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tv   Closing Bell  CNBC  June 9, 2022 3:00pm-4:00pm EDT

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for this tournament? it seems historic. >> this is the first i've seen in my golfing career of any kind of drama of this variety at all, tyler. and i think you feel the same way. the pga tour has been the pga tour for years. >> yeah. >> nothing like this. >> and a lot of major tournament winners up on that list of 17. >> major winners, yes. >> dom chu, thanks very much thank you for watching "power lunch. >> great to be here with you "closing bell" starts now. thank you, seema and tyler we've got red across the board as investors await tomorrow's crucial cpi inflation report nasdaq is down more than 1.4%. we're near session lows. the most important hour of trading starts now welcome, everyone, to "closing bell." i'm sara eisen take a look at where we stand isn't the market the s&p is off a little more than 1%. you've got every sector in the red. consumer staples are holding up the best communication services down 1.5% along with financials, technology and materials the nasdaq as i mentioned down 1
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spo1.5% what's weighing particularly, some of the big cap tech players like nvidia lower. small caps down 1.25%. here's a look at some of the most actively traded names right here right now nio at the top of that list, down 7%. we'll talk about that later in the market zone with phil lebeau chinese internet names giving back some of their recent big gains. carnival cruises down another 8.3% it's been slammed all year long. coming up on today's show, tech fund manager kevin landis says it is time to put your shopping list together, even as the nasdaq sinks again today he'll tell us who made his cut. speaking of tech, meta trading under its new ticker symbol today as the stock sits 50% below its highs. we'll talk to a bullish analyst. let's kick it off with the broader market
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mike santoli taking a look at stocks versus bonds for his dashboard today including we must hit those european bonds on the move. >> they have been working in lock-step, stocks and bonds. you see the ecb today mostly as expected talking about ending qe and raising rates in the next few months but the market wasn't quite positioned for it. this shows you the s&p 500 against this global bond etf so this is encompassing the world of fixed income. you see over the last six months they basically arrived at the same place obviously stocks are more volatile than bonds but it shows you the yield pressure, upward pressure on yields, upward expectations of what central banks are going to do and that impact on valuations the s&p itself sagging below the bottom end of this 10-day range. markets flinching ahead of the data tomorrow. the 2-year note going out at the highs into that number people are thinking it could be hot or can't take for granted that it's not going to be. take a look on equity
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valuations it shows you among the stocks in the s&p, 1500, a broader universe, on average they are trading in terms of their price earnings multiples in the 40th percentile of their own historical pe range dating back in 1998. so more than half of all stocks are cheaper than they have been on average since 1998. so a lot of the work has been done to reset valuations, but we also are not far from that point in 2000 before the market continued to have a rough ride arguably even still in 2008 as well so if the fundamentals are going to erode from here, it's not necessarily a broader buy signal but if it's 2016 or something like that, yeah, that's where bottoms are made up the fundamentals hold together. >> do you remember the pigs because they were problem, right, they had high debt. we're seeing some of the highest yields there since that level. bonds are selling off. the ecb signalled that it's
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going to hike in july and maybe my a bigger margin i do wonder if we start to see those dislocations and those really higher yields for the higher indebted countries, if that becomes a problem for u.s. investors as well. >> you're seeing the spreads open up, i guess, among the european issuers, but it's not really as much about solvency. it's not really as much about can they service the risk, are the markets going to refuse to finance those riskier or more indebted countries it is across the board german yields, no better credit out there. the 10-year has gone from 95 basis points to 1.5 in two weeks so stepping up the idea of what. ecb might have to do to fight inflation. >> like we're seeing in the u.s., with the 10-year back above 3%. major investors are gathering right now for the virtual sone conference. leslie picker has the details. what is it >> long a presentinger, david
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einhorn believes powell is bluffing when he said the fed has the tools necessary to fight inflation. as such he is recommending investors buy gold the gist of his presentation centered around this idea that raising rates would increase the amount of interest the public owns, therefore adding strain to the deficit and the fed's own balance sheet. so he said the fed can raise rates but it's not clear it can raise rates high enough to, quote, get the job done. he said next year the, quote, rubber will meet the road where the fed will have to choose between fighting inflation or supporting the treasury, and he believes it will choose the latter at that point he said it's prudent for investors to hold some gold as an inflation hedge. einhorn's gold pick was one of the three investment presentations at the conference that we've seen so far we also heard from mala gankar.
