box" begins right now. ♪ feels like the first time ♪ feels like the very first time ♪ >> announcer: live from new york where business never sleeps this is "squawk box". good morning, everybody, welcome to "squawk box" here on cnbc. i'm becky quick along with joe kernen and andrew ross sorkin and as joe mentioned the u.s. equity futures at this point look like they are in positive territory. dow futures up by 34 points. s&p futures up by five. nasdaq up by 12. you have to remember this came after a second day in a row of losses for the markets. the do you was down yesterday with s&p down by 19 points. if you want to take what happened overnight in asia you'll see that the markets there ended in positive territory. nikkei was up by .8%. some pose gains for the shanghai

composite. in europe some negative numbers. dax is one of the losers for the major markets. down by .9 of a percent. italy and spain seeing some losses. as joe mentioned if you look at crude oil you'll see that crude oil yesterday actually managed to have a positive session. up to 3.26%. that was the november number. so it was november trading yesterday. it went up yesterday by over 3%. this morning giving back 1%. >> what's the correlation? >> market was down. the financial sector was down. >> 300 points. >> real estate was up. >> 300 points in two days. including friday. >> monday and friday. two sessions in a row. >> not two straight days. >> long weekend in between. not long enough. >> it's never long enough. especially with what we got going on.

>> it's our top story of the morning, the first debate between hillary clinton and donald trump and it got off to a contentious start. >> we have no leadership. and honestly that starts with secretary clinton. >> all right you have two minutes on the same question to defend tax increases on the wealthiest americans secretary clinton. >> i have a feeling by the end of this evening i'll be blamed for everything that's ever happened. >> why not? >> yeah, why not. >> john harwood is our man. he was there live. good morning to you, sir. thanks for saying up late and waking up early. >> not a problem. this was a big moment in the campaign. the bite you just played was representative of the strategies that went to the core characteristics of the candidates. zant outsider not in public life some went after hillary clinton for failures of public policy on the economy, on foreign policy. hillary clinton tried to present a calm temperament, tout her experience, her plans for making

things better but she also tried cast out about donald trump's ability to serve as president by going after his preparation but also his character, including on why he had not released his own tax returns. take a listen. >> maybe he doesn't want the american people, all of you watching tonight to know that he's paid nothing in federal taxes because the only years that anybody has ever seen were a couple of years when he had to turn them offer state authorities when he was trying to get a casino license and they showed he didn't pay any federal income tax. >> that makes me smart. >> so true to form donald trump came back and said look at the economic condition of the country, why haven't you made it better? here's donald trump. >> we're a debtor nation, we're a serious debtor nation and we have a country that needs new roads, new tunnels, new bridges, new airports, new schools and we don't that have money because it's been squandered on so many

of your ideas. >> and maybe because you haven't paid any federal income tax for a lot of years. and the other thing i think is important -- >> it would be squandered too, believe me. >> now, what effect does that have on the presidential race? both candidates showed their core personas. donald trump was the same donald trump that we've seen in the past and if you believe he was on a path to victory before last night, nothing that happened last night is like try to disturb that. on the other hand, if you believe as i do that donald trump needs to expand his support, needs to persuade some of the 60% of american people who say he doesn't have the temperament and experience to be president, i don't think he succeeded in that goal and that's one of the reasons why the clinton campaign was so pleased with the debate last night. the trump campaign was complaining about topics that didn't come up, benghazi, not more focus on e-mail, other issues that were potentially detrimental to hillary clinton

and of course we've seen a reaction in the betting markets and financial markets indicate that they thought hillary clinton won the debate. >> what about the foreign exchange markets. some dollar versus some. >> yes but also on the odds market the betting markets. >> they clearly showed hillary clinton winning. however fascinatingly, because i was going to am different websites, snap polls you see it depends what site you go to. if you go to drudge or frankly go to cnbc.com you would see that trump would have won the campaign. >> cnbc, people ticking in their responses. it wasn't a survey. no science to it. >> completely agree. >> the betting markets. >> yes. but authors a little bit different. it's not self-selected. it's the distillation of sentiment about the debate whereas if you are talking about

a site and they say write in if you think somebody won that's not quite the same. >> it goes to the enthusiasm issue. trump supporters are typically very enthusiastic. they go to these sites. >> that's what it takes on election day. >> there wasn't a single any of these polls, none of them -- cnbc was 62-38. betting polls there's the notion of the wisdom of crowds, but brexit of 80% on betting polls the night before. i think betting polls -- i don't know. we'll see how it works. >> john stay with us. for more on last night's be debate let's bring in betsy mccoy and jerry bernstein. be folks welcome to both of you. betsy, what was your take on what happened last night? >> this was a big battle between

the builder and the blabber. and as everyone expected hillary clinton has made her living giving speeches often for big fees and she came in with a hundred carefully prepared scripted peop eed people -- mem answers. trump tagged hick with this failing economy and state of the nation. secondly he just tagged her as a blabber rather than somebody who gets the job done. especially in the area of trade. he really labelled her as part of the trade deficit, the cause of it. and came in hard on the nafta agreement which has devastated ohio, pennsylvania, upstate new york which i know very, very well. and so i think he scored some big points. >> jared, you have to say these

two candidates painted very different views of the economy, because the way the clinton portrayed things is that this is a nation that's created jobs and it's improving. how do you match up those two >> this is a nation that has created jobs. about 14 or 15 million since employment started growing in 2010. look, i think the assessment you just heard is this alternate reality that hillary clinton was talking about last night. the american economy definitely has a long way to go but whether we're talk about financial markets, now whether we're talk about meeting household income, poverty or wages we're moving in the right direction and the idea that you want to shift to, i think, what we heard last night from donald trump was a lot of incoherent word salad on the economy. let's talk about one area -- >> finish your thought. >> let me finish my thought. write think there's a distinct difference here and it was interesting in the clip you played, donald trump would

increase the debt by about $5 trillion often years. to me it's hard to hear him complaining about the debt on one hand and prove eproffering that increase that. >> is there a possibility that there's two americas. people who have been left behind by these trade agreements that feel they aren't participating which explains why we had this type of election season. >> i think that's accurate. the only caveat i would add there is that if you look at say how low-income families are doing or communities that have been hurt by trade they are finally climbing out of a hole but that doesn't put them ahead that puts them back to where they were. i do think this two america theme of pervasive inequality is an important one. >> jared the whole narrative

that the pro private sector supply side trickle down lessons don't work is a false narrative. go back to jfk, the notion that that's what caused the financial crisis, that lower taxes -- there's a lot of things that went in -- trickle down caused the reagan revolution or at least supply side and jfk larry will be on later in the show to talk about how similar jfk was in terms of freeing up the private sector. >> look, i think you -- >> i want to get this out. hillary clinton tried to portray the economy last night as doing well but in fact it's limping along at 1%, 1.2% and her projection only promise 2% economic growth. we can do much better than that. donald trump's plan proposes

3.5% to 4% economic growth largely by slashing the corporate tax rate and you're quite right. just as jfk did, he slashed taxes when he came in '62 and the fact is he sparked, he and his successors sparked a 5% annual growth rate in the '60s. reagan came in and did the same thing in the '80s. slashed the corporate tax rate, slashed income tax rates and created 4.5% economic growth. both of those presidents were greeted by a lot of nay sayers who said you'll increase the deficit. in fact, reagan coined the term transition deficit. but he taught americans that you tax something less you get more revenue as a result. in '91 the deficit was coming down and that will happen again. >> this is a very -- this is

this trickle down business and, you know, look -- >> that's the term. >> hold on. >> you had a chance to make your point. please let me do the same. this is an experiment that we've tried time and again and has consistently failed. donald trump said last night if we cut the taxes on the wealthy the wealthy will create more jobs. in the 2000s we significantly cut taxes on the top and more importantly when it comes to the financial crisis and the recession we deregulated financial markets and that by the way -- i agree with your point, joe, i think tax cuts failed to create jobs and growth and wages. that's in the data. but when you talk about deregulating markets that's where you unleash the kind of volatility and under pricing of risk that caused the great recession and that's very much part of donald trump's plan. so i think that this notion that we're still debating whether cutting taxes on rich people does anything other than

increase inequality, increase their after tax income and blow-out the deficit that argument should be completely over. on the growth business there's no way trump gets us from 2% to 4% gdp. i read their report yesterday and one of the claims that they make is donald trump will make the trade deficit disappear immediately. they claim a trillion dollars of extra gdp growth on that. there's no economist who would get behind that no economist with any credibility who would agree that's plausible. >> andrew? >> i'm speechless. >> i would like to weigh in on this. last night hillary clinton kept saying tax cuts for the rich. if you look at donald trump's tax cut plan the big beneficiaries are lower earners and middle class earners. >> that's not true. >> it's not true. >> excuse me let me finish. the deductions for the wealthy are capped at $100,000.

so the wealthy are not going to benefit from these income tax cuts. let me explain that a middle class couple -- >> hold on. explain that. >> greatest percentage benefit is at the top. >> that's who pays the taxes. >> that's right. >> trump himself -- >> they will pay no federal income tax under donald trump's plan. a single man earning $60,000 will save $2700 under donald trump's plan. the fact is -- >> bill gates gets the biggest tax cut. >> of course he's paying the taxes. >> how is that consistent with what you just said? how is that consistent with what you just said? >> so that's true but also there's a study that came out yesterday -- hold on a second the tax foundation affirmed -- remember the tax foundation is the conservative organization that donald trump was looking to

for scoring and validation. he raises taxes on some middle class families especially those with children, especially single parents. >> not if you include the child care tax credit. >> including that. >> look at the tables. you're wrong. >> talk to tax foundation. >> this is the politics of envy versus the politics of growth. that's hillary clinton's approach. she's trying to divide the nation into the haves and have notes. blacks and the whites. >> you started out saying -- >> listen to her rhetoric. >> now you're saying you shouldn't point out they are benefiting because that's the politics. >> if you listen to last night's debate you would have come away thinking only rich people are getting tax cuts when in fact if you look tables people earning $50,000, $70,000, $100,000 --

>> that's a fair point. >> they will have more money in their wallet snoops that's a fair point. it is true that donald trump cuts taxes throughout the income distribution but cuts them far more at the top -- wait i'm trying to help you here. he cuts taxes far more at the top and as i think it was john who said there are about 8 million families middle and low-income families whose taxes will go up. the reason for that is that he gets rid of the personal exemption and that will end up hurting a bunch of those families, about 8 million families including many single heads. it's kind of a tax plan that does two things. it very much worsens the after tax distribution and frankly we have enough inequality. it doubles down on this trickle down nonsense if you cut wealthy people's tax, it crates job. doesn't happen. most importantly it aedes $5 trillion to the debt. people may not care. >> this is what the tax

foundation says. on a dynamic basis the plan would increase after tax incomes by 20% on average. all would see increase after tax of 10.6% over the long term. taxpayers that fall in the bottom see their after tax increase between 10.6 and 11.5%. middle income taxpayers in 30 to 70 percentile would see increases by as much as 19.7%. top 1% of all taxpayers would see an increase of 27%. so it does give the biggest percentages to the top but everybody across the board are taking home more. >> cost $5 trillion. i haven't figured out how you're explaining that. >> the increase in tax revenue. >> i would be wary of that -- >> a lot of conservatives have been arguing for a different approach. the tax rates were 90% and 70% at that time. different thing from cutting

them when they are 39.6. >> do you want to support a candidate who predicts 2% growth into the indefinite future? we can achieve much more abundance than that and fact is -- >> you're not going to get faster grow simply by saying we can have it. you got to have a plan. >> they are playing us out. betsy thanks for coming in. jared thanks for joining us. >> jared, that's a great tie. fantastic tie. >> john, thank you. coming up market reaction to last night's be debate. mark gran joins us with his take. stocks rebounding a little. ok team,

