this story just into cnn. our crews in tripoli, libya, report it turned into a night of very heavy nato air strikes. at least a dozen explosions in the libyan capital. right now smoke rising from the compound of the libyan leader, moammar gadhafi. the libyan government says 12 rockets hits that popular guard compound. our reporters staying on top of that story. that's all for us. we'll be live from missouri tomorrow. "in the arena" starts right now. >> good evening. i'm eliot spitzer reporting from washington tonight. welcome to the program. it's as american as you can. joplin, missouri. population, 50,000. a mining town established in 1873. it was named after a methodist minister but in the best western tradition it quickly became known for its saloon and its gambling. the website proudly celebrates its colorful and prosperous history. a new and awful chapter is being

written. 116 people are dead with that toll expected to rise. now i want to show you two different perspectives of a tornado. first, through the eyes of a storm chaser and then from the inside, 20 people huddled in a refrigeration unit in a convenience store. >> the tornado is trying to come down right here. the winds are out of the north and it's coming right back around. tornado is here. coming on the ground right here. get sirens going. get the sirens going. i'm telling you. i got debris on the ground over here. i got debris on the ground. it's coming up north. it's debris. tornado coming into the city. wedge on the ground. this is storm chaser. i have a large destructive tornado on southwest side of joplin. >> back up!

>> i am. it's tearing up the entire city on the south side of joplin right now. this is jeff. it's a massive tornado. massive destruction. it's a mile wide tornado. it's leveling the south side of joplin right now. >> we're good. >> thankfully all of those people survived. i'll talk to the governor of missouri in just a moment but first a look at the other stories we'll be covering tonight. did netanyahu blow it?

israel's prime minister draws a line in the sand and obama walks over it. if your best friend can't tell you you're wrong, who can? and a game of chicken. that's what the republicans and democrats are playing with the budget deficit. what happens if the deadline comes and nobody blinks. fema is a four letter word in new orleans. they're on the ground in joplin already. we talk to the man in charge to ask if they learned from their mistakes. more frightening activity in the area called tornado alley. chad myers is standing by in our severe weather center. what are you seeing on the careens causing such consternation? >> it's hard to believe that tonight was going to be a night in between storms. and tomorrow was going to get exciting. north carolina, tornado warning. allentown, pennsylvania, ten miles to the north, tornado on the ground right now. just had a tornado move to the south of cleveland, ohio, no reports of damage.

a couple warnings just to the north of cincinnati. more weather into hopkinsville into kentucky and tennessee there and then weather here into parts of joplin, into tulsa, and oklahoma city. now, all of this even affecting some of our live shots coming out of joplin, missouri, trying to bring you terrible stories of what's going on there. this is another night where we will see tornadoes probably on the ground. the bigger story will be tomorrow night when warm air and cold air clash again. it's when warm air is on the ground and cold air is aloft and there's spinning in the atmosphere. during the day the humidity and the air on the ground heats up. it wants to bubble like a hot air balloon. it goes straight into the atmosphere. last night that joplin storm, the top of it, was 60,000 feet tall. higher than any jet plane can fly. any plane in the area would have had to fly around that storm. then it begins to spin, hail

will fall and tornadoes will fall out of the bottom of it the cell. that's what we had last night. that's what we're going to have. it just doesn't seem like this is going to stop any time soon. tomorrow will even be a more severe day than we're seeing right now and for tonight. we could have 50 tornadoes on the ground tomorrow. at least 50 reports. yesterday there was one big tornado. one. and it hit joplin, missouri. it killed 116 people so far. they are still finding people. the good news is with this rain coming down now, i know this is really hard to think about, unless you are buried in rubble, that rain will be used by those survivors still under the rubble to drink as water and not become dehydrated. when it rains in a disaster, the extension of the life expectancy can go from two to four and five days because of that water. it's rain water to you and me but a life saving drink of water to people trapped in rubble. >> fascinating stuff, chad. i know one of the issues is how much warning people get. tell us once again looking at the maps, you know where these

things are going to strike, where should people be paying attention keeping their ears out for a tornado warning to make sure they don't get caught flat fo footed. >> central ohio is under the gun tonight and into oklahoma tomorrow. i'll move you ahead to tomorrow because tonight is a small tornado day. there will be small tornadoes on the ground. tomorrow there could be 200-mile-per-hour tornadoes like the joplin storm. that would be kansas city, wichita, springfield, again joplin right there. and then oklahoma city, tulsa, dallas, all along the red river and then stretching itself out to nashville and louisville, everywhere you see orange there's a chance of something happening. where there's red, there's a likelihood of tornadoes on the ground tomorrow night. for right now as it's cooling down and we get into cooler part of the night, the storms will calm down. the ones we're seeing now will calm down in the next couple hours. the ones tomorrow may go all night long. >> all right. thanks for that warning.

