after those stress test results last week. >> we'll see how the banks trade tomorrow and we're going to look for earnings after the bell from fedex, we'll be watching for the he misdemeanor lines there -- headlines there. >> we're out of time "fast money" starts now. thank you. "fast money" starts right now. i'm melissa lee with our guests. coming up on fast, a social shut down, pressure mounting as more high-pro file advertisers pull out. plus shares of micron company's call is new under way. and tesla celebrates 10 years as a public company. will the next decade become just

as electric. one of tesla's biggest goals straight ahead we start with the banks and the latest. >> we've seen a flury of press conference from banks announcing plans for their dividends, one of those coming at a future date is wells fargo saying it's third level will reduce from 51 cents a share, didn't mention what level it will reduce to, but that will come in with the announcement of july 14th earnings another company on the watch list for potential definitely dind watch is capital one with buffer of requirement of 5.6% but no plan of what to do with its dividends in the press conference we've seen so far press release we've seen so far. of the companies that have reaffirmed their dividends citi group morgan stanley

golden goldman sachs bank of america. this based off the stress test last week. >> jpmorgan have not issued a release yet. >> not that we've seen, correct. -- >> -- wells fargo started today up with an 8% yield so nobody thinks an 8% yield is what the ongoing yield is going to be for well to me they're announcing to cut their dividend is not news in anyway at all. once we know the dividend

the stock will actually trade up so i like what jpmorgan is doing, hopefully it's uneventful i think it's reasonable so far with what we've seen it wouldn't shock me if when they have to resubmit plans for the next dividend if things are materially worse maybe the feds says nobody can do repurposes, and nobody can do dividends. that wouldn't shock me i don't know if the fed would do that but so far i think nothing dramatically has changed >> look at karen putting on her trader cap would you agree. >> i understand what she's looking at for sure. karen knows, and we talk about it all the time, wells fargo has been awful stock for quite some time, a lot of itself-inflicts one would think the housing numbers should provide a tailif you just sort of -- tailwind if

you connect the dots but it doesn't trade well i understand why you would want to dip your toe ahead of earnings in couple weeks but i'd much rather say something today definitely i think well no-touch for me. >> in terms of the general banks, is it a sigh of relief the companies saying we're going to reaffirm our dividend, et cetera, or if just the spector of resubmission later on is enough of an overhang to keep you away >> i really like what guy had to say. to answer your first question, i do think from posturing or publicity standpoint it definitely shows the banks are in a stronger position than fear i still think the name of the game here 100% is capital preservation and every option at our disposal should be used to make sure that we do not have a melt down like we had about a decade ago.

again, capital preservation being the number one thing i wouldn't be surprised to see dividends restricted a bit further. mind you a lot of large banks came out early, voluntarily suspended by backs and curbed dividends here well i'm going to stay away from early on i think larger money center banks, jpmorgan and stronger balance sheets, those are the names i'd dip my toes in. >> don't know if you heard this from morgan substantial -- stanley. over lie -- i'm wondering if this is something that even the covid over lay, the fed is putting on the banks may not be enough to convince in vestors -- investors that they're

really being put under stress. >> if you're investing on banks you're investing on expectation of loan loss q1 numbers were conservative i don't think you need to specula speculate on the next numbers. you're not investing in banks based on divs. if you remember about two years ago it was some of the big-money center banks were trying to fail their stress test because it's a machine had you aggressive they can be with their balance sheet and no question the banks are under the thumb of the fed i won't get into, should they be, it's their own faults, nationalizing the banks. we talk p with what the fed has done. if you invest in banks, banks made record profits around record issues attached to the pandemic everyone went as far as they could go on revolvers but we have that for bank going into q2 earnings nothing came out after the bell

just like nothing came out that should have been surprising week and half ago when we got the numbers on the stress test you invest in banks because you believe they're long term investor and that they're healthier and the evaluations and relative ability to take risks are under valued >> our next test says every bank should suspend its dividend coming from director of volger a license, sheila, thanks for being with us. >> tharngs for having me. >> why don't you believe what the banks are telling us in terms of paying dividends >> we don't know we're in a unprecedented situation, much tougher than previous stress tests, what they assumed in february. so i think it's common sense to

