i don't know >> we're trying to figure it out. >> bull market, bear market, rally. you know when we'll know like a year. i guess. maybe not even by then >> will we when will we know? i don't know >> final check on the market i know tomorrow's friday final check on the markets we're now positive we're now positive some of those numbers that came out at 8:30 were okay. jobs friday. make sure you join us. "squawk on the street" is next ♪ good thursday morning, welcome to "squawk on the street," i'm david faber along with jim cramer live from the new york stock exchange. carl has the morning off let's give you a look at futures, get started with trading here 30 minutes from now, and as joe told you, we're looking up on the markets after we got some data about a half hour ago, turned things around a bit. let's get to our road map. we're going start with earnings that show some cloud computing gloom. salesforce and snowflake both being weighed down by slower

growth plus, former ftx ceo sam bankman-fried denies committing fraud, but admits that he screwed up and that apple pile-on calls apple's app store not sustainable, but elon musk now calls his criticism a misunderstanding sometimes i feel like if you write it there, i will read it, and i don't even know what i said i'm not quite sure >> you did a good job. >> it's okay thank you. but we will get to that, in particular musk and cook sort of making up, taking a nice stroll around the pond at apple's hq. and we'll also get to zuckerberg, but let's start with salesforce you can see the stock is going to be down almost 8%, this after posting quarterly results that were above street estimates. current quarter guidance, though, did come in at the low

end of analysts' forecasts, and of course the biggest news is that brett taylor is stepping down as coceo. that's effective january 31st. marc benioff will become sole ceo once again, and of course, we will also remain chairman. here is what mr. benioff told jim on "mad money" about brett taylor's departure >> it's a gut punch, and you know, running a company, and i have been doing this now for 25 years, you look for the best people in the world to bring them in, and the hardest part is when they tell you that they want to leave, and that's where we are with bret he's going to be leaving at the end of the year. >> all right here's the man who conducted that interview what do you think? >> okay, first, yeah, when i questioned whether it was conservative guidance, negative guidance, he said, no. it's actual, because there are some real slowdowns.

there's some customers that are simply choosing to not spend a lot. the most impacted were retail consumer goods, communications, although t-mobile did announce a big deal but let's talk about bret taylor for a second i've never seen marc this upset. it was a hold back tears moment. he actually had to stabilize things before he went, because he loves bret. >> he was emotional about his departure. >> extremely >> and it was a surprise >> very rare, my wife was there, and we know marc >> yes, i know >> and marc was -- he was stunned and hurt he loves bret, and it was his -- he had lost composure, which is very unusual for a ceo, but marc's an emotional guy. >> yes >> bret taylor beat musk >> yes, as chairman of twitter, he delivered for all those shareholders >> right >> most people would have been

intimidated by musk and backed down bret taylor drove that he was the chairman. people may not realize he was the chairman of this wihile he was co-ceo he beat musk and beat him because he said, listen, musk is going to pay us. i saw at dreamforce. >> bret taylor did a great job the law was on his side, as i said throughout. >> he was not scared, backed down. >> he did prevail. why is he leaving this company >> he's got offers galore. he's going to start his own company. >> what offers e he's co-ceo of one of the most important technology companies out there, and he's 42 years old. look at him. he's a kid >> he's young. he's such a great guy. totally understand there's a great coaching tree of benioff. i mean, you got gasman from aviva, mckinnon from okta who recollects had a decent quarter. >> these are all people who worked at salesforce >> right george did some amazing work at twilio and then went on.

it's fabulous. but the -- when you -- no one's beaten musk except for taylor, so you can imagine you've got this guy, the most powerful man in the universe, and you have this very quiet, steadfast man, who told me, when everyone thought that the 52 was out of the question, said, oh, he's paying. i said, no, i mean, but everyone's scared. he says your numbers -- he said, the numbers are accurate, and he's paying. when everyone was saying, fear musk, he was, like, who's musk >> yes, you've come back to this twice now, but that doesn't answer the question as to why he's leaving >> okay, because he has so many opportunities. and he just feels like it's time he's got great opportunities i know marc didn't want it to happen marc loves bret. >> it also follows keith block's departure, perhaps for different reasons, but nonetheless, co-ceo arrangement there as well, not that long ago, didn't work out, lasted 18 months >> also, i think you meet people justifiably who says, wait a

second, maybe you can't work with marc. i'm telling you, point-blank, that's untrue. i spent a lot of time with bret when i was out at dreamforce they are -- he and marc are very, very close, but the opportunities were too great >> so, he's leaving for other opportunities. >> he could turn down the opportunities. >> a young man, although one would expect being co-ceo of one of the more important technology companies, not a bad opportunity. >> marc did everything he could to keep him. everything but -- and he did a great job, but the opportunities were great. i'm not going to return to what i said, it's just to be self-aggrandizing and i'm not going there. i'm not a bankman-fried character. i'm not going to tell you i'm sorry for stealing i'm sorry, allegedly comingling, allegedly taking your money. >> we're going to get to him we'll get to sbf let's stick with a name that you know very well >> i just felt bad for marc. marc was entirely broken up.

he didn't want it to appen >> let's talk about the numbers themselves and then let's move on to snowflake as well, because you know, are these numbers reflective of this macroeconomic slowdown cited yesterday, for example, the tape by crowdstrike down as much as 20% yesterday as well you've been talking about this slowdown in cloud for quite some time >> it's real the people in retail and consumer goods, communications and media. now, by the way, those areas were very strong for -- for snowflake. remember, snowflake has kind of disconsidered. >> you don't need a long-term deal with us >> it's short-term it's the right time. it's where you want to go. but longer term, he's not sure, and they have a different -- a nonratable model, so you don't know what the numbers are going to be, so he goes to 8% margins. now it's going to 1% i mentioned that last night. he said, look, he actually had a

belichick moment he is belichick-like he said, jim, the guidance is the guidance >> let's listen, actually. let's listen to that moment from frank last night on "mad money." >> the guidance is the guidance, and you know, you always have to wait and see how it plays out. we think these numbers are formidable in any reasonable context. obviously, the sentiment in the market is a little stressed out, and people react very strongly, and that's understood, but we live in the real world, and we just go one day at a time, one quarter at a time. >> the guidance is the guidance. i love that. >> he's like the belichick >> if you don't know your stuff with snowflake, he will completely dismiss you >> does he wear a hoodie around the office >> he will basically tell you, listen, you don't like it, move on to cincinnati >> does he sleep in a cave >> no, but in a cot. at the end of a quarter, when he

was at service now >> i always imagine belichick sleeps in a cavem i don't know why >> i know he slept on a cot at the end of service now quarter, when he built service now to the great company it is. i will say without a doubt, the quarter was the best quarter of cloud. >> right and the stock is not suffering >> right best quarter of the cloud. it was down 15 at one point. that's because people did not hear the interview, and the interview was basically, hey, look, we had a great quarter the guidance is the guidance, which was, i know, the level of surety there, i actually like. marc, on the other hand -- >> benioff from salesforce >> marc from salesforce is basically saying, some companies have really said, you know what? we've got to be really careful here, because we're not sure >> and so we're going to put our foot on the brake a bit. >> dollar continues to be weak >> it's not the first quarter, though, by the way, jim. we're starting to put -- >> no, no. if you're listening to jay

