take another break before we get to icahn. you'll take pictures on the first day of school,

kindergarten, for your kids. you are at a different point. there comes a time -- it's prom season. our viewers know my daughter from a young age. this was last night. i promised her -- >> when she was born. >> that's when she was born. >> viewers know her from her little red-head. the red hair has continued. that is last night. >> she looks gorgeous! >> i showed this guy when he came over -- showed him my clock. i said -- this is not for any reason but i happen to have one. can you believe it? that was a senior prom. she is only a sophomore. that's how quickly -- that's how quickly it -- you know -- >> she looks all grown up. >> i said to my wife you're going to cry. she didn't because she had to pin the guy because will, the guy's name, he got struck when he tried to put the there is a beautneer and a corsage. she didn't cry. >> you're tearing up? >> you'll see. senior prom. pretty cool.

coming up -- another break and then we'll get to carl icahn who will be with us for as long as we can keep him. we'll give wopnerapner a run fo money. politics, investing and push to change the world. get bill ackman on the phone. maybe they can start fighting. we'll be right back. okay, so what's our latest data say? our customer is a 21-year-old female. heavily into basketball. wait. data just changed... now she's into disc sports. ah, no she's not. since when? since now. she's into tai chi. she found disc sports too stressful. hold on. let me ask you this... what's she gonna like six months from now? who do we have on aerial karate? steve. steve. steve. and alexis. uh, no. just steve. just steve. just steve.

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this morning. continuing our change the world series this morning with mount sinai -- i was thinking saint. you could be a saint too. joining us is legendary investor carl icahn. he has pledged nearly $200 million to mount sinai and the medical school is named after him. a lot to talk to carl about this morning. stocks and the markets. we want to talk about charity first, if we could. >> all right, andrew. >> here we go. thank you for waking up early. first of all, when is the last time you have been up at this hour? >> you know, i was up -- i was watching your whole program. i was up at 6:00 doing some work. >> wow! >> catching up on some stuff. it helped me. i got some work done and was listening to you guys. >> thank you for waking up early for us. >> hey, i'll do anything for you. you know that, you guys. >> it's not secretary icahn yet, is it? treasury secretary icahn? >> you don't have to worry about that, joe. >> what do you mean?

i'm not worried about it. >> well, that's not going to happen. i am not going to move to washington. >> you could do it -- you could be treasury secretary on a phoneer carl. >> i wouldn't be able to go on your program if i were secretary. >> if you were watching at 6:00 you probably heard us talk about the "wall street journal" cover story. george soros. >> i'm looking forward to reading it. didn't get the "wall street journal" yet. look, i haven't read it. i think he is a very smart guy, george soros. listening to what you said he said, i can't help but think he has a couple real good points. you know, i think there is -- you know, i have been saying it. i think that you have a -- sort of a false market, by zero interest rates. you have to be cognizant of it. look at stocks today. what happened to graham and dod. when i grew up and learned this

stuff, was a young broker. you looked at company's assets and liabilities. today these things -- you got a lot of companies out there going at negative net worth. you are paying $25 billion, $30 billion for some of these companies that don't have any patents, don't have any proprietary technology. >> carl, there were many times in the past where you were -- i have mentioned this on the air. it probably got back to you. we had dinner 15, 20 years ago. you have always had a problem with the overall market and valuations. you are a guy who knows how to pick, obviously, from your record, you know how to pick individual stocks. but the market's rise in valuation has amazed you. you have had chagrin about that for years. is it more so now? >> you're right in one part of what you are saying. i don't think anybody can really pick the market on any short-term basis. i think that's sort of a

ridiculous thing. it's almost like picking the red or the white -- you know, will red, white or black come up on a roulette table. i don't think i've always been bearish. look at our record. you know, there's ups and downs. there is no question about that. but i don't -- i think there are times i've been pretty bullish. but i really think now i look at this market and you just say, look at some of these values. and you just have to wonder. and you have to -- now, look, i am no expert on china. but i read a lot about it. you read -- hey, you read different experts tell you there could be a major problem there. others say there won't be. how do you know? but it's a richisk. let me tell you one thing. if china really blows up. i was reading carl bass' report

on it a few months ago. if it ever happens like that, and it could, you're going to have a major, major problem in our markets with that. i don't know that it will happen. i'm not saying it will, but you really have -- you certainly have a credit problem over there. i don't think anybody denies that. however, you know, if you have a very strong dictatorial country, they can deal with things like that. so we'll see what happens. but it's certainly a risk. you can't ignore it. i don't think anybody can ignore it. i don't think the most bullish guy in the world would ignore it. i had dinner with a couple of ceos last night. one ceo and a cfo of a -- a company that we own in freeport. and i'll tell you. you talk about copper. and, you know, we think, you know, copper is sort of cheap and that there's going to be less supply, more demand. then you say, well, yeah, but

