heard that? >> well, it is interesting, because he wants it, but a realistic assessment frankly, because he was a pro choice mayor of new york city and pro gun control and i defer to erik who knows the party better than i do, but i don't believe that giuliani with his social issues could be nominated. >> well, are you truly desperate? >> well, i don't know if it is rudy or judy who wants to be in the office. well, he is jealous of sarah palin taking so much spotlight this weekend. >> well, all of you, i will be smart to leave you out of the rudy giuliani and what he is up there to there, and thank you all, gentleman. that is all for us tonight. "anderson cooper 360" starts "anderson cooper 360" starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com

the president will lay out a speech to the nation, and democratic sources are telling us that it calls for $300 billion in tax break, incentives and other spending offset by an equal amount of budget cuts. this is being described as a major make-or-break moment for the president. we will discuss it along with mitt romney's competing plan that he unveiled today, but first on the phone, chief white house correspondent jessica yellin with the details. jessica, this $300 billion figure, and what are the detailing of it? >> hi, anderson. with people in discussions with the white house confirm that the $300 billion has been the working figure for the jobs package for a week now, and it would mean $300 billion in both spending and then cuts. you know, the white house has said that this is a revenue-neutral package so in addition to outlining the new spending the president will also outline some cuts on thursday in his speech, but he would then put out a more detailed package

later, explaining more of those cuts when he makes the proposal to the deficit super committee, and i should point out that of course, these numbers could change between now and thursday, anderson. >> so just so i'm clear, $300 billion in new spending and then an equal amount of cuts or what is the breakdown? >> yes. yes. $300 in new spending and $300 in cuts so that you will come out with a zero total in the end. >> and do we know specifics about or what could be in the package? or what other specifics? >> right. the biggest ticket items as we understand it would be payroll tax cuts and then an extension of unemployment insurance. those are the big dollar figures. but, i'm also beginning to believe by democratic policy makers in the package some money for laid off teachers, also funds to renovate the dilapidated schools and the democrats see it as a quick way

to employ laborers an studentd and also first responders, and you can see a political advantage for putting in money for first responders and teachers and not only employing laid off individuals, but it is also theoretically harder for members of congress to vote against that,although in this political environment, anything is possible, anderson. >> how does the president go about this? >> well, in the speech on thursday, i expect him to lay out not just the specifics, but a vision of how government can help us in his view. he'll then hit the road and he will be giving the campaign-style speech we heard from him yesterday, and hitting congress hard, and going out selling it to the american people in a very sort of rhetorically aggressive way and taking the case to the american people and basically hitting the campaign trail with it, anderson. >> and we will talk to

democratic strategist paul begala and kevin madden, republican kevin madden, former spokesperson for mitt romney, but first, before we go to them on former governor of massachusetts mitt romney who laid out his plan for the economy as a preemptive strike. take a look. >> i know the president is going to give a speech in a couple of days, and i know what is coming. i have seen version, one, two, three, four, five. and they are not working. and the reason is -- [ applause ] i mentioned a moment ago that we are now using smartphones, not pay phones. president obama's strategy is a pay phone strategy, and we are in a smartphone world. and so, we are going to have to change -- what he is doing is to take quarters and stuffing them into the pay phone and thinking, can't figure out why it is not working. it is not connected anymore, mr.

president. the pay phone strategy does not work in a smartphone world. >> well, governor romney's plan to cut corporate tax rates and cutting taxes on interest and dividends and slashing government regulations and eliminating the affordable health care act and clamping down on china's unfair trade practices and it would create 11.5 million jobs in four years and to be honest, it sounds like a lot and more than the last three years, but it is much different, because bill clinton and jimmy carter and president bush created about the same. but obama's response to the romney plan says that it is more tax breaks for the large corporations. and rick perry's is that -- we did some checking on mr. romney's experience that his private sector experience uniquely prepares him for a job

