tv Fast Money CNBC June 18, 2019 5:00pm-6:00pm EDT
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that's why i feel since they didn't signal june and the market is not priced specifically for a june cut, it would be a surprise and very much a preemptive move for them to go. >> lay the ground work. >> as the press conferences go, this will be as tense one as they've have been. you can see it live on "power lunch" and "closing bell" tomorrow. >> we're out of you time today >> "fast money" begins right now. >> "fast money" starts right now. live from the marketplace, overlooking new york city time's square i'm melissa leader tonight facebook unveiling its highly anticipated cryptocurrency project libra and rbc's marc mahaney says it is a game changer for the stock taking a bit of a breather after hitting $200 a share today one top technician says the pair bolling stock has more room to run. we start with the market rally and -- everything is awesome. that's right trump's tweet saying he had a
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good call with chinese president xi, sending stocks up soaring. the s&p 5001 percent away from its record and this coming ahead of the fed's big decision tomorrow where inspectors expect doves to fly that's the question for tonight. is the fed about to release the doves and is everything awesome once again >> i love the chrissy teigen song. >> it is your ring tone. >> my ring tone. >> it is i looked at my phone when it started, i'm like, who is calling me at 5:00 i don't think everything is awesome at all if everything awesome, utilities wouldn't be making all-time highs. we wouldn't have 24% of global sovereign bonds with negative yields that's just my world through the price many of the s&p 500 everything is fantastic. you know, president trump could say whatever he wants, great call with president xi i'll say it again, i don't think we are closer to a trade deal with china now than we were six months ago i may be proven wrong in a week. it has happened before, but the fact that the market is here is all in the back of this hope that somehow the fed has our back, and i think it is madness.
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t if the fed were to emergency cut, i think it is madness at the highest level. >> if the fed doesn't deliver on any level, i don't know what happens. >> yes, there's a big risk the market has done a lot of the fed's work for it, right it priced in the cuts. yields are at lows i mean look at bond yields in the u.s., ten-year bond yields are the same as italy bond yields here. the world has gone side ways here that being said, if the fed doesn't come out with a dovish statement or a dovish kind of tone to it all tomorrow, i actually think the equity market is at risk because it is built on this assumption we are going to get more stimulus out of the federal reserve. >> so i think a fed that's preemptive and one that will be cutting tactically, which is not really in their mandate but they've done it before, is very good for equity markets. a fed that's actually reactive and needs to follow really where we're going on the leading economic indicator, business confidence, look at the new york fed yesterday which was lowest since october 2016, and it is closely correlated with the ism.
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so these are things that the fed would probably be saying, hey, this is a reason to move maybe tomorrow they're not going to move tomorrow, but i'm just telling you if they're waiting until july and possibly even september, that's a fed that the market doesn't like. so i would echo what's been said already, that markets have priced in the fed at this point. i think it is a little bit of a concern to think that the fed can give you more ammunition tomorrow, even though they do need to begin to kind of restate where they're going to be in july. >> it is going so far now there's a case being floated around there could be a 50-basis point cut in the offing and the last two easing cycles in '01 and '07 started with a 50-basis cut. why not this time around >> why not just go for it? i mean i don't know, if we don't get anything tomorrow i don't think that -- i think the market may be okay with that waiting to see. all right, well, in july if we don't get anything by then, that's very different. 50 basis points seem sort of aggressive to me in your dove's
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cry, people would party like it is 1999 and it may be 1999. >> nice. >> but i don't know. i got to tell you, i get why the market is up i get the tweet. i get the drahgi, you know, with that -- any time of -- no sign of improvement would be enough for them to do something, right? >> yeah. >> that's about as dovish as you can get without actually doing anything >> right. >> i guess they will so i get all of that, but i think the fed -- i mean let's see how earnings go. i think i see a headline coming out of u.s. steel right now. we are just getting into earning season to me i'm really concerned about not just second quarter but what companies think about the second half of the year i'm really concerned about that. i don't think a tweet is enough. i think a deal -- not even the hopes of a deal, a deal is enough. >> and that's actually what mario drahgi cited, was the uncertainty in the global economy is becoming a drag on the economy. and so that's what the federal reserve, that's what the ecb and the bankage pen are all dealing with to guy's point i'm not sure that monetary policy is the fix for
