independent inspector's preliminary report shows nelson peltz elected to procter & gamble's board again, kelly, the key will be the challenge, i don't know whether p&g is going to challenge or whether he's just going to sit down and get on the board. >> whether they'll draw this thing out. like in 2000 i'll stop drawing the comparison david, great stuff, thank you very much, david faber reporting that in fact nelson peltz has won a board seat at procter & gamble that does it for "closing bell." "fast money" starts right now. "fast money" starts right now. live from the nasdaq market site overlooking new york city's times square i'm melissa lee. o tonight on "fast," shares of cisco surging after hours, that conference call is under way, we'll bring you the details as they unfold. plus top strategist at wells fargo says he solved the market mystery. he'll be here to explain and a bitcoin trading

battle, the head of one of the largest brokers has a major warning about crypto currency, he says it would derail the economy. the ceo of interact i have briv will break it all down nelson peltz winning a seat on the board of procter & gamble the stock is higher by as much as 3% in after hours david faber broke the story and will be here shortly this is a company that declared victory on the initial vote count and here we are, a reversal of fortunes, tim. >> they declared victory they said they thought she could work with mr. peltz' team. you have to wonder if we haven't already done a lot going into this in other words, i think the entire proxy fight was at least something that illuminated some of the key issues of this company. these are not new stories. it's about unlocking value and brands that in some cases have gotten stodgy and a company that might have more value. >> even after the company declared its own victory, a lot of analysts were saying this is

a clear message to david taylor, the ceo, anyway that it was a win for mr. peltz. what's different >> as a shareholder, it's a win-win for the shareholders like you just said, tim, it unlocks value, it shows areas where they can unlock value. it forces management to get their butts in gear. i look at it from a shareholder standpoint >> to tim's point, this stock traded off in september about 10% and it has rallied back pretty decently. there's a lot that went into the mix here ultimately the stock market will like it. i believe that it probably trades higher from here, not lower. >> karen, what do you make of this, one of the most expensive proxy battles in history >> which always bothers me, the idea that the company spends the company's money, however much of it they want, and the activists spend their own money. sometimes when they settle there's an agreement on sharing fees that seems unfair to me but that's sort of the way it is i wonder, i think your point,

they heard what he has to say, which is important it's one person, though, i think will be difficult to really move the needle, if they're not inclined to do some of the things he suggested anyway, which they didn't seem to for some of them >> mr. peltz didn't sound like that really bothered him, he said add another board seat. he didn't really care about being a small percentage voice on the board >> i think he's confident in his ability to over time win over other board members. and we've seen him do that other times. >> he's got now a place where he can speak from, versus just sitting from the cheap seats, so to speak, now he gets that message out there more and maybe the company starts to get a little more flexible >> if he does get on the board, i believe he'll have access to all of the minutes of the meeting prior to this. it will be fascinating to read about -- >> how they talked about hill? >> yes >> the question now is timing, how long is it going to take to implement change and move the needle there you look at ge and you say that

will take forever. >> that's a whole different ball of wax >> my point is it does take time to implement process and change to really have an impact on shareholders i think they'll be able to do it >> at some point it gets down to, what is this company worth and what do you want to pay for a company making low margin consumables in a crowded world >> let's bring in cnbc's david faber from 30 rockefeller plaza who broke this news. david, any chance p&g challenges the recount since it was so close? >> reporter: you know, there's always a chance, melissa, certainly, that they may choose to do so what i will tell as you the firm that did that independent verification of the election spent six weeks on it, it's been weeks. the reason they did is because it was so incredibly close in fact let me read you the numbers here if you want to keep track at home. 971,953,651 votes for that man, mr. peltz. versus 171,910,871 votes for the

lowest director. so it's like 43,000 shares, it's nothing, absolutely nothing, razor thin but they spent weeks going over this and so it does raise the question that if p&g were to challenge it, after all of that review has already taken place, would it change the outcome. that remains very much unclear not to mention that given that victory, however razor-thin it is, and their previous decision to declare victory at p&g, it would seem they don't really do themselves any favors by challenging. i don't want to get in front of their decisionmaking i don't know, i haven't had an opportunity to reach out to p&g and find out what their thinking is but one would assume that nelson peltz will probably take his seat on the board of p&g >> do you think they'll be able to get past the acrimony and