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welcome back to "squawk box". we've been watching the aftermath of the debate and following what's been happening in the financial markets as a result. take a look at the dollar versus the peso. right now the dollar is down by 1.3%. people reading into that maybe that means clinton won the debate because the dollar is weaker, mexican peso picked up ground. at this point the dollar is only down by 1.3%. we'll continue to monitor this. in the last few days peso hit all time lows against the u.s. dollar as trump appeared to be gaining momentum. you know how his visit to mexico went for mexico. >> okay. i got it. just looks like a pretty good uptrend. not sure what that indicates. >> that indicated trump was picking up in the polls. >> okay. so it's down. 1.3%. all right. wow, look at that move in just the last month.

okay. futures higher this morning. little bit following last night's debate. joining us now mark grant managing director at hilltop securities. i'm researching peso. let me see how it's been characterized, mark. it says market scores -- stocks and mexican peso bounce as markets score one for clinton. do you think 30 points on the futures that they are down 300 and you saw the peso is that up what we should take from that, the markets awarded last night's mantle to hillary clinton? >> no i don't think we can take that at all. stuff going on having to do with a variety of factors and i'm certainly not willing to say that somebody won or loss the debate depending upon the dollar versus the mexican peso. i think it's fluff.

>> i mean it's pretty sustained uptrend in the dallas versus the peso. what else did you take -- you probably six months ago just looking -- i don't think you care -- i don't think you're politically biassed one way or another. i don't know. i've never talked about it. i don't think that was your reason but you thought that there was some indications that trump was doing better than people were giving him credit for which has been the case all along probably just objectively. >> well i think that there's justification that a lot of the media spinning things one way or another and i under that. i think that trump and clinton -- forget the politics of being a democrat or a republican for a moment. you got the ultimate insider in clinton. and you have the ultimate outsider in trump. and i think that my take and i'm not political, by the way, let

me respond to that. i've given no money to anybody. i'm an independent. and so that's where i stand. but i will say this that trump represents, as i said, the ultimate outsider and i think a lot of people in america are very unhappy with the way the country is being run and the direction of the country, and i think trump is likely to win. i'm not saying i'm in favor necessarily of that result, but i will say one thing about this. the one place where it's substantial and it's meaningful is in energy as we distinguish between the two candidates. hillary clinton is against the coal industry and fracking industry, trump is in favor of them and i think that's a very substantial point and my feeling, personally is i want america to be energy independent and not relying upon saudi arabia, iran and iraq and these countries that are fostering

terrorism in our country. >> the only think i would say on that, i guess as devil's advocate there couldn't have been any administration more anti-hydrocarbons than the obama administration and now when he takes his victory lap the president talks about you can thank me for $2 a gallon gasoline. the markets are even bigger than a guy with executive orders coming out every week. even bamako not hold back the energy renaissance. so i don't know whether she could either. >> she certainly wants to try and that's of some concern to me. you know, i was very underwhelmed, joe, by the debate last night. i don't think either candidate did particularly well. they certainly didn't stay on the issues, the economic issues that i would have liked to have seen them discuss. >> we didn't talk a lot about a lot. the birther thing and what else,

tax returns and things. i've seen some articles written that he actually said he was proud of not paying taxes. i wonder just how many people that were reading that just don't use their deductions. i'm not going to take that, i don't think. i'm just going to -- i told my accountant don't give me any of my deductions i want to pay more. obviously if it's avoidance it's one thing. if it's evasion it's one thing. if you take all the deductions you're entitled to it's a different thing. anyway, mark, do you expect markets across the board to be held hostage between now and november the boe, boj, fed all that malarky as joe biden would say? >> i think that all feeds into

the markets. i continue to think we hit that 1.69 on the ten year. town around 1.59, 1.6. looks like we'll go back into lower yields again. i think the market is moving a lot off of the fed not doing anything which i think they made the right decision. and then the question with who is going to become president i still think it's very unclear moving towards the november election, i think, you know, just my guess that there are enough people in the united states at this moment that are secure in new york that are sitting in the bleachers at yankee stadium and are going to go throw the bums out. i think that's what's going to take place. >> one thing that donald trump double downed on was his criticism of the fed and janet yellen. he said he thinks she's very political. if he wins the election he'll

name a new fed chef. he made that clear. what kind of impact does that have on financial markets that uncertainty and who knows what happens in terms of rising rates. you said you agreed with the fed decision not the raise rates. >> die. i agreed with her decision. my view of the fed is that we have way too many academics that are living some other place with the fed board. i think having all these people say one thing and another thing, you know, the fed says it's transparency. i'm sorry i don't buy that argument. i think it provides a lot of confusion for a lot of people and institutions in the united states. you don't know what they are saying or doing. i also think that the fed, even the way it's constructed which is different than most central banks in the world is still the central bank of the united states and to think it's not influenced by politics is just silliness. >> mark grant -- thank you.

we'll see you around. see you next time. >> thank you, joe. coming up, more of the best moments from last night's debate a recap of the one liners and colts on the economy. we'll talk about it. plus the latest casualty among hedge funds. one notable fund shutting down after 28 years in business. take a look at yesterday's s&p 500 winners and losers.

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welcome back to "squawk box" this morning. our top story today reaction from last night's debate. in case you missed it here are the candidates sparring over trump's tax plan. >> under my plan, i'll be reducing taxes tremendously from 35% to 15% for companies. small and big businesses. that's going to be a job creator like we haven't seen since ronald reagan. it's going to be a beautiful thing to watch. companies will come. they will build. they will expand. new companies will start. and i look very much forward to doing it. we have to renegotiate our trade deals and have to stop these countries from stealing our companies and our jobs. >> the kind of plan that donald has put forth would be trickle down economics all over again.

in fact, it would be the most extreme version, the biggest tax cuts for the top percent of the people in this country that we've ever had. i call it trumped up trickle down because that's exactly what it would be. that's not how we grow the economy. >> we will talk to the trump campaign manager kellyanne conway coming up in the next hour. in the meantime let's get a check on the markets. futures ral chipped by over 100 points after the debate but they have pulled back. we're still looking at green arrows. dow up by 32 points. s&p futures up by 4.5. nasdaq up by 11. this is coming after two days of delines. yesterday the dow was down by 160. in europe there are some red arrows. may account why we've seen a pull back in our futures. the dax is down .9 of a%. crude oil prices, crude oil

rallied yesterday. pulling back by 1.5%. wti down 69 cents to 45.25. >> hedge fund perry capital shutting down its flagship fund after 28 years of business. it's the talk of the town. >> it came as a surprise. they had some performance set backs. the idea that they are flat out winding down was news to me and i think it surprised a lot of people in the industry. essentially what happened yesterday richard perry released a letter saying although i continue to believe very strongly in our investment process and team the industry and market headwinds against us have been strong and the timing for success in our portions too unpredictable. referring no doubt to some performance issues. they were down 12% last year. year-to-date down 2.5%. their assets under management have been absolutely slashed. they were about 15 billion, less

than ten years ago. now they are about 4 billion. they laid out a timetable for unwinding position they do have. but they have a couple of time tables depending on sort of time horizon of how difficult it will to be get out lasting up to 12 months. they have a six person head count to keep on their core team but it's unclear when and if other layoffs will happen. there's no plans to start a family office. which is what some people were speculating. go the way of a george soros. >> this is effectively over. >> they say it will take up to 12 months to unwind. >> any ancillary funds? >> this is the main one. they may have national vehicle or multiple funds all employing

the same strategy in this case event driven. it might be worth take a look at their top holding, allied financial, air cap holdings, aig, ball corporation, st. jude, johnson & johnson. >> what's the danger for a fund like this when people know what they own that other funds affecting play against them on the way out. >> this is a bill ackman effect. in a lot of cases the market is going against him like if he has an issue in one name then there's a sell off in his other long positions. >> up recognize the weakness and this is the way -- survival of the fitness. >> in ackman's case it's hard to think people aren't trying to tweak him. he's not on the verge of shutting down. you often see a sell off in what's regarded as the big names in a basket of stocks. >> we talked about the consolidation or end of the hedge fund industry and what's happening. this is one of the biggest name

thus far to shut down. are you hearing more funds like this are thinking about this? >> nothing i want to say on air. yeah, absolutely rumors. rumors of people making that family office move. if you have a founder, cio type that's on the younger side, 50, 60, until feeling energetic, wanting to manage money yet frustrated with the new transparency required as part of dodd-frank and filing forms with sec, investor feedback, possibility ref demonstrations you've seen people do a few things. cut fees. there was news on that yesterday. they are taking their management fee to zero for certain clients if the board approves it. i assume they will. you're seeing changes in strategy. mark lisery adopted model that once was a hedge fund business to keep the money in house for a longer period of time.

but, you know, number of things people are doing to try to give themselves a little more runway during this difficult performance period. >> thanks so much. great to see you. >> when we come back yahoo! under scrutiny following confirmation of a cyber attack that compromised half a billion user accounts and provided new problems. we'll take a closer look next. and as we head to a break quick check of what's happening in the european markets. some red arrows. dax is down by .8%. stick around. box will be right back. ♪ it's been over 100 years since the first stock index was created, as a benchmark for average. ♪ yet a lot of people still build portfolios with strategies that just track the benchmarks. ♪ but investing isn't about achieving average. it's about achieving goals.

♪ and invesco believes doing that today requires the art and expertise of high-conviction investing. ♪ translation? why invest in average?

welcome back. u.s. futures at this hour indicated up 40 points. s&p looking to gain back just under six points. nasdaq indicated up 13. david faber is reporting that twitter is moving closer to a information or to a formal sales process with disney and microsoft added to the list of possible suitors. the struggling social media site said the entertaining buy out bids due to sluggish growth. doesn't mean they are in formal

talks bath possible sale reportedly expected to accelerate within the next 30 to 45 days. among the possible suitors, just mentioned a couple. you can add salesforce.com. and we mentioned as i said microsoft and disney. recent move by twitter into life streaming events have attracted the attention of disney ceo robert iger. the stock is surging. it's up more than 26%. >> there was another downgrade yesterday. somebody said they didn't think they would gate bid for about $17. that it was trading at? >> i saw that. >> forget who downgraded them. somebody yesterday downgraded them saying don't buy into the hype. >> $16 million? >> that's the question. >> at one point it was -- >> even more. it was 14 billion not long ago because it was the same as temp u tax assessment. >> that's right. give them that instead.

what's the all time high? >> all time high was $69. >> almost 70. another tech story we've been following closely yahoo! investigating a data breach that compromised half a billion accounts. investors now weighing what that news could mean for the company's kicks by verizon. joining us to talk about it more is ed lee. i should point out i got a call from the crisis management pr firm that yahoo! hired asking for a correction in something i spoke with, tim armstrong about yesterday. those questions with tim armstrong i brought up how come yahoo! knew about this since july but didn't tell verizon until late september. his point was it was a different incident and that incident led to a second investigation and didn't find out about this half a billion compromised accounts until august. now i asked some questions when

in august did you find out. wouldn't tell me earlier. later i asked if there was a material adverse change. didn't answer those questions. he did say marissa and the board found out in august and i just asked more about that. he said he wasn't a party of that. there's been two breaches. first one they found out in july led to the board and marissa finding out about this other situation in august didn't tell verizon until last week. >> the nature of what they knew that's tissue they are bringing up and ceo marissa mayer was alerted there was an investigation. not sure the extent or the depth of what that was. i think that's what they were taking issue with. july same month that they basically agreed with verizon you'll buy us. that's a significant time period. and, yes, we have been told the same thing that it wasn't until august that they found out. oh, it's a big deal now.