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this i agree. i think we need to see some concrete steps on a deal at the g20. otherwise i think it would be tough sledding for the market. >> it is interesting and we talked about it when president trump was candidate trump and he was elected. we said he will somehow use the federal reserve as a scapegoat if the market goes lower and he has set it up perfectly now. he is -- he has talked about it now for months think about tomorrow if the fed doesn't deliver and the market goes down. he has the perfect -- he has the perfect villain in this whole game. >> let me add to that. and that is that once again, you know, today the reports they're considering demoting chairman powell come out today, and tonight is a reelection rally for trump in florida he is candidate trump once again now, right >> uh-huh. >> i don't know if -- i'm not going to posit a conspiracy theory but i will put it out there. >> it is unbelievably coincidental. >> one more word too, i would say that tweet was very convenient. >> this is all about 2020, and president trump no longer
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candidate trump knows exactly what it is going to take it is going to take the market to be in the right spot in 2020, but in the meantime the pushback on china and guy says he doesn't think we get a deal, that's enormously popular in this country, let's be clear. although we're not a politics show i want to talk to you about where policy could be in short and medium term. the s&p is effectively at all-time highs the federal reserve, by the way, if anything look at market conditions, look at liquidity conditions and risk factors and others the market is giving the fed a lot of room to do almost nothing. when risk assets and the association between essentially household balance sheets and the market is what it is, the fed does not need to stimulate the market, brian talked about this, is doing the fed's work for them. >> could i push back on something you said >> sure. >> we haven't seen yet the second round -- or i guess it would be the third round of tariffs really go through, and i don't know how that resolve will hold up in the face of what will start to be, you know, prices that either companies can't absorb or that the -- or i
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know -- i know we're with billions in tariffs but let's say the consumer has to absorb it i don't know if the resolve will continue. >> well, agree with that i agree if we look back on the last 15 months the market never really recovered even though we haven't had the teeth of tariffs take hold yet and it has been about confidence, and ultimately it is a leading indicator whether it is businesses or consumers. yes, it is a fair pushback i'm not sure we can quickly flip a switch when it comes time and not have done irreparable damage to a fragile recovery. what i'm saying is i think the white house understands how important the market is to their reelection they know how many administrations before them have not been re-elected on the market and economy alone, nothing else, not policy people are voting with their wallets and therefore that's the back stop of investors right now. >> we have a loyal viewer base that watches every day. >> almost to a man and woman. >> devoted, yes. i'm going to marry with what we talked about yesterday's a block
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with what we're talking about right now. >> were you here >> i was here. >> we asked whether or not the market at these levels would, you know, which is higher -- >> i remember that one. >> straw trade or value trap and you surprisingly said it was a value trade. >> i did, i remember that. i started the show by saying you think you're in my head but you're wrong. >> do you still agree with that today? >> i do. >> you still buy into the market, 1% away from market highs? >> listen, the market has gone down over the years for many reasons, not least of which has been a forward multiple. it doesn't have to be an expensive market for the market to sell off. i think the least of the markets problem is a valuation that's expensive. i don't think it is, which is why i think the sa&p is a value trade. however, the other factors going on right now outweigh them all a 15 viks and s&p at an all-time high with people hoping there's a g20, china trade and hoping that the markfed is more dovisha they've been, you're in the deep
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end at this point. >> let me focus on the things that rallied today, that would be raw materials, right? commodities went higher. >> sold to you i think those are value traps. let's think about one of the reasons that people think commodities might go higher is you think the fed is going to cut rates and you get a weaker dollar i would say the dollar gets stronger if they cut the rate because the entire world is going to come in and buy u.s. bonds. that won't be good for commodities. one step further, it won't be good for multi-nationals take it to a third step here, for the s&p 500 we traded in a huge range but basically traded side ways. what catalyst is out there today that wasn't there yesterday that will break us out? i would argue we don't have a new catalyst in fact, the g20 meeting, why would the chinese at the g20 meeting come and say, hey, we're going the make a deal right now? why wouldn't they drag it out to the election >> it is interesting, the editor of the global times, who is said
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to have a link to the party. the she whisper said that the meeting at the g20 is at the request of trump and the united states just as it is positioned to have a leg up in the united states, china thinks the opposite. >> i know. the protests in hong kong are another way to believe xi wants to go into g20 with strive in his region, certainly in their area of domain back to commodity goes, copper is up over 2% today, and copper and oil had been taking a beatening. if you look at the bottom up of how some of the minors in iron, ore and copper have been run, the thing is if we're going to get stimulus in infrastructure, we get one belt, one road. iron ore provides above 100 are not going anywhere seen. i like steel not because i've been happy about steel tariffs because i thought the valuation