keep the capital and bank balance sheet that way can support positive taking. if it supports the real economy. which is their function. i do think it's really important to understand as part of the discussion that the fed has been providing capital, the fed and only regulators have been lowering capital minimum, which makes bank balance sheets more fragile. i understand some of that is necessary because banks do need to expand their capacity when you get into a situation like that but a better way to do that is to retain capital and keep the dividends on be the balance sheet, that expands capacity without weakening the bank i'm wrong and we get out of this just fine then later do a special definitely -- definitely dind and dividend should stay

with the bank. >> what factors in. >> i think there's a lot of n certain -- uncertainty. first of all there's a lot of loans in c.a.r.e.s. act that said if you're in forbearance you can't treat that as trouble gas which is fine but that means you don't get a higher capital charge as organize ordinarily would. lot of the loans will be rehabilitated. lot of them aren't they did a lot of provisioning in the first quarter but it's not deducted against capital usually it is. these are all things that tend to inflate risk-based capital ratios the other thing that bothered me about last-week's announcement was the sensitivity analysis only use riske-base ratios

they have a lot of problems. that's why as part of the post-rate financial crisis reform we said we need a simple leverage ratio to back stop risk-based measures which can be unreliable and great financial crisis everyone said mortgage securities and derivatives were low risk but look what happened there. so they're not using that any more to test the stress of the bank's financial situation if you look at one of the most important biggest banks, even in the february analysis, you saw goldman sachs, dipping down to 3.5% as par the of the most -- as part of the most adverse scenario that's about the point we're dealing with now i do think there are a lot of questions in addition to economic uncertainty a lot of

difficulty to figure how strong banks are. keep the capital on the balance sheet. i'm wrong do a special dividend. but we can't afford banks to get in trouble again, we'd have a financial crisis that would be absolutely devastating for our economy. >> thank you both for being on our show let me just ask as a bank shareholder, playing devil's advocate, what if they just continue this incrementally allowing every quarter a reassessment of bank dividends and if it ends in a worst case scenario that could happen than the worse to happen they would have paid out one-quarter's dividend beyond ha they holiday bowl have a -- what they should have. and maintain

the focu . >> let's look at what happened in the first quarter couple banks, wells and jpmorgan, distributed more than earn in capital. they were depleting their capital in the first quarter we're not going to get it back $30 billion in dividends with was divided up to public 145irshareholders that $30 billion on bank balance sheet could expand capacity by half trillion dollars, that's significant support for the real economy right now but that capital is gone. it's not coming back same time the fed is lowering capital standard to allow the banks to take on more leverage i'm a shareholder and sympathize with shareholders. i tried to make suggestions if banks think their shares are under valued, i think a lot of them do, pay a dividend in fines too, pay your shareholder more

stock. they need cash can sell it in the secondary market or hold on with tremendous upside potential. you can do that without compromising your financial position to pay cash dividends now, even at 30%, it's a lot of money, it's just ill-advised given the tremendous economic uncertainty we have and need we have for banks to keep functioning. banks have a special deal that others don't have. they get deposit insurance and special asset to federal liquidity facilities a lot of the underwriting fees they're getting right now is because of the fed, because of government intervention. i know shareholders want the profits to go to them but a lot of the profits are coming from government support not anything bank managers are doing. to say let's shoot it all out to shareholders when we don't know how serious this could be and

whether the banks could be in trouble later in the year. i think it's ill-advised wait to pay it out until it's warranted. >> sheila, thanks for joining us we appreciate it >> sure thanks for having me >> sheila bair guy, it's interesting note, hold off the dividends now, if shareholders believe in the strength of the bank they'll get it later on. >> i happen to agree with pretty much everything she said i'll say this, i could be dead wrong, i think it will take a bank like jpmorgan who has clearly risen to the upper echelon given number of different things, least of which their valuation to make that decision because it will make air cover to the rest of the banks, the others will follow in kind. we have breaking news on bogey. >> eing >> . >> let's take a live picture of