i just hate to hear the name joplin on the list of cities that may be hit once again. not good news. thank you for that report. now we return to joplin where i'm joined by our headliner the governor of missouri, jay nixon. thank you for joining us in this horrific moment in terms of your entire state. what's the focus of your activity today? >> our focus of our activity is making sure we get over every foot of ground here to see if anyone is living. we've rescued seven folks today. we believe there are live folks out there. we have firefighters, paramedics, we have first responders from throughout the region helping us even though there's lightning, thunder and rain out here, we have to make one more solid sweep. we think there are live folks out there. >> we hear in the backdrop the rain continues to come down. what are assets you are using? dogs out and national guard, what are you doing to make sure you can possibly find anybody who might be alive in the rubble that's been left behind by this tornado? >> we have hundreds of national

guard called up including mps to make sure property is protected. 110 highway patrol troopers. we have 1,000 first responders from throughout the state including task force one out of columbia that was at 9/11 including kansas city fire department that brought heavy equipment here. all of that is using with other firefighters and other first responders to literally have to with dogs and machines walk across every square foot of this ground. >> have you been able to get shelter and basic necessities for those that survived this horror? >> last night which opened up a shelter. that shelt er is 24 hours befor i gave a graduation speech. it's a shelter now for huge devastation and many deaths here is very, very difficult situation. one i think the community is coming together to be strong under this incredibly difficult situation. >> how about at the hospital?

you talk about harsh when the tornado hits the hospital where wounded would otherwise go. what's happened at the hospital? are people positioned in other hospitals so they are being taken care of right now? >> one other hospital is full. we're having emergency rooms set up and triage centers set up for people that are wounded. we have that under control about 24 hours into this. it's traumatic where a place people go for safety and to be cured is a place that has to be cured and will have to be scrapped. >> what are continuous dangers that will pose a risk even after you have done that last complete search to make sure there's nobody wounded out there who you can still help? >> gas leaks and fires this morning. most of those have been cutoff. water pressure has been high. we still continue to restand up the power. we had cell towers knocked over. it's hard to communicate.

we have emergency management network but it's hard to get coverage for anybody. we're asking people to be calm. we'll have hundreds at the shelter. we will make sure our folks are safe. >> how long until they can set up cell service? so many people these days have cell phones. how long until you get temporary cell towers back up so you can have communications throughout the region? obviously not just the region that was hardest hit but the entire region, 17 cell towers down. >> we hope within the next few days we can get temporary service back here. there's some service from outside of the area now. i should know we have law enforcement network up and ability to communicate during the entirety of this time there. it's just one in which i think a number of people around the country who have relatives here are concerned about what's going on. shelters opened up. taking care of folks. making that final sweep. unfortunately there have been many, many deaths. >> did the early warning system work as it should have? a lot of people say this tornado came out of nowhere. it formed in a quick fashion.

did early warning system do all it could have done to save as many lives as possible? >> 17 minutes before the tornado hit was the time the sirens initially went off. the tornado then just formed around here. it was a very devastating tornado. it didn't move along the ground very fast. it stayed here almost screwed into the earth and that's why it was so devastating. it almost -- this was almost a center of where that storm started. the warning system while the down pressure called alarms to go off, there was so much rain, wind and hail that many folks couldn't hear it. >> what was the economic engine of this town? will it be there and will it come back? what does it look like a year or two years from now? >> i can guarantee you joplin will come back. we in missouri are at our best when things are tough. we'll get this place rebuilt. this hospital and other hospital here are regional hospitals that are a big centerpiece. a university here that does well and manufacturing in this state and moving farther east significant agriculture.

