i think is what we would say in britain. you've always had a great heart, a warm, generous person. anyone who doesn't really understand the unique pressures of being a member of the royal family and coming into what you did, doesn't understand what you went through and i do and i think you are coming out the other end and i wish you the best. >> thank you, piers. thank you very much. >> nice to see you again. >> that's it for us tonight. good evening, everyone. we begin with breaking news. increasing evidence that nato is directly attempting to kill moammar gadhafi, not just protecting civilians, not just driving him from power and out of libya, but trying to kill him. we got our first clue after those air strikes tuesday. they targeted gadhafi's compound, a location that's been hit again and again. last night on this program, john burns of "the new york times" said he had gotten indirect word that it was hit again on information gadhafi returned there, and burns visited another site which seemed to indicate he

was being targeted. tonight, we have word from a nato official that nato is now targeting gadhafi. the justification for killing gadhafi, according to the source, falls within the u.n. security council mandate for the operation. here's what u.n. resolution 1973 on libya specifically says about protecting civilians. >> it authorizes member states that have notified the secretary-general to take all necessary measures, that's the key phrase here, all necessary measures, to protect civilians and civilian populated areas under threat of attack in libya. so apparently nato believes the efforts to kill gadhafi are justified because gadhafi is the commander in chief of a military force which is killing civilians. it does appear to be a departure

from what was at least the publicly stated mission. listen. >> there's no question that libya and the world would be better off with gadhafi out of power. i, along with many other world leaders, have embraced that goal. and will activity pursue it through nonmilitary means. but broadening our military mission to include regime change would be a mistake. >> well, joining us now, cnn national security contributor fran townsend, former homeland security adviser to president george bush, and is currently member of the cia and department of homeland security external advisory committee. also joining us, john burns from tripoli who got the ball rolling this week. and by phone, wesley clark, senior fellow at ucla. fran, basically nato sees it as well within the scope of its mandate to target gadhafi.

can you tell us as much as you can about how you got the information? >> it was a sort of interesting cat and mouse conversation. i was speaking to the senior nato military official and said from the looks of things, just as you laid out, looks pretty much like you're targeting him personally. and he wouldn't really answer the question and said let me say it this way. if our mission, under the u.n. resolution, is to protect civilians and gadhafi is the commander in chief, we take all sorts of measures to knock out their infrastructure, their military capabilities so they can't attack civilians. the commander in chief of the military that's doing these attacks is a legitimate target. i asked a second time, are you saying you're targeting gadhafi? he said, i'm saying that i think under the u.n. resolution he's a legitimate target. now, this is a single military official in nato. is that the nato official? i don't know. there was leon panetta's testimony today in his confirmation hearing where he

suggested sort of half handedly, if you will, that gadhafi was not going to remain in power. so he seemed to try and walk that back later in his testimony. but we've seen a lot of pieces that sure suggest that this is the current -- at least the current view of the authority under the u.n. resolution. >> and this is a source who would be in a position to know this kind of strategic detail? >> that's right. there's a whole nato mission, and a whole nato command structure that involves military officers from all of the nato countries involved. but this is not a small military operation. they have a whole command structure there. yes, this is somebody that would be in a position to know. >> again, this started to get into the headlines, or at least on our radar on tuesday and we had the video of those dramatic daytime attacks on gadhafi's compound, a compound that had been hit multiple times. john burns is joining us from

tripoli. john, explain what you are seeing on the ground that would lend credence that nato is targeting gadhafi directly. john burns, are you there? we'll try to get in touch with john. general clark, you're former supreme allied commander of nato is. this even legal? can nato target a head of state like this, if in fact they are? >> well, he's not acting as head of state here. he's part of a military chain of command, as fran was explaining the logic of this. it's perfectly logical. the orders to attack civilians emanate from a chain of command. chain of command has operation centers and operations personnel. it has a communications means to convey those orders to the troops. and so if you' can attack the troops, you can attack the

communications means. if you can attack the communication means, you can attack the command and control. and if you attack the command and control, you can attack the commander. >> i'm told we now have john burns in tripoli. john, from what you have seen on the ground there, what evidence is there that gadhafi is being directly targeted? >> well, i don't think there's any doubt of it at all. from what we can see, every time that nato says that they are hitting a command and control facility in central baghdad or frequently, they're hitting the compound of colonel gadhafi in central tripoli or as they did 48 hours ago, the desert encampment to which he has frequently taken his guests, which was also described in a nato statement as being a command and control facility. it just seems to me putting two and two together, the evidence you see on the ground, that

anywhere that he is is deemed to be as indeed a command and control facility. >> fran, why then would president obama earlier say, we're not attempting regime change? >> anderson, look, this is i think it's fair to say this has gone on, this whole military mission much longer than anyone planned. it was questioned whether it would be extended and it was. i think there's been a rethinking about how long can we do this, how much violence are we going to take from gadhafi and how are we going to bring this to an end? i think there's been a realization that merely protecting civilians isn't enough, if you can't do it forever and as long as he's there. i think this has been an evolution in terms of the policy and it's sort of understandable to me. >> general clark, in terms of legality, is this legal to be targeting a head of state? you're saying he's acting as a military commander, but he is

also head of state. >> i think you got to be careful not to split hairs on this thing. i don't think the united states or nato is saying this is an all-out hit mission on the person of this individual. it's an effort to go after the command and control. he just happens, by virtue of his dual authority that he has as the head of state and the head of the armed forces and the one directing the operation, to be in the military chain of command. that makes him vulnerable. it's only normal in an operation like this that you look at where the orders are coming from and you try to knock out the source of the orders. so it's not a conflict -- it's not a change in the objective that i see. it's not an escalation. it's just a natural continuation of the events that were started

when he began attacking civilians and nato enter veend. nato was always going to go after command and control. and what's happened over the months or weeks is it's gotten sharper and sharper at focusing its intelligence on where that command and control is. so it probably is true that we're talking strikes around the country wherever gadhafi is, that's where he's giving orders from. and he's a legitimate target as a member of the chain of command, no doubt about it. >> john, for those who are hoping when nato or anywhere in the world hoping that someone in gadhafi's inner circle takes him out, how does it look from your vantage point in terms of the cohesion of those around gadhafi? >> well, of course, we see nothing of him. we were told the other night by one of his senior officials that he's everywhere, but nowhere in particular.

the last time i heard that phrase was during the cultural revolution. what we hear from people in the underground here who claim to know, he's moving all the time. moving from hospital to hospital, to museum to school to friends at very short notice. and he has always, so we were told, been very, very weary, each in times of peace, arriving somewhere an hour before the scheduled time or an hour after the scheduled time. his entourage, so they say, this is all, you know, hearsay in effect, but you never know how much authenticity it has. these people say he's reduced entourage to just a hand full of people, as few as five or six of absolute loyalists.

and as we saw with saddam hussein for example during the run-up to the first gulf war when he spent his time driving around baghdad in a taxi. somebody who behaves like that in a city of 2.5 million people is going to be difficult to find, unless you have real time intelligence. >> john burns from tripoli, thank you. general clark and fran townsend, thank you very much. let us know what you think about this on facebook or twitter. up next, what triggered the mass exodus from newt gingrich's campaign. a number of top staffers just up and quit. he says the campaign goes on. we'll talk with a former top adviser who knows firsthand how gingrich operates. is his campaign for president essentially over? we'll find out. chilling evidence, the casey anthony saw today. little caylee's skeletal remains, duct tape wrapped around her nose and mouth.

how it all fits in with the prosecution's theory of how caylee anthony was murdered. first let's check in with isha sesay. >> tonight, the study that's still being cited by those who think they can prevent children from becoming gay. you'll meet ryan kendall who was sent to repairtive therapy when he was just 14 years old. he said he was told being gay is a choice and says the treatments tore his family apart. part three of sissy boy experiment uncovering the truth, coming up. you inspired a very special dog food. [ female announcer ] chef michael's canine creations. chef inspired. dog desired.

