news. >> avocado toast. >> square says $6.78 national average price of avocado toast >> travel around find it cheaper. >> my next -- the take on the next avocado foeft is breakfast bull zblools breakfast in a bowls. >> different than cereal >> we've run over time my apologies "fast money" begins now. >> i love bowls who doesn't layoff love a bowl overlook new york city time zwar seem steerm cartinger werth. guy adami tonight on fox snap stock looks like it's disappearing plunging to a low after a top analyst ripped the social media company apart we will tell you what was in the report that had investors ghosting the stock plus ben bern naeng speaking out ever after the kriez and guy adami has choice words for the federal reserve chair you won't want to miss start with apple launching a

crop of new iphones a new version of the apple watch and software upgrades. josh lipton is at apple headquarters in cupertino. >> melissa three knew iphone models to choose phillip listen to apple ceo tim cook on stage behind me talking about the new phones. >> it's clearly the best lineup we have had by far taking the breakthroughs of iphone x even further than before and making them available to even more people. >> reporter: so apple is now going to sell the iphone xs and the iphone xs max. .'07.8 and 6.5 inch oled dplas max starting at $1,099 apple introduce agnew third model, 6.1 inch lcd display

starting at $749 a few take aways one is clear that apple is targeting a broad range of consumers and markets. two, clear, the the camera is where the battle are battleground seems to be and three the question is the dmeld device going to win over consumers? apple is clearly going after different markets and consumers. you see three new models at the high end, different specs and pricing. there are tech analysts saying if you want to keep the franchised franchise the stable growing in the low to mid-single digits you should be offering different consumers to different consumers. they are trying to reach more with the devices two it's interesting how much time was aspen on the camera apple's fill schiller took the stage. spent a lot of time on the camera and the updates coming to the phones apple promising better photos than ever. rivals are spending a lot of time money and effort on the cameras. it seems the tech companies

believe the kwaerm is a feature as important as a lot of other features that people look for like displays and batter life. apple saying the watch has multiple missions yes there to connect to friends and family, yes to help you keep feet. but the core of the feature presentation today on the watch was clearly positioning the device as a dmeld dpts with features and tools to for example detect irregular heart rhythms. fda approval come to features. the question, is that a selling point for most consumers out there. >> josh thanks >> so did apple impress today? guy. >> well obviously it's lost on me i think everybody came away the camera was the big deal. on the health care front for somebody like at an age where you have to worry about some things happen. >> if you fall for instance it. >> fall and i can't get up and wearing the thing around your neck i have an apple instead of a door which for me is easy to do

as far as the stock it's under welcome. jim cramer says don't trade apple just own it. that's a way to play it. the other side of the coin is if 240 is sort of the upper end of the target based on valuation, they are going to earned $13.44 next year. 18 multiple gets that you price. do you want to risk the upside of 6.5, 7% for potentially a downside to 180? i think there is a kmans in this environment especially if the rhetoric with china heats up you're seeing the 180. you have to ask, do i want to hold up the 240 or willing to take money off the table and buy it back cheape >> in terms of products we don't need a batch of consumer to buy the phone. we need the current customers to refresh. revenue continue to grow which had will and average selling prices going higher. >> the good news is the xs versions and the offering the biggest iphone ever. that's helping asp if there is a mechanic i know there is thought there is

tremendous pentup demand for phones in asia we no he what happened the last time they introduced a plus cycle. that was good for them i will tell you this, i think the lineup is very confusing there is a lot of different phones and price points. it's hard to get a sense how to difference them. if you think about how the company will guide for the holiday quarter you have to go back to when they introduced the phones in september they released on the x version in november and. >> sloppy. >> sloppy. and they're doing the same thing now. the xs is going on sale next week or it's delivered on the september 27th or so and then the other one one the one they are excited about, the xr lower price goes on sale a month later. in the near term you will have a lot of goofy stuff people gaming what unit sales are like we won't have a sense until late january. >> this product spoik, the new release cycle is like last year i don't think all that much is built into the stock stock ran 20% off the earnings it ran off earnings and