the boeing 737 coming back from the second of its certification flights. this was out in moses lake they flew out this morning and are now coming back. conducting a i number of specific man urves part of -- specific maneuvers part of the arrangement with the faa that wants to see xyz and they go through all those maneuvers. you see the max coming in to land in boeing field they have two more days of certification flights and then take all of the data, they're reporting all this on board and on the ground, they do analysis on the data and will be part of the final submission boeing will make for the max to be ungrounded boeing's target for the max to be ungrounded is by late summer. it happens means we could potentially see commercial revenue flights for 737 max starting by november, december, some time in that time frame depending how long it takes

airlines to get their pilots trained under the new procedures there's the max returning from its second certification flight of the day. >> each flight is the m cast trigger snd. >> i would assume it is, but i don't know specifically. look, that's the main feature they're going to look at, to see if the software has been upgraded to the guidelines and specs the faa will look for. whether they do it every flight or how on they do it we don't know but that's the main focus making sure the max is safe. >> phil, thank you it does look like the plane has successfully land in washington. the stock up 14% in the regular session. tim? well, this is the kind of news boeing shareholders, which i am, want to see it doesn't get you past the faa.

i think boeing mr. >> i think boeing will go out of their way to make sure to not get ahead of the faa norwegian air has cancelled and filed suit goodness boeing for damages. filed suit against boeing for damage so a lot of work to do to clean up the industry. management changes, i think the folks the at the helm hold those relationships especially at the chair man's level. it's something to watch. doesn't change the dynamic demand for the industry. as covid-19, the data we're quoting, morgan stanley, whatever you look at, it doesn't bode well for quick return to air. but this was weighing down boeing well into this crisis this is a very, very day. >> yeah when phil said november as revenue-generated flights i was thinking who will be on the flight first you got the covid scare

and in the back of your mind you think of the fatal crashes of theed 737 max maybe you're thinking i'm not going to be the first one on that plane. >> i couldn't say it any better. aside from the financial dynamics boeing has to overcome along with the rest of the travel sector there's still real psychologicalical hurdles in terms of the tragedies that happened in march, i believe, and really retouching with their customer base. at thend of the day our life is the most precious asset we have and they're going to have have to go on the charm offensive and work with the faa to ensure they're up to quality standards. absolutely. >> we've got breaking news on hong kong. kayla. >> melissa, the trump administration is officially revoking the special trading status of hong kong. commerce department out with release saying the preferential economic treatment of hong kong

as excluded from certain tariffs and customers control is suspended in the wake of the security law beijing is moving forward with president trump said he was instructing the administration to move forward to revoke the status but was unclear when it would be pursued but now official with this commerce department statement what remains to see if the u.s. will push to remove hong kong as a member of world trade organization but as of today commerce is rescinding that special preferential trading treatment of hong kong back to you. >> bottom line that capital flows into and out of kong hong kong will be the same as for china, as restrictive >> that's what it appears to be at this moment the state commerce released is very short and doesn't go into

great detail exactly how this will apply we are efforting more details from the white house and national security council and state department as to how exactly this will be applied a lot are saying not much trade coming into the united states from hong kong but is a premier hub for operations and could challenge the location as head quarter because of that. >> thank you, from washington, with the latest. we go to tim in another lifetime is known as ambassador because of specialties in international markets. when kayla was talking about this i was thinking about all of the companies that were seeking dualisting in hong kong or in united states and rush to get the deal done on the hong kong exchange, maybe before it closes off to outside companies. >> and guess what, this was a total boom to their market caps.

it was actually a catalyst to a lot of the chinese e- commerce names to go to significant all-time highs so this is a really difficult day. in terms of the gio politics, it's important to make a stand. it's important to make a stand trump administration at times were not ready to make a clear stand but are ready to make a clear stand and it's necessary for world to make a clear stand. what it means for the emerging markets trading with hong kong and here so far no damage. again, getting that trading done on that side of the world, the trading volume in hong kong and chinese markets could dwarf trading here, i know it's hard to believe, but at least in the namesle that have done that registration really important incident event