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>> the gold call is really interesting, leslie. it's predicated on the idea inflation will stick around because powell doesn't have the tools to fight it? is that a summary of what you said >> exactly, yep. he gave this whole anecdote about his grandfather and how his grandfather was a gold bug and said it will one day become necessary to hold gold he doesn't know when that is i kno einhorn is saying now is the time because he doesn't have the faith the central bank will get inflation under control. this stands in contrast to what we heard from sam bankman-freed when he talked about why bitcoin wasn't as correlated with inflation as a lot of bitcoin bulls said it would be he said actually it is and inflation was rising before the key indicators, or the cpi, were suggesting that inflation was rising during that time, bitcoin tracked it he believes that the future
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expectation of inflation is actually decreasing and that's why you're seeing bitcoin decreasing as well so kind of interesting, two different schools of thought here. >> everybody wants to be an inflation hedge and nobody quite, mike, is a perfect inflation hedge. if gold really was a good inflation hedge, it's only up 1% this year. >> exactly. >> a year when inflation exploded. >> exactly arguably what it's good at is capitalizing on negative real yields and that hasn't been the case by the way, einhorn in 2010 made a big bet on gold. he was bearish on the ability of the fed to actually corral inflation. inflation didn't really show up then if you remember he did get macro in those days. >> kind of critical, right >> yeah. >> he was one of those saying -- there was some sort of -- >> if you gave a mouse a cookie, i believe was the metaphor, which is like a children's book. >> oh, yeah, i love that book. he'll ask for a glass of milk.
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you don't know that book what was einhorn's last big hit? >> well, i mean there have been individual value names that he's done well on, i believe. he was bearish on moody's in the early part of the 2010s. so i think that you have to take away the macro calls from what the overall portfolio is doing, which is a lot of it i think at times has done well because it has a valuation orientation. >> i've got to ask your take on the market we are looking at the lows, down about 370 or so on the dow and the reason i'm asking is because we have been in this trading range in the last ten days or so for the s&p a lot of people were looking at tomorrow's cpi report as a catalyst to break out. is that going to happen before >> to break out of the range >> out of the range. >> we're just a little bit below the bottom end of that range so clearly the patience is running thin or maybe the idea of staying out of the way ahead of that number i will say you are bracing for the potential for a hotter number the 2.8 hasn't been that high
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before implied expectations for how far the fed will have to go have been rising. all of that kind of suggests we're there at least positioned for a higher than expected number or at least not a downside surprise. there have only been three downside surprises on the cpi in the last year, so basically it's been 9-3. >> if you pull it apart and think about it, we know airfares are going to be high and hotels and a lot of service areas are going to show high inflation food and oil prices are extremely elevated and gone higher on the flip side there's some anecdotal that the supply stuff crunch, semi conductors maybe and certainly used car prices have come down. >> used cars, shipping rates, all the container shipping stuff has eased. almost no matter what tomorrow's number is, it doesn't qualify as qu convincing evidence of what the new trend is it doesn't create a prompt for the fed to change its story in a near term way. however, it's probably better
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for the market to go in bracing for something rough as opposed to assuming it's going to be benign. >> always a silver lining with you. mike, i'll see you soon. after the break, nearly 70%, 70 cfos in our latest cnbc survey say they are expecting recession in the first half of 2023 we'll ask jeff sonnenfeld measure with what he heard from cfos at this years summit. continuing to move south here, down 380 on the dow.