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of u.s. steel was -- and that was 30% ago. i'm wearing that one i have to like it here, and i do think that the inputs to steel ultimately are better for steel prices. >> well, everything may only stay awesome for a little bit longer as markets move closer to record highs our next guest says the gains are in for the year. let's bring in scott rents, senior global equities strategist at wells fargo. scott, great to speak with you last time we spoke was towards the end of may and you said you would buy the markets at that point. that was a great call. why do you think the gains are in for the year at this point? >> melissa, right now we tried to take risk out of the portfolios largely because if you look ahead it will rely on what -- you know, if we get any kind of trade deal the market will it take it as a positive but i think it is a big uncertainty. we don't expect a deal cummins ocummins -- coming out of the g20, maybe some happy talks and a handshake or two we think eventually there will
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be one, but right now -- and i will say this with the fed meeting tomorrow, you know, at 2:00 eastern time we're going to find out whether or not the market is counting on the fed cutting rates, because the dot plot is not going to jive with what is going on with the fed funds futures. it is going to disappoint relative to those fed funds futures. now, we've been talking to clients about, hey, you know, the market wanted to reassurance from the fed that is certainly what j. powell gave us. we would argue that the market is not counting on rate cuts we think there might be one this year we don't think they need to do it, but we'll see. tomorrow, 2:00, and for the two hours into the close after that, you know, you have some big-time potential here for a lot of volatility. >> so you think one cut this year what if the fed delivers two cuts this year does that leave some room to the upside in your view or no? >> i think it probably would but really importantly for us,
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at least in our opinion anyway, you know, you need some kind of trade progress to really get up above the old record high, which we're almost going to certainly test soon here the old record high, and to really stay above that so, you know, there's a long road to hoe i think before we see some kind of trade deal and, you know, i guess one thing we can say for certain almost is that these global central banks in a nine-month period of time have gone from playing hardball and talking about a lot of rate increases to being pretty soft and talking about easing, and some of them almost no doubt easing at some point >> let me ask you something. what would make you change your view and become more bullish again? you talk about possibly the fed already been in there for some, 25 basis points. would it have to be a trade deal that is sooner rather than later? >> i tell you, karen, that is really for us. you know, you could certainly argue -- we are staying here at
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neutral largely relative to strategic allocations but we are leaning sector wides we like industrials, we like consumer discretionary, we like technology those will do well under a trade deal scenario and really for us that's what we need, we need some kind of deal. does it need to be a perfect deal absolutely not does it neat to be a deal where you will strip away the tariffs that are in place and it promises to not add more i think that's the key to the whole deal so, you know, the market, really to be honest with you, probably would be happy if you went back to the status quo for the last 25 or 30 years it would take some uncertainty out of it, and the market would probably even like that. but i think we're probably going to get some kind of deal here. it is just not going to be a perfect deal but, like i said, in our opinion the market doesn't need a perfect deal. >> scott, great to speak with you. thank you for your time. >> all right thanks, guys. >> scott wren, wells fargo i think scott is 100% right. the market needs certainty there's too much uncertainty out
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there. some kind of incremental stat or some kind of idea that, hey, wait a second, there won't be any more tariffs, there be a bit of a ratcheting back i just have no confidence it is going to happen two weeks at the g20. that's why i think the market is extremely vulnerable here. >> what is incredible, the most uncertain we have been in quite sometime and here we are with all-time high on the s&p, it is madness if you think about it. again, the market is trading on positive things coming out again, you said it earlier we think as americans when a deal is made, ready to be made by president trump, a deal will be made. i understand why we would think that i'll push back and say if you are the chinese, if you take a step back, why would you make a deal at all at this point when you can string us out right into next year's election coming up, boeing flying high, the stock having its best day since january as it marks its first new order for the 737 max. is the worst over for the aerospace company? plus, the new cryptocurrency
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welcome back to "fast money" shares of boeing posting its best day since january after international airlines group, which is the parent of british airways, signed a letter of intent to purchase 200 boeing 737 max planes, ending a month long drought following the fleet grounding. this comes as boeing announced korean air decided to bay 37 dream liners for more than $6 billion is this a sign the worst may be over for boeing, tim >> every time boeing had a safety issue, and i go back to the software glitch of 2013, it kind of served its time and it is still doing that. i'm not saying we have all of the answers and i'm certainly not saying people shouldn't be pointing a finger at them trying to get all of the answers. whether it is the faa grounding them and ultimately coming back on line, eventually you get to the place where boeing needs to be boeing's biggest enemy. outside of this, boeing hasn't
