>> mike santoli, put some respect on his name. >> our senior markets commentator. we'll see what happens with the finish of this week, but your conversation, what you thought it might be on monday is certainly looking like it could be a little different. we'll see what the final hour holds. dow is good for 500. we're green across the board. "the exchange" starts now. ♪ ♪ >> thank you very much, scott. welcome to "the exchange." i'm kelly evans. it's been a long week, and here's what's ahead. jobless claims are helping ease concerns about the strength of the labor market. but what about the strength of the consumeer? the travel earnings guidance, not great. retail is a mixed bag right now. we have fresh data from bank of america institute. 69 million consumer and small business accounts, a real-time picture of what's going on. it may explain why the opportunities are in the consumer space. and don't try to make sense of

the markets, but there are trades that do well in this environment. this is one of them, up 4% today, 20% this year, that name is ahead. and the fed, jobs, and housing, the new prediction platform lets you bet on economic indicators. i need an account. it's been live for a week. the founder and chair is here with a first look at where clients are putting money. but let's go to dom chu on the rally. >> rally, you can see the bull out there in full effect. we're trying to bounce back strongly. we're not back to where we were last friday, before monday's big meltdown to the downside. but we are at 39,278, up 515 points, 1.3% gains. the s&p 500 is at 5295, up 95 points, north of 1.75% there. at the highs of the session, we were up roughly 106 points, up about 34 at the lows of the

session. just to give you an idea of the trading range. so tilting towards the upper end of that range. the nasdaq up about 2.3%, that's 376 points on the nasdaq composite index. 16,571 the last trade there. let's put these in context. over the last week, here's what the s&p 500 etf has done, down about 2.75%. on a one-week basis, the nasdaq 100 is down about 3%. and that small-cap russell 2,000 is off about 5.25%. you can see the rally that we have seen kind of throughout the course of the week, but today especially, has brought us to a point where we're only about 1% away in the s&p 500 and nasdaq 100 away from the highs that we saw, or at least the levels that we saw on friday. we're about 2% away from there from the dow. but you can see that move here, playing some catchup. but the small caps have largged the large caps.

the consumer and economy. we got a slew of reports out over the last 24 hours. underarmor, up 19%. bumble, monster beverage and topgolf, a cautious consumer, but bumble on dating, monster beverage, less foot traffic, and topgolf, are people still going to go towards those alternative driving range venues at the same pace before? all of that factors in. but some of those consumer games, keep an eye on those. >> i can't resist asking you a quick question. i think they might spin off topgolf. dom, that was a quick era. >> i'll tell you what, it was a great move at the time. things didn't pan out the way they did post pandemic, and then beyond. but what i would say is this -- this is going to be the future of golf in many ways. you wonder whether or not when it does eventually find what

it's role is going to be in the future, whether it's part of topgolf or its own separate entity. but shareholders are looking at what's happening. i would point out, because you opened the door, look at a chart over the last year for topgolf grands versus other brands and you'll see what i'm talking about. >> it's shocking. everyone would have thought the opposite coming out of the pandemic. dom, thank you very much. there's that comparison he talked about. we mentioned stocks rallying on the jobless claims number, just 233,000. mega sigh of relief, down from the nearly 250-k the week before, below the estimate, as well. the country's view about the health of the economy is getting a little rosier right now, as well. steve liesman is here with the results of cnbc's latest all-america economic survey. >> yes, but not for the reasons you think. it seems the survey shows a curious bump in economic

optimism gripping the economy, but it's more likely politics a t play with economic sentiment. take a look at our top line. just to remind you, trump led biden 45 to 43. we have trump ahead by harris by two points. so all that sound in theory, they have consolidated bases, just a two-point margin, within the margin of error. for the first time in biden's presidency, more americans are optimistic about the outlook for the economy than pessimistic. 34% see the economy improving in the next 12 months, compared to 12% see it getting worse. a 14-point net positive. but overall, take a look here. 19% last year, that was the number overall, and now it's 14. we just gave you that number. the democrats, they're a little optimistic.

