digits over the last 36 months that's exactly what arch capital group has done. >> nice. >> great company, insurance. >> how many times do you think the fed will hike by the end of the year >> i think it's a jump ball at this point i think they're going in july. unfortunately, i believe that's a mistake. we'll see what happens there after. and i'll see everybody in "closing bell" in a couple hours. thank you, scott welcome to "the exchange." fed chair powell testifying. he said it's less important now in terms of rate hikes dow is down 30 points, the session low is 178, the s&p 500 is down 19, 4369 today, a half%. the nasdaq is the worst performer. let's get straight to steve

liesman. steve, for all the biggest takeaways from day one >> hey, kelly, thank you just a few moments allege, fed chair jay powell pretty specifically endorsed the outlook for two more rate hikes, noting that a majority of fed officials had forecast it, and saying it's a pretty good guess if the economy performs as expected, but they're in no hurry to hike rates. >> the level to which we raise rates is a separate question from the speed speed in the early process was important, it is not now now we're moderating that pace >> powell had said in his opening remarks, but still, quote, has a long way to go to get to the 2% target

consumer spending had picked up, housing was weak higher rates and slow you output was slowing business investment, but the labor market remains very tight the upshot was little change to the 75-point probability, and -- i'm going to double check that -- a 20% probability of that of a second hike. so the market not necessarily taking them for their word. my next guest says the fed might need to keep hiking into 2024 larry lindsey is president and ceo of lindsey group, and also was on the council under president george w. bush >> i'm not surprised

the market hasn't been there for a long time. i thought the chair did a very good job today, a much better than he did in his presser, at conveying where the fed was going. the reasons he gale for the necessity to hike further is quite clear. it includes the labor market, the economic remains quite strong core inflation is moderating, but only if you put a telescope on it. so, you know, the fed is going to have to move. >> i'm also curious, layry, people have pointed out the asynchronous nature of this. >> there's three different economies, and one of the great things about different

currencies, different monetary regimes, each one can tailor its behavior to the needs of its economy. >> so, i guess my question is, is it actually a benefit that we have, for instance, china exporting deflation, it sounds like, right now. >> well, the chinese have one huge issue, it's called communism. i know that's not in vogue, but if you look at their behavior, what the regime has done is a major power grab that has stood in the way of the efficiency economy. i think they're beginning to realize that they returned jack vosma's associates back to alibaba they didn't push him off the top of the building like they did other tech execs

they just sort of disappeared him for a couple years now they realize they're not doing such a good job at it, so they put him back in their handling of covid was a major, major problem i mean, we know how disastrous lockdowns were for the u.s. population, especially for school children with regard to psychology, with regard to education, and everything else same thing is very much true in china. they had more severe lockdowns they're not good at handling psychological issues they've got a lot of depression, much like we do, as a result the other piece of this is their propaganda exercise is to blame it all on the united states. they have convinced the chinese population, we're trying to hold china down well, that's not exactly something that will create exuberance for the chinese

population it's one reason that i think sentiment is so weak. >> steve, let me turn to you and bring it back to the question of what the u.s. does with rate hikes. powell made a couple interesting comments, we're not necessarily better than economic forecasters, and talked a bit about what the pace would be, about inflation, so forth. why do you think the market it had to be yanged up to where the fed was many times is not right to the level where powell thinking they ought to be right now. >> maybe i learned this years ago from larry lindsey, that it hasn't hurt them or paid them to be wrong on this if you've had the fed wrong over this time, i don't think it cost you very much. i don't know that could have made a lot more money, maybe in the fed funds futures market, but i'm not sure that you would

have really -- you would have had it wrong in the stock market for sure, if the fed was going to hike to where larry says they're going to hike, and if you said have been long in the stock market, you still would have made money at this point. i think the other aspect of this is the market has had a different outlook on inflation than the fed has had and i know there are people -- rick has had this idea that the fed is not hiking anymore. i respect the pin, but i don't know if i agree with it. i would be remiss if i didn't mention powell going to the grateful dead concert, him saying he's been a fan, but there was bipartisan agreement on that issue, so i don't think