powell, federal reserve chairman, versus, say, mr. bullard, who's not the federal reserve chairman, you would say to yourself, wow, what happened in the last six weeks >> you and i talked about the last two weeks of october, for example. >> october was one of the worst months >> you and i both got from different people, but we got evidence that things had slowed, sometimes dramatically, but just slowed >> how many times have you heard 2008 mentioned in the last 48 hours? >> that one, i don't buy >> not on the systemic risk of the country, but of the, wow, i got to cut back because i'm afraid of 2008 in other words, there is no 2008, but they're afraid because they w they remember what it was like go ahead >> maybe starboard just picked a bad time to be an activist on this name, on salesforce, because it was only recently that jeff smith came out with that position in salesforce, just saying they've not

generated meaningful operating leverage relative to peers in recent years their long-term targets are less ambitious than peers the valuation discount is largely the result of their subpar mix of growth and profitability. and on from there. >> i'm not going to say that i'm going to say that they bought back more than a billion and a half in stock. the margins were up, which is something that starboard wanted, and let's be sure. everybody knows this i've done a lot of work on the relationship between starboard and salesforce, and it actually is amicable. this is not one of those faux amicable things. it's real. >> right >> they're working together to try to figure out how to make it >> that said, it -- lot of stocks down. >> because there are people who are using salesforce less. >> yeah. >> and then there are other people -- the biggest customer okay, we have the ceo, and one day, he came in and said, we got to eliminate salesforce because we're in trouble their numbers went down big. it was just a really bad way to

save money, is to cut out salesforce then another time, when the company was doing poorly, we brought in salesforce and started doing better and you know, there's things -- some companies are wise and up their salesforce spending. others cut back, and they tend to do worse. and that's pretty much it. and you know who stepped up and spent more >> who >> mike seifert at t-mobile. >> they're in a very good spot >> and michael dell stepped up and brian moynihan from bank of america stepped up they added and moved ahead >> let's talk about sam bankman-fried, because you want to you know you do. ftx manager sam bankman-fried did continue to speak out. you want him, he's available now, apparently. this, of course, after the collapse of the cryptocurrency exchange he sat down with andrew ross sorkin yesterday at the deal bank summit. bankman-fried struck back

against those who accused him of fraud. >> i didn't ever try to commit fraud on anyone. i was excited about the prospects of ftx a month ago i saw it as a thriving, growing business i was shocked by what happened this month, and you know, reconstructing it, boy, are there things i wish i had done differently. there was no person who was chiefly in charge of positional risk of customers on ftx, and that feels pretty embarrassing in retrospect. >> didn't really keep a close eye on that alameda, apparently. it feels his first interview apparently he may have done another one already today. i would assume his lawyers have just thrown their hands up and said, we're just done with you but he feels compelled, somehow, to continue to speak it's obviously a fascinating story for many, regardless of whether they have any involvement in the crypto world at all it's still been fascinating to watch and listen to and

obviously, kudos to him. >> it was a fabulous interview by andrew. there's a couple things -- having gone to harvard law school and became a member of the bar, i will say this that guy is a clueless idiot intent means nothing saying "sorry" means nothing if you comingle, if you had no recordkeeping, those are against the law. it's not like they're like, you know what? i was sloppy and i feel bad and i'm sorry. no you were sloppy, you didn't keep records. illegal. so, if you're admitting to illegality, even though you think that you had no intent, the u.s. attorney does not care one whit about intent. what the u.s. attorney cares about is, did you break the law? you can't go to the u.s. attorney and say, i'm really sorry. i didn't mean to hurt anybody. no it's against the law now, being a nice guy, which he clearly is, is irrelevant. >> he is many people that i have spoken to met him and known him, describe him that way. doesn't mean a thing, though >> it means absolutely nothing

some of the nicest people i know have spent some serious time in jail i mean, millionaires >> he does seem genuinely sorry, but again, there are many out there who believe he's just a pathological liar. >> i'm that. >> you are >> he's a pathological liar. he's a con man he admits to comingling two accounts that shouldn't be commingled, but then he says, it doesn't really matter, and i feel badly well, you know what? again, it doesn't matter if he's a pathological liar or the most honest man in america. the fact is, he broke the law, and i understand why his lawyers don't want him to talk, because a lot of times, what the lawyers say is, if you admit and you do not seek fifth amendment protection, we can't help you. you will probably go to jail see, lawyers say, you know, it's perhaps better that you don't say that you did the crime that tends to be why lawyers are lawyers. >> well, it's an important point you make again, his saying, i didn't knowingly comingle funds doesn't mean a thing

it's not effective >> look, i was -- if you comingle funds, your lawyers say, well, that's -- you'll probably go to jail for that don't comingle so, i would say, but i didn't have any intent to comingle, which i did not comingle wow. >> i think he's still hanging at the albany club, although i don't know how he's paying those monthly dues >> is he at bakers bay >> he's at the albany club >> have you looked at some of these bakers bay >> what about bakers bay what about it? i'm sorry? >> we should just take up golf and go to these places >> they're very expensive, jim >> oh. >> but if you invite me as your guest, i'll go >> i just did some looking >> you might have to -- >> it's too expensive. >> you might have to sell a couple houses to get to bakers bay. >> how's that stock doing, wheels up? is that good >> coming up, mark zuckerberg, another very close friend of jim's, defends his metaverse strategy, weighs in on apple of course, also, he was a guest

at the dealbook summit we'll have those details straight ahead let's give you another look at futures. we get started with trading about 13 minutes from now, and as you see, following, at least it would seem in the early going, on what was a very strong rally yesterday, of course, after those perhaps more dovish resqua ormrom the fed chaian mo "wkn the street" straight ahead g me get an ice bath again. what do you mean? these straps are mind-blowing! they collect hundreds of data points like hrv and rem sleep, so you know all you need for recovery. and you are? i'm an investor...in invesco qqq, a fund that gives me access to... nasdaq 100 innovations like... wearable training optimization tech. uh, how long are you... i'm done. i'm okay. to adapt in a fast changing world, you could hire a professional pit crew. go, go, go. sorry. nope. okay. fresh donuts - hot coffee! they deliver real time data and business forecasts when you need it.

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well, if you've been watching us for any length of time, you know those shares

right there of meta, you can see it in the right-hand corner, down almost 65% this year, and actually, that's way off the lows hurt, of course, by, in part, the enormous, record-setting spending that the company is undertaking to create the metaverse. yesterday, though, at the dealbook summit, mark zuckerberg defended meta's strategy he told andrew ross sorkin, "a lot of people like, okay, we're just wholly focused on the metaverse. we're not focused on the social media part, the family apps. that's basically wrong the vast majority of my time and the vast majority of the company's effort is going towards the social media efforts. the engagement we're seeing in these apps is strong there's somewhat of a perception that it's not going as well for some reason, but internally, from all the numbers that we see, the metrics are strong. okay i turn to you. >> all right, so, instagram, people are checking it as much as they used to, but people aren't posting as much, and they

don't know what to do about that they're in a panic about that, actually so, let's say you check seven times, people only post twice a day. that is the issue. >> what did you make about this pivot that he seems to be saying, wait a second, you know, it's not just metaverse and we're much more focused and my time is more -- is that genuine? >> he did make a series of very -- a lot of people feel he didn't do anything with instagram. he bought it he made a lot of serious changes. i think people feel that he has to be -- that this is his baby, metaverse, and he's going to show you it works. but people have not -- it has not caught fire. >> no. it's early and he believes this is a long-term effort >> yeah, but at the same time, it is a public company and i think it's -- my travel trust owns it. we own a little bit. we had bought it '18, '20. >> we know -- we've been down the emotional road with you and meta >> it is an emotional road

you know why >> why >> because if you try to do business with meta, they don't really -- they're not capable of doing business >> what does that mean >> well, you know, they're supposed to be a mall. a meta mall. but it's not anything. you can't -- there's no real meta mall. people are trying to figure out what meta is still is stick figures whereas you could use mirror from lululemon to exercise against. it's not commercial. it's considered cumbersome many of the smart people i dealt with in the last 48 hours were involved in some of andrew's work, they're basically saying that what was said is not really what's happening and that zuckerberg is really trying very hard to figure out but loves the metaverse, but it's a multiple-year thing, except for it's in public companies, you don't do rebuilding if it's the nfl, you say, it's

year four. >> the stock has responded positively >> you fired a lot of people >> to the impact of cost-cutting >> alphabet, i think, has to lay off a lot of people. they probably may not like that agreement. they may not agree with that, but they have to amazon, we know, has to. >> amazon has undertaken layoffs. meta has >> salesforce said, no >> alphabet, not so much >> salesforce said, no >> snowflake >> all right start thinking about your "mad dash," because that's what's coming up right here of course, we have an opening bell seven minutes away. don't go anywhere,

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you also most likely know what happened to the equity markets but there's a look at that ten-year at 3.592. go back a little bit, it wasn't that many ekagwes o, right, we were above 4 we're back after this.

