tv Squawk Box CNBC March 26, 2021 6:00am-9:00am EDT
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after yesterday's 200 point gain for the dow. nasdaq was all over the place. managed to eek out a small gain. supply chain disaster. the ship blocking the suez canal is holding up an estimated $400 million in trade per hour. and elon musk ordered to delete a tweet and ordered to rehire a terminated employee over a labor law violation it is friday, march 26th, 2021 "squawk box" starts now. ♪ ♪ good morning welcome to "squawk box" here on
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cnbc i'm brebecca quick along with je kernen andrew is off today. the dow was up by 200 points the stocks slid until 11:00 a.m. and then picked up nasdaq eeked out a gain of 15 points the green arrows this morning. dow futures are up almost triple digits s&p futures up 13. the nasdaq indicated up by 48 points probably worth taking a look at treasury yields. the ten-year is yielding 1.657%. we have been in a tight range for several weeks at this point. market likes to stay right in the middle of that otherwise, if things get too high or low, you see pressure, especially on the nasdaq let's look at the "squawk stack. draw out more stories we want to talk about joe, we had a debate back and
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fo forth. we talked about the "squawk stack" this morning. one obviously came up which was gamestop it is up 10.5% this morning. it was up yesterday by more than 50%. this came after the decline of 30% before that. there's been big swings. anybody who thought retail there was dead on this you were wrong $202 this morning. >> we've talked about the math is complicated you go down 30 you need to go back 50 that's not exactly right >> right >> you go down 50. you need to go back 100. i have been thinking about this. >> right >> those comments from yellen and powell we'll talk to the former acting controller of the currency in this hour at some point. talk about really devastating comments from powell and yellen about the prospects for digital currency any kind and what china is doing.
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with we saw the big move. these are moves from 61,000 to 49,000 which would not matter if it wasn't $1 trillion market cap. a lot of retail investors is part of the whole thing we've been talking about and part of the stimulus checks. it finds its way to gamestop and bitcoin and crazy nfts we will talk to a technician in a couple minutes technical analyst about whether any of this is portending trouble. with so much stimulus and another $3 trillion and the fed saying 2023. maybe it is not. maybe we do need to worry. it seems like there are troubling signs sdplchlt yeah. that's a statement that makes you nervous hearing it
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retail investors disappeared earlier this week. you wonder if they were looking at march madness or on spring break. they came back to gamestop yesterday. these checks continue to come in we have breaking news for you. >> march madness and bitcoin look predictable >> right >> the ten-year yield. cra crazy. on the big picture for the economy. it is stupid five basis points. there are algos that the basis points make a difference and we overstate the importance of the tiny moves and the borrowing money and yields it is ridiculous that five basis points makes a difference. >> it moves and you assume it keeps moving >> we were below 1.6 yesterday for a while. 1 1.59 1.67 earlier today
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now 1.65 >> we'll talk more about oil and the suez canal in a bit. we have breaking news from wework the company is planning to go public by a spac the deal will value wework at $9 billion including debt the paper says it will be among the investors at starwood capital and fidelity if those are the pipe investors, they are the due diligence companies. the spac in question is boex acquisition corps. wework was in talks with boex. this is a big deal we watched wework as the ipo was yanked in 2019 when they tried to go public watched the iteration that happened and the pandemic hitting really did a big impact as so many people weren't going to work. so many questions that have come
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around this. it is worth noting when you have starwood capital, barry st sternlicht and fidelity, they he w with were looking for more than $500 million to be put in that by the big investors, the question is will they show up? this is interesting news just breaking now, joe. >> and a saga of the things swirling around wework and the way they accounted for the forecasts and everything then you throw in the pandemic let's see. they will give you a place where you can go to work outsource a place to collect employees and go to work suddenly nobody goes to work anymore. my home is where -- your home.
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that's where they are going now. they interact with zoom. the whole thing broke down, isn't it >> bet on this would be a bet on the return of cities and return of the work force. back in the workplace. that would be a certain bet on this you hear somebody like barry on earlier this week. he said there would be a big return he talked about that with these issues if you see starwood in as an investor, you have to believe that is his thesis getting carried out. the cities will make a comeback and people will go back to work. >> i hope so it is still quiet here lawmakers meanwhile grill the ceos of facebook, twitter and google over misinformation on the platforms ylan mui joins us now. >> reporter: good morning, joe democrats accuse ceos of
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misinformation of proliferation on the platforms as they defended themselves and ramped up the fight and cracking down democrats claim that divisive content drives engagement and the platforms have a financial incentive to leave it up >> each of you acknowledge that your company has profited off harmful misinformation and violent content on your platforms? say yes or no. >> no. >> i don't think we profit from it i think it hurts our service. >> certainly not our intent. >> since you said no, can you provide how you managed to avoid collecting revenue from ads targeted by or served on such content? >> reporter: the solution the democrats appear to be heading toward is to realign the industry incentives by reforming section 230 liability
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protections. republicans want to change the law, too, but for different reasons. the argue is the platforms are overzealous in taking down content. there was one who asked jack dorsey if he believed private companies should be the arbiters of truth dorsey said no, but the government shouldn't be either back to you. >> this is getting interesting we will have discussion today, ylan obviously, about all of these things we had one yesterday i don't know if you caught it. strong feelings on both sides of the issue as well. you know, i think it reminds me of "spiderman. with great freedom, comes great responsibility with great power, comes great responsibility i feel bad for zuckerberg. he needs to -- it will take him a while. he needs to look at every post
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you know what i mean >> reporter: right i thought the lawmakers did really a good job of staying focused and streamlining the topics and themes of questioning. one thing they did was to bring up the personal accounts of individuals who either had been bullied or somehow had a negative experience on the platforms or specific pieces of information allowed to stay up of course, as the company said they cannot police billions of posts on the platform every day, but individual pieces of content is that is the point you can't stay ahead of the problem. that is why washington may need to step in here. there was a theme or questions around the relationship of the platforms to children and the potential harm they could face on social media. even asking the ceos of how do you limit screen time for your
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kids what are you doing during the pandemic i thought that was compelling as well in trying to make this a personal argument and not a policy one >> joe, your line about with great power comes great responsibility it's funny yesterday, i was talking to a washington policy type for one of the big tech companies. i used that same line in quoting to them. why don't you go after the other people because you are the biggest. you are the ones who exist you are the ones making decisions. i don't care about mother jones or other places i haven't seen anything from. you are the influencer with great power comes great responsibility. >> that was tobey mcguire's uncle. the late great cliff robertson, i believe. the other one i use, it is embarrassing it is from joc ewing
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that's a good one. i loved him. joc. jim davis. i loved him. he's gone, too not bad. you know i have a problem. i don't think you have enough tremble in your whistle. thank you, ylan. coming up. >> interesting stuff >> it is coming up, futures are in the green. it's early we will talk technical about some of the big high flyers and names we talk about all the time what do they look like on the chart? checking the shares of gamestop the stock jumped 52% yesterday no apparent news the day after it dropped l again in the pre-market we'lbe right back. ♪ i'm so glad i ♪ ♪ found you ♪ >> announcer: this cnbc program is sponsored by baird.
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it is bumpy. what are the macro factors before we get into the individual names you see in the charts >> sure. becky and joe, thanks for having me on the show the macro factors we have to pay attention to is the interest rates. clearly a change is starting to happen on the interest rate front. we could see rates continue to keep moving higher through this year originally we talked about 150 or 175 on the ten-year that will prove to be a bit low. we could potentially see ten-year bond move up toward 2%. joe, when that does happen, what we will see is the sort of compression. higher multiple stocks are probably going to come down in valuation. at the same time in time, you see earnings moving up you could see a market which could be stuck you may need to move sideways which is what you see with the nasdaq stocks. the faang name to be specific.
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>> you point out the path of least resistance is up we talked about this earlier unwaivering fiscal and monetary policy should help absorb the rise and rates in other speed bumps. >> correct i continue to think we got the fed still very accommodating i don't see them raising rates any time soon. we could see more fiscal spending from washington big package got approved we will see infrastructure coming potentially coming between those two pieces, there is a lot of money in the system. i think trying to keep it system looking at the charts and keeping it simple. the primary trend is still higher, but the rotation in the market as interest rates are starting to changes. we will get speed bump setbacks along the way. the market still will work higher toward the year-end objective toward the year of
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2025 >> i mentioned 12,500. it was on a friday a couple weeks ago. it got ugly that day it was down a lot. you think right now the resistance, i'm sorry, support looks like 12,6 and after that 1 1 12, 12 12,050 what is the lower level? >> the key level we have to watch is we have to watch the moving average nasdaq corrected about 8% to 9% from the 52-week high. we broken the up support trend high from march lows last year the 200 day is coming in at 11,873, joe. that is the level i'm watching that is one of the big psychological levels
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>> the individual names we will talk about we are already out of time, craig. we booked a segment to talk about tesla and paypal and zoom. even on the charts those are still positive don't buy now. wait to buy all of those on further weakness >> the quick rundown is you have seen up trend violations in zoom and paypal and also now you have a downward trending channel in zoom at this point in time i think you have anywhere from a 20% down side where you find support in tesla to about 10% support in paypal to down side of 10% before you find support in zoom. there are other things in the nasdaq i would rather buy in market than those three names. >> long-term ease in if you get a better buy opportunity. craig, thank you piper sand i have to get used to that it happens all the time.