services good for you dan you've been pointing out a long time the skews and at some point that's confusing. you're at least consistent on that and i think you're largely right. except for the fact that they are now going for really everybody. so they continue to get bigger faster strong. there are people always sfending the extra money. you get 512 gigs on the news phones and everything. you get the stronger case, bigger they are trying to compete in emerging markets having a lower price phone offering all the bells and whistles is great i'm surprised you dant didn't talk about the watch because ufbl very i think positive on the wind chill i have to say that not just guy. i think there are people that want the functions there is a lot of people that want to know the afib concerns might be and i think people are based to embrace apple, unlike other companies. >> it sounds great but it's only 4% of the revenues last year. >> go ahead. >> before -- just on the watch i think this is the killer app for

the watch. it's fda approved. if can you get a subsidy from insurance companies, that's where this thing could take oh off. that's all i want to say. >> or buy it with fsa dlarps. >> you decide levels that are not good in terms of the asymmetry. 240 versus downside of 180 what we know is that the stock -- we might have a chart here on the screen the stock at one point last week was trading 25% above the $150 average. every time that happened over the past five, six seven years eight years it's packed backed away that's the bottom panel of that two-panel chart you see there. and that's exactly what's happened again this time so -- and the 240 you cite, that's higher than the 45 analyst that ever could it their price target is 224. it is asmrkle. and there is downside risk. >> i'm looking at your chart and the pullback getting to the level on the 150 seems like it

hasn't been anything substantial. so that pullback i realize it runs out of gas. but it hasn't necessarily dsh those haven't been big pull barkers. >> at peak to trough the last six eight sekss is 5.5% typically those are 10%ers it's not about the downside it's about does it have a lot of intermediate upside. that's the main message. >> here is the question i want to ask. >> would you rather? >> no, no, i'm asking one question because everybody has the iphone we all have iphones here on the devg >> i'm charging now now with who i apple charger. >> flip phone. >> is apple be valued more like a consumer staple. >> of course. >> yes >> then apple stock should be higher if you look at color ox and compare the pe of color ox versus apple color ox's pe 23 apple is 16.5. >> consumer products company mask raiding as a.

there is no question that's the whole point. that is the watch is going to get people further tied into the ecosystem. yes consumer products. >> go ahead. >> just really quickly we stalk about staples, the valuation, a lot of that has to do with the yield and the defensive nature that over time that has proven to be the case when you think about hardware businesses there's never been a hardware business that's able to maintain the margins they had had -- that company has 90% of the profits of the smartphone business globally. so you know that is one of reasons why in thing is trading at a discount to many of the peers, many other industries that have similar sort of monopoly sort of characteristics stleeft on the high end smfrp. that's one reason that holds back on the valuation front. one reason why you never see it trade 18, 19, 20 times. >> never >> never. >> guy. >> 1.45, 19 is the top end but 23.5 where color ox is i don't see that type of valuation unless you see something ridiculous in the broader market

which i don't think any of us thinks it happening. the 240 level given next year's earnings puts you at about 18 or so multiple. that's sort of the top end of the range. >> for whatever its worth on a trailing last 12 months at 19.5 with the cash. that's actually good news. that's the good news for shareholders because when this traded at 12 times x cash people were like it's cheap we're going higher on multiple. >> the next guest says there is significant upside on mum lou ventureses. >> so based on what we know gene and based on modelling in terms of how many units sold for each skews what do you think average semg price also do compared to right now? >> melissa, that's the really substance. you hit it there with the asps of what happened today it wasn't about features or the number of products it really was revealed to us after the ended and we started to go through the buying pages and look at what they are charging

they introduced nine new phones above the average phone price for this year. and what that means is we modelled this out for fiscal 19 for next year. it became progressively clear to us that these numbers are going high higher and potentially much higher let me put it in perspective our revised asps mid-for iphone is shh $791. the street this morning was at $765 but it was difficult to get it below 80 oh dollars. i was recommendnessing back to covering apple five years ago reporting the quarter and give low guidance in how difficult it was at to a times to get the model as conservative as they were pushing us to i had some of the flashbacks as we worked on the model this afternoon. s in a big deal. and i think that's the true mastery of the event nine knew different skews. nine skews within that that are finding ways to increase asp. >> within the phone alone,