republicans, from minus 55 to plus 3. you can't know for sure, but it seems likely the increasing optimism is tied to donald trump being re-elected. we see links to who is in process and the prospects of who will be in office. if things were getting better, you would see it in the current views and you do not. views have taken a tick down. take a look. the percent who say it's excellent to good, 25 to 21. fair and poor up to 78%. and then you look at it by party. 42% of democrats, their guy is in office, so 42%. independents always in the middle here, and 3%, republicans right now, judging the economy good. what's unclear, how much these partisan views do and don't affect spending behavior. over the time americans have been down about the economy, consumer spending has been healthy. from an economic standpoint, you would rather have happy

consumers rather than unhappy partisan consumers. >> steve, come on over. i want to break away for a moment and get the results oh of that 30-year auction. rick, what happened? >> it's a big echo to yesterday. i'll tell you what happened, back-to-back three basis point tails. not good. that's a pricing phrase, which means, higher yield means lower prices, and the yield for the one-issued market, well, it is significantly higher -- or lower where the market clears. so this auction came in at 4.314. three basis points higher than the one-issued market, which is trading basically 4.284. that tailing means pricing was on the soft side. that's the biggest reason i gave it a d as in dog. and an even work auction than yesterday. what do they have in common? they're first runs, meaning

they're not reopened issues. those become actually a little less aggressive sometimes, so the primary action counts the most. very weak on long dated maturities, and i think that if you look at the intraday of 30s, intraday of 10s, all yields, they're moving to the upside. it's not only because the auction wasn't good but because it was the last auction and two out of three weren't good. so 125 billion in supply for the refunding, and very quickly, i told you the yield and the grade. but i'll hit some of the biggest metrics on the direct bidders. pension funds, hedge funds, at 15.5%, the lowest participation se since february of this year. dealers took a big amount. 19.2%. that's the biggest chunk primary dealers were left with on the buffet table since november of last year.

now, it doesn't mean that every auction is going to be poor and this doesn't mean that yields only can go up. but this gives us a sense of after monday's rout, it seems as though the buyers are scare for the long maturities, mostly in view of what steve was talking about. politics, it's an election year, and believe me, that debt deficits and servicing debt at a trillion dollars is going to be abongoing story, so the focus of that political camera is going to be on debt. and that's why these auctions matter. >> indeed. at least stocks are holding up bet they are time around. we saw the dow give up about a 500 point gain and it's hanging on to the rally. >> good news is good news today. i think that's what it is. jobless claims, the revision was at 250. but they came in lower. all the yields popped. equities are in the green. and i think today as yields move up, it isn't necessarily a poison pill for stocks, at least

not today. >> great point. and a reminder that if we start having a weak economy and the fiscal worries, it's like a double whammy, but when we're still growing everything is okay. rick, thank you. bank of america is out with a new consumer checkpoint this morning. they find americans are increasingly trying to stretch their dollars with spending growth and grocery and clothing stores focused on value products. that's outpacing the overall spending. they note an uptick in service spending last month, with a 27% year on year rise in spending in paris, and surrounding olympic cities. that was compared to the 23% bump that london got during 2012. for more, let's brig in my guest. liz, welcome. >> thank you. >> going back to the point rick was making about yields and stocks, it comes down to a strong and growing economy or what are the takeaways? >> i think there's a couple things. you look at the spending.

credit card spending numbers were strong in july. but they weren't deteriorating. i think that's an important distinction. down 0.4, but in june, they were down 0.5. again, it's not deteriorating. >> year on year or month oh month? >> that was year on year. month on month ticked up 0.3. so i'm feeling not the sky is falling. what is important to look at is the consumer spending growth has been tracking inflation as inflation has come down. and why i think that matters, you look at the overall cti, it includes things like shelter that people aren't putting on their cards, but if you dig into what i call the card centric category, gas, airlines, hotels, we are seeing prices falling there. so it does make some sense that you would see the total card spending also come out without a big cause of concern. >> in other words, volumes might be the same.

