a one time adjustment for taxes. a company's idea of what the tax rate is going to be. >> we will see what it does now, after today's big reversal. >> we are getting into the thick of things. >> mike, thank you as always that does it for us on "closing bell" today. "fast money" starts right now. >> "fast money" starts right now, live from the nasdaq market site overlooking new york city's times square i'm la listaly. traders, tim, karen, steve, and guy. tonight, it's crypto carnage, bitcoin sinking to a six week low. we will tell you what is behind the selloff and if any of the traders are buying this dip. plus one wall street strategist says bitcoin's blood bath could hit stocks later, is this the beginning of the end for ge? the stock getting slammed as the ceo hints at break up. we will bring you the latest details. first we start off with today as huge reversal testimony

dow surging # 00 points breaking through a key record before taking a reversal. ayman jaggers is a of the the white house with all the information. >> reporter: they are trying to get steve bannon on camera to answer a mystery, did he answer questions of the house intelligence committee or not? we know he was there, arrived earlier this morning there are reports he was asked by the white house to not answer questions pertaining to the white house. of course, the most interesting questions that the intelligence committee will have for steve bannon relate to the white house. the question is, did he or did he not answer those questions. later on this afternoon, the white house put out a statement not exactly denying that they asked bannon not to talk and sarah huckabee sanders, the white house press secretary, was asked about why the white house wouldn't want steve bannon to

talk, even though she would not specifically say that they asked him not to talk. here's how sarah huckabee sanders answered that question. >> that's something that i would refer to attorneys on that matter, and specifically steve bannon's attorneys look we have been completely cooperative throughout this entire process we are going to continue to be but we are also going to maintain some of the executive privileges here at the white house. >> reporter: you heard sarah huckabee sanders there invehicle vo -- invoking the words "executive privilege" but not necessarily the white house invoking the white house privilege as a legal matter. there is definitely league wrangling going on, what we don't know are answers to some key questions. one is did the white house actually ask steve bannon not to talk two is did steve bannon talk or not. we height get the answers later this evening stay tuned >> are there grounds for

somebody subpoenaed who refuses to answer questions. >> my understanding here is that if he gets a subpoena from the intelligence committee he would be able to talk. we will have to talk with some constitutional lawyers about this because under executive privilege there may be a way for the white house to assert that his conversations with the president himself would be protected. we'll have to get the lawyers sort all that out. but it's not clear that steve bannon decided not to talk, because he has been up there for several hours. so he has been something for some period of time on capitol hill this afternoon. >> ayman, thank you. a lot of questions here. as you can see, the market selloff accelerated right after the media reports ayman was just talking about hit the wires. the selloff seemed to bottom out when the white house released a statement clarifying those reports. while it seems like nothing can take down this market, what has caused panic albeit temporary

selling this year has been the chaos in washed. we should make sure this is not about politics, we are not having a political conversation but clearly the market is reacting to what is going on in politics and seems to be worried about this the question tonight is is the investigation into trump the only thing that can wreck this trump rally? grasso >> yes in a one word answer, it's yes i think all the things you listed as the reasons why the stock market has sold move the past -- this is a real personal issue. he knows where the skeletons are. he knows where the bodies are. >> bannon. >> bannon. so if he starts singing, the markets start sinking. and that is end of story for the market you will sell first, ask questions later. he has already turned on trump he has already turned on trump jr we don't know what he's going to do it is a big if if he decides to sing if he does it's lights out for the market. feel like having gotten the tax deal done that puts a floor under the market

i don't know that it's at an at the money put. but this tax deal is bigger than what happens in the trump administration obviously, that's a big story, but i think that businesses around the world are growing and that's helping our economy here, that's helping u.s. stocks, it's helping stocks around the world. and the tax break is real and it's done. >> so it's the economy stupid -- not calling you stupid but you are saying that that trumps -- >> many nights you could i think you have a case here where if you think about the dynamics that karen is talking about, if anything, i think a lot of -- haven't given you the full deal into what the tax deal and what it does for them and they are not incented to try to drive up thor about. infrom the consumer perspective, look we have had roughly over a billion in terms of hand outs to the consumer and they are going to start to see some of this coming through in terms of their wage gains and what happens in mid february i think it's all about the market itself has taken

