is looking at them as they did the tableau acquisition, and the way we do business has shift and pivoted whether we go back to work or not, and this is company is looking at $50 billion in revenue by 20226. >> quick one >> kme, m&a is back. >> thank you for watching. "the exchange" is next. >> thank you, scott. i'm becky quick, and this is what is ahead today. when is royal caribbean going back to sea? when is vaccinations going to be required to get on board richard is going to join us for a interview straight ahead. and rising mortgage rates and tight supply, and when we look at the potential impact on the spring housing market. and bitcoin trimming the holdings, and investors will take aim at kohl's, and is

instacart taking aim at the investors. >> dom chu, good to see you. >> yes, thank you, becky, seems that we were all hanging out at "squawk box" but it is 1:00 p.m., and the markets are hanging out at the highs of the day, and a 100-point gain for the dow industrials, and doesn't seem like a lot, but at the lows we were down, and decent-sized comeback and the s&p 500 has 1/3 of one percent. and 13670, and the underperformer off 1% of the day. and one story playing out on the macro side of things is the interest rates they are on the rise today and 1.358% and a hair behind the highest levels of the course of the year. you have to go all of the way back to last year to find this level at 1.4%, so keep an eye on the 10-year treasury note yields and because of that, the financials and the banks are continuing to be in focus, but

this time, because of the deal. mnt bank and buffalo bank is buying bridgeport bank and those banks have been taking a divergence, but mnt is up today, and 14% gains on the day for people's united but a big deal in terms of the regional banking and maybe the latest step of bank consolidation, so keep an eye on the interest rate and the regional banks for sure. becky, i am sending it back over to you. >> dom, talking earlier today, it was boeing shares that were dragging down the dow down 200 points or so, but they have turned it around. >> yes, the idea right now that you are seeing a little built of the mentality of the people trying to buy it on the pullbacks, and especially on the blue chip names and why you are seeing boeing up, and by the way, on the course of the day, down nearly $209 a share and up

to where we are now, and boeing is a big reason why, and maybe it is the mentality, becky, that we have been seeing is over the months here of the people buying the blue chip oriented names and perhaps boeing is on the shopping list today, becky. >> i knew that i could throw anything at you, and you have the charts right up to run with it dom, you are the best. thank you. >> thank you, becky. >> see you soon. okay. as dom was mentioning the bond yields, and we have been watching them closely and especially the 10-year, and there is a been rising and the market setting new highs, but with the 10-years hitting the highest level in nearly a year, and is that is going to start to hurt the stocks. here to answer that is kim for est, and also david wagner at aptos capital, and so it is hard to say interest rates below 1.4% looking at the 10% are a sign of concern, but we are moving quickly, and so what are you seeing when you see this >> well, sure.

especially the 10-year, and this is the number that we are all discounting the cash flows at, right? so the higher that goes, the lower that we should be looking at accepting the p.e. so that is going to lower the multiple, right. but, as you are pointing out, we are moving fast, but it is a very, very low number. so i think that we are not going to have a taper tantrum yet or whatever that was, and so i think that it is okay right now, but it is something that investors do have to keep an eye on. >> david, what are you thinking when we are watching that? we are looking at the 10-year below the rate of inflation which is close to 1.4%, but people are starting to ask about whether inflation is going to pick up quickly, and are you in that camp? >> yeah, kim is spot-on with what we are seeing with the note, and it is the changing of the dynamic of the market, and the bond people tend to be the smartest people in the room, and so starting to see the

capitulation from them, and in my mind the equities were ahead of themselves. so seeing some type of normalization in the yield curve. this happens every economic cycle here. i would not start to worry about the equities until maybe you start to see the 10-year ahead of the s&p 500 yield of 1.5%, and like kim said, that could be a little headwind for the higher valued stocks in market that have had a huge run especially last year. >> yeah, kim, that is the big question, and probably not a big deal for the economy to hamper or slow it down, but you could potentially claim it is going to make housing prices more expensive getting into the spring season, but looking at this, it is a question for the fed, too. will the fed react if you see the interest rates start to pick up like this >> i think they will. i think that looking globally, we live in a low interest rate environment, and i think that the fed wisely knocked down those rates when we were getting

