>> i think mariah's challenge is something that makes people think a little more, to say we can do better. mariah is forever, i can't get her back, but i can help other parents keep their kids safe. if we save one child, we save a generation. the worst race riots this country has ever seen. and the man at the center -- >> no, put your f'ing head face down. with my hands up, showed no threat. >> rodney king his race, his rage, and his death. >> don on camera 2. >> this one here, because alatino vote. >> the black vote. >> what about the white people? the real deciders in the presidential election. >> we've got 30 seconds. >> and doubting the existence of god? if you're losing faith, you're not alone.

>> a reading from the holy gospel. >> tonight, we ask, at this rate, decades from now will anyone believe god even exists? i play devil's advocate. >> stand by. >> hello, everyone. i'm don lemon. we'll get you up to speed now. rodney king was found dead at his home today? suburban los angeles. the 47-year-old whose beating by police triggered riots years ago was found at the bottom of his pool. police say there is no sign of foul play. the acquittal of l.a. police officers in the king beating sparked days of rioting that left more than 50 people dead. in just moments we'll have more on how america changed because of rodney king. the national election in greece, it's over. voters picked the conservative new democracy party to form a government taking european

bailout and stay in the eurozone. had the opposition gotten more votes greece ran the risk of dropping out of the euro, and that would have pounded the markets worldwide. soaring temperatures, strong winds fueling a new wildfire in the lake george area of colorado. evacuations are under way as flames threaten a number of homes. firefighters near ft. collins are trying to get the upper hand on the massive hyde park fire. >> it will be some time before the fire is out. over 140,000 man hours have already been dedicate to this fire. >> almost 200 homes have been destroyed. high fire warnings are currently in place for nine western states. heading into a new week in washington and the president's big shift on immigration policies still the talk of the town. the president made it easier friday for some children of illegal immigrants to avoid deportation. he called it the fair and just thing in do.

top obama aid told our candy crowley that politics was not a factor in the decision. >> this builds on steps we've taken. you could have done it last year, the year before, the year before that. >> we've been trying to get the dream act done. we've been trying to pass immigration reform. this builds on a series of stages the homeland security department has taken. gives law enforcement personnel the ability to have more discretion and focus resources where it should be focussed, which is criminals deportation number -- >> it was not done without some political consideration. >> it was not. >> five months before the election? >> listen, who knows how the politics will turn out. but this decision -- >> probably pretty good. >> well, we'll see. i've ceased making predictions. >> mitt romney believes it was politics and told cnn politic was a big part of the equation behind the announcement.

he didn't vow to repeal the decision but said he would look for a longer term solution. >> well it would be overtaken by events, if you will, by virtue of my putting in place a long-term solution with legislation, which creates law, that relates to individuals, such that they know what their setting is going to be not only for the term of the president but a permanent basis. >> i don't want it keep on but b this, but to make sure i understand, would you leave this in place while you worked out a long-term solution or would you just repeal it? >> we'll look at that setting as we reach that. the beating of rodney king was clearly much more than a case of police brutality. the incident pulled back a curtain revealing a very dark truth about race relations in america. cnn's nick valencia was living in los angeles during the riots sparked by rodney king's case. when the riots started there was

no internet, no twitter, no cell phone. how did you find out and people in los angeles find out the city was starting to burn? >> my family and i were huddled around tv, i was 8, we were watching the news. i didn't get scared until my mom and dad were scared. when you're a kid your parents are like ten-feet tall, my dad lived through the first riots in los angeles and this scared him. >> this went on for days. >> for at least a week. >> at least a week. what was it like, as a child, for you being -- did you have to stay at home? could you go to school? did you go out and about? >> imagine this, looking outside your balcony, 15 minutes northeast of downtown loss l osx angeles, where the riots were concentrated, seeing smoke plumes 15 minutes away, chilling. >> lasting effect? >> formative event. >> why? >> it's probably the reason i went into news. so many things going on in los

