get a free month supply plus free shipping on all bundles at live human.com. >> goldilocks needs. >> a place. >> of. >> her. >> own and fast. >> thankfully, she's. >> on redfin. >> they update their listings every two. >> minutes, and with so many. >> options. >> she's. >> bound to find. exactly what. >> bound to find. exactly what. >> she wants. what tractor supply customers experience is personalized service. made possible by t-mobile for business. with t-mobile's reliable 5g business internet. employees get the information they need instantly. this is how business goes further with t-mobile for business. >> and welcome. >> to power lunch. it's not. >> all bad. >> some recovery. >> today after yesterday's. >> deep sea, deep cut to some big. >> tech and energy stocks. but did the tech.

>> rattle rattle you? should it? we're going to ask the man some call. >> the dean of valuations. did the deep. >> tech news change. >> the power demand story. >> two big. >> companies make. >> it. >> a big deal. today we're going. >> to tell. >> you who. >> and why. >> and oh yes. >> kelly the federal reserve it. >> is their. >> first meeting. >> of. >> the year. >> and it. >> kicks off. >> with the fed. >> whisperer himself. >> david zervos. here with his hot take. >> looking forward to that as always. tech stocks are bouncing back after yesterday's big sell off, leading the market with a 1.7% gain. we're up about three quarters of a percent on the s&p, a quarter percent for the dow. and nvidia is bouncing back about 6 or 7% this afternoon. it's seen some steady gains throughout the session today. and look at this market cap back above 3 trillion. that said, it comes after it shed $589 billion in market value yesterday, the biggest one day loss for any market cap for any single stock. brian. >> wow. now market momentum. we all know it's a powerful force. i mean to your point. >> look at nvidia.

>> to see how momentum. >> can cut. >> both ways. >> the bigger a stock is the more it can move markets. and etfs. right nvidia. >> is in hundreds of etfs. >> when it. moves the market moves. and that means also that when a stock gets kneecapped, billions. can disappear in minutes as kelly just mentioned. >> and maybe this. >> is a good rbi. >> random and interesting kelly. yesterday's drop by. >> nvidia was the single. >> greatest day. >> market cap loss. >> by any one company in the history of the world. nvidia lost more investor value in one trading session than any company in history. that's a heck of a stat. but of course it also hopefully nvidia has made. >> you very. >> very rich as prices. >> have moved up. >> or down. valuations have. also moved more energy. many energy stocks like vistra and constellation yesterday wiping out most, if not all of their ai valuation gains. >> but what. >> does it mean for. >> the macro market? >> let's talk. about all of it. joining us now to kick things off. some man that some call

the. >> dean of. >> valuations. >> nyu stern school of business, professor aswath. >> damodaran aswath. good to have you on the program yesterday. it was a really. >> weird. >> day because a lot of stocks got crushed, but most stocks actually went higher. it was a big rotation. what are you seeing on the valuation story? >> you know, if you didn't have this much money at play, this would be an absolutely fascinating exercise and experiment because i've never seen a story kind of change this much over a weekend. let's go back to last friday. the wisdom was. >> that i. >> was going to be this incredibly big business, and the only way you could be in ai was by investing huge amounts in the most powerful chips, mostly made by nvidia. you had to have data centers that were immense. lots of data. with the power and the energy needs coming in. and then all of this would allow these companies that invested in ai to make immense amounts of money on ai products and services. i

mean, this is like the emperor's new clothes. i mean, deep sea, you know, if you get past the distractions of is it better than chatgpt, is it downloaded more ultimately shakes that story because it says, look, a big segment of ai, at least the products and services don't need those powerful chips. yeah, they don't need the data. so in many ways, that's exactly what you're seeing playing out is that is that effect. >> i guess. the question backing it up just a second. >> aswath the. question that i would ask is, does the market. >> need ai? >> does the market need nvidia? >> in other. >> words. >> if we don't. >> have the ai. >> story. >> let's let's assume deep seek is real. seven hamsters and duct tape are now the. new ai. okay, let's assume that. >> i don't think it is. >> but let's assume it's real. >> does the market. >> then have to fall. >> because the valuations are all built on this ai story. >> it has to give up some gains. you can't have a stock which is three, 3.5 trillion.

collectively, there are companies that have built off the ai ecosystem that probably are, you know, 5 or 6 trillion in value. some of that value is going to go away. i mean, you can't make it up by having i mean, imagine how much other companies would have to go up to make up for that difference. there's no way around the fact that the market has to adjust to the bringing down of the ai dream. i mean, let's be in the, the contradictory effect of deep sea, because it's actually made it more likely that you and i will be more will will see more ai products and services be accessible for us. what it's changed is the monetization. it makes it more likely that a big chunk of the ai market is going to be commoditized, low margin businesses where you essentially you're not going to make tons of money. it's good news for consumers in the long term. but along the way, we've got to prune some of the valuations we built up because we thought all these companies would be money machines. >> i like us what the way that you say the deep seek effect will be that the ai market is