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"raw politics" now. on a day that one headline writer called apocalypse newt. 16 members of gingrich's campaign staff quit in one day. we're not talking about interns here, his campaign manager quit. his press secretary quit. his top strategist in the key battlefield states of new hampshire and south carolina quit, as well as staffers in iowa. 16 people in all. basically his staff. they said they could not convince him to run a focused campaign. operations have been hamstrung mainly beginning rich himself. there was confusion when his campaign was announced and the trouble began when he on "meet the press" attacked paul ryan's

plan to turn medicare into a voucher program. >> i don't think right wing social engineering is any more desirable than left wing social engineering. i don't think imposing radical change from the left or the right is a good way for a free society to operate. i think we need a national conversation to get to more choices for seniors. i think that is too big a jump. >> he later denied that he was talking about congressman ryan, hen though he clearly was. then he tried to backtrack and said that any campaign ads using his own words should be considered fraudulent. >> it's very odd to me that someone would run up a $500,000 bill at a jewelry store. >> go talk to tiffany's.

all i'm telling you is we're very frugal. we in fact live within our budget. we owe nothing. >> what did you buy? >> it's my private life. >> i understand. >> i'm just suggesting -- >> you're running for president, you're going to be in charge of the treasury department. >> after that, he went on a two-week cruise to the creek isla -- greek islands. mr. gingrich said he'll be rebooting the campaign on sunday. joining me now is rich galen and gloria borger. rich, how does he even have people to put up a statement on facebook? >> it's probably just about everybody. it's not a funny situation, but who is going to order the car and driver to get him from the airport to the republican jewish coalition speech on sunday?

but here's the big issue here is whether or not there is a campaign anymore, and i think that no matter what newt puts on face book, the answer is no. it may take three or four days to wind down to zero. >> there's a republican debate that cnn is doing on monday and i think he says he's still going to that. >> as of this afternoon, he was still planning to go. but look, one of the problems he had, anderson, was that when he went off on this cruise, for the first three or four days, nobody even missed him. nobody was saying where's gingrich? nobody cared. he wasn't out, but that didn't matter to anybody until it became obvious he was on vacation, but i think at the base of all this, was the discipline that many of us who have known newt and liked him and worked for him for 30 years, thought maybe missing, and the kind of skill set you need to do the things he did to bring republicans into majority in the congress are a completely

different set of skills than what you need when you're running for president. i think that's been glaringly obvious. >> some are raising the question was he really running for president or was this just an attempt to keep his name recognition up to keep his money making ventures and speaking fees all that still high. >> you know, he was really running for president and still is. and you can tell because he hired a terrific professional staff, and in trying to piece this together today, anderson, it's very clear to me that this was a staff that was essentially trying to do an intervention with their open presidential candidate. in a conference call on wednesday, and then in a meeting today, saying, you know, if you want to be president of the united states, the discipline that rich talked about, you've got to have that. you've got to help us raise money. we need money. you spoke about the missteps he

had at the beginning of his campaign. the money was drying up. you've got to come up with a singular strategy, a vision for the campaign. and most of all, they said you have to allow us to control your schedule. we know how to run presidential campaigns, and i'm told that there was an awful lot of friction in the campaign between the people running the campaign and newt gingrich's wife. they didn't want him to go on the cruise, and there was the sense that we need to control the candidate's schedule, no one else should. so that was another problem, too. so i think as a group they decided at some point their professional reputations were on 2 line, as well. and they said we can't do it. >> rich, do you think this was a serious campaign in his mind? >> oh, i don't think there's any question about it. let me make two points. one, this story broke about 3:00 this afternoon. the first call i got about 3:01 was from gloria borger, who has

been dogging this thing for the last seven hours without a breath. yeah, i think he was taking this seriously, but these are professional campaign people who wanted to run a professional campaign, and they were being prevented from doing it, because the money wasn't there, never was going to be there after that really bad start. and as gloria pointed out -- look, we've all dealt with candidate's spouses. that's part of the game. you know you're going to have to deal with the candidate's spouse, male or female. but in this case it appears that speaker gingrich may have been maybe a little more or a lot more solicitous toward his wife's desires and her intervention in the campaign than most candidates are. >> he could have taken a vacation in the united states even and at least made it appear as if he was still kind of doing -- >> yeah, new hampshire would have been perfect.

>> he could have gotten a bus like sarah palin. >> right. after you've had such a rocky start, you can't just then disappear and say, i'm going to go do some thinking and writing. you have to do some retail politicking. in the states of iowa and new hampshire. not only that, you have to do some fund-raising with big donors who are going to help you get your campaign bus together. >> gloria, briefly, what does this mean for rick perry in texas? i've told a number of the staffers that left have close connections. >> very close connections to rick perry. a couple of his top staffers used to work for rick perry. you put one and one together, sometimes you get two. there are questions whether rick perry is going to run. i don't think you can draw a direct line with these people quitting and rick perry getting in. but if he does get in, some of

these people can run his campaign. >> anderson, that happens all the time. as candidates fall off, the other campaigns pick off the best staffers from the campaigns that don't exist anymore. the best example is ari fleischer, who was elizabeth dole's press secretary. >> rich galen, good to have you on. gloria borger, as well. newt gingrich will be at the republican primary debate on monday. that's 8:00 p.m. eastern right here on cnn. up next, a stunning day in the casey anthony murder trial. photos of the duct tape found wrapped around caylee's mouth and nose. the defense theory was she drowned in a pool. why there would be duct tape around her mouth, unexplainable.

and casey's brother goes on the stand. wait till you hear what casey told him about that fake nanny who she said was named zanny. later, part three of the sissy boy experiment, research still being cited by those who think they can prevent kids from becoming gay, or make them not gay. ryan kendall was sent to what some are calling repairtive therapy when he was just 14 years old. >> i thought there was some legitimacy to the idea that i was an evil sinner that was going to burn in hell and for years i thought god hated me because i was gay. >> we'll talk to the doctor who he says treated him, coming up. [ woman speaking chinese ] thank you. do you have an english menu?