these are strong people. we'll work together to rebuild this city. >> all right, governor. thank you for taking time out to be with us. god's speed. now we move across the world. there's breaking news out of it libya. heavy air strikes pounding moammar gadhafi's compound in tripoli. cnn crews on the ground there reporting seeing smoke and hearing blasts in quick succession. a reporter is live in tripoli right now. give us the latest. >> reporter: this is definitely the most intensive strike we've had here in tripoli. within half an hour we had over 12 explosions in quick succession. the libyan government is telling us that they believe it was the auxiliary center very close to the gadhafi compound that's being hit. we're still hearing jets overhead. anti-aircraft fire. it's not clear whether this strike is yet over but casualty

toll so far is three killed and 150 injured. >> those are certainly significant numbers. any word from nato about what the intended target might have been and can you in fact validate or verify what the gadhafi regime is telling but where these strikes have occurred? >> reporter: we are very close. our hotel is close to the gadhafi compound. we very much felt those strikes. we heard them. we can see the black, thick smoke coming out from very close to the compound. it does -- it would actually make sense it's either the compound or somewhere close to it that's been hit. we have not yet heard from nato because as i was telling you, it feels like the strike is ongoing. they have offered to take journalists out to verify but as you can appreciate it doesn't yet feel safe to go out there on our own. this comes just hours after the u.s. envoy was in benghazi that

strikes will not end and nato wants to make sure that message is heard loud and clear in tripoli. >> any sense of where moammar gadhafi is these days? knowing he's potentially a target and not going out in the streets the way he used to but any sense or word or chatter that gives you a hint of where he might be hiding? >> reporter: well, even his administration admit that he's very much on the move. he's gone under ground. they say that there's no shame in admitting this because they believe that nato is trying to assassinate him. but they also say that he is very much in control of it. he's in charge of the security arrangements in terms of dealing with nato air strikes and the sanctions. that's what we're being told. it is obvious that there's a lot of paranoid not just for gadhafi but also amongst his sons and

immediate family. we do keep hearing rumors that his wife and his daughter have left the country and that various sons have defected but the government has been careful to try to respond. last time they responded with an audio broadcast on state tv because they're aware as they say this is as much a propaganda battle as anything else to ensure that his people if nothing else can hear his voice. very much concerned for his safety. >> all right. thank you for that report. you are so right there are reports that members of his family have gone to tunisia. coming up, amid the tragedy, a story of survival and some very bad luck. a couple who fled katrina to what they thought was safety in joplin, missouri. first, edie hill is here. you are talking to fema folks on the ground there in joplin? >> they just held an emergency drill last week. when it work when it was put into practice? as rescue operations continue, what can the government do to

help survivors there. we'll look at that. >> all right. thanks. a lot more when we come back. stay with us. ♪ [ male announcer ] in 2011, at&t is at work, building up our wireless network all across america. we're adding new cell sites... increasing network capacity, and investing billions of dollars to improve your wireless network experience. from a single phone call to the most advanced data download, we're covering more people in more places than ever before in an effort to give you the best network possible. at&t. rethink possible.

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rough weather in joplin again tonight. hampering rescue efforts. ca >> reporter: the rain is really starting to come down here and this is the weather that's been hampering the rescue efforts all day long. there have been storms moving through here with winds as high as 60 miles an hour. hail, quarter size. of course nothing compared to the kind of weather they encountered more than 24 hours ago. that devastating tornado that went through this town killing 116 people and we're expecting that number to go higher. earlier today we joined one of the search and rescue teams that's fanned out throughout the area and came across ha heartbreaking story. they were being deployed to a

home depot that was flattened and as they were getting ready to enter that structure a young woman came up to us, 17-year-old young woman, believed that her uncle and father were still inside that building. we don't know what happened to those two men if they've been recovered yet. what we do know is that one person was rescued from that structure alive. three fatalities were the result of that home depot being basically flattened. we also saw incredible stories of people helping each other. not official search and rescue teams but neighbors digging through piles of rubble trying to help people get out and determine if there were people trapped in these flattened homes. it's like something no one here has ever seen before even the veteran search and rescue teams and even people who lived in this area all their lives where they are accustomed to tornadoes. all of them say it's like nothing they have ever seen before. >> it's heart wrenching to see the footage and you have the storm and weather you are