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welcome back disney one of the bigger drags on the dow after announcing a major shakeup in management. >> reporter: the ceo abruptly fired the most senior tv content executive, peter rice, remplacin him with dana waldon rice, whose contract ran through 2024 and was seen as a potential successor had moved over from fox as part of the acquisition along with walden. a close source said he fired rice because he was not the right cultural fit he said in an email that cnbc obtained that walden is a collaborative leader and cultural force who has literally transformed our television business into a content powerhouse all of this comes as disney shares are down about 44% in the
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past year and as the company invests in content to grow its streaming audience amid speculation about why chapek would fire such a senior exec executive. they say he and his leadership team have the confidence of the board. >> all of this centers around the question, julia, about whether chapak, first of all, was this guy a potential contender to replace him and the board putting out this statement expressing confidence in bob, have we seen anything like that since the whole florida debacle? >> well, look, i think it is really notable that the board put out that statement so quickly. clearly they wanted to tamp down on any concern about any lack of confidence in chapak but peter rice was very well regarded, one of the most senior
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executives, probably the most senior executive to come over as part of the fox acquisition and a lot of speculation that he would be a potential successor but i also want to note that he had been reportedly, according to my sources, had interviewed for some very senior jobs at warner brothers discovery. this idea that he could be a number two potentially to david zazlov, that didn't work out for any number of reasons. but clearly rice was in the conversation as a senior executive in the media space here but i think dana walden is also very well regarded and had worked with rice for a long time, so this elevates her in that role. but it looks like the disney board wants to tamp down on any concern about chapak's future and his contract is up next february presumably they would have let him know by now if they were going to extend him past february but that really doesn't mean anything these days you never know.
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>> right but we haven't heard that, right? you'll stay on that. >> they have not announced anything but from what i understand, it would be typical to let a ceo know about a year in advance what they could know going forward so they have not announced anything but i would assume since they have not announced otherwise they have told him so. 68 ceos interviewed expect a recession in 2023. this comes at c-suite executives gathered at the yale summit. host of "the summit," it's good to have you here at the exchange so many cfos that we polled expect a recession what did you get on that topic >> it's fascinating. what a gap there is between the cfo mindset and ceo mindset. i guess it's a reminder that these financiers, these economists are trained in the
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dismal science and looking at the worst-case scenarios and ceos are the opposite. they were surprisingly optimistic even folks with big china exposures, you saw how hard we pushed them on some of the lockdowns and issues having to do in particular with the recession. one major banker said this will be a very strange sort of recession if it happens with so much cash, record employment and also pointing out that these are very strong earnings a chairman of another very prominent humongous invest bank said i'm in the business of risk management and we have to get people to be ready for a surprise upside. >> prepare yourself, don't necessarily bank on recession was sort of the idea that i got. i pushed back on the fed hiking and quantitative tightening and they didn't seem worried look, we're coming off of zero
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so a move to, i don't know, 3% is nothing of a deal. >> exactly, that was their response to you for asked and good for you for trying to provoke them >> jeff, ukraine was front and center you had president zelenskyy there and got to ask some questions. you also heard from companies on what's been a pretty tricky but universal exit from western companies on ukraine you've -- or from russia you've been tracking this. how's it going. >> it's amazing. it's the first time in history we've seen this sort of thing. i was close to many of the ceos that led a 200-company leave from south africa over apartheid. we have over 1,000 companies, which is remarkable. when we asked them how you feel about it, you saw it was 96% in support of the exit and 100% said they were very much
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impressed by and inspired by the sense of unity and courage shown by ukraine >> which is it because russia is such a small market anyway and not really a growth market >> that's what surprised us, that these companies didn't pull out instantly. some of them stayed in there some small fragrance companies stayed in for this reason. but they're only perhaps not even 1% of these companies that had as much as 10% of their earnings coming from russia. like 95% or so, a large percentage of them were really drawing perhaps less than 2% of the revenues from there, so it wasn't a big hit and in fact as our research has shown just published now, that the more dramatically a company has pulled out, the more their shareholders have benefited. shockingly, that doing good is not antithetical to doing well the companies that had big writedowns of assets were heavily rewarded in the market. >> where are executives right now in terms of their worries
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about the war and what they're trying to prioritize and how they're trying to help after the initial pullout? >> well, that's what they wanted to ask zelenskyy about, president zelenskyy. this was the first time he's had an interactive session with any leaders. united states congress, the eu, here -- they want it to know how business leaders could help and they came back with a show of force. how they could show unity but a number of them asked what you could do about refugees or one of the big issues coming that are unintended consequences. zelenskyy said the people who aren't suffering great losses of life outside of ukraine still around the world are going to suffer greatly by a massive famine that's coming because of what russia is doing. >> he called it food genocide by