>> verizon found out last week. i read reports verizon is the upset. tim armstrong said cooler heads are trying to prevail. >> our reporting we heard the same, verizon is upset about this. at the same time they really want -- they want it still. it's not even so much the yahoo! brand. there's an argument to be made yahoo! brand is tarnished by this. you can argue a breach. but they really want the ad tech. in their minds that's what they are buying and that's going to help their mobile efforts, try to differentiate their product from the other mobile services. mobile services are seen more of a commodity and there's this price competition, price war between the different service providers. that's verizon's m. o. anything we can do to differentiate our product whether having content on mobile phones and yahoo!'s ad tech helps us better sell that. >> what do you think the chances

are they renegotiate this deal for a different price. lower price. >> you always ask the tough question. i don't have any reporting on that. i think at the end of the day verizon still has deep pockets. it's not like they felt like oh, we were somehow overpaying for this in the first place. again they are buying the ad tech. in their mind that's the most important asset. >> even with all the bidders that were around the table not clear they would come back or come back at the same price. >> the presumption is yahoo! made a good faith effort. we told you everything we knew. we didn't know until august what this really was. maybe i could have called you a week or two earlier. yes. there is absolutely room for verizon to come back and say look let's rework this because i didn't know all this before i ponied up whatever it was. >> there's two issues, one is how yahoo! has dealt with

verizon and verizon probably still wants this deal to go through. the second is the way they are working with consumers on this. look, i think security breaches are just a fact of life. i think companies will be dealing with these things. what concerns me in this case is it's two years later before we find out. only thing that yahoo! is telling people to do is change their password which is way too little way too late. >> it underscores how the company managed for years and that's been -- we looked into our reporting shown us her management hasn't been the best and the -- >> in terms of customer service. >> communicating to customers, communicating within the company what we're doing, what we're about. what we're trying to get done. this is part and parcel of that. and, yes, maybe there's a bigger argument verizon can make management hasn't been great in terms of figuring out the

product. >> obviously they had a lot on their plate. i grant that. but when you go in and try to figure out what you can do about any of these situations, can you freeze your credit report that will cost you $5 to $20. they are not paying for any of says change the passwords and if you try to change your birth date, it won't allow you to. >> right. my one sort of consumer tip here is hacking is a point of life. two point authentication should be the norm. and if a service doesn't offer it, don't use that service. >> and change your password frequently. >> and i think that's -- you know, you can't wait for as a consumer you can't wait for the company to take care of that. you have to be the one to do that. we mentioned verizon. i think talk about twitter, potential twitter buyers. i think verizon is on that list as well. because twitter, it's not a consumer play if verizon goes after it. they have ad tech as well. they have this mobile ad company

called mo pub which does a lot of ad tech stuff for mobile services. that's an aspect they might be interested in. >> ed, thank you. coming up, stocks to watch ahead of the opening bell. and in the next hour, trump campaign manager kellyanne conway will join us on set. i'md things about the network. all the networks are great now. we're talking within a 1% difference in reliability of each other. and, sprint saves you 50% on most current national carrier rates. save money on your phone bill, invest it in your small business. wouldn't you love more customers? i would definitely love some new customers. sprint will help you add customers and cut your costs. switch your business to sprint and save 50% on most current verizon, at&t and t-mobile rates. don't let a 1% difference cost you twice as much. whoooo! for people with hearing loss, visit sprintrelay.com.

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kite pharma says more than 2/3 of patients tested with its experimental lymphoma treatment responded to it. half are now in remission. lenovo cutting more than 100,000 jobs from the motorola smartphone business. rice energy is buying rival vantage energy for $2.7 billion. the move comes two weeks after vantage filed for an ipo. before we go, i got a point of privilege. there are two little men watching tv. it's their birthday. henry and max sorkin, happy birthday. i'm sorry i didn't get to see you today. >> happy birthday. >> the big 6. when we return, mgm resorts ceo jim murren joins us. and then kellyanne conway gives

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global markets reacting to last night's presidential debate. >> i've been all over the place. you decided to stay home. and that's okay. >> and you know what else i've prepared for? i've prepared to be president. and i think that's a good thing. >> full analysis of the issues at hand and what it means for your money. straight ahead. our news maker this hour, mgm resorts ceo jim murren. he says he is crossing the aisle once again this time around and he's here to explain why. plus donald trump's campaign manager kellyanne conway joins us to talk about the gop

nominee's performance and how both candidates faired. "squawk box" begins right now. live from the beating heart of business, new york city, this is "squawk box." >> welcome back to "squawk box" right here on cnbc. i'm andrew ross sorkin with becky quick and joe kernen. look at the markets after the big debate. i'm not going to say they were impacted by the debate but we'll see. looking to open about 16 points higher on the nasdaq. also the mexican peso rallied during last night's debate. we're actually showing you the energy boards right now. crude at $45.27. and the peso 19.47. in the last few days of the mexican peso had hit all time lows against the dollar. we'll have plenty on last night's presidential debate in a moment. but first a quick look at this

morning's headlines. volkswagen shares are under pressure this morning. u.s. government and the automaker are in talks about a settlement regarding the diesel emissions scandal. and there are reports that officials are pushing for an extremely large fine. we'll get a fresh look at data on home prices a little later this morning. the s&p report for july is expected to show a 5.1% a year increase. and a legal victory for american express. a federal appeals court appealed an earlier ruling that barred merchants from steering towards competitor's cards with lower merchant fees. >> bravo. that was good. justice was served. we talked about this. >> i thought you were talking about how well she did that. >> she did a wonderful job reading the news. that's true too. but we talked about this antitrust decision a year and a half ago about how unjust it was. >> year and a half ago?

>> yeah. >> don't remember last week. >> selective memory. >> the good guys just won. >> back this up. american express won because they had said you get lower merchant fee ifs you stay with us. >> and they were, quote, steering. and the original court said that was not allowed. >> and there's all kinds of things the corporations do. >> and of course -- you know, if you take the card and you're a merchant, that's part of the deal. yeah. you get a better deal. crazy. it's crazy. >> the debate was when? it was last night. i knew that. i remember that. this morning global markets are moving in part, it says here, because of the comments from both candidates. in last night's presidential debate. the most hotly anticipated political event of the year so far lasted 90 minutes. it went at trade, taxes, terror, race, and foreign policy. >> typical politician.

all talk, no action. >> trumped up trickle down. trickle down did not work. >> nothing will ever top nafta. you called it the gold standard. you called it the gold standard of trade deals. >> and donald was one of the people who rooted for the housing crisis. >> we have no leadership and honestly that starts with secretary clinton. >> he's paid nothing in federal taxes. he was trying to get a casino license and they showed he didn't pay any federal income taxes. so -- >> that makes me smart. >> i have much better judgment than she does. there's no question about that. >> his cavalier attitude about nuclear weapons is so deeply troubling. >> i want to get on to defeating isis. >> well at least i have a plan to fight isis. >> no, no. you've been doing this for 30 years. why are you just thinking about these solutions right now? for 30 years you've been doing it. i will bring back jobs. you can't bring back jobs. >> i kind of assumed there would be a lot of these charges and claims. and so -- >> facts.

>> for more let's bring in our guest host this morning mgm resorts chairman and ceo jim murren and governor asa hutchinson from arkansas and a trump supporter. governor hutchinson, thanks for joining us. i'll start with you. what'd you see last night in your own words? how do you think it went and how's the coverage today? right down the middle? >> well, i thought the debate was not any surprise in the sense that it was entertaining. both candidates got their message out. certainly hillary looked well in style. she was probably more aggressive. i think lester holt helped a little bit in putting donald trump on the defensive on some of the questions. but the expectation was that donald trump couldn't hold his own against hillary during a 90-minute debate. i think he showed a command of

the facts. whenever he was asked about a nuclear first strike policy, i thought he did well on that. i thought he showed a command of the facts on the crime issue and showed strength in his presentation. and so neither candidate lost the debate. i think both teams had their -- energized their supporters and i don't think you'll see a large difference in the polls as you go into the remainder of the election. >> i saw a lot of that, jim murren, that 95% of the people that had already decided probably weren't swayed by what they saw last night. >> i don't know about that, but i saw a different debate. i saw a debate with one candidate that was well prepared, that was specific. and i saw -- i thought it started out well for the other candidate. >> you can say his name. it's okay. >> okay.

so -- >> it's not like voldemort. maybe to you it is. >> that's a good analogy. >> okay. you actually wrote an op-ed about backing hillary clinton. >> i did. >> and you call yourself a life long republican. in past times that you've been on, i've kneaded you a bit about being a big supporter of harry reid. people think that's incongruous. being a supporter of harry reid and a lifetime republican. how does that work? >> well, i've been in nevada now for 18 years. >> right. >> and i view myself as a nevadan as well as a republican. senator reid has brought a lot of jobs and infrastructure to the state of nevada. nevada is a small state. a lot of people don't care about it. >> it helps your business, obviously. you've led some -- i guess you speak at -- i don't know. at fund raisers. but you've headlined some of his energy conferences and things like that for him. >> certainly promoting clean energy is something i care

deeply about. >> as a republican. >> as a american, as a citizen of the world where we are leaving this world in a worse place. and i'm not a climate change denier. i know the climate is warming. and i know that -- >> how? >> how do i know? it's science. >> i didn't say how. i said wow. that's great to know that. and you in the past said it would be rare for you to cross the aisle. >> i've only done it once. yes. >> for president obama in '08. >> democrat may be a better -- instead of sticking with the republican -- in the current election, jim, some people might reduce it. reductionism it down to higher taxes, more entitlements, more government spending, more regulation versus lower corporate tax rates, lower regulations. they would look -- and that

normally would be seen as sort after a republican versus a democrat thinking. how do you square that? >> so as a republican that worked here on wall street for 14 years, i know one thing more than anything else. the markets hate unpredictability. and even donald trump's best fans would say he's unpredictable. he said it again last night. doesn't even know what the bank of japan has done. he said that rates -- as soon as rates start coming up, it's going to happen. the markets like predictability. secretary clinton is a predictable, stable, thoughtful person. trump is unpredictable. so if you want to create jobs like i am right now, i'm creating jobs because i have access to low cost capital. access to low cost capital is the way american companies