creator. we checked on that. here is what he says. >> i don't think that barack obama is a bad guy, and i just don't think he has a clue. having never worked in the private sector and not having a real job, it is not a surprise he does not know how to create a real job. >> if you want to create jobs, it helps to have had a job. >> i understand how to get business going again. >> i have spent my life in the private sector creating jobs. >> i have spent most of my life outside of politics dealing with real problems in the real economy. >> and i spent much of my life in the real economy and by that i don't mean creating jobs and being saved, i did that myself. >> being in the private sector for 25 years and therefore knowing how the economy works and why jobs come and why they go and not watching the jobs being created, but creating jobs. >> create jobs -- >> create jobs -- >> it is time for someone who knows how to create jobs. >> that is the bottom line. the private sector experience gives him the know-how and he got specific in this fox news debate. >> when i was at bank capitol we

invested in 100 different companies. not all of them worked, but i am proud of the fact that i learned about how you can be successful at enterprise and how we lose jobs an gain jobs and overall of the 100 businesses that we invested in tens of thousands of jobs net-net were created. >> keeping him honest that number tens of thousands is vague. when we asked the campaign for specifics to back it up, we got no reply. in addition, some of the investments of bain is a they invested in staples because they employ about 90,000 people, so should he be credited with creating the 90,000 or only a fraction? we are not experts in the field, but implying that he is investing in companies makes him better atuned to creating the jobs period. he says he won some and lost some, but never mentioned in his

previous work in a private equity firm laying people off was a good business and businesses like staples, they were heavily leveraged when romney ran it. there is nothing illegalle or unusual about it, because that is what private equity companies do. but what he does not mention is that means cutting pensions and cutting jobs. seven years ago when running against u.s. senator ted kennedy, he boasted about jobs, he didn't say tens of thousands, but just 10,000, and the senator's campaign fought back with this. >> he took jobs away. >> i worked there 30 years, and i never dreamed that i'd lose my job. >> mitt romney says he helped create 10,000 jobs and the former works at s.c.m. in marion, indiana, say something else. >> if he is creating jobs, i wish he could do it here instead of taking them away.

>> well, he and others lost their jobs after they bought the company and then institutes layoffs and then after the workers went on strike, bain closed entirely. and a couple of years later, american pad and paper went under costing even more jobs. mitt romney and bain took a hit to the reputation, but not the wallets as they pocketed $100 million in that deal. here to talk about it in the upcoming speech on jobs joining us is the romney spokesman in the 2008 campaign. so, if he was not touting that as one of the major selling points, how real is the record in the business world would it be? >> well, any candidate, and their background in business and professional life is important. mitt romney has made it a sen tepiece and st -- centerpiece is job, and it

is much the way that an undertaker is a medical doctor. and so he created a company and got made him rich, and god bless him, and i don't know but you will more and more from workers who were laid off by mitt romney and maybe the tens of thousands were created in india or china he was bashing in his speech. he has set himself up, anderson, as someone who is quite vulnerab vulnerable. and remember, mike huckabee who won in iowa won because he accused mitt romney of looking like the guy who laid you off. and a lot of people said, yeah, he does. >> and kevin, you are the spokesman, and are these attacks on romney anything new? the attacks of bain, are they new? >> well, it is coming down the world view, and what governor romney will tell the many primary voters and if he were to earn the nomination and find his way into the nomination, he would say that his world view of understanding the private sector and admittedly what goes right

alg wro and wrong in the private sector is important to put together his blueprint to turn around the american economy. we can't rely on people who have just government experience who only know about government paycheck in order to create and fix and create an economy that can get, that can put american people back to the work and can be turned around again so that we are creating jobs. ultimately, this has to come around people who are in small businesses and big businesses and businesses that have succeeded and failed in order to make sure that we are a back to create ing t creating the jobs so that americans have more of the jobs. >> but kevin, sometimes in business what goes right in a business is not what goes right for a private equity firm. what goes right for private equity firm is making a big return on the investment which means cutting costs and laying off workers? >> well, at the heart of it is the free market. what happens is that many of the companies like bain capital and other folks with private sector experience like governor romney