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putin. >> food genocide citigroup asked about it 30% of the world's grain comes from russia. russia is destroying the stockpiles and infrastructure for grain and inability to plant the seeds. it's not going to be good for russia, devastating for ukraine and bad around the world so this is a huge problem. other ceos were asking the ceos wondering -- ethan allen wanted to know what we could do about helping the refugee crisis and unintended consequences. they talked about hiring ukraines we have so much remote work that companies in the u.s. and companies in europe can hire people as well as this massive displacement of 15 million people displaced and 5.5 ukrainians driven out of the country itself, over 3 million driven into poland >> give them jobs, help them financially, that was some of the advice. >> weren't you surprised that he got multiple standing ovations
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from these -- people that don't usually -- >> i'm not surprised he's an exemplary leader. >> but business leaders taking political positions. it was impressive. >> so when they come to you, ceos, and say, jeff, you've been compiling all this data on pulling out of russia and doing what's right and say what else can i do, what should i be doing now? what do you tell the ceos? >> they don't want to hear by people's thoughts and prayers. they want to know what people is the end state as lloyd blankfein asked where does this all go, he said we need to stop russia doing what they're doing when people said the average russian is not the source of the problem. yes, they are. it is a certain complicity by the complacency of the average russian. pulling these businesses out is a very sharp message, symbolically and substantively that there's still some businesses that shouldn't be in there. >> yeah, who's still in there? >> huntsman chemical shouldn't be in there. some companies like benaton,
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versace shouldn't be in there. even the self-interest of it is hard to explain. but symbolically as we saw in south africa, romania, with the government change in poland or east germany, when they're seen as a pariah to the world, then they know the propaganda they're being fed is not true. if they're an outcast and are also starting to suffer, we're trying to make life a little more uncomfortable for the average russian so more than 4% of them will download a vpn and get the truth they don't want to know there's a great book that came out in 1995 about hitler's willing executioners that book talked about the average german was being a source of the problem and that somehow we don't just say it was adolf hitler itself. we can't blame putin only. the russian complacency is what makes this possible. business blockades working in conjunction with government sanctions are what makes it more
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effective than just the government sanctions alone. >> it punishes the whole country. jeff, thank you. thank you for joining me here. let's give you a check on where we stand in the markets. down about 360 or so on the dow jones industrial average s&p 500 down 1.4%. every sector is red right now. communication services is leading us lower, staples and energy holding up a little better but everyone is down. the nasdaq is down 1.8%. still ahead, why one strategist says there's a real risk of another 10 to 15% correction for the s&p 500 we're already down more than 15% on the year. plus, what earnings results from sinnet and five belowcan tell us about where consumers are spending in this environment. we'll be right back. hey lily, i need a new wireless plan for my business, but all my employees need something different. oh, we can help with that. okay, imagine this.
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stocks are sitting at session lows, taking a leg lower in the last 30 minutes or so here's a live look at the s&p 500 sector heat map. as you can see it's communication services down almost 2% at the very bottom of the pack financials also joining at the
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bottom you've got pretty much broad weakness in the communication services warner brothers discovery down 5%, meta down almost 5%, paramount. a lot of the media names netflix, match, disney all at the bottom of the pack financials down there with technology and materials on the other side consumer staples are holding up a little bit better and so are energy names. but again, some pretty broad weakness across the board. the nasdaq 100 more sensitive to some of the mega caps down 2% right now. stitch fix shares are falling, down 9%. cnbc.com's lauren thomas reporting this afternoon that the company is laying off 15% of its salaried workers lauren joins us now. lauren, were these layoffs inevitable given the pressure on margins and the stock price that we have seen over the last, i don't know, year or so >> yeah, absolutely, sara. stitch fix is a company that has certainly been under pretty substantial pressure for a period of time now i believe shares are down more
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than 55% year to date last i checked at this point. just three months ago, stitch fix cut its revenue outlook for fiscal 2022. it also entirely withdrew its outlook for earnings guidance. at the time the company said that it was really going to have to re-evaluate its cost structure, how much money, for example, it was spending on marketing because it just wasn't bringing in the active customer count that it had anticipated. again, stitch fix was really appealing to a lot of us maybe when we were going to the office or, you know, looking for more formal outfits to wear, certainly during the pandemic it had to pivot its business a bit. but again, to go back to the headlines this afternoon, ceo elizabeth spaulding did send out a memo to employees announcing these layoffs. 15% of salaried positions, like you said, that represents about 4% of the company's total workforce because it does have a number of employees that are paid on an hourly basis.