create jobs. they're creating jobs now. and so there's not a disconnect by being a republican and a job creator if you want stable accessible capital markets. >> we could never let rates go above zero ever again and then you could create jobs forever. >> i think they will. >> let's get governor hutchinson in. do you have a response to any of this, governor? >> oh, absolutely. i think what the markets want but more importantly what the public wants is consistency and policy among the candidates. donald trump has been consistent in job creation. that's his priority. he nailed that last night talking about how it's important to keep manufacturing here in the united states. i don't agree on everything that he says, but he's been consistent in his message about bringing manufacturing back to the united states, bringing the cash back to the united states. he's been consistent in his economic policy. he's been consistent on his

immigration policy. he's been consistent on going after isis. and last night if the public watched the debate which they did, then they would have seen donald trump sticking with the same message, being consistent on it. and also demonstrate a command of the issues. whenever you looked at the issue of law and order or the crime problem that we face in this day and of course the question was asked in terms of racial divide. donald trump answered it and talked about the rising crime rate. if you look at "the wall street journal" today, the headline is the murder rate has gone up. and so he was right on the facts and he identified with america. >> the consistency in the stability of sub-2% growth and with the consistency and stability of 60% of the country feeling like we're headed in the wrong direction, i mean consistency and stability is one thing. but the reason that trump has any traction at all, jim, is because he's an outsider and people want a change. >> hey, look. i get that. >> do you? >> i get that people would like

change. but here's what i also know. i was just in detroit last week. he talks about detroit. we employ 3,000 people in detroit. detroit is coming back. it has been coming back. and the people in detroit don't feel the way he said they feel. i'm building a big property in springfield, mass. we're going to employ 3,000 people there. >> how much of your business is macau related? >> only about 12%. >> but it's important. >> it's 12%. most of our money in the u.s. >> and mainland china you have a project there. china bashing would be bad for mgm. >> china bashing, mexico bashing, canada basher, europe bashing, uae bashing, it's all bad. it's all bad for the country. you know, trade, cyber security, working together. here's the difference. okay? if i could say this. i'm a business guy too.

i believe that deals could be created where both sides win. common ground. you could create a deal. donald trump does not believe that. the only way he can be a winner is if somebody loses. you don't get deal after deal after deal as a company or as a country if you try to screw the other side. and, you know, i just -- that's the way i feel about the philosophy of business. -- founded my company. an immigrant american by the way. and he created a tremendous franchise. so the idea one can win, one can lose is wrong. >> but governor, i mean, it doesn't have to be us -- i guess trump would say that we've lost a few too many times in some of these deals where there's been a clear oner on the other side and maybe you negotiate better deals. it's not hard to see that that's his point. >> that's his point that we haven't been tough enough. you can negotiate a fair deal, but if you're not tough in that negotiation in the world market

dealing with other nations that are not our friends, then you're going to come out on the short end of the stick. i think that's donald trump's point. and you're right that while he could be consistent in his message, it's a consistent message of change. he's the change agent in this election. and hillary clinton represents the same as what we've had over the last eight years which is anemic recovery. and presiding over a foreign policy that has taken us the wrong direction. it's a change election. and while you look at detroit, other parts of our country and they say we can do better as a country both in terms of our national strength, in terms of our negotiating with other countries. and also in eterms of our county here at home. >> and nafta, he -- you know, we got to talk about nafta. that's supposed to be the worst deal ever. you know, nafta's not a perfect deal.

but they're are two most important trading deals here. to rip it up instead of enhancing -- >> nafta you mean mexico and canada. >> mexico and canada. these are our two most important trading partners. and i believe -- now, i disagree with secretary clinton on tpp as an example. i think we should move forward with tpp. but the idea of creating good trade relationships around the world not only for commerce but for cyber security, why is it that companies like mine and every company is left on our own to protect ourselves on cyber? why aren't countries working together to try to help companies like ours fight cyber attacks? that would happen in trade deals. it's not happening right now. >> okay. all right. great. governor hutchinson, thank you very being with us today. jim murren will be with us until 9:00. meantime, check out the futures which have been higher

this morning but have pulled back on the gains we saw earlier. now the dow futures up by 44 points above fair value. this is coming after a couple of days of declines for the market with the dow down once again over 160 points yesterday. added up for more than 300 point losses between friday and monday. s&p futures up by 5.5. we'll have much more on last night's debate and the markets when "squawk box" continues. the first presidential debate is in the books. >> she's been doing this for 30 years and why hasn't she made the agreements better? >> i am determined that we're going to get the economy really moving again. >> so who's better for the markets? we talk politics and profits right after the break. what guysi switched to sprint. sprint? i'm hearing good things about the network. all the networks are great now. we're talking within a 1% difference in reliability of each other. and, sprint saves you 50% on most current national carrier rates. save money on your phone bill, invest it in your small business. wouldn't you love more customers? i would definitely love some new customers.

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believe me. we're in a bubble right now. and the only thing that looks good is the stock market. but if you raise interest rates even a little bit, that's going to come crashing down. we are in a big, fat, ugly bubble. and we better be awfully careful. >> that is donald trump warning of bubbles and saying that the fed is keeping interest rates low for political reasons. all of this is happening as the dust settles from last night's presidential debate. so let's find out what wall street is saying this morning. joining us now is chief investment officer at bank of america's global wealth and investment management business. also tom lee who's managing

partner at fundstrat global advisers. welcome to both of you. >> thanks. >> this has been a burning question that has been playing out through the market for years at this point. tom, what do you think? you have been bullish for a very long time. but is there a point where you think the fed's influence wanes and does donald trump have a point that markets -- financial markets have gotten ahead of themselves in some places? just because of this artificial inflation from the fed? >> we have to be careful. i think the economy has not out-performed expectations. it's underperformed. but it doesn't mean there isn't room for the market to do better. i think it's all going to come down to how housing performs. >> you don't think interest rates has anything to do with this or what central banks around the globe are doing? >> i think central banks have always played a really important role in the economy and the business cycle. and i think it's been incredibly

important for the market -- for the markets for central banks to be predictable. so i don't think it's created a bubble. i think it's very scary to hear a presidential candidate, though, say that we're inheriting -- that he's going to inherit a huge bubble. >> what about you, chris? >> i was just going to say, it's hard to say there's a bubble when you have the sentiment that we have. and investor sentiment is not good. we've had negative flows into the equity markets. by retail investors, by institutional investors. i mean, stock buybacks are what have held the market up. now, the stock of interest rates, the term structure, all of that occurs down enabling corporations to buyback stocks, raise dividends, and balance sheets. raise debt to do all that. >> ki just say one thing? this past may and the may before when i sat down with warren buffett, bill gates, and charlie munger. all three of them said stock market prices are going to be

determined by interest rates. just because money goes to the place where it is most loved. and is that all that different than saying, look, donald trump is saying it differently, but interest rates are going to have an impact on equity prices. >> no question about it. discounting mechanism is there on cash flows. lower interest rates do that. you get rising multiples. but we are still at an 18 time multiple. we're not in the 20s. we're not excessive here. and the supply of stock, the supply of equity is low. so you get low supply, get a little bit of demand. >> you were talking about the relativity of where we are compared to the rest of the world. both of these candidates have suggested different growth plans, right? trump has said 3.5% growth all the way up to 6% i've heard him say he can get the country to. hillary clinton is really stuck closer to 2% which doesn't get people that excited. which one's more realistic to

you? >> that's a tough question. you know, predicting future growth rates. but i don't have any problem with the notion that over the next decade the u.s. is the primary driver of global growth. we've got of lot of pent up demand. and so if those start to normalize, i think it's -- you can picture 3%, 4% real growth. >> what makes it normalize? we know formation has been slow out of the financial crisis. what gets us to the point where people actually go out and buy houses and form more households. and do we get more supply on the market? part of the reason housing prices have been high is is there haven't -- >> yeah. if housing starts just mean revert to the normal level starts of 2 million, that swing and activity is equal to a capex boom. >> when you say we could get to

those numbers, is that a function of policy or a function of demographics and -- >> it's a little bit of both. right? i think there's pent up demand because household formation is taking place. but there isn't really animal spirits. i don't think people feel like they need to form their own household. then there's been legal restrictions. we had almost 20 million households go through foreclosure or a bankruptcy. those are starting to take seven years to discharge it from your credit history. the end of this year is really when we start to see that strengthen. >> i would say it is a demographic issue for sure. >> but you think we get to 3% or 4%? i'm trying to understand is that -- >> yeah. in the next cycle we could goat 3% or 4%. you need -- >> and can your candidate get you there? >> we don't know at this point. i mean, you need to have policy change for sure. you need structural change across the board.

>> suggesting no policy change to get there. >> i think either candidate can get us to a much better -- >> neither? >> no. both. either. so both. >> on that point, you know, we're spending $1.4 billion in maryland right now building jobs and creating a property there. it took las vegas seven years to get back. and i think that speaks to your point is that jobs are in the offing because investors are starting to put money to work and companies are starting to put money to work again. >> and higher rates do help. >> gentlemen, thank you both for being here. jim's stay withing us. coming up, reaction to last night's debate from former labor secretary alexis herman. "squawk box" will be right back. what's team spirit worth? (cheers) what's it worth to talk to your mom?

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still to come this morning, the labor department is launches a review of all complaints concerns wells fargo in recent years. details straight ahead. plus former labor secretary alexis herman joins us to talk jobs and last night's debate. "squawk box" will be right back.

welcome back to, everybody. among the stories front and center this morning, we will be getting the latest figures on consumer confidence just a

little later. the conference board's monthly report for september is expected to come in at 99.1. nike is expected to report. the athletic footwear and apparel retailer is expected to report quarterly profit on revenue of nearly $8.9 billion. samsung says it has gotten back more than 60% of the note 7 smartphones it's recalled. those phones were recalled because of fire prone batteries. some had caught on fire and damaged property in certain situations. the company is hoping to finish the process as soon as possible to try and avoid holiday season impact. also, the labor department is launching a review of all complaints concerning wells fargo in recent years. in a letter to senator elizabeth warren, tom perez promises to conduct a top to bottom review.

senator warren has called for an investigation into possible violations involving bank tellers and sales reps who may have stayed late to try and meet sales goals that some of their coworkers were kind of juicing the numbers to meet. tomorrow the house financial services committee will hold a hearing and question ceo john tump. last night donald trump and hillary clinton went head-to-head in the first presidential debate sparring over jobs and their view of the economy. >> hillary, i just you this. you've been doing this for 30 years. why are you just thinking about these solutions right now? for 30 years you've been doing it and now you're just starting to think of solutions. >> well, actually -- >> excuse me. i will bring back jobs. you can't bring back jobs. >> well, actually, i have thought about this quite a bit. >> yeah for 30 years. >> joining us now alexis herman. you've got to be on your best behavior because she's a board

member of your company. >> and my comp committee too. >> mgm ceo jim murren is here as our guest host for the two hours. i want to talk about wells fargo with you, too, if we can. but i know you were at the debate last night. >> i was there. i was there. second row. >> first impressions? >> my first impression was i thought both candidates started off very well and really appealed to their constituents. but as the evening wore on, i must admit, donald trump confused me. i was perplexed. i did not think he was prepared. and i was personally offended the way he kept interrupting secretary clinton. it did not bode well for me. just one participant in the audience. i was looking for more concrete details from him. >> let me ask you in pairness because this is a polarized political season. you walked into the debate supporting hillary clinton? >> of course i did. i have always supported secretary clinton.