angeles during the '90s and the rodney king incident was very big part of that, no matter the color of your skin. if you were living in los angeles this impacted you, and it had a big impact on me and my family. >> you say that, i had just -- i was a cub journalist in a new york city was newsroom when riots broke out. they were closing down fifth avenue and stores and the fancy shops in manhattan because they thought the rioting may spread across the country and come to new york. this was an event not only the u.s. but the world watched the event. >> it resonated everywhere. i remember talking to my dad and asking if we could move to los angeles, one of the near big cities of los angeles that wasn't impacted by the rioting. i wanted to get out, everybody else wanted to get out. watching our city burn to the ground. >> this was one of the first big incidents caught on videotape. this is precell phone. >> sparked an era in journal ism. >> one of the first, if not the first. you know what? there are very few other

incidents caught on camera that evoked as much passion and as much of a response that that rodney king beating video. of course the subsequent video from the rioting. >> i remember that. you covered it with such vigor during the 20th anniversary. that's why it seems so recent it happened, it left a lasting impact and impression on everybody in los angeles. >> thank you very much, nick valencia, appreciate it. it was just last year rodney king took me back to the very spot of the famous beating and talked about turning his life around, a new man, 20 years later, he said. >> i consider myself a decent, you know, good human being. >> this is rodney king that night in the days that followed, like you've never seen before, next. [ truck beeping ]

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nobody keeps you on the road like progressive commercial auto. [ flo speaking japanese ] [ shouting in japanese ] we work wherever you work. now, that's progressive. call or click today. last year i sat in rodney king's living room, one-on-one he walked me through step by step what happened along a california road in 1991 on a night that changed this country. >> reporter: a city in flames. entire neighborhoods burn to the ground. now two decades later, what's it like to be the man whose beating, seen around the world, ignited one of the worst race

riots in u.s. history? do you still have nightmares? >> yeah, yeah. i'm -- i do. >> what's a nightmare? do you wake up like tossing and turning, sometimes hearing voices that was going on that night. >> get down, get down. get down you f'ing -- you know those words, you know? that's how i have to wake up, it's all right, look outside, it's all green and blue. >> reporter: king's nightmare begins just after midnight. he and two friends out celebrating, head west on the 210 freeway. >> i just gotten word that my old construction company had called me to come back to work that following monday. >> reporter: but the celebration is cut short. state police clock king's car going 110 miles per hour and immediately start a nearly eight-mile high-speed chase through l.a. neighborhoods.

>> i was doing 100, i did every bit of 100, and i'm not proud of it. >> reporter: following our interview, rodney king agrees to relive those terrifying moments by taking me back to the scene. >> coming down the 210. >> reporter: as retrace his steps we discuss the split-second decisions. >> i exit here on paxton. >> reporter: where did you pull over? >> i seen all of the apartments over there, i said, man, i'm going to stop right here if it goes down, somebody will see it. >> reporter: once stopped he they are surrounded by police, king's two friends are arrested without incident but rodney king would have a different fate. >> when i opened the door, she said take three steps back away from the car which i did that, took three steps back. i took three steps back, said lay down.

when i laid down i laid down like this. and my face was facing this way, so i could see them. they said, no put your f'ing head down, face down. when i finally face down, bam, took the blow. bam. a real hard blow to the temple. when he did that i looked and i went up like that, run this way with my hands up showed no threat. and that's when i didn't know, but my leg was broke. >> if you're just hearing now, king was found dead today, in los angeles, drowned in his swimming pool. coming up a little bit later i talked with rodney king about the challenges he faced over the past 20 years. the president seems to have a new strategy when it comes to congress, if you can't beat them, don't join them, simply do nothing. governoring through inaction, next. do you have any idea where you're going ? wherever the wind takes me.