between, i wonder what do you model in terms of the uptake of the xr versus xs and the x max as a consumer you might opt for the lower priced xr instead and that could depress asps overall. >> that's what crazy about how the higher asp we talked about i want to go into some of that the max again three products within that are about 12%. we think about 15% of those are going to come from the xs. so slightly different number but the real product i think is going to be this r version and we expect 34% to come from that. if we put it all the together it maps out to a similar percentage of iphones that come from the latest line every year it's just above 50% tp it maps out historically but in order to get the asp below $800 we had to have that massive apgs adoption of the rp i think the r is the home run

that's the correct way to model it but i think that is really the depth of the -- of the opportunity here around sasps between it a home run r it sets up as an asp of the next few quarter zblas gene wherefore the last couple years there's been talk about the upgrade supercycle and it's been elongated. there is not a ton of innovation i know some of the stuff is better but it's not huge innovation at morgan stanley says there are millions of high ponies older. but they're not growing year over year. help us understand at some point are going to start like losing units? >> some point they will. it's probably five plus years away when some form of a wearable comes out i think that was another take away today is ar is not advancing as fast as apple would like there needs to be some sort of wearable that's a different discussion. but in the current world of

smartphone you should expect the iphone to be 0% 5% unit growth not exciting opinion the smauder sprrch o smartphone market is declining. fractional market gains. the reason is moves higher -- when you talked about the multiples earlier. -- i'm in melissa's camp that has multiples of higher than 20. if you take a approach of stable zero to 5% iphone unit growth and even isp improvements but stable asps that along along with services are enough for investors. even the big picture here, dan, is even in a great growth market i think they can grow the iphone in the low single digit number. >> gene, always great to speak with you thank you. >> thank you >> gene munster of lieu ventures >> despite the move this is one of the times i feel comfortable staying on the stock especially in a market that i'm less confident on frankly

and so what these guys are talking about really no one is overly critical it's about being taqle. i've been tactical over the years and frankly i left a lot on the table. >> does apple look any better in terms of the chart. >> put it this way if you looked at a relative performance, it basically made no progress in eight, nine years and this last three or four months has broken out above the relative peak. so that extent you could say this is the beginning. but day to day where money is made and lost it's my judgment that it's a bet of ahead of itself. >> none of what we said was indictment of apple. if we said buy it then we'd have 17 minutes of dead aaron tv. that's not good for anybody. we try to point out if you don't want to be tactical. zwrim cramer says all the time own it don't trade it. if you feel this is an opportunity i do think to contractor's points it's gotten ahead of itself maybe 7% upside

to 240 the down side is 180, 185. >> good luck with the ekg. >> you get old ner life and you have to do this. you'll get there some bay are day wisen heimer >> and they're the basically the same age. >> to your valuation point -- this would be the best story -- i know there is a lot of analysts how do you value a recurring revenue stream you attach a monthly fee for hardware, take the asp out of it in a way you we know the ultimately the hardware they are going the r route, the lower end phone. people will think about the higher end phones like a laptop. you don't replace them every three or four years or so. to me i think if you could have an apple prime lump a lot of services, music, icloud. >> a membership. >> that's the sort of thing that people would start saying that's how you revalue this company up. because revenue peruser would be the highest on theant plan

sfwleet that's an interesting thought, dan did i say that surprisingly coming up something has to give. u.s. markets hang tough. but asian markets getting crushed. how will it end? the chart master has one interesting theory plus snap shares plunging. the top analyst slashes his target on the falling social media stock. is it time to ghost the stock. >> guy adami steaming mad over something former fred chair said you won't believe what it is more "fast money" right after this >> announcer: this cnbc program is sponsored by allegrad at fidelity, our online u.s. equity trades are just $4.95. so no matter what you trade, or where you trade,