what happens if china has a hmm. all of a sudden all bets are off. >> who picked up the tab? >> i had it in my home. >> so you did. >> i have a lot of dinners at my home, andrew. you can talk more freely. i meet a lot of ceos at my apartment. we have a good chef. >> poor gayle. working her fingers to the bone. >> gayle was at this dinner. she gets involved with some of this stuff. she is good. she is a great operator. you pick on her a little bit but -- >> carl, when you talk about your concerns about the market, though, you are actually putting your money where your mouth is. you have brought down some of your stock positions, and if i am right, based on these latest sec filings, you have more cash on hand i guess for opportunities if things do go -- >> becky, it's a little bit -- you know, overstated, because if you look at what we call our fund, we probably are net short.

but we own a lot of companies at i.e.p. you really do have a built-in hedge, you know, where we -- we hedge out the stuff. but if you look at our overall picture, we're probably long because of of the -- we own the refineries. we own the rail car business. we own pepboys now. so you really sort of have a hedge going on in the fund. but -- >> so we have made too much of it when we've looked at your positions and figured -- >> well, i don't think you could look at it that way and say, oh, my god, you're over-short because that's just in the fund numbers. but if you look -- we have billions of dollars of value in companies that we own. as i said, the refineries and -- the rail car business is a huge business.

and we own it. so if you count that, i would say we're net long. it is a little worrisome to me that we actually are that long. >> great point. >> carl, i want to -- we have ken here. i want to get back to what you're doing with mount sinai for a minute and then back to stocks including the comments on the dell decision last week, which i imagine you might have a view on. politics after the break. since ken is here. explain this. you are a value investor. when you give away money, how do you think about it? you have given $200 million to mount sinai. >> and more. >> what's the thought process. i assume hundreds of people call you every day asking for money. how do you actually make the decision? >> you look at a couple of areas i'm really sort of interested in, and i feel -- i feel it's sort of unfairly -- we'll start with education. our educational system in this

country is abyizmal. we have charter schools. we give a lot of scholarships away. the kids in this country don't have a break. you look at new york city, one of the wealthiest -- probably the wealthiest city in the world. this wealth gap is right here in new york. yet, if you look at it, you go north of 90th street and you have these kids that just are not educated. it's really a sad phenomenon. you have a government that spends $11,000, $12,000 a kid and they don't get an education. then -- i set out to prove this. then i really got into it. so i said, you know, this is just terrible what you're doing. so i get a charter school down the street in the bronx, down the street -- and those kids read as -- as well as the kids in scarsdale, for instance,

because, you know -- >> that's not true. >> i don't operate the school. but you have a system there where you can fire a teacher if they're not doing a good job. you have accountability. that's one of the -- that comes to the -- so you take mount sinai. i was on the board of trustees. i never go to meetings. i have too much to do. and i don't -- you know, i can't sit around listening to everybody pontificate. nothing wrong -- the trustees are great there and they do a great job. my point was they asked me to go in, but you had to pick a new ceo. this is many years ago. i went to that. they say, carl, you have real good ceos at your place. we interviewed seven, eight guys. sitting there. ken davis came along. and i said to the guys on the search committee. your search is over. take this guy. just take him. they listened to me. that's how ken really was there. and he has done a phenomenal

job. i think, in most businesses, just like in a hospital, you have to get the right guy to run it. and ken has done a great job. and that -- that's why i gave them a lot of money, because i got to know ken, and i figured that he was going to really be able to use that money and to make this -- mount sinai a great hospital, which we needed to badly in this city. there were eight of these hospitals. i don't have to tell you what trouble they were. now look at the turn around at mount sinai. ken did a great job. peter may did a great job as the chairman. i love something like that. i don't have to be involved myself. i have dinner with ken every few months. and i -- i think that the city owes him a debt of gratitude. >> another turn-around job. thank you for that, carl. >> it really was. >> we're going to press the pause button. when we come back we have to talk about politics with you.

i do want to get to the dell issue and a number of other stocks that you have involvement in. hang with us for a little bit. dow down by 60. nasdaq off by 15. s&p down by 7. when we come back, much more to discuss with carl icahn. kpmg's focus is to elevate women on and off the course. through the kpmg women's leadership summit, kpmg is empowering the next generation of women leaders. and with the kpmg future leaders program, we're inspiring future generations. it's a responsibility that belongs to all of us.