itself -- has been -- i don't need to you will ka it euphoria. it has moved in one direction for five, six, seven straight sessions that's what happened today, that's the story. >> we are also getting into a busy week when it comes to earnings. >> one of the thing we have said for a while is, bullish in the market, but what's going to be an indicator that suggests maybe we are running out of steam. one of those to be potentially a big up day on the market on a day when the vix is up big as well the mark was up to a couple hundred dow handles but the vix was elevated all day one day is not a big deal. we have seen things like this before, but if you are looking for -- i said it before with steve, on the "closing bell. this is the closest reversal day we have had to february 10th, 2016 since effectively that day, s&p trade down to 1810

reversed deutsche bank did a bond offering that day and we had some headlines out of the uae about oil. all of those things lined up that put in a bottom for the last twoers yao. i'm not suggesting the headlines are similar in the other way but again the price action we saw was reminiscent. >> is this muslim mueller/bannon stuff an excuse at this point to sell a market that may be overextended >> it's never just one thing you have the big round number of 2800 everybody talks about the market being overvalued i think it was the perfect storm for the market today the outside reversal day though tells me we closed above the number we needed to. it tells me they want to wait and see. if bannon's story continues the next couple of days and we start to hear he actually did speak then you could see the market fall. >> does it matter if one thinks that trump's presidency is is in jeopardy impeachment stuff. >> if he comes out and speaks what everything thinks he knows

about, i think the presidency is in jeopardy. i think that's what we are all talking about. at least i am. >> i think the one thin that is sort of built in and isn't there yet is infrastructure. you have a lot of industrials and beneficiaries of an infrastructure bill, maybe that's starting to get priced in i think that would come off the table. and the big move in bitcoin, in crypto currencies today that's a factor in overall markets. >> i'm looking at the aftermarket. ultimately we have got a case where you think we found some leveling i think the risk appetite for markets is a case where other high flying stocks, airlines got dumped industrial metals got dumped you had upgrades by deutch across industrial metal space and a lot of those names settled down testimony high flyers, less attractive quality in terms of management and earnings stories were the ones that closed the hardest because they moved the most. >> what will be key tomorrow for you? >> how the vix trades tomorrow the reducel -- had a huge reversal in the russel

close to the lows of around 156. to me, the two biggest thing -- i'll give you three thing. how the vix trades how the bond market trades, which rallied today. and how the russel trades. >> two of the biggest gainers since trump took office have been boeing and catty pillar but there is something this the charge that could be signaling a top. carter has the break down. >> reporter: these are obviously high flyers. they are almost cult stocks. each operates in a duopoly caterpillar with komatsu, and -- obviously, you can see the spread maybe it's earned and desired. let's go to a ten-year chart you can see the spread correlation. and now this epic run. let's pull it back even further.

this is going back to 1980 all data september of 1980. s&p, and what's happened of late granted this is arithmetic let's look at a log chart to try to put this in coneck the. it's the same chart going back to 1980 but i've done it non-linear to try to put in context the preceding prices relative to current price. here's what catches my eye if i put in a channel -- i didn't manipulate this what we know precisely is the 1980 recession close if reagan, the 1999 high, the 2007 high, the '09 low, and for the first time we've actually blown through the top of that channel. my hunch is that we are going to fall back in at the minute to the channel. how far are we this is, again, those two securities plotted equal weight. typically you will get a check back towards your 150 moving