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>> announcer: the opening bell is brought to you by nuveen, a leader in income, alternatives, and responsible investing. let's squeeze in a "mad dash." we'll get an opening bell about a minute from now. five below >> new champion of companies offering great value, it's five below. versus, say, dollar general, which had problems at the distribution level, some inflationary issues. five below, which i happen to have on tonight, reported a remarkable quarter with strength throughout a lot of people -- remember how we said october was weak these guys just have a runway that is rather incredible, and they're talking about still opening a lot of stores. david, it's squish mallow. the products -- >> the what? >> squish mallow >> what is that? >> and candy did very well

>> got it. >> when i first heard of five below, of course, i thought it was like an rei kind of store. but no five below is the place to go. >> here is the opening bell. back at the realtime exchange. we kind of moved into positive territory. here at the big board, world vision, strong women, strong world, empowering women and girls in poverty over at the nasdaq, the index iq celebrating the launch of a new suite of etfs, because one thing the world needs, jim, is more etfs >> more etfs and more spacs. i want to come back to something you've been talking about. credit suisse, today, it's down 6.4% >> it's funny you started there. i have been spending time, and yet again this morning go ahead i didn't mean to -- >> i just think that, at this point, i don't know if it's the

right software i don't know the way out >> it's interesting. we have a chart now of the credit to false swaps because you want to keep an eye on them as well. it's still above the 250 swiss franc level. by the way, the charts that you'll see are in dollars. when you look at the swiss franc chart, it's lower. in other words, it's closer to 270 right now. it's an issue. now, remember, it's backstopped, so the banks have stepped up for the rights offering, but then you sell the rights, people give you money for them, 250, then they have the right to buy the stock. the problem is, if it falls below that, nobody's going to do it, and then the larger question becomes, are assets still flowing out, as i believe they are? to what level? and can they continue to raise more capital not to mention making sure the rating agencies are kept happy

it's a difficult thing to execute right now for the company, jim, when it's -- when it cannot stem the flow of assets and prevent its stock price from continuing this decline. you got to sort of get there >> are there institutions or countries that simply will not let this go? >> yeah, i mean, there's a thought that the swiss won't let it go. is there really systemic risk here that's unclear certainly, there are derivatives and plenty of -- there's some counterparty risk, perhaps, but you're talking about a giant wealth manager, not a great deal of systemic risk >> i just want to keep people. >> many people say, well, it will just end up, ubs will just sort of pour over a lot of it. >> wj. >> we'll see it's too early you know, why we followed it so closely is, in part, it's just the -- it's a franchise that's been around for a long time, but it has, you know, never failed to miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity

>> yeah. >> who said that about the peace process? so, they just -- they get it all wrong. they have throughout not a lot of stock owned by those who have run the company, but man, they've been paid pretty well. over the last seven years, jim, they've raised -- the amount of money they've raised in capital exceeds their current market cap by more than 20% >> you didn't happen to catch this piece by morgan stanley about the downside risk of some riskier lenders, ali financial >> no. >> very, very weak a lot of real negative things to say about capital one, synchrony. i don't know i think a lot of people are very worried. >> the thesis is these lenders in some way are risk because of a recession? >> there's a great line here by betsy grayson, who's just a great analyst. she says, as times get tougher,

consumers increasingly will have to prioritize who to pay and who to pay, well, paying super lenders comes after paying for food, shelter, and energy. you know there's a very -- there's a very interesting merchant of venice-like analysis shakespeare holds up in almost every stock that i follow. salesforce dragging down the dow. >> salesforce is, yes. of course, we did spend a good amount of time on it but it is down almost 10% now. >> it really hurt the dow. they should have added, i don't know, what could they have added that would have changed their fortunes >> jim, it's been a rough year for this company's stock, not to mention, really, the last couple of years >> look, it was -- the bret taylor thing was just astounding people love bret >> yeah. >> love bret bret was very accessible bret was very sports fan, good

job last night, sorry about the phillies he was one of those guys >> well, he still is he's not dead. >> you're right. i don't want to get emotional. i'm just saying that he was, during the period when musk was basically calling him and his whole company a fraud, he was, yeah, i really don't care. >> twitter shareholders will be forever thankful to bret taylor for holding the line there along with other people on the board saying, sorry, my man, and they got it now it's elon musk's and obviously every day, we talk about what he's doing with twitter. that brings me to, what do you make of musk and cook getting together and seemingly ironing out some of the what seemed to be building hostility and kind of defusing it tim cook's very good at doing that, it would seem. >> well, it's because tim cook is a true customer person and

also someone who is very rational there's no emotion look, this -- here's the cards this is what you've been dealt cards are fair and if you don't sit down with him and you just throw bombs, it doesn't work it just -- i mean, i've always thought, for instance, china, they do a huge amount of business they're -- i'm always waiting for people to say, duplicitous. the people are not -- the people who work and live in china are not the enemy of the united states they're not. many of them would love to come here and work. there's a grave misperception about what the people feel like in that country about the united states, and tim cook understands that >> well, whatever he said to musk seems to have worked. he indicated there was never a plan to throw them out of the

app store. that was a tweet from musk, sort of showing where he was and thanking cook for taking him around what he said is the beautiful headquarters there, of course >> well, i think musk -- we forget, at the beginning of tesla, he made a lot of mistakes, and then he course corrected, and maybe he can do that with twitter, which, so far, no one's noticed that much difference and he's fired, what, half the people. honestly i mean, think about it has twitter gotten worse, even though the sales -- whole group has been laid off there? >> no. i think a lot of people are waiting, hedging their bets. >> right i'm waiting for him to understand the power >> i'm still using it. >> if the consumer brands are cutting back, that's very bad for them >> right and obviously, apple is one of the larger advertisers on the platform, and that clearly was something that was important for musk as well

didn't stop zuckerberg from going after apple, of course >> he ought to zuckerberg was pretty much destroyed by apple apple decided they didn't want you to -- apple decided that the customers don't want to be tracked. now, why did they do that? because the customer didn't want to be tracked. there's not a lot of counterintuitive >> how many billions did they -- in advertising did they destroy as a result of those changes ios? there's zuckerberg on apple, saying, you know, trying to control unilaterally what apps get on a device and that's not a sustainable or good place to be. >> no. the people really like what tim cook did people are tired, also, of saying something, like you and i are talking, i need a new pair of shoes and then i get albrecht's for the rest of the day. hi, i love faber now i'm going to get things about faber college. >> great school. college is good. >> or hamilton faber >> the analyst that we