up to the magical 3%. i think that they have an eye on the global interest rate environment, and that is what we are working with. it is low interest environment for as long as the eye can see. >> david, interesting segment that you like and it is the reits, the real estate investment trusts and driving around new york city looking at how much is shutdown and real estate that is open and available, and explain your thinking here? >> we are proactive on the home builders as whole, but what we are seeing more is value in the reit space, and 20% of reits ar trading above theare looking ate cyclicals you are seeing only about 20% trading above the precovid high. so maybe some of the smaller cap side, and they are exposed to

the exact same industries that are running like the restaurants, and the resale and the store front, and so we are seeing the relative value trade here that is beneficial for reits forward even if it starts to rise. they are not monolithic, and benefiting from the stronger economic growth, and that is something that we are going to be seeing here in the near future. >> kim, you say that you like the technology names like intel and micron, but you like urban outfitter and i am trying to figure out the thought process there, and the tech names, i understand, but what about urban outfitters makes you feel so positive >> well, a couple of reasons. a long history of being at the forefront of trends. as we get out and out of covid, we are going to be out of the house. i don't think that we want to wear what we have been wearing. nobody does, right so, i think that they have a good shot for getting our

clothing dollars, but they also do experiential selling, and the stores are great to mull around and pick things the up, and find stuff that you never knew that you needed. i think that people are going to want to be out. and i think that they do it so well. >> kim, david, i want to thank you both for being here today and it is really good to talk to you. by the way, the stocks are mixed today, but the long term market strategist sam stovall is warning that there are several indicators coming to a pointing correction and it is scary, if you want to hear more about it go to cnbc.com/pro to read more about it. and the biden administration is announcing changes to the ppe program to better target aid to small businesses. kate rogers is joining me to tell us more about it. good afternoon. >> thank you. and the administration is making several changes to the program to increase access for smaller companies that may have been

excluded from the aid last year. it is tailored to reach the smaller businesses and the minority business owners. starting wednesday a two-week window for businesses with 20 employees or smaller to make sure they are not crowded out by larger companies, and also, how many aid and sole proprietors can be eligible for in this round as 70% of sole pry pry or theships are owned by women and minorities. and also those with prior convictions and those who are delinquent on the federal student loans, and also those who have green card holders will also be eligible. and ppe alone is not going to be enough to save the small

businesses and urging congress to pass the rescue plan which has $284 billion allocated in the latest round, and $144 billion remains and the outreach is for businesses that turned away or missed out on the aid to come back to apply as the changes take place. back over to you. >> hey, kate, i have a question for you, and this is something that i have not been able to get straight as i have been hearing the reporting through the day, and this time around you have to say that you were hurt by something of 25%, taking a hit to the revenue year over year, and this is this year over last year or last year over the year before, because pretty soon, you are coming up against the comps when you were already in covid and maybe you were hit by march of 2019, and if you are doing a year later, i don't know if it is going to show 25% >> those are for the second drop ppe loans. you have to have shown the 25% decline from current times to

precovid times. that is something that a lot of people wanted to see included to make sure that truly struggling small businesses were eligible and wound up getting the aid. the good news is that smaller companies are going particularly for first draw loans and data this morning showed that new draw loans in the first round of the ppe were average loans of $21,000 which means small companies are going for aid this time around which is important, and the second draw ppe loans were closer to $100,000 in average loan size. >> that is good to hear. kate, it is good to see you, and we will talk to you soon. >> you, too, thanks. when we come back. shares of royal caribbean are surging on the bullish comments of the ceo, and he is going to join us live and talk more about what he has been saying that has investors so excited and we will talk about vaccines and whether it is a requirement to cruise. and large bitcoin investors are trimming the investment

while other retailers are picking up, and the battle of the wall street and the main street and who is right. bitcoin is down after hitting a record high over the weekend. "the exchange" is back in two minutes.