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>> hit the pause button here i guess the interesting comparison would be to the twitter. we saw twitter as one of the first peer plays after facebook who was an upstart this is a company literally -- snap has two times the daily active users in the u.s. that twitter has. and yet twitter is you know obviously turning a profit here on adjusted basis. they have grown sales faster than most companies we have seen go from zero to $2.5 billion so the problem with snap is they haven't figured out how to montize the user base. we saw this for twitter. it was trading in the teens and this then they figured it out. sat palm point they are turning it on. i don't know if they can do it by themselves. >> we saw facebook facebook wasn't able to get up but then finally did this is not showing the life it needs to where at this point twitter started to recover and facebook as well. this is taking too long. >> facebook wsh -- social media is not doing well anywhere right

now. the stock i think is underperforming because frankly if you can't outperform facebook in an environment where facebook to me is existentially challenged it's a tough time second quarter were down 3%. first contraction ever major executive losses the they are better and more profitable remember when twitter started flat lining and flipping a bit on the dau group took the market a linc time to care about the profitability. >> and greenfield points out they burn cash if they need to do a capital raise and the stock is trading the way it is it's harder to do. >> in my opinion -- we have said this -- listen i'm not the demographic clearly. i don't have the. >> with the big tongue >> it's our kids with we all have kids. but they're not. >> he is on it all the time. >> they're in the spending the money they need to make a difference the demographic doesn't work at a certain point they figure it out do you want to play stock

market i don't think so. >> there it is there you are. >> that's not me, tim. >> that's andy. >> that's not -- that's dsh zbloosh do you use it. >> facebook went after these guy base a year ago with the stories and they just killed it. they killed it and i have a 13-year-old and 15-year-old daughter that's the demographic they are using snapchat increasingly less every day. and instagram is the thing this is all about facebook even though facebook not particularly doing well. >> anyway options traders see more declines ahead what are you looking at >> interesting price axe today or options being put volume is two times that of calls. a lot of closing call sales. people monthizing what could have been pejs or bearish puts there was a trade that caught my eye. accumulation of october 8 puts about 8500 traded for 0 cents. eye o a bit of lottery here but playing for a move back below -- making new lows down at 70, 80 this can be a cheap way to stay in your name at least on premium

terms if you are long on the stock or just trying to hang in there a little bit. >> and just from dsh wsh -- we know a break out the is a stock contends with a former high and exceeds and broke out is a getting to away former law it broke and dropped today break out break down goes on all the time presumptive more to go. >> very oa. >> is oa in action. >> it's oa in action. >> when it's good. >> as is the full show which you can catch friday at fierpt p.m. eastern time up next a monster hurricane. florence is approaching and might wreak havoc in the east coast, the southeastern east coast. we will bring you the latest first in business worldwide. in the meantime here is what else is coming up on fast. >> announcer: now actually it's to shares of pot stock but pot master tim seymour says it's

time to take profits plus bernanke, adami, two men, one beef and a rant that could go viral and that's when "fast money" returns. oh, and there's the closing bell. >> announcer: options action is sponsor by think or swim by td ameritrade days a week. that's amazing. it's a pretty big deal. so i can trade all night long? ♪ ♪ all night long... is that lionel richie? let's reopen the market. mr. richie, would you ring the 24/5 bell? sure can, jim. ♪ trade 24/5, with td ameritrade. ♪

