competitor is going to eat tesla's lunch? >> reporter: well, he says that they have been for years in china. and, look, we don't follow byd a lot here because they're not sold in the u.s., you go to china, you see a lot all over the place. they're doing quite well there >> thank you very much for watching "power lunch. "closing bell" starts right now. the hawkish fed speak sending the markets tumbling here in early trading. we've come well off the lows throughout the session we're at the highs of the day. this is the make-or-break hour for your money welcome, everyone, to "closing bell." i'm sara eisen the dow down as low as 410 the s&p 500 down 0.4%. every sector lower now utilities at the bottom of the pack the nasdaq down half a percent,

again, looking a lot better than how we were looking this morning after the wholesale inflation number another hot read on inflation. ten-year treasury note yield higher 3.8. the muddled economic picture what it means for the fed's path joined by the former treasury secretary jack lew and later an exclusive interview with snap ceo evan spiegel. we'll get his jowl look for user growth, his read and much more senior markets commentator mike santoli here to break down all the action at the "market dashboard. speaking about the resilience, really, of this market sold off a lot harder given how we've come into it and some of the data another morning dip. it does get bought again, sara every day for the last two weeks the low for the day on the s&p 500 has been within 1% of the 4,100 mark each time it kind of gained some traction there we're up 1% for the week

so still managing to stay in the upper end of this range for now. you see it's been this kind of indecisive pattern since the end of january, but certainly holding most of what we got from the october rally after lows of 17%, 18% on a closing basis is where we are it could be because yields are tame considering what could have happened with some of the fed speak. did not really make new highs with the two-year note yield take a look at the higher beta, more aggressive, more volatile parts of the market compared to lower volatility stocks. the high beta versus low etfs. we knew we had a fast start, people grabbing for risk, trying to play a snapback that's what we've seen here. the remarkable thing, though, over a two-year basis, you are now in the lead with the riskier stocks by 3 or 4 percentage points close to the all-time high of the overall market, high beta is

still ahead. the market is running hot, maybe it's getting overexcited in the near term and a little bit more disregard for safety and stability and fundamentals for now that's also the mark of a risk-seeking market that tends to have those bought, sara >> what does it depend on, the ten-year standalone below 10%? >> whether yields stand below the recent highs even though they've been going up, we're well below the highs we saw in the fall, and then really i think we're okay with incrementally adding potential fed rate hikes every six or seven weeks as the fed meeting comes. if it really seems like they have to rush again and go back to 50 basis point hikes, things like that, probably can't handle it the economy has been holding well outside of manufacturing. that can't change either >> there was a little talk about 50 basis points from the cleveland fed. the new economic data is painting a confusing picture

trying to gauge the economy. look at today, producer prices, supplier prices really, which rose 0.7% in january, higher than expected. 6% higher than last year this follows the hotter than expected cpi print, consumer price print on tuesday, but even with persistent inflation, consumers are still spending retail sales jumping 3% in january, well above expectations but debt is racking up according to the new york fed, household debt increased by $394 billion in q4, the largest jump in 20 years and then the housing data all over the map, too. housing starts fell seasonally adjusted 4.5% in january to the lowest rate -- that was the lowest rate since june of 2020 sentiment improved by the biggest amount in a decade joining us now to make sense of all it have is the former u.s. treasury secretary jack lew. welcome back good to see you. how do you read all this data? some of the really important ones like inflation and retail sales and jobless claims today

all coming in better >> look, at the core of it, the economy is doing pretty well and i know for markets sometimes good news is bad news, but with a strong jobs market, a strong consumer, it's not a big surprise that it's going to take a little longer for inflation to come down to where the fed wants it to be i actually think that the market got ahead of the fed i never thought we were headed for kind of leveling off and coming back down if you're sitting at the fed, if you're sitting making macro policy, you don't want to have to do this again you want to get it right -- >> powell said >> if you listen to what he's been saying consistent lip the last six months, it's no surprise that they still have a little ways to go, and when they get to the destination, they'll stay there for a while i don't know if they're going to move 25 or 50 once or twice or three times more, but for all of the news of the week, the question is whether the destination rate is just under