both bigger and less profitable at the same time. but i wonder if the way to think about it is that it shifts the profits, and the profits are not so much going to the mega power companies, and maybe they are, but the market's telling you yesterday it has to question that thesis, but that the profits might actually be going to software. look at salesforce up 5% today to the deployers of ai and the ones who are going to capture margin that way as it becomes commoditized. >> some of the profits are going to other companies, but a great deal is going to go to consumer surplus. and that's why i said it's ultimately good news for us as consumers. i mean, imagine going back 20 years, you know, look at retail being disrupted by online retail is the biggest beneficiaries there. and not just amazon and the other online retail companies. it's you and i in terms of being able to buy stuff at way below what we would have been able to pay if online retail were not there. so it's a fascinating changing of the story. and to be honest, now i, i, i'm actually glad to see some of the ai blowhards being

brought down to earth, because the way they sold the story was just that they broke. no, no, no stopping them. they just they just went crazy with the story. and this i think, is, is the emperor essentially being revealed to having no clothes. and that, i think, is an adjustment we've got to get used to. >> right. and i so from that point of view, the valuation question shifts a little bit. and we say, okay, so what is the appropriate valuation for some of these power and utility stocks. what is the appropriate valuation for the software space. what is the appropriate i mean the nvidia questions are maybe a little bit more difficult to ask. maybe maybe what is the appropriate valuation for chip stocks and for other components into making ai. >> the collective investment architecture after deep tech is going to be smaller than it was before. how much smaller? we haven't figured it out. that's going to affect the companies that feed into the architecture, the chip companies, the energy companies, the i mean, the companies that cool those data centers. there's a whole

ecosystem. the next layer, of course, are the companies that spent the money on ai. and there are some big tech companies in that space. and half of the nvidia chips are sold to the four big tech companies. some of them today are probably having buyer's remorse. did we have to spend 65 billion? they're never going to say it right. they can afford to take the loss. but i think that the beneficiaries of the companies that went slow in a strange way, while people were jumping on apple for being slow to the game of not jumping in. this is an affirmation that tim cook was actually on the right track is saying, let's wait, this is too early. we're not going to spend tens of billions of dollars when we haven't quite figured out what we're going to make out of this. so i think it's a it's good in that sense of not jumping into a trend just because it's happening and starting to spend money before you even know what you will make out of it. >> all right. >> aswath for joining us today. we appreciate it. it's always good to see you. aswath damodaran with nyu. >> all right. the white. >> house ordering a.

>> freeze on federal aid. >> and some. >> breaking news. >> to get to the white house. and meghan costello and more. >> hey, guys. just wrapping up a long and newsy first press briefing of the second administration, second trump administration. and the biggest topic by far was this freeze on federal spending that the office of management and budget directed to federal agencies last night that seemed at first to be freezing all federal spending. press secretary caroline leavitt came out and said any funding that is direct aid to individual americans would not be affected. and she listed some examples, those examples of things not affected included social security, medicare and welfare benefits. but when she was asked specifically about medicaid, she said she would have to get back to us. now, some individual lawmakers and states, including florida and connecticut, are both out there saying on social media that medicaid programs in their states and systems have been shut down. so a lot of confusion out there right now on medicaid and a lot of discussion still about whether that type of aid will be frozen under this program. a couple other news highlights from this briefing. i

want to bring you. the first question was about deep seek and whether the president sees anything fishy or what his reaction was to deep seek. the press secretary, caroline, said that he sees this, saying it should be a wake up call to u.s. ai companies, but that trump believes in restoring ai dominance and that he's already taken some steps in that direction. asked specifically on the national security implications of deep sea, she said she was in touch with security officials inside the white house about that, but no further updates on that at this point. and then finally, just on tariffs, she was asked what the prognosis is or what the update is on when tariffs are coming in. caroline leavitt tells us that the february 1st deadline that the president has spoken about for tariffs on canada, mexico and china, that that still holds. she says that as of last night when she was speaking with the president directly on tariffs, that that was still on the books was her wording, but nothing more specific in terms of whether or what canada or mexico could offer. so more to watch on that front, guys. i'll toss it back over to you. >> yep. with the date coming up on saturday, feb one, we could

see those tariffs go into effect. megan. thanks. now it's the first day of the fed's big meeting concludes tomorrow. powell and company bring us their decision at that point. but our power lunch mock fed is making the call today. and today's chair david zervos today's chair david zervos reveals their decision next. power e*trade's easy-to-use tools, like dynamic charting and risk-reward analysis, help make trading feel effortless. and its customizable scans with social sentiment help you find and unlock opportunities in the market. e*trade from morgan stanley. ♪♪ with powerful, easy-to-use tools power e*trade makes complex trading easier. react to fast-moving markets with dynamic charting and a futures ladder that lets you place, flatten, or reverse orders so you won't miss an opportunity. e*trade from morgan stanley (traffic noises) (♪♪) the road to opportunity. is often the road overlooked. (♪♪)