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welcome back to "fast money. age j markets getting crushed having the longest losing strategic in over a daek let's get to bob at the new york stock exchange hey, bob. >> the long emerging market he will era sell off getting close to end sng cnbc confirmed the united states is in the early stages of proposing a new right now of trade talks with china in the near future. now that's helped sentiment. but it's been a nightmare for overseas investors in the last few months particularly asia what do we have? we have a rising dollar. we have trade and tariff car row wars throw in countries like turkey with high government and correspondent debt levels, much of it denominated in dollars ouch you have a perfect storm for a

bear market in emerging market equities in fact, what china shanghai market 30% off its 52-week highs it hit in january. honk oenga 52% off turkey is 24%. philippines close down 17% indonesia and korea also off their highs by double digits now, the barmg msci asia-pacific index which excludes japan fell a 10th straight day. it's ugly you but not unprecedented a after the financial crisis emerging markets general i outperformed the u.s. market for years. but that changed about 2014, late 2015. that was another bad year. that was when the china boom lost some of the luster. they went up and down. still the performance gap is unusual. look at the numbers. asia certainly cheaper and oversold and all of the things being equal, we may be near a bottom but that's the all other things being equal whether it's worth buying asia and emerging markets on a mean

reversion trade depends on your view of other things, like the dollar and on trade and particularly the later performances of the u.s. markets later this year. so if the u.s. stock market sees any notable drop in the next few months, that will certainly create a risk off environment in other markets in all the emerging market stocks could fall more. look at the outperformance here of the u.s. markets versus those emerging markets this is a tough call about whether this is the typo time to buy back to you. >> thanks, bob >> kmart master at the plasma saying there is pain ahead for asia what are you seeing >> looks that way. i first want to talk about the whole concept of why 20% is not a bear market. this is the shanghai composite over the past -- well you can see 2003 to 2018 so think if we applied that rule i mean, that would then imply or be said that we had a bear market here. in 2004. then another one in 2009 then we had another one in 2011.

we had another one and then we hit another one. that's patently ridiculous yes? in fact, we go to the next screen it means these were all bull markets up 500% and then up 100% then 40 there have been bulow one bull, one bear, a second bull and bear let's look what with he know is this. this was essentially a bull market all through here to the peak, the commodity peak, this was a bear market. that this was a second bull. and that we are now in a second bear the 20% thing, non-sensical stay away from it more important how much worse could it get you draw a simple trend line my hunch is we come down and find this line. we have been here a few times. it implies another 6% to 8% could happen overnight this is a highly volatile thing. but emerging markets and shanghai specifically not good

>> should we invite carter back to the desk. >> yes yes. >> just kidding carter come on back tim what douse. >> i think bob and carter hit on important things if the u.s. has been flailing and i should -- the u.s. has been outperforming and if u.s. gives background it's not helping china and emerging markets they are selling off even more. they underperform on the do you understand relative to what they've done the bottom line is the i think the fundamentals don't reflect where i think the markets moved and you underperformed underunderperformed em to the s&p by 20% since april this is an extraordinary time. and i am and em longtime investor i am not running back to emerging markets bus i don't know the outcome of the trade war and because this is not a classic trade war and they are prbl all different this is really about china 2025 within and we are digging in a long time. >> am i allowed to ask carter a question since he we brought him

back sometimes that taboo. >> he is the guest. >> the protocol is different. >> anyway the question >> my question, what needs to give does the s&p need to give to the downside are you surprised we haven't seen a bigger selloff -- any sell off for that meter in the s.n.a.p. >> that's the great question when you have bifurcation. most have rolled over while the u.s. continues higher. financials have rolled industrials have vold and certain parts of the market. bifurcation almost always is resolved by the weak having a final capitulation low a dump in em and the strong oning succumb. we see that in apple and amazon. this is a normal conclusion and it should in principle be the same thing relative to the u.s. >> what's fascinating from an economic perspective is that no one is sitting here thinking this could be like the canary in the coal mine, that every major equity index outside of the u.s. is down on the year. and specifically the ones he we

are talking about have higher growth at a time we are so focused on printing two consecutive 4% gdp quarters when economists see dramatic slow down in the back half of the year or start of 2019. what about the equity weakness, what about the dollar staying firm it's not rallying now and some calling for it to go lower? what if we see a global slowdown a big part of the bull market in '15 and a16 was the recovered. we recovered maybe now we come back in globally and maybe these equity markets are telling us that and we are not paying attention. >> a lot of the equity markets are up in terms not in dollar terms. they are they are not going dounl but i agree with you i'm patching the pmis. we have negative 50 so contracting pmis in honk conand other parts of asia. concerned. >> the rally the cannabis stock is now 500% since the ipo but the move is tim seymour sounding

the alarm. he tells us why he is worried. hurricane florence fast approaching the u.s. and calling it a monster srmto we will go to the ground for the latest more after this. the nature of a virus is to change. move. mutate.