meantime the stocks are near all-time high. big rally on wall street as fed chief gears up to deliver remarks tomorrow we have details. >> specifically to the house financial services committee in it you are not going to see a lot of fireworks in the prepared remashes fed chair jay powell will go through and reiterate the steps the fed is taking to combat the economic down turn due to covid virus. we know the steps taken. he made interesting remarks regarding current state of economic affairs he talks about this notion that many businesses are opening doors, hiring is picking up, spending is increasing, employment moving higher, we're in a new phase sooner than expected, while the bounce back in economic activity is welcome it presents challenges needed to

keep the virus in check. the path forward for the economy is extraordinary uncertainty and will depend in large part on our success in containing the virus. a full recovery is unlikely until people are confident it is safe to reengage in a broad range of activities. he goes on to talk about the extraordinary measures taking place and whether the fed has over stepped its bounds, in it he says the tools the federal reserve are using are for times of emergency such as what we're living through now when economic conditions improve we'll put those tools back in the tool box those are some of the highlights a lot of this will go into reiterating the steps taken. we'll listen for q&a for any more news. back to you. >> thank you i listened to the feds comments about the economy i'd be depressed, except that the fed

has extraordinary tools it continues to use. >> yeah we're just levitating on those tools. that's been a good thing and i don't see that changing at all. remember how down beat powell was a week or two ago. and that give some people comfort that things are bad so they're still there. that's been the right trade. >> bad news is good news, wins the day again. coming up, shares of micron on the move. we'll bring you the results. and one airline up, the name and trade straight ahead on "fast" keeping me from the things i love to do. talk to your doctor, and call 844-214-2424.

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micron let's get to josh with the latest >> so melissa, micron beating on the top and bottom -- street was at 81 cents and revenue 5.75 to $6.25 billion closing closer to $5.8 billion for their q4 i caught up with steve who said material raise across the board. biggest upside in gross margins improving significantly, demand appears better than feared i asked why he continues to rate it a buy he says banking on server demand remaining strong in the back half of the year not just micron, check out western digital intel, both up after hours. in terms of the forecast

short-term visibility is limited, not surprising due to the pandemic and broad economic challenges but he expects the data center to stay healthy. smart phones should improve the forecast as 5g gains traction and new gaming councils on the way will help demand by the way he'll be on cnbc tomorrow morning, live and exclusive interview, tune in for that back to you. >> josh, thank you of course for memory prices and memory stocks, guy. >> yeah the good news here, operating margins came in 18%, a pretty strong number for them. i'm surprised the stock isn't higher in the after hours. this is $54 stock on june 8th and new $52. i really thought it would be higher i think you need a break out above $54. valuation might be a tad

stretch. and dialing same thing big move after hours big move still very strong but where we were few weeks ago to me is a wee-bit concerning. >> yeah, tim >> so a lot of the numbers people knew about, the outlook is pretty good demand in data center and pc, very good. the other thing should support the entire sector is they talked about supply, about being cautious and things like gaming are actually increasing the demand out of d ram and nan. very good numbers. even better on the outlook agree. i think the stock will take some this momentum higher in tomorrow's session. the pressure is mounting on facebook more big name companies join in advertising boycott. the latest -- including all these that have pulled from the social media site when it was first a handful of names a lot of people were ready

to discount this we didn't on this show but i'm wondering, facebook at this point, is investable? >> i still think it's investable at the end the day it's still a titan of the industry. but i will say there does seem to be a little bit of momentum picking up here. again, what we're seeing are large headline names starbucks was the largest in terms of revenue allocation. about the bulk of the customer base will be small and medium-sized businesses. i'm curious to see if there's a trickle down theory in terms of the boycotts as it stands, i think your long-term name with that said, there is going to be somewhat of an overhang on the name as we've seen in so many large tech names might be an opportunity to retrench. >> you made that point earlier, we were chatting about the bulk of facebook's advertisers are