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in this memo, spaulding really described that stitch fix is in the midst of a transformation and she said while some decisions can be difficult to make such as this one, it's really going to hopefully set stitch fix better for profitable growth over the long term because, again, the company does report its second quarter results after the bell in less than an hour and it's expected to post losses for this latest quarter. >> yeah, it looks like you scooped that with this announcement lauren, thank you. we'll monitor any other job loss announcements as we try to figure out if there's a turn coming in the economy and the labor market which has been so strong lauren thomas, you can read more about her story on cnbc.com. speaking of the consumer, the big picture today. we've got more signs the u.s. consumer is slowing down at the lower income level signet jewelers, a great quarter, a beat but the strength is in its higher price jewelry
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and the wedding boom and value oriented customers are challenged she also said once the stimulus wore off, traffic decreased and sales shifted to higher price points but did add that jewelry tends to perform well in recessionary periods because it holds value. though overall she expects the jewelry category to be down low single digits after what was record growth last year. one reason the slowdown in value oriented consumers five below also reflecting that slowdown on the lower end. the discount retailer plunging after reporting a revenue miss for q1, issuing lighter than expected earnings and revenue guidance the ceo of five below joel anderson saying he expects the macro environment to remain challenging. so the takeaways here, the lower end consumer is feeling the pain and consumers overall are prioritizing travel and concerts and weddings instead of goods. it's creating some big gaps in the winners and losers on wall
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street, even within that consumer discretionary basket. booking holdings is up while target is down over the same period it tells you what is working right now and what is not. up next, tech investor kevin landis reveals the three names he thinks are worth buying right now as the nasdaq takes a leg lower. the dow is down more than 400. you can listen to "closing bell" on the go by listening to the podcast. we'll be all over the sell-off when we come right back.
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another ugly day for stocks. the nasdaq seeing the sharpest declines right now, down more than 2%. our next guest says at some point it's time to put your shopping list together joining us now is kevin landis from firsthand fund. i assume you say that some point is now with some of these names that you like. i want to go through all three of them, but start maybe with the worst performer, whiches bill.com, software player that does back end financial operations for small and medium-sized businesses, kevin why are you going with an unprofitable company in this environment? >> because a lot of the startups we've invested in with a clean slate have chosen that as the best tool that they have and startup companies are usually a good indicator because they don't have switching costs,
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they're a good indicator of who's gaining market share in the future you know, if you go back to before the pandemic, their revenue was less than a quarter of what it is now. the stock has over that call it a two and a half year period, the stock is up but it's up maybe somewhere on the order of 50%, something like that and so it's actually cheaper than it was back then. so it's a terrific growth story. >> well, so growth story, so how do you value a company like this in this kind of changing rate environment? it's come down a lot from the highs. i don't know, early last year. but it's still pretty elevated from where it began. >> well, it depends on how far back you look. it's up a bit from pre-pandemic. so one useful exercise is you've got two, two and a half years. what happened to this company, never mind the mountain, the matterhorn stock chart that they all have how did this company change over the course of the pandemic and
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what do they look like now and that helps you put it in context. so it's a great growth name. we're heading into a recession i want to own companies that are going to grow. i rely on people out in the world who are customers of these companies to tell me what they really like to use and that's -- it's a great name. some of the smartest people i know have quit their jobs so they could go to work there. >> so you think we're heading into recession but now is the time to buy some of the beaten down names, correct? >> that's not trading advice let me just say, by the way, scheduling me to come on, i'm going to just say i think it's bad luck and causes the market to go way down because the last three times has been really painful. i think you can't time the bottom here. you just have to put together your list of companies that you're going to be glad you bought two, three, four years from now