>> in fact, we are seeing the volumes essentially be flat top of that 1%. so that is something that is important to look at. you brought up another point which is key, when we look at the breakdowns within categories, like grossers, like apparel, which are what i'll call the card centric categories where we are not seeing prices falling, we are seeing a greater shift to value brands. so people are not necessarily feeling as hunky doery, and therefore are trying to make their dollar go further and see some of that growth. >> it all makes sense. a lot of people are joking today, what about the emergency fed rate cuts everyone was calling for on monday, but this all to me is part of the same story. it's a story of shift to value, feeling pressure, maybe excess savings running out. i don't see why the fed shouldn't cut in that environment. >> to make a critical comment about this segment, you're

underselling it. there are traders on the edge of their seat, so hungry for economic data. >> true. >> we are in a data desert right now, to the point where what rick was talking about, did you see what happened? i have never seen the ten-year move the way it moved on a jobless claims this morning. >> it was a great data point. now it's become a top tier -- >> jobs and gdp all together with a big swing because we're desperate to know. was friday the right signal, was the rebound the right signal? we don't know. so anybody that comes in and says -- very smart with this, liz was saying the idea of being careful when you see things declining in this disinflationary environment. it could mean a layer in my segment is things are weird because it's political season and people have different attitudes going on. so i think my read of what --

how the fed read what's happened was, i'm going to take a step back and fold my arms and take a deep breath and i'm not going to panic here. i have indicated as the fed that i'm ready to move in september. how much i move is contingent upon the data. i will point out tomorrow morning, we have our retail monitor. i don't think it's going to look a whole lot different from liz's, but i can't give it up right now. next week, we have the retail sales report. the big news is going to be thursday's jobless claims. until we start to get more serious data. i'm sorry to be critical. >> thank you. i like that backhanded compliment. but two pieces of critical data. friday, the first thing our team said, what's driving unemployment, is this because we're seeing more people file? and the answer is, in bank of america data, the number of household that are getting unemployment is up slightly. i mean, slightly off of very low

numbers. so we are not seeing it as high. >> we had an influx of workers into the workforce on friday, there was also an increase in the unemployed. the deconomy will be tested in the sense of, these folks will come in, can we put them to work? >> the hiring rate is slowing. if one thing that would solve our problems, an upswing in new hiring. >> but what else helps is people's wages go up of people that are employed. they continue to go up, and in fact, across lower, middle and higher income households, all went up. lower income households are growing the fastest. what is is the fed going to do about it? >> the lower house incomes went from 3.1 to 3.2. higher income households are at

1.5%. last year, they were flat or down, because we had a lot of layoffs. >> we kept talking about the white collar recession. >> one quick word, a wonderful use of high frequency data, where the private sector and their data can fill in gaps not provided by the government. give us a heads up on what's happening and something else to think about when the retail sales report comes out. i imagine liz's data that it's not revised because it's actual data. the census next week will give us partial survey data, which is not where they're filling in some gaps. they're trying to move away from that, god bless them. >> shothers are trying to blame this on a new cycle effect, saying we saw retail pull back, but consumers are waiting for the outcome of november. >> i don't know about that.

i think you are seeing a little bit of hesitation because the consumers, the amount of money they have in their checking and savings accounts has come down. it's still 40% above where it was before the pandemic. >> how about by income group? >> i didn't break that down. but what we have seen is it's higher for lower income, because higher income people are moving out to the market, or in fact, we see a big uptick in moving out to cds. but, again, it's still a lower level than it has been in quite sometime. so you might be thinking, i need to stretch my dollar, because your deposit balances seem lower. >> we probably got about a 15% cushion still to go. >> in your checkings and savings account. but it's always hard to estimate what is that excess savings if you moved it from your checking account to a cd, but that's still there. >> in a pinch. you're happy to pull that out.