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"crime and punishment" tonight, an emotional day in the casey anthony murder trial, a difficult day. anthony was visibly upset at the skeletal remains of her daughter, caylee. some people didn't believe the tears were real. she avoided looking at the screen when a picture of her was shown to the jury. the trial ended today 90 minutes early because casey anthony said she was ill. among those photos were those of

the skull with duct tape. gary tuchman was in the courtroom today. he has the latest developments from orlando, florida. >> reporter: casey anthony spent much of the day tearful and emotional. or appearing to be tearful and emotional. this day, much different than any other day of this trial. >> did the office of the medical examiner, with you present, ultimately recover a skull from this area? >> yes, we did. >> is the skull shown in this photograph? >> yes, it is. >> reporter: this was the day the disturbing, devastating, and horrifying images that caylee caylee's remains were displayed to the jury. we are blurring the photos. this one showing little caylee's skull. this one showing a closeup of her skull with duct tape. this one showing a medical examiner picking up her skull to take it to the lab.

this was a 911 call, when caylee's remains were found in these woods in orlando. nearly half a year after she disappeared. casey anthony is now claiming her daughter actually accident drowned in the pool and she lied about it and kept it secret because of family turmoil. listen to what the jury heard today from a sheriff's deputy. >> what are we looking at in 196 in evidence? >> this is a closeup photograph of the duct tape that was on the front of the skull. >> reporter: the prosecution is trying to show the jury that the duct tape on caylee's face was likely used to suffocate the little girl. and if she drowned, why would there be tape at all? the defense will attempt to convince the jury that the man that discovered the body tampered with it, in an attempt

to gain fame and fortune. >> there there were a body or remains tampered with, that would affect your ability to do your job? >> yes. >> reporter: the prosecution is expected to link those bags to casey anthony. they called casey's brother lee to the stand focusing on the lies she told him. >> zanny held casey down and told her that she was taking caylee from her. >> reporter: the zanny he's referring to was supposedly a nanny who casey was blaming for kidnapping. casey now admits she was a complete fabrication. listen to casey talk about her to lee. >> if i were to be looking for the nanny's place -- >> uh-huh. >> would it be advantageous of

me to look in areas that are familiar to another friend that she may have? >> that would be pretty much on the money. >> you didn't give me the last time this nanny had used a few different phone calls to contact you. >> yes, those are three of the area codes, yes. >> reporter: those lies could prove troublesome for the defense. but no more so than the crime scene photos. it appeared to us in court that casey anthony never looked at any of the graphic images of her daughter. but she did hear the graphic descriptions. and she did not look good. more than 90 minutes before court was scheduled to end for the day -- >> okay, ladies and gentlemen of the media, miss anthony is ill. we are recessing for the day. neither the state or the defense has any comments concerning her illness, nor do they want to be interviewed. >> reporter: and with that, this emotional day was over.

>> i spoke earlier with gary and dr. drew pinsky, who is following the trial. gary, some of the pictures of the crime scene photos shown in court today were incredibly dramatic, and i think for me the picture which you see the duct tape and the amount of duct tape that was placed on this little girl, what kind of an impact did it have in a court? >> reporter: it was very hard to look at, anderson. i actually didn't want to look at the monitors. i found it very upsetting. i'm still very upset that i saw these pictures, but that was the key picture. >> it's hard to get a sense of what we're looking at. there's a shot where you see somebody's feet pointing down at the ground. do you recall what some of the images are actually of? >> reporter: that shot where you see the feet on the ground, that was the medical examiner picking up this poor little girl's skull and taking it to the laboratory.

the key reason they showed the skull was to show the body parts were actually in bags, four bags found near the skull. the reason the bags are important evidence is because as this trial goes on, prosecutors will show one of these bags had a picture of winny the pooh, another with disney and will try to link these bags to casey anthony's house and the other evidence that we said before, the tape, the duct tape on the mouth of the skull that was still here, why would duct tape be on the mouth of this poor little girl's skull if she drowned in a swimming pool? >> the picture we're looking at right there, gary, is that duct tape on a skull? what is that? >> reporter: what we saw in the court was a huge amount of duct tape where her mouth and nose would have been. it's been months since her body was put there, and the duct tape was still there. and it kept the lower jaw

attached to the jaw. the medical examiner said he never seen that before, that after that much deterioration, that jaw would fall off and it didn't because of the tape put there. >> some of the things that casey anthony's brother said today, she told him a story about zanny the nanny that was very different than the story she told the police about this alleged nanny. what do you make of -- just lie after lie, and then lies that aren't consistent with other lies. >> yeah, the lies are absolutely outlandish. you have to remember, lee is hearing this lie and imagine how crazy casey's life has to be already that he accepts that story as something possible. it's so outlandish. you know, somebody sent me a document with some of the interrogation report on it. when you read the lies after lies and the absolute conviction with which she lies, the lies

are so outlandish and so incredible, and with such conviction that you almost can't look away from what this woman has done. the fact that she's been such a liar, and there's overwhelming evidence of the fact that she was a horrible parent, that is what is really causing people to speculate that she's capable of just awful things. now, today you see her right there alongside of me reacting to these pictures and reacting to some of the testimony in the courtroom. most of the people i talked to that were in the courtroom today didn't buy it. they just believe she was being coached by her attorneys to do this. the public opinion is so profoundly against casey, and have already judged her as guilty, mostly based on these outlandish, crazy, persistent lies. >> does somebody believe -- if you lie that consistently in your life, what is that a sign

of? >> they're going to allege she's not a bad person, she's a sick person. yet i've not heard any evidence of the kind of abuse for somebody to be this impaired. i have a little nearly about zanny the nanny. it's street name for xanex. you hear a lot about chloroform in this case, and chloroform is a dangerous drug that can easily go too far. >> gary, you were in court today. did it seem like she was really sick? what actually happened? >> reporter: the judge announced -- he goes, casey anthony is ill. so we're canceling court the rest of the day. i'm thinking, judge, why don't

you say allegedly ill, because we don't know that she was ill. that being said, i've watched her a lot in court today. she did not sob once today. she was wiping away tears, but she did not look good. all of us in court were emotionally horrified. so was she upset about her little girl or herself she may be a step closer of being convicted of murder, was she trying to show it to the jury or a combination of all three? we don't know for sure and will really never know if she was truly ill. >> gary tuchman, dr. drew, thank you so much. >> thank you. still ahead tonight, part three of our "360" investigation, the sissy boy experiment, uncovering the truth. research that's still being embraced by those who think they can prevent kids from becoming gay or change them. kids like ryan kendall, sent to reparative therapy when she was just 14 years old. he says he was told being gay

was a choice and a sinl. he said the treatment tore his family apart. >> i don't get that decade of my life back. i don't get those opportunities back. and i don't get my family back. and i will live with the damage that these individuals did for the rest of my life. >> we'll also talk to a doctor who continues to do this treatment. also, the anthony weiner sexting scandal. what a new poll says and what weiner's wife reportedly wants him to do. [ female announcer ] there's a new way to let go of some of the annoying symptoms menopause brings.

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check in with isha sesay and see what she's following with a "360" news and business bulletin. is she there? actually not, we'll do the sissy boy experiment instead. for the last two nights we've been airing an investigation called the sissy boy experiment, uncovering the truth. over the last two nights, we've shown you what happened more than three decades ago to a little boy named kirk andrew murphy who was enrommed in a government funded study. he was just 5 years old. it was the early 1970s and his treatment was called a success by the man who ran the study. kirk's siblings told us their brother was deeply challenged by the treatment he received and struggled with being gay all his life. he was 38 years old, kirk murphy hung himself. the research lives on, however. it's still being cited by those who think they can prevent kids

from being gay. and some kids are being sent to something called reparative therapy. ryan kendall was sent to reparative therapy when he was 14. here's randi kaye with part three. >> reporter: growing up, ryan had a secret, a secret he shared in the pages of his diary. but when ryan was just 13shgs his mother read his diary and discovered ryan was gay. it was the beginning of the most painful years of his life. >> i didn't question the world i had grown up in. i thought there was some legitimacy to the idea that i was an evil sinner who was going to burn in hell. >> reporter: ryan says his parents were determined to change their son. as ryan tells it, his parents signed him up for reparative therapy.