or just over 5 >> and where are you >> look, i think these numbers are stronger than had been expecting. there are lagging indicators housing tends to lag in terms of when it comes through, all the measurements so they're going to have to wait and see. i think, in fact, they've given themselves room to kind of go 25 or 50 and still show determination that if they need to, they'll do it again. if it were me, i would keep my optionality open for a few more meetings >> it kind of pushes back the whole pivot or pause excitement that the markets have. >> i never thought that was credible i've said publicly the market is ahead of itself. there's no good policy basis for turning around quickly it's going to take a while monetary policy moves through the economy slowly the fed is going to see the impact of everything it's done

is and they won't see that the moment they hit what feels like an estimation. >> that's why it's so surprising to see all of the strong data especially in retail sales and jobs because the fed has done a lot of tightening, and all we keep hearing about are policy lags when do the lags actually hit? >> the consumer is still in pretty decent shape. still the measurements i've seen range from 1.5 to a little more than that trillion dollars of excess savings, savings built up during the pandemic. it means there's a little bit of room for the consumer to kind of keep spending before they pull back until people start worrying that they're going to lose their job, it's not the moment when you're going to see the consumer pull back quickly i think we will start at some point to see a slower economy and we'll start at some point to see unemployment growing with a little bit of luck, it could avoid a recession. and more likely it's going to be

bumpy. with unemployment below 3.5%, there's some room for some bumps to still have what will look in retrospect as a good landing >> the financial conditions have improved so much, that's why sentiment in housing is up, right, mortgage rates have come down mike showed us the momentum stocks, which are gaining. bitcoin is up. does that sort of stuff tell you the fed has more work to do? >> look, i'm not sure that the markets tell us what the fed has to do. i think the markets have been a little off in terms of what the fed had to do. just thinking they were done well before they were done, thinking they would turn around before they're going to turn around i think inflation is slower than it was, the economy is remaining stronger than everyone expected. it will slow down some do they have to go up a little more are they going to have to stay there a little while yes. i don't think it's a radical change it's on the margin >> i wanted to ask you about

president biden's recent, i would say, ramp-up of populous red meat when it comes to the new billionaires' tax. we talked about it with sam zell listen to what he says about this >> the idea of taxing unrealized gains is crazy i think that putting people who are successful at risk of liability and low cash makes no sense what sofer, and i think it would have a significant impact in how you think about investing. >> do you agree with this new plan >> we have a fundamental problem that great wealth and asset accumulation goes untaxed in this country because it's very easy to do estate planning to make it so you don't pay taxes on capital gains and the

accumulation of intergenerational wealth it is challenging to have taxes that hit wealth before there's a liquidity event. >> right you can't tax unrealized income. >> we do in your home. we have figured out how to do it on the assets that everybody has. i think it's a bit extreme to say there's no way to do it. i think it's challenging i believe that stepped-up basis, for example, in taxing the appreciation of assets is a critical thing in terms of raising our tax base and reducing inequality. whether you do that at death or on a regular basis is a technical question i don't disagree it's challenging, but it's not impossible and it's not crazy. >> now brainerd will get to join president biden's fight against republicans on the debt ceiling. the white house says it doesn't want to negotiate. republicans want to cut spending how do you see this playing out?

>> first of all, there ought to be an agreement that we won't default. there should be no threatening that if i don't get my way in a fiscal negotiation we're going to put the u.s. economy into chaos. i think we learned in 2011 that you get to the edge of the cliff, you don't know if you're going to fall off it or not. so there's been way too much comfort this is all going to work out because it's always worked out in 2011 we got closer to a default than ever before, and we didn't know if we had a way out until the very last minute you don't know when the very last minute is so they should do this, do it soon, they shouldn't wait until they're a week away. should there be a discussion about fiscal policy? of course there has to be a conversation about fiscal policy both in the short term, in terms of what appropriations are for this year and in the longer term in terms of dealing with the accumulation of deficits and debt it shouldn't be in the context of threatening default

they need to be separated. >> i think everyone will agree with the conversation about the fiscal conversation. thank you for the time and your perspective. former treasury secretary of the united states. shares of snap having a strong start to the year up near 20%. the stock is still down more than 80% from its 2021 peak. coming up, ceo evan spiegel joins us fresh off the company's investor day where snap unveiled its road map for user growth dow down 202 you're watching "closing bell" on cnbc.

