stronger than ever as a community. that's what the mayor of colorado springs was articulate when the president of here, talking about how colorado springs -- they're going to come back. >> lots and lots of stories out of colorado this week. individual stories. and the big story. governor john hickenlooper, thank you very much for joining us. >> you bet. thank you, candy. >> if you'd like to help the victims of the colorado fires, visit cnn.com/impact. thank you very much for watching "state of the union." i'm candy crowley in washington. if you missed any part of today's show, find us on itunes. "fareed zakaria gps" is next for our viewers in the united states. this is "gps," the "global public square." welcome to all of you in the united states and around the world. i'm fareed zakaria. we'll start with politics in the wake of the supreme court ruling on health care. what does it mean for the presidential race, for health care? what about economics? i've got a star-studded panel to

discuss all this. then we go overseas to egypt's election of muhammad morsi. what can we expect from an islamist president? two of the top egypt experts tell us. next, how do you count and catalog 1.2 billion people? i'll ask the man creating a revolutionary biometric i.d. for every one of india's citizens. also, the housing bubble caused the crash. will the coming housing boom finally power this anemic recovery? first, here's my take. what to do about syria. western military intervention looks fraught with difficulties, but the situation on the ground is a humanitarian nightmare and is producing greater instability by the week. i was recently in turkey and russia, and i've been persuaded that there might be a path forward. the pressures on bashir al assad's regime are mounting. it is running out of cash, and it now faces a real military

threat from turkey. these pressures could be combined with smart diplomacy to push assad out of power. but it would mean trying to work with the russian government rather than attacking it. the u.s. has been bashing russia for shielding assad, coddling an apply at the cost of human lives, for arming the syrian military. some of this is true, some false. but all of it is unhelpful if the goal is to oust assad. unless the united states intends to ask iran for help. russia is the only country with any influence with the syrian regime. now the first thing to realize is the extent of russia's link with syria are limited. the economic ties are weak, russia is syria's ninth largest trading partner, accounting for just 3% of syrian trade. well behind the e.u., iraq, china. political bonds are not strong either. assad's first trip to moscow took place five years after he

became president, well after he had gone to france and britain and turkey. this is not the behavior of a client state. russia's naval base at tartus is often described as highly strategic, yet it is rarely used. it's been allowed to crumble, no russian ship is based there. russia is the main arms exporter to syria, though its deliveries to syria are marginal, less than .1 what is sends to india every year. but its ties to the syrian army could be very useful. moscow could reach out and make syria's generals understand that they could preserve the military if they assisted in dislodging the regime and moving to a democratic framework. that's essentially what the egyptian military has done and while the revolution is not perfect, it's been preferable to a long and bloody civil war. russia might be unmovable. its officials are paranoid about western interventions that topple unpopular regimes. we've seen kosovo, afghanistan,

iraq, and elizabeth as parts of a pattern, but they're also concerned about what would come after assad in a country, syria, where 40% are minorities, especially if some long, sectarian war would energize jihadi groups. russia has had and continues to have struggles with such groups in its southern regions and border areas. if the russians could be persuaded that assad is going to fall and that the best way to prevent radicalization is to push for transition now, they might be willing to help in that transition. it's a long shot, but it's not impossible that moscow will shift from being part of the problem to part of the solution. it's certainly worth the effort before we move toward a wider and deeper war. for more on this, you can read my column in "time" magazine or at time.com. let's get started.

joining me to discuss this wild week in america and maybe we'll get to europe, as well, jeffrey sachs, economist who serves as director of columbia university's earth institute. peter schiff is an economist, businessman, and author who recently ran for senate on the republican ticket in connecticut. peter orzag was president obama's first budget director. he's now a citibank executive and cluolumnist for bloomberg. and katrina van hufl is editor and publisher. welcome to you all. we've to see talk about the supreme court ruling, and none of us are constitutional scholars, so the question i would ask is, politically catrine ado-- katrina, does it help obama or energize the tea party? >> i think it's a victory for obama, a victory for the american people, a victory for the fersz who have been fighting very a sane health care policy