discovered yesterday in london, yeah apparently no relation >> none whatsoever different tribe, as you said different branch david, can i talk about of all these companies, airbnb, uber, lyft, i mean, the only one that is really holding up right now is etsy. etsy, price target raise has become the theme, and i think what's happened here is that this is one of the rare companies where people tasted etsy during the lockdown and decided, you know what this is how i could buy a present that isn't like everybody's present, and i want to continue to watch etsy as being very much like what -- i happen to like the store, macy's i think jeff is doing a good job, but this is a store of stuff you can't buy anywhere else, and etsy, i think, is the one that makes the comeback off the north face of everest. >> and unlike so many others, is

substantially up since the pandemic that said, it is still down 48% over the last year >> how about two that went down too much okta and splunk. people think the world was coming to an end at both of those, and they're making a bit of a comeback. >> jim, you and i both took note of a note this morning from wedbush. i noted it because it wandered into my area of, you know, m&a and risk, a lot of focus, there will be, especially this month, on activision and the sale to microsoft. we talked about that politico story where they were indicating that sources close to the ftc were close to potentially acting to block the deal, but i don't know what wedbush thinks they know or don't know, but they simply say, we think you should buy the stock because they expect microsoft's acquisition

to be completed at the proposed -- it's not proposed price. it's at the price of $95 a share. >> you don't do that unless you're sure, that piece. >> well, you know, i can't imagine there's an analyst at wedbush who -- it's pacter i don't know, what does he know? >> what, he's like a stooge? >> does he have any sources in the antitrust world? >> that piece is written as if he knows this is going through this piece is either hubris or -- >> i will say this i don't necessarily directionally believe that politico story from last week was correct. these are always difficult things to do i don't have any reporting that i would go out strong with but this is a situation that continues to bear watching and those who believe that there's extraordinarily high likelihood that it's going to get blocked. let's give it a little more time by the way, you got the eu and

the chinese still. i mean, it's so many different things to wade through here. >> i know. i know we'll mention kroger when we come back? >> we got to take a break because we're going to be getting data, but let's give you a quick bond report. take a look at how treasuries are faring yields came off yesterday after the fed chairman spoke the market responded quite positively you can see where we stand right now as well. >> good deflator today >> the two-year at 4.337 >> that's a major move

welcome back to "squawk on the street", rick santelli live here at cme hq with more breaking news. we're going to be getting our november final read on s&p global manufacturing pmis. the mid-month read was 47.6. and 47.7 still remains the lowest level for this index

since may of 2020, when it was 39.8 and like many pmis across the globe, it is definitely weakening, and many believe these are the early signs of a potential recession at some point down the road. remember, yesterday, two-year notes closed at a one-month low yield, ten-year at a two-plus low yield. the dow finished the month down 5% and it's down another 1% today. remember, "squawk on the street" will return after a sht ea orbrk. ♪♪ energy demands are rising. and the effects are being felt everywhere. that's why at chevron, we're increasing production in the permian basin by 15%. and we're projected to reach 1 million barrels of oil per day by 2025. all while staying on track to reduce our carbon emissions intensity in the area. because it's only human to tackle the challenges of today to help ensure a brighter tomorrow.

welcome back chance for us to talk a little bit about kroger >> yeah. you know, look, this is one that they really did blow the numbers away 6.9% comp sales, extraordinary stock was up very big. as the call went on this morning, they start talking about, there's no new news on the albertson's deal david, that's worrisome. we mentioned earlier the notion of microsoft, but they've already really spoken on this issue. >> lena khan, who runs the ftc >> i know the assistant attorney general will not be involved, as

i understand it's really just -- but he would not be looking at his writings involved in this no new stuff about the merger. >> okay. >> end of express deal, going to cost them a hundred million dollars. >> but the numbers themselves were good. >> i'm saying is i was really kind of blown away by how good the numbers were. by the way, once again, consumer trading down, their own products. >> down to the store brand. >> yeah, doing better. i understand what he keeps talking about is union jobs will be preserved in the deal which is a direct appeal to president biden. >> but the key is, you and i have discussed this in the past, the competitor created by the divestitures, is that a viable competitor that becomes the key question. >> it's the safeway deal, the

merger where safeway created a new entity to merge with albertsons they used hagan. hagan went bankrupt five months after. hagan bought a lot of stores they wrote about this saying this is precisely the kind of deal we will not back. rodney mcmullen intends to put a lot of money into a new deal to create a new competitor. and by the way, cantor at justice, doesn't matter, doesn't work now, as you've always told me, jim, you seem to forget the fact that you can appeal their rulings. you can take them to court. >> yeah. obviously, you can just defend yourself in court if they bring, as we know, right? at&t successfully defended itself, completed the time warner merger. that said -- >> that could happen. >> it happened a year later than they wanted it to and that was very detrimental. >> and that's what hurt kroger,

i think. the idea that this is going to drag on. you may think it's going to be done quickly, and it's not our same-store sales may not mean anything to you at this point next year. >> can become a real distraction for management and shareholders. let's get over to bob pisani and check on the broader market after the big rally yesterday. >> the dow is down on salesforce the s&p is up. inflation moving in the right direction. that's why we're up. risk-on up here, if you want to look at ark, metals and mining stuff, you see them to the upside defense sector tends to be we are getting a breakout on new highs. pharmaceuticals are at my hue. merck is at a new high lp lilly, smuckers, general mills. and another interesting group, insurance companies are hitting

52-week highs. generally considered fairly defensive. there's progressive travelers, hartford financial, chubb, i wanted to put in there, but chubb at a new 52-week high. we are breaking some potential downtrends on the s&p 500, folks. yes, technicals matter when the fundamentals are confusing, people look at the technicals we've been in a downtrend all year this is the s&p 500. we're on the verge of breaking that downtrend yes, people watch technicals when the fundamentals are confusing. watch that we're in an up-trend we're 14% off the highs we hit a little over a month ago, so in terms of the markets, the good and the bad, uptrend for the s&p. good news. two-year yield, downtrend, good news dollar, downtrend, good news earnings, however, are in a very clear downtrend and that's a problem. is somebody's wrong here prices are up. earnings are coming down rather quickly and dramatically, particularly by the strategist somebody's got this wrong.

here's the consensus for the s&p for 2023 is $231 that's the analyst the strategists all have numbers way below. this morning jpmorgan lowered their estimate for 2023 to $205. these guys are way below what the analysts are $220 is about what we're doing in 2022, so the bottom line, a lot of people expecting us to be flat to down for earnings next year, where the overall stock market is acting like, what recession? there isn't one that's going to happen so, the result is, the multiple is going up here depending on how you look at the estimates. if you think $231 is what we're going to do, it's 17 times forward, that's the historic average. if you have $220, it's 18, you have $200 it's 20. you get towards 20, you have to make some very strong arguments that the economy is going to be doing fine and there's potential earnings growth. that's a tall order for people to make.

jpmorgan came out with '23 numbers and they say, we expect the s&p 500 to retest the year's lows as the fed overtightens into weaker fundamentals that seems to be the consensus these 2023 comments you'll hear over the next few days, they were written weeks ago things are change significantly in the last few weeks. the markets are acting like if there's going to be a recession, it's going to be very, very mild or even some kind of soft landing. we'll keep an eye on this. the only big wild card now is wage inflation that's what you want to watch tomorrow on the jobs report. see if we see any kind of serious wage inflation if not, we'll have another rally. back to you. >> bob, thank you. bob pisani it's funny, jim, we haven't talked this much about what was a big rally yesterday. >> oh, huge. i devoted the top of my show to it, how extraordinary it was i think what you have to recognize was a lot of it was faang. they had been down, down, down.