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look at shares of manchester united moving sharply higher in the last few minutes as qatari investors prepare $6 billion opening bid for the soccer club according to bloomberg it's expected to be the start of a bidding war with saudi arabia's investment fund would also bid the stock has run up big since word that it would be for sale shares of labcorp beat earnings estimates but missed on revenue. it saw a 9% decrease from last year thanks to foreign currency and decrease in covid pcr testing. adam, it's good to have you back >> it's a pleasure to see you. thanks for having me today >> are people still testing for covid? how much have the numbers declined >> so the good news is we've had a significant decline in the amount of covid-related work we

do with regard to vaccines and antivirals the reason i say that's good news, that means the country and the world is getting past the covid pandemic at the same time we're seeing our base business increase and show real good signs of growth >> so back to 2019 levels, pre-covid for the regular testing that we get done >> so if you look at regular testing, we're seeing increased levels from 2019 if you look at what we reported today with our earnings, w bases if you put aside covid testing if you look at what we provided guidance for we see 10.5% to 12% growth and 5% to 7% growth for drug development business. i would say we're really back on track showing strong growth in our base business for both segments >> where are the new innovations coming from, adam? what has you most excited when it comes for testing new

diseases and illnesses >> there are so many exciting scientific and technical advances that we're working on whether it be liquid byiopsy, alzheimer's disease, rheumatoid arthritis. our business is based upon science innovation technology. i believe we have some of the best in the world working on these disease areas. >> i was going to ask you about the liquid biopsy, trying to get it more into the mainstream. there will be competition coming are you partnering with some of these companies? how do you do that and when does this become a standard of care where we go get a blood test to see if we have cancer? >> so it's going to take some time to validate the blood tests to make sure you get the most accurate results i believe over time we'll be able to get there. we have our own internal

development for the liquid biopsy test. a company we acquired last year called pgdx. but at the same time we are looking to partner with other companies. we want to bring the broadest set of offerings to the patients and the physicians in oncology with our testing and the partnerships we're putting in place with others, we'll be able to offer the broadest range the world can offer. >> keep us posted. adam scheckter, thank you for the update appreciate it. >> nice to see you thank you. >> you, too. we have some breaking news comments now from st. louis federal reserve president james bullard. steve liesman has the details. steve? >> reporter: thanks very much, sara st. louis fed president jim bullard saying he can't rule out a 50 basis point rate hike at the upcoming march meeting, and he said he advocated for one at the last meeting as well i'll read you other comments on

the wire here from reuters he sees a policy rate in the range of 5.25 to 5.5% as appropriate. he has been at that level, a quarter point above the average. he does see the drop in long-term yields as confidence that the fed will fall -- the inflation will fall and less need for inflation -- sorry, inflation premium inside a fed rate hike. he's the second person, sara, to kind of advocate for this and to acknowledge he advocated at the last meeting saying the federal reserve can accelerate rate hikes if necessary. not much impact in the bond market which, as we've been reporting, has already started to think about the idea of an extra quarter point going into june or down to 25 the stock market did fall off on this news the last i looked,

sara, 20 points to the down side for the s&p 500. >> is he a voter this year i knknow mester is not >> reporter: jim was a voter last year, sara, if i'm not mistaken i did not update my notes. i don't think he's a voter this year that may not matter that the objective is for the board to come to consensus and people who are dissenting, it's rare on the board. there is a wing that wants to do more now the he believes front loading has been helpful, front loading rates has helped the fed get further in front of the inflation problem.