went in and tried to turn around the companies that were inefficient or bloated or not producing profits and not expanding and what you have to do to make hard decisions. sometimes the hard decisions are to make the company more efficient and sometimes it requires some of the companies to get leaner. that is one of the important things that we know about the private sector, but ultimately at the core of what governor romney tried to do and the core of many of the entrepreneurs try to do is to create jobs and make their companies better. that is what governor romney will try to leverage with the american economy is that we are not efficient and not creating jobs and how can we go to experience of the american entrepreneur and get people back to work, because over the last three years the approach of the obama administration with more spending and taxes and regulation have not produced jobs. that is a critical world view here. >> and paul, let me ask you

about this, with the details coming out about the president's jobs plan $300 million in new spending and $300 million in cuts? >> well, we have to wait and see how it is targeted and where it is target. the very fact that the president is doing it is good news. it shows that he is dialed in to the most important issue facing the country and unlike all of the other candidates except for, well, governor perry is still in office and bachmann is, but he can do something about it and more than a member of congress or a governor can, but the key is will he be targeted on the m middle class. that is where he wants a point of departure with kevin's old boss mitt romney, and it is a world view, and he is right, the focus is on the heart of the middle-class. he believes that is what drives the economy and business needs more customers and you get that by helping the middle-class. >> well, paul, you could argue that if the details are right that jessica is detailing tonight that it is a revenue-neutral plan, that should be music to the

republicans' ears and do you believe, paul, that it is in the republicans' best interest to get this thing passed? >> i think it is in the best interest, but they won't see it as such and here is why. there are all kinds of republicans and some truly deeply want to help, and i know they do, but there are others who frankly understand the political physics which is if america fails, republicans succeed. mitch mcconnell has said that he wants to make the president a one-term president, and john boehner said that some of the policies might cost jobs and he said sobeit, and michele bachmann said, it might be good, and rush limbaugh said he hopes that the president fails and several republicans and a lot of them who frankly don't like to see the economy fail if it means they succeed politically. >> and kevin, republicans, if it is a revenue-neutral plan is that something that the republicans can get on board in this climate? >> well, anderson, it is going to remain to be seen if it is more of the same with the

president. he is good at providing lofty rhetoric and going before congress to offer poll-tested nuggets or sound bite in a speech, but very bad at the practice of producing jobs and putting americans back to work. it sounds like just more government spending. i think that on the cut side, i think that the government, and many of the republicans up on capitol hill are going to believe that we can go further when it comes to finding the wasteful government spending, and that is the kind of wasteful government spending suffocating the american economy and with high-def it it hi high-deficits and the president has had three years to produce something tangible to produce jobs, and he hasn't, so i expect more lofty rhetoric and a lot of platitudes and not a lot of action. >> paul, you are shaking your hand? >> well, one man's wasteful spending is a firefighter risking his life for my former neighbors or a teacher going back to school today. when you get to the specifics and the president will and

should, and i think that americans in the middle and not id log eologues like me and kev and they say, cut spending like kevin, good point, but then you say lay off the cops and the teachers and to make it harder for fema to respond to an emergency and they are not so much in favor, because they want them to be there to help them through the storm. >> it is going to be easy to see if he can marshall public opinion about more spending, paul. >> and reminder that the president will speak at 7:00 eastern time thursday, and we will keep them honest at 8:00 p.m. and 10:00 p.m. eastern. let us know what you think about this tonight at anderson cooper.com. and the fire images are inkredable from the fire lines in texas. and gadhafi is fleeing libya, and the question is where

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as paul mentioned earlier a lot of people are hurting in texas tonight. massive wildfires are burning largely out of control and more than 700 homes are destroyed and thousands have been forced to flee and two more lives lost today. the largest fire near austin has spread across 30,000 acres which is twice the size of manhattan here in new york and it has burned half a town and destroyed a state park and shows little signs of letting up. the -- are calmer than yesterday, which is welcomed news, but the problem is too little to fight these flames. joining us is mary hicks head of the texas forest service. when we spoke yesterday, you said you had never seen anything like this, and what it is like today? >> well, it is calmer today, anderson, and the wind is dying down help us to get more of a handle on what is going on. the texas forest service