>> there was a huge rebound in so many of the names we talk about. >> it said, look, yes, we're absolutely going to have tough quarters but maybe '23 is better we're all in december. december, what do we care about 2023 we have time for a quick "stop trading. >> pvh had a bad, bad, bad quarter and now having a good quarter. cal calvin kline and tommy hilfiger had good quarters. >> what's on the show? >> five below, remember what that is -- >> i have now been instructed, yes, as to what they are >> we have a tougher one, george kurtz, crowdstrike, who had his first, what i would say, not as strong quarter stock was down very badly. >> that's a good interview, actually looking forward to that. >> thank you

>> i watched your hormel last night, too >> i didn't drink any -- >> you only drink it with us applegate -- >> yeah. i'll see you there later i think it was a good show what do you give it? 7? >> b-plus. >> b-plus. i'm going 7, 7.5 out of 10. coming up, we'll continue to stay on top of all of these cloud-related stocks, salesforce is down sharply. snowflake, though, moving up >> good. deserving. >> keep it here. if you wake up thinking about the market and want to make the right moves fast... get decision tech. for insights on when to buy and sell. and proactive alerts on market events. that's decision tech. only from fidelity.

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dolly varden silver is advancing their high-grade undeveloped asset in bc's prolific golden triangle. the property includes two past producing mines, and over 135 million ounces of silver equivalent. dolly varden. good thursday morning. welcome to another hour of "squawk on the street. i'm david faber with morgan brennan and mike santoli we're live at the new york stock exchange carl has the day off. we have gotten off to a positive start after a strong day yesterday. the dow is really only under pressure because salesforce

shares as a part of it are down sharply. otherwise, it would be be higher we're getting economic data across the tape. rick santelli has that for us. >> construction spending for the month of october, always a month in arrears, of course. down 0.30. what's fascinating is this is the second negative number of the year the last negative number was in august when it was down 0.60 prior to that you have to go to february of '21 to find another negative number. it gives you a sense of how construction spending and housing in particular have really taken a hit ism manufacturing for the month of november expected to be 49.7. disappoints, like many pmis. 49.0 that is the first time the headline number has been below 50 going back to may of 2020 when it was 43.5 so this is, indeed, a biggy.

the rearview mirror was 50.20. let's look at employment, considering we have the big employment number tomorrow 48.4 48.4 that is the lowest level going back to august of 2020 if we look at new orders, new orders, 47.2, 47.2 was the weakest since september when it was 47.1 that was the weakest going all the way back to may of 2020. finally, prices paid the sort of inflation component to this pmi. it was expected to be 45.9 came in at 43. in that case, lower is better. 43.0 we haven't been at that level -- that's the lowest prices paid going back to 2020 if there is any in this series, that's the best news out of the four variables i depicted.

this is the only one that gives the markets a bit of a tailwind, especially after yesterday keep in mind, yesterday's low yield in tens was 0.59 3.59 we have already done some work below that that is significant. morgan, back to you. >> we'll take the silver lining. of course, it speaks to all the data that's been rolling over, this idea that manufacturing is now in contraction territory rick santelli, thank you. we're 30 minutes into the trading session. we'll get to salesforce in a moment but here are three other big movers we're keeping an eye on we'll start with snowflake off the lows after issuing results that beat the street it's up now. it's 4%. here's ceo frank sluteman with jim on "mad money" last night. >> the guidance is the guidance. you always have to wait and see how it plays out we think these numbers are

formidable in any reasonable context. obviously, you know, the sentiment in the market is a little stressed out. people react very strongly that's understood, but we live in the real world and we just go one day at a time, one quarter at a time. >> meantime, shares of pvh are surging following an upbeat forecast saying its pricing power has held steady in the face of an uncertain macro environment. we'll end with kroger beating on the top and bottom lines, raising forecast for the year shares are down 2.5% kroger chairman and ceo rodney mcmullen will join "closing bell" at 3:00 p.m. eastern time. another name i wanted to mention, morgan, because i was wondering why it was weak, after what seemed to be a positive sale after its b-read is blackstone down 8%. i think we figured out the reason why

i want to provide more background to the extent we can. the breit, incredibly successful product for the company that has raised tens of billions. in fact, raising as much as $3 billion a month. got to assets of $70 billion they're starting to have redemptions. those redemptions have exceeded what the company has said in the past since its formation almost six years ago was its repurchases. they allow up to 2% of every month and 5% of net asset value in a quarter we learned this morning that breit received repurchases equal to 2.7% in october, $1.8 billion, and received 100% to fill those purchase requests

that is triggered proration for nav allowed people could withdraw for the quarter why is that important? because this is has been an incredibly successful product for the company, creating a lot of fees. by the way, they have on an nav basis cited still up for the year again, this deal as well this morning involving mgm was out of breit and seen as a positive nonetheless, a lot of investors have been focused on this particular product and sort of when it would turn because obviously in an environment like this, especially where it was a yield play in a low yield environment, it's not nearly as alluring. >> for sure. i guess it's important to make the distinction. especially there's outflows. they are rationing the cash they're permitting people to take out of the fund and obviously have to generate liquidity within the fund to provide those redemptions.

but this is, assuming, not a situation where they have some kind of i wliquidity within the fund itself. >> i don't see that as the case. the market is reacting to what is stockholder notice, especially, put out this morning. and as you say, this was the standard practice that has been in writing for some time when they started the fund almost six years ago. nonetheless, i'm not sure if it's the first time, but certainly they are now implementing it. and it's essentially a repurchasing you say, okay, i want you to buy back my breit shares and they typically would do that if he they can up to a certain level they do say unfulfilled repurchase requests will not be carried over automatically investors have to resubmit

>> perhaps not totally surprising given what we're seeing in real estate. higher rates, et cetera, et cetera >> right some people, though, talking about the net asset value of the fund itself and looking at the peers, the publicly traded peers, which are down 30%, and wondering about the mismatch >> okay. well, we're going to shift gears. in his first public appearance since ftx's collapse, andrew ross sorkin joins us from highlights from the conversation what an incredible day, andrew congrats on everything and talk to us about this, what was a very highly anticipated, this discussion with bankman-fried last night. >> thank you, morgan it was something i think there's a big debate about it this morning about whether he was telling the truth or not and what the implications of it are. i did speak with ftx founder and former ceo sam bankman fried in an extensive interview first time he spoke live it went on for an hour

i asked him directly about compliance, about commingling of funds, funds that diz appeared and so much more. >> there was no person who was chiefly in charge of positional risk of customers on ftx and that feels pretty embarrassing in retrospect >> i also asked him whether his lawyers were telling him to do the interview or not >> they're very much not and i -- i mean, you know, the classic advice, don't say anything, you know, recede into a vole that's not who i am. that's not who i want to be. i think i have a duty to talk to people i have a duty to explain what happened and i think i have a duty to do everything i can to try and do what's right, if there is anything i can do to try to help customers out here and i don't see what good is accomplished by me just sitting

locked, you know, in a room pretending the outside world doesn't exist. >> you're in the bahamas right now. are you in the bahamas because you think you can't leave? >> no. i'm in the bahamas -- i have been in the bahamas for the last year i've been running ftx from the bahamas. i've been running ftx digital market, our primary office down here, with bahamian regulators and, you know, others in contact. and, you know, right now i'm -- you know, i'm looking to be helpful anywhere i can with any of the global entities that would want my help. >> do you think you could come to the united states or go elsewhere? >> to my knowledge, i could. >> have you thought about doing that >> i've thought about it and, you know, i mean, i've seen

a lot of the -- obviously, all of the hearings that have been happening. i would not be surprised if, you know, some time i am, you know, up there talking about what happened to our representatives or, you know, wherever else is most appropriate. >> whether he would be talking to the police at some point as well that is the question interestingly, guys, you know this already, his parents are law professors at stanford and big legal questions ahead for sam bankman-fried. interestingly, he did say, and we'll see whether it turns out to be true, that when you think about ftx.us, that's the division where a lot of u.s. consumers had their money, he believes, or at least said he believes that some of that is solvent and actually heard from the bankruptcy -- the ceo leading the new bankrupt company that there may be pieces of that that hopefully are so, we'll see what kind of -- what kind of money comes back to people or not.