but that's the reason i said i actually thought in the beginning it was quite balanced. and i said you know what, they're both doing a very good job appealing to their voter base. i started listening for concrete facts. i started listening for real answers to the moderator's questions. and i didn't hear that from donald trump. >> let me ask you this. there has been what some people describe as an enthusiasm gap between voters voting for hillary clinton and those voting for donald trump. it is clear online or elsewhere, you can feel the enthusiasm for donald trump in a way you have historically not been able to feel for hillary clinton. do you think last night changed that at all? >> oh, i think first of all when you talk about donald trump versus hillary clinton with the enthusiasm gap, there's no question he has an emotional appeal. his rhetoric oftentimes is very polarizing. however, i think last night did change the dynamics of this election. i think that people who were on

the fence were looking for real answers from both candidates. and i just don't believe donald trump gave hard answers. particularly when it came to things like how are you going to create the jobs. you can't just say you're going to create 25 million jobs through tax cuts and expect that to trickle down to people who need work today. that just doesn't work. >> when she says, though -- her economic plan, it's hard to get very excited about. because it is not that inspiring. right? we're talking basically about the same path we are currently on. which i'm not suggesting to you is a terrible path. because i think it's marginally better than it gets credit for, but it is still nothing like 3.5% if not 6% growth that people like donald trump is suggesting you can get. >> first of all, i don't believe that donald trump can get anywhere close to what he's talking about. growth. he said 4%, 5%. first of all, it keeps changing, so i'm not sure where we're

landing on his growth numbers. and you talk about hillary's plan not being inspiring. you know, i don't know if i want to be inspired when it comes to getting very practical and very real about how you're going to create jobs. i want to hear concrete statements. you're going to invest in infrastructure. you're going to make college affordable for our kids today. i also want you to tell me about what you're going to do to help the environment. child care, paid leave, all of that makes for the job market of the future. >> although secretary clinton is kind of saddled with this idea of being a continuation of the norm, being a continuation of what's in washington. and there's been a real political pushback for people who feel like they have been left behind and have not been addressed. that is a huge issue for a major part of the electorate. that's why we're seeing polls that show trump doing so well. >> i don't doubt what you're saying in terms of we've got a

lot more work to do. that's very true. but the reality is you have to look from where we were in 2008, where were we with double digit unemployment. do we have more work to do? of course. do we have more than 25% of african-americans still in poverty in terms of even though the rates have come down? of course we have more work to do. but i'd rather be on the path where we're on now than where we were in the past. and i don't hear anything new or different in what donald trump is saying about what we're going to do to take care of even more of those who need work today. >> you mentioned infrastructure as a major point. both candidates said they would spend more on infrastructure. >> donald trump has said he will spend more on infrastructure. donald trump has said that primarily he's going to create all of these jobs by reducing

taxes. and that's for the most part all that he has really said. >> given the last eight years in terms of the highest tax rate in the corporate world that we have right now and the amount of regulations that small businesses face every day. that's not a stretch. at least in my view. and thinking that maybe the government is not the answer, that the government has to create jobs through infrastructure. the government has to pay for college. the government has to -- just expanding the size and scope of government activity hasn't worked for eight years to get us above 1.5% to 2%. so unencumbering the private sector has merit in how we perform globally. i know there's supply sicidersi. even jfk sort of unencumbered

the private sector through getting out of the way. you're a labor secretary rb right? >> that's right. eni must tell you. >> you don't like government jobs. >> i don't. and i love the work that i'm doing now in the private sector, but i think it takes both. larry and i used to have greet conversations about this very topic. >> you stick around. he's going to be here. >> i want to give him a hug. but i know that larry knows like i do that it takes both. it takes government and the private sector -- >> only have one for the last eight years. >> that's the reality though. it takes both. and you also need government, i think, to, you know, plow the road, to clear the way. to be sure that you're going to create a stable environment. >> and on that, alexis, i travel a lot for the company. thank you for letting me do that. and i agree with donald trump when he says that the airports are tremendous in dubai and fantastic overseas and the high

speed rail in japan is all great. and how is that we don't have it in america? the best country in the world. there's no doubt we need to invest tremendously in infrastructure. both candidates have talked about it. we have to do it. that's a bipartisan issue. everyone knows we have to do it. just getting it done. how do you get something done? you have to work across the aisle. which is something secretary clinton has done her whole life. as a senator, as a first lady, as a secretary of state. so, you know, working on the history, working on facts, i think there's a better chance that she can get that done than somebody that is -- >> you might not have to work across the aisle if you're on the same side of the aisle. >> that sounds like there's winners and losers. >> so are you saying you want to democratic house and senate and a president? i like that. i like that. let's work to do across the

aisle. >> paulsen said the same thing. look, you're going to have republicans in the congress so let's get somebody to work across the aisle. unless you put a republican in. then everybody's on the same side. >> i think she has demonstrated -- no. >> i am republican. >> my great friend here really is. he really is. [ overlapping speakers ] >> what do you do about the trust deficit that hillary clinton has with voters? and are you bothered at all by any of the foundation stuff? >> no, i'm not bothered. i happen to have done great work on the katrina fund, the haiti fund with the foundation. i know personally its work. and i think it's taken a really bad wrap in the media. and when it comes to, you know, the trust issue with hillary. i think people know she really is the best candidate to lead us forward. >> okay. i'm sorry we didn't get a chance to talk wells fargo. we've got to run. great having you.

>> always good to see you. >> stick around for larry. >> yeah. do a good job, jeff. counting on you. >> he's a life long republican. >> i love his kind of republicanism. >> i did bet you do. i bet you do. anyway, coming up kellyanne conway on donald trump's performance and what we can expect during the debate. the futures this morning, let's take a quick look. up 40 on the dow right now. five on the s&p. 13.5 on the nasdaq. [chains dragging]

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trump versus clinton. round one in the books. >> the plan trump has put in the books would be trickle down economics all over again. >> i'll bring back jobs. you can't. >> now the response from wall street to main street. analysis from executives and political experts. plus the reaction in the markets. that's straight ahead on "squawk box."

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hillary clinton and donald trump facing off last night -- was that last night? >> yes. >> just a few hours ago. >> the falcons were playing the -- >> yeah right. >> yeah right. you were watching. >> yeah, i saw it. darn it. last night in the first of several debates ahead of the election. joining us now trump campaign manager kellyanne conway. i was there 10:15. i got to say for democracy, i've never seen my kids so interested. >> it was just fabulous. >> and even my dogs were -- i don't know whether there was some --

>> i think trump has the dog vote. tell your dogs thank you. >> i bet you're right. dogs and cats. exactly. when dogs are with cats, that's bipartisan. so what was your take, kellya e kellyanne? >> i'm glad america got to see them side by side. it's the first time they had that opportunity. he held her account for her record on trade. which has sort of the sleeper issues of 2016. so to those guys who are out of work in ohio and pennsylvania and michigan, they heard him clearly last night say i'm the guy who's going to bring those jobs back. there's no reason between nafta and tpp, we just -- jobs are going to mexico, they've gone to china, gone to robots in some other country. and we're going to create american jobs for people that want to bring back manufacturing. i also thought his strong moment was when he held her to account for being responsible for the

growth and birth of isis. in other words, he said you and president obama created this vacuum by the way you exited iraq and it's allowed isis to form and fester now in 30 countries. >> lester was in a tough spot. you saw what happened to matt lauer when he dared ask hillary a tough question. eaten by his own to some extent. what did you think of lester? we did hear a lot -- it was an hour and a half. 90 minutes. i'd say 15, 20 maybe spent on birther and tax returns. and zero spent on immigration? >> clinton foundation, immigration, her e-mails. mr. trump mentioned her e-mails in response to a question about his tax returns. otherwise -- >> that was the only way it came up. >> and so she was able to pivot out of that. and so i thought that lester holt did a fine job as the moderator. mr. trump said he did a great job so i'll echo that. i think those are difficult circumstances. you can never really cover all the issues you want to cover in

90 minutes. but joe, that's why donald trump is out on the stump every day on his way to la guardia right now to give yet another policy speech in yet another swing state before audiences. why do americans have to wait to learn how hillary clinton really feels about the issue that affect them every day? why do they have to wait until debates? she's running a negative campaign about him. she's not running ads about here's what i would do to fix the disaster of obamacare. and here trickle down government policies of more regulation, higher taxation, and no economic growth, the wage stagnation we've had for decades -- practical decades now according to the economists. i don't think anybody who tuned in last night is comforted thinking that she would change any of that. >> let me ask you a business economic question. given the policies that mr. trump has espoused that arguably according to him and you would create growth, 3.5% if not 6% or whatever number you want to put on it. lower taxes for corporations, the ability to repatriate all this cash. this should be a ceo's dream and

so far in terms of the biggest ceos of the largest multinational companies in america, fortune 500 companies, we have not seen public support from those companies. jim being one of them. >> that's fine. mitt romney had 30 of them and it didn't work well. >> 28. >> we'll round up. i don't think that's the measure that most voters are going to say how much -- >> does the public support? >> there is public support for his economic plan. if there wasn't he wouldn't be tied in the polls. >> i'm saying why don't we see ceos coming on here every day saying this is spectacular, we need to do this. given that the policies are -- look. many have been talking about the issues donald trump is talking about. yet you don't see them out there publicly supporting him. why is that? >> he's a non establishment candidate. there are two candidates running for office last night on the stage, andrew.

only one of them has pocketed millions upon millions upon millions in speech fees from wall street and from the big banks. by the way, we don't even know what she -- >> did it answer your question? i'm a ceo that creates jobs. >> and you can vote for hillary clinton? more regulations, higher taxes for everyone? >> somebody that is going to put infrastructure to work. that is going to -- >> why hasn't she done it? >> she's not the president of the united states. >> my goodness. she's been in office -- she's been in public life forever. why didn't her husband do it? why didn't president obama do it? >> the husband did do it. and president obama has. >> really? because the roads and bridges are crumbling. >> would you not say the economy has been getting better over the last several years or is it not? we had the best july in the history of my country. >> congratulations. a lot of americans don't feel the same way. >> and i'm employing 7,000 more people. >> god bless you. has she ever created a job?