supports the local fire department which is volunteer and that means they work for free and they have left their communities to battle these blazes for more than 290 days in a row. >> 290 days in a row? >> that is correct. that is almost a year. it is hard to believe that these people, they are the heroes out there. >> i mean, how do you keep up with that kind of a pace? because this is grueling, grueling work, and you are digging and dragging underbrush, it is really tough? >> well, what they do is that we called support in from all over the country and we have had firefighters come in from all over the country and every state has come in to help us, and every 14 days we get a new bunch in. so, that's saved us. >> have you -- i know you have assessment teams going into the neighborhoods who have been scorched by fires, and what are they finding? >> we do. i talked to several of the crews on the ground, and the assessments are going good, but they are walking through the subdivision, row by row, and

street by street, and they are putti putting stakes on the ground to mark off the homes that are completely gone and the ones with damage and get a handle off what is there, and they are finding out that they have missed some, that slab that used to be a shop really was a home. it is devastating out there. >> and you point out that a lot of these fires, they are not started by nature. >> no. no! a lot of the fires, all of these fires are caused by people. what is unusual is that we are seeing things that start fires under normal conditions, i mean, that would not start fires under normal conditions like safety chains on trailer, either too long or not hooked up at all and drag along the pavement which causes pieces of metal to break off and lands in the grass along the road and it is hot enough to ignite and cause a devastating wildfire. >> i had no idea about that. so wait, a chain dragging along the road can ignite a fire?

>> i know. we have all seen it. we have done this and i tried to drive up on a flat, because i said, i don't want to stop here and i want to keep going to get to the service station or get somewhere else, well normally, that would not cause a grass fire, but we are seeing it, and we have seen three or four of them just dragging, you know, on a rim. causes that metal to cause sparks to start the grass on fire. >> mary kay hicks, we appreciate your talking to usb and aga, an our best to you and all of those in harm's way. you hear that the dry land is no exaggeration. take a look at this. you can see the fire line moving in a few seconds and the line skre stretches back as far as the eye can see. the state park in awetustin and

6,000 acres burned and more from david mattingly. >> reporter: this woman has not seen her neighborhood since she left it behind in a cloud of smoke. you know what is there for you? >> absolutely. >> reporter: i am going with her to see if there is anything left. she has confirmed the worst. hers is one of 24 hours destroyed by fires in a neighborhood outside of austin, texas. the only question is will there be anything to salvage. >> my heart is pounding. it is pounding so hard right now, because i -- i don't know how i'm going to react when i actually see it and stand in front of it. >> reporter: a short walk down the street reveals friends and neighbors burned out as well. >> katy and brian's house. >> reporter: and then the moment that michelle had been dreading. >> and that is my house.

that is my husband. >> reporter: right here? >> yes. >> oh, i'm sorry. >> the oak trees are still there. >> reporter: trees were left standing, but the two-story house, gone. brick walls fallen away and even the stonework around the backyard pool cracked and buckled under the heat. >> it was completely smooth. >> oh, my gosh! the numbers are standing. >> reporter: the only piece still standing a section of brick where the front door used to be, and only the house numbers are left behind. it is not like the family didn't see the fire coming, because they did. they were standing on this very spot watching the fire cross the highway and come over the ridge, but when it got into the canyon, the wind caught it and the fire was moving so, they barely had time to get out. they had 15 minutes to grab what they could and run for their lives, and it is a good thing they did. because when they came back, that's all that was left of their house.

are you all right? you are shaking? >> i'm okay. i -- the luckiest person in the world, my family is safe. now, i need to check on my neighbors. >> reporter: face to face with all of her possessions and a smoldering pile of ash, nichelle finds time to help others. >> we have nothing. passports and pictures and everything is gone, and we got out with what we were wearing and the cars and our family. >> reporter: and for now na has to be enough as the worst fire season in texas history continues to rage on. david mattingly, cnn, austin, texas. >> so much loss tonight. up nexts the manhunt for ousted libyan leader moammar gadhafi is intensifying. we will have a live report from tripoli. and teenaged boy who liked to wear makeup and jewelry to school who was shot to death in his classroom. police say that a classmate