dealing with right now. is it possible to be outside to even continue the search and rescue operations? can the national guard and other first responders continue to do what they want to do? clearly it's getting dark there as well. does the weather itself provide a huge impediment to their efforts? >> reporter: rescue efforts go on in fits and starts. times authorities have had to say you have to stop because the weather is so bad. now we are expecting more storms to move in here tomorrow so this looks like a situation that's not going to be any easier for these rescuers any time soon. >> my recollection is that the numbers we've been hearing late through the day is that seven individuals, seven families rescued from under the rubble. is that number increasing and is there hope and any reason to believe that number will increase? anymore good stories coming out of this? >> reporter: we have not heard that number has increased but officials here remain hopeful.

in all situations like this, the longer time goes by, the harder it is to pull people out of these structures. rescuers are confident that if anyone is still alive in any of these collapsed homes or structures, they will be able to get them out hopefully by tomorrow. >> all right. thank you. now for more on rescue efforts, let's go to joplin city manager who is live on the phone. sir, we've seen the horrific weather conditions there. what is going on right now? who do you still have out there in the field searching and do you have resources you need? >> we had 400 to 500 volunteers, fire personnel, and public works department personnel that showed up early this morning and as soon as the early storm lifted, we deployed them. during the course of the day we've been able to rescue some 17 citizens and we continue our efforts as you said in your

report we're working through the weather and doing the best we can. we have had two rescuers be struck by lightning during the course of the day and we obviously don't want that to occur and we're taking that into account. we're doing the best we can with limitations we're presented with by the weather. >> obviously you keep doing everything you can within the realm of what is safe. are there they ongoing risks or gas leaks or electric wires down? how do you deal with what is visible to our viewers, utter and complete devastation. are there continued risks you have to be very careful of? >> we have gas leaks all over the city. when we drive around viewing progress of the rescue attempt, we can smell the gas. there are wires down everywhere. you just got to be careful as you navigate through the city to avoid those hazards and we encourage rescuers to do the same so we do not impart harm to those people trying to rescue

our citizens. do you have enough shelter and enough support coming in from fema and national guard to provide food, water, shelter for the so many thousands of displaced people? >> yeah. volunteers from throughout the area and throughout the state and other states and fema has been here and assistant director from fema has been here. he's been great. governor was here today offering state assistance and we're appreciative of all of the assistance we've gotten. they are greatly helping and assisting in our rescue efforts. >> all right. mark rohr, thank you for all your doing out there. keep it up, sir. nuclear disaster. that's what our next guest says st. john's regional medical center looked like after a tornado tore through joplin last night. the storm demolished the hospital just when it was needed the most. several were killed in the building as the storm blew out nearly every window and scattered x-rays and medical

records across two counties. a doctor helped treat and evacuate patients last night and is now the site commander at the triage center. doctor, thank you for joining me. >> you're welcome. thanks for having us. >> you are doing amazing work out there so we just thank you for that. you've been in these disasters before. how does this compare to what you've seen in the past? >> well, one of the original responders at the disaster in 1981, which absolutely pales in comparison to the devastation and width of the path of destruction compared to the hyatt regency disaster in 1981 but the same kind of incredible response of the medical community in kansas city and joplin. i can't believe to tell you. we had people coming from several hundred miles away that

just literally grabbed scrubs and anything they could and threw it in the car and came. within a matter of hours we had more help than we could put to use. i live a mile south from the hospital and the tornado or sound came roaring down our street. i didn't know what it was. i assumed it was a tornado. go ahead. i'm sorry. >> you continue, sir. we're listening to your description. this is what we need to hear about. >> just a few minutes after the sound passed our house which is just a mile south of the hospital i got a text from our president of our medical group and one of my partners and he told us that the hospital was on fire and emergency room was gone. i hopped in my car and headed up. all of the roads were blocked. i was able to drive over some power lines and some trees and some curbs and got to the emergency room. all of our staff had evacuated