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the president makes a surprise shift on immigration

policy, but why? he calls it the right thing to do, but critics see politics as the motivation here. i talked about it with cnn contributors will cain and maria cardona, and i asked maria if the president could made his move three years ago and if it was gaining support from hispanics. >> he would have loved to do this three years ago or any time before now, don, but what happened? absolutely zero support from any republican in congress to help him do this. let's remember, he cannot change the laws or pass laws by himself. democrats can't do it by themselves. he needs republicans. let's remember, in 2010, he famously tried to pass the dream act. he called republican senators asking them for their support on this. you know how many voted for it then? three. he needs help on this. >> i understand what you're saying but you can't say this isn't about politics. of course it's about politics. he wants to be the president

again. >> look, don, if the president yawns during an election year people will tell -- >> i'm not saying anything's wrong with that. can't he be honest about that. >> i'm saying everything he does this year is looked at through the prism of politics. >> go ahead, will. >> we know what happens when your policy goes meet a stonewall of inaction through the democratic process. we now know the answer to that question, we have numerous examples to support our conclusion. the president then picks and chooses which laws he will support, which laws he enforce, that's the word to use, enforce, that's the power granted to the president in the constitution, enforce the law. we know the president will pick and choose which laws he choses to enforce. listen here, maria. i hope we can have this conversation with no partisanship. this lays a precedent regardless of who the president is, regardless of what party he comes from that should terrify everyone. should terrify everyone. >> i'm going to ask both of you this. if you -- and everyone is saying

it's no secret that people believe that there is inaction in congress and in washington that nothing is getting done. if the president can figure out a way of getting it done, hang on maria, will, what's wrong with that? if you are being stonewalled every place you turn and figure out a way to get something done, regardless of which party you're from, what's wrong with na if you can figure out way to do it? >> you're suggesting the democratic process is insufficient. to accomplish your policy goals. the president has two outs on not enforcing a congressional law, law passed by congress, through the democratic process. one if he sees the law unconstitutional. there's nothing here, no serious argument whether or not this is constitutional, whether or not our immigration laws are constitutional. the second is prosecutorial discretion, which means we, as the executive branch, don't have

the money to pursue a certain criminal. does not mean we invalidate an entire law. this does not fit into either press den. you have to ask yourself, maria has to wonder, what happens if a president, mitt romney, decides doesn't like capital gains cap rate? i'm not going to use the irs to prosecute their taxes. i'm not going to have the irs prosecute the fines for obama care for not buying mandated insurance. >> let her answer. go ahead. >> first, let's tell truth here. this is not an absolute decree and the president has said this very clearly. this is still a case by case review of each case that comes before them. it is, like you said, will, prosecutorial discretion, which the president has under the law. so he is not basically ignoring anything. >> that's not true. >> he's using the authority that he has under current law to do a case by case review of each of these kids who, by the way, have done nothing wrong of their own doing. and, by the way, you're right, this actually has been done before.

bush famously, when he signed legislation would include statements basically saying if he didn't like pieces of the law he wasn't going to enforce it. my thanks to maria and will. firefighters in colorado now have even more to worry about, details next. plus, this -- >> this one here, because of the latino vote. >> the black vote. >> what about the white people? the real decider in the presidential election.

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welcome back. almost half past the hour. get you caught up on headlines here on cnn. rodney king, the man whose beating by los angeles police sparked riots 20 years ago, found dead in his swimming pool today. king's fiancee heard a splash and walked out to fine his body at the bottom of the pool. no sign of foul play. the acquittal of l.a. police officers seen beating king on videotape sparked days of rioting that left more than 50 people dead. the greek people enacted a government today, a conservative one, that promises to keep greece in the eurozone. most of the financial world including the united states holding its breath now, waiting to see global market reaction in the morning. also election day, election weekend in egypt. voters went to the polls to pick the first president since the fall of hosni mubarak. polls are closed. vote counting under way. expect results to be officially

announced on thursday. dangerous conditions out west. where yet another fire has erupted due to hot, dry conditions. evacuations are under way in the lake george area of colorado. meantime firefighters near ft. collins are trying to get the upper hand on the massive hyde park fire. almost 200 homes destroyed and more than 55,000 acres burned. fire warnings currently in place for nine western states. lawyers for jerry sandusky expected to begin presenting their defense tomorrow. prosecution is expected to rest its case. so far the jury has heard from men describing years of sexual abuse at the hand of sandusky. a former penn state assistant football coach charged with 52 counts of molesting 10 boys for more than a decade. we like to see questions get answered on this program. but not like this -- >> it is -- it is the right thing to do. excuse me, sir. it's not time for questions,

sir. not while i'm speaking. precisely because this is temporary. >> there is no way we're going to pardon that interruption on tonight's no talking points. don't miss it. you don't are to be in front of a television to watch cnn. you can stay connected, do it on your cell phone or do it from your computer at work. let's go to cnn.com/tv. and zoom... in your car. introducing the all-new cadillac xts with cue. ♪ don't worry. we haven't forgotten. you still like things to push. [ engine revs ] the all-new cadillac xts has arrived, and it's bringing the future forward.