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been it has been as well-run as any company in the world from an operational perspective, unlike boeing of other years. if you look where the stock defended this key level between 340 and 360, this news is very, very important for confidence. it doesn't solve all of the legal, but it does solve a lot of the confidence issues. >> erin, what do you think >> i sort of agree i think it is important. you can't help but -- if you are a ceo of a company and you see someone who would purchase planes and you see others who are doing it and you're not the first one and, you know, then you start to think, all right, maybe it is okay to put a toe in the water, and that sort of breeds confidence among other potential buyers. >> right. >> so maybe the bottom is in i think there's still issues about boeing is not cheap, right? and we are in a trade war. there is that as well. but i do think maybe the worst is over. i do think a name change, which
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we brought up -- >> of the max? >> yes. >> and part of the name of the game today could have been certainly. >> no doubt. >> a key piece of information we don't know yet is at what price is agi buying these planes >> you think there's a discount embedded in it >> or incentive. >> they should. >> maybe that's the right way to do it. >> they should here we are at 373, 374. this is where the stock basically cratered down to after all of the news came out probably back, what, april or march or so? right back to those levels i thought it would stop here three months ago he had another 10%, 12% to the down side. to tim's point i think the worst is in and there's room for the upside you are basically saying the defense portion of this company is not worth nothing but close to it, and although i understand what karen is saying in terms of valuation, this is a company that traded richer than it has now in similar environments. i think boeing goes higher from
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welcome back to "fast money" facebook going full crypto, unveiling its new digital currency, libra, the start of what the social giant calls the internet of money to rebuild a reliable and global financial infrastructure brian kelly says it is not exactly cryptocurrency he is over at the plaza with a little crypto class. take it away. >> let's get into it it is not to put down libra. it is a huge step forward for the entire space, but look at how it works and what you are getting into if you do libra how does it work what are the mechanics? you exchange dollars, yen, euro, whatever the basket is going to be for a token facebook gives you a libra token in for your dollars, so facebook is holding your dollars. you have to trust facebook that they're going to hold on to the dollars, they're going to keep track of the ledger and that your token will be worth something. you go out, you buy your goods and services on the facebook
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platform, whoever else is using it maybe uber somehow is involved and then you are left with the libra tokens that are leftover let's say you bought $20 worth of libra tokens, it cost you $10 for a nice digital cap on facebook and now you have $10 left in libra tokens again, you have to trust facebook they will hold it, that the company is there, the companies in the consortium are going to keep the ledger and be honest about that. that's a big difference from what a cryptocurrency is it is about trust. so when you talk about the difference between this and something like bitcoin, bitcoin is trust left. you don't need to do -- to believe anybody is going to check that ledger. you can do it yourself you hold on to it yourself so let's look at really kind of the main difference, and i will be a bit simple on this for the crypto folks out there, they may not like this, but this is really the main difference what libra is doing is creating a digital version of the u.s. dollar, yen, euro. it is like a stable coin, but
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you still have all of the characteristics of a fiat currency bitcoin is digital gold, probably better than gold, but there's no trusted third party involved and that's the huge difference this is about the trusted third party and to me that's the revolution of crypto, is that it is peer-to-peer. this keeps the existing system, this does away with it that's the difference. >> sara has a question. >> it sound to me like paypal or venmo. i was wondering, paypal didn't seem to react, certainly facebook has gone up a lot in the last couple of days on this. how is it not a paypal or venmo for facebook >> i mean effectively that's what libra is, it is paypal, venmo, any of those type of things we have now it is the next iteration of it you likely will be able to do more i'm frankly shocked paypal wasn't down more i know we will have mark ma haney on talking about how big it is for facebook
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for the payment space, think about this you have global payments that will cost zero what does it do for everybody else who is charging money for the global payments? those spreads are going to zero. >> so,brian, what we're talkin about paypal, we are talking about visa, mastercard and kind of libra stripe, you name it they funded this project isn't it what everyone has been waiting for in terms of institutional backing? forget investors, you actually have platforms that are conduits now. >> yes, actually this is -- that's what i started this off, saying that i would not want to disparage libra at all it is a huge step forward. you know, facebook will have a nice looking wallet everybody can get on it is easy to use. you can start moving this stuff around we can have an argument about the philosophy behind one of these, but for facebook to do this and to create that wallet and get people involved and have these and have visa and mastercard all involved in this validates the technology and gets people involved to me it is like the aol moment.