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welcome back to "the exchange", everyone. and surging for the billion dollar loss in the fourth quarter for royal caribbean, and richard feignain is going to jon us, and what is behind those numbers? >> well, cruisers are a loyal bunch, and on those future bookings, royal caribbean has been seeing more bookings as older americans are getting vaccinated, royal has had to fight to stay afloat, and raising $9 billion in equity and selling their asamar cruise line to stay afloat. we bring in richard fain. >> thank you for having me. >> let's talk about the increase in bookings that you have seen over the last five weeks. would you say they are primarily

americans over the age of 65 i am trying to understand the correlation between getting vaccinated and booking a cruise. >> well, you know, we are still in such a period of uncertainty, and there is still so much turmoil, and we are trying to read all of the statistics that we can, and of course, they are all over place, and the specifics that you were referring to was on the call, and jason liberty said that the bookings were up at the current pace 30% higher than in november or december of last year, and remember that was a terrible time in november and december. so what you are seeing is enthusiasm about the pace of the vaccine coming out. older people who are getting the vaccines earlier, and people over 65. so some of the things that we thought that was going to happen aren't happening. they are better than we thought. we thought that older people would be more cautious, and turns out, that i wt i, they wao

get out of the house, too. and the experienced cruisers understood cruising and are anxious to come back. yet in the singapore operation, 80% of the guests are first-timers, so a lot of the surprising data as things are coming out, and it is mostly positive. >> all of the demand in the world is not good if the industry is not given the clearance from the cdc and where are the discussions standing with the biden administration and the cdc with getting back to sea. what is the holdup and why is it taking so long >> well, we are just now coming down, but we were in the midst of a huge surge, a real spike over in the last of last year taking prevalence to a high level that nobody would suggest that we start operating in that environment. but it has been coming down as the numbers are getting better, and the prevalence in society is better and the vaccine is out

there more, i think that is when people will, and that is when we can start to have serious conversations to restart. >> richard, has the cdc said what percentage of the population needs to be vaccinated when they will loosen the restrictions or where the vaccination rate needs to be >> no, the healthy sales panel will say that no one sta tix s is -- statistic is the determining factor, and looking at what the vaccine does, and we are close to the time when they are working together, but there is no, unfortunately, no one magic threshold that says now is the day. if we reach this point, we can go. but we are coming, and there are several points that i made on to call that we are starting up in singapore and in the canaries, et cetera. >> richard, i'm not surprised to hear that people who are vaccinated wanting to go ahead to sign up and get back out.

i can't wait to get a vaccination and i'd love to get back out after that happens, but what was happening with the cruise lines when this first happen and ships that could not come back, and no nation wanted you to dock because you had infected people on board, and does every passenger have to be vaccinated or do i have to risk that i will be stuck out there if someone comes down with coronavirus? >> i am glad you raised it. people are not worried about getting sick on the ship, but worried that someone else is going to be sick, and that is going to destroy the whole vacation and they can't be isolated that is why the focus is how do we isolate the cases when we have a case, because there are going to be cases on the ship just as there are cases in society. our job is going be making sure it is cases and not an outbreak. so i think that is where the healthy sail panel comes from and the discussion with the cdc

and others, and that is in the vaccines that are a big part of that. >> and that seems to be what is fueling the stock now, and up 13% on the day, and also successful in raising a lot of debt and equity, richard, over $9 billion over the past year, but how many more times can you go back to the debt market if you are not able to get to see t -- get to sea this summer >> well, what we have said is that we said on the call is that we have a lot of things that we can do we have a quiver of things, and full of actions that we could take if we needed, but we have been methodical about this, and always looking fairly far out so that we are not dealing with the imminent issue, but we always want to be dealing with if something goes wrong, we have time to fix it. in this case, we have built up the liquidity and the ammunition so that we have the luxury of not having to deal with the crisis, but to gradually improve

the liquidity and the financial health, because we want to get back to investment grade as quickly as we can. >> and the liquidity position is much stronger than anticipated. richard, thank you for joining us today, and we appreciate it, richard fain, ceo of royal caribbean. >> thank you for having me back. >> thank you, seema, and richard as well. when we come back, the recent spike of the 10-year is pushing the mortgage rates higher, and we will look at the impact on the spring housing market. from art to classic cars to sneaker, and we will look at the rise of art-secured loans and the risks that come with it that mi bk teth qck"the exchange" is congacafr isui break. ♪♪ you can spend your life in boxing or any other business, but one day, you're gonna take a hit you didn't see coming. and it won't matter what hit you.