pulled a trigger and many people saw it, so why a mistrial in the case? and why might it be brought back for a retrial? dr. drew penske will join us next. and inspect your vents. correct. [ male announcer ] we are insurance. ♪ we are farmers ♪ bum, ba-da-bum, bum, bum, bum ♪

tonight the hunt for libya's moammar gadhafi is heating up. a mass exodus of officials who were once close to the former leader sparks new questions about his wrbhereabouts as the loyalists are flooding into

niger, and two convoys have passed through their country this week, and among the ranks the head of the revolutionary guard and the man responsible for gadhafi and his family's security, but is the colonel with them? the state department says no, but it is urging niger to detain members of gadhafi's regime and our correspondent ben wedeman is in tripoli with us to give us the latest. ben, two separate convoys have passed from libya into niger, but as far as we know gadhafi wasn't with them, right? >> no, but all indications are that he was not with them, but where he is, nobody really knows. i mean, we have heard this and seen this reuters report this evening that he is somewhere near the border of either chad or niger, but you have to keep in mind that there's an effort ongoing by the national transitional council, the new rulers of libya to convince those cities and towns that are still loyal to moammar gadhafi to surrender, to give up, and they have sent out this message day after day that they know

where gadhafi is, and that they are going to catch him soon. and this is really part of a psychological effort to undermine the resolve of those towns and cities that are still holding out. we've heard i don't know how many times officials have said they know where he is, but all indications is that they don't know where he is. he could be in sirte on the coast of the mediterranean or in the south, and we have heard a lot of talk that he might be in bani walid, and all indications are that he is not there either, so i would take all of the reports or claims by rebel officials that they know where he is or could be with a good deal of salt. anderson? >> what about saif gadhafi and any sightings of him after he appeared outside of the hotel a few weeks ago? >> well, he made a couple of statements he claimed from tripoli, and the last sort of place where they believe he was

was benny ani walid which is zs miles southeast of here and i have spent a lot of time outside of bani walid, and speaking to the rebel commanders and they say they believe he left bani walid three days ago heading south, and whether that is towards the deep sahara to the south of here about 900 kilometers, it is really hard to say. but, they, we did hear saif and his father say over and over again, they will not leave the country, and until we actually see them outside of libya, i think that we might want to take their word for it. >> and briefly, have the opposition forces said what they will do with gadhafi if and when they catch him? >> well, that i say that they are going to put him on trial, and whether that is in libya or before the international criminal court, and the hague is not clear. this is what they say.

i have spent a lot of time with the fighters here and one of them made it quite clear what he would do if he found moammar gadhafi, and he pulled out the bayonet and dragged it across his throat. that is a very good possibility if in the heat of battle they come across moammar gadhafi, i don't think that they will be getting out the lawbooks, anderson. >> ben wedeman, stay safe to you and your crew. still ahead in the "crime and punishment" an openly gay teen shot dead in his classroom and why his alleged gunman could go free despite a confession. and the 9/11 attacks, ten years later, and drew goodman takes us back to that day with a secret service agent who found himself a potential target. >> so you are counting down the planes coming overhead? >> we knew there were two coming and we knew they were coming to the washington, d.c. area, but we don't know where they are coming to. ♪ gone, like my landlord's smile ♪ ♪ gone, gone away

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in tonight's "crime and

punishment" a student named lawrence king was gunned down and the gunman was brandon mcinerney, and he was brought the trial, but last week a judge declared a mistrial. mcinerney shot king in the back of the head. he was tried as an adult and tried on first-degree murder and use of a handgun, but a jury deadlocked. despite dozens of eyewitness accounts they were torn with half of the jurors voting for manslaughter. now, in a moment we will hear from dr. drew on the surprising outcome of the case, and from the teacher who saw the tragedy unfold. first randi kaye has a look at the crime that has a jury and community divided. >> reporter: in a sea of students at e.o. green junior high school outside of malibu, california, this eighth grader stood out. a boy who came to school dressed like a boy.