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it is time now for no talking points. neil munro, how dare you. >> is it -- it is the right thing to do. excuse me, sir. i -- it's not time for questions, sir. not while i'm speaking. precisely because this is temporary.

>> matt lewis, the nerve. >> there was going to be no question and answer. this was the only chance he had to ask a question. >> happens all the time. he had no business interrupting the president. >> the press corps should be less differential to authority. >> tucker carlson, the audacity as editor in chief both men work for to defend boorish behavior, by writing, quote, i don't remember diane sawyer scolding sam donaldson for hecking the president. then sum up your response by saying, we're proud of neil munro. what if someone heckled you in your "dancing with the stars "ruse teen. someone needs to take a long look in the mirror ball. wait, you didn't win. in fact the first sent packing. plus, tucker, there's a big difference between sam donaldson and neil munro. who the hell is neil munro's?

this dig any find that response read like this. never once did i interrupt a president in any way while he was making a formal statement. donaldson says what munro did was something new to me, wrong and unusual. he also says, let's face it, many on the political right believe this president ought not to be there, they oppose him not for his policies ands political view, but for who he is, an african-american! finally, the elephant in the rose garden, thank you, sam donaldson, enough said there. some in the conservative media called munro's hissy fit refreshing, most thankfully have denounced it. >> i think it's outrageous. >> mr. munro's absolutely wrong in interfering with the president's statement. >> he's representing all of us. >> i'm hoping make tucker didn't see it, didn't know the context, because tucker knows better. >> must respect the office of the presidency even if you don't like the person in it. >> and, yes, other presidents have been badgered by the media, sam donaldson had his moments with president reagan, david gregory versus president george

w. bush, ed henry and president obama. heck, w. was even dodged shoes but he was in a war zone and it was in iraqi reporter who did it and the guy was taken down by security. but this is america. it's not a war zone. and we pride ourselves on civility. and we also respect the office of the presidency, just as we respect the courage of a man or a woman who dons a uniform to fight for our country. as a journalist, i know there are ways to get my questions answered it may not always be on the time line i want but there's always way a way to do. interrupting the leader of the free world at the white house in front of an international office is not the way. quite frankly, you're the one who should be asking answering a whole lot of questions of yourself. that's tonight's no talking points. ♪

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heard anyone talking about white voters lately? me either. sounds funny, but can you name the last time mitt romney or president obama made a direct appeal to white folks? white's make up 3/4 of all voters. so when i talked about it with cnn contributor anna and stephen moore of the "wall street journal" i asked anna why it seem there's no love for white voters in this campaign. >> i think there's plenty of love for white votes. you've got mitt romney doing a bus tour through new hampshire, through ohio, pennsylvania. i've got it tell you, i've been through new hampshire, ohio, and there's a lot of white people there. they're getting plenty of love. they are -- it's a good voting group for republicans. we actually have a white male gap that obama has got to overcome. >> yeah. and that's why we're talking about this. trust me, i was at the iowa state fair and so your point is well taken there, anna.