for this country. human, moral. i think it also helps with the legitimacy, leadership of his presidency because that was a question. it helps in the sense of this renewed priorities because this president if he gets out and makes the case, explains provisions that show even republicans when it's broken down like this plan, he needs to gets out there and make the case. sure, it will energize the tea party, but they're energized anyway. will it help largely with independents who seem to be the savior and key to this election? i think so if he gets out there as the democratic party needs to and explain provisions, pre-existing conditions, being a woman is no longer a pre-existing condition. your kids can stay on your health care plan. this is the kind of america millions want to live in. >> peter, i take it you didn't like the ruling. but on the politics of it, do you think it will energize the tea party? >> probably. i think it gives you more of a reason to support romney if your goal is to get rid of obamacare. the supreme court didn't do.

it and now we have to do it legislatively. this is not the kind of america i want to live in. and i would disagree -- you don't need to be a constitutional solar to recognize this is a terrible decision. it diminishes individual rights. and listen to what the supreme court said -- they said that congress doesn't have the power to force us to buy something, but they can tax us if we don't. that is a distinction without a difference. and i think more importantly, if you want to label this a tax, it is unconstitutional on its face because this is a direct tax on american citizens who don't buy health insurance. the constitution says it must be apportioned. this is an unapportioned direct tax. it is constitutional. if the supreme court is now saying that the constitution doesn't apply and the federal government has unlimited taxing powers, then it's a real sad day in american history because what it means to be an american has been irreparably changed. by the way, this is a disaster for health care, for the economy. it's going to cause insurance rates to go up. health care's going to be more expensive, not less. this is not good economics. it's not good policy, and it's

clearly unconstitutional. >> peter, as one of the authors of the health care plan, what do you think the net effect will be? >> well, look, actually there are very exciting developments that have been happening. health care costs the past three or four years have decelerated dramatically, and i don't think it's all because the economy has been weak. we are moving away from fee-for-service payments, moving toward a digitized health care system. the dividing lines between providers and payers are eroding. that's all good. >> and there are provisions in the health care bill that will accelerate this? >> that will continue to encourage it. that's where i think the focus should be. we need to continue that progress. if we don't move away from the fee-for-service system we will not succeed in continuing to slow health care cost growth. and we will all be better off if we succeed in that effort. >> what do you think, jeff? >> i agree completely with what peter said and katrina. this is a good decision for the american people. it brings us to a fairer and more normal state, and it also

creates a basis for getting our health care costs back under control. we're moving to -- more toward the kinds of systems that other countries have which cover everybody and keep the costs down. we have a system which is "most market oriented." at what do we get for it? the worst coverage and the highest prices. and the kinds of things that peter helped to put into this legislation are going to make a difference. >> you have to understand why health care is so expensive right now. it's because of government. we've got to get government out of health care. we've got to have individuals buying their health insurance the same way they buy auto insurance, life insurance, fire insurance. we don't have problems there -- >> peter, wait, all the other countries have more coverage at lower cost and better outcomes, and more government -- >> just because other countries make mistakes doesn't mean we should -- >> my point is that their outcomes are better than ours, and you want to go farther away.

we tried your way. >> no, we haven't. we did try it a long time ago, and it worked great. >> when did it work -- >> before the government stuck its nose in. before the government got involved. >> let's get back to the system of when exactly? >> before we had medicare and medicaid. >> oh -- >> before we had the tax code that -- >> i would rather live with the health care system in the 1950s than the one that you have access to today? >> i don't want the technology of the 1950s, but i want the free market of the 1950s. that would be a vast improvement on what we have today. >> we've got to move on. i'm sorry. i want to ask about the economy in general. you've been gloomy about this recovery from the start. and unusually for somebody who is thought of as left of center, upper critical of the stimulus because you thought it was too much fuel and consumption, not enough fueling investment. >> i thought that it was fueling the deficit but not really providing much of a lift. and also not a lift when it was going to count which is the medium term. unfortunately the administration used its ammunition in the first

couple of years. here we are, the fourth year, a weak economy, not going anyplace and feeling a lot of headwinds. i would have rather seen a strategy that built out our infrastructure and that improved training and education, skills, and many other things over a decade perspective rather than putting everything up front. and i think we're in the situation now where we don't have ammunition now and the economy remains weak, and the headwinds are not only internal, the kind that comes from this deleveraging process, they're not only unfortunately coming from europe which is the biggest mess in the world. but now they're coming from slowdowns in the emerging economies, as well. >> that's right. >> so we're seeing a kindynchro almost everywhere in the world economies, dangerous -- >> a lot of the economies such as it has been has been fueled by exports. and that slows down -- >> what strikes me about this election is it's an extraordinarily important election. deeply ideologically polarizing.