the patients and told me that we were going to try to assemble at an alternate site at memorial hall. i went there to try to get that organized. staff started drifting in and patients that had been diverted from our hospital across the street started arriving so for first several hours we had several priority one and priority two patients which we were able to stabilize and ship to hospitals in the area within about a 60-mile radius of joplin. by about 10:00 we had taken care of the first wave of casualties. most of which were crush injuries and penetrating injuries. then through the night we basically took care of people that were extricated from their homes. >> it must be emotional devastating to see the hospital itself where people go for the care that you provide and such a tough job under ordinary

circumstances but to see the hospital destroyed and a victim of this massive tornado to be emotionally gut wrenching to see that happen. you've also been down to haiti in the midst of their disaster. how does this compare to that? >> it's a totally different thing. the haitian disaster was vertical. this was horizontal. you know, of course, tremendous amount of death in haiti. here it's localized over a path of residential homes and businesses and of course no disaster plan ever survives a disaster that attacks the hospital that you plan to be the base of safety for patients. never in my life did i ever anticipate our hospital being literally devastated and gone nonfunctional. we've reestablished our emergency room at memorial hall and we're up and running and ready to receive patients and we're trying to take the load

off our hospital across the street. from an emotional point of view i -- >> continue. do you in fact -- >> from an emotional point of view -- >> yes, sir. continue on. >> from an emotional point of view i don't think anybody prepares you to see your hospital and fire and top floors of the hospital gone and emergency room gutted shell. i was able to ascertain that all of my staff and friends were good. and they shortly followed me up to the memorial hall or the auditorium where within a short time we were able to reestablish a triage area and a patient area. i sent my son and my partner down the street to the catholic high school where we established the secondary treatment area and homeless shelter taking the load off us in terms of patients.

i guess as people responded to memorial hall there were a lot of hugs and reassurances and we were just glad to see everybody there and everybody that had made it because we count on that team. we work together so closely that to lose the continuity of that team would have been devastating to us. >> doctor, it obviously is very difficult emotional moment for you. we just can't thank you enough. last question. do you in fact have a plan to evacuate the hospital itself? this is what you had to do. did you have to improvise at that moment or are there procedures that you practiced? >> we have something called a condition grade. whenever there is bad weather in the area we move patients from windows and close doors and then we prepare and then there's an overhead call that says execute condition gray and that means any patient that we can, we get into a safe area. within a matter of 20 to 30 minutes, all of the acute care

patients of which we have about 200 plus were evacuated out of the hospital. the emergency room patients were evacuated across the street. but i have to tell you that our hospital is ground zero for the tornado and everything around it and access to it was destroyed. >> all right. doctor, thank you so much. not just for taking the time but everything you have done in this trying time and all of the great works you have done. thank you so much. >> thank you. >> up next, e.d. hill talks to fema's man on the scene in joplin. stay tuned.

all eyes on joplin, missouri, tonight. brave rescuers continue searching through an incomprehensible disaster scene. in situations like this the difference is determined by the experience of the people in charge. richard serino started 35 years ago in boston and he's now a consultant to the pentagon and deputy director of fema. i appreciate you joining us. >> glad i could join you tonight

as well. >> the city manager mark rohr said you have been great. i know that you just went through a practice, a drill for this about a week ago. how has it worked when you put it into actual practice? >> what we were able to do is a lot of it was having the relationships and fema was really just proud of the team. we had to support the governor and i spent a lot of time earlier today and the fire chief and really going around the area touring the area. and what we hear is this is about the governor but part of the team. it's really looking at the city and state and the federal community. president sent me down here earlier this morning to make sure the entire federal family is here to support joplin. we also are working with the faith based community and the private sector but what's been striking is the neighbors helping neighbors here today. >> it's a great part of the country. you see that often not just in

times like these. one of the things we've seen fema do in disasters like this is come in with temporary housing and trailers and things like that. have you already made plans for those and how many people can you help accommodate? >> right now the primary focus is the search and rescue that we're going through here. search and rescue is primary focus for first few days. they had a great opportunity urban search and rescue teams where they saved a number of people today. they are still going home by home. i was with one of them earlier. torrential rain, hail, wind, pulling people out is priority right now as we move further on we're going to be here for the long haul. we'll be worrying about debris removal and housing but right now we're putting focus on search and rescue and taking care of the needs of the survivors and helping the families of the victims as well. >> let me tap into your vast experience specifically in that in helping people at the crisis scenes through your work as a paramedic with ems.