>> thank you both so much. we appreciate it today. especially in a much-needed data desert. stocks are rallying on the back of that stronger data this morning, but it's just one point, could be a head fake. my next guests join me now. nancy, i'll start with you. twok you both. what do you make of this market? >> well, i'm hoping that this is the correction that we have been waiting for and needed. you know, we get one every 12 months. we get 5% pullbacks kind of two to three a year. we have been running, you know, just kind of straight up. so it's good for the market to take a breather. i still think we're in a bull market. i know there's a lot of people in the bear market camp, and that's what makes the market.

based on my experience and analogy to the '90s, there are so many commonalities, not the least of which is this recent knockdown due to the yen carry trade. so you pick your spots. you use the volatility as your long-term investors, volatility is your friend. so we will be picking away to either trim, which we did in early july, or new names. we are adding a new name this week. >> so you still like, for instance, in amazon, an uber, are those places you're looking? >> yeah. you get an opportunity with amazon, because the earnings were disappointing. to some, and the cap ex spending was disappointing. but operating income is up, margins were up, aws was up 19%. so we're going to use the weakness to add to holdings across our strategy. and we think this is one of those opportunities that you get every couple of years, because the cap ex budget is up.

and that tends to -- here's a little take. one man's increase in cap ex spending is another company's increase in revenue. >> exactly. sl as long as the numbers all add up. i like how you make the point that the confusion we all feel. pepsi and p&g showed a weakening with the consumer. bra brandon, where would you be, where are you putting capital to work? >> thanks for having me. certainly this whole pause that we got here was a wakeup call to the market. that ai momentum trade that's taken a bit of a breath here. we like things that are over on the consumer space right now. we're not going all in on consumer staples, but there's some strong names there. again, with just kind of this one-way trade, markets don't always go up every single day for two years as they have for the prior two years. so it's a good time for people to reassess their portfolio.

we like some spaces in staples. so both of those areas tend to be one of those places to you haveset this tech growth that people have had. >> this gives me a chance to go on a rant. i look at the consumer staples, grant it, a lot of this is coke and that's a unique story. but a lot of the rest of these names are trading at all-time highs, when consumers are looking and spending for things on sale, on value. we have heard from some individuals talk about how they need to do more on markdowns, and i don't know why you would want to be exposed to companies that are going to face topline pressure. >> sure. from a staple standpoint, if you look at a general mills in particular, they have a wide array of product, trying to value chain. yes, consumers are looking deeper in their pockets. as americans, we love to spend our money as much as we can.

so that discretionary element is starting to fade away as people have less and less of their disposable income. from a staples perspective, when you think about some of these, you need the general things for your home health care, for personal care. those sort of things are things people continue to spend on. what people will always spend money on is premium pet food. they have the blue buffalo brand, people will not give that up. they care for their pets. >> okay, i know this is going to be a pet play, and everyone is like, i'll sacrifice my feel before my pet's. nancy, can you weave that into your outlook, what do you do on consumer staples? >> well, so we own walmart. and that's kind of the poster child of our investing them of companies that have pivoted to the new technologies. we told proctor and gamble.

i know it's at an all-time high, but it's 30% behind the market over five years. so if you no longer have pricing opportunity, then you are going to see a contraction in margin. full disclosure, we open wn pep. it's been a difficult day. i used to start every day with a handful of cheetos. my colleagues call them nancy tanglers. but they were so expensive i gave them up. these companies are trading at 21, 24 times. i would rather own microsoft, which is growing earnings at 16%, trading at 31 times. so we're looking to other places, powered with another name i brought to the show that we have been adding to. we owned it. they had great earnings. it got clobbered. so we'll be buying more. >> qantas was our mystery chart, as well.