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in the average household, there are dozens of connected devices. connectivity is a big part of my boys' lives. it brings people together in meaningful ways. 24 hours we get the fed's next decision on interest rates. first one of the year. last week the president demanded they drop rates immediately during his speech out in davos. let's check in with our fed to see how they feel about that. six of our seven panelists voted for no change this time. don peebles once again wants that 50 basis point cut. all roads point back to chair powell as investors gear up for what he'll say at the press conference tomorrow. for more on all of this, let's bring in one of our fed panelists. i think we said he was the chair this time. i don't know where that comes from, but i'm fine with it. if you'd like to accept the honor, welcome.

might be the nice chair i'm sitting in here. kelly. >> i don't. cathedral. >> he's the. >> chair, man. >> that's right. you're the chair man. that's what you are. you voted for no change. why? >> so? i think the market's set up for it. i think they've they've got no reason to sort of get aggressive right here. they've they've prepped the market for it. why would you change it at this point i am sympathetic to don's idea that we have, i think, a much lower neutral rate than many in the market or on the committee think is out there that we're kind of going back to neutral rates at 2019 levels. we've articulated that in a lot of our research related to the balance sheet. but, you know, it's early days. we can wait. let's get a few more better, a few more cpi, pc data prints that feel good or a little bit of weakness on the payroll side. and i think we can resume again and get moving lower, which is where where i believe we're headed this year. and i think that will be quite supportive for risk assets. get

moving lower. that's where we're headed this year. that would be good for you know, not many people are feeling very confident on that branch right now. why do you think that is still the way things are going to evolve? >> i you know, i, i think the argument that we made two years ago, kelly, that policy wasn't that restrictive because the balance sheet was so large and that was pressuring stimulus into the system, residual stimulus into the system. from all that qe that's gone, the balance sheet is now at $6.8 trillion. it's getting close to 20% of gdp where it was where it was before covid. so all that storyline that kept us in the higher for longer camp when everybody else was pushing for massive cuts is reversed. and so we're on the other side of the market. and you know what? i liked being on the other side of the market two years ago, and i like being on the other side of the market today. it always feels good to be out of the consensus. >> what about tariffs? >> you know, i'm just. not so worried about them. i'm not worried about the tariffs. i'm not worried about the immigration. i think what the

president did with columbia was an amazing geopolitical strategy. and that's more of what we're going to see with tariffs. although he does seem to like the idea of raising revenue and more revenue with tariffs. he keeps talking about mckinley. and he had a pretty powerful speech down here in florida last night, really, really pushing that almost zero income tax idea. i don't know if we'll go there. but again, i just think the market's overplayed the tariffs and the market's overplayed. the immigration and the fiscal problems because he risks and they've underplayed actually what the president said last night which is deregulation. that's the big story. you know it's the first time i heard him say this. but he said he's pulled ceos consistently about would they rather have tax cuts or would they rather have deregulation. and he says over the years and over all of his discussions in the past, administration and then currently in the lead up to this election and the win, they've all told him one thing less regulation is always preferable to lower tax rates. if you if you had to make the choice. and

i think that's the biggest story and it's just a huge positive for business sentiment. well, you know, we don't talk about it. >> much david. >> but you travel. >> the world right. and so you get the global view. and i know. >> we got the fed meeting. >> today and tomorrow and the whole big thing. i'm looking forward. >> to getting. >> back to the. >> fed after, i don't know like eight years. but that aside, what's happening in europe. because all i'm. looking at is a german stock market that's going up, up, up. we're worried about. ai powered. >> they don't have any. i really don't have anything. >> to worry about. and their borrowing costs are way lower than ours. >> i feel like there's. >> like more opportunity in europe than there is here. right now. well, you know, a lot of that, brian, can be traced to the strength of the dollar, the weakness of the euro that always propels a stock market higher gives them a competitive advantage. i think that story is important. we're almost at parity between the euro and the dollar. so that's given them a nice a nice tailwind. and their disinflation story has been more aggressive than ours, which really opens up, i think, more

optimism on rate cuts going forward. and we're probably seeing that in the uk as well. so i think that's where that relative optimism, i wouldn't get so excited about taking your hard earned capital and giving it to the less capital friendly governments of europe. i just don't think they treat capital as well as we do. and historically, that's why there have been lower, and that's why it's been hard to make money relative to deploying that capital in the us, in europe for more than, you know, more than many decades. fair enough. i don't think that's changed 100%. 100% agree. >> with everything you just said because as always. >> it is accurate. >> i'm just pointing out this year, the. >> last few months. >> we've seen some european markets do a little bit better. and me wonders is. >> that because. >> they're at 2.5 or whatever on the german ten. year and. >> we're at. >> 4.6 and we don't. >> know what. >> they're going to. >> do in terms of interest rates. >> but you probably do. >> well, i'll tell you. but i would actually be pretty optimistic on the south of

europe, i think italy, greece, spain, portugal, these are places that don't have the same manufacturing malaise and issues that the north faces, particularly with the suspension of russian energy and just the changes that have taken place in the geopolitical landscape via china. and there's just, you know, we're all going to go on vacation in europe if we're a parody to the euro, the place, you know, the places people will travel will not be dusseldorf, they will be mykonos, they will be rome, they will be lisbon. i think there's a really good southern european story. you've got leaders there like meloni, which is very friendly to the current administration. we've got a friend that's going to be the ambassador there. it looks like, from the united states, brian, that i could make that could make that even more interesting. i'm really positive on the south of europe, really positive. and i think people want to venture out of our, our recommendation of a us trade. i would be looking first to either