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money. the daunting image you see is hurricane florence from cameras on the international space station. look how big that thing is our contessa brewer is live in georgetown, south carolina waiting in the calm before the storm. contessa. >> reporter: it's a lot prettier view down here but a million people under evacuation orders in this area and united announced it's cancelling all flights tomorrow for the area airports. here at the port of georgetown, a historic harbor walk along the water front and a lot of the business has shut down entirely. in fact you see the tow boat u.s., this guy has ridden out a lot of hurricanes has towed five boats out of the way of any potential storm surge. he is riding out the storm to be available to do debris removal after the storm goes by. let's tell you about sochlt big business here. port of charleston will also close down tomorrow, won't reopen until sunday. and we know that boeing has sent 6,000 workers home to evacuate

bmw was moving thousands of cars out ahead of the storm trying to get them off dry dock before it's not so dry. and we watched that car carrier move off to sea heading toward the panama canal south to miss the storm entirely we also know there are automobile plants like mercedes-benz which just started manufacturing a sprinter model this month that has shut down. volvo just opened in june has shuttered the doors waiting for the storm to come in it's bad news for big business here in georgetown, international paper, liberty steel and csx all have big facilities here. but for now it's just basically a ghost town at this point one more note. look at the big box. lowes up 4.5%. home depot up 2.75 seeing movement because of the hurricane. >> thank you, constant aire. stay safe. what kind of impact to do we

expect from the hurricane. the big box stores jenner ac is another mover this week on the storm. >> home depot has a monster. but it's a monster prior to the storm. so i don't think anything is changing i don't mean to be glib. but obviously you get tail wind on the back of that. but if you want to talk about big box. comps up 6.5%. the street is lower. they beat on eps, beat on revenue, the margins hang there. and you have to ask, does target make sense close to 16 times when wal-mart is close closer to 19 just on valuation on this valuation makes sense. >> not about big box but the lumber futures in the cme no movement making new 52 week lows down to where they were in 2013. down 40% from the peak in may. you would expect a storm related bounce, nothing. >> again, what we see in lump are you ber and prices before

all this though was a lot of concern on trade and we've been hearing about this so you know if you look at the insurance companies, largely they are the uns that people point out how big of a loss. they have not been trading well period if you think they've got more room for exposure i'd say hartford is the most interesting because on a relative basis to chubb and travelers is trades cheap. they made a recent acquisition the navigator deals. typically these guys have underryan owe written and laid off a lot of the exposure. i think they are worth buying. >> when the retailer report you got to assume that they're going to site storm impact as a negative impact for stores. >> yes that's a great point. that's what i was going to add we have seen this during the past bad storm sins it's not great to be disrupt every in the holiday season depending how many we see how many different regions we see that's where we have seen the impact before. but it sounds like back to school got off to a good start. coming up, hot pot, the

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welcome back to "fast money. time for a buzz kill check out shares of goldman. just posted the longest losing strategic since going public in 199. it's the second worst performing dow stock of the year. what's wrong with goldman. >> they are getting away from proprietiary trading in a major way and focusing on fee-based businesses and frankly they are not getting the same multiple. i think goldman should be trading higher and price to book if you put at 1.8 multiple on the book value get about $$320 stock. but given the fact that they are getting away from core competency at least over the last ten years you have to wonder do they deserve the 19.8? i think they do. but the fact that now there is rumblings they are not getting into cryptocurrency, no bit askcoin desk they don't want to be in any business construed at risk