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they are all merged. they are all double names. thank you. see you again. >> thank you >> we'll check back. thanks, joe. when we come back, the nasdaq's board room diversity proposal hitting a speed bump leslie picker joins us for that. and as we head to break, check out shares of nio. they are shutting down for five days due to the global shortage of the semie semiconductors. we heard a similar story of the f-150 plants wall street is watching every delivery stock is down by 1% this morning. "squawk box" is right back the” joe esposito]
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the nasdaq boardroom diversity proposal is delayed by the s.e.c. leslie picker has the state of director diversity what is the problem, leslie? >> reporter: becky, it was hailed as a progressive and bold move by the nasdaq recommended objective to have two directors on the boardboards if not, the companies had to explain why. it faced praise from sheryl sandberg and mellody hobson and
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kewsong it lee on the flip side, the detractors included the members of the banking senate committee arguing it is moving out of the scope and it would interfere with shareholder fiduciary duties in response to the criticism, nasdaq watered down the rule a bit and the ongoing controversy means the proposal is not sailing through the s.e.c. with the agency announcing it will take a few more months to review the implications guys >> it seems odd. you think the nasdaq, if they want to set limitations and the companies don't like them, they can go elsewhere good to the nyc and still have the opportunity to trade it is odd they are concerned about that >> reporter: well, it is more than the s.e.c. they need approval from. they received a lot of positive
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support for the proposal they have seen a significant amount of criticism and concern as well. it is something i think a lot of people expected to really fly through and be a no-brainer. now it is taking more time to sort itself out. >> leslie, while you are here, we should ask about the robinhood story. planning an initial public offering sources are quoted with reuters saying it is building a platform to allow users to get early access and snap up shares alongside big players of wall street now they can't buy into the stock of the newly listed company until the shares start trading. big funds could give allocations with the ipos getting advantage. the trading pop was 36%. it would be great news if the retail investors could get access to this how in the world would that work
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from robinhood's perspective how do they access >> that is my question as well, becky. i think we saw a lot of ideas. i don't know if anyone is feeling too much fomo of the ipos of this week which plummeted in the debuts. last year, we saw gains in airbnb and doordash on the first day of trading more than doubling on the first day of rading. if you are a retail investor, it is difficult to get allocation to the stock and ride the up side. i'm sure robinhood faced criticism. i'm missing outon the gains th big guys get you are supposed to be democratizing. the one missnomer is they don't
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get allocation this is done through brokerage >> it is not much. >> it is not much when you think of the number of retail investors. >> right the percentage that goes to retail investors and the percentage that is retail -- yeah >> right actually the rule of thumb on wall street is the hotter deals you actually have a smaller allotment for retail maybe you need to offload stock. that is what happened with facebook gave too much to retail. retail is offering in at high prices turning it on its head, it is not you have to investors of who gets the allocation. investors can say we are willing to pay high prices that decision comes down to the issuers and banks. they have put together what is known as the book. they say here is who we want to buy into the deal.
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the idea that it is up to robinhood to democratize, it may have more control with the ipo i don't see how they do that without buy-in ahead of time. >> they could become a partner with an underwriter with cost and regulation that comes along with that. if they did that, they could be part of the option process >> that's definitely true. that is a different side of business it comes with different risks and regulations and approvals in order to become an underwriter of the deals even if they were an underwriter, it is unlikely they would be a lead underwriter. the one tasked with allocating the stock. if they are farther down on the pecking order of underwriters, they will not have as much say i'm hard pressed to see them being able to elbow out goldman
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sachs or morgan stanley. >> not to mention robinhood is good at building a platform. engineers have done a great job on that. they have not done a great job of dealing with the risk which is what we saw them run into with the trouble this year with how much they had on hand and how much they needed on hand not a huge vote of confidence of the risk assessment abilities. >> that's a great point and taking on that role. thank you. >> great to see you, leslie. >> do you think we will use the word fomo in two or three years, leslie beck i think it's here. >> i think it is the sign of the times. >> right we don't have enough time. we need the quick things lol. right? i'm laughing at that wth. you know what wth? it is like wtf
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i can't say wtf. i say wth. what the heck? thanks, leslie i think we will be using it. it will be in the oxford english. coming up, the biden showdown with china. next, an update now on the ship that is stuck in the suez canal. officials say dredging operations, i can't imagine what is involved here, at the bow of the ship are about 87% complete. what a complete pain this must be dredging is complete, but tugboats will resume they are using helicopters to move it. there are no cranes available. as we head to break. here is a look at the s&p 500 winners and losers from yesterday.
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china. china has an overall goal and i don't criticize them for the goal they have an overall goal to be the leading country in the world, the wealthiest country in the world and most powerful country if n the world. that is not going to happen on my watch the united states will continue to expand. >> that was president biden yesterday. that was his speech as nike and adidas face a ban in china over the forced use of labor allegations. we have dewardwick o'neil who is the managing director and cnbc contributor. gentlemen, thanks for being here why don't we start with talking about what this means for global
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companies? we mentioned some companies, but this seems like a time where companies are going to be forced to take sides and maybe not move as easily as multinationals as in the past. do you believe that? >> i think so, becky if you are a western brand with a footprint in china, you will be forced to choose a side or conform to chinese values and norms. i think it is time for western companies to reassess assumptions about china and make sure they are well suited for today's china. this is a time for you to understand the china of 20 years ago does not exist the ability to thread the needle and not choose a side is less and less possible. i think we're going to see a lot more of this this xi boycott is one of many
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issues that western companies can find themselves in what the contradiction of the chinese market expecting for companies in the market to do. i think we have to take this serious. this is not a time for best-case scenario planning. we are not in the best of times. >> that's a pretty dire outlook for companies that have been operating as multinationals for decades as this point and built up markets not only here and in china and other asian markets and other places if you are saying you have to choose sides, you have to pick which customers you stick with and which ones you are willing to leave off >> i'm not saying it, but i think we have seen offever the t two years that the chinese are certainly saying it. they will not allow for the sort of statements and company values and corporate responsibility we are used to seeing in this country. that may not play well in it china. at some point, you may have to
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decide i know that sounds grim. i think one of the mistakes that western brands have made is focused on best-case scenario planning and not the reality of meeting china where it is today. this is not the china of 20 years ago. h&m made a statement of working with 350 brands. that is not good the chinese don't care how long you have been in china or how many brands you have been working with they were not happy with the statement and that is what h&m and nike is being punished with. we need to be real about the risks when you depend on the china market and this environment. >> leyland, describe a bit about this situation what happened and where do you think it goes from here? >> you know, we have seen boycotts before in the chinese market against americans or against the japanese companies
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or korean companies. this feels different st sometimes a push back. a pllever for the state to summ chinese and able to push back one lever of geo politics and pushing policies they don't like this is different. you look back at what has been happening and this is not just about bad policy choices or something that the clchinese ar objecting to this is about xi western companies said we are not involved in the problematic supply chains, but recognize there is ap problem what the chinese said that is not acceptable you have to be clear that it is not a problem in the supply chain. they are creating a black and white issue here it is difficult to extricate
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the chinese said is saying that signals you are anti-china if you don't participate. this is black and white the way other boycotts were not in the past. >> we are talking about nike h&m&a and adidas. elon musk says he thinks china is the biggest market when he talked up china earlier this week can those companies continue to walk a fine line leland >> not if it continues the way it is continuing the problem here is not just about cotton or tomatoes you are talking about a biden stimulus package creating a green revolution you have a lot of the world and silicon coming from china. there is an itch thankt is very important for the companies to
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figure out in the supply chains. beyond that, if this continues the way it is, we are looking at consumer decoupling. that is more severe than china with a certain supply chain in tech or pharmaceuticals. the chinese will have to make a decision how much they want to continue this. this could escalate very quickly from here. >> dawardric, the biden administration taking a stronger stance than the chinese anticipated, but building the supply chains in the united states and the factors that we have seen to start building a lot of the things we traditionally relied overseas manufacturers for. is that part of the tension here >> i think so. it is not the only part. there is a real geo political competition between the countries. joe biden had made it clear he will rally allies to compete
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with china and try to pressure china on some of the sensitive issues as leland said, taiwan, the issues that the chinese regard as core interests. they will push back extremely hard and they feel more powerful today than they he did in the past they feel like they can push their weight around and force companies to choose. i agree with leland. this is black and white in the way it has never been before and threading the needle is more and more difficult for companies to do >> wow gentlemen, thank you very much good to see you both this morning. >> thank you, becky. coming up, berkshire hathaway went to help texas avoid another power crisis that story later. more fireworks from the big tech hearing on the hill reminder you can watch or listen -- never get over that. watch or listen to us live anytime tnbonhe cc app.