small and mid-cap companies. a lot of them are direct to consumer for a lot of them if they boycotted would hurt them more than coca-cola >> right when you think of big corporate america right now. the more that pile on and sort of suspend their facebook advertising, the rest of them feel they need to do the same thing and they're just hoping that facebook gives them enough, makes a statement that gives them enough cover that they could go back to using facebook because it's so effective for advertisers. it is one of the least concentrated businesses. the top ten make up very little. so as pointed out, it's all, you know, so many small businesses they don't get the bang for their buck making a big statement that we're going to suspend advertising on facebook. we've seen them weather many, many storms before i talk about it in my book, because i'm a long-term facebook shareholder, i think they'll weather this one as well. >> the way they weather the

storm in the past, guy, is that we've always made the argument and always has been the case the advertisers will still go to facebook because that's where the eyeballs are so are we seeing maybe that shift in terms of that power dynamic? >> i think you're seeing a shift. to karen's point, they have 8 million advertisers and the lion's share is small to mid-sized businesses i totally understand that. to a certain degree they're still insulated from all this. but they definitely now are in the cross hairs in terms of what's going on. the good news for the stock, you had a huge reversal today, two times normal volume. at least you have something to trade goodness in the form of the low put in today 207 or to as reported june 22nd. we talked about rei and pall

patagonia on tuesday they were the first and won't be the last. what you take away today, the stock is seemingly impervious. trading on the long side >> all right let's talk more on this facebook advertiser's boycott joining us now -- ked -- -- there and does seem to be a movement but that movement is really being temper in the marketplace. i read one headline that kind of concerned me as a student of the advertising industry which is so and so upped ante as if it was a competition between brands i'd like to think it's not i like to think this is a moment where progress could be made on behalf of the marketing community. we have organizations that are do thk -- doing this we have something that has a lot

of attraction. the global alliance for responsible media. garm there are places in which marketers the should be convening to have those conversations. yes we all see sometimes you can move markets by utilize your checkbooks, obviously, but i think the point made moments ago about the small and medium-sized businesses they don't have a lot of optionality and the reality is main street and wall street and if you will, sand hill road are not necessarily aligned here, relative to what the marketers are saying look, the marketers are saying they need movement, they need action, they're saying that with their checkbooks and i think to facebook's credit over last several days, maybe they should have moved faster, that's probably true. but i think they've stepped up over the last several days to pay attention, to listen and to make some serious moves in

regards to what the advertisers are saying. >> sure and i agree with you, it's a powerful statement for the companies to vote with their checkbooks, walk the walk not just talk the talk, to donate to organizations that support this boycott this is also happening at a time of economic uncertainty and i'm sure a lot of companies were ree value ating ad budgets anyway. could this mark the time companies seriously reduce or walk away from facebook? >> no. i don't think so, michelle and i think that social media in general is going to be subject to different kinds of views from marketers. but there is a bit of a conflicts here and one can't help but realize everybody is reimagining their marketing budgets in the context of covid and only things happening, i'm not suggesting there's anything cynical here but i would suggest

that's part of why advertisers might have chosen this particular moment to make these kind of statements relative to how their marketing budgets are shrinking in general, at least in the short-run >> great speaking with you and next time we talk it's melissa by the way >> you got it melissa thank you. >> i get it all the time, there's a famous actor in the 70's named michelle. anyway tim seymour. >> i actually know her there you go >> it's real all right, tim, what do you think, facebook. >> so, i think it's first of all very interesting we haven't heard from cheryl sandberg she's normally very involved here. i do think facebook is going to come around. i think the brand is something they're worried about and there's ability to actually control that environment and

there's company that's double verify or company that's tell advertisers what context are being viewed, whether it's good or bad i don't think facebook is going to radically change what they do, unless there's a new regime over there, again, that's not the body language we've got so far i think there's winners in the media space as social media is taking a hit there's so many new online platforms, this network has one as well, a lot of folks can be beneficiaries in a headwind digital ad environment i think it will be very good for some people. >> yeah and sandberg had been on the front of the scandal in the past and karen, you were commenting on that today as well. >> yeah, i think that -- i'm sure she's doing a lot of that right now. not in front of congress, but certainly to these major advertisers. you know, i just go back to, they're begging her, and

zuckerberg to give them cover to go back to facebook, that's what they want to do. so i think, you know, we talked about are they going to walk the walk, not just talk the talk they will for a month. sort of what they're holding out, we're going to suspend through july. >> coming up, break out the bubly because we're celebrating. happy anniversary tesla. we'll take a trip down memory lane looking at what's changed in the past ten years and what's ahead for electric vehicles. plus speaking of love, one airlines soaring higher as goldman sachs gave it a boost. details ahead after this break and in an emergency, you need a network that puts you first. that connects you to technology to each other and to other agencies. built with and for first responders. firstnet. the only officially authorized wireless network for first responders.