>> every day i would hear, this is a choice. this can be fixed. >> reporter: did you believe that? >> i never believed that. i know i'm gay just like i know i'm gay and short and half hispanic. it's part of my fundamental identity. so the parallel would be sending me to tall camp and saying, if you try really hard, one day you can be 6'1". >> reporter: ryan says he was treated by joseph nicolosi, who today is still associated with narth. >> the constraint refrain was a religious one, that this is a sickness that can be fixed, that is something that makes god cry or something your family doesn't want for you. >> reporter: at his office outside los angeles, we asked him if he remembered treating ryan kendall about 14 years old. >> i'm not familiar with the name at all. >> his parents provided bills from your office, there have

been checks written to your office but no record? >> no. >> reporter: he says that your therapy was quite harmful. he said that he was told 1% of the world is gay. >> 2%. >> reporter: he said you told him to butch up, quote unquote. >> never, that's not our language. >> reporter: and when he was sobbing, he was told it was wrong. >> we do not do that kind of work. when a client begins a session, how can i help you? what do you want to work on today? i have to be seen as an ally, a helper, a good father figure, a good male image. this is what's curative. i have to be the man who accepts you for who you are. >> reporter: when somebody says, people like yourself, others are trying to get the gay out of people. >> that's a terrible way of phrasing it. i would rather say we are trying to bring out the hetero sexuality in you. >> reporter: at 14, ryan says he had no interest in changing.

or continuing therapy with nicolosi. did he understand you were there against your will? >> absolutely. but this is what he does. he takes in gay kids whose gamlies want them to be straight and goes to work on them. >> reporter: nicolosi told us that's not true. and you put the child's interest before the parent's even? >> absolutely. absolutely. >> reporter: he says he's kept hundreds of children from growing up to be gay. one of the researchers he points to is this man, george rekers. a big believer that homosexuality can be prevented. nicolosi even cites his work in his book. he uses rekers' therapy as evidence that therapy can keep thing from growing up to be gay. he writes that growth into a heterosexual identity is indeed possible.

>> george rekers has done pioneering work in this for many, many years. >> reporter: what he didn't know until our interview was that the young boy he cites as a success story, whose real name is kirk murphy, struggled with being gay his entire life. he committed suicide in 2003, when he was 38 years old. kirk's family says the torment brought on by the therapy is why kirk took his own life. but rekers argues there's no way to prove his therapy had anything to do with kirk's suicide decades later. >> george rekers has done a lot of research. he's done a lifetime of research. if there's somebody who committed suicide, that's tragic. but we have to look at the body of literature. that's what we're relying on. >> reporter: nicolosi claims science supports the idea that people are not born gay. >> we say that homosexuality is

an adaptation to an emotional breach with the parents, primarily parents of the same sex or for the boy, it's an emotional breach, a failure to bond with the father. >> dr. joseph nicolosi simply makes things up when it comes to science. >> reporter: wayne besen is with the organization truth wins out 679 >> he says a person who is a gay man is a distant father. i was an all-city basketball player in high school and am incredibly close to my father. >> reporter: the american psychiatric association opposes reparative therapy, saying the risks are great, including depression, anxiety and self-destructive behavior. nicolosi says his therapy isn't harmful and only treats people who want to change. does it concern you that there may be a psychological impact on

some of these kids? >> there's much more push from society to be not homosexual, not to be gay, that's for sure. >> reporter: you're saying they feel more pressure out here than in here? >> absolutely. >> every day i deal with people who are survivors. it's destructive, it harms people in a very deep level. >> reporter: ryan is now back in school. he says the only way he was able to escape therapy with nicolosi is surrendering himself to the department of human services in colorado springs and legally separating from his family. but he had been through more than a year of therapy by then and had already slipped into a deep depression and thoughts of suicide. >> what they did hurt me. it tore apart my family. it led me to periods of

homelessness, to drug abuse, to spending a decade of my life wanting to kill myself. and it led to so much pain and struggle. i want them to know that what they do hurts people. it hurts children. it has no basis in fact. and they need to stop. >> this is unfair to have these accusations put to me like this. i'm not familiar with the case. all i can do is speak in generalities and we would never do that to any client. >> what happened to me is not something that goes away. i don't get that decade of my life back. i don't get those opportunities back. and i don't get my family back. and i will live with the damage that these individuals did for the rest of my life. >> reporter: now 28, ryan has plans to become a lawyer one day. to advocate for children, because, he says, no one was

there to stand up for him. randi kaye, cnn, los angeles. >> we'll have more on this story tomorrow night. still ahead, new calls for congressman anthony weiner to resign, but his pregnant wife is not one of the people who thinks he should step back. and saying goodbye to the queen of mean's best friend. millions of reasons for tonight's "ridicu-list." or...choose aleve and 2 pills for a day free of pain. enjoy the flight. or...choose aleve and 2 pills for a day free of pain. ♪ ♪ membership rewards points from american express.

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a lot more we're following

tonight. isha sesay joins was a "360" news and business bulletin. a wildfire in eastern arizona is threatening power transmission lines which supply electricity to 400,000 people. and the willow fire is just half a mile from the border with new mexico in some places. about 600 square miles are scorched. that's roughly the size of chicago and new york combined. a democrat source says congressman anthony weiner has no plans to resign, and that his wife wants him to stay in congress. a new poll shows a majority of constituents support the idea. 56% say they want weiner to remain on the job. jury deliberations begin tomorrow in the trial of rod blagojevich. he's facing 20 corruption related charges, but denies trying to sell president obama's old senate seat. this jury will try to do what the previous one could not, reach a decision on all of the charges. on wall street, stocks

snapped a six-day losing streak, adding 75 points. anderson, across the pond, will and kate attended a children's charity benefit in london tonight. it was the first official royal event for catherine, duchess of cambridge. looking at the photos, these royals know how to scrub out. >> to what? >> to scrub up and look good. >> scrub up? haven't heard that term. >> that's what they say about you, you scrub up well. >> really? >> yes, you do. >> thank you, i guess. does that mean bathe or just like dress up? >> it means dress up. put yourself together. >> okay, yes. well, i try. >> we're going to work on that. >> thanks, isha. tonight's nominee for the "ridicu-list," a blast from the past, leona helmsley makes the list. and yes, i know she's dead. but today we are reminded just

how ridiculous she was in life. today, her lap dog named trouble died. probably the richest dog in the world, is dead. now, if you don't remember trouble, you need to get your priorties straight. i know you're busy, but we're talking about a maltese who inherited $12 million when she died. that's a lot of money for any heiress to inherit. before you start screaming at the tv at outrage, a judge reduced it from $12 million to $2 million, on the grounds that leona helmsley, who went to prison after declaring that only the little people pay taxes, was mentally unstable. in equally shocking news, i'm white. at this point, you're thinking how could a maltese get by on $2

million? i work with people who spend more than that on an eyebrow pencil. she lived in a hotel in florida, ate gourmet meals and had a bodyguard. what do you think that bodyguard is going to put on his resume? trouble got more money in the will than some of her grand children who were cut out all together for, as she put it, reasons known to them. it's like my 20-year feud with nancy grace. she knows what she did. one footnote, news of her death, said to be of natural causes, only surfaced today. but officials say she died this past december. well, in you ask me, trouble fell in love with her bodyguard, faked her death and now they're living large with the rest of her cash. as for leona, she may be six feet under, but tonight she lives again on the "ridicu-list." we'll be right back. host: could switching to geico really save you 15% or more