>> she's created tremendous amount of financial stability. >> she has? >> financial stability creates -- >> she hasn't created any financial stability. as you said she's never been prt. she's never created financial stability or a job and we know it. donald trump has employed tens of thousands of people. >> who knows how many. >> you don't know how many employees he has? >> no. i know how many i have. >> aassure you he has tens of thousands. god bless you. you are non-hillary clinton types that are entrepreneurs. >> how many jobs does he have right now? >> employees you mean? >> yeah. >> he has tens of thousands employees. >> that's a vague number spp 10,000? >> here's what america cares about. the jobs hillary clinton has created, zero. if you think that wage stagnation is great, if you think the slowest recovery in decades that we've had under this president is a great idea, if you think the 1.9 million more people in poverty is a

great idea, i just don't. and i think that's why workers all across the country particularly in some of these swing states where donald trump is beating or tied with hillary clinton in states that president obama carried twice, that mitt romney economic genius couldn't carry. he lost colorado, he lost iowa, he lost michigan, wisconsin, pennsylvania, ohio, florida, virginia, new hampshire, must i go on? >> actually, let's talk about some of the swing states. that might very well be where the election comes down to. that's where the momentum has changed rapidly in the last few weeks. kellyanne, what has to happen in a state like michigan, ohio, pennsylvania and how much of your campaign is riding on that? >> well, we're very happy to be competing in what people consider to be the blue states. because we don't look at them as blue states or red state. we look at americans as people who want more jobs and better paying jobs. and also they want somebody to help with this everyday

affordability crushing problem which is people even that have jobs, two and three jobs in the household say why in the world is the job not enough? why am i white knuckled end of every month to pay the student voucher payment, the food, the fuel. when my grandfather had a job, it was enough to support the family. now it's not enough. why is that? they appreciate the fact that donald trump is a businessman. we know it doesn't work in washington. washington has a 12% approval rating. and 70% of americans want this country to go in a different direction. you simply can't hire someone that represents a status quo and failed policy and pretend you're for change. if you're part of the 28% that says life's great for me -- sounds like you're one of them. god bless you. and we want to go in the same direction, then vote for hillary clinton. it's not the 70% that want change. >> can i talk about one swing state nevada? life is great for my employees. the majority of my employees are minorities. 66% of them. many of them have come to this

country and this is their first job. and so to think about diversity inclusion and making a diverse workforce is very important to me. >> jim, they're playing us out right now. we're in a hard break up against the hour. literally going to roll on us. >> i'm glad that donald trump has employed many people from many different countries of origin. used to live in one of his buildings and that was very clear. but i think people want a job creator, a change maker, there's only one person who represents that. thank you. >> thank you. >> got way too much republican rhetoric here. >> we'll be back with more "squawk."

round one in the books. hillary clinton and donald trump spar over the economy, taxes, and jobs. >> that's going to be a job creator like we haven't seen since ronald reagan. >> that is not how we grow the economy. >> from main street to wall street, have the markets declared a winner? global reaction to last night's face-off. all that plus the social media aftermath. a full rundown of the most tweeted, posted, and googled stories of the night as the final hour of "squawk box" begins right now. ♪

live from the most powerful city in the world, new york, this is "squawk box." >> welcome back to "squawk box" here on cnbc. i'm joe kernen along with becky quick and andrew ross sorkin. futures have been up a little bit all morning long. the dow is now indicated up 41 points. 42. 41. the s&p 500 indicated up just under six. the nasdaq indicated up 13 or so. and last time we looked at the energy complex, it was down a little bit after a nice session yesterday. we'll take a quick look at wti down 89 cents. actually down 2%. it was up 3% i think yesterday. but there wither. i love guys that predicted for 40% range. they were so smart. >> they've been right for a long time. >> so amazing. >> had another analyst yesterday

saying the same thing. for the next year. you're not going to look at maybe $60 for at least a year. we have much more on last night's debate in just a moment, but first why don't we take a quick look at some of the other top headlines from today. housing is in focus today? the case-shiller report today expected to show an increase close to june's jump in prices. the release on that comes at 9:00 eastern time. of all complaints concerning wells fargo in recent years. in a letter to senator warren, the labor secretary promises to conduct a top to bottom review. and perry capital is shutting down its flagship fund. in a letter sent to investors, richard perry says although he believes strongly in the firm's investments, the headwinds against the firm have been strong. perry capital has seen its assets under management decline from $15 billion in 2008 to $6.6 billion as of last december. okay. we got some stocks to watch this

morning. here's what's going on. twitter. there's continuing speculation that the company is now moving closer to being sold. walt disney and microsoft the latest to be called possible suitors. the auto makers are in a talk. there are reports that officials are pushing for an extremely large fine. also american express can bar merchants from steering customers towards cheaper credit cards from competitors like mastercard and visa. this from a ruling reverse. >> i don't understand why you say the good guys won. >> because the -- this was the antitrust case. i'm fascinated by antitrust. this was an example where the decision was to wrong headed by the lower court, i thought, and we talked about it. you don't remember us talking about it. but i talked about it and here we have -- we finally have an

appeals court that agreed. >> okay. if you want to get the cheapest possible price for a consumer and american express charges -- >> basically what the deal -- if you want to accept american express, you are not allowed to then -- what was happening was and what happens today or -- you walk into a store, put your american express card down and they'd say excuse me, could you use your mastercard because the fee is lower. >> right. >> within the terms of the deal, if you accept american express, you're not allowed to do that. >> the merchant. >> the merchant. and mastercard had sued saying this was somehow illegal. >> for them to be saying that you can't ask them to use something else. >> exactly. >> okay. >> it's complicated. >> it is. let's get back too another complicated story. politics. the first of several debates. it's on the books. john harwood is here. he was there last night and had

a lot of e the highlights. >> it was a fascinating hour and a half. we talked earlier in the show about policy issues, taxes, economy, foreign policy. but another issue for donald trump and hillary clinton was temperament. hillary clinton has been running against donald trump as someone who lacks the temperament to be president. and polls show that a majority of the american people have doubts about him on that score. 60% in our poll prefer hillary clinton to donald trump on temperament. now, how did donald trump react to that? the first 20 minutes of the debate he was calm and even in his tone. but then he got rattled when she went after him on a personal basis on taxes, on the conduct of his business, issues of that kind. and then he got to the end of the debate and here's how he dealt with the issue. >> well, i have much better judgment than she does. there's no question about that. i also have a much better temperament than she has.

you know? i have a much better -- she spent -- let me tell you. she spent hundreds of millions of dollars on an advertising -- you know they get madison avenue into a room and put names. let's go after temperament. i think my strongest asset maybe by far is my temperament. i have a winning temperament. i know how to win. she does not -- wait. the afil ceo the other day behind the blue screen i don't know who you were talking to, secretary clinton, but you were totally out of control. i guess there's a person with a temperament that's got a problem. >> secretary clinton? >> whoo. okay. >> now, was donald trump protesting too much? the question is does he reach any people that he needs to bring to his side to advance in the polls, close the small gap that he has behind hillary clinton? those are principally college educated white voters, largely women. we're going to find out in polls over the next week or two.

that's going to be the test of the debate. >> what's the first big poll that we'll see, that will show us that. >> there are polls all the time. my question is the elite polls, the nbc/"wall street journal," "washington post"/abc, cbs/"new york times." don't know the schedule for all of them. but we have a constant role with the nbc survey monkey track. that track came out yesterday showed hillary clinton up five in a four-way race. that was unchanged from last week. so we'll see what happens next week. >> thank you. joining us now, john sanu. you haven't endorsed trump. you haven't even said you're going to vote for him, have you? you'll fit right in here today. >> there you go. it's -- nobody cares what i think. >> you are a balanced republican

guest to balance off the other ones we have. that's how we get the balance. that we strive for. so what'd you make of the debate? >> first i think it was a debate of contrast. donald trump is about slogan or themes or vision. cut taxes, renegotiate our trade deals whether it's nafta or tpp or the deal we made with iran. hillary is really about the past. validating the obama administration. obviously, she served a long time. one of trump's strongest lines was when he referred to her as you're a 30-year politician. and that more than anything just set up a contrast between the two people and the two personalities. >> sounds like you're ready to vote for trump. did you promise governor kasich you wouldn't say anything or something?

what the -- who's your dad voting for? have you asked him? >> you know him. you got his number, joe. you can call him and ask him. look, seriously i think he's is said he's supporting the ticket. i've got a brother running for office that's endorsed trump. but the least important thing in this conversation, joe, is what i or my family are doing. >> that's a cop out, senator. that is such a cop out. okay. fine. don't -- you don't need -- do whatever you want to do. >> come on. you'll live. >> all right. but then -- okay. i don't -- i guess we want to still hear your thoughts on this. less important if you're not convinced who's the better candidate for the future of the country. >> well, i didn't come on to tell you who i think the best candidate is or who i'm going to vote for. but to give you a little insight into what voters who i've dealt with a lot are looking for in

this. and they're not looking for the crap that you usually talk about, this plan or that plan, on health care, or are they going to create 327,487 -- >> senator, did you just say i talk about crap? did you really say i talk about crap all the time? not me. you mean everybody -- just me? >> if you're not going to ask a good question, you're not going to get a good answer. the voters are looking for the contrast between the personalities and their leadership styles and their vision. whether the voters think they're going to take us forward and change because any poll you look at shows that people aren't satisfied with where they are today. or are they kind of rooted in the past? and again, that's the strongest thing that donald trump has going for him by contrast. the strongest thing hillary clinton has is probably her command or experience with foreign policy. she's obviously a more, quote, disciplined and scripted candidate. she was more practiced, more

rehearsed. but in this election -- certainly coming through the presidential candidates with john kasich that i supported, i saw that voters were looking for a lot of change. looking for someone that they really thought could shake up washington. that was trump's strength in the primary. and i think it's the thing that he has going for him now in the general election. >> i'm just gratified that apparently you watch. because you're very accurate in your commentary. >> i had to watch. i probably wouldn't have watched, but i knew i was coming on to talk to you. so i did my homework. >> oh, no. joe is thanking you for watching "squawk box." that's the thing. >> i'm thanking you for the comments. >> you meant business people talk about all these different -- >> i'll cop to that. we do talk about a lot of crap. >> you were talking about the fortune 100 ceos.

and look, i'm not trying to be overly critical, but these are the least risk adverse people in the america. okay? they're not out there -- these aren't profiles -- certainly not political courage. there's no reason for them to endorse somebody publicly. >> not only that, senator -- not only that but the -- >> -- for them or their shareholders. >> right. the evil twin of socialism is -- >> crony capitalism. >> i was looking at you, andrew. i wasn't looking at necessarily at jim murren. but obviously that -- it wasn't you, it was somebody else that -- oh, i was watching actually it was jim cramer on the show after ours that said is it a good thing or a bad thing that she's got 11 fortune 100? would you rather have zero? like mitt romney had 30. where'd it get him? got him nowhere. >> there's nothing -- i don't fault them. look, i want --

>> they have democratic customers. >> i don't fault them for endorsing her. but again, what's more telling is that 70 or 80 or 90 don't do anything. the reason they don't is they don't want to be involved in politics, they don't want to take a risk. it's not good for their company. >> that's right. they got to sell stuff to both sides of the aisle. why should they say who they're going to vote for when we can't even get a republican senator to say who he's going to vote for? i don't expect them to say it. >> i'm a private citizen. >> i know. i know. you know, they told me john sanunu was on. i didn't know who the heck you were when you came up. >> this is insults going all the way around. >> where's the real governor sanunu? >> i'm sorry was that the casino guy who lives in nevada. of course you don't know who i am. >> id canning. you've been in here a lot. we appreciate it today. larry kudlow will be on in a little while.

he's going to maybe be definitive. see you, senator. thank you. >> thank you. coming up when we return, the market reaction to last night's debate. we'll talk to strategists when "squawk" returns with a lot more in just a bit. guess what guys, i switched to sprint. sprint? i'm hearing good things about the network. all the networks are great now. we're talking within a 1% difference in reliability of each other. and, sprint saves you 50% on most current national carrier rates. save money on your phone bill, invest it in your small business. wouldn't you love more customers? i would definitely love some new customers. sprint will help you add customers and cut your costs. switch your business to sprint and save 50% on most current verizon, at&t and t-mobile rates. don't let a 1% difference cost y as much. whoooo! for people with hearing loss, visit sprintrelay.com. actually making your body feel better... making your whole day better. hi, everybody. i'm boomer esiason. and that's exactly what tommie copper does for me. now, they call it "wearable wellness"