stephen, a new survey president obama pulling in 38% of white voters. is that a white voter problem? you wrote about that this week, didn't you? >> yeah, it is a big problem for president obama. i wrote the story, don, as you said at the outset of the show, everybody talks about the latino vote and the black vote and the senior vote and the soccer mom vote but nobody looks closely at biggest voter bloc of all, which is still whites. it's about 70% to 75% of the electorate. when i started to kind of look at those numbers in the polling, lo and behold it shows that barack obama does have a white voter problem that's worse than it was back in 2008. let me say this i actually believe, don, there's no question that in 2008 barack obama's race was an asset, americans loved the idea of electing the first black

president. i think that really helped him in the election. it was cool to be for barack obama. it's a little bit of a problem, though, it's -- let me put it this way, it's not big as an asset now as it was then, because barack obama has a record to run on. and so, you do have more skepticism of white voters. by the way, the polling shows barack obamas is undoing unbelievably well with black voters, polls as high as 94%, 95% of the black vote is nor barack obama. >> the interesting thing this time that is will the black electorate be as passionate going to the polls as they were last time. >> great point. >> if that doesn't happen, it's going to pose a big challenge for president obama. it's interesting, anna, and stephen, last time you would think, barack obama is the president of the united states, you would think that he'd garner most of the white vote. he didn't. john mccain did. so steven i want to talk about something you mentioned earlier. you talked about, you know, about people last time were proud to go to the polls and

vote because the idea of a black president. >> sure. >> do you think some liberals have white guilt -- i'm being honest, we talked about this -- and when they go into the polls this time they may be reluctant to deny the first black president a second term? >> i think there's a little bit of than i think no question about it. look the american people like barack obama. not just because of his race and being the first black president, but he's a likable person. >> but does the economy outweigh that? >> yes, definitely it does. i think that's the reason barack obama has a white voter problem. where the problem is most severe, and i looked at the kind of cross tabulations in this polling data, there's a kind of white, middle class anxiety out there a lot of white middle class voters did vote for barack obama in 2008 but feeling financial strain, they know a family member who doesn't have a job, and, yes, i think don you put your finger on it the economic issues are trumping these issues of it's cool to be

for barack obama. >> okay. so anna? >> don, i think it's a lot less about race, i think, and than it is about history. four years ago, obama was a phenomenon, obama was a history exle moment, a historical opportunity. the thing is you can only make history once and he's made it. no he's no longer the historical figure. he's the gray-haired president who's got a four-year record that he's got to defend and contend with. talking about two completely barack obamas. he's not less black or more black today than he was four years ago, and not about that issue. it's the historical component that i think is the determine ant factor. >> one last point. >> go ahead. >> barack obama does have to get 40% of the white vote. it's hard to go over the finish line if he doesn't get 4 out of 10. right now he's at 38%. he has some work to do. >> my thanks to stephen and anna? next -- and doubting the existence of god?

if you're losing faith, you're not alone. >> a reading from the holy gospel. >> tonight we ask at this rate, decades from now, will anyone believe god even exists? i play devil's advocate. you're out and about, not in front of a television to stay connected to cnn. pull up on your cell phone or watch from computer at work. go to cnn.com/tv. tell them don lemon sent you. sweet! [ male announcer ] the solid thunk of the door on the jetta. thanks, mister! [ meow ] [ male announcer ] another example of volkswagen quality. that's the power of german engineering. right now lease the 2012 jetta for $159 a month. visit vwdealer.com today. right now lease the 2012 jetta for $159 a month. recently, students from 31 countries took part in a science test.

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it is the top story on cnn tonight. a key figure in recent american history is dead, rodney king was found dead at his home today in his swimming pool. his beating at hands of los angeles police and the street violence that followed

permanently changed los angeles, its police department, and the race conversation in america. just a few minutes ago i talked with cnn's nick valencia, living in l.a. near south central 20 years ago when the riots exploded. >> my family and i were huddled around the tv, i was 8, watching the news. i didn't get scared until my mom and dad were scared. when you're a kid, your parents are like ten feet tall to you. when they were scared -- my dad lived through the first watts riots in los angeles -- and this in scared him. >> this went on for days. >> at least a week. >> what was it like, as a child, for you being -- did you have to stay at home? could you go to school? could you go out and about? >> imagine you're looking outside you're balcony, 15 minutes northeast of downtown los angeles, many riots in south central, seeing smoke on tv and looking out on the balcony