brandon, hopefully you're not indulging in cheetos. nancy, brandon, thank you for your time today. appreciate it. markets in a better mood after that data. coming up, he's been called the conscious of capitalism, advising three presidents from both parties. now he has new data about people's biggest worries in this economy. he joins us next with his take on the upcoming election. what if you could trade the jobs report or housing starts, if you think they're going to beat or miss. international brokers buys event contracts related to the economy and climate. the chairman will join us with the latest on demand. we look forward to checking in with him soon. "the exchange" is back after this. >> this is "the exchange" on cnbc. ♪ that colonoscopy for getting screened ♪ ♪ is why i'm delaying ♪ ♪ i heard i had a choice ♪ ♪ i know the name, that's what i'm saying ♪

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designed to balance growth and guaranteed income. because doors were meant to be opened. michigan is one of the tightest races in the senate this year, and the debate over ev manufacturing is front and center. emily wilkins has a closer look at the stakes. emily? >> reporter: well, there is debate not only about evs but how much the government should support the industry. democratic nominee congressman backs the tax credits for those buying evs and billions for charging stations and manufacturers. policies that match what

automakers say they need as they transition to manufacturing evs. >> it may have been politicized more recently, but this movement, if you look across the world and at markets, these are the car companies saying we have to keep up with the times. >> reporter: yet republicans, including mike rogers, have proposed eliminating the tax credit and joverturning an epa regulation that would require half of all vehicles sold to be evs. >> there's probably a lot better ways that we can spend that money to get to where we want to go for that clean, affordable energy that has a better impact. >> reporter: ceo of the detroit regional chamber told me that while ev purchases have slowed, the industry needs to prepare for a shift to evs in the next 20 years. >> if we can't get to the right

volumes fast enough, our companies will continue to lose money on evs. we want them to make money on evs. i hope any politician of any party would want michigan's auto companies to make money off of their evs and not delay that transition. >> reporter: congress is already getting ready for a tax debate next year, and whoever wins the senate race could have a major say in whether ev credits are kept in place or cut. kelly? >> and there's the angle of chinese companies and the competition as their evs might bring. i'm curious how that's playing in here. >> reporter: it a es a very serious concern, and you're hearing it from both candidates. mike rogers at the rnc say manufacturing evs was like to get into bed with communist party china. alyssa had a provision in a house bill that would prevent evs made in foreign companies being on military bases.

but a lot of chinese technology is beyond where the u.s. is, so you're seeing manufacturers here in detroit partner with chinese companies trying to catch up. so a lot is trying to strike that balance. folks said yes, there are serious kens, but there needs to be a partnership. so you've seen some tariffs with biden on chinese evs to see what kind of policies the next administration might bring about and whether congress might make changes to make it more difficult for evs from chinese companies and other companies to enter into the u.s. market. >> emily, thank you very much. we're serving up lots of alternative economic data. my next guest has served under three sitting presidents in democratic and republican administrations. and with the economy issue number one right now, his company, operation hope, released the results oh of a survey, finding nearly 38% of respondents say they are most

concerned about the cost of everyday goods. this is the first time that overtook personal debt, which came in at 26%. reflecting the pressure of inflation on households. joining me now is john hope bryant. great to have you here. to be able to shine a light on what is going on with american's financial situations, how would you describe it? >> well, i'm honored to be here with you. i think that every election -- you're seeing people confused about where the hope is coming from. on top of that, the cost of living has gone up because coming out of the pandemic, we had all the stimulus, and trying to take the froth off the economy by raising interest rates. now you need more income.

when the signal is ei is bad aand helping people at the bottom and middle feel there is no hope for them. so you have a combination of not thriving like they used to be, not believing the future is bright. and interest rates have gone up. there's a solution here, and it is inclusion. if you get the credit scores up bec the cost of short-term debt can go down because you're getting the best cause of the funds available. and some cities, some states have done that better than others. your region is one of the tops in the country, which is new york and that whole area. interestingly enough, minnesota, minneapolis, the top state in

the country. >> so you also do a lot of work on the housing front, that is a huge factor into whether people can afford to put a roof over themselves. you have residential homes for instance. are rents cooling, and are we finding that housing is becoming more affordable than it was at the worst of the pandemic a couple of years ago? >> rents are cooling a bit. i think we need more supply. go back to the very good question you made -- mentioned a moment ago. i also want to note our survey showed that those in the middle, those making $100,000 a year, are living paycheck to paycheck 27% of those. so this is folks who --