>> it would be interesting if we seahe hawkish dissents >> reporter: just very quickly, there hasn't been much change in the probabilities we're looking at here, still 87% chance of a hike the fed funds market is not embracing this 50 at this moment >> we're seeing a little lower, down 300 now on the dow. steve, thanks. >> reporter: in stocks, yeah >> steve liesman let's check in on the markets as we said, just a tad bit lower than we were ten minutes or so. the s&p down a percent it's been a down day all day, every sector lower, ever since we got that hot ppi report whole sale inflation numbers came in better than expected which is worse for the markets to see that higher than expected inflation. just looking at where the pain is felt now. consumer discretionary, communication services have been the best performing sectors for the week and really for the year under the most pressure right

now. consumer staples and health care hold up the best snap's investor day just wrapped where the company announced 750 million monthly active users we'll talk exclusively with the ceo evan spiegel about his message to shareholders. go optimizing data. go efficiency. go results. emerson's plantweb digital ecosystem is the brain for smarter, safer and more sustainable performance. go plant go. go boldly. emerson.

snapchat parent snap just wrapping up its investor day at its headquarters in santa monica where the company announced it now has 750 million monthly active users they're expect to go reach more than a billion users in the next two to three years joining us now is snap ceo evan spiegel along with our very own julia boorstin who covers the company. julia, over to you >> reporter: sara, thanks so much evan, thanks so much for joining us here today at your headquarters on the heels of this investor day. we appreciate it >> thank you for having me it's great to be here. >> reporter: i want to talk about these user targets, 750

million now, a billion in the next two to three years, there's so much competition for consumers' time right now. tiktok, first and foremost among your rivals. what makes you confident you'll hit that 1 billion number? >> you think about the core of our service it's about visual communication between friends and family and that's what has continued to drive or growth over time. snapchat opens up into the camera where people can choose from all sorts of augmented reality lenses and share those with friends and family and ultimately what we've seen the last 11 years or so building our business communication with friends and family is something that brings a lot of joy into people's lives and they really like to do frequently. we shared today that in the united states, for example, people open snapchat approximately 40 times a day on average. and that's really because they like to talk with their friends and family i think that communication, especially visual communication with friends and family, will be a big driver of our growth. >> there are two pieces you're focused on one is engagement and the other

monetization you talk about this idea of shifting focus to direct response ads where are you in this journey of better monetization of your relationship with your users >> direct response has always been a core focus of our business it makes up about two-thirds of our revenue today but it has been beset by some of the platform policy changes that disrupted the way people measure and buy direct response advertising. so we've beenworking really hard over the past year or two to help people measure their advertising in new ways using things like our conversion api, for example. we've been making improvements inside the application itself so the way people engage with advertising, improving the performance of web view to increase on platform conversions or changing the way ads appear in our service and then very hard to recalibrate machine learning models against those types and to focus more on last click which are increasingly important to advertisers in this environment where observability has been impacted.

>> i want to return to this machine learning conversation in a bit, but you mentioned today that you have a new team you had the loss of two of your big executives who went over to netflix. it comes at a time when there's a lot of competition for ad dollars in this video ad space where snap is. there's communication but you have a lot of premium doneconte with ads what are you going for in terms of growing ad market share >> when we thought about the evolution of our team, what was important was to combine engineering, sales and revenue product into one organization so that we could much more effectively go to market with a highly complex and technical sales. selling direct response and advertising today as a very sophisticate process it requires custom integrainteg. our new chief operating officer has helped us combine to better and more effectively serve our

partners as part of that, we've regionalized our leadership so we have three regional president roles, ronan harris, mohan, an we have the americas role open where we're looking for our americas president and this regionalized go to market is helping us better serve our customers all over the world and increase our average revenue per user in apac regions because we had more of a u.s.-centric focus that has driven our growth over time. i'm excited how this new structure is informing our growth and what that reflects is a very different sales process than streaming video direct response advertising on mobile with full-screen vertical video, conversion on platform inside the application is critically important to helping people grow their businesses it is differentiated when it comes to streaming which is not necessarily bought in the same