when you are in a situation like this, do you go to the heart of the problem and then sort of work your way out or do you start on the outskirts hoping there may be more people alive there and work your way in? >> what they are doing now is the fire chief and the city manager along with the urban search and rescue teams and mutual aid for ems, fire and police have sectioned the city into grids. they are bringing in reinforcements because they're going 24 hours nonstop. we'll be here to support them in the long-term. but right now it's the work that first responders are doing truly heroic work they have been doing. >> you know that very well. what's the most difficult thing about the rescues right now other than finding people, is it because -- i can see in the background there that you still have horrible weather. a lot of rain. the people who are being found certainly have to be cold, wet and almost in a state of shock.

>> right. and a lot of the survivors that we've come across both the people who have minor injuries and people that they are pulling out, some have had minor injuries. i was talking to search and rescue crew that pulled nine elderly people out of a nursie ing home and they had minor injuries. they were confused and state of shock but minor injuries. it was the great work that people were doing on the ground and then looking at neighbors that were helping neighbors pull people out of the rubble in their adjacent areas. right now just looking at the faces and into the eyes of the survivors, the first responders, and they will keep working as hard as they can. they've been doing unbelievable work. >> i know that your focus from the federal perspective is to sort of help the state and local government and authorities get this under control. but fema does have an 800 line so i'm supposing that you would like people if they need help in

two counties that have been declared disaster sites already to contact you and i think we have that number. tell me if it's correct. 800-621-fema. is that correct? >> that's correct. we want people especially the survivors in impacted area to call 1-800-621-fema. and if they get online, ww www.disasterassistance.gov. they can register to help and we'll get help to them as soon as possible. right now we're still focusing on the search and rescue. >> eliot was talking to remarkable man earlier in the program who talked about how he was staying in his house because he has a cat and you can't take the cat to the shelter where he was supposed to go. he stayed there until they forced him to leave. i understand that places like facebook have sites set up as well to help people reunite with lost pets but has the federal government been able to help in

that regard as well? >> reporte >> it's a state and city and we'll be there to help meet needs they can't. if they need extra water, extra cots, extra blankets if they need those, generators as well. right now they are managing that. whatever they need, we'll be there to help them. we'll have the entire federal family that's on stand by. >> a tribute to how well you've done is at this point they say they have everything they need from the federal government. good work. richard serino, thank you so much for what you and all folks down there are doing. >> thank you. >> we will have more on the tornado later. up next, the u.s. and israel are friends. eliot asks if that makes it easier or perhaps harder to disagree. researching ways to ene its quality and performance, and making their factories more environmentally friendly. producing products that save on fuel and emissions, and some that can be reused again.

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president obama has made a lot of people angry with the use of a single phrase pre-1967 borders. he brought it up in his speech to the arab world last thursday and then again when he met with

netanyahu netanya benjamin netanyahu. on one side, a pro-israel group not afraid to criticize the jewish homeland. steven, let's start with you. did the prime minister ignore much of what the president said, president obama said, that was good for israel and was he getting upset with the phrasing that actually articulated what u.s. policy has been for a number of years? quickly give me your view on that. >> thank the president for many of the positive elements in the speech. i don't think there's any question about that. the president anticipated israeli unhappiness. in fact, his advisers were divided. you had the secretary of state on one side and you had the national security adviser on the other side exactly because -- >> that's not responsive to the question. the question was not whether anyone was upset. the question is was it a new statement of u.s. policy or rearticulation of what's been the policy for a number of years and were other things in the speech critically important for

israel. give me that real quick. >> it was new. they knew it was new. that's why they debated it heavily in advance. >> was this new? >> slightly. the basis has been the 1967 borders and adjustments need to be made to it so nothing new. >> look, just so it's clear. i heard the president say 1967 borders with agreed upon swaps. that's what camp david was based upon and what they were relying upon when negotiating with arabs. isn't that the essence regardless of who said it, the core of the policy for years? >> i think you are leaving aside that it was the palestinians who wanted the president to say this and israelis who asked him not to. advisers knew this was going to be a problem with israel. some of them said let's not do this. others said let's do it for this