seeing smoke plumes 15 minutes away it was chilling. >> lasting effect? >> formative event. it's probably the reason i went into news. so many things going on in los angeles in's '90 and the rodney king was a big part of that, no matter the color of your skin. if you were living in los angeles at this time, this impacted you and had a big impact on me my family. >> i was a cub journalist in a new york city newsroom when the riots broke out. we were saying what is go on? they were closing down fifth avenue and stores on the fancy shops in manhattan because they thought the rioting may spread across country and come to new york. this was an event not only of the u.s. but the world watched this event. >> resonated everywhere. i remember talking to my dad and

asking him if we could move to las vegas because it was near big cities of los angeles that wasn't impacted by the rioting. i wanted to get out. everybody else wanted to get out. watching our city burn to the ground. >> this was one of the first big incidents caught on videotape. this is precell phone. >> sparked an era of journalism. >> it was the first, if not the first, very few other incidents caught on cam that effect much passion and response than the rodney king beating video. and of course the subsequent video that came out from the rioting. >> that's right. i remember that. you covered it with such vigor last year during the 20th anniversary. that's why it seems to recent it happened. it left a lasting impact and impression on everybody that lived in los angeles. >> nick, thank you very much. we really appreciate it. for a man whose severe beating changed america rodney king struggled to become a changed man himself. i sat down with him in his living room where he told me about his battles and he continued to live his life in fear. in the 20 years since his

life was turns upside down, rodney king has relocated to suburban rialto, california. he's 20 years older and, according to him, a lot wiser. he admits his past is riddled with bad decisions. >> if you could do it all over again, what would you do? go out that night? >> i'd have stayed home. i think i'd have stayed home. >> for years after the beating, rodney king continued to have run-ins with the law. in 1996, he was sentenced to 90 days for a hit-and-run involving his wife. he was also arrested several times on charges related to domestic abuse. drug intoxication and indecent exposure. >> why, after all that, that's what people would say, especially black people, why after all that, rodney, are you still getting in trouble? >> i guess the trouble they see me in is a part of my life i'm working on. >> 20 years later, rodney king still lives in fear. >> years after the beating, you wore a vest?

>> oh, yeah. >> do you still wear a vest? >> yeah i do. i do. >> he wears a bulletproof vest in large crowds because threats against his life were all too real. the fbi once infiltrated a white supremacist plot to assassinate king. >> over your shoulder. >> you know, i -- i never feel safe, you know? it's things that happen. >> when you are part of history and it changes, for the better, you've got a lot of devilish people out there that don't like it. >> when rodney king had the blood on his face, that mugshot of you with the blood on your face, who was he then? >> oh, man, a guy that was almost dead and just like happy to be able to still have that face to be able to see that face. >> and rodney king now? all cleaned up, trimmed goatee, beads around his neck, who is rodney king now?

>> i consider myself a decent, you know, good human being. during my interview with king, we went back to the scene of the police beating, and you can see that interview in its entirety tonight as part of our special race and rage, the beating of rodney king, in ten minutes here on cnn. it's getting away ! where is it ? it's gone. we'll find it. any day can be an adventure. that's why we got a subaru. love wherever the road takes you. wow, there it is.

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okay. for your sunday night mysteries, we solve one puzzle and give you one to think about. okay, who in the world are these people? photographs found on civil war battlefields, in the pockets of dead northerners and southerners as well a civil war museum in virginia is hoping to recognize one face and speaks up. i'm reading slow on purpose i'm want you to look at these faces. they return the pictures to the rightful owners. the museum knows it's a long shot, but won't it be amazing if they actually do find a descendant? and no longer a mystery tonight, forest boy, he's a young man who told police in germany that he's an orphan and has been living in the woods alone since he was a little kid. turns out his story was b.s. we know what b.s. stands for.