we want to miss the moment and highlight bipartisanship, even if it's about the grateful dead. >> it's a generational thing, steve. >> gentlemen, if you could pause for a moment. >> some jung congressmen there. rick santelli is here. what can you tell us >> it was a terrific auction as a matter of fact, we started these 20-year auctions back in may of 2020. i remember doing the first one quite well when they came back in vole. they got rid of them about 20 years ago. this auction had the highest bid to cover of any of the auctions thus far, a 2.87 i have gave this an a-plus $12 billion, 20-year bonds, which is like two basis points below. 4.03, lower yield, higher price. the government is selling it for us, higher price is a good

thing. a solid auction. every metric was off the charts. as far as powell goes, a two day of twos, a two day of tens, it doesn't have a big effect, but where it did have a big effect was the dollar index if you look at that intraday of the dollar index, pretty much the minute he turned the microphone on, the dollar index went down. i can't think of anything easier to understand about what the market thinking about the fed and future fed policy than that dollar chart back to you, kelly. >> rick, my esteemed gentlemen seem to disagree with you. larry, i'll let you kind of respond. >> well, i hesitate very much to disagree with rick he knows the markets better than just about anyone i know however, in the end, the fed cannot give up a 2% targets.

the amount of progress they're making is quite low, and i know the market doesn't want to have rates hiked. the fed almost always goes further than necessary, because they don't know what necessary is so i think they're going to have to continue to hike until they cause the pain that steve was alluding to, until the markets say ouch, the fed has probably not done its job >> steve, a quick last comment on that. >> i think that's right. i actually have a question for larry, if you don't mind, kelly. >> sure. >> i know this upsets the timing the introof the section is you think they need to hike into 2024 how high do you think the fed has to go to hit that rate does the speed afternoon which

it gets there as much as it did before >> i agree with the chair very much that's why i think they'll be going into 2024. if you look at things likes the chandler rule, what have you, you end up where a six handle. they'll have two more hikes this year, and that means hikes in 2024. >> put a coda on that, steve >> i think six is different. i also wonder if the market has internalized the pain we're talking about here as you know, kelly, the story i did yesterday on this show was the idea a soft landing, and this idea of gdp going flatlike, but not necessarily going negative there's a big difference between zero and negative with the gdp and the impact it has on individual people's lives and

corporate earnings. >> larry >>. >> the market handle -- hasn't internalized anything. they're being a 15-year-old right now. if you want 15-year-olds to behave, you know what you've got to do. >> i don't know yet. >> yeah, you're going to have your hands full, no question [ laughter ] >> you'll have to write a book about it >> you know, i couldn't even read it. gentlemen, thank you both. it's a pleasure. larry lindsey and steve liesman on the markets. home builders have been marketing. mortgages rates below 7%, but demand still remains subdued hi, diana. >> kelly, most mortgage rates fell for the third straight week, but demand pretty flat the average rate for 30-year with conforming balances decreased to 6.3%, with 20% down interesting, the rate no jumbo loan rose, that's the second

straight week it was higher. that hasn't happened in two years. tighter liquid conditions have and that, in turn increases rates. applications to refinance a home was -- mortgage application to purchase a home increased 2% for the week, but they were still 32% lower than a year ago. fha demand, though, drove the increase for purchases it's favored generally by lower-income borrowers or first-time buyers, so at least it's a sign they're trying to stay in the game in contrast, demand for newly built holes much stronger. applications for mortgages to buy new homes jumped sharply in maid, up 17% year over year. that's why the builders are doing so well. stocks at 52-week highs. housing starts are a huge jump and we saul builders with big earnings week last week, and

we'll have kb homes report after the bell today >> i almost asked larry and steve about this, but if the fed wanted to take the heat out of this part of the housing market, they should cut rates. that would increase inventory, lower prices, so on. >> by cutting rates, because the builders could build houses lower? >> no, people would put their homes on the market. they're frozen into place. >> but remember, mortgage rates do not follow strictly what the fed is doing they follow what the fed thinking about the broader economy. it also has a lot to do with mbs, mortgage-backed bonds, so it's not a direct correlation. the biggest issue in the market today is, as you said, inventory, and potentially if mortgage rates were lower, people could put their homes on the market, but most have under 4%, most under 3% even even if they pulled back to 5 or