reason. because it had to do with pressure on israel and because it had to do with not the legal details because they weren't negotiating with the border. it had to do with what degree should american policy based on pressure on israel and working with israel. >> let me try this once again, was this statement of what policy was going to be? borders with agreed upon swaps. was that not a factual and philosophical level precisely at the essence of camp david and the position of prime minister over the last several years? >> declaring it as american objective was a new policy. that's why it took them weeks to come to it. >> you keep coming back to does it matter who says it? >> it does matter but essence of what you're asking is this is where we've been. anyone serious about making peace whether israeli prime minister or american president or head of the authority knows we're making adjustments to the 67 lines. there's no change in the policy but the president saying it is

new. >> i want to focus on two other things that were in the speech. one, the president saying that israel has no obligation to negotiate with hamas, an organization that's a terrorist organization. does that not grant israel the right to say we will no longer negotiate. wasn't that an enormous opportunity for israel to say we now have done what we need to do until hamas changes we're off the hook? >> first of all, israel is not looking for an opportunity not to negotiate. israel is looking for a way to negotiate. secondly, that was a well established american policy for months before there was no debate about it and no division about it and no controversy. it isn't what the issue was at this hour. that's why no one in the world was so focused on it. they are all focused on the 67 border statement because contrary to what you just said, it was new. >> jeremy? >> i think what you're pointing at is right. there were concessions or gives to israel in the president's speech. hamas thing was one. u.n. vote making it very clear

that palestinian should not look to the u.s. those were incredible gives. the important thing is the president made it clear this is critical for israel. if they are going to survive a jewish and democratic nation, they need a two-state solution and that was said today to the apec conference as well. israelis recognize this is in israel's interest and not just talking negotiations between two countries. it's what is in israel's best interest. >> when the president said a palestinian said, should there be a two-state solution is that created one. was that not also -- you will say of course that's been agreed upon but restating it and making that part of the complex -- >> i could give you 25 more. there were many positive things in this speech. but none of them were new. what was new is what you're saying was not new. the president knew it was new. hillary clinton knew it was new and so did palestinians know it was new.

you were missing the heart of it. >> last word before i take it? >> we won't have peace if we don't realize we'll start with the 67 borders. it's in the americans interest and israeli interest. i commend him for the speech he said. >> for the president to have said out loud what every secretary of state would and every prime minister would and every negotiation for a decade and what everyone in the public has known to be the case is not new. it's not worth the prime minister picking a very public dispute with the president when the president has gone out of his way to make so many important statements about other elements of the policy. that's why i think prime minister netanyahu made a mistake about this. it was not new. and therefore this fight was not worth it. obviously deep respect for your views on this. jeremy, steven, thank you for this conversation. >> coming up, august 2nd, that's when time runs out on the budget debate and we default on our debt. vice president biden is trying to broker a deal but is it too little, too late? stay with us.

have, have. vice president hopes to patch together a deal on the budget ceiling. governor chris von who willen will meet with the vice president tomorrow. a short time ago i spoke with him and asked him if he thinks a deal might be coming together. >> not yet. that's why the president and bernanke and chairman of the federal reserve have said don't negotiate out with the debt ceiling. the fact of the matter is it would cause an economic crisis if you default. secretary of treasury said that's august 2nd. the clock is ticking. >> we know august 2nd is the deadline of the moment. having said that, the republicans are not acknowledgiacknowledge

ing the fact that the sky will fall. are those on the biden commission meeting on this, do they acknowledge that august 2nd is the real deadline? >> i don't think they have taken an official position on this. there's this hair brain scheme out there on the republican side that says, okay, we'll pay china and foreign creditors, we don't pay troops or social security, that would in addition to being totally misplaced priorities, it would also send a terrible message to the credit markets. >> capital markets most people think would go haywire if that happens. people inside the room and i know you can't get detailed here, we acknowledge august 2nd is a deadline and we've got to meet it. >> i think the republican leadership at large understand that but the fact of the matter is in the house you still have a lot of these tea party republicans and the tail is wagging the dog still. that's what people need to understand. the republican leadership may get it and say so publicly. but the reality is they don't control the show entirely. >> if this is going to be a negotiated agreement where you