japan or to the south of europe. i think they both offer very interesting opportunities for risk assets. >> yeah, for. >> travel and for travel. where would you want to go? vacation. >> should we go to capri. >> or cologne? >> yeah. >> hard call there. i think that's a pretty easy call. i think it's. >> a pretty dark and. rainy or. yeah. >> anyway. >> go to cologne. i'll go to cologne then. i'll see. i don't want to go to capri. >> it's too. oh, i don't want to go to capri either. you know, beachy. like i even don't have any beaches. it's all rocky. all right? there's other places, kelly. >> there's sunny david. thanks. appreciate it david. >> always a pleasure, guys. >> jeffrey's the chairman. >> by the way. >> the very. >> nice bartender at the. >> marriott in cologne. >> ted marriott. you went to cologne and you were at the marriott. >> ted. >> you think i'm joking? i'm not. all right on deck. bonds may be boring. but coming up, we're going to show you why. >> what bonds do. may be. >> critical to your stock money. they call it market navigator. and it's next.

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strategies. could the trump agenda impact inflation and the fed's next move? fed chair powell's crucial remarks and message to investors. power lunch tomorrow, 2:00 eastern. >> cnbc welcome back to power lunch with some green on the screen today for a change. the s&p up about 8/10 of a percent. the nasdaq nearly 2% dom. and that brings us to market navigator. >> all right so let's talk a little bit about the yield curve and what it's been doing and how to read the signs to profit in this kind of environment. now since last summer the 210 yield curve spread. short term long term yields right has been steepening consistently. that's a trend that picked up some steam after the presidential election. our next guest has thoughts on that. and also says that despite all the sell off in ai stocks, investors can still use that space to their advantage. so joining me now is john szilagyi, the ceo and co-founder of reflexivity, a firm that uses ai and machine learning to glean things about the market. so, john, take us through what you're seeing and

what your models are seeing and what it can mean for investors. >> yeah. >> hi. great. >> great to be on the show. as you already mentioned, reflexivity is purpose. and mission is really to monitor all sorts of developments in the vast space. >> of kind of market data points. and currently one of the more interesting. >> ones is the fact that, as you already mentioned, the yield curve has been steepening. >> in other words. >> i think investors are very clearly anticipating a period of. of higher economic growth. and also, as a result, higher. >> inflationary environment. >> and what the system is highlighting is that during. that period, the sectors that have tended to do by far the best are generally cyclical sectors. so things that you see outperform are real estate materials sectors also consumer discretionary and industrials. and the margin is. >> not small. >> they outperform. the kind of less exciting. >> sectors and less cyclical sectors like. >> utilities, healthcare and. >> so on by by.

>> 3 to 1. >> so it really is quite. >> a quite a big difference. again presumably not quite. >> not a huge surprise to veteran investors. but that is. >> the kind of the upshot on the on the. >> on the sector side. >> so if it's going to be cyclically oriented, economically growth oriented, what parts of the market do you think will or what does the data suggest will outperform in that kind of environment? you laid out some sectors, but if you were to place bets, where do you think the biggest octane boost comes from? >> yeah, i mean, i think presumably you are going to see actually. >> quite a lot. >> quite a lot of gains specifically on the kind of industrial and consumer discretionary side. >> i think. >> industrials are interesting to watch because we can see that there is a push on the side of the current administration already to really boost manufacturing. >> in particular in. >> the us. >> so i think you are going to find some interesting names there. >> without going into individual, individual stocks. i think that's the space absolutely to watch, because generally it's the less exciting. >> one for. >> a.

>> lot of investors. >> and the. >> the ones. >> again. >> to avoid. >> are then names in the utilities sector. with the caveat. and to the extent that we get to talk about it in a little bit of those that have exposure to ai. so obviously, the utility sector generally, as rates rise, those stocks underperform. but there will be exceptions like constellation energy and so on. >> yeah, i know you think you're sort of still in the camp. we're going to see a lot of adoption of this and be careful betting against it. >> i appreciate it. thank you very much for that. so what's interesting about that is that story about the utilities trade. that is one that's got a lot of people a little bit nervous right, about what exactly what it could mean. and is this a precedent for how much volatility there could be? >> we also heard the case for health care last hour, and the sector was up 2% yesterday. the steepening yield curve is a reminder, he says, to just be a little bit careful. it's kind of taking that too far right now. dom thanks. you got it, brian. >> all right. >> coming up. >> speaking of y, one energy ceo says. we may have gotten it all wrong about yesterday's big moves.