way or experienced the same way by customers >> evan, it's sara eisen in new york thanks for joining us. big picture question from me on growth in 2022 you grew 12% and this year analysts expected growth to be flat. is that the macro environment? what else are you facing here? >> growth has certainly decelerated rapidly from the beginning of last year we were, prior to the invasion of ukraine, growing around mid-40s, in the mid-40s percent year over year and that following the invasion, of course, the uptick in inflation and higher interest rates has decelerated dramatically we certainly are feeling the pressures of the macro in addition to things like increased competition and some of the platform policy changes we've been working through a

number of really challenging circumstances for the business as you pointed out, the growth we've seen in terms of our community gives us a lot of optimism and excitement that as we work through the changes and we're better able to generate revenue with our community of over 750 million people around the world that will contribute to the long-term growth of our business >> you just mentioned competition as one of the head winds and i'm curious if you could dig into that more is it still tiktok and reels and is that getting more fierce or better in some way >> we certainly have a number of enormous competitors, youtube or meta, tiktok as you mentioned. the competition for mobile video is going to continue to remain fierce and so that's why we're so focused on adding value in ways differentiated for our communities, starting with communication for close friends and family, augmented reality in our camera and inspiring people to create and add to their story

to share with friends and family or, of course, submit to spotlight which is our destination for more entertaining video that's grown 100% year over year in terms of time spent last quarter. that's something we're really excited about. kind of taking a step back if you think about the overall depressed rates of growth for advertising as a whole, that means as that pie is smaller, competition is fierce. and so we're really focused on taking share through direct response advertising which through had period of time continues to grow for us in the last quarter and that's because it drives immeasurable return on spend for advertisers. >> one thing you've been very good about is giving very detailed updates about where you see the advertising market in the moment and you gave an update for the first quarter based on the first couple weeks of the first quarter, a pretty wide range between negative 2 and negative 10%. where are you seeing things now, and what's your overall outlook for what the ad market will look

like this year do you have any sense whether it will rebound in the second half? >> i think broadly speaking we don't have any specific updates to share about this quarter, but broadly speaking as you look through the year, the comps get easier on the back half. when you're talking to leaders about how they're seeing growth in the back half of the year, i think folks are hopeful that the economic environment will stabilize a bi-. maybe rate increases will pause. some think rates could be lowered. i'm not sure if that's in the cards this year. i do think based on the much lower comps for digital advertising businesses in the back half that makes folks more optimistic about what growth prospects could look like in the back half of the year. >> certainly will be an interesting one to watch i have so many more questions for you but i am sorry we are out of time. thanks so much for talking to us here at your headquarters on the heels of your investor day presentation sara, back over to you >> thank you, julia, for bringing that's interview from santa monica

it was once a cnbc 50 disruptor. if you are a private venture-backed company scan the qr code on the screen or go to cnbc.com/disruptors to learn more still ahead on the show, shares of tesla taking a midday dive after the company recalls more than 350,000 vehicles over concerns about its self-driving software we'll talk to an analyst about the potential cost for investors when "closing bell" comes right back we continue to go lower, down 350 on the dow

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the stocks in the last ten minutes or so, we've taken a leg lower, heading south down on the dow now 343 points the low down more than 400 early in the session that was after the hot inflation numbers on wholesale inflation the s&p down 1.1%. mike santoli joins me. i'm sure the hawkish bullard comments did not help. >> i think that was the push we got coming after loretta mester from cleveland saying they would have voted for half a percent increase at the last meeting, the fed will have to get rates up to the 5.5 area