15-year-old larry king wore jewelry and makeup and lipstick and mascara and most days he showed up in high-heeled boots. he asked the teachers to call him latesha instead of larry. friends say larry was proud of who he was, and these photos are from the family's website. he was gay and he had come out at age 10 and teachers and students said he frequently acted out making clear his sexual preference which made some students so uncomfortable they bullied him. his friend alexis chavez stood up for him. >> they mocked him and every time he came around they said painful things about him. >> reporter: more than two years ago in february of 2008, the bullying suddenly stopped and not because larry was finally accepted, but because he was dead, murdered police say by a fellow student. that awful day began like any other tuesday for larry king in english class along with two

dozen students and his teacher. they were in the computer lab so that the students could type up their papers and larry was seated in the middle of the room and his classmate brandon mcinerney behind him when police say brandon stood up and pulled out a gun that he had managed to bring into school that day. they say he pointed the gun at the back of larry's head and fired. according to some accounts, brandon dropped the gun and calmly left the classroom. someone called 91 is 1. >> okay. do you know where the person with the gun is? >> no. >> joel, who is the victim? is there a victim? i'm on the phone with dispatch. larry? >> larry was rushed to the hospital. cops picked up brandon within minutes, just blocks from school. >> it is over. it is over. >> reporter: the next day larry was pronounced brain dead, but kept alive for two days so that his organs could be harvested. brandon who turned 14 just weeks before the shooting is being tried as an adult. charged with first-degree murder

and a hate crime and he stands to get more than 50 years in prison, but he says, he's not guilty. brandon's lawyer won't tell us what their defense might be, but in court police testified that brandon may have been bullied, too, by larry, in fact. larry had reportedly told people that the two were dating but had broken up, and a couple of days before the shooting classmates say that larry had asked brandon to be his valentine and brandon's friends joked that the two could make gay babies together. on larry's final day, he left his makeup and heels at home and went to school wearing his uniform just like everyone else. it is ununclear why, but if he had decided to try and blend in, he never had a chance. randi kaye, cnn, new york. >> well, as we said the mistrial was declared last week and the local district attorney is vowing to retry brandon as soon as possible though this time he may face charges in a juvenile

court. some who sympathize with brandon believe he should be punished including dr. drew who is the host of dr. drew on hln, and i spoke to him and the teacher in the classroom when larry king was killed. dr. drew, on the one hand you say it is a simple case because both sides the prosecutor and the defense attorney both agree that this boy, brandon, shot lawrence king to death in a classroom, but it is complicated in that it involves adolescence and gender issues and questions about parenting and school supervision and family life and were you surprised that the jury could not reach a verdict? >> boy, you said a mouthful there, anderson. i completely agree with you, and that is a nice summary of the complex ity of the case and i ws surprised. and not only surprised, but angry. it is a open and shut circumstance, a kid kills another kid and multiple lives in the room are changed forever

and a teacher has her career ruined an suffers from post-traumatic stress disorder and no one has to pay a price for that, but on the other hand, as you bring up, this is a child who committed the crimes and he had home issues and could he not be rehabilitated? i don't think that we can say that. perhaps he could become a fine citizen and the fact that it is a child and then tried adds y i adult, these issues get complicated. >> dawn, you were in the computer lab when larry was killed and i know it is obviously difficult for you the describe, but you were in the court, and also you testified. there was a lot of criticism of the school administrators that they didn't know how the deal with what was going on in the school with larry and the reaction to what he was doing? what was he like as a student and doing that was getting so much attention in the school?

>> larry was definitely acting out and causing and drawing negative attention which is pretty standard for his age group. but the way he was drawing it obviously was a little more than they were all of the other kids were ready to deal with at this point. >> he started to dress in female clothes? >> well, he was not really dressing in female clothes. he was wearing makeup. he was wearing jewelry, and he was still wearing a white polo shirt with blue pants. i think that what you are dealing with was the behavior, and i didn't see that behavior. i didn't happen in front of me. so i couldn't address it directly with him, but i did address him with the way that my friends had told me that he is going overboard and doing some stuff and the administration is not taking care of it, and you need to help us to step in where you can, and that is what i did, i took him aside and spoke with him.