and he really is a dutch guy who who's a troublemaker back home. someone in holland recognized him and called authorities. forest boy staying at a youth home in berlin, getting money and free clothes. germans are going to put him on a train back to the netherlands. nice try. go now to the big stories in the week ahead from the white house to hollywood. i'm athena jones in washington. president obama begins this week in mexico at g-20 summit. expected to meet president putin and differences over syria are almost certain to come up. at end of the week the president heads to florida, where he'll talk to latino leaders eight conference in orlando. latinos are going to be a key voting bloc to watch in november. >> i'm poppy harlow in new york. all eyes on world markets following greece's sunday election. the outcome, no doubt will impact markets around the globe,

given the significance of the election and the future of the eurozone. back here in the united states, the federal reserve will hold a two-day policy meeting. close attention paid to comments made by ben bernanke following the meeting especially any hints whether or not the fed will act further to stimulate the u.s. economy. on the docket the latest home sales and home building numbers. a lot ahead on wall street. >> i'm nischelle turner. what we're watching "showbiz tonight," emmy award nominees, one-on-one with heather tom and maurice bernard. make sure to watch all next week. watch the daytime emmys on june 23rd here on hln. >> thanks, guys. on the show we tend to ask the questions a lot of others are afraid to ask. this weekend was no different. this past week we learned young people are more and more questioning the existence of god. i asked, where is the proof that god even exists?

time to play devil's advocate with jim and tammy faye's sun, pastor baker. more people are now saying they have questioned the existence of god. so i'm going to lay it out there for you. what's the proof? give me the proof, the physical proof that god exists. >> well i think the idea that everyone sees god as this being in the sky when really i think if you look at god as being like the grounded being. god is the ground below us, god is in everything. for me i can't prove to you and that's why it's called faith. you know, if it was -- if it was a belief it would be called belief. but for me it's faith. >> a lot of people would come on and say of course i can prove to you that there is a god. look at the sun. look at the moon. look at the trees. i was talking to people in social media and i said give me physical proof that god exists. and those were similar answers. i said what about is there a

recorded conversation? do you have physical proof? so really playing devil's advocate. there is no real physical proof, is there? >> no, no, there's not. i mean the sun is an interesting idea just because it's an amazing thing to study. but, no, there's no physical proof. and the thing, though, we have to realize, doubt is not the opposite of faith. doubt is actually an element of faith. so you know, that was said by paul tellic. i really have to agree with that. you can't have one without the other. when you don't doubt you don't grow and don't question things and it's important to question things. i think -- i think faith is becoming something else but i think the church is going to shrink. we'll see less religious people because of partisan politics and how people -- how the church as treated the gay community. i think we'll see -- definitely see a decline. >> for those among us who

consider themselves christian, if you read the bible and read the red parts, the guy who is jesus said doubt, doubt, doubt, doubt everything. >> he doubted, you know, in the garden and also on the cross, he said, you know, god, why have you forsaken me? we have a god that was forsaken by god. in a way, christ was an atheist at one point. >> interesting. saying subversive things here. i want to show you a quote from stephen hawking. he told the guardian i regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when components fail. there is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark. that's his final conclusion. listen. >> it's my view that the simplest explanation is there is no god. no one created the universe.

no one directs our faith. >> arguably one of the greatest minds of our time. do you think people are starting to see heaven as a fairy story? >> yeah, i think so. i think it's starting when people started questioning hell and people question heaven. i think what's important is that we don't live for life after death. you know what i mean? we have life before death. and that we love each other and focus on helping one another and necessarily you don't have to have religion for that. but for some of us it's a comfort. for some of us it's -- it's shown us a whole new world. i'm obsessed with the idea of grace because of the bible and the church. >> listen, i have to run. but i want to ask you, weren't you writing -- why aren't you write ak booking on doubt? >> because it's something i've dealt with over the past years. i doubt just as much as anybody else does. and i think it's important to realize that doubt is part of

faith. it is an element of faith and it's okay to have. i just want other people out there, so many people have fears over the years of doubting about but now we have computers and internet and facebook, everybody's able to share doubts. which is a powerful thing. and we shouldn't -- we shouldn't have -- ever have the ability to tell someone they can't doubt or shouldn't do. you can't do that anyway. you're going to doubt everything. rodney king, the man whose beating by police set off one of the worst race riots ever in this country has died. king was found unconscious in his pool early today's by his fiance, cynthia kelly. kelly called 911 and police arrived to find king unresponsive at the bottom of his pool. just last year on the 20th anniversary of his beating, i spent time with king and his fiance at their suburban los angeles home. they talked about the wake