average. that's my bet. that would apply about a 10 to 15% selloff here and just to put this in context, from the low of february of 2016, we are up 200% on a two year basis more immediately, take a look at these statistics boeing and caterpillar plotted equal weight a three month gain of 30%. the probability of that occurring is one-tenth of 1% a six month gain of these two securities, the probability of that occurring 1980 to president is .05 a one year gain, a two-year gain this is exceptional. the question is first if you are long old only to, buy and he would how, do you trim sure if you are tactical, do you trim or get short on the bet that even if these triple from here they are probably going to ukt correct and perhaps in a meaningful way. >> carter comes over >> oh, come on. >> come over, carter karen will bring the chair

in thank you very much, karen. just to clarify it's not the combination of the two dow stocks achieving those gains simultaneously, is it? >> if you took those two and made them one security, the 300 billion and looked at the his three of that one security, 1980 to present this is basically an incident rate that has occurred own one or two times in history. >> does it get treated separately or not? >> there is another way to look at it. individual the two stocks are the number one and number two performer on the s&p industrial stock sector basically if you go back and find any instances where they have both exceeded 75% in any given year it's exceedingly rare. >> if i look at the chart and the overlay over the s&p it's pretty much identical. so if you say that one turns or should check back, then the s&p

checks back. so it's chicken or the egg for me. >> the long term chart, they diverge. but the day to day with the s&p, it's much steeper. >> do you think if the s&p turns south then these turn south as well, obviously to a different degree. >> i am not saying there is cause and effect but they would go down more because they have higher beta. and these are stocks that traded at eight times earnings in their past >> what does it say for their sectors what you see for the sectors in their charts, especially boeing. >> these are almost cult status. when you think of 3m you don't think of them. they have more competition but the sector itself has not outperformed the market in the last 12 months, the industrials. but it's as steep as you are going to fine it in the rolling 12 month period. >> in terms of the overall charts we are all talking about

reversals in today's session what did you talk about it. >> you are talking about a day to day thing when you have a new high and then you close on absolute low, last time we saw that was august 8th. and it gave way to a 3% selloff. i would think this would be more like 5 to 6 selloff. in other words we are steeper than we were in august. >> does the vix tell you anything, it opened higher and closed higher on the day first time we have seen that as well in a hng time. >> everybody is participating. banks are on fire. energy is on fire. the consumer -- >> are you negative on the market >> i'm always negative on the market >> more so after today are you more negative. >> i think you have to assume this is an important intermediate top that gives you a give back, correction, dip, something that -- put it this way, if you are bullish you want a dip or a correction because that is what sets up the next advance. if you are bullish you say the

dip is the beginning of a nightmare. >> did you say closed on the low. >> it didn't close on the absolute low, no but in the bottom of the range. >> are you in the camp that you think this will be the set up for another advance or -- >> even fur bullish -- would you remember if the you are bullish have it go up another ten or give back ten? give back ten. then after resting it can assert itself and go aagain if you put on another ten at some point you give bakr mo. if you are bull iish you want a correction, and if you are bearish you want a correction as well >> what did you do today. >> i was doing hedging taking an opportunity -- on friday -- the we think the market is in a tough place the rest of the week, whether in the white house or a euphoric move, playing short-term protection is not a bad position i did short a little bit iwm i think a lot happened there. >> karen >> i sold a little bit of

facebook, which was only a facebook story, thinking about it over the weekend. trimmed a little there otherwise, no i'm hanging on to what i have got. coming up, general electric getting slapped. having its worst day since november after a breakup to be ahead. plus, don't look now, bitcoin crashing almost cut in half from recent highs. a top strategist says it could mean trouble for stocks. chris harvey explains high. >> ford reist leasing disappointing guidance moments ago. the telast details after this break. much for "fast money" coming up next big plans. big plans. so how do i make the efforts of 8 employees... feel like 50? how can i share new plans virtually? how can i download an e-file? virtual tours? zip-file? really big files? in seconds, not minutes... just like that. like everything... the answer is simple. i'll do what i've always done... dream more, dream faster, and above all... now, i'll dream gig. now more businesses, in more places, can afford to dream gig. comcast, building america's largest gig-speed network.