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aol got you online libra will get you into crypto. >> thanks for that, b.k., crypto class. we got a news alert on this. elon moore is in d.c. with the information. >> waters is calling for a mo moratorium on libra until congress has a chance to weigh in she says facebook executives should come before hermity to testify about these issues she says facebook with its announcement is continuing its unchecked expansion and extending the reach into the lives of its users he called it a wake-up call to get serious about national security and privacy patrick henry has also expressed reservations about the new cryptocurrency we are hearing scepticism from senate democrats as well, so clearly facebook has to answer to congress as well as it develops this currency back to you. >> thank you so much
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el elon loy >> facebook's push back, and obviously i'm not on their board nor do i care to be, but their push back is, hey, we are showing you how people trust us in the most powerful way possible, with their checkbooks effectively. if they trust us with information that we can, you know, have currency go back and forth, what better way to exhibit trust? this works to their favor i think. so in a lot of ways i think facebook is trying to preempt exactly what they're trying to go after them for. >> this is what senator sharon brown, top democrat in the house committee said in a statement. facebook is already too big and too powerful and it has used that power to exploit user's data without protecting their privacy, which we cannot allow facebook to run a new cryptocurrency out of a swiss bank account without oversight. >> it is a new tangent for facebook, obviously an exciting business, but it gets you into a place where if we're already into a form of -- call this economic exchange amongst
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individuals, that already is shrouded in mystery for most regulators -- forget the practitioners who don't believe it is mysterious at all. for regulators this would be another bucket look, the $30 move in facebook stock off of 160 is all about a recovery from leeb ya', yeibra,h market overall but from headlines on regulatory onslaught. that stuff has not left facebook and it is a reminder of such. >> our next step says libra could be a water shed moment for facebook and the crypto space. marc mahaney is here in houn this is a rare occurrence. >> it has been a long time good to be back. it is raining outside. i don't know if anybody knows that. >> you don't look wet at all by the way. so we were just talking about the pop in facebook stock and some would say, you know, it is libra. what do you think? >> i think that's definitely part of it i mean the stock is up, what,
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7%, 8% in the last three days. speculation started on friday, we wrote a note on it then and another today. this may be the waymo moment for facebook when i talk with long-term investors of on facebook, they like the core advertising but they want to know the option value. what else can the company do besides advertising. they may have answered the question there's a lot of ifs, ands and buts on whether they execute it well we look at we chat, it is a share of commerce and transactions facebook has two great assets that people in the u.s. underappreciate, a thing called whatsapp that has over a billion people you leave the u.s., it is very widely used and immaterially monetized and then facebook messenger. there was a lot of controversy about facebook in the u.s. market you leave the u.s., you go to india, to africa, the middle east, there isn't a debate about the functionality, the privacy concerns related to the two assets we had a rerating because of
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this i think it is warranted. >> people in those countries use whatsapp already they're fully entrenched on that platform as it is. when you think about what this can do, when david marcus, the head of libra, was on ""squawkbox"" this morning and i didn't get from him anything beyond peer-to-peer transfer of money, and if that's free i don't understand how facebook monetizes whatsapp or messenger by doing that. can you connect the dots for me? >> i'm going to try. if he can't do it there's a communications problem for the company. look, david marcus is a very good executive so my guess is they're not showing all of their cards. think about it this way as a platform you are increasing the functionality of whatsapp. it is used widely as a texting, messaging tool between people. why not layer in more functionality, the ability to order a meal delivery or ride-sharing or to actually make purchases or to send money back and forth? you have just created more engagement on the platform, so you could put some ads against that i really think if people are