this is not out of the range of what folks were saying in december we did have members then saying that i think we had a market that the low for the day has been 4,100 on the s&p, plus or minus 1% here we are back right around that level, just testing it. you can look at this and say, well, the market has been essentially using up a lot of energy just to stay still over the last couple of weeks or say this is traction it shows people are underinvested, buying gifts because they believe the economy is in firmer shape we are going to continue, i think, to face those tests for what's the yield level that is relevant in the here and now to stocks after this run that we've had. >> we're not even making new interday highs on the two-year yield. >> we're not. >> we saw that this morning. the probabilities aren't changing we're still at a high likelihood of 25-point basis hike in are ma

does the conversation inside the committee and in the market change -- >> exactly and it is all filtered through where the market has been and where there has been this real reach for risky stuff. i mentioned the high beta stocks get overexcited so you see the nasdaq is giving back the outperformance -- >> they thought the market was too excited about cuts, about pauses from the beginning. >> if the market rally is premised on the fed is going to get dovish and we'll have rate hikes back of the year, i don't think it's justified i really don't think, though, we know for sure it's mostly about that i think it's about the fed destination being in sight we know where we're going to settle, where the highs will be in rates, and maybe we get cuts from that point on, but i think the market recognizes that it would require economic weakness, the market to suffer a lot i don't think we're priced for that it could just be you have a

sturdier economy as one push and then you have a higher for longer for the pull. >> a soft landing is helpful fed pausing is helpful t. could be either one. >> no landingis tricky >> no landing is tricky. stronger numbers -- be. >> right >> -- gets tricky. mike, we'll see you in just a minute tesla taking a leg lower but the selling started this afternoon when the company announced a recall related to its self-driving software. we'll talk to an analyst about that in just a moment. we are down almost 400 on the dow. every sector lower in the s&p 500. consumer discretionary at the bottom of the pack managers. (other money manager) different how? aren't we all just looking for the hottest stocks? (fisher investments) nope. we use diversified strategies to position our clients' portfolios for their long-term goals. (other money manager) but you still sell investments that generate high commissions for you, right? (fisher investments) no, we don't sell commission products. we're a fiduciary, obligated to act in our client's best interest. (other money manager) so when do you make more money, only when your clients make more money?

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we want to show you some pictures we are just getting in of some bankman-fried leaving a new york city courthouse moments ago. he was there for a bail modification hearing regarding his use of encrypted apps while out on bail. a judge asked prosecutors and bankman-fried's lawyers to send proposals on revised bail conditions next week we got a glimpse of him. i guess he goes back to california now where he's been at his parents' home tesla sitting at session lows, announcing a recall impacting nearly 363,000 of its vehicles warning its full self-beta driving software may be causing crashes a hold rating on tesla there have always been questions about this self-driving software whether it was really indeed that how surprising is this recall? >> this isn't surprising at all. there's been a lot of debate and

speculation around in regulating this technology a little bit more aggressively. this is certainly a collaborative effort between the industry and seeing this sort of issue come up given the accidents that have been well publicized is not a surprise what ultimately is the cost to the company and to the brand it looks like the cost of the company will be not terrible here they have about two months to actually rectify this with an update and certainly i think the brand has held up relatively well even through elon musk's acquisition of twitter and there is price decline given the activity we're seeing now. it will be interesting for ust see who actually signs up for this service as we get into the back half of the quarter into the next quarter >> and just to be clear on the self-driving software which is an upgrade, the number is surprising people. tesla cars are not self-driving,

right? hasn't this always been a weird gray zone in a marketing question mark? >> it's an enhanced driver assist with the option for the company to layer out incremental functionality. certainly the ability to navigate is something everybody is working on in the space and a lot of this is really around the use case for the autonomous driving and self-driving functionality. what we're seeing here there's a lot of trial and error and this is called a beta because it is a beta they're doing the testing out in the field, and that's where they need to be doing test to go get more information and they have a very active user base that's helping them do that testing right now. >> colin, thank you very much for your take on tesla, someone who covers it very closely from oppenheimer. colin rusch. we'll go straight into "the closing bell market zone." mike santoli here as always to