>> dr. drew, this is an extreme case and awful of what occurred, but now schools are dealing with kids at a younger and younger age and this is more of a gender expression issue? >> at least that is the way it is painted, but i keep hearing ruer mos that maybe there was something about his sexuality which is a separate issue, and you are right, anderson. >> and he is a young boy and maybe wrestling with both, but they are separate. >> that is right. absolutely right. and to protect somebody who is wrestling with coming to terms with who they are is incumbent upon the school and it sounds like the school was trying to do it, they were, but it is again another complexity of the case and at what point is that then problematic and what is their duty to protect the other kids who were by the way the children and not trying to help somebody come to terms with the identity, but just other kids. >> and dawn, what do you think should happen to the other young

boy involved in this, brandon? who actually pulled the trigger. >> brandon -- brandon i believe ne needs to serve his sentence. i have a hard time wrestling with he took a life. i don't know how you ever jus i justify that life for a life. >> and prosecutors are saying he was a white supremacist and they found nazi writings at his home, and do you buy any of that? >> no. and i adamantly denied it and basically told them that was a pile of krp when i was on the stand. it was. >> and do you believe it was a hate crime? >> no -- well, obviously it was a hate crime because he hated larry an unfortunately larry was gay, but i don't believe that brandon would have gone out to murder every gay person he ran into. >> i mean, it is interesting, dr. drew, how complex this is, because there are so many issues involved. >> let's just remember that our

attitudes and our law and culture can result in behavior and no more so than on the adolescents who are the barometer of the culture, and we have to pay attention to this. it is sad and we have to think about this very long and hard. >> dr. drew, thank you very much, and dawn boldrin, thank you as well. >> i should point out that dr. drew is going to talk with dawn more on his program at 9:00 p.m. on hln. and also coming up the 10th anniversary of the 9/11 attacks. and we will talk to the secret service agent who was evacuated with all he knew was two planes were headed toward the capital. >> and a crocodile was found that weighed over two tons and we will tell you where it was caught and how many people it took to catch it and plus the "ridiculist" is coming up. [ male announcer ] this is coach parker...

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well, the anniversary of the september 11th attacks is five days away and even after ten years we are hearing compelling stories of that day from people with haunting perspectives. in the back of the 9/11 commission report there are more than 1,700 footnotes and many of of those footnotes are people's stories and airline dispatchers and airline traffic controllers and swun a man you are about to meet. a secret service agent who stayed in the white house after it was evacuated to see if a plane was going to hit. drew griffin has his story. >> reporter: at 9:05 a.m., the

white house learned that a plane was hijacked from dulles. it was already turning around, and this time heading for washington, d.c. nelson garabito was the secret service agent in charge of protecting the white house air space, and then vice president dick cheney was hustled to a nearby bunker while the president was on air force one. >> the first thing i did was to pick up my phone to call the contact at the faa and he said four planes outstanding. two have hit the towers and two are headed to washington, d.c. one of them approximately 30 minutes out and one of them approximately 45 minutes out. so we knew we had some time, but little time. >> reporter: the order came to evacuate the white house. garibedo said he could hear the workers scrambling to leave. his supervisors gave him and the rest of the staff including two

civilians the option to leave. no one did. so you are basically counting down the plane coming overhead. >> we knew there were two coming, but at this point, we know they are coming to the washington, d.c. area, but we don't know where they are coming to. >> reporter: as the minutes then and seconds ticked by, garabito braced for impact. >> as the one nearest us got closer and closer, and six minutes out, five minutes out, we knew it was over the cia and we thought, is that where it is going? but it kept coming. and then at one point, we got under one minute and i said it is 30 seconds out. >> drew griffin joining me now, and it is remarkable that the secret service agent bracing for the plane to hit the white house and i never heard that before. it is easy to forget that feeling of not having any idea what was going to happen next. >> and anderson, i know you have talked to the secret service agents before on a mull tud tit