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going to use whatsapp in order to order a ride-sharing cars, you can get a commission off of that i think that's been the model at we chat and that's what they're going to do. >> they're making money from uber basically or whoever the partner may be >> i think that's exactly what will happen here, but we're just guessing. >> sure. >> i'm surprised they're not more up front about it but i think that's the path. >> mark, i'm curious are other social media stocks going to have to follow or going to follow? i know jack dorsey is a big supporter of bitcoin, and let's talk about snap. do the other guys now have to come along >> no, i don't think so. there's also one thing that's really important and special about facebook it is just how big its audience is outside of the u.s. there's not a payments problem in japan or in korea or in the u.s., north america, western europe you don't need cryptocurrency. there are parts of the world where credit card adoption is limited, that's where cryptocurrency as an enabling payment method can help. facebook has a billion people in those markets.
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snap doesn't have anybody in those markets. i don't think there's much of an opportunity for them, they don't need to follow tracie strahan one it is a reminder that it is cheap, the number one pick in the group. >> mark, let me ask you this they have all of these partners in this and i thought that the partners were not going to be part of the rest of facebook's business to the extent they monetize it from some of their other businesses, how do they divvy that up? and if it is only used in the u.s., why would it be pegged to other currencies as well, if it is used at all in the u.s. >> we don't have answers to some of the questions uber, they could work with uber and uber is in most markets, ow there is a play there. merca mercado leeb ray mercado libra is one of the partners i would like to see a broader list of commerce where is the one of indonesia,
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of india, are they going to be part of the network? they should be, because it will create more value for the network. we don't know how it is going to play out but i think that's the goal. >> that's the question to the extent facebook is creating a new eco advertisyste the payment system at its core, when you look at the other players out there who do you think gets interrupted the most? i mean would it be -- i mean apple has been trying to create this ecosystem, but apple pay? i don't know if a lot of people use it i know you don't cover apple. >> i'm going out on a limb now i'm not shf shf zack schwartzman who works with me is the crypto bull in the house. they will tell you five to ten years out it is traditional banking that is upended because if somebody is creating a platform that's going to enable commerce and payments and transactions, then it is a lost opportunity for some, but guess who. the traditional banking companies. how is that for going on a limb? >> mark, great to see you. mark mahaney of rbc.
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what do you think? >> he is right i would agree as well. tim nailed it, 160 was the level. 50% replacement, did it on huge volume a couple of weeks ago now the stock clear to take out the 197 left, which is where we topped out in may. the real test will come at the all-time high we saw last year, 225. i think that's where the stock is headed over the next couple of weeks. >> simply if facebook runs into more regulatory issues and has to be broken up, it is a positive for the stock in my view i think it is cheap. the businesses that -- mark is not here anyone -- talked about that some are probably undermonetized right now and could be by themselves. >> still ahead, beyond the captivating wall street of the stock cracks 200 bucks a share first time ever, if you think that the move -- >> oh, my. >> -- is crazy, you won't believe where one technician sees it adheing next check out adobe jumping. it has been hot all year we will tell you about the move when "fast money" returns.