>> it was a wide-ranging interview, andrew. there's so much we could talk about right here the political donations piece of the puzzle you guys got into, the drug use and rumors there piece of the puzzle. i'm actually most interested in the commingling of funds he said in that interview with you that he had a duty to explain what happened but i walked away feeling like i don't totally understand what happens there and it raises the questions, i know we've been debating about this for weeks, whether what he did or whether what his team actually did in terms of commingling funds is even technically illegal it's very illegal when we talk about commodities. i think about mf global and that implosion. we don't know if that's the case with cryptocurrencies. >> you're hitting the issue on the head and we repeatedly asked him about the commingling of funds maybe it's a distraction to him, i don't know i think that he thinks at least that on that exchange, there was

the opportunity for margin to be lent to others we can debate whether that is the case because the terms of service suggest that that is not the case, but may have been the case for certain people. i don't know and what i think he's saying is was then lending that money out. the question is whether that was the case and whether he was just taking depositors' money and then making big bets that then went wrong in which case, that won't be a loan that would be stealing >> right exactly. you know, he said numerous times he doesn't have access to the systems and also they were false and his understanding of what was happening at the time. other people to disentangle it andrew, appreciate it. >> thank you >> really great interview with him. markets still digesting yesterday's remarks by fed chair powell that small rate increases are likely ahead and could start

as early as this month but is he really all that dovish our steve liesman joins us now to answer that hey, steve. >> good morning. the question of the day, mike, i think is did fed chair jay powell intend to give a speech that would lead to a decline in stock prices his overall message remains hawkish. three things he said, there's a long way to go to restore price stability, rates will go higher than september, and the fed will stay the course until the job is done here's pretty much all the market heard >> monetary policy affects the economy and inflation with certain lags and the full effect of our rapid tightening so far are yet to be felt thus, it makes sense to moderate our approach the time for moderating the pace of rate increases may come as soon as the december meeting >> so, the reaction of the two-year yield has been

dramatic 20 basis points yesterday. powell's remarks remove the tailwind, and combined with cpi in november, another 40 basis points of tightening 4.90 was the top on that that's all easing. the peak rate and fed funds rate fall from 5.05 as the market started to price in the potential end of hikes early next year. pricing shows the market expects 50 in december, that's followed by even odds, a debate of 25 or a 50 in february, and the possibility is that mean they're done after that with one more 25-basis point hike. either 75 or 100 to go from here before a pause maybe that justifies the rally, maybe not. either way it's a fair bet rally easing is hard to justify. that was the intention. >> i want to go back to the point you made it's the same hawkish language, the same words on paper, but

what we've seen powell do for the better part of a year is job own and push markets lower with how aggressively he's delivered those words and the fact that he didn't do that, at least with his tone to the same extent yesterday, which you called ahead of his appearance yesterday. does it mark an actual shift here in terms -- >> i don't think so. >> okay. >> i think the market -- >> not at all? >> i think the market has decided what's going to happen, but i don't think powell intended to deliver a different message. you remember that fedex commercial, morgan, where the guy goes, he said the same thing but he went like this and the other guy went like that it was pretty much the same thing. with maybe this one idea that he's taken the tail risk off of higher rates than the higher rate they're already forecasting. in other words, the idea that it goes above 5, it sounded to some out there, and there's a

legitimate debate about that, that it doesn't go much above 5 if it goes above there. >> all right steve liesman, thank you. we're going to turn to the broader markets right now to start this new month of december it is -- the dow andthe s&p ar both lower right now and the dow is actually down 303 points the s&p is at 4063 right now joining us is cfra chief investment strategist sam stovall. good morning to you. sam, i'll start with you the conversation we're just having about powell yesterday. your thoughts on that, with equities trading where they are right now. >> sure. good morning, morgan well, certainly the market was anticipating him to be even more hawkish than he had been before. that's why the market had been lower heading into his commentary but i guess the thought is, you know, how could he get even more hawkish? so, as a result, he indicated what we had anticipated, which is a 50-basis point hike likely

to occur in december and as steve just mentioned, we're on the side of 50 basis points in february and then a final 25 in march. so, i think investors are looking across the valley and saying, okay, the pause will come by the end of the first quarter and then maybe even seeing lower rates start to occur by the end of 2023 >> okay. we're coming off two months of gains, samir, and certainly the dow at least, i realize we have further to go with the s&p and na nasdaq, but the dow at least is closing back in on potentially a new bull market. i wonder what you think of equities here and whether this is a time to buy or not. >> sure. so, what we've been saying all year is be dynamic and play volatility to both sides as recently as a couple months ago when we were around 3500, 3600, that would have been a great time to step in and provide liquidity to markets

here we are above our year-end target, which is 3800 to 4,000, and then our target for next year is 4300 to 4500 we do see some additional gains in probably the second half of next year. right now you pull forward so much of that positive news that at least in the near term, we think there will be some disappointment there is positive seasonality at year-end so it could be the first part of next year where that sinks in, but we'd probably be fading this rally >> samir, i mean, it certainly seems as if that's what the market has been doing in recent months at the low end of the range it's saying stagflation recession is in place, at the higher end you have a higher probability of a soft landing is there a lane into next year in which we say, look, we did the big valuation and rate reset in 2022. nominal growth is still pretty healthy. look at the consumer personal income and spending numbers from today.

shows you a healthy level of overall activity happening and somehow that could buffer earnings from a big decline in 2023 >> you know, mike, it's possible i think the tricky part is history tells you when the yield curve is inverted the way it is and you get some pmis and ism numbers you got this morning, especially around new orders and employment, all of those would suggest we are probably headed for a recession. our base case is you probably do end up with a moderate recession next year and earnings probably come in closer to 205 than the 220, 230 the street is expecting. it's possible. clearly that's what the market is betting right now with the big rally yesterday. but it's really hard for us to see that goldilocks narrative playing out. >> sam, it's still, even with the kind of shuttling back and forth in this range, a lot of the familiar rhythms of what happened seasonally have shown up you had a low in october you're up some 15% from that

level. what can we expect from here based on a lot of those cadences >> well, i think that we're still likely to see a positive december december since world war ii has been the best month of the year. not only in terms of average price change but vatting average, frequency of advance. even if you overlay midterm election year, a good december, and heading into december being among the ten worst year-to-date returns since world war ii, you still end up with a 60% frequency of advance i would tend to say investors would want to continue to look for a seasonal rally to occur this month >> all right sam and samir, thanks for joining us >> my pleasure as we head to a break, here is our road map for the rest of the hour salesforce shakeup the shares are moving lower.

this is co-ceo brent taylor announces he will be stepping down plus, russian oil sanctions are about to kick in continental resources chairman harold hamm weighs in on his outlook for the sector. mark zuckerberg says apple's app store policies are not sustainable or a good place to be much more ahead on "squawk on the street." don't go anywhere.