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ford reporting guidance moments ago. we have the story. >> this is disappointing guidance in the eyes of many people ford is looking at a profit next year that really is not going to be changing much from 2017, giving a range of $1.45 per share to $1.70 per share the midpoint, $1.57, that's below the consensus right now at

$1.6 ford giving this guidance today at an analyst meeting here in detroit just within the last couple of hours. during the meeting they outlined the fact that the company is still going to be making heavy investments as they try to transition away from cars into more trucks, suvs and autonomous drive vehicles, increasing the amount of money they are investing when it comes to autonomous drive vehicles from about $4 billion, and electric vehicles as well, $4 billion up to $11 billion so the combination of greater spending as well as this lackluster guidance and the fact that ford relatively to their competitors probably doesn't have the strength of the truck and the suv portfolio has frankly given people a few jitters this afternoon as they give guidance for 2018 meanwhile, you look at what this says relative to their competitors, look at the outlook for 2018 generally speaking, most auto make remembers saying look we expect strong profits. not a huge bump from 2017 but we do expect profitability to be up on a healthy basis

at the same time, the companies are also outlining their plans for the future what happens the nafta ford has already outlined its plans over the last year general motors says it's not changing its production plans until they know exactly what happens with nafta and we saw what happened with fiat chrysler last week. finally there is the question in terms of trucks and suvs if you have new ones coming, we know the big three all do, but particularly gm and fiat chrysler are geared towards that market that's wherethe strength of th profits are going to come from in terms of total sales for 2018, most believe we will see 16.7 or $16.8 million, falling below the $17 million mark i should point out more than a few executives said look we think the tax changes could be a benefit to the market of anywhere from 100,000 to 200,000 units. as a result, don't be surprised if you see vehicle sales in 2018

get up to close to 17 million vehicles two stocks to watch, first race, that's ferrari, today their ceo said we are going to build an electric car if tesla can do it, we should be able to build a premium sports electric car they are planning on doing that. at the same time, fiat chrysler continues to move higher >> phil la buff from the detroit auto show on ford. the stock is down about 2% in after-hours session. compare and contrast with what gm has said it sounds almost kind of in line that 2018 would be as good as 2017 it's in the eye of the beholder and what you think of ford's prospects as opposed to gms prospects in terms of how you interpret it. >> ford's prospects are not as rosie. and the cap exthat they have to throw into autonomous. if anything, you would expect

eps guidance to be better depending upon where they could see front loading of the tax impact to the taxpayer and their numbers. for full year december on u.s. cars, fords were probably weaker than gms they had a ihere amount of fleet sales. they had less profitable components to the overall mick ford is the one. and gm is exsensitive, and it's relative value here. >> i agree gm is the one. i think they announced we are closer to a beat they talked about meeting the higher end of the range. and also for next year's strength for ford it is a little under. i mean at this valuation, i think gm is muchmer. they seem to have momentum also, they talk about trucks how important trucks are gm is an enormous truck push. casino stocks are soaring. traders will weigh n. i'm melissa lee, you are watching

"fast money. here's what else is coming up on fast snoetd breaking up is hard to do ♪ ♪ >> but a break up could not mean anything good for shareholders we'll explain. >> bitcoin getting bashed again. now a top strategist says it could lead to selling in the stock market he will be here to explain why, when "fast money" returns. when a critical patient is far from the hospital, the hospital must come to the patient. stay with me, mr. parker. the at&t network is helping first responders connect with medical teams in near real time... stay with me, mr. parker. ...saving time when it matters most. stay with me, mrs. parker. that's the power of and.