work productively together >> reporter: karen, i do, things get nasty and then people decide to get civil heinz was a nasty proxy battle too. not only did he take his seat but they worked well together, and mr. johnson, the former ceo of heinz, is now involved to a certain extent with tryan. my sense is while these things do get heated, as you know, they're adults, and they will find a way to work together in the boardroom. >> no statement yet from procter & gamble >> reporter: no, it's 12 zeroes, melissa, 12 zeros and one at the end in terms of the margin >> that is amazing >> david, real quick, it's tim do you think that management at procter & gamble is more of a buyer or a seller at this point,

in terms of all the pressure on these guys to look at the brands and spin off it sounds to me like they're not a seller, it sounds to me like they're looking to even grow, expansion. >> reporter: i think you're right. peltz said that he was not advocating breaking up the company. but i think that was always the subtext and certainly a concern on the p&g level, that he will push for that over time, because he thinks that will create the most value and focus, get rid of layers of bureaucracy he claims are there and the costs associated with that but that's not certainly been the case from the p&g camp, as you well know. they've been talking about the benefits of this company staying together and to your point, potentially continuing to grow, both organically, they hope, and through acquisition. >> i hate to ask you to speculate, david but given what mr. peltz has said in the past about what p&g should do, and given the notion that procter & gamble should be more of a seller than a buyer of

things at this point in time, what assets do you think could be on the table? >> reporter: yeah, i don't know, melissa, what route they'll go what i can tell you, of course, having followed the campaign closely, is that was not his focus as much as it was saying that the company needed more focus, that it needed crisper decisionmaking, and that there were a lot of costs that could come out of the business, some that have been identified by p&g, otherwise perhaps not, and he wanted to hold management accountable. so we'll see what the future holds for the company there with mr. peltz on the board of directors. he did say to us, famously, he doesn't know how to spell the word "lose." it looked for a while like he learned to spell it, but maybe he didn't. >> it doesn't likely he did, so far. peltz has won by a very thin margin an expensive and acrimonious proxy battle with

procter & gamble we were having this discussion about staples being very expensive. does this make the case that procter & gamble may be worth being in if despite being expensive, based on valuation, because you've got this activist in there >> well, maybe but again, what can he do? i'm not sure we knew peltz made his way into that boardroom somehow 3% organic growth on sales is nothing to get terribly excited about although they're slightly better than the industry over the last five years they've cut brands by 70%, definitely stream streamlined this company you can make an argument this is a leaner, meaner p&g again, it's not cheap. north america is 45% of sales. it's not growing emerging markets is where they're getting most of their growth >> you say peltz can have his procter & gamble >> i think this stock rallied dramatically i would do nothing >> how about you, karen? >> if i had to be in the space, i don't really love the space because for the reasons tim

said, i think it's expensive, the growth isn't there it's not crazy expensive and there is a dividend, but if i had to own one, it might be p&g. >> and because of nelson peltz >> that's a little bit of it i do think the whole proxy battle does put pressure on the board to do something. >> i think p&g is a good long term bet i'm not going to rush out tomorrow and buy it. as far as staples are concerned, they're pricey, one of the most expensive sectors in the market. you look at it and say, are you going to go out and buy clorox or intel or something at 14 times earnings i would rather buy intel >> they're the number one holding in the staples, in the xlps when you look at this group, i do believe they're 12% of the xlps i do believe you'll probably see it run higher. i believe he'll make some efficiency changes he's not talking about breaking it up or selling off pieces, eventually somewhere down the road that will be a

conversation >> he could run another slate next year. >> he could, you never know. let's stick with the consumer staples space. as we mentioned, the sector has been rallying along with so-called safety stocks like reits and rules. our next guest says there's danger in the group. carter worth is here to break down the danger. >> "danger" twice. i like utilities, reits aren't bad. staples, i wouldn't hide, it's not safe let's look at fsu charts this is a chart that takes you back to the '09 low. now take a look at the following. this is the up trend we have been in consequentistently at a minimum you'll come down to the trend line for the xlp,

another sort of 5% let's really dig into this strength here. okay so this is now the same chart on top, and it's the relative performance in the s&p i'm going to draw this line right here from the absolute low in '09 what we know is as seen in the prior chart, staples as an aggregate goes straight up but every dollar put in there has been a loser it's going basically straight down relative to the market. which you might expect in a bull phase. there's no alpha here at all let's keep going here's the chart right here, right now. last two years we know that there was a peak last summer and essentially a peek here. let's talk about relative again. this is effectively a new high one year later the asset made a new high, but what we know is, it never made a relative high. what it was doing was

underperforming. that's a problem okay let's draw some lines and end with this. one thing we can see about this process right here is this is something of a head and shoulders top. and we got the break where do we get the break and the throwback? the throwback, putting our head and shoulders top, we got the neckline break and we've thrown back right to that line. that's an inherently difficult level. the presumption is you're going to fail again. the lines one more way put in our head and shoulders top. here is your neckline. the break. the throwback. that's where it should stop. i want to sell the staples, i don't want to use them as a place to hide. they are expensive no thanks. >> pretty clear. carter, come on over he's in the parthenon.