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we are back with our special guest. legendary investor carl icahn. our guest host dr. ken davis is with us as well. got a lot of companies to talk about you to you about, carl. herbali herbalife, valeant. quickly. we call it the 800-pound gorilla in the room. that's donald trump. you have known him a long time. i know you're friendly with donald trump and have been, i guess, somewhat supportive of his candidacy. has anything changed your view on that in the last couple of weeks? >> no, not at all.

i think you need someone like donald in washington very badly. i know -- if you ever go down there -- it's no secret. i don't think many would argue, there is just pure gridlock there. you have different constituencies, different ideologies and really can't get anything done. that's very, very bad for this country at this time. the federal reserve is holding up this economy, and they -- i just don't think you can have zero interest rates for much longer without having these bubbles explode on you. you need fiscal stimulus. the whole obsession with the deficit is ridiculous. the right wing of the republican party, if you talk to them, you ask them, what's so bad about the deficit at this time and really they can't answer it. there is no answer. i would say that it -- in an economy like ours where you have a reserve currency, the fear of the deficit is just completely

overdone. and right now you need -- well, donald hasn't really spoken about that, but you need somebody to go in there and break this gridlock. i know donald for years. and he -- he is a consensus builder. he knows how to deal with people. and if you don't have that in washington, we're going to just have more -- >> carl, the talking point dejour, if you're with trump, you're with a racist. and that's -- i don't know. there is an entire contingent of people that are making that case, including "the daily news." i am with racist or whatever paul ryan -- yeah, he is a racist but i still think he should be president. you know, i -- it would be easier for you to do this part of the interview. you know him. is he a racist? >> i know him. i think it's ridiculous. come on! it's an absurdity. i don't know if you -- i don't know what racist means.

he -- >> there will be riots in the streets i was just told, carl. riots outside the white house. there will be, i don't know, open warfare, righ basically? >> no. i don't think -- come on, joe. this is ridiculous. >> i was told that. >> i think it's ridiculous. i mean, if they can't find anything worse to talk about donald than say some nonsense, i mean, that just gets you angry. if you look -- let's talk about all the problems with hillary clinton. >> i tried that. >> what are we going to do. >> words are worse than actions, i was told. >> in fairness. we had ken langone on yesterday. he is supporting donald trump but he said he thought donald trump's comments about the judge were what he called, quote, disgraceful. he condemned the comments. he was not happy about that. >> i don't think anyone that supports donald is happy about that. i mean, i think sometimes donald will say things that become very provocative and -- so i am not

here to defend donald saying that about the judge. i am here to talk about who would be by far the best president. we're not here to talk about that either. but if you're asking me who would be the best president i don't think there is any comparison. i think that -- just look the record of hillary clinton. i mean, it's sort of funny. she gets up and says, i'm here, we're going to clean up this mess. where in the hell has she been for 40 years. look at eleanor roosevelt and what she accomplished. hillary could have done all these great things. now she says, i'm going to clean up this mess. it's sort of absurd. >> elizabeth warren and hillary both calling him a failed businessman. i guess they're referring to the casinos or any of the individual bankruptcies. but i don't think that trump enterprise was quite as successful as the clinton foundation, carl in terms of generating -- >> you might say that. of course, the clinton foundation has a lot of advantages. but i am not sheer to trahere t

clintons. i am saying to you that you have to get this gridlock fixed. you have to get a change. and i think donald will accomplish that. it's sort of as simple as that, joe and andrew. i think it's as simple as saying that we need, in this country, a major change, or we will have riots in the streets. >> given that we are talking about trying to improve the economy, a couple of stocks i wanted to mention to you. i mentioned before the break the dell decision. you had argued for a long time that when michael dell was taking the company private the price was too low. you got him to bump the price. the judge in the case said actually market price is still not enough. what do you make of that? >> you make of it is what the major problem, i say, in our corporations today. so many boards are so bad. it's really a sad commentary. here this board gives away

$7.5 billion, and all you can say is, well, they made a mistake. that's fine. business judgment. it's absurd. i was there. i made a bid, and they wouldn't even dignify it, literally. they just gave this to dell. you know, we really set in it. nothing can be done. you have these laws. i will tell you that's another thing that has to be done. you have to change the laws of corporate governance. this is the epitome of what we are talking about. the quintessential example of where boards are just terrible. and here they give away $7.5 billion and nobody wants to do anything. they say, oh, that's okay. business judgment. it's an absurdity and dell literally walked away with it. if the board lets them get away with it, so be it. you really can't even blame dell. though i think the whole thing is unconscionable.