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you know, running the company, and i've been doing this now for 25 years, you look for the best people in the world to bring them in, and the hardest part is when they tell you that they want to leave, and that's where we are with brett. brett will be leaving at the end of the year. >> that was salesforce chairman and ceo marc beniof on the leaving of his co-ceo bret taylor the company did report earnings that beat what the street was looking for. jon fortt is with us to break it all down jon, it's incredible salesforce is by far the worst performer in the dow, not just today but on the year, down 44%, and yet it seemed like it was a pretty solid quarter is this just all today on this leadership change? >> i don't think it is bret is great. i have an extensive conversation

with him about a year ago on what led him to salesforce and the values-driven approach and how he vibed with marc benioff i think it's the revenue deceleration, billings deceleration and overall wariness about this period that enterprise software is moving into if you look across the analyst notes, there's still a lot of confidence in salesforce's overall position and its overall str strategy just recalibration with what's happening with some deal cycles being elongated. that's the new catch-phrase, talking about what's happening with sales in enterprise even though the margins are holding up well, there's a question about how the next few quarters will go you put on top of that, yes, bret taylor was the latest heir-apparent. he lasted in that role for a year not only a rough year, not only help dealing with running salesforce, absorbing the

acquisition, dealing with all this acquisition but also chairman at twitter, dealing with elon musk he did pretty well at that one could understand he might be reconsidering his life choices after the 2022 he's had. >> oh, yeah, jon certainly plenty of reasons to step back for a little while, i'm sure, on his part. i did want to drill in a little bit to what you alluded to with all the software companies coming out and citing somewhat slower deal closing times and lead -- i mean, what is it a euphemism for? less demand, the power is more with the customer than with the vendor, it would seem and maybe there's some negotiation going on on price because it's not just that people decided to slow down the clock budgets are under some pressure, presumably >> yeah, budgets are under pressure and i think it's even more granular than negotiation on price. customers are trying to break down these offerings into smallest digestible pieces and saying, okay, can i take this piece of the software package and phase it in over time and pay over time?

there's a shift toward consumption-based software models we're sort of used to thinking about that in the use of hardware resources you know, how many servers do you want to use, how many cpu cycles in the cloud? a consumption based model in software, a little different to talk about, you know, c3ai moved to that, snowflake more on that mode when you're more consumption-based, there's less guaranteed revenue and you really have to expect revenue based on the value you're delivering to the customer right now. that's a little bit of an iffier place to be than enterprise software contracts are used to being. so, even across cyber security and areas like that, we'll see how that ripples through and changes the results for some of these companies. >> all right jon, thank you for joining us. jon fortt. i know you'll have so much more on all of this, salesforce and everything else we just touched on coming up on "techcheck" at 11:00 a.m. eastern time.

it's the first day of december and trading in that month. you want to sector the watch how about communication services is the spdr ticker xlc is outpacing the sector for the month. the top is netflix because that stock has come to life recently. today is adding to that. yesterday ceo reed hastings admitting that the streaming giant was slow to introduce advertising because he was focused on digital competition from meta and alphabet take a listen. >> i didn't believe in the ad-supported tactic for us i was wrong about that hulu really proved you could do that at scale and offer consumers lower prices and that was a better model we did switch on that. credit to hulu and jason for figuring that out. i wish we had flipped a few years earlier on it, but we'll catch up

>> that's a significant offering for netflix now as it isfor disney and so many others. the ad-supported tier. you can't fast forward through the ads. >> no. >> i realized. >> my daughter, who has never had to deal with advertising before, who is 6 years old, said, what is going on >> it is a more effective -- from the advertiser's viewpoint, because ido have paramount wit the ads and i've been watching a great show there, but also you can't go to another channel either you really are a prisoner of having to watch those ads. >> it is also fascinating what hastings said about, look, tv, the eyeball hours aren't there anymore. therefore, advertisers have this massive appetite to address people where they are. netflix is becoming the core of whatever the heck tv is becoming it's sort of the default basis and then you add around the edges to it to some degree on streaming. >> he also seemed to come back at john malone's comments during

our interview a couple of weeks ago that somehow content spending will come down in any real measurable way saying, huh-uh. >> he deflected the opportunity to say these big deals are a thing of the past. >> and a price-conscious consumer, which is why we saw netflix earlier in the year take a tumble, in part, because you started to see some pushback how much consumers are willing to pay. sit through ads or pay for ads in a high inflation environment. >> those ads are horrible. >> well, it is time now for a news update. let's go to contessa brewer with that hi. >> hi, mike. president biden is hosting french president emmanuel macron at the white house this morning. it's the first state visit by a foreign leader since president biden took office. they are grappling with some big issues here. the ukraine war, china relations and u.s. clean air subsidies that could affect european businesses. the united nations is now

asking member countries for a record $51.5 billion to fund aid efforts next year. it's 25% more than the request a year ago and the u.n. says it has to support 65 million additional people around the world. for instance, they're looking at the crisis in ukraine, droughts in africa and floods in pakistan and the prince and princess of wales arrived in boston yesterday for a three-day trip that really focuses on charitable causes. they took a breather, sat courtside at the celtics/heat game and accompanied by celtics executive. of all the video, this is it boston mayor michelle wu, governor-elect healy the royals' first u.s. trip in eight years. where else to go but boston, massachusetts. morgan >> contessa brewer, thank you. when we return, continental resources founder harold hamm,

his energy outlook as russian oil sanctions are about to kick in. we're an hour into the trading session. take a look at where things stand after the data we got at the top of the hour. we saw markets move lower. we're trading near session lows. the s&p still well above that 4,000 level. stay with us this thing, it's making me get an ice bath again. what do you mean? these straps are mind-blowing! they collect hundreds of data points like hrv and rem sleep, so you know all you need for recovery. and you are? i'm an investor...in invesco qqq, a fund that gives me access to... nasdaq 100 innovations like... wearable training optimization tech. uh, how long are you... i'm done. i'm okay.

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oil is edging a bit higher you see it this morning up 3% on wti, after reports that the eu is moving closer to that price cap of 60 bucks a barrel on russian crude. it's also coupled with murky china and opec outlook of course, the chinese economy outlook and opec production outlook. and comes on the heels of what has been a tough month overall for energy let's discuss it all with harold

hamm, continental resources founder and executive chairman in fact, just took the company private last week. harold, good to have you first time in your now private continental in quite some time i think in a press release at the time, or at least you said operating as a private company enhances our ability to do what we do best and unlocks endless po possibilities. give me a little more as to what that means, what are the endless possibilities and what do you do best you couldn't do as a public company? >> thank you good to be back with you you know, we had to stand by the sideline for a good many months there, you know, went through this process and we had to respect the process, which we did and it's been long and arduous, but we're at the other side. we are private now and, you know, just like we did when we went public, we embraced

that market. the market embarrraced us it paid us for growth and all the things we do well as an exploration company. we're proud of what we did as a public company about 1,000% gain to $17.25 with a split in the middle. so, you know, we did very well and -- but today it's a different situation. you know, basically we've got people telling us where to go, what to do, what you can produce, what you can't and, you know, market directs what you do and so, anyway, we didn't want to be part of that herd any longer so we departed from that herd we were a very unique company in the fact of our ownership that we could do what we did. our peers would like to do the

same, the very same thing. >> going to be harder to take chevron or exxon private when you say departing from the herd, harl harold, what are we going to see i'm curious as to what that means in terms of your approach that you, perhaps, were not undertaking, even though you were still in control of the company as a public company. >> well, what it means is the same thing we've always done that's applying the market with american crude and clean burn natural gas. so, supplying that market, not oversupplying it, but giving it what it needs and keeping an ear to the ground on that. and not to a bunch of wall street analysts and they do their job. but we have to do ours so, we're fearfully independent. you know, that's what we do. we're an expiration company and we've done great things with horizontal drilling and energy renaissance in america, bringing