carter, we're talking about procter & gamble, nelson peltz winning his proxy battle according to trian >> the two that stand out are walmart, the only one that's making new 52-week highs with coca-cola. you've got a sector where the top five stocks are 50% weight and the fact that they are expensive, this is your area, people who do that, but you know the numbers, you're talking about an area growing at 4.8% earnings, tech is growing at 20. it's twice as expensive, for tech it's twice, three times what is it, yes, can access get in there and move around and make some money. but as a bet, as a thesis, is this where you want to go to try to win the game? >> carter, you pointed out it's performance relative to the s&p. when you said this is not atip when you're looking at a bull market and the s&p is running. right now when you start to see the s&p rolling over and you

start to see those utility bets, the staple bets, those are the ones that seem to be green on a day where you're red on the overall macro, how do you think that shapes up if the s&p continues to roll? >> i do like certain parts of that complex, that's the point of bringing up utilities and reits. they don't have the structural issues these have. utilities are making new highs staples have been coming off for the better part of three months. but also, they're sort of beloved. they're still enduring in the memory of the investing public these are the great names, the household names, american icons. that's not a thesis. that's nothing >> carter, thank you very much, carter worth of cornerstone macro. procter & gamble has issued a stable by business wire regarding the results. procter & gamble sharing proxy results, nelson peltz is leading the other director by a margin of .0016% of shares outstanding or approximately 42,780 shares

they say the results are still preliminary and are subject to a review or challenge period during which both parties will have the opportunity to review the results for any discrepancies. p&g will disclose the final results after we receive the final certified report in the weeks ahead. so trian declaring a victory, procter & gamble says they're preliminary results. >> it doesn't make sense for them to dispute the results, it doesn't look good, it doesn't sound like a company that wants to be constructive coming up, mattel singing after hours, their stock has been in the gutter tim seymour is a shareholder, he'll weigh in next. >> the father of high speed trading says crypto currencies could take the market and maybe the whole commit the ceo of interactive brokers will be here to make his case against trading bitcoin.

despite the weakness this week, it's been more than one week, we've seen as much as a 2% selloff in the s&p 500 a top strategist says there's a simple reason why traderkes ep buying the dip, a fascinating explanation ahead on "fast." us. sometimes they just drop in. cme group can help you navigate risks and capture opportunities. we enable you to reach global markets and drive forward with broader possibilities. cme group: how the world advances.

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welcome back to "fast money. a news alert on mattel rejecting hasbro's takeover bid. seema mody is in the newsroom with details >> reporter: melissa, reuters says mattel has informed hasbro its proposal undervalues the company. it does not take sufficiently into account the potential for regulators to reject the deal based on antitrust concerns. this of course throws cold water over the potential combination between these two toy companies. mattel shares are lower here in extended trade back to you. >> all right, thank you, seemy modi tim, what do you think mattel's game is here >> the stock rallied on technical levels but mattel has to drive a harder bargain. in the mid-'20s it was a takeover target. the new ceo, they brought her in

from google, she's got a digital strategy they're going after hasbro's strategy, which wants to be in the next gen of kids' online toys they have a portfolio of brands, fisher-price, "cars 3," these guys are far from dead i don't think they should ship the deal as it is. there aren't a lot of other people out there when they say the reason for that is because you're not giving us enough of a premium for when the antitrust guys step in -- >> i appreciate your calling me ken. once you start to see these takeout bids float around a little bit here, to tim's point, you have to drive a hard bargain. then you start to see other people start to get interested and start to see what the real price should be. maybe it's not the mid-20s i do believe it's probably higher from here instead of moving sideways. whenever you see these bids sort