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welcome back to "fast money" check out shares beyond meat touching $200 today before staging a big reversals. still shares of the meatless wonder have been on fire since the market debut last month, up nearly 600%, posting a $10 billion market cap making it larger than around 75 companies in the s&p 500 our next guest says beyond meat and a handful of other hot ideas are about to sore. let's go to chris verrone, what
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are you watching >> while it is still below the highs of the last 18 months, i like the fact that the ipo index -- this is the ticker ipo -- has broken out of the 2018 highs we are getting strain from the riskier corners of the market. when you look at a long-term picture of this, it is telling in 2018 ipos peaked in the second quarter before s&p 500 peaked, we saw safety thing in 2015 they bottomed well before. we think the new high is a good sign for the broader market. when you look at some of the constituents in this group, so ipos, the short interest levels are still very, very high. 15% on uber. 46% on beyond meat so there's still a lot of skeptics out there about this group. we like that from the contrarian standpoint if you look at some of the names, i think uber is interesting here it has been quietly making this series of higher lows over the
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better part of the last four, five, six weeks. it is starting to peak its head near the 45 level. we think it breaks out ultimately on i.t. way to 55 if you look at a name like pintrest, very similar story after about a 30% decline, starting to put in this really big base, up through 24, 25, challenging 28 we think on its way to the low 30s. so another example of a reversal playing out in the space is dropbox, a name they took 60% out since the ipo. this started to bottom, it began in march, carving out a low here goes carving out a higher low here, on the verge of breaking out. another good prbarometer in ters of risk app tied, these ipos reacting pretty well then we go to the one everybody wants to talk about, beyond meat i think it is interesting here the 200 level, when you look at trend lines on the beyond meat chart if we can draw them, you have them basically connecting from the lower high -- because
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we're not getting lines anyone we are getting from the lower high to the higher high, pause right near 200 that was the top end of this range, consolidating here. i think 150, 155 is an area to buy the stock. we expect new highs here, but the broader message is strength from ipos is reflective of risk appetite, and whether it is uber, beyond meat, a good group of stocks here. >> chris, why don't you come on over and join us at the desk jonah will bring the chair in. >> jonah >> evan is going. >> jonah, the marathon kid >> did you realize jonah replaced evan? >> i have to get out more. >> chris, not to pit you against another technical analyst that resides in the pantheon, but carter braxton, one of our collective friends, said when analyzing that ipo there's not much of a history there. >> yeah. >> how do you look at these charts and say the trend line is this for beyond meat when it has only been trading since the beginning of may or so
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>> but it has respected these levels if you look at the eight weeks of history that we have on the chart, every single time it has come back to support it has reaction sell rated. until it breaks that pattern i think we have to give it the benefit of the doubt here. uber as women. while the ipo didn't go well, it has held every level for the better part of the last six weeks. so i have to respect these, and i think the broader message is when you look at what is typically risk-on type stock already as an index making new highs, it probably bodes well for risk app tied leans saying this market is maybe in better shape than people think. >> i see your point about some of the skeptics reflected in the high/short interest, but on the flip side don't you have a lockup at some point that would have deluge of shares, that's not relevant >> it is certainly in the future what i think is curious is none of these were great ipos to start. i mean they hit uber, they hit
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lyft, they hit dropbox i think a lot of the bad news -- >> beyond meat, you can't say that was. >> that's perhaps the exception of this group. dropbox was down 60% from the high when you look at the majority of the names, they've experienced a tough go at the start. i've been impressed how they responded. no question the lock-up four, five, six months from now becomes an issue for these names. >> you are indicating this is a sign of risk appetite and some risk aggression on some level. how about the opposite how about the fact that, look, may was the worst month in markets in a long time, june was best month since january you can make an argument it is really a byproduct of people reaching out to grab whatever they can. >> i think you can make an argument when you look at some of the valuations of the stocks, when you have negative interest rates around the world and 2% tenure yields, valuation is a timing tool. it is not helpful to any of us and you are willing to pay excess valuations to own growth. you know, these are companies,
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whether you like the business models or not, they're actually growing. when yields are low, you go out and you pay for it i think it is one of the messages here. >> chris, thank you. check out shares of adobe in after-hours at after hours hi s highs. plus one trader just set the house literally. but is gupthro of stocks is about to tumble. they're soaring by the way right now but about to tumble. more when "fast money" returns