taking. >> is it specific to goldman morgan stanley is under pressure big asset manager and t. roe and back rock rolling over it's the problem that rates are stuck. and the operating businesses aren't what they could be. >> yeah, except for the goldman is underperformed the xlf. if you look at the peer group. us what is that? because the xlf -- it has money center backs this is guys point too goldman sachs is not only not what it used to be and. >> and can't be what it used to be. >> and can't be. but it doesn't have the same exposure to the economy that some of the other money center banks. the you guy you worked there do you think the culture is gone sflo that was defined goldman sachs. >> i was there a long time i'm old as i pointed out a number of times tonight and over the course of the few years. >> you interned for mr. goldman back in the day. >> funny you should say that and sachs we used to go to nathans as it turns out. >> anyway zbloots with that said, i would say there were

6,000 people in the firm now close to 40,000. you can't maintain a culture with that rate of growth. >> real quickly, the price action today in the whole group was horrible especially on a morning where citigroup cfo gave a mild boost to tagts. the opened up 3% close toorz the lows ever goldman trades horrible. jp morgan is one of the only major u.s. banks up on the year. that and bank america. a few% i think jamie dimon taking sights at the president. these make me less positive. the xlf at $28 look like a era looks like a clear hot to 26. >> would that keep you away from jp morgue zbloon maybe not because the outperformance -- just that in particular? but i think the whole group acts bad. >> the comments? >> the comments about running for president how he would fare in a toe to to toe battle. >> anyway, ten yeerps ago this week the financial crisis kicked into high gear and early yerl today cnbc andrew

ross sorkin interviewed former president ted geithner and ben bernanke at the brookings institute in d.c. to discuss how they handle the period and bernanke said something that guy got heated over. we thought it would be a perfect time for the game we call, not so fast. >> tell me the world's please. >> how it works to remind you we play a clip of the interview when guy adami heart's heart you jumps in and says not so fast. the interview stops. time stamp and guy drops knowledge about what bernanke is saying are you ready. >> i hope so. >> let's roll the tape >> it's not really a fair question obviously because we didn't let the students grade themtz usually. >> not so fast not so fast. stop it. why is it not a fair question? that is a fair question. this is -- remember the ben ten years after.

this is ten years after. i'd like to change the world as well that's one of the. >> i'd like to change the world. >> ten years after but it's a fair question because over the course of ten years you can absolutely go back and say i can grade what we did ten years ago. if it was ten minutes after it's not fair ten years after, absolutely a fair question. andrew ross sorg row sorkin spot on. >> my general sense you know, we didn't anticipate the full -- we all of us had various concerns about the financial system about the economy. none ever us anticipated the full ramifications and extent of the crisis and so in that respect we were late we then responded very aggressively. >> not so fast on the aggressively yes, they did respond very aggressively but at that point you have no choice it's when you choose to go to battle you do it all in. you're either all in or all out. they had to act aggressively to throw it in there there was no choice but to do what they did. my problem with them is not what they did it's the duration with

which they did it way too long in my upon. >> roll the tape. >> we were successful in stabilizing the financial system and there was paper here yesterday about comparing how quickly it happened at what cost how quickly the economy recovered and generally speaking we looked good compared to other advanced economies other countries that had crisis in the past i think where we didn't succeed obviously. and tim already alluded to that is that we didn't persuade the country generally speaking what we were doing was necessary. >> not so fast not so fast. >> i would push back and say where they didn't succeed is they didn't see where or they didn't realize or didn't bring out what the unintended consequences would be. one of the many unintended consequences in my opinion can be corporate governance in this country got lazy why because money was cheap they could borrow money cheap buy back the stock and didn't have to the focus on the core businesses >> is he talking about qe being. >> the problem was showing up a financial system in disarray.