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and for those, you're going to get your best pricing right in here when everyone is very, very fearful. so that's the simple thinking. >> and then chargepoint is on your list down 60% from all-time highs. market not really feeling the ev plays and the sort of future growth companies right now >> right, right. so chargepoint is probably the best built-out network of all of the charging companies you know, i can tell you from firsthand experience earlier this week, having taken a little bit of a road trip in a full ev, that that charging network is really important, particularly when they forget to plug your car in overnight so range anxiety is a real thing. and as more and more people get these evs, they'll have to keep building out these networks and that's going to end up being a pretty good franchise. maybe not as good as a cable
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company or a wireless carrier, but it's going to be a really great network to have. >> it's had a rough quarter with the inflation story and the supply chain issues, kevin how much do you see that hurting the whole space? >> well, i can tell you looking at charge ppoint, i've been frustrated lately because i think i just missed the bottom and kind of wanted to step in and build that position back up. i think it's -- it's a long-term play and the thing to do in these market meltdowns is to ask yourself not what trade can i make, because trading is crazy and will just drive you nuts, but what can i own right now that will come out of this smelling like a rose typically it's a really good, strong company in an emerging market it's a good growth story and while everyone else is missing their numbers, these guys have been making theirs. >> okay. well, putting yourself out
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there, kevin, thank you. on some of the hard-hit names. kevin landis from first hhand. meta is down about 5% today. we'll talk to an analyst about what's driving the decline. plus a top strategist says more pain could be ahead for the bulls. he'll explain why when we take you inside the mkeart zone with the dow down 488 right now if yod , there are other options! umpire: ball! good eye! good eye! eyes are good for lots of things. like reading! be the best, caleb! statistically impossible, caleb. umpire: strike three, you're out! you'll get 'em next time! or you won't, probably won't. and it won't impact your future whatsoever! talk to us about college planning today. feel comfortable about tomorrow. massmutual.
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♪ ♪ we are now in the "closing bell" market so did. mike santoli is here to break down these crucial moments of the trading day. plus meta's plunge and ben emmons on today's late-day
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sell-off stocks are down about 500 points on the dow jones industrial average. nasdaq is lagging the major averages, it is down a little more than 2% mike, every dow stock is lower except for home depot. goldman sachs, visa and caterpillar are the biggest drags on the dow is this a setup ahead of cpi tomorrow >> it would seem a little bit of a loss of nerves ahead of cpi. the market has really been held in check and in been a very narrow range for almost two weeks and you've just broken below. what's interesting is trading at these levels right before this big friday rally before memorial day was one of the last trading days in may, the 27th. and that was sort of the area that was being protected the market seemed like it was being quite resilient given the fact you had the ongoingness of all the issues, with treasury yields inching higher. largely oil has been relentless even though it's backing off today. now you have the central bank story kicking in further
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it really doesn't change too much about the overall picture but i do agree it sets up the market to be in a defensive crouch ahead of that inflation number tomorrow. >> i'm just looking at some of the performance of the mega cap tech names today apple is weighing the most on the qqqs you've got meta lower, nvidia, alphabet, amd. it has felt like a more constructive environment for some of these names. i don't know if you call that a bear market rally and how much conviction was in there. >> there was some relief in some of those amazon had its little run and it was showing a little disengagement from things like crypto that were weaker. i think the burden of proof remains pretty high because it arguably is the last area of the market really holding on to something of a valuation premium, while most of the rest of the market has had it wiped away. >> let's hit meta because it is one of the bigger decliners in the s&p 500.
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the company is leaving behind its fb ticker and is trading under meta it aligns with its rebranding to focus on the metaverse so they finally got the metaverse etf ticker and are launching as meta with a ticker symbol it's a reminder of how strategically this company is changing where are they in that process >> they remain very early but they are very, very serious about this they were hoping to do this change last year, pushed it out by a few months and then pulled it ahead and now again finally we are seeing this change in ticker so again, meta, formerly known as facebook, is very serious about what they want going forward in the next five, ten, 15 years again, they have had a lot of hits over the last few months.