break down the crucial moments of the trading day plus kate rooney and crypto and shopify on the move today mike, we'll kick it off with the broad market which is selling off right now. more than 1% decline on the s&p consumer discretionary is the worst, tesla and etsy down 8%. a lot of the consumer names are getting hit, the tech names also getting hit which had been holding up relatively well so far this year, the microsofts, interestingly cisco is the winner in the nasdaq how do you read the current sell-off >> the market for two weeks has been trying to digest this big move we got coming into the year and especially in some of the riskier parts of the market. we have that going on on one side confronted with a little bit of a move in yields. not so dramatic today but the idea we're having to adjust to a

fed that might be on alert to do more versus less all those things funneling together earnings in general not a great earnings season. it's almost done, and yet we've kind of gotten through it okay because it's been more or less measured declines in first quarter forecasts and people were able to hang their hats on the fact a lot of it was priced in already i think that's what's going on as i mentioned 4100 seems more tactically in this market for the s&p. i was saying after january if it backs off to 4,000, 3,900, that type of area, it would still look relatively normal in the pullback i guarantee you it would get people a little bit nervous because there's a lot of newfound or tentative bullishment in the market because of how the market has behaved. i think that would be a little bit of a gut check quickly >> if you're just joining us, some comments from st. louis fed president bullard this hour not helping sentiment. he said he would have backed a 50-point basis hike last meeting and he would do so again in

march. he's not a voter but clearly that's where the conversation has gone loretta mester of cleveland also said she would have seen the case for a 50-point basis height bitcoin is holding on to gains today despite the late day sell-off now 13% this week hitting its highest level since august and crypto-related stocks are having a strong week as well kate rooney, is there a reason >> sara, it does really go back to what you and mike were talking about, the high beta tech names some of these stocks are on the extreme side of that higher beta tech play, also some of the most shorted names of the sector. you've seen short squeezes play out, part of the dynamic for coin base, and it's really seen low institutional interest i'm told a lot of this has been driven by record retail trading so there's a lot of risk going into some of these names and, like i said, really on the opposite side of the spectrum. for bitcoin in particular, ironic this is coming in the face of what has been, i'm told,

objectively bad headline news for the industry a consensus i'm hearing the worst may be over in terms of some of the incremental regulation we've seen from the s.e.c. it's not an all-out ban. you're getting these piecemeal either enforcement actions or pieces of suggested regulation there's data suggesting the opposite is actually happening what i mentioned with crypto stocks and that driven by detail when it comes to bitcoin itself there's some data showing it's high institutional interest and what you might call the whale buyers coming in seeing an opportunity because they've been so depressed last year >> that was the question whether they would come back in and buy. kate, we want to hit shopify with you investors concerned about the company's weaker than expected sales guidance earlier on "squawk on the sheet" harley finkelstein said he was

shocked. >> we showed great growth on the top line and on the bottom line and all the while we're making these changes like some of the layoffs that, again, not fun to do but that isn't necessary. we're taking our medicine because we want to be a long-term, 100-year company. >> shopify taking down a lot of names today. what can you tell us >> the long-term trajectory for shopify, sara, does seem to be intact right now there were a lot of analysts surprised. that's a strong holiday season the near-term results are causing some of the jitters here that offset some of the potential long-term strength there's questions over margins they have a lot of competition now with this buy with prime that amazon is doing questions about merchant growth and shopify didn't give annual outlook. they gave for the current quarter but that was causing some fears in terms of what to expect going forward and you can see it really sunk the stock this week and today, yesterday

in particular. really fears over struggling for profit even though they have raised prices here and what the slowing revenue growth will mean for this company but, again, had got ann bit of a bid going into earnings and has been one of those winners during covid that got damaged last year and has sort of been all over the place. very volatile. >> absolutely. kate, thank you. let's stick with e-commerce. i mentioned etsy one of the largest counterfeiting platforms in the world can no longer defend counterfeit products as a small percentage of revenue. mike, what do you make of this >> well, it's hard to know, first of all, if there's anything particularly fresh about this or some kind of consequences related to any of these efforts or if it's just been one of these overhangs over the company from its existence