have to concede some degree of cuts to get the republican votes in the house to increase the debt ceiling, are you going to hold firm and say part of that must be a revenue increase? >> any balanced approach requires revenues. here's the craziness of it all. they say we're going to send the economy into default unless we get deficit reduction our way. in other words, threatening to tank the economy unless they get it done their way. we've said we understand we have to do deficit reduction better now than later but you have to do it in a balanced way. >> any sign the republicans will agree to a revenue increase. >> no sign. the public position the republicans have taken is what it is. on the other hand the president and vice president have made clear in their public remarks you can't continue to allow big taxpayer subsidies to go to big oil companies when you ask other parts of the country to take a hit. it's just unfair. the white house has been clear on this. we hope they will stand firm. >> here's the question. then we will hit a roadblock and

there may be cataclysm unless republicans agree to increase revenues. >> there's no doubt that a balanced approach requires revenues and republicans will have to deal with that fact. now, that doesn't mean you're going to get big change in revenues but let's begin, for example, with the subsidies for big oil companies. if they can't do that, we're in trouble. >> let's ask a couple questions about which tax loopholes you would close if in fact we can agree that's how we cut expenditures. mortgage home deduction. deduction for taxes people would pay on interest on mortgages. do you think we can eliminate that one? >> i don't think we can eliminate it. the president has a provision for high income earners. that's something we should look at. nothing we want to do all at once overnight. >> how about charitable deducti deductions?

it's expensive in terms of federal budget. is that one we can look at? >> there are other things you can do for charitable deductions. you don't get a deduction for first $500 of contributions you make. incentive for people to contribute more. there are things you can look at without taking it all away at once. >> this is where you may reach agreement with republicans if you get revenue in addition to cutting costs. >> other parts of the tax code. you can look at just beginning to phase out deductions for very high end income earners. also on the corporate side, in addition to subsidies for oil companies, there are incentives to ship u.s. jobs overseas. >> do you think we could raise marginal rates. do you think those should be paying a higher marginal rate? >> i definitely do because we need to get our handle on the deficit. we need to bring down the deficit and we need balance. >> let's move over to

expenditure side. where do you believe we could cut? what's the one program where you could cut the most? >> the president put a number of cuts on the table including things like community block grants and other proposals like that. my view is we have to take those cuts unless we can identify all ea alternative cuts. there are very responsible cuts in the defense area. you just have to talk to admiral mullen who said the debt crisis is a major security challenge. everyone has to contribute. people like governor haley barbour. >> last question. social security. can we, should we raise the retirement age over a course of 10, 15 years? >> i don't think we should for this reason. my view is that people who earn their living the way we do, yes, we could easily do that. the fact is if you are doing backbreaking work, that early

retirement is a hardship. there are other ways you can do it that allow people to voluntarily retire. maybe take less. there are other ways to do it other than saying you have to retire early. for you and me, not a problem. for people who are doing manual labor -- >> doing real work. >> not as easy. >> thank you for joining us. pleasure. good seeing you. ♪ [ male announcer ] in 2011, at&t is at work, building up our wireless network all across america. we're adding new cell sites... increasing network capacity, and investing billions of dollars to improve your wireless network experience. from a single phone call to the most advanced data download, we're covering more people in more places than ever before in an effort to give you the best network possible. at&t. rethink possible.

our next guest dodged yesterday's tornado and before that hurricane katrina. you might think they are on the run from mother nature. we now have them with their dog who really has a story to tell. the whole family joins me live from joplin. what's the name of your dog by the way? >> fate. >> tell us where you were and how did you hear about the tornado? condition of your house and most importantly for the purposes of this story how you found your dog. >> well, we were both at work. trey was actually getting out of work at 4:00. and i begged him please, don't leave. i have bad feelings. i said we just need to ride this out. we got reports about things hitting and then we started hearing st. john's and our house

is across the street. at that point i was in touch with family and they said they saw st. john's was completely gone. i asked trey, just please go home. get the dog. that's all i want. trey got close to the house and called me and said that everything was gone. trey was about five blocks from our house and we were walking and just the further we got, the worse it was. we finally got to our house. i saw trey. the only way i knew it was our house was the bricks that i recognized. we immediately ran to the house to try to see if we could see the dog's kennel. we couldn't see anything. we were screaming for him and calling for him. and we couldn't hear anything. and so we just kind of walked around in a daze. it was a