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welcome back to "fast money" we have an earnings alert on adobe. shares are higher after reporting earnings let's get to josh in san francisco with the details josh. >> melissa, a couple of quick hot tapes from the street here dan ives said that it was incremental, a way to measure how much new recurring revenue they are booking in the segment for the quarter. that came in better than expected at 406 million. the street was at 371. to him it is a sign of the growth initiatives that the company are starting to come to fruition on the other handy checked into pat walravens, on the sidelines of adobe to him he said not a lot in the quarter to get excited about he thinks investors in his words
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are breathing a sigh nothing went wrong he points out the company guided down slightly next quarter and raises the point gdp is slowing and how is it not reflected in some of the businesses obviously, sounding a more bullish tone on the call, talking about the acquisitions of magenta and marketo said they're increasing value, helping adobe attract new logos. says it differentiates us. for more, melissa, i know your viewers will turn in tomorrow to squawkally our own john ford will interview the ceo talking about this print and i'm sure a lot else. thank you. >> josh in san francisco. >> see, the stock has been trading side ways since last fall, around 275, up or down but effectively where it has been. i think it takes it to the next level, it breaks out now people say, wait a second, 30 times forward earnings is expensive. it is expensive but you have eps growth to back it up and it is one of the best companies in the space. i think it has been trading side
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hitting an all-time hide but one trader made a $350 million bet the sector is on shaky ground. mike ho joins us from cape cod, massachusetts. hi, mike khouw. >> here i am at my favorite chinese restaurant we will talk a little bit about vnk. vnk is the vanguard exchange traded product designed to track the msci reindex today we saw an extremely notable trade, traded 16 times its more than daily put volume and the trade we saw was purchase of 40,000 of the september '81/81 put streds, a roll up from the spread. the reason it is a $350 million bet is because it represents 40 million shares or below 86 it closed around 90 1/2 today. it is a bet that vnq could decline below the 86 strike by at least the amount of premium they're spending in this case,
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$0.55, down to 85 1/2. presumably it is a bet that could decline more than that and it may potentially be a hedge because of course vnq is up substantially, more than 25% from the beginning of the year only a few blocks of options, elliott management owns about 40,000 so they're a potential contender for having done this trade. >> i'm glad mike made the comment about the chinese restaurant. >> he beat us to it. >> you are looking at vnq, bk? >> yes if you look them, they all trade the same so it is a rates bet in my view. perhaps the people own vnq as a way to play lower rates and this is a hedge against it, but curious this happens right before the fed tomorrow. i think if you get higher rates this will pay off quite well >> first of all, mike, your kid was so cute for father's day that was ridiculous. but aside from that, he really was, is this more efficient than playing a rates bet outright i would think it would be less efficient, or is it just if you
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own the underlying >> well, i think there -- you could belong the underline or major constituents of the underline which could have crossovers with the builders, like simon properties or avalon bay. if you have exposures to those, this would be a direct hedge obviously for the potential impact it could be a play on rates or just a hedge against those types of names. >> mike, we will let you get back to dinner enjoy. >> beef datoy? >> can only hope. >> 5:30, "options action up next, trades. wall street guy. what's the hesitation? eh, it just feels too complicated, you know? well sure, at first, but jj can help you with that. jj, will you break it down for this gentleman? hey, ian. you know, at td ameritrade, we can walk you through your options trades step by step until you're comfortable. i could be up for that. that's taking options trading from wall st. to main st. hey guys, wanna play some pool? eh, i'm not really a pool guy.
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time for the final trade tim? >> all of this talk of interest rate sensitivity and the housing market leads you to home improvement with a consumer with the wealth effect but low rates to put money in the house. lowe's's under performs home depot. >> brian kelly >> tomorrow will be about rates. the federal reserve if we get a stronger dollar, would way to play that is sell gold. >> karen. >> cbs we haven't talked about in a while it seems to be widely no merger
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talk with viacom heating up. even without a deal, i like it. >> steve. >> should have told you, hfc hollywood is too chief. >> is that a metaphor? >> no. >> we'll see you back here my mission is simple, to make you money i'm here to level the playing field for all investors. there is always a bull market somewhere and i promise to help you find it. "mad money" starts now hey, i'm cramer. welcome to "mad money. welcome to cramerica other people want to make friends, i'm just trying to make you money. my job is to entertain and teach and put in context call me or tweet me. this wasn't just a great day for the stock market dow surging and s&p gaining and nasdaq and also a revealing da
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