of evaporate or the conversation is done for the moment, you'll see a little bit of a healthy reversion, sort of a giveback in the stock. then after a couple of days, another headline comes out and the stock pops 10% or so >> this is a business that's in secular decline. let's face it, technology is basically taking over the children's sort of appetite for any entertainment. i look at it and say, what are they looking to pay for it if you come in from google, you're used to tech premiums this is a toy company, you're not going to get a tech premium. >> you can't tell me that toys are in decline these companies who have a brand portfolio -- >> it's licensing. >> yeah, who have characters that -- they can plan any format you want >> you think this product is going to steal gifts from under the christmas tree this year >> they can compete right there, is my point. gaming, why can't barbie be the next video game? >> do you think mattel has been

in front of the secular change >> no. that's why they have a new ceo that's why the company has gone -- [ simultaneous speaking their rival hasbro has a very different strategy they've gone asset light they're not manufacturing their own toys in many cases the disney princess licensing deal they stole from disney. the cisco conference call is under way, we'll hear from the ceo after the break. i'm melissa lee, you're watching cnbc, first in business worldwide. meantime here's what else is coming up on "fast." the question is, why do traders buy every dip in the market and a top strategist for wells fargo says he may have found the answer he'll explain. plus here's what the ceo of one of the largest electronic brokers thinks will happen when brokers thinks will happen when bitcoin futures begin trading.

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we've got an earnings alert on cisco surging after hours let's get to josh lipton in san francisco for the details. >> reporter: melissa, cisco has some new reporting results ceo chuck robbins began by walking through those divisions. for example there's the so-called infrastructure platforms division that includes switching and routers, also wireless and data center revenue there was down 4%. >> i -- cisco is saying that's mostly due to wireless robbins says catalyst 9000 has

already been adopted, more than 1100 customers in three months he's talking about their embrace of the cloud, their new partnership recently announced with google cloud. they've bought app dynamics, you saw the applications division revenue up 6%. finally talking about security, up 8% in the quarter listen to his take on that division on the call >> that i think is differentiating it we've been on a multiyear journey selling software and subscriptions against the threat intelligence and the malware intelligence we have that's what's continued to pay off. so i think it's resonating with our customers and it's an architecture we can continue to innovate on, we continue to expand on. >> reporter: a final question came on tax policy and what repatriation could mean for cisco. the company's cfo saying that perhaps repatriationcould mean the company could get a lot more

aggressive when it comes to buybacks melissa, back to you >> thank you very much, josh lipton >> i -- cisco up 5.7%. >> this is a ridiculous cheap valuation for a company that has put in the time. software and subscriptions is a high margin business expense management is very strong i think you stay long in this name >> security, it's the smallest business in terms of revenue dollars, but 8%, what does that tell about you the rest of that space? >> right but i think the overall problem, the macro problem is transforming obviously this looks like where people are willing to take a step in and say, okay, after eight quarters of no revenue growth, we see some glimmer of hope here to turn the company around to a streaming and services company you have the oracles, the saps

is this still an ibm, where it's a legacy business where you're attached at the hip to something that can't be transformed. and it looks like the marketplace is giving it the benefit of the doubt just now. but there is a big machine that these guys have to turn around to actually move the needle other than one off quarter in eight. >> remember the four horsemen? speaking of "back to the future." tim mentioned cisco was one of the four horsemen, oracle has come roaring back and cisco and intel have been left in the dust will cisco as grasso mentioned be able to retain those highs? >> i don't think so. there's a floor to the stock this is a company that you can absolutely move the needle on, solid free cash flow yield, you talked about repatriation. those are big tail winds for this company intel is a name i would be buying aggressively as well.

>> even listening to "braveheart" music >> it gets me every single time, some of mel's best work. >> karen >> i don't know, i think this is interesting, one quarter, i was trying to think about it is it better today, up 5% with the news that we have, than it was this morning at 34-ish not knowing what the earnings would be maybe. maybe. >> we're betting on another loss how many people is -- how much of this is a knee-jerk reaction, oh, jeez, it was a quick turnaround, i'll bet against the law of odds is on my side, and now they're going to miss again, and i'll collect and i'll cover right after it and then they see -- >> tiny shortages, though. >> i'm just saying, it's a bigger company, it's hard to tell on a day bet when you're sitting there on a market that can be moved by very low volume where people are just saying, it's missed the last seven, it's probably going to miss this one.