what can you do? i have enough to do, so i'm not going to lead a crusade on this. but it is a sad commentary. >> different stock i wanted to talk about. you got out of apple. i am curious, is there a price at which you'd get back into apple? >> i really think apple is a great company. i have to tell you that, you know, we made all -- we made several billion dollars on it. you look at the portfolio. you say, you know, apple is a great company, but what happens if china really has trouble. and you know, china was sort of, you know, shaking the trees a little bit there, talking about apple, saying they want more and why don't you wake up one day, you know, china starts giving them trouble. i still think apple is a great company. i like tim cook. i think he's doing a great job. i would get back in if i felt more secure about china, which i don't think anybody can tell you that china is not going to have

a problem, even though it might be a very small one. but it's -- look, i -- i think china's banks, we all know, could have a real credit problem. >> in hindsight should they have bought back all the stock you wanted them to buy, carl? maybe they need it now for whatever the next big thing is going to be. >> joe, come on. they're sitting with $200 billion over in cash there. hey, i am the first to say, joe, that there are too many buy-backs by the way. i think that many companies are doing buy-backs rather than putting money into much-needed capital improvements. many companies i could point out and i'm short on some of them though i'm not going into my short positions. i'll tell you this. you really have sort of a real problem, if you want to think about it. you have ceos, just think about this as a paradigm. you have ceos that have a lot of

vesting that's coming up. say they know that in three years or four years from now there is going to be -- you vest. the three years comes due. now they're vesting. they want the stock up, when their options are vested. they want them up. what do they do? instead of taking the money that janet yellen gives them via the courtesy of zero interest rates, instead of putting it into capital expenditures. where is the money going into capital? look at the productivity in the country. it's terrible. what do the guys do? you can't blame them. they make themselves 100 million bucks. i am no great fan of buy-backs. >> on a graham and dodd basis, a lot of analysts and even you to some extent a year ago said it was at eight times earnings. it had all this cash. it's cheap. it seemed like a slam-dunk that it should be -- >> what are we talking about?

apple now? >> yeah. >> it should be a trillion-dollar company based on multiples. as we know, the "e" in multiple, it can change. >> i still think apple is a great company. i think it's very hard to ever break into their ecosystem. i haven't changed my opinion on the fact that they have -- >> you sold it all. >> i sold it for a different reason. i sold it because i worried about, you know -- i have a company too that's sort of -- that's public even though i own most of it. i am worried -- sometimes you worry about the near term. people say i am a short-term guy. i am not. my average holding period is seven years. you guys say i'm short-term and i'm not. >> you seemed so sure about apple. i was counting on you. next thing you know you're out, carl. >> well, things change. i worry about china. china came -- you know, china is

a problem. you have to change your opinion sometimes, right? >> i know. i agreed with you in the previous thing. seemed like a slam-dunk. i don't know if it was. can we talk about one of your newest positions. we found out you have a large position in allergan. i know part of this is a bet on the ceo there, brent saunders who you worked with in the past at forest labs. you made a lot of money when you were involved with that and forest was eventually acquired by activists. the company said they don't expect you to get too involved with company management or anything. i smiled when i saw that because i don't see you as a passive investor. >> becky, i'll start with this. i love not to get too involved. i am not too involved with mount sinai because i have a good guy running it. >> dr. davis said the same thing. >> but yeah. i'll give you an example. maybe that's a bad analogy.

i have companies where we own, like apple, for instance, we have a good ceo. you don't micro-manage. you don't get involved. >> you big ideas about apple, though. >> he did a great job. brent, i know him fairly well. he did a great job at forest. i will say that that's one of the reasons i bought allergan. i saw allergan fall apart. when we had forest we made a great deal of money on forest because he came in there -- i was instrumental, and i am proud to say, to have him become the ceo. he got that thing sold, did great. so activist went up. i figured, what do i want to keep it for. i sold it. i made a big profit, but we sold it and it kept going higher. i said, if it comes down i'll look at it because brent is a really good manager. it fell apart because pfizer --

completely wrongly it was tinged with the brush of valeant. it was a great -- it's simple. you look at allergan. the thing got way down to close to the 200 level. and we bought a lot of stock. we just looked at the numbers. allergan has a great pipeline. a great pipeline. and it also has a deal with tever. it's a risk if it doesn't go through. you talk about the anti-trust laws and all that, it's pretty much a fait accompli, i hope. even if it didn't go through, which i think it will, you look at the numbers. allergan is just simply undervalued with a good -- with a very good ceo. it's really a simple question. >> carl, on the screen we also showed the stock price of valeant. i know your friend bill ackman is suffering through this. would you buy that stock? frankly, would you short that stock at this point?