4.5, you won't get a lot of % people wanting to trade up to that. diana olick reporting, thank you. coming up, the epic run has added nearly $3 billion back to the market capital barclays says it's time to move to the sidelines plus the s&p's 14% game this year has powered by the so-called magnificent seven. our guest says it's time to go to other names. the dow is the outperformer, down only a 0.1% down only a 0.1% t this is the all new, all electric lucid air. a car that goes as far as it does fast.

as sleek as it is... we're back after this. spacious. as smart... as it is beautiful. introducing the lucid air. experience the best. ♪ this is dr. arnold t. petsworth, he's the owner of petsworth vetworld. business was steady, but then an influx of new four-legged friends changed everything. dr. petsworth welcomed these new patients. the only problem? more appointments meant he needed more space. that's when dr. petsworth turned to his american express business card, which offers flexible spending limits that adapt with his business. he used his card to furnish a new exam room, and everyone was happy. built for dr. petsworth business. built for your business. amex business.

welcome back to "the exchange." tesla has been on a hot streak lately one analyst says it's time to hit the brakes dan levy from barclays downgraded people are -- he still raced the price target by 30 bucks dan levy, senior autos annual it's at barclays

welcome. >> thanks for having me, kelly >> these are always tricky how do you thread the needle >> yeah, listen. we've been bullish on tellsla. we see them as a long-term winner we've acknowledged there's more to tesla, even from a midterm catalyst path, you have to mass scale coming late 2024, but i think the view on the stock is there's still a more challenging near-term fundamental setup as far as finding the forward margins. inventories for model 3 are still somewhat elevated. there is still concern that you'll have further price cuts we thought the stock was dismissing some of those

fundamentals there is certainly, you know, based on some of the data that we have seen, there is elevated inventory, especially for model 3. i think, you have inventory ramping in austin and berlin, and that as more capacity comes online you've seen more competition from other automaker. >> the shares are down 5% today. do you think they can hang on to the doubling from the year to date >> our view going forward, we fully recognize there are other non-automotive components. the opportunities near term is that you may potentially see a bottoming of the margin on the second quarter we think as far as deliveries

go, you'll have a delivery release in the next week and a half we're a bit ahead of consensus on that, but it's important to go mindful and what about the valuation. 75 sometimes forward earnings, or something like that's correct raising the price target to 260, above levels from here what do you value wait the shares on? >> the valuation is based on the long-term 2030 outlook we think by then tesla can be comfortably north of 6 million units. that makes them -- call it five or six automakers globally and then what we're trying to do is embed some upside optionality there. we think that is quite necessary, but at the same time if you look at the trading multiple, it was trading at just

under 30 times ebit/ebitda, as recently as april. in the span of the last six, seven weeks, it's gone to well over 40 times ebitda really off the sentiment. this is actually a sharp contrast as the other a.i. names we have seen, where we've seen reratings. >> that's a great point. you mentioned that a.i. has, to some extent, the driver of the stock, special the self-driving capabilities, where it seems like marketplace demand is not that strong, based on some of the prices, where they're not getting much of a valuation boost from it. they actually have had a pretty

hands-off approach, but as we've seen with crypto, that may not last forever. >> this is quite different from what we have seen with automakers taking. tesla takes an approach with a lot of cameras, and computer dealing with it. it's a vision-based approach we've seen other automakers use lidar and maps we see tesla as binary it could be a next tack heart success, but it's also not very clear it can be successful, especially in contrast to the other automakers near term, the uptake rates having more of a u.s. story, and if you look at actually some of the third-party data stacking up

tesla's system against other, there's difficult reviews. they have a lot of data out there, but the technical approach is still unclear. >> though it sounds like it's not necessarily embedded in your long-term bullishness. >> there's some upside yo optionality. >> where, you know, one thing you can say, they've had incredible success on the automotive side. dan, thanks for joining us today. we appreciate it. >> thank you for having me still ahead, bank of america flow data shows retail investors growing more cautious on stocks. one of our next guests agrees. he's playing it through etfs.