>> i think that's important, the positioning into the quarter, very low expectations. the bar wasn't set high or low, sort of muted. now you have people repositioning. >> people are picking around for some value steve has highlighted the key problem. this company has done nothing, it's been at $49 billion in sales for three years. free cash flow too has been flat all these other guys, those other three horsemen -- do not play that "braveheart" music again, i won't be able to stay composed >> you asked for it. >> the jury is still out i think you have to go and get this one chuck robbins has slowly turned this thing around. ahead, why is everyone buying the dip a top strategist says he has the explanation. he'll join to us explain bitcoin's magic square with overstock, all trading at 52-week highs as the companies embrace the crypto currency. y twhishe ceo of one of the

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welcome back to "fast money. stocks selling off today, but the markets at near record highs, thanks in part to a rising trend in investing. bob pisani is at the nyse to break it all down.

hi, bob. >> reporter: hello, melissa. the s&p is only 1% from its historic high. several factors are keeping stocks up including record earnings and a global economic expansion. one little-discussed trend may also be a factor, the rising popularity of index funds and etfs, which are created by buying baskets of stocks the etfs trade independently but the underlying stocks don't necessarily trade. the theory is you've taken a certain part of the equity market out of circulation. this creates upward pressure on stock prices the rise of etfs has not been without controversy. bank of america reported in july that etfs are distorting the market and making it less efficient. a lot of people disagree, i do but they're becoming more influential as a percentage of trading volume in 2014 they were 20% of the trading volume this year it's about 25%

but don't overestimate the influence of etfs. the total value of all etfs in the u.s. is a trillion dollars, a tiny percentage of the roughly $26 trillion value of the u.s. equity market and the even bigger $38 trillion u.s. bond market melissa, etfs are not just taking up a lot of stocks. there are fewer stocks to trade overall. the wilshire 5,000, the broadest measure of the u.s. stock market, they haven't had 5,000 stocks for years at the end of 2016, which is the last data we have, it was down to 3,618 stocks. blame it on m&a and a less than robust ipo market for the last decade back to you, melissa >> 3618 is not nearly as catchy. bob, thank you, bob pisani at the nyse chris harvey, head of equity strategy at wells fargo securities, says not only will passive investment keep the market afloat, it could even drive stocks to more record highs. chris, welcome how does that work >> thank you this is how it works

what we've labeled -- passive is a new qe when you look to qe, qe took a significant portion of the treasury market out of circulation, putting upward pressure on the price. passive is taking a significant portion of the equity market out of circulation and putting upward pressure on price for now, it's a one-way trade. money goes in, doesn't come out. sort of a black hole the other thing we're seeing is a lot of managers are seeing, chris, we're having a great year, this is the best in the last four or five. however, every time we've tried to rebound, reposition, the last three, six, 12 months, it doesn't work out what you're seeing is a lack of natural sellers. you have to have an adjustment in price upwards to incentivize sellers to come back in. >> i get that, and in a bull market that makes complete sense. but the first whiff of a selloff, you don't think that works to the downside? >> so what happens, in my opinion, in my experience what

happens, until you have something extended, what changes behavior, what changes behavior and what people lose money in, when they lose money for an extended period of time, a little selloff, that's not going to do it people aren't going to reallocate they really have to lose a lot of money over an extended period of time. so we think it's here to stay. >> this passive money has displaced what you call active money. how active is active money in getting out on the downside or piling in on the upside? >> so what we're seeing from active is, again, they've had a great year they're overweight technology. every time they've tried to rebalance, it hasn't worth out they're becoming less active they're kind of sitting back and saying, we're waiting. what they're waiting for is not clear. sometimes i joke around, divine intervention but a lot of times we say, when it goes bad, it will go worse. what they're all going to do, what they're telling us, once the market rolls over, that's when we'll sell. once technology starts to underperform, that's when we're

going to sell. until then, nothing. >> chris, isn't even active using passive investments to hedge their portfolios so you get a double whammy where they're worried about those single stock blowups so they wind up buying the passive vehicle. >> of course that's a terrible hedge. >> right >> i think you're right. but chris, you also use the metaphor of qe isn't this a function, isn't this passive generation all because of qe? you've had a central bank put. you take that away, i think this whole thing changes dramatically >> what we say in the back half of '18, we think the market will become a lot more discriminating, because you have the e wcb, you have the fed, th boe, all taking back accommodation. at this point in time the market should become more discriminating, focus on people who are better allocators. >> this is really a short term call you're making in terms of the impact on the markets. not for us on "fast money," but in general, saying things will change in the back half of '18 >> right