everybody needs financial literacy, which is my main issue. so going back to the affordability issue. if the president wanted to shine a bright light for the future, the one thing is making affordability -- home afford bilabi ability more afordable. if you're a first-time home buyer, you have financial counseling and you can hold them to this unique financing, that would make a generation of affordability for an entire generation. there are tools there for the biggest economy in the world, we just need to use them. >> why not go to a 40-year

mortgage? i hear your support for harris, but the biden and harris administrations come out with rent control-esque policies which often backfire. i'm curious what you would prefer to see a better way of bringing relates down in a more long-lasting and impactful manner? >> yeah. more supply. supply and demand. i do think that the market generally speaking, i don't like forcing things like rent restrictions. i would rather see other inventory come on line that brings down the cost of overall availability. i would like to see more home ownership available from those owning properties as i used to do when i owned one of these companies, give you a chance to rent to own. so if you rent a property and you pay your rent on time, some

of your rent may go to attribute to a fund to allow you to become a homeowner. these banks are providing decent programs. sometimes at below market rates. i do believe there are other tools that are available. i don't want to send a signal that somehow america is not a free democracy. it's important for markets to work, and only in a worst case scenario where markets refuse to work, then you should use things like rent restrictions. >> right, exactly. you helped when they called on you in covid, with a little bit of a push when needed. john, great to have you on today. thanks for bringing us these results and giving us more things to think about as we figure out what's going on with the economy. >> my pleasure. my candidate is america by the way. >> amen. go, america.

and we're cleaning up in the olympics. john hope bryant, operation hope. thank you very much. still ahead, apple is on pace for its worst week since april after monday's big reveal that berkshire sold half its stakes. st wh . ayitus ♪(voya)♪ there are some things that work better together. like your workplace benefits and retirement savings. voya provides tools that help you make the right investment and benefit choices. so you can reach today's financial goals and look forward to a more confident future. voya, well planned, well invested, well protected. (reporters) over here. kev! kev! (reporter 1) any response to the trade rumors, we keep hearing about? (kev) we talkin' about moving? not the trade, not the trade, we talking about movin'. no thank you. (reporter 2) you could use opendoor. sell your house directly to them, it's easy. (kev) ... i guess we're movin'. shopify's point of sale system helps you sell at every stage of your business. with fast and secure payment. card readers you can rely on. and one place to manage it all. whatever the stage, businesses that grow grow

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welcome back to "the exchange." i'm tyler mathisen with your news update. donald trump is reconsidering next month's debate with kamala harris. sources tell nbc news trump might not have a choice if vice president harris declines other offers because he has to get her to speak. meanwhile, the harris campaign said she will be at a debate regardless for a chance to speak with the primetime national audience. the world federation of advertisers is discontinuing its global alliance for responsible media initiative after elon musk's x filed an anti-trust lawsuit against it. in an email to members, the ceo

said the organization will contest the allegations in the court and is confident of the outcome. and david copperfield has been sued for allegedly destroying his new york city condo. the suit filed tuesday by the buildings board accuses him of causing over $2 million to the building. his representative said it was a simple insurance claim. "thexcng rur ehae"etns after this. we're going to disappear. we'll be right back.

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welcome back. shares of interactive brokers are up nearly 40% this year. the brokerage has about 3 million accounts, of which over 2 million wrbelong to retail investors who can buy and sell forecast contracts on economic indicators, including gdp and the jobs report. they're called forecast x, and it went live a week ago. and interactive founder and chairman joins us now with a first on cnbc interview. great to have you here. welcome.