woik to "fast money. crypto currency prices tanked after officials reiterated that a crack down on trading was

possible bitcoin losing almost 20% since the debut. cue the bitcoin bug. our next guest says beware chris harvey is the head of equities strategy at wells fargo securities and joins us here on set. great to see you. >> great to see you, too. >> institutional investors are not invested in bitcoin and there is hardly any leverage in the antibiotic coin market. >> it is becomes fans 101. what you have is a risk on situation. today we had a risk off situatio situation. today we had cryptedo selloff, a market reverse and a high yield. that's it. >> do you think the investor in the crypto market is feeling the

same thing as a market investor. >> we could argue about what degree, what beta that is or what time period but they should be all related that's that we are seeing. >> couldn't they be different investors groups retail frenzy in crypto. in fact it started selling off a week ago. >> if we talk -- let's take another example. let's look at the rates market if rates go down, should dividend yield or bond proxies go higher? usually we see that. the two don't invest together but it's similar everything is approximate, and everything is a baito on everything else. what we just saw was risk off. it's across therd bo i doesn't just happen in one spot it's not in a vacuum this was a bit of a spillover and something we have to look at and look forward to. >> it sounds like there is a hunch on your part

is there a correlation. >> on december 22nd we saw crypto currency sell of, the equity market got soft within that we saw technology selloff. within that, semiselloffs. what did cici today. if you ask around, guy, you may know, if you ask people, they didn't point to any particular story. they say it's technical, it's this, people say -- well, the market, it's tied -- [ no audio ] -- this is what you should expect. >> my question is, and we have talked about this. i don't know the answer. but is the euphoria of crypto currencies over the last month, is that somehow potentially emblematic of an equity market top or near term top >> people talk to us about euphoria and sentiment and so on and so forth the biggest thing that we see is fear there is two types of fear fear of missing out. and people don't have a fear of a downside when we talk to clients they don't want to derest, they don't

want the raise cash. they don't want to miss out. that fear is palatable the second thing is we haven't seen a downside. people forget there is a downside i think what we are seeing is repricing of risk. a healthy repricing of risk are. what ear seeing now is equity markets moving higher and volume moving higher. we think that's healthy. what we are seeing is central banks starting to pull back. now equity markets and fixed income markets have to stand on their own and fundamentals are starting to take place to us this is a part of the process, a healthy process. >> a cryptoff sell off and a market softening couldn't it be coincidence as opposed to it being a correlation? >> it can be we are going to watch -- >> instid stead of saying i'm worried about a crypto currenty implosion affecting the currency markets because i don't have they are the same or driven by the same markets. >> they are not the same but if you have risk placed very

aggressively you should have it in other parts of the marketplace. we saw returns to risk factor is very, very strong. we don't want to say we are going to avoid the whole situation. it's nothing what we want to do is better understand what's going on, the size of the market, the liquidity of the market. what we are seeing, it as it gro hes it becomes a bigger liability. we can debate about the beta, about the length, but really, there is an influence. now the question is, we'll watch it going forward and we'll see if it was just an accident or if there is a connection. >> you wake up in the morning, an equity strategist but get on the phone with your clients, talking to him, what are you looking at, yields or crypto currencies and what they are telling you. >> everything. yields, yields curve, looking at the credit curve, looking at earnings we are looking at the crypto currency market and how it's trading. is there a correlation is there a connection? is it rolling over. >> you don't know yet is what

you are saying >> i cannot guarantee. >> it you are not saying that the market rally f there was a bitcoin or a crypto implosion that the markets will go down and feel the impact? because what we don't know -- >> we don't know but we would expect that to occur. today that did occur we will watch it going forward so we don't think it's -- we think there is something to this so it's important for our clients to understand, and we don't want our clients to wake up one day and realize, hey, my portfolio is more correlated to the crippo markets than i thought. that's a difficult conversation, a difficult thing to occur it is a very fluid situation we are watching it we don't want the overstate it but don't want the put our head in the sand. and we think it's important to understand it more and more as we go forward because it is a fairly big liability. >> got it. chris, harvey at wells fargo what do you think. >> i get what chris is talking about as far as risk on, risk off. you talked about correlation versus causation i think you have to treat