i don't know if i read the current read but a lot of these stocks are down a bunch. you mention shopify, all about where you're measuring it from, off the lows in the fall or last summer, it's up a ton. today it's taken a big hit off the highs, still pretty rough. i don't think this is make or break for etsy maybe want to get creative on the thesis around this company that's not really about the macro and it's not really about how the company is executing >> i think the company would push back hard against this as well and focus on what they are known for which is their individual artisans and unique art, furniture, clothing, what have you >> i can tell you that ebay for 25 years has kind of been in the cross hairs of a lot of this

stuff. to what degree they have to stand behind the authenticity of various goods. it seems like it's a noisy area to work through. >> mike, as we head toward the close, it's not an all-out sell-off you are seeing some strength, cisco is having a really strong day in reaction to earnings. you have some of the health care names, fertilizer is higher. it's not like it's defensive move or anything like that >> no. it doesn't feel like some kind of a big shock or a game over type day but absolutely showing that there's been this comfort that we got as we've been talking about, dips being bought and the market seemed like it was kind of teflon some of the short-term so we have an excuse to pull back you have the 6 and 12-month treasury bills a lot of the atmospherics here contribute to this idea of taking a half step back. you can interpret what's

happening the last couple of weeks as the market churns and spends a lot of energy doing so even though right now you still have 2%, 3% down side from here before you even have to say it's more than a routine pullback >> just to reiterate the data today, producer prices coming in hotter than expected jobless claims under 200,000, just continued strong labor market no evidence of all the tech layoffs. and it does feel like the market waffles between cheering for good data as a sign of a soft landing or a better economy, better earnings, better market, and we're thinking the fed is going to have to do more for longer >> there's no free lunch you have the philly fed index come in below expectations you have this kind of hot/cold economy, manufacturing certainly retrenching a lot of the leading indicators of overall activity pointing lower

the consumer won't quit. retail sales are hot what does that mean for policy and for valuations the top line, and even the overall earnings base of the s&p, is up a lot we're barely off the peak. >> we've been up a lot, to your point, coming into today, which says a lot that today is the dow's worst performance in a month, since january 18th. it's been a strong period and it's just down 1.2%. we have two minutes to go in the trading day. >> the internals eroded here they were 50/50 in early afternoon and now 2.5 times as much declining i wanted to take a five-day look to illustrate that pattern every day going back to last friday if you held the open, you made money and you see they tried it again today and we've given it back. we're essentially trading back to the morning lows now.

that did show you had this kind of stickiness to the lower end of the range volatility index, a lot of folks looking to -- by the way, a lot of heavy bets in vix futures volatility at the lower end of its one-year range and people are bidding to see if we get more turbulence in the second half of february >> you jinxed it at the top of the hour when you said another morning dip bought -- >> oh, i jinxed it you were telling me about that, too. i thought we were both agreeing this pattern was impressive. >> we both did we were impressed, we jinxed, and now back at the morning lows there's the dow down 440 points. microsoft, amgen and boeing the biggest drags. only cisco and home depot a higher in today's trade. s&p down 1.4%. as mike said that leaves us flat for the week so far, which just shows you how strong everything

has felt consumer discretionary, technology, communication services are your worst performing second source the nasdaq down the most it is breaking a three-day win streak and you have weakness in places like a microsoft, tesla on the recall, amazon, nvidia, apple. that's all weighing hard on big tech that's it for me on "closing bell." now into "overtime" with scott wapner all right, sara, thank you so much. welcome to "overtime." i'm scott wapner you heard the bells. we are just getting started from post 9 at the new york stock exchange we have another big night of earnings upon us, draft kings and doordash and applied materials. we'll see the stock moves as they happen. plus, a big-time market watcher coming right here to post 9 to argue why an even bigger pullback than what we saw today might be coming. we'll debate that call, what it might mean for your money moving forward. we do begin, though, with our "talk of the tape.