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good evening, everyone. we begin with breaking news. increasing evidence that nato is directly attempting to kill moammar gadhafi, not just protecting civilians, not just driving him from power and out of libya, but trying to kill him. we got our first clue after those massive air strikes tuesday on tripoli. they targeted gadhafi's compound, a location that's been hit again and again. last night on this program, john burns of "the new york times" in tripoli said he had gotten

indirect word that it was hit again on information gadhafi had returned there, and burns visited another site which seemed to indicate he was being targeted. tonight, we have word from a nato official that nato is now targeting gadhafi. the justification for killing gadhafi, according to the source, falls within the u.n. security council mandate for the operation. here's what u.n. resolution 1973 on libya specifically says about protecting civilians. >> it authorizes member states that have notified the secretary-general acting nationally or through regional organizations or acting in corporation with the secretary-general to take all necessary measures, that's the key phrase here, all necessary measures, to protect civilians and civilian populated areas under threat of attack in libya. so apparently nato believes the efforts to kill gadhafi are justified because gadhafi is the commander in chief of a military force which is killing civilians.

it's unclear if nato has just come to this decision to kill gadhafi. it does appear to be a departure from what was at least the publicly stated mission. listen. >> there's no question that libya and the world would be better off with gadhafi out of power. i, along with many other world leaders, have embraced that goal. and will activity pursue it through nonmilitary means. but broadening our military mission to include regime change would be a mistake. >> well, joining us now, cnn national security contributor fran townsend, former homeland security adviser to president george bush, and is currently member of the cia and department of homeland security external advisory committee. also joining us, john burns from the new york times who got this ball roll thing week on this story. and by phone, wesley clark, senior fellow at ucla.

fran, basically nato sees it as well within the scope of its mandate to target gadhafi. i know this is very sense save stuff. can you tell us as much as you can about how you got the information? >> it was a sort of interesting cat and mouse conversation. i was speaking to the senior nato military official and said from the looks of things, just as you laid out, looks pretty much like you're targeting him personally. and he wouldn't really answer the question and said let me say it this way. if our mission, under the u.n. resolution, is to protect civilians and gadhafi is the commander in chief, we take all sorts of measures to knock out their infrastructure, their military capabilities so they can't attack civilians. the commander in chief of the military that's doing these attacks is a legitimate target. i asked a second time, are you saying you're targeting gadhafi? he said, i'm saying that i think under the u.n. resolution he's a legitimate target. now, this is a single military official in nato. is that the nato official? i don't know.

but it is from the looks of it. there was leon panetta's testimony today in his confirmation hearing where he suggested sort of half handedly, if you will, that gadhafi was not going to remain in power. so he seemed to try and walk that back later in his testimony. but we've seen a lot of pieces that sure suggest that this is the current -- at least the current view of the authority under the u.n. resolution. >> and this is a source who would be in a position to know this kind of strategic detail? >> that's right. there's a whole nato mission, and a whole nato command structure that involves military officers from all of the nato countries involved. but this is not a small military operation. they have a whole command structure there. yes, this is somebody that would be in a position to know. >> again, this started to get =r into the headlines, or at least on our radar on tuesday and we had the video of those dramatic daytime attacks on gadhafi's compound, a compound that had been hit multiple times.

john burns is joining us from tripoli.,&m john, explain what you are seeing on the ground that would. lend credence that nato is targeting gadhafi directly. john burns, are you there? we'll try to get in touch with john. general clark, you're former supreme allied commander of nato so is this even legal? can nato target a head of state like this, if in fact they are? >> well, he's not acting as head of state here. he's part of a military chain of command, as fran was explaining the logic of this. it's perfectly logical. the orders to attack civilians emanate from a chain of command. chain of command has operation centers and operations personnel. it has a communications means to convey those orders to the troops.

and so if you can attack the troops, you can attack the communications means. if you can attack the communication means, you can attack the command and control. and if you attack the command and control, you can attack the commander. >> i'm told we now have john burns in tripoli. john, from what you have seen on the ground there, what evidence is there that gadhafi is being directly targeted? >> well, i don't think there's any doubt of it at all. from what we can see, every time that nato says that they are hitting a command and control facility in central baghdad or frequently, they're hitting the compound of colonel gadhafi in central tripoli or as they did 48 hours ago, the desert encampment to which he has frequently taken his guests, which was also described in a nato statement as being a command and control facility.

it just seems to me putting two and two together, the evidence you see on the ground, that anywhere that he is deemed to be as indeed a command and control facility. >> fran, why then would president obama earlier say, ñe're not attempting regime ç2"g change? think it's fair to say this has gone on, this whole military ód9 mission much longer than anyone planned. it was questioned whether it would be extended and it was. i think there's been a rethinking about how long can we do this, how much violence are we going to take from gadhafi 9(s@'ñzy this to an end? i think more and more as time has passed that there's been a realization that merely protecting civilians isn't enough, if you can't do it forever and as long as he's there. i think this has been an evolution in terms of the policy and it's sort of understandable to me. >> general clark, in terms of legality, is this legal to be

targeting a head of state? you're saying he's acting as a military commander, but he is also head of state. >> i think you got to be careful not to split hairs on this thing. i don't think the united states or nato is saying this is an all-out hit mission on the person of this individual. it's an effort to go after the command and control. he just happens, by virtue of his dual authority that he has as the head of state and the head of the armed forces and the one directing the operation, to be in the military chain of command. that makes him vulnerable. it's only normal in ñn=a like this that you look at where the orders are coming from and you try to knock out the source of the orders. so it's not a conflict -- it's not a change in the objective that i see. it's not an escalation. it's just a natural continuation

of the events that were started when he began attacking civilians and nato intervened. nato was always going to go after command and control. and what's happened over the months or weeks is it's gotten sharper and sharper at focusing its intelligence on where that command and control is. so it probably is true that we're talking strikes around the country wherever gadhafi is, that's where he's giving orders from. and he's a legitimate target as a member of the chain of command, no doubt about it. >> john, for those who are hoping when nato or anywhere in the world hoping that someone in gadhafi's inner circle takes him out, how does it look from your vantage point in terms of the cohesion of those around gadhafi? >> well, of course, we see nothing of him. we were told the other night by one of his senior officials that

he's everywhere, but nowhere in particular. the last time i heard that phrase was during the cultural revolution. from what we hear from dissidents, people in the underground here who claim to know, he's moving all the time. moving from hospital to xd%7ñ4nr hospital, to museum to school to friends' at very short notice. and he has always, so we were told, been very, very weary, each in times of peace, arriving )aá(rq"uled time or an hour aft the scheduled time. his entourage, so they say, this is all, you know, hearsay in effect, but you never know how much authenticity it has. these people say he's reduced entourage to just a hand full of