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for patriots.com. >> welcome back i'm julia boorstin with your. >> cnbc news update. >> israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu. >> says president. >> trump invited. >> him to a meeting. >> at the white house. >> one. >> week from today. >> it comes. >> as. >> the u.s. >> presses for the. continuation of a fragile ceasefire in gaza. >> that brought 15 months of fighting between. >> israel and hamas to a halt. >> the white house said year. >> were in part. >> authorized by. the federal aviation. >> administration for research and, quote. >> various other reasons. the large number of. >> unexplained nighttime sightings. eventually led to an faa. >> order banning drones. >> in the airspace. >> of several new jersey cities. >> and california governor gavin. newsom launched a fundraiser. >> today for los angeles fire recovery. >> l.a. rises. >> pledges to help affected communities rebuild. >> it was started today with a $100 million. >> donation from the dodgers. >> the district of palisades and eaton fires are now nearly 100%

contained. together, they destroyed more than 16,000. structures and claimed at least 29 lives. brian, back over to you. >> at least we know now the drones actually existed. julia boorstin. thank you very much. in the flesh. all right. >> let's talk. >> power with. >> one. >> of wall street's most powerful people. i get choked up just saying that. helima croft of rbc capital markets speaks to literally all the power players all over the world. on your way to dc. you stopped in to see us and we appreciate it. obviously, there's a lot to talk about. >> in fact, opec making kind. >> of a bigger move than we think yesterday. that aside, obviously the energy collapse i kind of the story i know you're not a stock person, but do you think what happened in the last 36 hours or so is going to fundamentally change the energy investment and infrastructure story in america? >> well, there was a question about were we having too lofty expectations. anyway about. >> power demand. >> because of ai. but if you think about the near-term story, it still looks very supportive. i mean, look at the situation when it comes to, you know,

whether i mean, if you think about what we've seen in terms of weather events here, in terms of the gulf coast, the south, if you look at what's happening in europe, colder than expected winter weather, we. still have, it looks like significant seasonal demand for natural gas. and we just have to wait and see how this story plays out on ai. >> okay. >> you pointed. >> this out to me and i want. >> to be clear, kelly, i have no idea what this means. >> it may. >> mean nothing. i want to make. >> that clear, but the. >> danish government. >> i know. >> the danish government. today in danish. >> so we used the. >> we used the english. >> we used the translate. and i'll. >> post. >> i think. >> i. >> posted. >> javier blasco bloomberg. >> originally posted it. >> great work by. >> him basically saying they're going to allow. >> russia to do some maintenance work. >> on the blown up nord stream. >> two pipeline. >> what does this possibly mean? >> this seems like a big deal. >> undisclosed maintenance work. >> and it. >> was so interesting because european governments were roundly saying, never again are we taking russian pipeline gas. and so the question is. >> is this because of.

>> environmental precautions? >> it could be. >> it could. >> be basically that's what the expectation is. but we also have a story out today talking about germany taking record lng imports from russia as well. now that is essentially blended lng. it comes via sort of france to germany. but there's a broader question about are we going to see more russian molecules making their way into europe, because you had a previous guest talking about germany. germany has suffered a lot economically because of their energy insecurity. >> i mean, listen, i was not privy to the danish reaction, but i take your point. so here's what i'm thinking about. i hear danish, i think, what's going on with greenland, right? i hear lng, and i think america is trying to clearly increase our presence in the economic situation of europe via gas, via literally whatever the situation may be. what's the big picture here? >> well. >> see, again, to be determined in terms of this danish story, but we have to stay on top of it. but president trump has been really adamant. europe, we want you. >> to take more. >> us lng, more.

>> u.s. energy. >> in general. so was this announcement sort of a subtle message to the united states about potentially like alternative suppliers. >> like you threatened to take greenland and we're going to go take more russian. >> by greenland, not take it. >> purchase. >> purchase the purchase agreement. so i think it's going to be very interesting to see like how energy becomes a broader bargaining chip when we think about, you know, china tariffs this china come in and basically say we're going. >> to buy a. >> lot of us lng as part of the negotiation. so how energy fits into these broader negotiations is going to be fascinating. >> how quickly opec. >> quietly his. >> royal highness saudi arabia they. >> put. >> out a picture of. >> the five. >> i think or. >> four of the. >> five founding members. i think we. >> have it today. >> there it is. >> that's the venezuelans. very tall. >> by the way. >> it's kuwait on the. >> far left. >> libya there, saudi arabia second from the right. >> what's going on with. >> this picture? >> uae i mean, the question is what are they discussing? and there were reports in saudi state media, they were discussing market stability. obviously we have a very interesting meeting or important

meeting coming up, the joint ministerial monitoring committee meeting of opec on monday comes against the backdrop of president trump saying opec lower prices. i want more oil. we have to wait and see what happens come monday. well, indications are looking to break up their agreement. >> though when you know let us know. >> and if you figure out what this denmark thing means let us know about. >> that as well. >> stay tuned. >> stay tuned in danish. >> thank you. helima croft. all right. >> why don't. we go ahead and. >> stay with. >> energy as well? >> because obviously that was the big. >> story with a lot of names. some are rebounding. you've got oslo and vistra. they are higher. >> but a little. >> bit. five and 6%. vistra lost 29% yesterday. >> on the upside or the downside i should say. >> constellation energy. >> and nextera. >> they're actually down again. >> nextera rose yesterday but constellation. >> did not. in the. >> meantime. >> chevron partnering with investment firm engine number one. and ge renova today to build natural gas powered power plants to run, you guessed it, data centers across america. heck of a timing for that deal to be announced. joining us now