at the same time, some of the enormous issues of our time aren't fully engaged. a global economic crisis royaling the planet, what's going on in europe, people don't -- the campaign isn't fully engaging maybe because it doesn't have the leverage. but i think at the heart of it, fareed, is that there is a kind of establishment consensus around some form of austerity, not growth. and unless this country, whether it's movements or electeds treat jobless not as the greatest threat to our country, not deficits in the short term, joblessness will become the new norm in light of the structural economic problems. and how do we address that? how do you address that -- >> probably going 3-1 here. i have to let peter get his in -- >> i disagree we have a recovery. all we did was borrow more money and spent it. as a result, we're this a deeper hole. i think our problems are self-made. i think the mess in america is bigger than the mess in europe. we are less capable of paying our debts than europe. we have more debt than they do, a bigger percentage of gdp.

more importantly, when interest rates go up in america, they're at about 7% in spain, and the world is wondering if spain can afford it. america can't afford 7% interest rates. we're actually less able to pay that than is -- that than is europe or spain. that's going to happen. and we're talking about creating jobs. we're not going to create jobs by creating government, by expanding consumption or deficit spending. in order to create jobs, we need to get the government out of the way of the economy. we need more capital formation. we need more savings. we need more production, which -- means we niece less government, fewer regulations, less government spending. if we're simply going to expand government we're going to destroy the economy. >> and i talked -- one of the main things -- >> we've got to take a break -- >> is public/private investment in infrastructure. public/private. who could be opposed to that? >> we'll -- we're going to have take a break because we're going to come back and see if there's any agreement on europe. we can't agree on america, we'll try and see if we can agree on europe when we come back. if you look at countries that have their own central

banks which means that they have the ability to print money, none of these countries are having any trouble borrowing. that is britain, sweden, japan, the united states, switzerland. [ male announcer ] citi turns 200 this year. in that time there've been some good days. and some difficult ones. but, through it all, we've persevered, supporting some of the biggest ideas in modern history. so why should our anniversary matter to you? because for 200 years, we've been helping ideas move from ambition to achievement. and the next great idea could be yours. ♪

any trouble borrowing. we're back with jeffrey sachs, peter schiff, peter orszag, and katrina vanden heuvel. when you look at countries that have the ability to print money, none of these countries are having any trouble borrowing. that is britain, sweden, japan, the united states, switzerland -- >> the operative word -- >> the only countries having trouble are countries whose debt is effectively denominated in a currency they don't -- >> for now. but you live by the printing press, you die by the printing press. the fact that you can print money isn't a panacea. that's going to make it worse. eventually our creditors are going to realize that getting paid in money that has little value is the same as not getting paid back at all. i think it would be a mistake

for europe to follow our bad example. you know, we're going to pay a heavy price for our quantitative easing and our bailouts. what europe needs to do is solve these problems, not kick the can down the road. europe has the resources to make that mistake. i don't think we do. a lot of people think we're suffering in america now because of the problems in europe. that's the best thing we've got going for us. people are so worry good europe, they're buying dollars, treasuries. that's keeping interest rates artificially loech that's keeping consumer prices lower than would automatically be the case. when europe confront its problems, right or wrong, whether it pushes them down the road and makes them worse ordeals with them now, the spotlight is going to move to america. we don't have the time that europe does. >> i mean, we have a federal reserve. we have a central bank. to me, one of the great political danger looking out at europe and what austerity has done, even to countries which control their own federal bank like the u.k. is what a mitt romney and a republican party