people, as few as five or six of absolute loyalists. and as we saw with saddam hussein for example during the run-up to the first gulf war when he spent his time driving around baghdad in a taxi. somebody who behaves like that in a city of 2.5 million people is going to be difficult to find, unless you have real time intelligence from somebody in the entourage. >> john burns from tripoli, thank you. general clark and fran townsend, thank you very much. let us know what you think about this on facebook or twitter. i'll also be trying to tweet tonight. up next, what triggered the mass exodus from newt gingrich's presidential campaign. fascinating developments today. a number of top staffers just up and quit. he says the campaign goes on. we'll talk with a former top adviser who knows firsthand how gingrich operates. is his campaign for president ñssentially over?umy78%oásp gingrich says no. we'll find out. chilling evidence, the casey

anthony saw today. little caylee's skeletal remains, duct tape wrapped around her nose and mouth. how it all fits in with the prosecution's theory of how caylee anthony was murdered. [ sam ] my first ride lasted just 30 seconds. another reminder of what i couldn't do. ♪ the accident could have been my excuse to quit. i made it my reason to go even harder. ♪ [ male announcer ] helping people achieve without limits. at the hartford it's what we do... and why we're the founding partner of the u.s. paralympic team. show your support at facebook.com/thehartford.

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"raw politics" now. on a day that one headline

writer called apocalypse newt. ÷b÷okzoers of gingrich's campaign staff quit in one day. we're not talking about interns here, his campaign manager quit: his press secretary quit. his top strategist in the key battleground states of new hampshire and south carolina quit, as well as staffers in iowa. 16 people in all. b9sically his staff.ñr%2yñi0 they said they could not convince him to run a focused campaign. we certainly have seep how unfocused the campaign has been from the get-go as operations have been hamstrung mainly beginning rich himself. there was confusion when his campaign was announced and the trouble began when he on "meet the press" attacked paul ryan's plan to turn medicare into a voucher program. >> i don't think right wing social engineering is any more desirable than left wing social engineering. i don't think imposing radical change from the left or the right is a good way for a free society to operate. i think we need a national conversation to get to a better

medicare system with more choices for seniors. >> but not what paul ryan is suggesting -- >> i think that's too big a jump. >> he later denied that he was talking about congressman ryan, ion though he clearly was. then he tried to backtrack and said that any campaign ads using his own words should be considered fraudulent. the next weekend he had to answer questions:s)uá his revolving credit at the new york jewelry store tiffany's. >> it's very odd to me that someone would run up a $500,000 bill at a jewelry store. >> go talk to tiffany's. all i'm telling you is we're very frugal. we in fact live within our budget. we owe nothing. >> what did you buy? >> it's my private life. >> i understand. >> i'm just suggesting -- >> you're running for president, you're going to be in charge of the treasury department. >> after that, he went on a

two-week cruise to the greek islands while other candidates were in new hampshire and iowa. that apparently was the last straw for staffers. mr. gingrich said he'll be rebooting the campaign on sunday. joining me now is rich galen and gloria borger. rich, how does he even have people to put up a statement on facebook? i mean, 16 staffers, that's a lot of people. >> it's probably just about everybody. i was laughing this afternoon, it's not a funny situation, but who is going to order the car and driver to get him from the airport to the republican jewish coalition speech on sunday? but here's the big issue here is whether or not there is a campaign anymore, and i think that no matter what newt puts on face book, the answer is no.=/6 it may take three or four days to wind down to zero. >> there's a republican debate that cnn is doing on monday and i think he says he's still going to that. >> as of this afternoon, he was still planning to go.

but look, one of the problems he had, anderson, was that when he went off on this cruise, for the first three or four days, nobody even missed him. nobody was saying where's gingrich? nobody cared. he wasn't out, but that didn't matter to anybody until it became obvious he was on vacation, but i think at the base of all this, was the discipline that many of us who have known newt and liked him and worked for him for 30 years, thought maybe missing, and the kind of skill set you need to do the things he did to bring republicans into majority in the congress are a completely different set of skills than what you need when you're running for president. i think that's been glaringly obvious. >> some are raising the question was he really running for president or was this just an attempt to keep his name recognition up to keep his money /aq." ventures and speaking &ez

fees all that still high. >> you know, he was really running for president and still is. and you can tell because he hired a terrific professional staff, and in trying to piece this together today, anderson, it's very clear to me that this was a staff that was essentially trying to do an intervention with their own presidential candidate. in a conference call on wednesday, and then in a meeting today, saying, you know, if you want to be president of the united states, the discipline that rich talked about, you've got to have that. you've got to help us raise money. we need money. 5v had at the beginning of his campaign. the money was drying up. you've got to come up with a singular strategy, a vision for the campaign. and most of all, they said you have to allow us to control your schedule. we know how to run presidential campaigns, and i'm told that there was an awful lot of friction in the campaign between the people running the campaign

and newt gingrich's wife. they didn't want him to go on the cruise, and there was the sense that we need to control the candidate's schedule, no one else should. so that was another problem, too. so i think as a group they decided at some point their professional reputations were on the line, as well. and they said we can't do it. >> rich, do you think this was a serious campaign in his mind? >> oh, i don't think there's any question about it. let me make two points. one, this story broke about 3:00 this afternoon. the first call i got about 3:01 was from gloria borger, who has been dogging this thing for the last seven hours without taking a breath. that's number one. number two is, yeah, i think he was take thing seriously as well as he could, but as gloria pointed out, these are professional campaign people who wanted to run a professional [ónted to run a professional prevented from doing it, because the money wasn't there, never was going to be there after that really bad start.

and as gloria pointed out -- look, we've all dealt with candidate's spouses. that's part of the game. you know you're going to have to deal with the candidate's spouse, male or female. but in this case it appears that speaker gingrich may have been maybe a little more or a lot more solicitous toward his w4%rk than most candidates are. >> he could have taken a vacation in the united states even and at least made it appear as if he was still kind of doing -- >> yeah, new hampshire would have been perfect. >> he could have gotten a bus like sarah palin. >> right.wt-fññi after you've had such a rocky k+ start, you can't just then disappear and say, i'm going to go do some thinking and writing. you have to do some retail politicking. in the states of iowa and new hampshire. not only that, you have to do some fund-raising with big

donors who are going to help you get your campaign bus together. >> gloria, briefly, what does this mean for rick perry in texas? i'm told that a number of the staffers that left have close connections. >> very close connections to rick perry. it may be perry's gain if it's gingrich's loss. a couple of his top staffers used to work for rick perry. you put one and one together, sometimes you get two. there are questions whether rick perry is going to run. i don't think you can draw a direct line with these people quitting and whether rick perry gets in. but if he does get in, some of these people can run his campaign. >> anderson, that happens all the time. as candidates fall off, the xd other campaigns pick off the best staffers from the campaigns that don't exist anymore. the best example is ari fleischer, who was elizabeth dole's press secretary, when that campaign folded, karen