to talk about all this and more is paul prager. >> he is. >> the ceo of. >> terra wolf. >> they're an infrastructure focused bitcoin mining company. they got nuclear assets. and the minute that not the minute, paul. but when all this stuff started happening yesterday, you texted me and basically said that we're kind of getting the story wrong. what did we get wrong? what did we miss? what did the financial markets cnbc whatever. what did we. miss about what. >> happened yesterday? >> sure. it's nice to be here. >> terra wolf is an energy infrastructure company, and we build state of the. >> art data. >> centers for. >> quality customers. >> first class credits. first thing we got wrong here was. >> the power markets. >> are. >> already tight, right? >> you have. >> retirements in the mid-atlantic. >> you have. >> industrial growth. in texas. >> you have a grid. >> that's currently burdened. >> you have. >> a new. >> administration which is going to reindustrialize. >> the united states. >> so even. >> without a demand, a massive. >> new demand for power. >> for data centers. power is already tight.

>> okay. second, not all power is created equal. >> at terra. >> wolf, we have power now. >> we have inexpensive. >> power, and we have green power. there's a big difference when. >> you're talking. >> about power. >> that's available for. delivery today, 12 months from now, 24 months from now, or 9 or 10 years from now. >> when you're talking about the smrs. >> yeah. so let me back it up because you're a tech expert. >> as. >> well, and i know you're going to speak your mind because on a great show that precedes. this one, it's called the exchange, 1. >> p.m. >> eastern time with kelly evans. kyle bass effectively said, in a way, kyle does that this this news out of china is probably garbage. it's probably not accurate. or if it is. there's more to it. do you believe that china has effectively figured out ai with like, you know, 5 million bucks and a couple people? >> no. >> but there's a. >> lot we. don't know. >> but i don't. >> think that. >> matters with respect to what. we are doing here in. >> the united states. >> right. >> their models may be more. >> energy efficient, but. >> in any event, the broader

adoption of ai leads to higher energy demand because. >> of increased. >> and higher consumption. they still run on. gpus in this particular case with. >> with with deep sea. >> it's reinforcement learning. but there's intense competition here in the united states. and that intense competition will be to be number one. and that drives demand for computational power, which requires substantial energy resources. >> so. >> paul. >> and by the way, we've heard analysts say, look, amidst all these power needs, companies that have kind of figured this out and could be a resource for this, the bitcoin miners. so, you know, i'm just trying to think through these cycles and the sort of people who are in these stocks, what do they have. they have earnings every quarter to worry about. what do you think this investment cycle is revenue cycle. whatever is going to look like for the next 4 to 6 quarters for the people who are in these stocks. >> i think. >> very exciting. >> listen, only two bitcoin mining companies.

>> made the leap. >> that's course. >> core scientific and. >> terra wolf. >> terra wolf is in a premier situation. >> we've got a. >> contract with c42 g42. >> g42 is. unbelievable credit. >> backed by mubadala. they're part if you will, of the mdx group. that that president trump talked about. >> in in. >> in stargate. so we have a contract with them. >> to, to. >> buy electricity to service a data center. >> we are building. >> for them at upper teens yield. and so that credit, the credit story hasn't changed. no matter what happens with deep sea or what comes out of china. and our customers are business as usual there at the site there with our partners dell and nvidia, they're working on how to build the best data centers and the customers that we don't have yet under contract, but that we've been talking to for the last nine months. they're still there. they're still intensively engaged in negotiations to sign a contract.

for new power. so i think the next 4 to 6 quarters are, are are ripe with opportunity if you've got the power and if it's at a low price, and if particularly if it's green power, which is what terra's story is. >> so the fact that we're moving from training to inferencing to possibly, you know, deep, deep, deep set aside this larger transition seems like it's one that would be somewhat less energy intensive than the first time around. or do you think that's wrong? and it will be equally or more so. >> i think it will be equally or more. so. there's no doubt that that deep seat relied on already built architecture. you don't know what was behind it, what's at the foundation of it. but energy infrastructure is the foundation of this entire industry, and it's intensely competitive right now. and the question is, i don't know where we're going to be in ten years because of the advancements and the algorithms and where data

centers get to in terms of, you know, artificial intelligence. but i can tell. >> you they're. >> still going to require power and they're going to require substantial power to get there. >> some people would argue that if the deep sea is real, we're going. >> to use more power because we're. >> going to have more ai. and so therefore it may not be as much power. >> per data center. >> i know you guys are building one up on the hard against the shores of lake ontario, but that if. >> it is actually. >> cheaper. >> then we're just. >> going to use more and energy consumption might remain. >> the same. >> greater adoption. >> means greater energy requirements. >> yeah. is that a bs thesis? >> no, i think greater adoption means greater energy requirements. but i, i don't know how far deep seek will get. but i know here in the united states, the companies who are focused on co-location, they require energy to advance their models. these are very sophisticated computational models that require substantial energy resources. and i think tara wolf is particularly well

situated because a we have a contract customer who's a world class credit, and b, we have power now. it's inexpensive power and it's green power. so i think we're in the right place at the right time. >> paul prager. ceo. >> tara wolf paul. >> always outspoken and we appreciate it. thank you. >> nice to. >> see you guys. >> and still to come, two time super bowl mvp eli manning joins us to talk. super bowl 59. the business of sports and very much more power lunch will be right back. >> crypto watch is sponsored by >> crypto watch is sponsored by crypto.com. ♪♪ ♪♪ ♪♪ ♪♪