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ten natural gas plants that would operate during extreme times of need. extreme heat and extreme cold and not compete in the power market in the state. joe, this has the characteristics of the buffet deal saying we will build it and have guaranteed returns of 9% according to the wall street journal. in turn, berkshire saying if these plants don't work, we will write a $4 billion insurance policy to cover any problems that would have been there from the lack of energy that's probably a compelling deal on some fronts to the politicians who are looking for an answer to make sure they can tell people this is never going to happen again. we heard yesterday from richard fisher who said 500,000 people moved to the state from places like california and new york and new jersey people who have got ten away fro
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the high taxes and moved down there. you have companies setting up servers. the first question for any business is how do you make sure we don't run into problems like this again how do you guarantee the power will stay on texas has advantages, but this is a problem >> that is a buffet deal 9% nobody gets 9% he will. where can we get the insurance probably get the insurance perfect for him. he's got -- we know he is sitting on stuff going, i'm not doing anything with this right now. i'm sure he is because of things being so crazy don't you think he has money to blow >> yeah. more than $120 billion >> this is one of those things >> invest in this. they can do it quickly it can provide an answer to politicians who need to say we
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have a solution to this. we have not heard solutions to this point the problems that were never supposed to happen how do you in an unregulated market make sure it never happens again. i'm looking for a quick and easy solution. >> if i'm leanding money to someone, they cannot say joe kernen is lending me money just because i'm getting him to lend me money, i get 10% the company is in bed with him and say i'm in bed with warren buffet he gets 10%. remember back in the financial crisis >> goldman sachs >> yeah. the company can say warren gave me money he can say ha-ha 12% in a 2% interest rate environment. from goldman sachs who is probably good for it it's a good deal if you can get it. coming up, bitcoin briefly
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it's more a speculative asset that's essentially a substitute for gold rather than for the dollar >> that was fed chair jay powell warning of the risks associated with cryptocurrency. bitcoin down 10% you saw my expression there, brian. that's very perplexing to me i'll tell you why. i will give him the first statement, that it's highly volatile and at this point it's tough to use for transactions, but then he says it's not really a store of value and then says it's essentially a substitute for gold so the 4,000, 5,000 year store of value that we know historically as gold and he said it's like gold but it's not a
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store value. so does he not think gold is a store value? and with what the fed is doing, the dollar, is that a store of value? >> you're thinking about it exactly the right way. there's a lot to unpack there. first of all, as a store of value, there's a reason why people are flocking to bitcoin as a store of value. we increased the money 40% it means the dollar is a 40% less good store of value than it was a year ago that's one of the reasons people went to bitcoin. joe, the point i want to make is the dollar may not be backed by anything cryptocurrencies are backed by something. they're backed by underlying networks and what you're buying when you buy a crypto token, whether it's bitcoin or anything else, is you're buying a piece of a financial network that's being built to transact all kinds of stuff and the number of
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things that have gone unchained in the last two years is enormously high. that's why the cryptocurrency market stays a $2 billion market i believe in the wisdom of crowds there's forces of the future at work here and forces of the status quo the crowds are telling you where these network finances are going in the future, i want to be part of that. >> there's books written about the madness of crowds. that's the thing they always go back to tulip bulbs. you either love them or hate them bitcoin has been around every -- every transaction is on that blockchain because of that that's why you think it has the most value -- first one to get to a trillion dollars. >> bitcoin was the first token to show you finance can be done on a networked basis as opposed to the bank. other cryptocurrencies have done the same but bitcoin was the
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first so when it got early adoption when they say, gosh, it's not worth anything but speculation the reason why there are $61 billion of transaction is because that network is adopted by people who used to go to the bank. >> this is the trillion dollar question can you fight city hall? that's what scares -- can you fight city snal if yellen and powell decide this is not k kosher, not something we accept, can they stop it or is it too big, too powerful, too -- >> hey, joe you can absolutely fight city hall. remember, every mayor tried to stop uber and 50 million americans wanted it and now we have t. the same as crypto. >> you are the former controller of the currency so we want to have you back and talk about this not many government types talk like you
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mccarthy did most of them are with yellen and powell, right? most of them are still like that thank you, brian >> thank you, joe. coming up, futures point to a higher open. "squawk box" will be right back. they changed how the world fights cancer. blocking the pd-l1 protein, lets the immune system attack, attack, attack cancer. pd-l1 transformed, revolutionized, immunotherapy. pd-l1 saved my life. saved my life. saved my life. what we do here at dana-faber, changes lives everywhere. everywhere. everywhere. everywhere. everywhere. let's meet the defending champs. kim kietz, investor. i invested in invesco qqq a fund that invests in the innovations of the nasdaq-100. like 3d rendering software. become an agent of innovation with invesco qqq. ♪
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and 2 free smartphones. plus you'll now get netflix on us. all this for up to 50% off vs. verizon. it's all included. 2 lines of unlimited for only $70 bucks. and this rate is fixed. you'll pay exactly $70 bucks total. this month and every month. only at t-mobile. - grammarly business helps my company build higher performing sales teams. since simon's team started using grammarly business to sharpen their writing, we've closed more deals. learn more at grammarly.com/business. stocks looking to build on thursday's turn around the dow and s&p 500 snapping a two week losing streak we'll tell you what you need to watch ahead of the opening bell straight ahead.
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things are getting a little salty in washington. will the salt tax deduction be debated. pent-up demand and stimulus checks help restaurants. the second hour of "squawk box" begins right now good morning want a bottle of red and a bottle of white, i think. >> why not, it's friday. >> yeah, here on cnbc. oh, i'm joe kernen predicted that line along with becky quick. u.s. equity futures this morning take a quick look. wow, they're fading in and out
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up about 121 on the dow. nice soft, nice -- nasdaq up about 15, almost 16. standard & poor's up 12.5. if you do this, i'm going to ask you to do this all the time. it's nicer, isn't it, becky? do you like it, becky, when they do the soft fading in and out with the music >> no, yeah, keep it sticking around i like it, too plus -- oh, you know, i think this is good news as we start to reopen the economy more restaurants coming back more that's what this song has me feeling this morning, too. >> excellent taking my time here. all right. here is this morning's stack we had some suggestions. we put maybe amcm in that's like gamestop that's a better representation of the reddit wall street bets,
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moves we've seen in the market becky, we get upset when retail investors make money have i ever given that impression how about all we care about are hedge funds? >> not at all. >> i don't care one iota about any hedge fund person. >> i actually like to see retail investors make money. >> i don't ever give them any thought. i don't hang out with them it's just really weird that people look for that but it's twitter. why am i even talking about it never mind then you saw the 10-year at 1.67 which has moved back up. we just heard the gentleman from piper sandler saying it's all about -- still is about interest rates in terms of the nasdaq, not necessarily based on business being bad but just the future value based on when interest rates go up discount value comes down a little bit in the multiple but it hasn't yet. >> right in the meantime, we do have this
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news that we've been following this morning wework is out with the news that it plans to go public through a spac merger. this is a $9 billion deal when you include debt if you look at the investors involved this is important. fidelity, starwood capital they're involved in the deal with the pipe investors. private placement investors who are involved in this the spac is boax acquisition corporation which is sponsored by bo capital management that's run by sacramento kings owners it lists shaquille o'neal as an advisor. in fact, we are going to have the owners joining us in the next hour to talk about the deal there was an article in the ft earlier that raised questions about what was going to happen about how much money the company had lost in the last year. they got ahold of some slides that had been presented rchlt
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maybe it benefits that as you have noted when you were playing that song, there's huge pent-up demand for that. can you say the thing about going back to work may not be the same. >> for the bosses, yes employees, maybe not quite the same. >> i think maybe there is some i think there is some or else we're all gb to go lunatics sitting at home with that terrible zoom shot looking up your moss strils. >> too late. >> nice shot. >> maybe there is pent-up demand certainly new york is not going to thrive just based on people going out at night in restaurants. you need people to come back to work in the city >> yeah, that's a huge part of it if you're betting on the return of cities, that's a questionable bet right now. if you're betting on the returns of cities, this would be one of the places you might do that anyway, we'll be talking to both of those gentlemen coming up i
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believe at the top of the 8 a.m. hour in other headlines, the bank stocks are gaining ground in the pre-market trading that move will come after the june round of stress tests if the banks can maintain sufficient capital june 30th is the date they're looking at bank of america is the biggest gainer up by 1.4% in the meantime, trading platform robinhood is reportedly building a platform that allows users to buy the shares. robinhood is including its own planned ipo in some of the plans. in order to accomplish this, robinhood would need to strike agreements with companies planning to go public as well as brokerages as well as approval from u.s. regulators leslie said there are questions about that it would be something if you wanted to create an option platform but it would require regulatory signoff and other
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risks associated with that, too. in the meantime, vanguard said it made errors in the last year in the education savings accounts of some customers vanguard said it allocated more money to stock than it had intended for a plan that was administered by the state of nevada that error has now been corrected. it didn't say how many customers were affected or if that resulted in better returns because of the stock market's gains last year but we can sure hope so. >> becky, you have hulu, right >> i have what >> hulu? >> yeah. >> you can watch -- it's for the kids don't let the -- but "nomad land" francis mcdermott. probably going to win best picture according to my son. >> i read up on it because it has gotten so much critical acclaim. it's fascinating. >> there are nomads that live in vans
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it's very sort of -- it's maudlin and sad but very -- you know, it's just really good. she's -- she is amazing but her van -- this is why i'm bringing it up. you know what she named her van that she travels around in >> what? >> vanguard. my free association. >> smart >> putting in a plug for -- she's amazing. don't look for the -- i did feel uplifted at the end because you just sort of -- life is -- throws stuff at you. the massive containership blocking the suez canal further stressing an already stressed supply chain brian sullivan knows about this and costing billions of dollars. you have a chance, you have time on your hands if you want to watch it don't look for a lot to happen in that movie. how long is this going to be closed, this canal can you imagine, 1300 foot ship. can you imagine if that thing really dug in the side of the
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stloil and the dredging that would be required? you think about getting a car stuck. i mean, that is just unbelievable i don't think we can fathom what it really entails. >> reporter: no. the way i described it on "worldwide exchange," you park your giant suv parallel and two people move in and you have an inch between the bumpers and you're trying to get out that's kind of what it's like. this is not only a big ship, this is one of the biggest containerships in the world. 20,000 of those containers that you see on the back of those 18 wheelers, there's 20,000 of those on this. the worse case is the suez canal, we all know one of the most waterways, transit points of whatever in the world, could be closed for weeks. doesn't mean it will that's kind of the worse case. that's a bad case. there is some hope this weekend on mother nature
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there's an unusually high tide that's going to flow in. officials in the suez, they're hoping that's just enough to lift the pressure on the bottom of this ship, which you can see has turned completely sideways, completely dug into the mud. the suez remains closed. what's the impact here right now we'll have to wait and see. the suez is more goods coming from asia to europe. that ship was going from china to rotterdam it had things like due catti motorcycles, beer, others. many ships are considering the longer route 200 ships are at anchor waiting. can they get into the suez, should they wait it out? that could add $500,000 to a trip going around, there's the increased risk of piracy you have to go through dangerous waters to do that. by the way, some impacts on this, guys
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oil prices are on the rise how come well, if you're waiting for a load of oil or gas, it's not there. you have to buy it from somewhere. two cargos of l&g from shaneer, texas, they sold it to customers are being rerouted from texas around africa. they're not going to try to go through the suez they're going around shipping rates are already inflated supply chains are tight. smitt salvage is the navy s.e.a.l.s of rescue. a lot of people say why don't they unload the cargo? they can't there's no cranes. the only way to get the containers off the ship would be by helicopter. you played scenes from an italian restaurant, brenda and eddie, king and queen of the prom the big waterbed is sitting on a container. >> i'm glad you're as crazy as i am, brian, bringing up totally
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insane things in the conversation so to go around the tip of africa, south africa, is that good hope or good -- i think that's good hope, isn't it that takes an extra two weeks. >> good hope. >> an extra two weeks and costs a lot more money, does it not? >> 4 to 500 tho,000 bucks we talked about a container story. i was down in south carolina a few weeks ago. it's not as if the ships are sitting around if you own one of these ships that's not stuck waiting to go through the suez, good times because people are going to pay you whatever it takes to get their cargo. look at that picture literally -- go back to that, guys this has become an internet meme there's one guy in a backhoe
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trying to pull the ship out. there's tugboats pulling it. the water is not that deep i'm not going to try to scare anybody but, joe, there is some concern about the ship's structural integrity, not yet. not saying there's a huge risk, but reading something last night -- >> don't say it. >> -- because the front is jacked up. >> titanic. >> if the rear gets jacked up, it could sag in the middle. >> titanic leo holding on before he went sliding down into the -- because the thing's like -- don't even say that but, brian, i thought we did a lot of -- we have a lot of domestic production. the suez canal isn't what it used to be for oil it's 10% of all products, all oil. >> 7ish. >> but -- and we haven't really seen it yet, but we will, i would think, if this continues anyway, we've got to -- which movie was that do you know for a fact there's water beds on that boat?