hughes hired him to be george w. bush's press secretary. >> rich galen, good to have you on. gloria borger, as well. newt gingrich will be at the republican primary debate on monday. hope you'll be joining us for that. that's 8:00 p.m. eastern right here on cnn.b we'll be live at 10:00 p.m. on "360." up next, a stunning day in the casey anthony murder trial. photos of the remains of caylee were shown, along with photos of the duct tape found wrapped around caylee's mouth and nose. the defense theory was she drowned in a pool. why there would be duct tape around her mouth, unexplainable. and casey's brother goes on the stand. wait till you hear what casey told him about that fake nanny who she said was named zanny. the nanny that casey made up and lied ant. later, part three of the sissy boy experiment, research dating back to the '70s still being cited by those who think they can prevent kids from becoming gay, or make them not gay. ryan kendall was sent to what some are calling reparative

therapy when he was just 14 years old. >> i thought there was some legitimacy to the idea that i was an evil sinner that was going to burn in hell and for years i thought god hated me because i was gay. >> we'll talk to the doctor who he says treated him, coming up. [ male announcer ] from nutritional science comes centrum. with vitamins and minerals balanced to support your energy... ♪ ...immune function... ♪ ...healthy skin... and help protect your cells from environmental stress. everyday benefits from advanced formulas. the complete benefits of centrum. and if you're over 50, discover the age-adjusted benefits of centrum silver. and if you're over 50, ♪ ♪

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"crime and punishment" tonight, an emotional day in the casey anthony murder trial, a difficult day. anthony was visibly upset at the

photos of the skeletal remains of her daughter displayed in the courtroom. some people didn't believe the tears were real. she avoided looking at the screen when a picture of her was shown to the jury. the trial ended today 90 minutes early because casey anthony said she was ill. among those photos were those of the skull with her mouth and nose covered in duct tape. we've obviously not showing you the details of that. the jury saw them, of course. the remains were found in a wooded area near the anthony family home back in december of 2008. gary tuchman was in the courtroom today. he has the latest developments from orlando, florida. >> reporter: casey anthony spent much of the day tearful and emotional. or appearing to be tearful and emotional. this day, much different than any other day of this trial. >> did the office of the medical examiner, with you present, ultimately recover a skull from this area? >> yes, we did.

>> is the skull shown in this photograph? >> yes, it is. >> reporter: this was the day the disturbing, devastating, and horrifying images that caylee caylee's remains were displayed to the jury. we are blurring the photos. this one showing little caylee's skull. this one showing a closeup of her skull with duct tape. this one showing a medical examiner picking up her skull to take it to the lab. this was a 911 call, when caylee's remains were found in these woods in orlando. nearly half a year after she disappeared. casey anthony is now claiming y?j?>vio5 because of family turmoil. listen to what the jury heard today from a sheriff's deputy. >> what are we looking at in 196 in evidence? >> this is a closeup photograph

of the duct tape that was on the front of the skull. >> reporter: the prosecution is trying to show the jury that the duct tape on caylee's face was likely used to suffocate the little girl. and if she drowned, why would there be tape at all? the defense will attempt to convince the jury that the man that discovered the body a meter reader, did some tampering with the body, and brought it to the scene in an attempt to gain fame and for the chub. >> there is a body or remains that have been tampered with, that would affect everyone's ability to do their job, correct? >> yes. >> reporter: but in addition to caylee's clothes found at the scene, other remains were found in bags near the skull, and the prosecution is expected to link those bags to casey anthony. they called casey's brother lee to the stand focusing on the lies she told him. >> zanny held casey down and told her that she was taking caylee from her.

>> reporter: the zanny he's referring to was supposedly a nanny who casey was blaming for kidnapping little caylee. but there was no zanny the nanny. casey now admits she was a complete fabrication. listen to casey talk about her to lee. >> if i were to be looking for the nanny's place -- >> uh-huh. >> would it be advantageous of me to look in areas that are familiar to another friend that she may have? >> that would be pretty much on the money. >> you didn't give me the last time this nanny had used a few different phone calls to contact you. am i right with all that? >> yes, those are three of the area codes, yes. >> reporter: those lies could prove troublesome for the defense. but no more so than the crime scene photos. it appeared to us in court that casey anthony never looked at any of the graphic images of her daughter. but she did hear the graphic

descriptions. and she did not look good. more than 90 minutes before court was scheduled to end for the day -- >> okay, ladies and gentlemen of the media, miss anthony is ill. we are recessing for the day. neither the state or the defense has any comments concerning her illness, nor do they want to bea interviewed. >> reporter: and with that, this @rñ gary tu. stilg ahead, parti.= three our "360" investigation, the sissy boy experiment experiment, uncovering the truth. decades old research still being kids from becoming gay, kids like ryan kendell. he says he was told being gay was a choice, and a sin. he says the treatment tore his family apart. >> i don't get that decade of my life back. i don't get those opportunities back. and i don't get my family back.

and i will live with the damage that these individuals did for the rest of my life. >> we'll also talk to a doctor who continues to do this treatment. new information about whether the congressman plans to step down and what a new poll says. so, did we build a slower car? or design wipers that could handle anything? what do you think? the cadillac cts-v, the world's fastest production sedan. we don't just make luxury cars, we make cadillacs and i can have a proposal to you within half an hour. we're a small business. with 27 of us always in the field, we have to stay connected. we use verizon tablets, smartphones. we're more responsive. there are no delays. delays cost money.

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for the last two nights we've been airing an investigation called the sissy boy experiment, uncovering the truth. and now it moves to the present, tonight in part three. over the last two nights, we've shown you what happened more than three decades ago to a little boy named kirk andrew murphy who was enrolled in a government funded study aimed at making effeminate boys more masculine. he was just 5 years old. it was the early 1970s and his treatment was called a success by the man who ran the study. kirk's siblings told us their brother was deeply challenged by the treatment he received and struggled with being gay all his life. when he was 38 years old, kirk murphy hung himself. the research lives on, however. it's still being cited by those who think they can prevent kids from being gay. and some kids are being sent to something called reparative therapy. ryan kendall was sent to reparative therapy when he was a teenager. here's randi kaye with part

three of our investigation. >> reporter: growing up, ryan kendall had a secret, a secret he shared in the pages of his diary. but when ryan was just 13, his mother read his diary and discovered ryan was gay. it was the beginning of the most painful years of his life. >> i didn't question the world i had grown up in. i thought there was some legitimacy to the idea that i was an evil sinner who was going to burn in hell. and for years, i thought that god hated me because i was gay. >> reporter: ryan says his parents were determined to change their son. as ryan tells it, his parents signed him up for reparative therapy. with the national association for research and therapy of homosexuality, otherwise known as narth. >> every day i would hear, this is a choice. this can be fixed. >> reporter: did you believe that? >> i never believed that. i know i'm gay just like i know i'm short and half hispanic. i never thought those facts

would change. it's part of my fundamental identity. so the parallel would be sending me to tall camp and saying, if you try really hard, one day you can be 6'1". >> reporter: ryan says he was treated by joseph nicolosi, who is a clinical psychologist who is still associated with narth. >> the constraint refrain was a religious one, that this is a sickness that can be fixed, that you don't want to be an effeminate man, so you want to butch up. this is something that makes god cry. this is something your family doesn't want for you. >> reporter: at his office outside los angeles, we asked him if he remembered treating ryan kendall about 14 years ago. >> i'm not familiar with the name at all. >> his parents provided bills from your office, there have been checks written to your office but no record? >> no. >> reporter: he says that your therapy was quite harmful. he said that he was told 1% of the world is gay. >> 2%.