plus amazon is slightly lower, the ftc suing the company. we'll have the details unitedhealth leads the way we also see strong performance intel, salesforce, walgreens are the decliners today, disney as the decliners today, disney as well ♪♪ the only thing i regret about my life was hiring local talent. if i knew about upwork. we're back after this. i would actually talented people from all over the world. instead of talentless people from all over my house.

a third kid. what if she likes playing golf? it's expensive. we're outlawing golf. wait. can i still play? since we work with emower, we don't have to worry about planning for a third kid. you can still play golf... sometimes. take control of your financial future to empower what's next. welcome back to "the exchange." let's check on what's moving this hour. dom which you is all over it at the telestrator. >> three straight days of losses, but we were just off our session lows right now, the dow

industrials is down about 31 points, about flattish 4368 for the s&p 500 so, again, towards the lower end of things, but off the session low mark so far. the nasdaq, 13,507, 160 points, the real underperformer there. one of the reasons why is amazon they're down more than 1% at one point when the headlines first came out that the federal trade commission and regulators were suing amazon those headlines now driving the down side there, one of the bigger drags for that technology trade. a couple industry calls, tech related, one for spotify, and one for peloton.

spotify was called the top pick, and peloton, meanwhile, down about 10%, they got downgraded to an underperformer pricing power is an issue there, some concerns about the demand for at-home fit mission gear keep an eye on those names movers, nonetheless. back to you. a 10% drop on that with.ton. tyler mathisen has a news update. rescuers have still not located the submersible that disappeared. the search area now twice the size of connecticut, including a french ship that can dive to the depth of 13,000 feet they're focused on an area where a canadian aircraft detected

noise. >> you always have hope. that's why we do what we do. with respect to the noises specifically, we don't know what they are prosecutors in idaho saying the dna found on a knife sheath at the off-campus home where four college students were murdered directly links the murderer this is in newly filed court documents. at least seven people critically injured after an explosion started a fire central paris. local officials say it's too early to tell the exact cause, but people reported the strong smell of gas in the area the blast caused at least one building to fully collapse kelly, back to you, see you at "halftime report." the nasdaq underperforming today. meta, alphabet, microsoft all off about two. with values rising and bubble

talks around a.i., is it time to hop off that train altogether? we'll discuss, next. ♪

♪ the biggest ideas inspire new ones. 30 years ago, state street created an etf that inspired the world to invest differently. it still does. what can you do with spy? ♪ ♪

♪ welcome back to "the exchange." the s&p 500 is up 14% so far in

year without seven of the biggest stocks in the market, apple, microsoft, alphabet, nvidia, tesla, meta -- the s&p would actually be flat is the rally about to broaden out or fizzle out altogether let's ask chris and andre. welcome, gentlemen chris, it sounds like you're fading big tech. >> yeah, kelly, good to be with us again i think it's a better bet that small will outperform large. it feels like the market has momentum and could easily broaden, but even if it broadens, what u to own is the stuff that's lagged at this point. apple, a great statistic, apple alone is now worth more than all the stocks in the russell 2000 put together that pendulum seems to be

swinging just about as far as it's able to go. so i say let's take the other side of the bet and find smaller names, 30, 40, 60 billion that can outperform in the second half another thought, are you concerned if this magnificent seven reverses, collapses, is the whole rally fizzling out do you feel that it can broaden, absorb that correction >> i think it depends on the devil in the details, kelly. if nvidia, apple, microsoft plupg, sure, the rally is over what i expect more to happened is they may tread water for a while. >> andre if i recall correctly, you've been warning about this market