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>> no. it was a reference -- i was trying to connect the dots between your billy joel reference -- >> reference to billy joel. >> and the container -- brenda and eddie. they got divorced and then they met again. >> all right thank you. >> lyrics from the song. the lyrics from -- >> i can do the whole song but nobody wants that. >> it's okay with me these days. me too we'll challenge you after work, brian. got a new life and the family is fine when we go back, the ship is as tall as the eiffel tower and that may be part of the problem. putting ships too big in there wall street looking to build off of yesterday's strong close. we'll speak to russ kostrich that's coming up about the rotation to cyclicals. "squawk box" will be right back.
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so jeff, you need all those screens streaming over your xfinity xfi... for your meeting? usaa. what you're made of, we're made for. uhh yes. and your lucky jersey? oh, yeah. lauren, a cooler? it's hot. it's march. and jay, what's with all your screens? just checking in with my team... of colleagues. so you're all streaming on every device in the house, what?!! that was a foul. it's march... ...and you're definitely not watching basketball. no, no. i'm definitely not watching basketball. right... ( horn blaring ) may continue, maybe not but we have seen investors start moving away from riskier assets. the cnbc spac index down 21% from the most recent high.
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bitcoin off 16%. tesla falling 29% from the january high we saw that the etf down 28% or so some say it's cause for concern. others call it a healthy pull back here to make sense of it is russ he's with blackrock. that's always the point. is it time to -- is there still time to exit or is it time to start maybe adding to some of the stocks you might have liked to own twomonths ago but they were too expensive >> i think it's the latter it's going to be choppier. we think the stocks are going to end the year higher. it's only down a few percentage points this is about a sector rotation. again, i think that the -- i'm going to call it the obvious trade but to me the trade that makes the most sense is the
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cyclical trade keeping quality and we're going to have gaudy gdp numbers. that lifting operating earnings. some of that is in tech and includes companies like semiconductors, payment companies. i think the main thing we're trying to do is position the portfolio to take advantage of a very different economic environment than we've seen in a very long time >> the value -- the growth to value trade has been forecast for a while and there's been some false starts. people have done that too early. are you sure that's going to be -- we still have people come on, russ, that say i'm sticking with growth. it's just never -- it's just going to be the future it's not going to be that. >> by the way, i don't disagree with that. we still have a lot of technology companies i think one of the things that we're trying to do is get long cyclicals without abandoning growth and getting into deep value.
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there's a lot of overlap but they're not necessarily the same trades we have not been selling down long-term quality companies we like we've been trying to do is look for more cyclical expressions. with tech that can mean rotating towards semiconductors, payment companies that tend to be more cyclical to the software part of the market consumers looking at housing, housing related names. more financials. i think everyone's focus is growth, value, debate. last year is one of those years where it made a big difference, but to me this is more about the cyclical exposure than abandoning growth. >> and just about everyone talks about this we have rising rates, stimulus and fed help as well rising rates and rising corporate taxes and rising maybe capital gains taxes. does one offset the other in terms of stimulus and free money?
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>> you know, i think it's the free question. the taxes i do think are outstanding, is a risk we don't know the magnitude. we don't know the timing that can make a big difference for capital gains. there's definitely that risk out there. the rate issue is more nuanced you know this very well. you go back and look at history. relationship between nominal and real rates is more complicated than the simple notion that rates go up, stocks go down. particularly if rates are rising in these very low levels, at least historically stocks have tended to move up with rising rates. if they're moving up, means the economy is getting better. i think what's tripped up the market the last month is less about the fact that the 10-year backed up to 165 than the rapidity of the move it's less about the level of the rate at these levels, more about rate vol more equity vol is a headwind for multiples. that's why the market has been pausing in the recent weeks.
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>> in terms of the absolute level of interest rates and the absolute level of the market in terms of multiples, you don't think it's totally out of zploel. >> no. no, i don't. i think the market can live with a 165 10-year. it can live with 1.95 10-year if it has 6 or 8% gdp i'm less worried about a 1.75, 1.80 10-year the issue is are we going to see the rate vol decline >> what's blackrock got now? if you change your mind on any of this, would you let us know it would make a big -- like $80 trillion or something. not quite but -- >> might be a little less. >> maybe a little less but a lot. a lot. all right, russ. thank you. >> thanks, joe coming up, pent-up demand
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and stimulus money giving a boost to casual dining a look at that sector when we return "squawk box" is coming right back time now for today's aflac trivia question. what device released in 1993 gave rise to the term personal digital assistant? the answer when cnbc's "squawk box" continues aflac! what a day of upsets. jill's certainly upset with that unexpected bill from her back surgery. aflac! let's see that one more time. (beep sound) oooh, right in the wallet! ouch! aflac! aflac would have paid jill cash directly to help with expenses health insurance doesn't cover. hold on, i think she's trying to give us a side-eye... because she can't turn her head! get help with expenses health insurance doesn't cover. aflac! official partner of march madness. this is andy, my schwab financial consultant. here's andy listening to my goals and making plans. this is us talking tax-smart investing, managing risk, and all the ways schwab can help me invest.