everything as its an individual entity i think that bitcoin will take the overall market down. about you i get the risk appetite element to it. >> you >> i think there is correlation on the way up, on the way down no, i don't think there has to be i think you have a lot of weak hands in bitcoin those are the guys that came in late in the game and the people that are step out. there are people that have been players and advocates the whole way. i think they will hold in. but a lot of people had the fomo. >> look at that bug. >> where >> under 10,000 on the bitcoin bitcoin itself broke $10,000 the futures contract also as you would imagine, below 10,000. should we be worried in tomorrow's session about this reversal taking new steam? >> in terms of bitcoin currencies or the equities. >> equities, are they on the hoff here. >> i would pull back and i think tim is saying this as well, i

don't think crypto is big enough to be systemic for the equity market >> crypto, in the top five, lost $105 billion today >> the top five currencies. >> right out of hundreds. i think there is something to it i think there are a few different holder bases of crypto currencies i'm one of them. i have a lot of equity exposure and a very small amount of crypto exposure. >> seeing this decline does it make you want to pull in your horns on the equity portfolio? >> no i'm just there for the long term. i think i'm unusual in that. i think there is going to be a correlation here that's okay. there is lot of volatility in crypto, for sure. >> yeah. >> i think -- i think that was the main driver today, actually. >> interesting we shall see still ahead, as the dow soars to new heights, its oldest pony component, general electric, is. >> at thatting could be on the verge of a break

up what that means for shareholders. casino stocks have been some of the hottest trades over the last year. we will ll y iteouf traders are buying this of mo. much more "fast money" after this

welcome back to "fast money. breakups are never any fun talks of a split at ge sent the stock tumbling today morgan has more on the developing story. >> reporter: that's right. je announcing it will take a

$6.2 billion for its legacy insurance portfolio and setting aside money to invest in capital over the next seven years. john flannery saying he is seriously considering a breakup of the blue chip company >> as i look at the company and continue to evolve along this continuum, i believel there could be different structures that can achieve all of those objectives, and that we need to examine those. so i don't -- you know, i would categorize it as an examination of options and it's the kind of thing that could result in, you know, many, many different permutations, including separately traded assetsings really in any one of our units if that's what made sense. >> while flannery has stressed every option is on the table, he has done that before, those comments mark the first time he has explicitly said that ge, including power, aviation and

health care could be spun out into separately traded assets. flannery also saying that the quote real core approach here is to make sure these businesses are flourish in the decades ahead. all that said, a breakup has not been fully decided those sources say the company is likely seen as embracing the idea an update on this is likely in the spring meantime, q 4 earnings come next wednesday. the stock falling 3% today because analysts say that with all the liabilities on ge's balance sheet and new charges announced today a breakup right now could signal that things have the potential to get worse if they were to do that right now. back over to you. >> thank you morgan brennan. tim, i go to you you bought ge, did so of the parts analysis does your view of the sum of the parts or view of the parts change based on the news today >> what changes potentially today is the uncertainty around the ge capital and insurance

liabilities and what reserves will have to be. that's what this is about. when they start saying this, it sounds wishy-washy to me we may have to start to sell off businesses but ge has done very parly in the past on identifying and having a vision on ge capital's responsibility to the overall structure. they have been terrible. it's one of the reasons why they are ultimately going to be -- they took this book down and selling it off today doesn't make me feel good. the up is of the parts is interesting when you start talking this way i think baker hughes is worth more than it was three months ago and some of these power aspects are attractive. >> guy, i know you remember this very well. >> civil war. >> besides that, more recently in history, when john flannery gave his interview with david faber and then they had an investor meeting it seemed like the news was uneve. investors arer of a certain mind-set and something else comes up