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minutes. >> and that is. >> the fda. >> approving their weight. >> loss drug, ozempic for additional uses around kidney and heart. diseases in adults with. >> type two diabetes. >> interestingly, the shares are still lower, so a lot's been priced in to some of these names. novo is down nearly 2%, and the matchup for super bowl 59 is set. the eagles the philadelphia eagles will face the chiefs of kansas city, who are going for a record third straight super bowl win. joining us now is two time super bowl mvp. former new york giants star quarterback eli manning. he's at the eye connections global conference in miami beach. eli we're all new jersey people. we could have done this here and saved you the trip. >> i know i should have known, but it's great to be down here in miami, get a little warm weather. >> get away. >> from the cold. so i'm enjoying. >> the conference. >> here at ai connections. >> absolutely. so i confess i watched it a little bit on sunday, but then i see all this drama on social media around the refs and the calls. did something really happen that we should be concerned about, or do you think this is just like sour grapes?

>> yeah. >> i. >> think it was a great game. >> especially against the bills and the chiefs. both of these teams are deserving to be in that game. >> both of them could. >> have been deserving to make the super bowl. there's always. >> on the course. >> of a game. >> there's going. >> to be calls that could have gone. >> here. >> could have gone there, going. >> back and forth. as a matter of fact, it came down to the fourth quarter. they left it up. >> to the players. >> to make some of. >> the plays. and the bills had some opportunities. they had chances to the chiefs, they find. ways to. >> win close games. that's what they've. >> been doing all year. they have one of. the great. >> players of all time in patrick mahomes and two great coaches, andy reid, steve spagnola. on the. defensive side. >> so you. >> know they've been fun to watch. obviously going for three straight super bowls pretty impressive. >> they're amazing. look i've been on the bandwagon for a long time. that's all i do. i don't have a real team. i just hop on the bandwagon. but i still feel bad for josh allen because how do you. he can't even get to the super bowl. it's hard to get past them. listen, the super bowl and the success of the nfl right now is interesting because society has never been more fragmented. there's no breakthrough shows, really, and music stars and even the nba has

been struggling in recent years after they kind of had this strong period. what's the formula for success? what are they doing right? >> well. >> they just have they. >> have great players. >> they have a great product. >> and. you know. live events. >> is what it's all about. >> you have to either be there. >> live to watch. >> it. >> you. >> want to watch. >> it on tv. >> and so with. >> that, they're getting great. >> media rights. and the. game is very healthy. because the stars are doing. >> well. >> and playing well. >> they've done great things. >> in the. >> past years. >> making the game safer. so your biggest players. >> aren't missing. >> the big moments. >> and they're staying healthy and. >> playing. >> great at the. >> pivotal moments. >> and so it's a. >> great matchup. >> in. >> the super bowl. >> against kansas city. it's hard for me to say the eagles are in another super. >> bowl being in the nfc. >> east and the giants. >> but they've. >> been playing well. i'm happy for my pal saquon barkley, former. >> teammate and his. success that he's. >> having and. >> what an unbelievable year. >> he had opportunity to break the rushing record. and he sat out the last regular season game and thinking about the team, thinking about what's at stake.

and so you know the league is healthy. the product is great. and just. >> to be associated. >> with it and you see it with the like i said, the media rights, everybody wants a piece of the action. >> you know what product eli? it's brian sullivan is not great. >> that is college football. >> and i know you got some views on this. i'm going to be fully transparent. i went to virginia tech. we have a proud college football program that has not done as well as. >> many of. >> us had hoped. and i'll tell you why it ticks me off. if i was ohio state, i would just get the whole team in a room. and go, guess what guys? >> why don't we. >> do 50 million bucks? the entire team goes. >> to some new school. >> we're a proven winner, right? i'm not. i'm only half joking because i feel like that's where college sports is right now. >> it's like this. >> i want. >> to see the. >> players get taken care of, maybe. >> get direct payments. >> but do you think college. >> football is sustainable. >> the way it is right now? just it's. >> it's. >> insane. >> yeah. it's. >> it's kind of the wild, wild west right now in college football. i thought. >> the playoffs and system and

was awesome. >> i thought it. >> played really well. getting those. >> 12 teams. >> obviously have a fan. >> in the background that's not you know, is. >> that. >> happy he's honking. >> about it. >> but you know, to have those teams go. in to play for this championship ohio state, you know. >> go through this. >> i thought. >> again, it was exciting to watch. you had a great championship game. and so. >> obviously the whole system. >> with nil like you said, i'm happy these guys are getting taken care of. i'm happy. >> they. >> it is a big business. there is a lot of money being made. the players should share in that. but are you going to be able to do that year in, year out, being able to transfer schools every year? something's got to work out to fix it so you don't have to recruit your players every year that are already on your team. you develop. it's hard to develop these guys knowing, hey, you can sit for a little bit, we'll keep you happy and then we'll throw you in when you're ready to play. if they're not playing right away, they're leaving. so there's things that got to get worked out there. but again, i think there's great players. the product is good, the players are