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wecome back to "the exchange." we are watching the stocks right now and they are mixed the dow is up about 3 or .04. the dow is cutting some of the earlier losses. at one point the dow was down 207 points and that is the low, but now in positive territory up about 121 points, and that is after things reversed for boeing. earlier, you saw boeing shares under pressure, and pulled back out of it, and that in turn has pulled the dow up. some to sek storctors are energ

industrials are the leaders today. and the biggest laggards are the utilities and and financials. and the biggest loser is looking like technology. and right now s, en phase energ is down, and then shares of spotify is gaining on the news that the company is launching new markets in the next few days to reach more than a billion people around the world. and the company is launching a new subscription service and the shares are up about 1.4%, and the ceo of spotify is going to be on "closing bell" at 4:00 p.m. eastern time.

and right now, we go to rahel soloman, and good to see you. >> hello, becky. good to see you as well. this is what is happening at this hour. mitt romney and susan collins will oppose president biden's choice to head the office of budget in that neera tanden does not have the temperament to lead that department. and merrick garland says that the a.g. office needs to be independent. >> if i am confirmed, it is the culmination that the laws of the country are fully and faithfully enforced and the rights of all americans are protected. >> and watch the news with shepard smith to see why garland says that america does not yet have equal justice. becky, back to you and some

emotional moments in that hearing as carl quintanilla has pointed out on twitter. >> i will be quietly watching and tune into shepard to find out more. and bearish sign of bitcoin, and instacart is preparing to take on the grocery stores. all that and more on this edition of "rapid fire." "the exchange" is going to be ghba. rit ck turn on my tv and boom, it's got all my favorite shows right there. i wish my trading platform worked like that. well have you tried thinkorswim? this is totally customizable, so you focus only on what you want. okay, it's got screeners and watchlists. and you can even see how your predictions might affect the value of the stocks you're interested in. now this is what i'm talking about. yeah, it'll free up more time for your... uh, true crime shows? british baking competitions.

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all right. welcome back, everybody. let's get you caught up on a few stories that should be on the radar now. joining us for rapid fire is deidre bosa and kate and becky. okay so at the morning lows bitcoin had been down as much as 17%, and briefly breaking below 50,000, and now new data from the chain analysis suggests that as bitcoin grew more popular with the main street investors and those with the biggest holders meaning more than $50 million in their accounts were trimming the positions. kate, you been following the

story, and what is to take away as we are following the breakout >> it is interesting that the bigger group of investors that you are talking about holding more than 50 million are citing of what has been driving the bitcoin past the 50,000 level, and that analysis from the chain analysis when it hit the benchmark of 50,000 level, they started to trim back, and whether they are cautious or wanted to take the profits, that particular group scaled back. but meanwhile, the retail investors of who we think of the 2017 or 2018 cohort ramped up. so you have seen the exchanges seeing the volume from the smaller individual buyers, so interesting changing dynamic there, and of course, you had elon musk tweeting about the bitcoin being too high at a trillion market cap, and interesting dynamics around and the bigger investors are scaling back for now. >> deidre, what do you think about this as we are playing through and watching this from

where you stand on things, and what you are hearing of what is going on with this, and i don't want to say that the smart money is deciding to sell on this, but when you are seeing the people being opportunistic and people in it for a long time, that is sometimes what you might think. >> right. and then another sense, this is a natural backing off a little bit after the incredible run it has been on, but anything that we say here, it is so difficult to put into context, because the analyst at jpmorgan said that it can be 11,000 a cost to mine it to $146,000 to give pit market cap of gold, so it is going to depend upon what the institutional investors and the retail investors want it to be worth and how much value they are placing in it, and becky, it is interesting to hear ken griffin on squawk box last friday saying that he does not think about cryptocurrencies and comments like that seem crazy, because whether you believe it