>> crops up. like this charge today. >> the earnings report, and then the springtime update. what do we know. >> i think to tim's point it doesn't make tim as a holder of the stock feel any better. i look of the alt the following way, some of the parts, maybe it's worth more than $18 i don't know ge aviation is an incredible business, as is its health care and baker hughes is wrgt more than it was three months ago but what do you pay for a company that has basically no earnings growth in an environment where they should be crushing it i go back. i think it is still expensive. >> health care and aviation should be knocking it out of the park in theory on paper based on -- >> don't you think though that he is just doing a public trial about lab effort here? i think he is trying to be very forthcoming, trying to be very honest i think he is honest, not trying to be honest about you the fact that the stock didn't pop

i don't think that the ceo is convinced at what he want to do with the company nor should the investors be. ic the price action today was very telling in the name that it did not pop. >> but a ceo coming out and saying, not definitively, hey we have looked at our businesses these two looked very interesting, or at least in the last six weeks since i've talked to you we have got three concrete conclusions we want to draw, and they are the following. we didn't get that today we got a guy saying in a new tax environment where these guys have to put more reserves back he is almost warning people things are not what they said. >> back in november when things looked better than they do today, callan's report says sum of the parts is 11 to $15, according to their analysis. which it could be below where it's trading right now >> to me, the first part, the charges, you know, that made me feel like wow, did they not have quite a handle on it, did this come up as a surprise?

that feeling, wow, wouldn't they have been digging through everything for the last several months and this just came up now? that makes me think maybe we have got to dig in deeper on everything else and see what do we have here. >> despite the selloff, some options trade remembers bettingan a rebound for ge what did you see, mike >> we did see over two times the average daily options volume in ge today the most active option was the january 18 1/2 calls those expire this coming friday. about 25,000 of those trait .12. these are traders making inexpensive bets ge covering the losses they had earlier this week. the prifs option is very close to the one year high now options traders making trades in both directions are expecting it to be a bupy ride. >> mike coe out in austin texas.

he's on 5:30 p.m. eastern time. >> still ahead, a roller coaster ride tins. we saw it dip below 10,000 and surge in the final minutes but ypere is something no in the crto occurrencesy stock that could put an end to all this we will explain after this u tra. i'm not really a wall street guy. what's the hesitation? eh, it just feels too complicated, you know? well sure, at first, but jj can help you with that. jj, will you break it down for this gentleman? hey, ian. you know, at td ameritrade, we can walk you through your options trades step by step until you're comfortable. i could be up for that. that's taking options trading from wall st. to main st. hey guys, wanna play some pool? eh, i'm not really a pool guy. what's the hesitation? it's just complicated. step-by-step options trading support from td ameritrade

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webb to "fast money. is the next catalyst for bitcoin about to hit the market? maybe so block chain efts are bubbling up hey bob. >> yes and no. melissa. there was a huge backlog of about it coyne themed efts in

registration but they have disappeared. two new block chain efts are posed for tomorrow they are designed to benefit from the block chain henomenon invest oars are clamoring for a way to benefit from the block chain phenomenon but there haven't been opportunities. that's been a big problem. the reality shares next jen kmee eft that's trading tomorrow. that's going to increst in smp and hitachi. but block chains aren't the prime airy business of any of those companies so it's unlikely to have an back on bitcoin ventures or volatility five eft companies have withdrawn their bitcoin eft applications in the last week. now, these ooechlts would have owned bit coyne outright for

bitcoin futures. and several had bit coyne eft long and short plays on the bitcoin. but the firm said the filings were withdrawn at the request of the sec. in september they asked several firms to withdraw their applications until futures started. after the futures started trading, they resubmitted the applications now they are asking them to withdraw it again. the goal changing but the theme is the sec is concerned about liquidity and valuation. in other words eve with futures contracts the sec is worried about the big price swings and the volume of trooed trading we saw that today. you see where we are ending out here with bitcoin. >> i think you should do ale of your reports with the music behind you. >> it's like is the 85 in here. it's like we are at the limelight downtown. >> what a reference. you speak from experience, i think. >> i withdraw that statement i withdraw that. >> it's already done