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now the answer to today's aflac trivia question. what device released in 1993 gave rise to the term personal digital assistant? the answer, apple's newton message pad. h'm. pda. anyway, the casual dining sector was struggling before the pandemic hit, but as vaccines and stimulus are rolling out, things are shifting. kate rogers has more kate, good morning. >> reporter: becky, good morning. casual dining does have a boost with pent-up demand and extra
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spending money overall same store sales down 1.2% in q1 this year from a drop of 13.1% the same quarter last year same-store sales are up 45% across the states. the firm is citing covid cases declining, vaccines and springtime weather something that btig is echoing at texas road house and darden that's the parent of olive garden and steakhouse. it also announced it would spend $17 million on one-time bonuses and pay raises for workers getting to $12 an hour including tips by 2023 investors seem to be confident as well. take a look at some of these stocks some of the best performers year to date are not the qsrs and pizza names, darden, brinker,
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texas road house, blooming brands all some of the biggest gainers year to date the one-year moves are impressive brinker up more than 300%. analysts at stevens have said we could be in a new golden age for casual dining, which is not something, becky, you would expect to have heard this time last year. >> back over to you. >> it's been crazy watching these stocks up even more than they were before the pandemic hit. you have to wonder how much does digital come into this >> i think a lot of these players have really wisely leaned into digital even more as we've seen across the restaurant space. with mobile order and pay, a lot are on mobile delivery apps and curbside darden said 19% of the q3 sales were digital another interesting thing, c
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chilies rolled out wings digital is going to become increasingly important in the casual space in the months and years to come. >> kate, thanks a lot. good to see ou >> thank you we do have much more to come on "squawk box." we're going to be talking taxes and removing the s.a.l.t. cap with josh gottheimer and french hill plus, wework announcing the plan to go public by a spac. we have a first on cnbc interview coming up. stay tedun you're watching "squawk box" and this is cnbc achievable steps that give me confidence. this is my granddaughter...she's cute like her grandpa. voya doesn't just help me get to retirement... ...they're with me all the way through it. voya. be confident to and through retirement. we see breakthrough medicines getting to patients in record time. at emerson, our automation software is empowering pharmaceutical companies to accelerate their production
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welcome back to "squawk box. i'm dominic chu with your market minute it is friday take a look at the dow industrials. take a look at what's happening with the s&p and nasdaq. just about flat on the week so far. we could be on pace to snap a short-term losing streak here. also watch what's happening with regard to sector performance we are seeing over the course of the past week a return to value more defensive sectors like consumer staples
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communication services and watch what's happening with regard to spacs. we've seen some of the shine come off of those spacs over the course of the last couple of weeks and months take a look at what's happening overall with the cnbc spac 50 index. up over the last day in the last week it's down roughly 4% during that time span you can see there a little bit of the energy coming out of the spac trade going so far in the last couple of weeks then a check on the meme stocks. the reddit darlings. take a look at some of the names like gamestop, amc entertainment, koss and express. gamestop, volatile week. massive rally yesterday. keep an eye on those joe, we'll send it back over to you. >> there is a cnbc spac, dom yeah, i mean, "squawk" spac. really >> is that right that's different than the
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"squawk" stack. >> you'll give your allegiance to the "squawk" spac >> i'm all in. take my paycheck right now >> all right coming up -- all right we've got me, you, tom so far and andrew, i guess. state taxes, corporate taxes, and the economic recovery. josh gottheimer and french hill. frenchill ll hwi join us to debate we'll be right back. where you learn, work, and fly we help make them healthier. we are the people of abm. for more than 100 years, we've been a leader in making spaces cleaner, from the things you touch to the air you breathe. today, more than 100,000 of us are innovating to ensure spaces are more efficient, healthier and safer. abm. making spaces healthier for you.
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earlier this week josh gottheimer testified in front of the house ways and means committee regarding reinstating the state and local tax deduction. josh gottheimer joins us this morning. he is the co-chair of the bipartisan problem solvers caucus this is an issue we've talked about many times with you. it's important to a lot of the big states, blue states where they saw a huge hit after the 2017 tax act passed. what kind of a sense do you think -- do you get that the administration is willing to work for this, that congress would pass this and specifically that the senate would take it on, too? >> well, obviously i was very glad that secretary said she'd
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work with me and others to work for ways to reinstate s.a.l.t. as you know in places like new jersey, blue states that got hit hard by the 2017 tax hike bill where s.a.l.t. was gutted, so many taxes have gone up and down new jersey we got hit. in bergen county the average s.a.l.t. deduction is $24,000. you might imagine why the average tax bill in my district has gone up, not down after the tax bill we're fighting to get it back and reinstating s.a.l.t. >> i live in bergen county i know it well the heavy lift here you would be taking to try to get this passed the far left probably doesn't care about lowering taxes on wealthier people some of the red state congressmen and congressional
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leaders who we know have come on and said if you want to lower your taxes, you should lower your local and state taxes it's not our problem and then getting it past the administration, janet yellen who said she'd work with you you have to find a way to pay for it those are a lot of hurdles to make this work are you more or less optimistic than you were six months ago >> no one said these fights are easy, and the principle -- this is a double taxation something on the books going back to 1913 i think there's a recognition and an interest in the administration in making changes and obviously we have to pay for it and i think as we've talked about before, there are plenty of other ways to get there without -- with -- that include actually reinstating s.a.l.t so, you know, there's a lot of proposals coming out of the administration a lot to do. my position is simple if taxes go up in my district,
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i'm out. if s.a.l.t.'s not reinstated, i'm not going to vote for that legislation. there are many of us who share that position. congressman swazy was on yesterday. he stressed his position as well many of us are pretty simple about this you can't in the middle of a pandemic when things are still difficult make things harder on us as you know well, becky, since you live in bergen county, united van lines were the number one out migration state. more vans leaving than coming. we're having trouble on growth we've had flat growth and loss of population because people are going to states where, listen, the red states and states that mooch a lot from the federal government have done very well in stealing our businesses so this is really a line in the sand for me. and i know for many people who feel the same way. >> congressman, your own party is not helping the democratic governor of new jersey, democratic house in new jersey raised taxes on the
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highest income earners they did it at the end of the year and then they made it retroactive for the entire last year if you're concerned about people leaving the state, maybe you should be concerned about that as well. >> by the way, i 1000% agree with that and totally opposed. agree with that. there was no reason that we are raising taxes. no reason to raise corporate taxes and taxes in new jersey should be cut, not raised. we need to really focus on places like new jersey that have been hit so hard over the pandemic and the last years. you can tie it right to s.a.l.t. you can see since s.a.l.t. hit, population and out migration is leaving. economic growth down we need to make things more affordable for states like mine who have to cut taxes. the way to do that is to start with reinstating s reinstating . it's not for the well to do. in my district, this is middle
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class. it's firefighters, teachers, they've been hit by s.a.l.t. given how expensive property taxes are in states like mine. yes, we have to get costs down in new jersey. we pay a huge amount of money to the federal government compared to the other states. there's no reason why states like ours shouldn't get the tax break. i'm sick and tired of paying the bills of all of these other states and we've been doing it far too long. >> been playing devil's advocate because we were having problems with congressman french hill's feed but he is now good. this is congressman french hill of arkansas who joins us at the same time. they both serve on the financial services committee so this will be a place where action gets taken. congressman hill, let's talk about your views on this coming from arkansas. what do you think? >> i'm glad to be with my friend, josh becky, good to be with you this morning. the whole issue of the s.a.l.t. was discussed in detail and the idea of a $10,000 acceptance for
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across the board was to help as many americans as possible it's true we can't help every wealthy person in a high tax state like california and new york, but on balance the $10,000 was a way to protect those state and local taxes for most americans and as a result most americans got a tax cut in the tax cut act. in arkansas we went from 7 out of 10 families to 9 out of 10 families that could take the standard deduction and have a tax savings for their annual filing. >> congressman gottheimer, what do you say back to congressman hill >> hey, french good to see you. you know, i hear what french is saying, but if you come to jersey and, listen, i get it, a lot of the red states in 2017 decided, listen, what's the best place to take money from to help us, from the blue states
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so they went after us. they took $800 billion worth for themselves out of s.a.l.t. i get it it's good for them if they're sitting in our shoes over here, we got whacked and taxes actually went up because of the fact counties like mine have an average s.a.l.t. deduction over $24,000 the average taxpayer got hit, every county got hit bill's and my state went up not down all i'm saying is let's reinstate that let's get the s.a.l.t. back and get a tax cut for everybody so we can get our costs down here, especially in a pandemic where we've lost 30% of small businesses people are hurting people are in trouble here now is not the time to raise taxes. now is the time to give people tax relief and help get the economy moving >> but, becky, that's what joe biden is proposing is raising taxes on all small businesses by raising the corporate rate from 21% to 28%, raise the personal
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income tax rate, potentially consider income tax increases on capital gains transactions, every stock transaction. the biden administration at the exact wrong moment is proposing raising taxes on all hard-working families and small businesses there in the midst of coming out of the pandemic and returning to economic growth i share that view with my friend josh and i just simply argue that on behalf of the general welfare in looking at the tax cuts and jobs act, a vast majority of american families were benefitted and the s.a.l.t. deduction was debated very vigorously in the house and senate and moved to $10,000. considered modestly higher but settled on $10,000 as the way to help the most american families across the country and you guys have already talked about this morning debating how california or new york or new jersey high tax states should be more effective in their public finance and give americans a
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chance to keep more of their own money. >> it may have been debated but not one single democrat voted for it the democrats and republicans in jersey voted against it. french in arkansas gets 1.64 from every 1.10. we're helping pay the bills. give us a little bit of relief here in jersey that's all we're asking for, french. >> i believe this is going to continue thank you for being here today. >> you betcha. josh good to be with you. >> good to see you, french >> thank you. coming up, members of congress talking to a couple of them faced off with the ceos of facebook, google, twitter in a 5 1/2 hour hearing about misinformation rip van winkle what investors need toak te away is next. what to take away from the faang stocks is next "squawk box" will be right back.
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only at t-mobile. so jeff, you need all those screens streaming over your xfinity xfi... for your meeting? uhh yes. and your lucky jersey? oh, yeah. lauren, a cooler? it's hot. it's march. and jay, what's with all your screens? just checking in with my team... of colleagues. so you're all streaming on every device in the house, what?!! that was a foul. it's march... ...and you're definitely not watching basketball. no, no. i'm definitely not watching basketball. right... ( horn blaring )
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230 is still broadly important. i wouldn't repeal the whole thing. these policies do need to apply more to large platforms. we need to find a way to extend small platforms. that way when i was getting started with facebook, if we had gotten hit with a lot of lawsuits around content, it might have been prohibitive for me to get started. >> that was facebook ceo mark zuckerberg yesterday saying amending 230 would help small internet companies joining us is sarah fischer.