for the last couple months even as we've watched the mag any sent seven vault into stretched territory. are you moving to the sidelines altogether >> i think you have to look at relatively valuation to bonds and cash appeared ask yourself, where is that incremental dollar was the a.i. enthusiasm filters through, where is that incremental dollar going to go, right? from that perspective, i think bonds and cash is where that will go. especially when you look at those seven, stocks like nvidia trading more than 30 times sales, right once some of this kind of enthusiasm fizzles out, it reminds me when tesla was trading like this. in order to see broadening out, you need to see earnings continue to deliver. that will take a couple quarters

to see through rather than weeks. >> it's a running jokes, i can get -- great, i got 80% on the megacaps. >> we said similar things in 2020, right? we're still trading on nostalgia of a bygone era of, hey, the fed will lowers interest rates to zero, interest rates do 1% to 2% it takes a long time to adjust to a different regime. >> chris, before we go, i want to clarify, it's not like you're actually reaches for small caps here we're talking dollar general, ice, why does that jump out to you? >> i like it i'm still afraid we haven't seen the end of the banking issues. i think commercial real estate really has some work to get

through. so i'd like a financial that's inexpensive, maybe, has been caught up in the tar of financials, but it doesn't take interest rates, doesn't have bad loans. it runs primarily oil and interest rates, and they don't care whether the commodity goes up or down, they care about the volume this is the kind of stock that has lagged the megacaps. it's a $60 billion market cap. it's not a small company, but that's the place i would be looking at there's some in finance, retail, some all over the place, and they have just been left behind. >> the anti-mega caps. we'll leave it there thank you both areciate it. coming up, meta sees outsized gains this year, but snap and pinterest barely in the green. could an advertising slowdown be

a stumbling block. a quick programming note "china's corporate spy war." eamon javers dives deep into the world of espionage, telling a story. it premieres tonight at 10:00 p.m. eastern and pacific on nbc.

you founded your kayak company because you love the ocean- not spreadsheets. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire

welcome back the world's biggest advertising convention is underway in cannes, france the big question is how to position for the expected contraction in ad spending julia boorstin that is key details from executives there, including a tiktok exec. hi, julia. >> reporter: that's right, all big brands are here trying to figure out the best place to put ad dollars, especially in light

of the economic uncertainty. a lot of it is centering on fast-growing tiktok. we're here at their setup. i spoke to the global president, blake chandly. he told me the company is growing its revenue by a high double-digit percentage rate insider intelligence estimates that they will top, though, of course, the company -- but getting them high double-digit percentage rates, that is new. i asked him if the regulatory threat that the company is facing, and the push by some to ban tiktok ace op's operations s having any impact on interest. here's how he answered >> the feedback is they want to work with us, how to have a presence in platforms, how they

get in corner of culture essentially the conversation all week has been really positive. >> now here at cannes, here at the company setup, tiktok is featuring some of the new tools enabling brands to have more control of their placement, where their ads are originating, where they're showing up, appeared also more a.i. tools to help advertisers both design and target their ads that's a key focus here, how to be used to not only use the content better, but make each of the ads more effective the company is also focused on rolling out commerce solutions take a listen. >> what we're trying to do with our commerce solutions is loudly the merchants, and allow them to have that purchase all in the user experience versus a link out to somewhere else. we're in the early stages in the u.s. we launched in the you can,

robust in southeast asia it's a big part of our future. we're excited about it. >> reporter: you know, chandlee said the move is bullish here despite concerns there's a lot of interest in what tiktok is do, particularly in its reach with the younger demographics that maybe are not spending as much time watching linear television. i asked about competition, he said they're focused on what they're doing, and not the other plasmsen. the former exec commented to you that part of his new venture is doing well. no surprise here thank you, julia meantime shares are barely lower after the ftc is suing the company over a deceptive sign-up process for amazon prime

steve kovach has the details. >> this is an interesting lawsuit. it's alleging thattal zone used a lot of deceptive practices to basically at the checkout process to hoodwink people into signing up for prime, making it different to unsubscribe after that happened. the ft dr. alleges they had a code name for this, pro project iliad. it's been severalhours since i was released so nothing yet from their pushback, being the first -- and a huge antitrust investigation, and we're expecting that lawsuit as soon as the summer. that's going to be the big one this one is just special about prime, and what the ftc alleges are deceptive practices.