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welcome back to "squawk box" this morning. a meeting in algeria this week. and hadley is on the ground there. >> reporter: what they told us was this was going to be a preview to the main event, the main opec meeting just a couple of months away. they are now releasing a possible plan to about 1 billion barrels to a day and iran freezing at 3.7 million barrels per day. and also see the kingdom of saudi arabia cutting 400,000 barrels a day back to january levels. so this plan if approved would have some of those details. they've been releasing more and more as the day has gone by. of course this is, of course, according to reuters. i asked what constitutes progress at this point and what

can we hope to see going forward? take a listen. >> a lot of progress, where we're coming from the last two years. fairness to saudi arabia, they've tried to rally around to realize the initial policy. worked for awhile. all just have to hold hands and move together. >> reporter: that's interesting coming from the nigerian minister. i asked him are we going to get a freeze from your country. he said no one could expect nigeria tro freeze at this point. he said for iran they were trying to get back to the pre-sanctions levels. and the plan if approved would see them able to do that. for saudi arabia, of course, you have to remember it's coming at a difficult time for why they're wanting to change their policy here. because at home right now, this is not only hitting the private sector. they're slashing bonuses. they're also slashing minister salaries. this would have been unheard of

just a year ago. a lot of changes for the kingdom. that's why you're seeing such movement from them now. >> thank you very much. we're watching wti closely today. it is giving back some of the gains from yesterday. we'll continue as we get closer to this meeting. joining us to talk more about the markets is richard bernstein. thank you for being here today. great to see you. >> thanks, becky. let's talk about a lot of different issues. what do you think is the primary motivating factors? we've seen a couple of down days for the markets because you're still talking about the highs. >> the big story today is all about politics and everything else. i think people have still forgotten fundamentals, earnings, and interest rates. and, you know, the fed is still threatening to raise interest rates. but they're not strong enough to -- >> that may be -- >> when we're in this limbo story right now, where people don't know is the fed going to raise rates too soon relative to

earnings? and so we're kind of caught in limbo. >> there was a story on the front page of "the wall street journal" saying forget about it. no longer think that the third quarter is going to be the quarter where we finally see earnings growth. >> i saw that article. i'm very confuse bid some of the data that they showed. on a sequential basis right now, reported earnings, the growth rate is actually positive. we are turning the corner. are earnings booming? of course not. everybody knows that. but you have to have a recovery in earnings before you get the expansion of the boom. we're in the recovery phase. i think that's what the markets have been telling you since last february if you look at the rotation of the market, the shift towards cyclical names. >> so you're a skeptic of some of this pullback. that corporate earnings are going to hang in better than we're giving credit for. >> absolutely. i think comparisons get reasonably easy. analysts always pooh-pooh that. wait, every cycle starts with

easy comparisons. you can't start with hard comparisons. just the math. 2016 into 2017 is going to be this period of easing comparisons. >> you know, becky, i think we are going to have a good third quarter. >> because? >> well, i can see it in our business. we had the best july we've ever had as a company in the united states and las vegas. >> that the american consumer coming back in? >> yeah. they're starting to spend a little bit more money. gas prices are low. it encourages travel. they're not traveling internationally as much for a variety of security and social reasons. and we're seeing good job growth in las vegas and we're seeing very strong earnings in that market which is a cyclical market. to see las vegas improving i think is encouraging. and i see that around a lot of our other properties as well. >> exactly. i mean, that's kind of the story. it's not booming, but it is

recovering. people always pooh-pooh recoveries that they're never going to last. >> the problem is you look at gdp numbers and they've been lousy. suggesting that we're not even seeing near le 2% that we used to say stinks. >> joe's going to hate what i'm about to say. >> okay. >> but there's been a lot of focus by a lot of people on the fed pumping up the economy. and what they're missing is the difference between gdp and corporate profits. this is not just the fed pumping up the stock market. corporate profits in this cycle became the largest percent of gdp ever. if i were to say to you five years ago or six years ago, corporate profits are going to be the biggest in history, should you be bullish or bearish? everybody would be bullish. >> where's the problem with gdp? what are the components? >> even profits are down six straight quarters. >> they are. but we've reached a point where they were the largest -- >> because everything else stinks so much worse? >> i think profits are actually booming if you look at the growth rates and earnings.

they were very strong. >> but if corporate profits are -- >> not the largest part of gdp. well, yes, they are the way you're saying it. >> but they're still coming down. >> and you're seeing the slowdown in gdp. >> where are the real weakness for gdp? >> a couple years ago believe it or not -- joe's not going to like this either -- government spending actually contracted. people forget that. >> a lot of that was state and local. >> but it still happened. >> and sequester which i'm sure you loved. >> hey. you know, people invest with us because i'm passionate. we all have our -- >> you're dispassionate. you e-mail me every day with something that i can't delete fast enough. >> he's passionate, but he's dispassionate on the politics. >> and when we come o to -- i think our clients invest with us because they know politics are not driving our investments. >> but i know it's you because there are so many richard bernsteins. and you won't take the middle

initial i gave you. we had jared bernstein earlier. that was not you, right? >> no. no relationship. >> richard, thank you. >> soul mates, but no relation. coming up, if you ever wanted to hit martin shkreli, you might get a chance. >> seriously? >> i guess. we're going to tell you why the pharma bad boy is auctions off an opportunity to punch him in the face. >> that is crazy. so that i can take my trading platform wherever i go. you know that thinkorswim seamlessly syncs across all your devices, right? oh, so my custom studies will go with me? anywhere you want to go! the market's hot! sync your platform on any device with thinkorswim. only at td ameritrade

and programmers i teach them to talk.es, so yeah, ge is digital and industrial.

so it's indigital. digidustrial. indigenous. shhhh... let's go with digital industrial. for now. digidustrial. yeah. or, digital industrial.

still to come this morning, an opportunity to hit martin shkreli in the face. he's auctioning this off. plus reaction to last night's debate from former cea chair alan krueger and cnbc senior contributor larry kudlow. stay tuned. "squawk box" will be right back. man, i'm glad aflac pays cash. aflac! isn't major medical enough? no! who's gonna' help cover the holes in their plans? aflac! like rising co-pays and deductibles... aflac! or help pay the mortgage? or child care? aflaaac! and everyday expenses? aflac! learn about one day pay at aflac.com/boat

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♪ welcome back to "squawk box," everybody. here is what's in our headlines this morning. we are just about a half hour away from the latest prices on homes. the case-shiller report shows an increase. also swift says that it suffered three new cyber breaches over the summer. and it says attacks on the bank and its network are continuing. swift is rolling out new mandatory security requirements for customers to try and protect against attacks like this. and eli lilly shares are on the rise this morning. the stock was upgraded to a buy from a neutral at goldman sachs.

significant earnings growth because of a robust pipeline. that stock is up about 1.5% this morning. check this out. this is what we've been talking about for the past couple of teases now. pharma bro martin shkreli wants you to punch him in the face. i'm serious. but you have to pay to do it. here's the deal. shkreli is holding an auction to benefit the child of a friend who passed away. the child is a cancer survivor. shkreli says he will match the winning donation up to a certain point. i don't know what that point is. and the winner gets to punch or slap him in the face. he tweeted yesterday that the two highest bids are $78,000 and $25,000 so far. shkreli gained infamy for raising the price more than 5,000%. i don't know if anybody -- you know. we've got some people on the set here that have that kind of dough. you want to do it? anybody? is there going to be video of this? >> definitely. definitely. >> no takers here, i don't think.

>> okay. >> all right. now back to politics. trickle down trump -- trickle up government. the trade deals. it was crazy. and the fed all mentioned at last night's debate. steve leisman joins us with more on the debate economics. hi, steve. >> good morning, joe. some debatable comments on the economy in the debate last night. let's begin with donald trump. >> believe me, we're in a bubble right now. and the only thing that looks good is the stock market. but if you raise interest rates even a little bit, that's going to come crashing down. we are in a big, fat, ugly bubble. and we better be awfully careful. and we have a fed that's doing political things. this janet yellen of the fed, the fed is doing political by keeping the interest rates at this level. >> the idea that we're in a fed-induced bubble widely debated on wall street.

now an bankrupt end to interest rates could shock the market, but few think the fed would hike without better profits. a few on wall street think the fed is being political. off to hillary clinton who is offering a unique theory for the reason for the financial crisis. >> it is as i said trumped up trickle down. trickle down did not work. it got us into the mess we were in in 2008 and '''09. >> indirection connection at best. in general not linked to tax cuts. deregulation by some. trickle down economics, not a leading theory of the crash. there are things you might criticize it for, praise it for, but causing the financial

crisis, that's a unique theory from the democratic nominee. >> thank you, steve. in the meantime, let's bring in alan krueger who's here. former chairman of the council of economic adviser under president obama. currently a princeton adviser and our good friend larry kudlow informal adviser to the trump campaign. also the author of a new book to get. "jfk and the reagan revolution: the secret of american prosperity." and also our guest host this morning, mgm resorts chairman and ceo jim murren. great to have everybody around the table. let me ask you this. you watched the debates last night. this gentleman has talked a lot about the kind of growth rate he sees under trump. what is a realistic growth rate in your position? >> under donald trump it would be negative. >> be negative? >> that's what serious economists that looked at his plan have said. if he's going to deport 11

million undocumented workers, we're going to have a trillion dollar loss in gdp. look at mark zandi cease forecast. so i think we need to get rid of the kpotive claks how he would raise growth and just look at the trade war that he would start. the negative impact of his immigration policy. right there i think we would see a recession. >> you don't think there's any merit in trying to fix our trade with our partners? >> look, i think there's -- >> working assumptions among certain economists that somehow a trade war is inevitable. >> saying that you're going to pull out of the wto, rip up long standing negotiations that we negotiated in good faith, who's going to want to trade with us? you'll see a trade war. that's what we saw during the great depression. >> the obama administration used it a couple times. so did george w. bush. so did ronald reagan. if somebody's breaking the

law -- look, i'm a free trader. i don't go as far as mr. trump does in a lot of things but the reality is that presidents for years have used that temporary targeted tariffs if somebody breaks a deal. trump is not going to start a trade war. can i just read this? i really have to disagree with you, alan. i'm sorry. the tax foundation which i think is a lot better model than mark zandi who is a friend of mine. hillary's proposal across the board tax hikes. she wants to raise taxes on individuals. she wants to raise taxes on corporations. she wants to raise capital gains, she wants to raise stock market financial transactions nap is not the path to prosperity. so tax foundation scores her proposals growth minus 1%. capital investment, minus 2.8%. wages, minus 0.8%. full-time equivalent jobs, she loses $311,000. you want to hear trump's real fast? trump gdp, plus 8%.