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media reporter at axios. also nikki christof who is the founder and ceo of christof and company. she helped establish the government relations office at salesforce and before that she ran uber's federal government strategy sarah, let's start with you and get a take away from how much damage was done to the companies yesterday? do you think they got out unscathed? >> i think the hearing was more productive than previous hearings this time they actually addressed some substantive things that both parties will rally around like child bullying, harassment, et cetera. i think the key take away from the hearing is that the hearings aren't very productive in determining what the future laws are going to actually look like. we know that laws are coming representative sicillini told axios this past week that he plans of putting out a barrage of antitrust bills by may to make it harder for the companies
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to respond to one giant bill when i watch a hearing for 5 1/2 hours, a lot of bikerring and not a lot of substance, it makes it hard for me to perceive what a bill is going to look like we're not talking about much, it's more sound bites at this point. >> exactly >> nicki, you've been around this before. you know how washington works. you know how things operate. what does this mean from a realistic perspective? everybody is mad on both sides of the aisle but they're mad for different reasons. how does that work out into any sort of legislation? >> that's right. in yesterday's hearing we saw a little more focus than we have in the past. the members were energized, anger at the tech industry as a bipartisan issue certainly facing regulatory headwinds. yesterday's hearing i would handy cap at a 0.0% chance of producing a bill that ultimately becomes a law, specifically around content moderation. it's an impossible unsolvable political riddle
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it's just not going to happen. >> is there something, nikki, that could happen from another agency is there some sort of oversight or some sort of regulatory oversight that could really pose a bigger threat to the tech companies now? >> i think absolutely we're going to see more enforcement. you're right, it will be out of the executive branch on antitrust. a topic we're nottalking about is equal employment nforcement eeoc enforce we'll see that i do not think we'll see section 230 amended, repealed. at the end of the day it's a regulatory blood letting it doesn't fix the ailment, probably does more harm than good the companies that bear the cost of that are smaller companies like next door or red ditreddit. facebook and youtube won't have any trouble absorbing that it's the smaller players i don't see that happening
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>> sara, you cover congress and you know what they do, what they've seen they must be pretty mad about the general consensus right now which is they can scream all they want but nothing is going to get done. is there anything you could see that could potentially work towards something that would address some of the issues we've talked about and have really kind of risen in terms of the algorithms for the big companies, whether they are seeking out misinformation and amplifying it? is there anything that you think there could be any sort of bipartisan deal or even a deal that takes the democrats where they would have to have everybody on board and push that through? >> there's two things i think they could get done. one is a national privacy law. it's something everybody wants because it's not consumer friendly to have a different law in each state. we're heading in that direction. that could happen. the second thing is if they introduce a lot of these bills, could be around content moderation, ai and surveillance.
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even if they can't get them passed, sometimes the pressure is enough to make fundamental changes. i'll point back to the honest ads act. we couldn't get that passed even though it was a bipartisan bill but it returned a bunch of transparency efforts by google and facebook so that it actually implemented the law without the law being passied there are some things they can do but i agree it won't be easy to tackle section 230 or content moderation it's too complicated and congress is just too divided right now. >> nikki, if you were advising any of these big tech companies, the ceos who testified yesterday, what would you be telling them to do right now they all have taken slightly different stances. facebook is saying we think there should be a change to 230. the other is saying not necessarily the case what would you advise? >> the truth is for those three companies, for youtube, for facebook, for twitter, again, if anything, it just reinforces
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their strength and dominance to have a change to the law because they can absorb it for twitter and google being against section 230 is more ideological. the real business cost of yesterday's hearing is in employees being distracted and demoralized. nobody wants to work at a company where they feel like they're doing harm i think when we see changes, a lot of that is from the internal tax on retention, attention and recruiting and those ceos have been facing that for several years. they're going to continue to face it and i think that's why they make some of the calls that they do. >> good to hear. niki, sara, thanks for your time this morning >> thank you. when we come back, don't miss our first on cnbc interview with wework ceo and vivek randive and sandeep.
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we'll talk to dr. scott gottleib on vaccine requirements. "squawk box" will be right back. we help seniors compare and shop for medicare options in their areas using licensed, trusted advisors and an online platform. gohealth has compounded at 52% a year for 20 years. we believe we're just beginning to realize the opportunity to improve access to healthcare for consumers.
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we believe we're just beginning to realize the opportunity hey lily, i need a new wireless plan for my business, but all my employees need something different. oh, we can help with that. okay, imagine this... your mover, rob, he's on the scene and needs a plan with a mobile hotspot. we cut to downtown, your sales rep lisa has to send some files, asap! so basically i can pick the right plan for each employee... yeah i should've just led with that... with at&t business... you can pick the best plan for each employee and only pay for the features they need. good morning wework is back with a spac news just out that the
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co-working firm, co-working will go public via a blank check company merger we've got a first on cnbc interview with wework ceo and the deal sponsor. president biden doubling his first 100 days vaccine to 200 million shots in arms. we'll ask former fda commissioner dr. scott gottleib what that means for the country's reopening. two big tech stories in focus this morning the top ceos getting grilled by lawmakers for more than five hours and amazon prepares to feel the bern. senator bernie sanders heading to alabama jumping further into the challenges final hour of "squawk box" begins right now ♪ ♪ ♪
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good morning, everybody. welcome back to "squawk box" here on cnbc i'm becky quick along with joe kernen andrew's out today we're watching the u.s. equity futures. it's friday. things are looking a little better than they were yesterday at this time, at least for the dow and nasdaq dow futures have picked up more up by 156 points this comes after a 200 point gain for the dow it was the biggest for the three major point averages the other two eked out gains this morning the s&p 500 is indicated up by 11.5 things have turned down for the nasdaq under a little pressure. down by 37 points below value. show you the "squawk" stack. the nasdaq had been higher earlier this morning. >> higher. >> 10-year note is yielding 1.680% doesn't seem like it's that much but things do tend to get a lot of attention here. joe, gamestop up another 8% this morning even after the 50% plus
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gain that it saw yesterday after -- or the 30 -- yeah, 50% plus after losing maybe was it 33% the day before it was all related to the earnings where they didn't say more about their plans, give more details on their plans. then things turned around. retail investors are back. wti up by 2.75%. back above $60 as we continue to watch the suez canal being jammed and shutting down trade in both of those days. >> what was the "back in black." did you attribute that to the market >> i was trying to figure out. >> i don't know. >> when we showed dorsey to not play z.z. top is i think a big mistake. whenever we have that -- >> back in spac. they're going with a -- >> yeah. >> go with cheap sunglasses or something. every time i look over at that i jump i guess i need to -- you know what, i need to change
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i need to change i need to change, be more accepting and tolerant of appearances and things like that i feel judgmental and that makes me feel very guilty. makes me feel very guilty so i'm not going to do that every time i look over i go, whoa what happened? >> big man to admit that and say but every time, right? >> i know. i do it every time i jump i don't know can you imagine if i showed up like that? i couldn't do it, number one. >> no. >> maybe that's why. he does because he can >> there you go. another big step for wework in the post adam neumann era co-working company agreeing to go public through a spac merger going to be combining with boax acquisition company in a $9 billion deal that includes debt. join us is sandeep muthrani and
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vi vivek. thank you for joining us so much speculation on what would happen leaks that came earlier in the week sandeep, let me ask you first. you have an ipo and why boax >> thanks for having me on, becky. because sometimes we don't take the path, the path picks you and in december we were approached by boax and other spacs. we looked at our plan. we've seen what we've accomplished in 2020 and we saw a path to profitability and we thought it would be time to raise additional liquidity and here is the balance sheet and make sure we have a path to profitability. sometimes the path picks you, you don't pick the path. >> vivek, let's talk about the
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opportunity you see here why do you think this is something that you can add value to >> thanks for having me as well, becky. i launched the spac a month ago and it was really to fuel the next generation of rocket ship we wanted to fuel growth companies. what we saw in boax was companies -- what we saw in wework was a company that had billions in recurring revenue. it's leaning to a gigantic space, which is the market leader in flex space it's going to be trillions of dollars in terms of total available market wework is the leader in the space. it has an incredible moat built around the business. it has a world class ceo, superstar like sandeep if you think about it, it was a tailwind for flex space. if zoom was the opportunity
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stock for the covid era, we believe wework will be the opportunity stock for the recovery. >> sandeep, there was bad press concerning wework and your finances there were slides leaked from institutional investors who picked up. there were things written in the papers that said you lost, what was it, $3.2 billion last year and that came after you slashed cap ex by 98%. they said occupancy fell to 48%. are those numbers accurate >> let me explain them to you. when people talk about numbers, they talk about 3. $2 billion. what they should be focused on is -- i'm going to be blunt and break it down, $900 million was building impairments we gave back 100 locations for accounting you take an
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impairment of non-cash charge. you have depreciation and amortization 2 billion in restructuring if you actually look at the business itself and look at the ebitda of the business, actually the loss is $1.8 billion in the previous year in 2019 it was $3.9 billion so you have to compare numbers by what's the cash ebitda, it was $1.8 billion i want to clear the air because you can be selective in how you look at your numbers >> what about the occupancy rates? i think you were running north of 70% before the pandemic hit the occupancy fell to 47%. you can get to 97% by the end of next year. is that an accurate reflection
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>> yes, again, let's look at the numbers. the revenue was $3.2 billion but by surprise the revenue held constant at $3.2 billion the reason the occupancy went from 70% to 47% was essentially we opened over 200 locations in the pandemic these are locations that were signed pre-pandemic and under construction and development we opened 200 locations and put it into the denominator and open it in the pandemic and obviously the occupancy will be very low in new locations you will expect it has a portfolio to come down to 47%. again, like i said, if you focus on the revenue number, it was 3.2 billion in 2019. $3.2 billion in 2020 if you look at the mature markets pre-pandemic of this
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company, the average occupancy was 88%. you know, so, again, the company never had a problem with occupancy or demand. the company's issue was it had a cost structure that was upside down we've got, like i said, $1.2 billion in functional expenses including sg&a $200 billion in real estate costs and we have room, another 150, $200 million of costs in the system we have $1.8 billion of costs in 2020 which puts us on a path to profitability. so, again, like i said, the occupancy, the demand was never an issue we see green chutes today. we have 33 markets that are up double digits in the last 60 days all around the world. >> wow. >> across asia going all the way to america >> let me ask a couple of things that you just mentioned there. first of all, you said this puts you on a path to profitability
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when do you anticipate seein profitability? >> you know, when i started this company in february of last year the question was can i really make this profit annual? it was an if it's never an if, it's a when. we hope to get to profitability by the end of this year, 2021. we're on path. >> hey, becky, i wanted to say if you do absolutely nothing with this business, it's 5 billion revenue business with 1 billion in ebitda. if they hold the market share it's like a $25 billion business with billions of ebitda. it's really a value buy that we're getting but it's a growth company. >> well, vivek, i've heard you all are operators. when you hear about the progress that's made at the company, what do you bring to the table? what other places do you see that you can really add to that trying to make sure that they can make more money by spending less >> becky, i helped create a new class of software known as
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middleware just about for every company in the world. so while if they stay the current path, as i said, this is a company with tens of billions of revenue the huge opportunity that i see is to become the middleware forcommercial space. the commercial space business is about 70 trillion. 5 trillion a year just in rents and services and to become the middleware for that space is a gigantic opportunity that, of course, is icing on the cake just going with the current scenario and using technology to continue optimizing the business, this tsunami that's coming where just about every company in the world now is seeing flex space not as a nice to have but a must have. if you look at the client structure, it's incredible wework's clients are the companies of the future, microsoft, google, amazon,
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tesla, airbnb, robinhood it's a who's who of companies. companies have now decided that flex space is a must have. maybe for their own headquarters, they want to own that space, but for everything else they want to hand it over to a wework. >> sandeep, let's talk about that you mentioned green chutes and what you've seen just in the last few months. what do you see in the united states when you look at some of the big markets there like new york, san francisco, los angeles? places maybe that haven't come back as quickly as maybe an austin or a houston or orlando or miami >> you know, being a global company we get to see what happens into cities when the pandemic is more in the rear-view mirror if you start off like in china, beijing, shanghai, beijing is up 14 points in occupancy shanghai -- >> is that year over year or quarter over quarter. >> quarter over quarter.