energy independence. so, it's been a great run. so, we're going to continue doing what we've done best, you know, for 55 years and so going back to the private side to do that, we know what that looks like. we was private 40 years. we're very excited about the future of american energy and what we can do as being a big part of that >> harold, just to dig into that a little more. we have seen a shift in the last year plus from the investor community towards free cash flow, towards profitability, towards not expanding output every time the price of oil goes up in an aggressive way. are you saying that by being private you don't have to worry so much about those metrics and you can focus more on expansion, on output, maybe not flooding the market, as you just said, but focus on those at a time where american energy independence is probably back in

focus especially as we come into opec meeting this weekend? >> well, american energy independence is back in focus. that's for sure. and what you've seen with the public market, you know, basically they want everything paid back to the shareholders, everything that's produce and eventually your company shrinks and goes away and that wasn't what we wanted to do. we want to be here for a long time still thinking about it quarter to quarter, we want to think about it in quarters being the next 25 years. and what america needs and what what this industry also needs, so it's a longer-term view it's a view that we've had as a company and will have in the future so there's a lot to do the world needs energy we're seeing some real

desperation out there in the oil supply side. we're seeing it with this deal on venezuela you'll see some oil come back into america because it's been sold in the black market to china and india. as far as bringing that oil on quickly, it's going to take a very long time that stuff has to be refined down there and, you know, it's tar. so it's not going to come on quickly as you might have heard. >> harold, what do you think about this proposed plan by the u.s. government to be buyers of crude oil if it stays around $70 a barrel for a while it's been promoted as an idea of giving some certainty to the industry in terms of longer term forward demand is that going to turn out to be a decent follow-up to what they did in terms of selling? >> well, david, for sure, you

know, that would be great if they put a floor under u.s. crude oil market, but i don't believe that's going to be the case maybe i'm naive, but i just don't see that happening first of all, you know, it should have been emptied, here again, for political purposes they emptied it. and now will they refill it? well, we'll push that off to the next administration. so, it's -- it was there for war-like purposes and emergency situation. now it's dang near half empty. so, will they refill it? it needs to be refilled. but will they do it? i don't think so >> you don't think so. how about the $60 cap that the eu is trying to pull off here on russian oil, do you think they can do that? >> you know, it's -- i think it's doubtful. you know, if i was one of those countries and had russia telling me that if you do that, i'll

never sell you another drop of oil, i don't know that i would enter into that. you know, i think most of those countries are not that bold, so we'll have to see if that happens or not you know, over there but i would doubt that that occurs >> harold, thanks for your time. >> good to be with you, david. thank you. >> you're welcome. when we return, mark zuckerberg defending his big bet on the metaverse we'll break down what he had to say and what it means for the stock, now down over 64% for the year up just 1%od tay

welcome back mark zuckerberg defending his focus on the metaverse, saying meta is optimistic for the

long-term investment, he's still focused on the family of social media apps joining us with a price target of $140 a share, kp partners rohit. great to have you back on. i want to get your thoughts on some of these comments that we did get from zuckerberg this week especially given the fact that he has been starting to rein in some costs, albeit, perhaps still modestly >> thanks for having me. again, i think costs is of paramount importance right now again, there is no line of sight of when we get those on $15 billion they're spending on metaverse. if that's the case, this does need some return on those. and reining those costs in, probably more from what they're doing right now, would drive the stock higher from these levels

>> so, why do you think, in general, why do you think meta is a buy it had such a rotten year. wall street in general has continued to be pretty steadfast in its bullishness on the name what propels it now, finally >> there's a bunch of factors that are still going up against. they're slowly ebbing, in my opinion. you have the apple effect, you have the tiktok market share effect, and then you also have effect of things such as what they're doing with some of the reels monetization so, i think some of the factors are turning from headwinds into neutrals and some of the new revenue generation things they're doing will start becoming more and more material, in my opinion. so, i feel at the current levels the expectations are a wash. so, investors do not expect big things from here on out for the stock to work.

a little cost savings and a little revenue stabilization should help the stock grind higher as the year progresses. that's where -- low expectations, low investor sentiment, a lot of kind of fear as well as hatred in the stock so, we like it here simply because it can't get any more worse from here. >> can we quantify at all the seeming market share improvement for reels relative to tiktok from an advertiser perspective at this point? it seems at this point there's been a little more uptick on users. >> i think users -- establishing users and improvement in engagement, which we see is happening with reels will drive monetization i think they're just still very, very early when they talk about less than $10 billion, reels is probably more in social engagement but probably less than 3% to 4%

revenue. that's a very big gap. we don't see that gap narrow in the foreseeable future probably takes 12 to 24 months but the gap starts to narrow over the next three, six, nine, 12 months as the company starts to crank up the monetization engine we have confidence in them doing that on the other hand, the other hae apple factor which is even a bigger factor in my opinion will start to fear that, a, we have the lagging effect from what happened into '21 into '22 and '23, and b, all investments in targeting start to have a little bit of, so we don't want a lot of heroic things, as i said, just a little incremental improvement, and yes, more cost cutting in metaverse will drive the stock, in my opinion >> okay. rohit, thank you for joining us. >> thank you >> when we return, why young investors are turning away from

art and honing in on birkins we're going to get a check on where the market stands at this hour as well just absolutely nothing to do with those berken bags i know some people really enjoy looking at them. we'll be right back. stay with us

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the street." it's birk birkins over basquiats. our robert frank joins us with that story >> it is luxury week in new york city auction houses selling millions of dollars worth of jewelry, watches, sneakers, and handbags. in fact, handbags have outperformed the market, the art market, up 16% handbags up 92% over the past decade a report from credit suisse projects handbags will be the best collectible investment over

the next 12 months they also have rather unique properties as investments. they're among the least volatile of any asset class they only move about 2% to 5% in terms of price fluctuation they're les volatile than commodities or bonds and it's a good risk/reward and over the years they have among the lowest correlations to stocks, so you get really good diversification against your equity portfolio. they have also proven to be good hedges against inflation we'll see in the next couple years. not all handbags are collectibles it's dominated by hermes, kelly, as well as chanel. they have to be rare, in mint condition, usually with specific colors or hardware and some of the best sellers include a birkin at sotheby's estimated at $200,000, and for all you sneaker heads out there, there's a pair of michael jordan's 1985

game worn air jordans estimated at $200,000 to $300,000. guys >> wow i'm impressed. i wil say, i like a handbag that i can wear out in public i think i would have to squirrel this away in a safe if it were me it's pretty incredible, the stats you just said. thank you. speaking of alternative investments, join us next week for the fa summit where we're speak with financial heavyweights as they address client needs and find new investment opportunities go to cnbcevents.com/fa to register now i'll be there. >> all right we'll look for you a quick programming note as we head to a break, today, on cnbc pro week, a new way to trade with the pros. it's real trades, real access, and real money on the line join us at 3:00 p.m. for a new cnbc experience called the tick. cnbc.com/protalks live, 3:00

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california for the annual reagan national defense forum we're speaking with industry ceos, senior government officials. there will many big interviews over the coming days including northroom grumman ceo, kathy warden the b-21 bomber. that's going to happen during this hour tomorrow, and we're going to check in with palmer luckyey, and many others that's it. >> looking forward to that that's going to do it for us on "squawk on the street. time to check in with "tech check. >> good thursday morning welcome to "tech check." i'm deirdre bosa in san francisco with jon fortt in new york today, a ton of earnings movers to get to. marc benioff is alone at the helm of salesforce investors warming up to snowflake, and okta gets a boost, and sam bankman-fried and mark zuckerberg talking at the book deal