>> you're seven months away. >> so what we're saying is, everything is expensive at this point in time. you look at the ten-year, 2.3, 2.4. a hundred basis points or less equity market, 20 times. if you tacked on a 3% risk to all that, you're looking at mid-single digits which is what we think you're going to get for the next 12, 24, 36 months there's not a lot of juice left in this trade. >> chris, thanks for coming by, we appreciate it, chris harvey >> all the quant investors are chasing this around. most of them are down 50%, 40% commissions paid to the street they got penalized by turning the portfolio over in a tape that is sort of grinding higher. when the reverse does occur and you've got the quants, the algos pressuring this tape, it becomes the reverse of what you described. >> 100%. what you see on the upside

you're going to see on the downside but even more >> okay. thank you again, chris chris harvey moving on. a news alert on a change to the s&p 500 telecom sector let's get back to bob pisani at the stock exchange >> reporter: melissa, welcome news s&p/dow jones indices says the telecom sector will be renamed communication services thank heavens, it's about time every time i put up the "telecom" label i wince. we're dealing with at&t, verizon, and centurylink we all know these companies are interested in getting into the media and entertainment business at&t already owns directv. people have been lobbying for this for a long time to make the sectors broader and more inclusive. this is a very welcome change, melissa. >> so bob, in this release, which just crossed moments ago,

so, you know, we maybe not have gone through the whole thing they said they would include things like surge engines, media companies. does that mean those stocks get pulled from the other sectors? >> reporter: yes >> so this would be a transformation of not just the telecom sector but also the tech center >> reporter: that's right. >> or the consumer discretionary sector because media stocks are in there >> reporter: yes if you're buying the telecommunications sector index or etfs around that, you'll have to buy those stocks. there will definitely be some movement overall but listen, this is really good news this is long, long overdue and absolutely it makes sense. >> it's like, welcome to the modern age, s&p. bob pisani at the nyse the list of the companies will be available by august 1st, 2018, and this will take effect on the close, after market close, september 28th, 2018. we're looking at almost a year from now to make these massive changes. these are massive changes because as we mentioned, it's not just the telecom center.

things have to shift across the board. >> we're getting it all out. it's funny because it shines a bright light on obviously some really big stuff over the last couple of weeks. this is disney as a communication company. >> at&t, time warner >> and netflix definitely is, in my view. so there you go. >> it's great that we talk about this right on the heels of passive investing. it creates people to buy more of those etf products to get people more in, if they want that single stock, they don't want the single stock exposure, they buy the etf. >> and if you buy the telecom sector today and it changes next year, do you bank on the fact that adding social media, et cetera, could lift that sector >> something's coming out, though, some shift, you can't have 108 >> a lot of those names will be much shorter weighting when you throw facebook in there. that's why you want to be active ahead, the interactive

broker ceo blasting bitcoin in "the wall street journal" today. what's got him so riled up he'll be here to explain target mistaking the market, taking 8% today on bad guidance. the ceo says there's something versus are getting allro wng we'll bring you those comments when "fast money" returns. ♪ approaching medicare eligibility? you may think you can put off checking out your medicare options until you're sixty-five, but now is a good time to get the ball rolling. keep in mind,

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the early days of the internet or the early days of the shift to the cloud, right? how many people said we'll never take data outside our data center, that that's not safe >> right >> look at what my old boss mark benioff has done >> that was sarah friar speaking to cnbc's jim cramer on "mad money. it's not the only stock getting a boost from bracing bitcoin despite the returns, the ceo of interactive brokers, thomas peterffy, took out this full page ad in "the wall street journal," blasting bitcoin futures the second week of december in the open letter to the chairman of the cftc, peterffy said bitcoin's price swings could be dangerous to the markets. thomas peterffy, also known as

the father of high speed trading, joins us on the fast line thomas, thanks so much for joining us >> thank you, melissa. if i may correct a little bit what you have said previously in the introduction, i am not at all against trading bitcoin. i think blockchain is a fantastic innovation and will have many, many uses bitcoin and other crypto currencies are great ideas they should be allowed to be traded freely and used freely to find their appropriate role in the economy. >> you just don't like derivatives trading for bitcoin, you don't like the fact that cme is going to offer futures on bitcoin in december? >> all i'm objecting to is linking bitcoin and other crypto currencies by federal regulations to the real economy, which would happen if we clear

bitcoin along with other products in the same clearinghouse. so the stability of the clearinghouse is extremely important, and putting bitcoin together with other products will jeopardize the clearinghouse with other parts of the economy, that could be suicidal >> the threat, thomas, is margin trading of these futures, so it doesn't matter if the cme puts a limit up or down on bitcoin?