>> they did that why stay with it ten years after. >> look at every other central bank in the wormed our fed is so much farther ahead. >> we shouldn't impair to other central banks in the world listen, again, you can't prove -- you can't -- it's counterfactual stuff hard to get into i happen to think if they stopped a year in weld be further along than we were continue to roll the tape. >> we believe it was and so that communication issue, i think, is still out there. but we did respond aggressively to the crisis itself and did bring it under control pretty quickly. >> you've been critical of mr. bernanke for a long time. >> you think i have been. >> for a long time. >> people champion he is the great hero of the 21st century listen the 21st century it's far from over. i think there is a chance he becomes one of the great villains of the 21st century for the things we are talking about. i don't think any of the problems of' 08 or 09 were solved. >> why would wouldn't you blame

yellen more than bernanke at this point. >> how does he win. >> he won the weekend they saved our way of living. that weekend and a few weeks after. then they could have gone into overdrive and ratcheted things back up in my opinion. >> but you had. >> their job isn't to save the markets. their job was to save the economy. two different things. >> not really because the -- they targeted the welt effect. >> the welt effect. >> and. >> 8% of the people in the country. what about the people on fixed income saw rates g go to zero what do you think they're saying >> that was pr probably chairman green span so much cancer in this country on the books of the private sector that needed to be moved over to the public sector. and ultimately i'm not sure what the fed should have done bottom line is we're till trying to remove that stimulus, guys. it's not easy. that's the problem this was the greatest scientific financial experiment of all time. >> we don't know how it's going to turn out. >> no. but top ripped the rug back from

under if anything bernanke was a student of history and understood the great kpr kbrepgs was formed because central banks didn't step in with enough liquidity and overwell the program. >> good argument good heated debate dan's not in it. >> guy guy's wrong and tim's right. >> that came out of the left field. >> that's a change. >> feels nice to be on dan's sides. >> the since the ipo has it gone to high too fast in the cannabis kweek. check out the cramer camera. you heard about the cloud kings but there is jim annointing the cloud princes. here is next in line to rule the throne find out at the top of the hour more "fast money" still ahead. .. it's kind of like playing your own version of best ball. because here, you can choose any car in the aisle, even if it's a better car class than the one you reserved. so no matter what, you're guaranteed to have a perfect drive.

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through internet essentials, comcast has connected more than six-million low-income people to low-cost, high-speed internet at home. i'm trying to do some homework here. so they're ready for anything. welcome back to "fast money. till ray shares on a tear jumping 10%. has it run too far too fast. tim seymour is over at the plasma when it's time to take profits in the pot stock. >> it has run too far too fast up 500% since the ipo? why? well there is the strategic dynamic. they have the great brands in the streep these guys have an international platform these guys have major private equity investors behind them that know how to work the capital markets. but the bottom line is the stock has gotten way ahead this is a short squeeze. if you ac look at the borrow on the stock it's 350%. which means it's going to be

impossible to put a short position on if you can get it. it's at 18% short interest bottom line that's also what's happening. i think this is a squeeze into options. this is not about fundamentals in fact what i worry about here is that while i think the industry is rightly evaluating where their strategic opportunities right now. there is a lot of both investors and brokers and people in the industry that are writing letters and trying to push stocks higher saying you're a company merge with these guys. you are not playing in what has been the bonnes aire i want to see the stock higher feels like jt marshal inif you know that reference. i think you have to be careful point out the chart. if you see the ipo this is the 500% move. let me clear that you have my goodness hard to see. bottom line what you can see is we have made that move this to me is where we have been essentially in euphoria land this to me which is somewhere around 62, $63 is fair value on the stock. and that's fair value based upon

production out three years on an sales. if you listen to vivian cal rain one of the great amounts she has a $62 target on stock. puts it in line with canopy, the grla in the room if you look at valuation that makes more sons but we have gotten frothy. >> thanks, tim up next, final trade you always pay your insurance on time.

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>> nagen. >> klf i'm a seller. >> guy. >> i got glaber casted >> are you calm now. >> flummoxed i apologize for that discovery communication. comes out discap see you backco >> all right i'm meliss "mad money" starts right now. my mission is simple to make you money. i am here to level the playing field for all investors. there is always homework and i promise to help you find it. m"mad money" starts now. >> hey, i'm cramer crum to "mad money." my job is to educate and teach you. so call me at 1-800-743-cnbc in this varmt it's a misleading