>> well, i don't know enough about it to say i would short it, but i definitely would not buy it. i just don't know what -- you know, when a company has these problems, i am not smart enough to know how deep they are. and so you wait. i have learned that. you've got to say, look, you got to worry about every stock you buy. do they have problems. hidden problems. you have to worry about that when you do it. but if you know they've got problems, i guess it's like a sick person. if you know they're sick, well, you don't let them run the marathon. you don't bet on them in a race. so i think, as far as i'm concerned, i should not be saying i don't like valeant because i really don't know very much about it. i never liked the model they had. i never really liked that model. i think a lot of the pharma companies have that kind of a problem where, you know, you're -- i don't understand where analysts don't look at the -- at the -- these patent

clips more. >> yeah. >> but again, i shouldn't even be talking about valeant. i wouldn't own it. i'm not buying it for the reasons i say. but i certainly don't know that it's got a problem or anything like anything like that. >> you picked out a pretty simple one in the past. when you're buying things, you came in pretty simple. you didn't know everything, did you, carl? >> no, didn't know them, but i did talk to people that did know them very well. and loved those drugs. i can talk to somebody that is really knowledgeable in pharma, i can look at the numbers, and that's good enough for me. but what more can i do? i look at it. i can't talk to anybody that knows what valeant is. i don't think anybody can.

you know there were problems and there's nobody that could tell me, can say the problems are over, let's not worry about it. the guys thought that when it was 80. but you're getting me into something that i really shouldn't be talking about. >> the existential threat to herbalife from the government, if it does get settled, and i don't know what they're talking about, it's not that much money, i mean, it's a lot, but it's not that much. does that close the book on whether ackman is right or not, if they do settle and they're allowed to stay in business? >> i can say one thing, and i think i can say it safely. my lawyers might not want me to say this. we're on the board, and i have a copy. but i will say it, and i've said it before. and i'll say it again. ackman is completely and totally wrong on this company. you know, ackman is a smart guy and all, but he is just

dead-wrong. this company creates work for a lot of people. and to say it doesn't is ridiculous. as far as i'm concerned, i've said it publicly enough, it's not a pyramid company. and it creates jobs. and that's all i'm going to say on it. >> just sort of mixed up those tickets. should have been on a buy on hlf and a sell on, what is it, vrx or whatever? >> should have been a sell on valeant at 300. >> you're not beginning to get me into ackman. we've made up. we talk to each other. so i'm not going to say anything bad about him, except i disagree with him, and it doesn't mean i'm saying anything bad. i just disagree with him totally on herbalife. but i'm not going to say another word about anything else. >> here's a stock you're not going to want to talk about, and they're going to kill me because

they want to go to break. hertz. >> i can't talk about it much. we're on the board there. but you do know that i bought stock very recently. >> that's why i'm asking the question. >> okay. so you know that. that speaks a lot. i can't say any more, because we're on the board. >> i have loved having you on, i've got to say. i know you had to get up early, but i think this is the venue for you, out of all of the cnbc venues. that's just my opinion. >> i would agree. >> becky, right? >> carl, thank you for joining us. >> i like talking to you guys. >> awesome. >> thank you. >> come on whenever you want. coming up, this morning's biggest movers. stay tuned you're watching "squawk box" on cnbc.

coming up, dr. ken davis of mount sinai wraps up a big morning. stick around. more after this. actions speak louder.

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welcome back, everybody. our guest host dr. ken davis. thank you for all the guests that you've brought on with you today. what do you think about what carl had to say today? >> carl is a very special guy. his commitment to philanthropy is really quite substantial. he's helped a lot of underprivileged kids -- we call it icahn scholars. they've gone on to harvard, yale, princeton, and it's all because of carl.

>> we want to thank you for your time. i feel like we only touched on a top of all the subjects we want to get to today, but we always appreciate seeing you here and thank you for your time. that does it for us today, everybody. we've been watching the futures. they have been under pressure. check it out with "squawk on the street" next. good thursday morning. i'm carl quintanilla with david faber and mike santoli. cramer is off today. the anxiety about global growth and now bond yields starting to weigh on the pre-market, that. kos after the highest close for the s&p. the u.s. tenure testing its lows for the year of about 166 and claims were muted once again. you might have heard a few moments ago carl icahn on squawk not impressed by the recent market run-up.