millions of people >> though several investors shrugging that off what about this google/microsoft issue also involving the ftc >> this is a complaint that google has filed, very similar to one that they filed in europe say they have all these customers and they've been leveraging that to get sweethearty deals. when it comes to they cloud providers, microsoft is right there in the middle, you know, some of the commentary coming out right now. if you can't beat them, sue them, and, of course, the irony is not lost. >> this feels like the season, and unclear if it's this issue

or simply the fact that they got way over stretched, way over their skis. >> probably more of the latter every time one of these actions come out, investors barely shrug. >> it takes a while to pile up steve, thank you >> thank you. up next, noting a divergence between retail and industrial investors. and that's ahead, also a look at bitcoin, as it cracked briefly the 30,000 mark, highest level since may. and throughout june, cnbc is celebrating pride month. here is poshmark's ceo >> for me, who i recently went through a process, i'm thankful

me and my partner now have two twins. i love the opportunity to share with them about the struggles, the costs, the emotional journey we went through, how we got there, being able to answer eange questions felt like i was crti a bridge for people to crti a bridge for people to be comfortable to understand the -changing route. -go. roadblock ahead. ...back up, back up... reverse! reverse! next level moments, we're 30 seconds out. struggles we go through. level n. [north corridor, hurry!] -coming through! -or 3, let's go. the network more businesses choose. transplant received. at&t business. i'm so glad we did this. i'm so glad we did this. i'm so glad we did this. life is for living. let's partner for all of it. i'm so glad we did this.

edward jones

welcome back the so-called smart money still believes in stock picking and the bull market according to new flow data from bank of america heng funds and institutional investors putting $4.5 billion into single stocks and equity etfs last week the largest inflow since october. different story for the retail investor, though back to selling after a week of buying and they've been sellers most weeks since april b of a reports. joining me now is jared woodard investment and etf strategist at bank of america securities jared, it's great to have you here you've got your finger on the flows. and you're also a little cautious on stocks here. >> that's right. i'm glad to be with you because this is one of those years in which active asset allocation i think is more important than ever investors are really bullish on big parts of the market, but our contention is that this is a year of slowing economic growth, of gradually weakening economy,

and that means we expect some parts of the bond market, especially the credit-sensitive sectors to outperform equities we think there are some great ways you can invest without taking on excess risk, without buying things that are already, you know, too expensive and if you do that you can achieve better returns than investors have had for a long time because in a world of structurally higher inflation and interest rates the old asset allocation playbooks don't work you saw this last year stocks down but long-term treasury bonds were down too down 30% a conventional 60-40 portfolio served investors really poorly and that's why we think it's so important to look the aalternatives in the bond market >> i'm surprised when you're looking at bond market alternatives that you're thinking about or primarily doing so through etfs, which are generally seen as a risky way to play bonds because they mark to market, you know, losses immediately. >> i understand the point, but in some ways i would look at etfs and fixed income as the market indexes are just lists of bonds that exist but etfs are actually traded they give you a much bigger view

of what's really possible in the market today, where the liquidity really is, and what's actually moving. we think that fixed income etfs, while they're passively constructive, are incredibly important as a way to allocate assets actively in a market as complicated as this one. and so whether it's sectors like high yield corporate bonds, high yield municipal bonds, convertibles, even preferreds, there are ways to get yield in this market without taking on inordinate amount of risk. and i think most importantly not taking on the risks of exposure to higher inflation and interest rates that so many investors have done in the years past. >> yeah. you're emphasizing you can get preferreds at 7% although a lot of those are financials there are some questions about that. munis we talking about yesterday some nice yields but if i were a muni investor i'd want to hold it to maturity. why deal with the stress of watching the market gyrate year in and year out? >> i think it's incredibly important to be diversified. whether it's in stocks or in bonds. and one reason we like fixed income etfs so much is they give you a diversified pool of bonds.