is bitcoin or the technology behind it whether it is blockchain or central digital currency, that is where the momentum s and we have to separate the up and down daily price of the bitcoin and separate the long-term value. >> yes, court, we have seen the places like tesla saying they will accept it at one point, and accepting for it the price of the cars and you have seen places like miami saying that if you want to be paid as an employee of the city, that you could be paid eventually in bitcoin, but looking at the broad group of retailers that you are focusing on, they are not looking at that yet? >> that is a good point, becky. i was thinking about that when we started to see the run up again, and i thought that if bitcoin is going to take off, because if you can't use it ref iday, because of what it is, a commodity or a currency or the separate asset class altogether, but unless you can use it at the grocery store or the drugstore,

there are a group of people who are no longer interested in this. so that is a good point that you were making with deirdre when we are talking about the smart money, and the so-called smart money does. so it is a nice run up, and anything wrong with taking the profits off of the table here, even if you missed potentially a further runup, at least, lock in the gains that you, because we know how volatile something like bitcoin can be. >> and although, kate, you have been watching it for quite a while, too, and i would hesitate that it is not going to go quite a bit higher from here. >> courtney makes a great point about the volatility, and if you a long term holder, and if you step back and didn't watch the day-to-day move, the year-to-date gains were unbelievable and over the weekend it had almost doubled, so there are a lot of the bullish folks that you have had on your own show, and we have talked about bill miller and stan drukenmiller to have gotten

and that has driven some of it, and i think of the bitcoin pizza that got the press when it hit 20,000, and they said that pizza is now worth 1 billion or however much. so if you bought say a dress with the bit kcoin and look back and say, if it doubled, i should have used cash and i can't believe i spent my bitcoin on something that i could have used the fiat cash with. >> yes, the bitcoin pizza for those who are not familiar with it, and 10,000 bitcoins that he used to buy the pizza, and it was an expensive proposition and i hope it tasted good going down. and topic two, and the group of activists and investors with a 10% stake in kohl's are nominating a board to try to

drive the stock higher in a buyback program, and kohl's shares are buying higher, and when i looked earlier, it was up 10%, and right now, up a little over 8%, and this is what one of the activist investor said on the halftime investors. >> it is really what they set for themselves and lack of expertise in the boardroom. talking about how there might be a lot of directors, but they don't have one single retail ceo on their board it is really amazing to think that a company would be able to succeed with that kind of board with no retail expertise in the boardroom. >> so kohl's issued a strong statement ahead of the interview saying quote, we reject the investor group's attempt to seize control of the board and disrupt our momentum considering that we are well under way in implementing a strong growth strategy and accelerating the performance and refreshed half of the board with six new independent directors since

2016. and courtney, you are the expert here, and what do you think? >> well, i think that this is an interesting target especially for this group of activists investor, because they have gone after the retailers before, but retailers that were smaller, and in much more of a clear decline than kohl's. i understand that some of the points that if you are looking over the decade and the stock performance has not gone anywhere, but since october 2020 when they laid out their latest strategy, the stock price has run up about 150% or so. and when they are talking about nominating new directors to the board, it is really an entire new slate with nine people, that is an interesting thought and of course, that would really be turning the guts of that board inside-out. i know that jonathan duskin's comment of not having a single retail ceo on the board made me look into ther retailer and

actually walmart does not have a retail ceo on the board and target does not either unless you count safeway which is of course a grocer, and they do have a former ceo of a grocer on the safeway board, so i don't know if you can be successful without a former ceo of retail on the board. and so, saks put a former retail on the board and did not change their fate, and on the flip side, macellum did on big lots, and that did not change their lot. so it is an interesting target, and a lot more to chat about on this one. >> court, it is not that interesting to, not all that unusual -- go ahead. >> i was just going to say that one of the pieces that the activist investors are looking at is this partnership with amazon and when the new ceo came

in 2018, and she was praised for new ideas and taking chances, a one of those was that partnership with amazon, and so it is basically a customer could return amazon items at kohl's stores and drive traffic, and it is so interesting what he said, that is he skeptical about how much traffic and at what cost. we would love if they could disclose profitability, and that is going to say a lot about the amazon strategy and what is kohl's getting out of it and amazon is getting out of it, and is it that straight forward to drive the traffic into the stores and would it be easier to get that item on amazon and walk out and not buy it, and walk out to buy it online. so raising questions of something so revolutionary at the time, and praised for being a good thing. >> yeah, i remember that early on -- >> and basically saying that before the pandemic -- >> and driven -- >> go ahead, court. >> oh, sorry, becky. i would say that kohl's has said