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when people look at the list of investors part of this idea they'll be amazed at the strengthable of tesla. >> that was ceo of tesla, smask, the stock has gone from $17 a share to nearly $1,000 it's market cap exploded from 1.7 to 184 billion and gains, monsterous 5,837% in the past decade this coming as they take preorders for their new truck. spoke with founder on friday who was pretty excited >> it's the coolest electric pick up truck the world's ever seen so yeah thes it's a big day on monday. also those reservations turn into tickets for niko world when

we show off the badger the next four or five months will be incredibly fun time. >> the coolest electric pick up truck the world's ever seen except the world hasn't actually seen it because it hasn't been made yet minor detail question is can it take on tesla's cyber truck. let's bring in kathy glad you're with us. >> happy to be here. >> i'm wondering in your view what is different from nikola today versus tesla when it ipo ten years ago and only had a road in time square. >> sure, well, i think the biggest difference is the right technology we did a white sheet of paper research at the beginning of our and just mapped out what an electric vehicle cost decline would look like, versus a

hydrogen, and as we were doing that research we realized that the infrastructure alone for hydrogen fuelling stations is going to be five to ten times as expensive as the infrastructure for electric. and then from the consumer's point of view, it is going to cost roughly three times as much it's so this is a 700,000 mile truck lease. if you tally up the cost to the trucker for the hydrogen it will be three times as much as the cost would be for electriocity -- electricity. so the technology is what tesla got right. >> is there economy of scale once infrastructure is in place, down the line. what's interesting they are selling a bundle where you sell the truck and the fuel, so if they get the cost of the hydrogen down that's just money

that they capture. >> yeah if they're able to do that we don't think they will be able to do that but let's just take the assumptions that they made in preparing for the ipo. and you take their cash flow out in 2024 where, you know, they've got everything moving their way perfectly. and what we have here now is a stock selling at $24 billion market cap for about 110 times cash flow. and if you take tesla by comparison today, our bare case without ride hailing is seven to eight times cash flow in 2024, and if you include ride hailing, which we think they will launch this year, and that's human-driven ride hailing, it's five to six times cash flow. so there's just no comparison. the other interesting thing is

this management team has come from the old world i mean, i'm looking at steal, and aluminum, and natural gas and you know, those are mature industries we're talking about exponential growth here. that's their attempt we don't think they will succeed. but we don't think they've got the right dna to begin with. >> hey, kathy, congratulations you've probably been the most outspoken bull on the name this is not a gotcha question but just an opportunity to explain to the audience, i don't think anyone is more bullish than you are, yet you actively trade around a long position, can you explain why you guys and gals do that. >> sure. well, you will notice in our flagship fund tesla is our largest position at about 10% right now. as it rises above 10% we can only buy up to 10% when it rises

above to 12% or 13%, and sometimes just above 10, you will find us taking profits. and the rb -- reason for that, disruptive innovation is inherently controversial so we know we can lie in wait and have another opportunity as bears folk on the short-term -- focus on the short-term. tesla in trading opportunity alone last year, forget about the fact it was up 35%, just our trading activity around the incredible volume volatility delivered 300 bases points on performance. in another 2014 down market year our trading alone in tesla contributed 175 basis points so trading around controversy

pays off you know, that said, guy, it never went below our top position that i want to be very clear about. >> kathy, it's karen, let me ask you -- go ahead -- >> kathy, so much for making yourself available i want to ask in terms of your upside scenario would you mind providing guidance in terms of how much the autonomous space market share tesla needs to capture to achieve those goals. >> you can see all our estimates and scenario test it on github we put our model out there we assume with our base case way out at $7,000. our bear case before ride hailing is 1500. with ride hailing will be, back in the nenvelope, a lot higher and our bull case is out to