determined to slash spending in the face of a weak recovery. what that could mean -- what that could mean for this country. it is clear putting aside our differences that one of the grave needs is to put money in the pockets of people, consumers. how do you do that? joblessness may be the best way of -- job program to give people jobs may be the best way to avert. look at spin on -- [ all talking at once ] >> without taking money -- >> but spain -- >> the right approach in my opinion is a barbell one in which we are doing lots of deficit reduction that's not taking effect immediately. that's based on -- >> we need it now. >> and also a bunch of infrastructure and other investment up front to try to spur the economy. we could do both. >> a basic point which i -- i think we mostly agree on which is at least looking over a period of several years, you have to get your books in order. and it raises the most fundamental point and probably

point of pretty big disagreement between us about at what level should we balance the books. should it be all spending cuts. should it be tax increases so we can continue to do some kinds of spending. i think our biggest problem right now in this country is that the powerful political interests in both parties actually, though, especially in the republican party, so controlling the tax cut side that we've gutted the corporate income tax, we're getting the personal income tax, everything is moving off shore more and more, and so the amount that we're collecting at the federal level is basic historic lows over the past six years, now it's 16% of gross domestic product. we can't run a normal civilized country at this rate. and if we try to do that, we end up with the poor without any health care, people on the streets. kids without an education. and that's where the republican party would take us.

the democrats, though, while the rhetoric is different, they also have powerful interests that are saying don't go very far on that. so both parties are basically tax-cutting parties, and we are bleeding in that way. the difference of us is that we agree that the budget should come into balance, but i want rich people to pay something. >> look, first of all -- >> you get a chance. >> first of all -- >> yeah -- >> government spending now is as high as it's been, and it's not just the spending. i own a business, and it costs me more to comply with regulations than i pay in taxes. so it's a burden on the economy to pay all these taxes and to dpl comply with these regulations and the government sucks capital out of the economy by running enormous deficits. the government doesn't have money that they don't first take. if it takes money from the private sector and spends it, it destroys economic activity. it ultimately destroys jobs. we don't want jobs, we want stuff. we need more production, supply. not more demand. the government can put us all to work, but we'll have flog to show for it.

>> how about skills, infrastructure, how about energy -- >> that doesn't come from government -- >> excuse me. we have public schools, we have children that need education -- >> that's -- you're talking about the federal reserve -- >> i know, now you want to go back -- >> the financial crisis -- >> you want no health care for the elderly, you want no middle schools -- >> i want the market to -- the federal government is broke. >> can we come back to the supreme court for a moment? >> 30 seconds. >> 30 seconds. >> then we have to go. >> we are living at a time of concentration of wealth, political income and power we haven't seen since the guilded age and robert barons. >> thanks to the fed. >> i think we need to take a measure of that. how do we limit that, end that, and rebuild politics for the 99%? >> and we're going to have to leave it at that. peter schiff, katrina vanden hugh hughesen, peter. the u.s. has a core strength to that sets it apart from other countries. what is it? we'll tell when you we come back.

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now for our "what in the world" segment. they say that all politics is loco. maybe all economics is local, as well. a sample of american were asked how they rated economic conditions. 49% said things were good or excellent in the city that they lived in. that percentage drops to 37% for how americans feel about their state. it drops to 25% for all of the united states, to 18% for

europe, and only 13% for economic conditions in the world at large. so the more macro things get, the more despondent people feel. at the local level, at home, things don't seem too bad. it got me thinking about housing, the most local of all financial indicators. it's making a comeback. this week we learned that u.s. house prices have now risen for the third straight month. the case index shows that reserdrese residential prices rose .7% in april. sales of new single family homes rose by 7.6%, the highest in two years. the data highlights a trend, and it provides some small reason to be optimistic for the broader economy. why? history shows that in the immediate years following a recession, housing leads the comeback. look at this chart -- it shows data for the first year of the last four american recoveries.