stories and how helpful they were and how helpful all of us were and waiting to hear the plane coming by, was it going to hit my building and that is how literally the secret service agents had to act that day, waiting for the plane to land, hit, crash, whatever. it was a helpless feeling. >> it is a unique way of looking at 9/11, because most of the stories are untold, and you got this idea of looking through the footnotes of the 9/11 commission report? >> yes, five years ago i met a guy who checked in mohammed atta at a ticket counter and he wondered why nobody followed him, and we took it a step further by getting the 9/11 commission investigators to find us the footnotes they felt were compelling and not just the unsung heroes and though anderson, there are some of them, but people who lived with real regret for what they did and didn't do that day. >> and so many untold stories, drew. later, you can meet some of of the everyday citizens who went

to work on september 11th, 2001 and became a part of history. watch cnn presents photonofootn 9/11. it is an interesting program. now, let's hear what is coming up from randi kaye. >> well, stopping by the situation room, dick cheney discussed his memoir and he defends iraq and he believes that big changes are on the way for one of iraq's neighbors. >> well, you know, i think that bashir asad is not long for the world either. h he is on the way out, because of the unrest that has been taken by his own people inside of syria. he is one of the most unpopular leaders in the middle east. it is the middle east. stuff happens in the middle east and you know it because you have vr coed it for years, but you cannot make the case that the world would be better off today if saddam hussein were in power. >> no regrets about iraq?

>> i think that we made exactly the right decisions. >> police say that a gunman killed himself and wounded eight others after at and ihop. the family said that the man had family issues, and they are looking at that as possible motive. and a man in mississippi was beaten and killed and run over by a truck has filed a wrongful death suit against a group of teens ak kud of being at the scene. it was caught on this surveillance. the suit says that these white teens set out to harass african-americans. and this is in italy that knox is appealing her verdict and sentence of killing her roommate, and this is coming after two forensic experts were

accused of mishandling evidence on a bra clasp and knife. and a crocodile is captured in the philippines. according to reports it took 30 men to take control of the 2,370-pound reptile. the new home, anderson s a nature park. >> that is unbelievable. >> you see the size of that thing? >> wow, that is incredible. i have never seen anything that large. and upcoming a road trip with kate gosselin and her kids and a slice of pizza that made it to ridiculist heaven. [ male announcer ] members of the american postal workers union

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time now for the ridiculist and tonight, we have to add kate gosselin on last night's episode of "kate plus eight" on tlc, she was on a cross country trip in an rv and her cousin ashley was on to help out. and everything was going along great, but it was not great because it was a cross country trip with eight kids in a rv and then an issue came up. a pizza. who controlled the said pizza, kate or babysitter ashley. >> we have all of the pizza, and the french fries. >> this is not going to be good. you can feel it, can't you? but think about this, kate has eight kids and a standard pizza contains eight slices and if the ratio is tampered with the whole lunchtime balancing act goes right to hell, and kate is just

concerned about feeding all of the eight kids. >> right. who wants a piece of pizza right now? >> wait, who is steve? standby. well, steve is kate's body guard i'm being told. >> steve wants a piece of pizza right now, hand it over. you can eat salads, give him the pizza. >> give it to him. that is rude. >> what do you mean, that was rude? >> he reserved it last night. >> i'm having a hard time telling who is who. ashley is in the van, ashley the babysitter and steve the body guard reserved it, and kate is right, you can eat salads afterall with the kids, because if there is one thing i know about the kids, they love salad. and the middle aged bodyguards can get cranky if their schedule is thrown off. the good news is that steve got the slice of pizza, but the bad news is that one of the kids handed it to him with their bare

hands. >> oh, my gosh! that is disgusting. >> who cares. >> who handed it to you? >> god forbid. >> story. sorry. >> literally, you handed it to a kid to hand out without wrapping nit fo it in foil? >> it is not a big deal. >> maybe when the steve the body guard reserved a slice of pizza at a rv filled with kids should have put it in foil. maybe he should have written it in masking tape and what about the children and the fries? >>, the fries you said were for the adults? >> yes. >> and the salad and -- he did not want maddie handing out a piece of pizza with her dirty hands out of the window. >> oh, and it is such a travesty. >> wow. it has been a long trip, and everyone is getting a little bit snippy, all that matters is this, now that steve's pizza has been sullied with the unwashed hands of a child, what is he going to eat? >> you want