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if you start to see how you go across, 27% in taipei. 24 percentage points in munich, 24 points in u.k america is 1/4 behind the rest of the world, it's 27% up in phoenix, 16 points up in miami, 11 points you mentioned austin, texas, austin. and finally we are starting to see light at the end of the tunnel in cities like new york, for us, march would be one of the largest months of new activity in the city of new york and even in san francisco we're starting to see activity a lot of people are being caught flat footed. no one expected the country to be vaccinated by march now all of a sudden there is a march to coming back to work sometime in jupe i think kpmg produced a report
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the day before from a few months ago, 69% of ceos said we're going to come back to work on a regular basis. today only 17% are saying we're not coming back to work. 83% are saying we're coming back to work. i think amazon's head of real estate said the other day in a new hampshire that we're going to go back to work because it's the right thing to do. it's where the culture is. i think there's going to be a huge shift in coming back to work and we see we're a flex provider the person would see it first. we're plug and play. we're starting to see even in new york new activity. we're pretty optimistic. >> we are watching the boax acquisition corp, watching that climb. part of the interest here,
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sandeep, i think was the institutional investor you were overprescribed in the pipe 820 versus 520. these are places like fidelity, blackrock and barry sternlicht watching the investors that really came through here these are people who are making bets on what they're making bets on you they're making bets on the return of cities on the return of people going back to workplaces >> so, becky, one place is we went out looking for a pipe of $500 million we were never going to announce a spac deal unless we had a fully committed pipe our pipe is $800 million fairly over subscribed we couldn't be more pleased with the roster of investors. i think people are making bets on multiple things they are making belts effecef -- bets you're getting things on a post
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vaccine company. they're seeing a huge rebound in the business of flexibility. you're looking at a tam, total addressable market, the tam is 3% of the market go to 13% of the market. so you're seeing that, hey, this company can actually -- if they just deploy the capital back into the business can grow rapidly. and the last aspect here is they do see the fact that there is something more there could be icing on the cake if we can really get the middle ware to work like i said, just purely on its real estate platform this company is, you know, today a value play because we've gotten it to a place. if i don't add another piece of real estate, i don't do anything but bring the buildings back to occupancy we get to $1 billion of cash flow by 2023 and that puts us in line, you know, as we
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said, a value play i think they see the up side >> sandeep, i think we -- your audio dropped out for a moment gentlemen, i want to thank you both for joining us today. again, these are people who know the business well. sandeep, you've got the retail property business background and vivek, obviously interested in hearing more about what you are going to be working on appreciate you joining us. thanks for your time. >> thanks for having us, becky. >> joe >> thanks, beck. is a spac -- is it cooling off a little, does it seem like, becky? i would think this might be a big -- you might see a big move. becky, are you still there are you still in >> i am, yeah. i'm here >> we're getting old, are we
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did you notice bindy irwin is having a baby she had a baby. >> no way! >> yeah. >> oh, my goodness she got married. i kind of followed her engagement and getting married comes next i guess steve irwin. >> 7, isn't she? president biden doubling his goal of 100 million vaccine shots in arms in his first 100 days in office. and a big ten university not far from us that has red as its color and usually a big r, not going to tell you who it is, someone on the show may have gone there saying it will require students to get vaccinated before they return for the fall semester. send in your guesses we'll speak to former fda commissioner scott gottleib about all of this. before we head to break, a few of today's big headlines microsoft is in negotiations to
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by discord for $10 billion a previous report said discord was leaning towards an ipo big bank stocks. planning to lift restrictions on dividend and stock buy backs if the banks can show they maintain enough capital. stay tuned congratulations, bindy and chandler you're watching "squawk box" on cnbc create personalized investment strategies to help you get back to your future. edward jones.
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so jeff, you need all those screens streaming over your xfinity xfi... for your meeting? uhh yes. and your lucky jersey? oh, yeah. lauren, a cooler? it's hot. it's march. and jay, what's with all your screens? just checking in with my team... of colleagues. so you're all streaming on every device in the house, what?!! that was a foul. it's march... ...and you're definitely not watching basketball.
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♪ ♪ ♪ i think this is always suitable for bumping in and out. despite the market's current churn, our next guest says she expects a track of concerns. she has percentages. joining us is charmane romani head of the investment management group at goldman sachs. she's also the chief investment manager for them there's always a possibility we could have an adverse event in the markets that people never, ever consider. that makes me nervous. i like the probabilities we have 60% of the s&p gives us a decent return. 7 to 9%.
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what i was highlighting is there is an outside chance that you could see a 3,000 s&p minus 20 -- minus 19%, 15% odds that that happens there's always got to be that, i would think. good to admit the possibility. welcome, by the way. >> thank you very much >> is that -- is that your own style for just acknowledging that nobody really knows >> that's a very important point that you make, and we always put forth our views with probabilities. the reality is we're trying to convey to our clients that we can't have false precision and that it is all a matter of probabilities. since the global financial crisis we have had more up side probability than down side probability, but we also always want clients to know that there are risks out there, whether the risks today are a turn in infections and an increase, while most people think it's
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unlikely to have a fourth wave, there is some possibility that the new york strain does become dominant and we're not sure what kind of impact it will have given vaccinations or natural immunity from infections we want clients to think about the risk we can have a deterioration in u.s./china relations while our base case is a 7 to 9% return, we also have a much higher probability to the up side we have a 25% probability to the s&p getting to something like for -- forty-three fifty that drives our clients to stay invested and not be caught up in the volatility and gyrations of the market on a short-term basis. >> in terms of looking under the hood, you are a value. you would over weight value versus growth in small cap
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versus large cap is that still consistent with where you are today? >> at the margin we recommend clients always have what we call a valuation orientation. that doesn't mean liking value stocks versus growth stocks. it means they want to invest in something, there has to be some real value attributed to that asset class but in fact specifically tactically right now we have gone overweight value sector for example, we like the energy sector whether it's the energy sector in the s&p or whether it's partnerships, we like an over weight to that sector. it's been a great return so far. we have that sector. >> you point out and you can
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comment on this. it's down 1.68 on the dow. the point is a hurdle. the prices are what's happening. >> joe, you're so right. >> the hurdle to get out of the equity what we're talking about it's invested we would not recommend going under weight growth. say we're at 6.5 to 7% the rents may be increasing.
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small moves. thank you for the update on where we are this week have a great weekend >> you, too, thank you we'll be back with dr. scott gottleib joining us on president biden's updated vaccine. stay tuned "squawk box" wl rhtacilbeig bk. t-mobile is the leader in 5g. we also believe in putting people first by treating them right. so we're upping the benefits without upping the price. introducing magenta max. now with unlimited premium data that can't slow down based on how much smartphone data you use. plus get netflix on us, and taxes and fees included!