>> it's wonderful to be here. thank you. >> what's the back story? was this a long time in coming or a relatively recent idea? >> so, we have been working on this for three years now, but we just finally received permission from the cftc to start. what is can you do and what can't you do? what should retailers or any investors expect? >> well, we can basically lease economic indicators and climate indicators, and that potentially some other things but not election related or political content. >> it's so funny to me that you can do fed funds and unemployment and global temperature. and so people are betting on what they think the temperature is going to be, as well? >> well, you see these xis existential questions, climate

change and the national debt are the two most important questions of our times. and it is the long-long-term constructs going out ten years, and we play the closing price every day of 4.38% currently. >> got it. so it's to get at these larger concerns that people have, a way to bet on them one way or the other. what's the take? how big do you expect these to be, and there are some -- they are predicted in these political betting sites, i'm not sure what the deal is there, but how big do you think this product could get? >> i think it's going to be huge when people realize these are real existential questions. what is going to be the national debt ten years down the road? what is going to be the global temperature or sea levels,

carbon content of the air? these are very important questions, and we better come to a consensus on these issues. otherwise, it may be ending up in a bad place. >> so if i were to put $1,000 down and i wanted to buy on something many years ahead of now, is that contract not going to settle for that whole period of time, or meant to be traded every day? >> it is not going to settle for ten years, but you receive interest every day on the closing of your contract. so if you buy the contract say at 20 cents on the dollar, and over time it goes up to 80 cents on the dollar, you are saving interest daily on the 80 cents. so it is a very dig difference. >> what is the most popular economic contracts out of the gate so far? >> so it's unemployment rate, housing starts.

these are the most popular currently. but i think on the long run, it is going to be the national debt and climate related contracts. >> could other brokers and providers come into this business, as well? >> of course, of course. this is a forecast ex-change, cftc approved exchange. any broker, any futures commission merchant can join the exchange. >> a final question, just as we have experienced this weekend a number of platforms having l log-on issues and so on, is that because they have become so digital or a ticker provider catching things up, can you shed light on this situation? >> interactive brokers did not have -- well, it's the high traffic that impacted other brokers. they are not used to it, they

don't have the band width for that much traffic. >> are you going to bet on global temperature and national debt on this platform? >> i would love to, but unfortunately given that i'm associated with the exchange, i'm not allowed to. >> i understand. thomas, thank you for joining us here to explain it. we would love to start feature thing data ourselves to show people what the market thinks. we appreciate you adding this to the conversation. >> that's great. thank you very much. coming up, stocks are near session highs, even after that nasty 30-year auction, the nasdaq is up nearly 3%, the dow up 600. n'gonyckft ts. dot awhere.

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apple is rolling out its new a.i. tools this fall. as of now features free for any u.s. users with its latest devices but some analysts say may not be the case for long.

today's "techcheck." what do you think about that? >> apple already said, kelly. these a.i. features are going to be free as long as you have the correct hardware like an iphone 15 pro or newer mac computers. the question, how does apple actually make money on artificial intelligence? cnbc put out a story asking a bunch of analysts and they think apple to eventually charge for some a.i. features. $20 a month seems to the price. companies like iba.i. and anthropic charge. near-term apple is banking on a.i. driving hardware sales especially the iphone. that business slumping the last several quarters, of course. apple's earnings call last week ceo tim cook asked about the services business and cook didn't have much to say. but he did say a.i. is a good reason to upgrade to the new iphone expecting next month.

that theory tested with the iphone 16 launch plus other a.i. phones from google just as soon as next week. apple likely won't need to pass costs of a.i. on to customers just yet. keep in mind to they trained a.i. relatively cheaply using googling processors, not nvidia. and using their own chips, the same in mac computers and servers to process the a.i. queries. that's not the same as openai, anthropic and the rest. those running very expensive processes on a partner's cloud like from google, amazon or microsoft. all said, one thing to watch on the services front developers. they have their hands on apple intelligence tools and perhaps integrating with a.i. will drive more app store sales. for now services is doing quite amazing without apple intelligence boost. up 14% in the june quarter and expect similar growth in the september quarter. >> can't wait to see what happens. thank you, steve kovach.

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