bob, thanks. our next guest is no stranger to the eft space as he helped launch and develop more than 60 of them. his block chain ooechlt, the first of its kind is set to launch tomorrow. christian lagoon joins us. this is the first actively managed eft. there is a passively magged eft that will also launch tomorrow but we are talking about the actively managed one when i first heard this, i haught thought how can that be there around that many block chain companies out there. when i looked at your holdings, block chain is not the primary driver of any of these companies for the most part. why launch an eft now? >> we think the block chain technology is going the transform the leaders in investment and research into this technology. melissa, we are trying to skate where the puck is going to be in the future so we are looking at that

investment and research as leading indicators of who is going to win that disruptive race much like investing in the early days of internet technology would have led you to companies like amazon. >> right you have got citigroup up there. i get that company, a financial services company will be using block chain in the future. to use your analogy, i don't know, it would sort of be like investing in, you know, an underwriter ahead of the internet boochlt i don't get the direct correlation there i mean,city you are going the look at it and it's going to trade on trading revenues and this and that and not block chain or its investments in block chain. disagree with i in the sense that citigroup is one of the five largest investors in block chain technology in the world. if and when they monetize some of that investment and make that announcement, whether it is a business line a spin-off, an ipo, i think they will monetize, and you will see it in their stock price. so we think that getting in early in these companies,

granted it's not as pure as we'd like, but we have taken an active approach to adjust the investment strategy and the universe of companies as the industry matures and we think this is a better idea than buying maybe a privately offered security that's working on block chain or making a button one or two companies. we think the diversification makes sense. >> how much due diligence does your team do at amplify to make sure this is not a company that's simply sticking block chain in their mission statement or block chain on their name >> that's a great point. it's one of the reasons we didn't want to go with an index we think index rules can be fooled and you can see some of these block chain companies in name only. we have qualification standards. and then there is a portfolio management team that is looking at the news, looking at the company business plan as it relates to block chain so we don't get caught in those traps. again, that's why we think actively managed is the responsible way, in the eft rssis abouted in block chain. >> within the call picks it is

not a perrage of revenues derived from block chain technology or percentage of refuse yous derived from block chain savings or anything like that this is a call taillightive assessment whether or not she is companies should be considered block chain companies? >> yeah it is really a relative comparison we are investing in the leading companies in terms of research and development, in terms of public and private investment and in terms of current refusee knew coming in these are the leaders in those categories again, we think that's a leading indicator of the companies that are going to monetize block chain going into the future. but right now there didn't a basic or 50% or 70% hurdle that the company has to meet. >> christian lagoon, that eft will be blok actively trading eft launching tomorrow. >> i could see the overstock being the play on block chain.

i think the big problem for chris and this eft sthal i don't think people differentiate between the coins and the technology it could be a head wind. even though the technology is going that way, it would be flavor of the month. >> christian has been doing this a long time. i'm sure they have done it with a little of transparency investors are trying to extrapolate who is going to be a player tomorrow. we have seen what happened with square stock it would be good for these guys to say the blended average revenue they are getting across the space is 11% or something. because i think it's important to have hard data to really determine who is in that space but ultimately that's where investors want to figure out who is doing the most. >> would you be interested in buying this eft? >> me personally, no if you are looking for beta play, astk is probably the way

to do it. >> up next, final trade. let's begin.

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welcome back to "fast money. we asked you on twitter how are you trading in the bitcoin blood bath 45% said you are buying the dip. cue the music, having the time of your life time forthe final trade. tim. >> talk about u.s. banks european banks areup cheaper ubs looks attractive. >> karen. >> also outside of the united

states, eem, and kudos to geno. >> unh, great chart, great performance year to date take a look at it. >> i think ford's guidance points out what karen and ti my mission is simple, to make you money i'm here to level the playing field for all investors. there's always a bull market somewhere, and i promise to help you find it. "mad money" starts now hey, i'm cramer. welcome to "mad money. welcome to cramerica other people want to make friends. i'm just trying to make you some money. my job is not just to entertain but to educate and teach so call me at 1-800-743-cnbc or tweet me @jimcramer. >> even after today's brutal