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all the ecosystem data points aren't glowingly positive, in fact they are more and more negative as the days go by, but in this realm of profitable tech, meta is holding up, so that's a good sign. >> so the stock is off 52% on some of the reasons you just gave, including the slower growth that facebook has seen. is now a good time to get in >> at these levels i think heading into year end, i think there is a balanced risk/reward. it's not an extremely compelling valu valuation. if you are willing to digest to sell side numbers in the next three to six months, i think meta is a very good buy heading into next year but the next three to six months the downside may be 10 to 15%, upside 10 to 15%
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that's the band i think meta plays in before breaking out probably that happens early next year. >> rohit, the problem is they're very early in the process of tropical depressioning into the metaverse which is going to be very costcostly. at the time with growth slowing before we're really starting to see some economic weakness, the question is what kind of leeway is facebook going to have or meta going to have to be able to make this transition >> the company is already sending signals that they are willing to pull back on pet projects on the side earlier today they tried to signal that the ar glasses is going to be put on hold. they are clamping down on hiring so come september, october, probably we won't be surprised if they pull back on extra spend on metaverse they pull in the cash burn
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in the in 10 to $15 billion cash burn per year. if they say in august, september the cash burn is going to come down, i think that is the point you get into meta. >> it's down about 300 on the nasdaq right now mike, how does a facebook, given some of these challenges and changes that it's going through hold up if the economic environment weakens more >> well, it's already looking like the market doesn't quite believe there's much of an immediate growth trajectory, which is another way of saying the stock looks quite cheap based on earnings. i agree that the street craves some sense that there's cost discipline that the company is not going to just bet in an unhinged way on whatever the future is. but i think in the shorter term, they have to show that digital advertising is not going to be severely impacted. they have to show there's going to be demand that's the next couple of quarters, not the next few years. that's probably would what get rewarded if the platform shows
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it's holding up pretty well. >> rohit, thank you for joining us on facebook. the ev stocks are getting caught up in the selling pressure tesla turning lower even after ubs upgraded the stock to buy from neutral also look at nio, it's down about 7% after the chinese company reported a decline in gross margins and also issued weak guidance because of higher commodity costs and supply chain challenges our phil lebeau joins us phil, how much do tesla's outlooks depend on -- >> well, more nio than tesla while both ramp up deliveries as the lockdown in shanghai expires, it's not going to be able to make up all of the deliveries that they lost. when you take a look at tesla, it's really more of a global view point that is what ubs highlighted today. in the world of evs, they have three advantages nobody else
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has. what are they? backlogs in production, much stronger in terms of where they are now than any other competitors, strong margins in pricing. that's not changing any time soon and they have supply chain advantages they have a headstart of many, many years on their competitors. that's what they're taking advantage of and that's why ubs upgraded them today. then when you look at nio, yes, it is growing but it comes off a very small base in china i hear this from people all the time, sara, what's going on with nio? >> it's growing, but it's very small. >> it is interesting that it's one of the most actively traded names here at the big board every single day like the last month. phil, thank you. small, maybe high momentum there. phil lebeau. stocks are sinking here into the close, we're down 2% on the s&p, the dow is down more than 500 and the nasdaq is bearing the brunt of the pain, down 2.4% ben emmons joins us. ben, we've been talking about how we've been in this trading range for stocks in the last ten
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days or so and we're starting to break below it ahead of the cpi report what is today's action telling you? >> hi, sara. yeah, we're in a perfect downtrend, right if you look at the s&p, you're sitting right below the 4200 level and the 50-day moving average is moving down and the 100-day is moving down it's really the reversal of last year, every dip was a buy and peak was a sell. obviously the ecb outcome doesn't help i think there was a lot about fears of eurozone slipping eventually into a recession sooner and i think that's weighing on markets today too. so we're sitting in this downward momentum. >> energy is faring a little bit better i don't know, consumer staples, industrials doing a little bit better are you still in the reopening