>> reporter: he said you told him to butch up, quote unquote. >> never, that's not our language. >> reporter: and when he was sobbing, he was told it was wrong. >> we do not do that kind of work. when a client begins a session, how can i help you? what do you want to work on today? i have to be seen as an ally, a helper, a good father figure, a good male image. this is what's curative. i have to be the man who accepts you for who you are. >> reporter: when somebody says, people like yourself, others are trying to get the gay out of people. >> that's a terrible way of phrasing it. i would rather say we are trying to bring out the heterosexuality in you. >> reporter: at 14, ryan says he had no interest in changing. or continuing therapy with nicolosi. did he understand you were there against your will? >> absolutely. he knew that i wasn't a willing participant. but this is what he does.

he takes in gay kids whose families want them to be straight and goes to work on them. >> reporter: nicolosi told us that's not true. and you put the child's interest before the parent's even? >> absolutely. absolutely. >> reporter: he says he's kept hundreds of children from growing up to be gay. one of the researchers he points to is this man, george rekers. a big believer that homosexuality can be prevented. nicolosi even cites his work in his book "a part's guide to preventing homosexuality." he uses rekers' therapy as evidence that therapy can keep thing from growing up to be gay. he writes that growth into a heterosexual identity is indeed possible. >> george rekers has done pioneering work in this for many, many years. >> reporter: what he didn't know until our interview was that the young boy he cites as a success story, whose real name is kirk

murphy, struggled with being gay his entire life. he committed suicide in 2003, when he was 38 years old. kirk's family says the torment brought on by the therapy is why kirk took his own life. but rekers argues there's no way to prove his therapy had anything to do with kirk's suicide decades later. >> george rekers has done a lot of research. he's done a lifetime of research. if there's somebody who committed suicide, that's tragic. but we have to look at the body of literature. that's what we're relying on. >> reporter: nicolosi claims science supports the idea that people are not born gay. >> we say that homosexuality is an adaptation to an emotional breach with the parents, primarily parents of the same sex or for the boy, it's an

emotional breach, a failure to bond with the father. >> dr. joseph nicolosi simply makes things up when it comes to science. >> reporter: wayne besen is with the organization truth wins out. >> he says a person who is a gay man has a disstanlt father and isn't good at sports. i was an all-city basketball player in high school and am incredibly close to my father. >> reporter: the american psychiatric association opposes reparative therapy, saying the potential risks are great, including depression, anxiety and self-destructive behavior. nicolosi says his therapy isn't harmful and only treats people who want to change. does it concern you that there may be a psychological impact on some of these kids? >> there's much more push from society to be not homosexual, not to be gay, that's for sure. >> reporter: you're saying they feel more pressure out here than in here? >> absolutely. >> every day i deal with people

who have been harmed, who were survivors of these groups who try to say you can pray away from the gay and change people from being gay to straight. it's destructive, it harms people in a very deep level. >> reporter: ryan is now back in school. he says the only way he was able to escape therapy with nicolosi was by surrendering himself to the department of human services in colorado springs and legally separating from his family. but he had been through more than a year of therapy by then and had already slipped into a deep depression and thoughts of suicide. >> what they did hurt me. it tore apart my family. it led me to periods of homelessness, to drug abuse, to spending a decade of my life wanting to kill myself. and it led to so much pain and struggle. i want them to know that what they do hurts people.

it hurts children. it has no basis in fact. and they need to stop. >> this is unfair to have these accusations put to me like this. i'm not familiar with the case. all i can do is speak in generalities and we would never do that to any client. >> what happened to me is not something that goes away. i don't get that decade of my life back. i don't get those opportunities back. and i don't get my family back. and i will live with the damage that these individuals did for the rest of my life. >> reporter: now 28, ryan has plans to become a lawyer one day. to advocate for children, because, he says, no one was there to stand up for him. randi kaye, cnn, los angeles. >> we'll have more on this story tomorrow night. still ahead, new calls for

congressman anthony weiner to resign, but his pregnant wife is not one of the people who thinks he should step back.

a lot more we're following tonight. isha sesay joins was a "360" news and business bulletin. a wildfire in eastern arizona is threatening power transmission lines which supply electricity to 400,000 people. and the willow fire is just half a mile from the border with new mexico in some places. about 600 square miles are scorched. that's roughly the size of chicago and new york combined. a democrat source says congressman anthony weiner has no plans to resign, and that his wife wants him to stay in congress. a new poll shows a majority of constituents support the idea.

56% say they want weiner to remain on the job. jury deliberations begin tomorrow in the retrial of disgraced former illinois governor rod blagojevich. he's facing 20 corruption related charges, but denies trying to sell president obama's old senate seat. this jury will try to do what the previous one could not, reach a decision on all of the charges. on wall street, stocks snapped a six-day losing streak, the dow adding 75 points to close at 12,124. while the nasdaq and the s&p each rose nine points. anderson, across the pond, will and kate attended a children's charity benefit in london tonight. it was the first official royal event for catherine, duchess of cambridge. i have to tell you, looking at the photos, these royals know how to scrub up. >> to what? >> to scrub up and look good. >> scrub up? 5 >> that's what they say about you, you scrub up well. >> really? >> yes, you do.

>> thank you, i guess. does that mean bathe or just like dress up? >> it means dress up. put yourself together. >> okay, yes. well, i try. >> we're going to work on that. >> thanks, isha.içt8ú)tñr next on "360," a teen rock band that's urging kids to take a stand against bullying. they want to drown out the haters, their words, with their music.

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more kids to stand up and do something. education contributor and high school principal steve perry explains in tonight's "perry's principles." >> they are making noise about bullying with its first single "renegade." ♪ >> you're starting to write your own music, when the wheels stop spinning, how do you end up on bullying? >> we had an idea, make a list of things we love, things we don't care about and things we really don't like. we all wrote the word "haters" on the list of dislikes. >> what's a hateer? >> someone who makes fun of you for your style. it's like, that's it, something that has affected us. >> how? >> we've all experienced it, but probably me the most, because i've always been on the shorter side. >> tell me about it.

>> so kids just like either verbally picking on me or sometimes even physically. i didn't really do anything about it and i should have, but i didn't. >> when i look at the ramones and others, they must have been outcasts. tell me about that experience of being on some level bedesign outcasts. >> you have to know it's okay. it's really all right and you have to be your own person and not care what other people think. >> the band teamed up with dosomething.org, a nonprofit that provides tools to create social change. together, they spoke out and rocked out at several high schools in new york and new jersey in new jersey this year. ♪ >> it's definitely more effective than just sitting down through a boring chitchat. kids can relate to it.

>> what do you want kids to take from this? >> the biggest thing about bullying is when i saw kids at my old school, it was always the same kids bullying the same kids every day and nobody else would do something about it. we're trying to get kids to stay up and say something to the bully, stop that, it's not cool. >> so these songs speak to your generation? >> yeah. we have a song called "future generation" that tells people that we are the generation. it's our time to change and it's our time to make things better. ♪ >> we're heard far too many stories about bullying and this stuff just keeps going on. what can students do to make an impact? >> well, what students can do is to use their voices. if you ever want to see how students really feel, take a look at their art. listen to their music. look at their poetry. watch their drawings. these young men at radio silence are taking their talent and