about that amazon partnership that it has driven traffic and from the data they have revealed to us that it tends to be a younger customer, and often customers who have not previously shopped at kohl's, but other than that, they are vague on the details to jonathan duskin's point about the profitability and the cost of that, but they talk about it as it is an incremental positive without any numbered details. >> yeah, i remember the numbers were pretty strong when it first started and then we got interrupted by the pandemic, and who knows how that cut into the strategy and where things are, but i was going to say that it is not all that unusual to see an activist investor to be opportunistic and jump in and then you can count up easy wins if the stock does pay off after that. so anyway, let's switch topics

to instacart, and it is exploring the use of robotic warehouses according to the "financial times" and looking at ways to automate the grocery picking carts now with as many as 50 warehouses to open in the united states within a year, but instacart has denied the claims that it may attempt to one day open up its own grocery store, and the company is headed for its own ipo in a month, and should the grocers be worry and we will start it off with you, dee. >> well, the grocers should be worried, because over the last few years and through the pandemic, they have handed over extremely, extremely valuable information about the shoppers and what they want the buy and even what they like to order and even the advertising information to instacart. so if they were to go to create its own brand of grocers that

could be dangerous to the existing partners, and becky, you have said that instacart has repeatedly deny and the ceo told us over a month ago that he told us under no uncertain terms that they will not compete with their partners, and does that mean that they never will and does thatcers are going to r the important data, and they have been the ifeline, because the fees and commissions can be high, and will the grocers pay that forever, and will instacart want to do that on their own, and what the company would say is that they are focused on helping the partnerships, and they are growing a large business doing so, and the enterprise and the advertising space on the backs of the grocers so they don't necessarily need to start their own line of grocery store, because the business is booming without it, and it will continue to do so >> courtney, a tough business and traditional grocery store

business, and tough margins. >> i would bring up those margin, and razor thin, and so many years in the united states before the pandemic, and online grocery was such a tiny percent of the grocery market for a number of reasons. it is really expensive to execute for the grocery, itself. they have to have the refrigerated trucks and line up the delivery times when you can be there to accept it, and a lot of customers don't want to pay for it or haven't wanted to traditionally pay for it before the pandemic. i had asked a number of times before many different food groceries, why don't you buy instacart, and they said that we don't want to bite, because it is an expensive proposition, and we don't want to pay for it. >> and kate, the last word, and we are about out of time, but last word. >> you wonder with the existing relationshipings and imperfect relationship, but amazon trying to partner with the retailers,

and wait, you your own grocery stores and leave room for a third party and a shoppify grocery store to come in and make room for other competitors. >> kate, deirdre, courtney, great to see all of you, and it has been nice, and we will do this girl chat again soon, okay. >> thank you, becky. >> bye, guys. >> when we come back, mortgage rates are on the rise after sitting on record lows for months and poised to make homes even pricier, and we will get a chk tecofhe all important spring season. we will be right back. inflation rising and currencies falling. but i've seen centuries of rises and falls. i had a love affair with tulips once. lived through the crash of '29 and early dot-com hype. watched mortgages play the villain

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power behind the gains >> in the upward trajectory and interest rates rose more than any other week in nearly a year thanks for the spike in the 10-year treasury yield. after hitting a low of 2.57 in janway, the average rate on the 30-year just hit 3.06 this morning according to mortgage news daily, and say you wanted to take out a $300,000 mortgage at janway and waited today, you are looking at more $50 more in the monthly payment, and that may not sound like a lot, but the bigger the mortgage, the bigger the difference and the home prices are accelerating at the faster pace in several years. prices up year over year according to core logic, and compared to 4% annual price gains two years and juiced by not high demand and low supply, but record low mortgage rates. the lower the rate, the more home you can afford. for the spring market, the affordability is going to weaken