okay? capital investment, plus 22%. wages, plus 6%. full-time equivalent jobs, plus 2.1%. >> hold on. there's one number that's being left out of this equation. how much debt is the country left with under the trump plan versus the clinton plan? most of the economists i've read put it even in the several several trillion dollars to hillary clinton. >> his original program was minus $10 trillion on revenues. his current is minus roughly $3 trillion. >> $5 trillion. >> i'm using the tax foundation score card. >> magical asterisks. >> that does not include his spending plan. very important. he's going to have broad based, widespread spending restraint throughout the government. and me, i think frankly, if you slash the business tax rate,

you've heard me say this many times before. for large and small businesses, you are getting a big bang economic growth rate. repatriation, trillions of dollars coming back home. full immediate cash expensing. i think you go 4% to 5% in the first several years. i don't know what mrs. clinton is talking about. tax cuts -- bush had minor tax cuts and that's the cause of the financial crash? >> leisman just said that wasn't. >> she wouldn't raise taxes on the middle class. she would lower taxes on the middle class? >> where? >> child tax credit. earned income tax credit. support for going to college. >> free college tuition. you think that's going to help the economy? >> i think we need a better trained workforce. we need to grow the economy from the middle out by supporting better workplace -- >> explain to me, alan. you're a distinguished columnist. i'm an admirer of your work.

not all of it, but some of it. explain to me how giving away student debt for free, taking over the whole health care system -- she wants single payer and then some -- and raising tax rates on investors, on companies. she's going to drive american companies overseas more and more. she does not understand that. >> look, we've heard this fear mongering before. it was said when president obama raised taxes on the very top. and look how the economy has grown since then. the economy has been better under president obama. >> i agree. worst recovery since world war ii. >> the last recovery was in recession at this point. >> hold on. >> if you look at the total amount of growth in this versus seven years from the start of the last recovery, we're doing better. especially in this private sector. >> if you compare it to post-war recoveries, it is the worst. if cow compare it with the reagan recovery, it is not

close. that's the point. >> that's not correct when you look at the job market, income growth. we just had the strongest income growth since the bureau has been taking data. >> for one year. >> but the bigger point here is -- >> -- median income has not increased since 2000. you know this. >> i need to ask which question i don't understand which is if in ten years i told you that we, the taxpayers, would be on the hook for an additional -- let's call it $2 trillion with dynamic swing. $1 trillion with dynamic swing. whatever number you want to use. relative to the hillary clinton number which i think is at $200 billion. isn't that very clear to you as an economist? >> no. >> okay. then explain it so i understand. >> because she is raising taxes across the board. i wish trump had made this clearer last night. i don't think it was his best night. >> because it's not true.

>> let me finish. i'll go through it again. she wants to raise taxes on businesses, on individuals, on capital gains. she wants to raise taxes on inheritance. this is double and triple taxation of investments. so my response to you, andrew, is in the short run in order to invest in economic growth which is what tax represents, tax ruts represent, i will take a deficit. because in the long run we will get it all back and then some. that's the way i look at this. i'm glad to hear one thing. my book is about jfk and reagan supply side. he did mention reagan. i was trying to get him to put jfk. maybe we'll put it the next time. if you want to tax your way into prosperity, that theory fails every single time. >> that's why the '90s created so many jobs. look, if this worked george w. bush would have presided over an economic boom. instead it was a disaster. he tried this. he cut taxes massively for the wealthy. >> no he didn't. >> that's why the deficit blew

up. >> wait, wait. >> let me finish, larry. i let you finish. you're talking about one candidate who has a plan, who has proposals to help the middle class. and another one who said very clearly the wealthy create jobs. that hasn't been the case. we need to grow the economy by improving the workforce, by raising productivity, by making sure we have a better work/life balance so people can enter the labor force. >> you know, if you think that productivity and i agree about the importance of productivity -- if you think productivity is going to be raised by raising tax rates on business, i got to disagree with you substantially. now, george bush lowered cap gains and dividends. that was a good thing. his income tax cut was very small. the guy had a five or six year boom. if you were going to tell me he caused the financial crisis, i'm going to tell you that's a missed read. but the broad areas in this history between kennedy's tax

cuts, reagan's tax cuts which for two decades gave us 4% to 5% growth. it's true bill clinton raised the income tax in his first term. it helps cost him the entire congress. but that is a reagan-esque policy. mrs. clinton is so far to the left. you are not. alan krueger, you are not going to give us higher taxes and prosperity at the same time. it doesn't work. even a good cainsian would say it doesn't work. >> the debate doesn't end here. we appreciate both of you this morning. go out and get mr. kudlow's book. jim will be sticking around. coming up, the fireworks weren't just limited to the stage at the debate. the drama unfolded on the web too. we'll bring in the top moment from last night's face-off according to google. as we head to break, take a look at the top three tweeted topics. top three tweeted topics.

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welcome back to "squawk box," everybody. markets have been influx this morning. we've seen the equities markets up about 100 points for the dow. now you can see that while those gains have been paired through the morning, you now have the dow futures actually negative. s&p futures essentially flat. a lot of this has been happening as we've been watching oil prices as well. oil prices yesterday were up by better than 3%.

but this morning they're giving just about all of that back. wti now down by 2.5%. decline of $1.18 to $44.76. and hillary clinton and donald trump were the only two candidates on stage at last night's debate but the internet was an active participant in all of this as well. la toya drake, a serge and trends expert at google joins us now. tell us about what was going on on the second screen, if you will. >> sure. for the first time in many of the searches that we've seen, hillary clinton actually came out on top. donald trump has had search entries. but last night there was more search interest in hillary clinton than for donald trump. of course some of the questions and the quality of questions that people were asking kind of skewed a bit. >> what kind of searches were they -- what was in the search stream? >> so this is interesting. because people really reflected on what was happening on stage versus say looks. the most searched question for hillary clinton is stop and frisk unconstitutional. sort of reflecting the debate

that was going on between her and trump. and then we also saw questions about what was in the e-mails that she deleted. and what did her father do. she spent a lot of time setting the scene about him. >> and what were the things related to donald trump? >> the most searched question was did he support the war in iraq. then there were questions about chicago and certainly stop and frisk. and then we saw questions about how much money did he get from his father to how many times has he declared bankruptcy. >> so people are doing their own fact checking watching along with this. because there are points where the candidates were saying no, you're wrong, no you're wrong. so people are figuring it out themselves. >> sure. we saw this play out in questions people were asking about lester holt. we saw questions about his political affiliations. but also is he going to fact check. so people were sort of following that throughout the night. wondering what to see from lester. >> that's fascinating to have a realtime look at this. >> sure. >> we described this as the super bowl of debates. do you know the traffic numbers?

>> we don't release search numbers. but this was very watched. people were watching this in realtime. we're waiting to see the ratings. >> post-brexit there was something said afterwards where people were searching what is the eu or something. like very controversial search. but when you looked into it, it was only like a thousand people. so it was a huge increase in the percentage of people who were doing it, but it had nothing to do with the electorate. i think that story played out in the media incorrectly. what's a fair an accurate way of kind of portraying how big -- if you can't give us the real number? >> it's a relative spike. when you see something right after brexit what is the eu, that wasn't a question we were seeing here searched in the states in mass search quantities. so it is a spike. >> i remember the percentage being huge but the actual number being really low. i felt like that story was completely taken out of context. >> certainly understandable. >> same situation this time or are the actual numbers much bigger than we were talking

about with that? >> don't have numbers to compare what was happening in brexit to what happened last night, unfortunately. >> can i ask, do most users end up on the actual sites of either trump/pence ticket, the official site, if will, or hillary clinton's ticket with tim kaine or do they end up on news organization sites when they ask these questions? >> we don't follow the behavior all the way through, we just look at the questions people are asking on google. where they go thereafter is up to them. we don't follow the behavior or track them to see where they go. >> my guess would be different places. >> but they're asking the questions. >> if you wanted to hear it from the campaign, you've already heard it from the campaign itself. i think you'd check it out somewheres, third-party choices. >> so whether they're going to the sites or a news site, people are asking those questions. >> unfair question, do you want to buy twitter? >> i am not party to those conversations. >> nice try. thank you. i had to try. when we return, jim cramer

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let's get down to the new york stock exchange. jim cramer joins us now. 300 points down in two days and

now we're unch. what's happening? >> something happened last night and we've got to put that aside and now we're back. oil is down because the whole algerian thing that we heard about this weekend was a complete joke and there's too much oil. you know, with this market, it skipped a beat for a day and then we're right back in. i wish i could say that i would think it was the end of a quarter and people will come in and buy it. i'm waiting for that to happen later. but it seems like it's same ole, same ole, like we didn't have a debate. >> so that's already -- it's over, it's done. that was last night and now the market has already moved on. >> yeah. >> we got up 50 or 100 at one point, never did trade there. >> no. look, i have been agnostic on this whole thing. i just think that whoever gets in, the companies are going to do what they do. i'm not a big believer that the earnings are down. i think that's kind of like a -- you see these big forecasts about earnings going to be down. i see a lot of companies doing a lot of right things, joe. they'll do a lot of right things

under trump, they'll do a lot of right things under clinton. we should just move on. >> all right, jim, thanks. a roundup of the top stories when "squawk box" comes right back. ♪ we're drowning in information. where, in all of this, is the stuff that matters? the stakes are so high, your finances, your future. how do you solve this? you don't. you partner with a firm that advises governments and the fortune 500, and, can deliver insight person to person,

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been mgm international's jim murran. i just want to spend a little time talking about your business these days. you've mentioned several times that july has been your best quarter or best month, rather, ever. what's happening in the business, both in vegas and elsewhere? >> fortunately, las vegas is doing very well and we own half the entire market there. it's because businesses are having more conventions in our convention spaces, more people are going on vacation. we are getting better rates, better activity. the airport is doing very well. more international flights. so las vegas is doing well and we're taking that growth and we're building around the country. so we're building at national harbor, which is right near d.c., and that opens in december. >> what percentage of the business these days is the table itself? >> so 75% of our revenue in las vegas is nongaming. >> nongaming? >> so we're more of a nongaming company there. >> what is it, is it the rooms, the entertainment? >> conventions, rooms,

entertainment, retail. and that's the highest growth part. the gaming side is pretty flattish. >> what about the property in maryland, is that going to be a convention center sort of locale or is that more of a -- >> it will be a high-end conference facility and ballrooms. there's a lot of convention space there with gaylord, there's 3,000 rooms already in the market so we're only building 300 hundreds, we're putting in a restaurant, so it's more of a luxury resort. >> but it does rely on business spending and you have seen strength in that recently? >> absolutely. all our properties rely on business spending. we're seeing strength across the united states. >> you made a comment about u.s. customers not traveling and you used the word "security" being one of the issues. how much do you hear that that's the driving force why people are staying? >> you know, people are diverting their vacations. people coming to las vegas. i don't want that to be the reason why we're growing

business, that doesn't make me feel good, but it's a reality of the fact that people are -- a lot of our high-end customers are more comfortable flying to las vegas and spending a few days there than going to europe. that's happening. >> jim murren, thank you. it's been a pleasure to have you the last two hours. appreciate it. >> make sure you join us tomorrow. "squawk on the street" is coming up right now. good tuesday morning, welcome to "squawk on the street." futures are steady as the world reacts to last night's presidential debate. we're going to bring you all the highlights as well as how some markets and polls have reacted. europe largely in the red this morning. oil is down more than a dollar today amid some reports out of opec that iran is unwilling to freeze at these levels. the latest home price number is out as well, up 5.1 in july.