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plays? does that still work even in this downtrend that you describe >> to an extent, i think we have to be encouraged that asia is reopening, that challenges for china as it starts to reopen some of the global reopening play is still there that you can have as an offensive play but you have to otherwise be completely defense it's everything about high dividends, high cash, high yielding type stocks to weather this environment basically how to flat line if you will, so offense/defense strategies flat on the year. so i think what you have to stay in until the bottom is hit and that's an inflation story. it's clear lowly about what will happen tomorrow. >> so mike, when people ask you how long is the average
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correction or bear market in history, and what does that tell us about where we are at this point in it? it feels like investors have already endured a lot of pain but everybody keeps saying we could see another big correction. >> well, it's been five months if it's a cyclical bear market, i think on average they go a little bit less than a year. this gets into this semantics here we got down to barely above a 20% decline. that's not really the marker of whether this is a bear market or n not. to me it's the breadth of the damage so i don't think there's a way to put a marker on it. to me the big, big debate is not so much how long does this typically last it's if this is a rerun of the major 2000 and 2008, more 2000 style multi-year, multi-weigh downtrends associated with a recession, that's a big if, then stop talking about where the bottom is. >> right. >> but if not, then this is some kind of major valuation reset
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that often happens at the outset of a tightening cycle and you just needed to take care of some expensive pockets of the market and adjust for lower growth. then arguably you're kind of there. down 15, 16, 17% from the intraday highs the lows were about 20%. if there's a retest from three weeks ago, that's not an unusual pattern and that's down a couple hundred s&p points from here. >> theoretically it should work until the fed tightens too much and the economy really starts to feel the pain and then could signal a policy shift. ben, which one does it feel like to you, something long for more prolonged multi-year in terms of a downtrend or you're just waiting for a buy opportunity until the work is done >> yeah, i'm still on the latter camp, sara i echo mike's comments we have seen a lot of damage and it looks like the year 2000 when a lot of overvalued stocks are
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down 70, 80% so we've completed that phase. the federal reserve is, i think, rogaining some level of credibility in markets to get ahead of the inflation problem but has more work to do. we have to accept that the economy may slow down and be on the edge of a recession but we're also coming off a pandemic and that's a very different dynamic. so there's going to be some overtiming but eventually if the market settles out and does find that bottom, it's not going to be at these levels, it's going to be lower. >> ben emons, thank you for joining us on this final, ugly hour of trading here we've got two minutes to go. we are down now about 600 points on the dow, mike what do you see in the internals? >> it's quite skewed to the downside it's close to ten times as much or more than ten times as much downside volume as advancing volume this is a little pickup in the general level of activity and selling pressure ahead of that cpi number
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clearly people stepping back from risk, not wanting to go in there exposed to the number. it could turn out to be a positive thing in terms of the setup. look at the refiners, crak it has tested a multi-year high. so far it's pulled back from that a little bit. see if it gets some relief that shows you tight refining capacity and upward pressure on gasoline the volatility index has perked up but still just above 26 not really doing much, but the range has been frd mythom the ms to 30s. >> even devon energy has duturnd the market action has been ugly and bearish in the last hour of trade or so. every sector lower communication services down the most, down 2.7%. it's the media names, the tech names like meta, like netflix, warner brothers, paramount all
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weighing on that group technology is also down sharply, that is why the nasdaq is underperforming on the day and you're seeing it across the board. consumer staples holding up the best but that group is down 1.5% there goes the bell. we are down 2.4% on the s&p, 2.75 on the nasdaq that's it for me on "closing bell." now into "overtime" with scott wapner >> sara, thank you so much welcome, everybody, to "overtime. i'm scott wapner you just heard the bells docusign earnings are imminent as usual we'll have the numbers and the instant stock reaction the moment that report comes out i will also be joined in just a little bit by gabriella santos on why she thinks we're closer to the end of the selling than the beginning. it's interesting to get that take on a day like today we do ben th our talk of the tape all that is riding on tomorrow's critical inflation read and which could cause a big shock to stocks

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