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>> what you said, becky, is this legal? the laws yes, they think that is legal. rutgers told us the university it will allow students to have exceptions for religious or medical reasons. and that's why they send the positivity you can see, it's more than 1% this is interesting. some folks we spoke with are talking about this now this plays into it
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>> meg, that's the deal. i wonder if that gets to the legal question i would say, yes, you're probably right they're saying this so people can make the decisions why are the faculty and staff getting off on this? >> well, rutgers reasoning is the infection rate the kids tend to have more cases than the infection rates the eeoc has indicated the employers. they need to make accommodations why are you doing that this is an interesting ecision
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>> meg, thanks so much >> dr. scott gottleib is here. it's interesting that rutgers is taking this step i don't know why they're exempting staff. this is the conversation that's happening in every workplace in america. >> the college or university the university has more discretion >> they can require vaccinations i think a lot of businesses are strongly encouraging vaccinations, they'll subject
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employees to have proof and do some extra screening they are trying to strongly encourage people one final point, these vaccines are likely to be authorized. they expect to file blas at some point. they will be totally authorized. they want to be able to have the requirements for getting vaccinated >> the college campuses and the kids on the college campus
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>> somebody refuses it that's a huge concern. they're still avoiding productivity why do you think employers are reluctant to require this and the approval from the fda from the fall >> they can require vaccination in the workplace business settings where you have a lot of employees that can't be socially distanced for the work in manufacturing folkes and those kind of jobs that's imposing something on employees. i suspect the proof of
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vaccination, you have to. >> you can forego some of those requirements that's likely to see what we'll see take shape two paths into different venues into the office and setting. those who can't provide proof, they'll do some extra checks it's like people who don't want to buy the token on the ez pass on the highway you can get on the highway, you have to spend a little more time on the toll booth. >> quickly they're playing us out if the employee goes into the workplace, they're vaccinated and exposed to somebody who's not vaccinated, gets some variant and that person who was originally vaccinated gets sick, isn't that somebody who has a claim against the employer
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isn't there liability on that front? >> i agree with you, becky the employers are oddly reluctant to do this even health care companies that i've heard from are grappling with whether or not they're going to set an example and require a vaccination at their job site i think you're likely to see most employers not do this going into the fall. >> okay. dr. gottleib, thank you. have a great weekend >> thanks a lot. when we come back, senator bernie sanders making his way to alabama today as a vote there by amazon workers on whether or not to unionize wraps up we'll tell you how high the stakes are for amazon when we come back.
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let's get to cnbc headquarters and check in with jim cramer i want to get your thoughts on a lot of things, from the wework spac and a lot of things they tell me you only have a minute. >> that was a fabulous interview. >> thank you >> what do you think about the spac >> i think everyone -- i thought rutgers was a thought leader on this we have too know more about this. >> me, too i don't understand why they're
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requiring students and not the staff. this is a first foray out there and it puts them in the spotlight before we see if there are legal challenges to these things this is what it' force. >> how about cruises >> the cdc, if you vaccinate everybody, i don't know, the thing is so capricious some places this, some places that, i know places where you get in to the building, if they take your temperature. >> right. >> what is that? >> that's pandemic first month of pandemic. so i don't know. >> this stuff is great. >> i think we're going to continue to hear more about the vaccinations, but i'm glad to see rutgers taking the first step and we will see how it plays out from here. anyway, can't wait to hear more. we will see you in a few minutes. and have a great weekend, jim. bye. >> you too. >> senator bernie sanders is heading to alabama today, just as a big unionization vote is
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set to take place. diedre bosa has the latest. >> the latest in a steady stream of lawmakers who visit that warehouse but he has struck a major nerve with amazon which has long discouraged attempts among the u.s. employees to organize and yesterday i told you guys about the twitter spat where a top amazon executive hit, sanders and causing another lawmaker to jump and conditions so bad that workers have to urinate in bottles amazon's official twitter handle says you don't believe that peaing in bottle is a thing, do you? if that was true, nobody would work for us and it turns out that tweet has not aged well internal documents from amazon workers that show companies are aware that employees urinate and defecate on the job and we did
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reach out to amazon on this and didn't hear back and the point is, the ballots will begin to be counted this tuesday and no matter the outcome, this battle will continue to play out through appeals on either side and if represents amazon's biggest labor challenge ever in the u.s. one that could threaten the company's control of a warehouse and delivery employees, and that efficiency that has made it the top e-commerce player and the number two employer in the country, so it will be fascinating to watch how this plays out. not just over the next few weeks, but over the next few years, guys, this isn't going anywhere. >> i knew we were going to talk about they don't dra, but -- but i didn't know i would get this much information when they deliver, they park in the middle of the street these amazon trucks, it's like, i don't know, they're fast and they're doing their job and everything else, but a lot of times these guys are hey, i got to do what i got to do, guys and gals, i got to to what i got to
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do and it seems like amazon is getting comfortable back talking to senators and last night hit back at elizabeth warren on tax policy and that is like poking the bears. is that smart? >> that has been amazon's strategy as of late. it's not unprecedented we've seen them do this before but they're really making this big push right now, regarding the elizabeth warren tweet on tax law, you make the laws we follow them and if you don't like the laws by all means change them and went back and talked about how much in taxes amazon has paid but the spicy tweet, the comebacks have a lot of people scratching their heads especially when it comes to the labor issues, because the last year has been unlike any other, right? we've been in the middle of a pandemic amazon warehouse workers and delivery drivers, they have been essential workers. there have been some issues in terms of what amazon is or isn't providing. and their transparency when it comes to covid numbers so is this something that could
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backfire potentially we'll have to wait and see and it also could be sort of a way for them to rally the other side republicans, those lawmakers that don't support unionization efforts if this does play out in congress so like i said, this is just starting, and there's so much to be done, and amazon is the number two employee in the country, so not just a lot for them at stake, but for the labor movement as a whole. one that democrats are very well aware of as we see by sanders' visit. >> yes, diedre okay, and becky, by the way, and thank you, we're going to say, becky, by the way, the movie we were talking about earlier, a while ago, francis mcdormand, one of the job he has at an amazon procurement center, goes all over during christmas. >> i read that. >> and you get to see the entire layout and even that is an interesting look into what, we
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forget what a massive undertaking that is, to try and do that, at amazon and you need all of these people to come in and, well, we're sticking with tech and also digesting everything we heard from the ceo's of facebook, google and twitter at a marathon house hearing yesterday, focused on online misinformation lawmakers hit the executives hard on their content policies, use of customer data, and how much children might be using their services for more on all of that, let's bring in illinois congresswoman jan, serves on the energy and commerce committee, co-chaired yesterday's hearing, great to have you, congresswoman, but first of all, do you feel any, i watched what is happening, do you ever fell sorry for these guys because it is such a huge job and such a difficult and trackable thing to try to monitor everything that's happening? do you have any compassion for them and what we're trying to do here >> not a bit all rules have been working in
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their favor. they've had pretty much a free reign. some people like to say that, you know, it's like having a get out of jail free card, because there is virtually no liability for the kind of harboring of organizations like q-anon, or the violence that we saw at the capitol, or the misinformation about vaccines and it's time, and that was really the take-away message that we left to these czars of the internet, that their time of self regulation is over. and we're going to be doing something. and by the way, speaking of amazon, they have no responsibility for fraudulent products that are sold and delivered to your home, or dangerous products while they weren't there yesterday, we are looking at
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having them have some responsibility to vet all the vendors that are online, because, you know, they can sell anything, and it can be harmful to yourself, or to your children, when it arrives, so we're taking a very hard look at this, and there's going to be a number of those that pass, that rein them in, and hold them liable and responsible and so i don't feel sorry for them at all. >> but what you're asking them to do is difficult and to try to figure out, when you look at the country, congresswoman, and i know that you'll say that there's definitive facts on each side that you can point to, but there's also gray areas everywhere how would you like to be the person that has to decide exactly what is suitable and what isn't, andtalking about
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billions of things that they need to pore over to find out? that's why i meant why don't you feel, not sorry, but just to understand what a major task and what a difficult task it is, considering that not everyone feels as you do, that, a, or b, is definitely just out of line, c's okay, d is not it puts politicians in a weird position i don't want democratic politicians or republican politicians deciding what is suitable for me to see we see what happens on the down side when that happens, and people get banned from twitter, they don't even know what they said half the time. >> there does have to be a, i think a third party referral that could look at, if people are bounced off, i totally agree, and this is not about protecting the first amendment, this is about protecting basic community standards, like making
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sure that violence isn't there, that the kind of hate speech that is clear and that they, that the companies themselves can set their community standards, but they have to be enforced which they have not been you know, when the decency act was first passed, for communications, the internet was just beginning, and they had a free rein to put anything up there. well, those days are really over because we've seen the harms we've seen, you know, they say the children under 14 need to be protected. but they really don't have any mechanisms that make sure that our kids are protected we heard from republicans and democrats, it was like magic, this issue brought us all together i mean the kinds of concern -- >> that's the bright spot here,
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that we do see both sides at least talking about how to handle this. but it's difficult and congresswoman, we appreciate your time, we're almost at 9:00 straight up. you cannot believe what happens to us if we go beyond that congresswoman, i really appreciate it. i'll get canceled. we appreciate your time. becky, have a great weekend. make sure you join us. >> you too >> see all of you next week. "squawk on the street" is next good friday morning. welcome to "squawk on the street," i'm scott wapner with jim cramer, carl and david have the morning off. let's take a look at friday futures this morning s&p and dow will open higher, the dow by more than 130 points, the nasdaq well, rates are up so the nasdaq pre-market looks like it's going to be lower our road map today starting with the reopening trade, economic recovery play, rising pre-market and a renewed focus on retail traders as shares of gamestop continue to roar back, i
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