your default rate, the risk of some kind of surprise is much lower in a diversified pool of those assets and you can have much greater control over the sort of exposure to the market that you want. today we find in the case of municipals that you can earn 100 basis points, a full percentage point more than comparable maturity treasuries or even higher yielding parts of the municipal market whether it's in preferreds or convertibles or even emerging market debt there are places to go today in a diversified pool of fixed income assets that we find give you much better risk profile than the conventional bond indexes that so many investors have tracked >> that's interesting. you know, i remain -- i don't have a strong enough stomach for it i think there's something about the security of kind of single security selection but let's zoom out for a second and talk about what are investors looking for? a lot of them are probably wishing they were in the big cap stuff, all the equity stuff year to date but everyone also knows you jump in at the end of the rally and you could get

steamrolled. >> that's right. the big equity indexes i would argue are more risky than ever if you bought the s&p 500 etf 30 years ago, it's 30 years old this year, that was a really diversified basket of stocks low correlation to each other within the index and low correlation to other assets. today the index is more concentrated than ever 7, 8, 9 stocks comprise 30% of the index. and the members of the index are more correlated to each other than they ever have been before. that means that those conventional equity investments, any index, any etf you look at, may actually be much riskier than ever has been before. we think they're looking deeper into the market, whether it's by individual factors or sectors is a much more prudent way to go. and the same thing's true in the bond market. most bond indexes own 70% or more in assets that are incredibly at risk from higher -- structurally higher interest rates and inflation you saw chair powell talking about this again today that's why we think you have to look beyond those conventional bond indexes and asset allocation models into specific parts of the market where you can get some yield at a prudent

level of risk. >> quick last question because i do share david einhorn's concern that the s&p has become a price maker more than a price taker and if i said okay, i want etf stock market exposure but not any s&p 500, are there ways to do that, to get that >> absolutely. so some areas we like within the market, small cap value, which has been a consistent outperformer over the past 100 years by a wide margin vbr's an etf we track that covers that part well. if you want high quality stocks, stocks with really high free cash flow yield, there's a cash cows product we like the ticker symbol's cowz we think for a long-term investor metals and mining's going to be incredibly important, whether you care about decarbonization or national security and resource nationalism, it doesn't matter your politics. xme the mining etf, gives you exposure to the raw materials that are necessary for all of that if you invest in these ways, capturing factors and themes in the market, you can avoid some of the overvalued stocks that are dominating today >> it's nerve-racking breaking

from the crowd but i appreciate the strategies and the advice on how to do that jared thanks for your time today. >> thanks. >> jared woodard, bank of america. that does it for "the exchange." but coming up next on "power lunch" we'll talk to dropbox ceo drew houston, whose shares are up more than 15% so far this year there's an ai play tyler can't wait for it. i'll join him on the other side of this break. communities and the people who live and work there grow and thrive. we're proud to call these places home too. they're where we put down roots, and where together, we work to help move everyone's financial goals forward. pnc bank. this is cynthia suarez, cfo of go-go foodco., an online food delivery service. business was steady, until... gogo-foodco. go check it out. whaatt?! overnight, users tripled.

which meant hiring 20 new employees - and buying 20 new laptops. so she used her american express business card, which gives her more membership rewards points on her business purchases. somebody ordered some laptops? cynthia suarez. cfo. mvp. built for cynthia's business. built for your business. amex business.

welcome to "power lunch," everybody. alongside kelly evans i'm tyler mathisen glad you could join us coming up, stocks down for the third straight day and we didn't even work on monday. momentum starting to reverse just a bit is this just a normal pause after a strong rally or is it perhaps something bigger like powell's comments today? plus that stretch of i-95 that was destroyed in a fire, it's going to reopen to traffic sooner than anyone expected. so how did this project come together so quic