the bar in blue shows what percentage of gdp growth is attributed to investments in housing. as you can see from the last three recoveries, housing provides on average 1/5 of the nation's gdp growth following a recession. 2009 was different. the housing bust kept home sales depressed. now look at the second year of these recoveries in red. again, positive in the previous recoveries, but negative in this one. that looks set to change. the latest data suggests that finally slowly the u.s. housing market having hit rock bottom is heading back upwards. vacancy rates are down, rents are up. a recovery in housing will have big ramifications. construction will increase, so will jobs. so will the economy. for all the doomsday prophecies about the american economy, one reason to remain optimistic in the long run is demographics. accounting for births, deaths,

and new entrants, we have a net gain of one person every 13 seconds in this country. that works out to about 2.5 million people every year. these people will all need places to live. so we can actually count on a future growth in housing, construction, and, therefore, those jobs. compare our demographics with those of other rich countries. germany's population is set to decline by 170,000 people this year. a trend which will hinder growth. japan's slowdown is already in large partude its demographics. its current population is 127 million, but it is on pace to drop by 1/3 by 2050. almost one in four people in japan are over the age of 65. in the u.s., only 13% of the population is over 65. 1/5 are under the age of 14. a guarantee that we'll have young, dynamic entrants to our

work force for decades. the crucial factor that explains america's unique advantage is, of course, immigration. our fertility rates are not so different from those in europe. what makes us demographically dynamic is that we make it about a million legal immigrant every year. more than the rest of the world put together. they are going to finally get us out of this sluggish recovery. we'll be right back. up next, egypt gets its first-ever freely elected president. but will he have power? if you really are serious about getting the military out of power, you need a president who can unite all of these disparate forces, the revolutionaries, the liberals, in order to make a united front against the military. is mohamed morsi, who is the very faithful son of the muslim brotherhood, and lots of places he's been described as a muslim brotherhood enforcer, is he the guy to do this? america's beveras have created a wide range of new choices.

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[ male announcer ] we are insurance. ♪ we are farmers ♪ bum, ba-da-bum, bum, bum, bum ♪ i'm candy crowley in washington. fareed zakaria will be back in 90 seconds. first, a check of top stories. nearly three million people across nine states are without power after violent storms and high winds swept across the midwest and mid-atlantic. the storms are responsible for at least 12 deaths. maryland, virginia, west virginia, and ohio are under states of emergency. the governor of west virginia described conditions in his state. >> we have got the -- have had the largest power outage in the history of the state with 5 it of our 55 county without power. that serves about 688,000 people. the power is slowly coming back on line. we still have over half a million people without power. yesterday was a tough day.

there was no power with the nearly 100-degree temperature we had. >> near colorado springs, firefighters continued to battle a massive wildfire that's responsible for two deaths and the destruction of nearly 350 homes. colorado's goff says the fires have drawn communities closer together. president obama visited the region friday, declaring colorado a disaster area and freeing up federal money to help fight the largest fires. those are your top stories. "reliable sources" is at the top of the hour. now back to "fareed zakaria gps." nearly a year and a half after toppling hosni mubarak, egypt has a new president. his name is mohamed morsi of the muslim brotherhood. he kwnt from a member of a banned islamic group to becoming the first freely elected president of egypt. he's also the arab world's first islamist head of state. what kind of leader will he be,

and will the military allow him to wield power? two academics who know egypt well, steven cook, author of "the struggle for egypt." and tareq massoud, a professor at harvard university. welcome. you have travelled with him, when you were doing research on your book. what kind of a guy is he? >> mohamed morsi is -- the way a senior muslim brotherhood member described him to me, he is a fighting personality, which i think is absolutely right. he's absolutely a fighter. and he was one of the best muslim brotherhood members of parliament from 2000 to 2005 in terms of standing up to the regime, in terms of ferreting out its corruption and holding it to account for its corruption and failures. you know, a fighting personality is -- you know, a fighting personality. this is not a person who is seductive in the way that you expect politicians to be. not a glad-hander. not somebody who can really win

over people. a lot of people have talked about his lack of charisma. >> probably a good thing. >> it may be a good thing, but at this moment in egypt's history, what -- if you really are serious about getting the military out of power, you need a president who can unite all of these disparate forces, the revolutionaries, the liberals, in order to make a kind of united front against the military. is mohamed morsi, who is the very faithful son of the muslim brotherhood -- in lots of places he's been described as a muslim brotherhood enforcer. is he the guy to do this? i'm not sure. >> do you think there is a way to unite the muslim brotherhood, the liberals, and people like that to create a kind of common democrat uc front in egypt? well, there is to some extent. the revolutionaries, liberals lined up behind morsy in the presidential election because they hated -- they did not want a clone of mubarak, that would be a representation of the old regime. now the election is over, and the revolutionaries have their own demands. liberals have their own demands.