15,000 in that bull case we assume that there's only a 30% chance that they will get autonomous right at all so, and we're assuming p with -- about 30% market share we do believe autonomous if and when it works is going to be winner take most business and the determining factors behind the winners we believe is going to be, well, the best chip, which tesla has, and the most data, they have, we're calculating roughly 15 billion miles worth of real-world driving. not simulation real-world driving and google released its stat a couple months ago. they have a total of 200 -- i mean 20 million versus 15 billion. that's a huge difference it's going to be very hard to

catch up with tesla, certainly in the united states >> kathy, it's karen, first, kudos, you've been right for so many years on this just looking at your notes, it looks like your bear case is 50% higher than here >> yes. >> are you saying in no scenario do you see a possibility or probability of down side in tesla? >> in -- what's interesting about the bear case is we assume that tesla is going to lose market share going from roughly 17% of the global market last year to, the five-year forecast would be about 11% what seems to be happening is they're gaining market share and what also seems to be happening is this coronavirus vooiz this coronavirus crisis has

forced other auto manufacturers, for the sake of their balance sheet. think of that. a year ago tesla was going to run out of cash, and now looks like a fortress. traditional auto manufacturers are cutting back, certainly on autonomous but even we believe on their electric. >> kathy we're going to leave it there. always great to speak with you. >> thank you very much >> from the bull we go to the bear tim, you still short >> sorry, so, i think you were calling on me. look, i any, again, yo the upside as it relates to sas is very difficult to quantify. it's important to note if it is about a free cash flow story, it's not something they've done very well, but it's hard to argue with the fact that the competition, which i think there

will be enormous competition, if there's a move to ev, i think it should be at tesla's expense but for now the reality is the competition has been laying back and that's, maybe a testament to the tesla technology but the valuation makes zero sense to me. i've been very clear about that. good for being in the game. >> let's turn from the road to the skies, airlines stocks rally today. there was one big stand out today. goldman sachs taking its rating to a buy to sell protecting from slow international air traffic recovery southwest gaining 10% today, also is one of the airlines extending the no-person in the middle seat rule for longer. so do you like southwest here? >> listen, i don't want to single out southwest truthly, the whole airline sector there's so much volatility and seeming trading

as opposed to investing. i'm steering clear of it all together i will say, to some of the points gold man made, southwest is one of the best, if not the best in terms of a balance- sheet point of view, in terms of the sector they have $6 billion in dealt versus $5 billion in cash i can understand the bull case for it much like i alluded to when discussing boeing this isn't something i care to speculate on and jump in. i think we're very much still in the early stages of the game and i'd rather have more information before putting my money to work. >> yeah, saying he is not a trader but an investor when kathy was talking about trading around her long-position and it generated 300 bases points or 175 bases points in various periods, i thought it was fascinating. >> yeah, and that's why i ask the question because we've had her on a number of times and a lot of the

push back we get is if they are so bullish it will and if they have these kind of price targets why would they ever sell the stock. she answered the question well i think that's important t to get out there number two, airlines have become tremendous trading vehicles. we talk about it all the time. one thing that concerned me about southwest on a big day didn't have a huge volume day, traded basically at a normal volume day and delta traded less than normal volume i would have liked to have seen an indication that people were behind it with two times normal volume we didn't see it today >> more now you can head to cnbc.com coming up options trading. we will tell you how high the stock could pop. stay with us at leaf blowers.

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between now and next thursday in line of what we've seen in the last four fiscal quarters. in name does move 3.5 to 14 to 15% on earnings, it is quite volatile the trade jumped out july 2nd called trading 2.80 breaking even 6.5 plan for reversal in the stock. >> thanks for that more on options action, the llinfriday up next, final trades. ♪ ♪ ♪

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final trade -- my mission is simple to make your money there is all a bull market somewhere and i promise to help your find it "mad money" starts now hey, i'm cramer. welcome to "34mad money. welcome to cramerica other people want to make friends, my job is to educate, teach, call me 800-743-cnbc or tweet me @aat jim cramer. this market is