further, and the sales could take a hit, and the prices will, becky, follow on the downside. >> diana, thanks. good to see you. >> rising mortgage rates can introduce a host of issues in the red hot housing market, but the next guest says there is a slim silver lining in the red hot market. and we bring in andy walton from mortgage nightly, and tell us about this of why the higher mortgage rate is a good thing? >> yes, like diana said that the housing market is extremely hot, and coming off of the environment where 3/4 million americans chose not to sell their homes because of the pandemic which is a drastic fall of homes for sale and down 40 to 50% down from where we were and record low mortgage rates and

environment where it is difficult for home own toers buy a home, and causing the drastic rise in home price, and as diana mentioned according to the collateral analytics numbers the median price is up 15% year over year in the last three months and introducing the higher interest rate environment while it is impacting the homeowners of what they would pay it is going to introduce bidding war risk and cool down the housing market. >> i am trying to get my head around, it is going to cool down the market. so it is going to increase the price that you are going to have to pay as the buyer and more money is not going to the people involved in transaction directly. >> well, when you are looking agent what is happening in the market out there, you have potential home buyers who cannot because of the bidding war activity, and so what you want

to see when the interest rate is low, you want to see them putting the money back into the pocket, but that is not what is happening. you pay more money for the same home. so looking at the health of the housing market, reducing the rate at which the home prices are going up, the 15% price home growth is not up, that 15% is not sustainable. pulling that down to a normal level, reducing the activity a little bit you're reducing a number of bids competing in the market which could be a benefit to do >> you're still not selling me on the broken glass theory explain to me what is the rule of thumb for every quarter percentage point that mortgage rates go up what does that to in terms of price for the house >> sure, it impacts your buying power by 12% interest rates over the last two years, interest rates are down by two percentage points your buying power is down by 2%

from a year ago. the roughly quarter movement, is equivalent to roughly a 3% reduction in your buyingpower. not a massive move from interest rates but a slight cooling effect on the buying power that homeowners have in the market right now. >> andy, thank you you're a good sport. good to see you. >> absolutely, thanks. let's goat to julia boorstin's announcement or spotify. >> becky, spotfy shares are up by 4%. and company announced expansions spotify with the markets to reach an additional 1 billion people the company arranged new podcast deals with president obama and bruce springsteen. spotify is expanding its ad network to be more like facebook's with self-serve access and the ability to target spotify users off the platform

spotify is doing a new hi-fi option to get more. julia, thanu still ahead, create sift is necessary for art now the art world is getting critical. and we've got that story and whether buyer should be beware, next

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welcome back, everybody. from art to sneakers and handbags, lenders are coming up with creative collateral for wealthy people to use to raise cash robert frank joins us with that story. robert, good to see you. >> good to see you, becky. loans against art have soared to over $20 billion with collectors pulling records amounts of cash from the art on their walls during the pandemic. bank of america's art lending business up over 30% last year goldman sachs, j.p. also seeing similar gains. some of the cash is going to buy other art but also financial markets, real estate and private companies. but the big change right now and the big risk is the business of packaging these art loans and then selling them to investors

art lender athena has work backed over $40 million in investors to its parent platform yield street some of these have launched a partnership with alex claben, he's the former hedge fund manager to make borrowing easier for clients and offering loans to investors saying it understand using art which is a notoriously ill-liquid, opaque and thicker market as collateral >> we've historically shown prudent-risk management and the ability to really assess the value of work and lending against it >> we really do differentiate ourselves is with the -- we've had the quite extraordinary data sets we have both around objects and clients. in our minds, it is one of the, you know, most compelling growth

opportunities in the overall sotheby's system >> sotheby's also considering expanding beyond art to include classic cars, handbags and jewelry. becky, when you can borrow against your berken bag, i think we've reached peak leverage. >> that is my question, why in the heck if you're wealthy do you borrow against it? robert, we'll have to save it for another conversation, okay >> thanks. does does it for the "the exchange." "power lunch" is up after the next break

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claim your seventy-five-dollar credit when you post your first job at indeed.com/groomer good afternoon, welcome to "power lunch," everybody, along with melissa lee, i'm tyler mathisen tech stocks feeling heat the sector down roughly 2% after last week's fall are we now in for a tech reckoning? plus, bitcoin falling dipping below $50,000. yikes. we're talking to the ceo that just launched the firs