working hard. it's just kind of figuring it out. some of the transfer rules. >> well you. >> know listen i'm. not picking on ohio state either because i got a lot of family that went there. but they won the. >> title this. >> year very quickly. >> how does your you're i think you're the richest man. i mean your other brother talks all the time on tv. your third brother doesn't get a lot of attention. but he's a very successful investor in his own right. by the way, cooper with private equity and hotels and everything like this. but how does eli manning invest his money? >> well. >> just try to surround myself with good people. have a great team to look at interesting opportunities. and that's what it's all about. i think i'm passionate about sports. i like investing in different sports opportunities, looking at those things. and obviously there's a lot of mention about private equity, getting into the nfl and getting stakes in that. but i think there's a lot of other opportunities to invest, invest in the. adjacencies around sports, whether it's media and content or from, you know, equipment to agencies to data

to, you know, the tech part of it. so youth sports is something i'm passionate about, you know, believe in getting involved in that. i have four kids that are all playing a ton of sports and understand just the life lessons that you learned through sports and starting at an early age, how healthy it is. and so want to get involved and make a difference, you know, help out the next generation and make sure sports are staying in a good place. >> there's a lot of logistics getting for kids to sports. eli, thanks for making the time. really appreciate it. it's great to have you on the program. we'd be happy to come on the manningcast anytime. so you're welcome. >> i love it. all right. next year. >> thank you. >> how do you get six kids. >> you don't to sports quick programing note fast money is live from the same i connections global conference down in miami. hear from top investors and strategists about the ai trade, what to expect from the fed tomorrow and more. it all starts today at 5 p.m. eastern. >> wake up. >> in florida. >> this morning. >> all right. three stock. >> lunch is next.

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and more in prospectus at invesco.com global strategist of freedom capital markets jay gm worst day. >> in four years. >> yeah i. >> think it's an opportunity. >> to buy. >> the stock. yes the quarter. >> was. >> pretty solid. >> people were concerned about 25%. >> tariffs that weren't mentioned in. >> their guidance. >> if they do hit mexico and canada i look. >> at two levels. technically. >> this. >> $50 level should hold all the resistance from the summertime. >> now actually support. >> rising 200. day moving average. so risk reward. >> you buy. >> it here. >> you get out if it breaks. >> the. 200 day moving average. our fundamental analyst. >> mike ward loves it. >> so i'm in. >> you're giving it a chance. all right jay what about rtx. formerly raytheon stock is up about 2% today not a huge mover. they beat estimates better. >> than raytheon. >> yeah best in class. >> and yes it's outperforming lockheed. lockheed didn't have that. >> rosy outlook. >> as we're seeing.

>> with raytheon. the sector is strong. it's one of the best in class in the sector. >> it's breaking out i. >> like the strength i like. >> the price. >> action there. >> and then what. >> someone's not. >> talking about is trump wants this american iron dome. >> and guess who helped with the israeli iron dome? raytheon. >> so if this does come to pass. >> expect raytheon to be okay. the headwind there is. >> doge, but technically it's breaking out. >> it has solid price action. i think it's a great long term buy. >> and hold. i got to ask you about nvidia. let's wrap it up with that. yeah we got to you know i wish i came on the show at 9:00. the setup for traders especially. >> the traders. >> watching this. you know you. >> watch that. >> 200 day moving average. it's the first time it. >> broke below. >> it since december. >> of 2023, maybe october 2023. >> it's been a while. we finally. >> eclipsed it. every buy stop in the world was set to 122. >> as soon. >> as it hit 122, it was off to the races. so your risk. >> reward, it. >> was. >> set up for a nice. rebound trade. >> and long term, i still think it's great. this story out of china. >> with deep sync. we shot first. we're asking questions

now and the answers we're getting kyle bass was on your show. he he doesn't trust it. and i have. >> more questions than answers. so i. >> think this is a buying opportunity just. >> like august 5th. with the. >> japan yen carry trade. >> remember that we sold off. >> ridiculous amount. we got an opportunity. >> to buy. and if it does fail the 200 day, you. >> get to wrap it there. jay woods, thank you. >> very much. thanks for watching power lunch. >> he's so great. >> he's so good. >> closing bell starts right now. >> all right. thanks so much. welcome to closing bell. i'm scott wapner live from post nine here at the new york stock exchange. and this make or break hour begins with today's tech bounce following that brutal deep sea sell off. nasdaq is up sharply today and it is led by nvidia. the stock rebounding after suffering its largest market cap loss ever one day ago, and other market caps. mega caps are on the move as well. just as many will report earnings this week. we'll ask our experts over this final stretch what's now at stake for those companies and investors too? apple. meta, microsoft, amazon. alphabet. they're also higher today. as for well there's chipotle. it's