morsi's going to have juggle their demands. it's clear that the revolutionaries still can make trouble k. still bring people out into the streets. perhaps not in the numbers they did during the uprising, but certainly have proven that they've been able to do that. and he's also going to have to deal with the military that is looking out for its own interests. this is not going to be an easy thing. may not be a fighting personality that is the best thing in order to unite a democratic front in egypt right now. >> well, the military action will cede power. what is going on the last two weeks where the military seemed to engage in strange power grabs at the last minute. >> well, it's clear that the military is not comfortable with ceding its historic role in egypt. and i think what we saw over the course of the last couple weeks was an effort on the part of the military to hedge against a morsi victory. and they issued a constitutional decree just as the polls were closing which essentially stripped the president of major foreign policy powers. they now have the ability to

veto parts of the draft constitution. they are in essence trying to emulate the role that the turkish military once had in egypt, which they played a role -- shaping the political arena to the way they prefer it to be. i'm not convinced that they're going to be able to do this over the long term, however. >> do you think that the military has the -- obviously there is if you look at just public opinion in terms of tahrir square and things like that, people tonight like it. but it doesn't -- it hasn't produced mass protests on the scale of -- of a year and a half ago. >> let's keep in mind that just a week ago almost half of the egyptian voters actually voted for a clone of hosni mubarak. i would go further than you went and say there's probably a large proportion of egyptians who are not only indifferent to the military's assertion of control but may favor it. so the question, is will they be able to do this. and it's not -- the reason it's

a question is not because we think there will suddenly be mass protests in every village and hamlet in egypt, but because standing against him is the muslim brotherhood that now occupies the position of the presidenti which is a position of moral authority and which has between 500,000 to two million members on the streets, are highly committed and willing to do things. >> so the military's great concerns people have traditionally said are they -- they want to have control over their budget, they want to have control over foreign policy in some sense. but they also want to control the sort of vast array of economic interests they have. >> that's right. that's right. and the presidency has been the informal linkage between the presidency and the military and, thus, the source of their power. it stands to reason with the first civilian president that the military will be more autonomous in seeking to secure those interests. its vast economic interests, its military budget, control over its own personnel, and importantly, that historic role of the military as the central

source of power and authority in the system. and i think that's really where the rubber is going to hit the road here. the muslim brotherhood is going to seek to replace that, and the military is not going to give it up easily. >> let me ask you, is it such a bad thing that the military is trying to assert its power? at some level, you know, if you look at the development of democracy, it's often been these contests between two powerful groups that force limitations on power. you know, the church and the state in the western world. here you have the military trying to check the power of the presidency, and the president will presumably try to check the power of the military. you know, should we be -- should we be worried? >> so, there's two issues here. in the sort of moral or ethical sense, of course this is a bad thing for the military to assert any kind of control. control emerges from the people. at the same time as i think you're saying, look, we have to be realistic. the military, as steve has mentioned, has been in charge in one way or another in this

country for the last 60 years. it is unrealistic to assume that they're suddenly going to relinquish everything and hand over power to a kind of jeffersonian democracy, especially one that's just elected mohamed morsi of the muslim brotherhood. >> what about relations with israel? he has now said that all international agreements will be honored, but in the past, mohamed morsi has id some pretty nasty things about israel. >> well, i think it's important not to be too alarmist at this point in time. but you're absolutely right. mohamed morsi, when he's talked about israel, has been very tough. he's somebody who in recent statements -- i'm not talking about years ago, i'm talking about days ago -- has talked about the need to keep the peace treaty, but only if the israelis abide by it. and he then goes on to describe what he thinks the peace treaty demands. and one of the things he thinks is in the peta peace treaty is a palestinian state with jerusalem as its capital. that's not in the peat treaty, not -- peace treat, not in the

framework of the camp david accord. he has a different idea about what the conditions of peace with israel are. and i think it's very likely that if he's allowed to, you know, have influence over foreign affairs, that relations with israel are going to be very difficult. >> people say that the two countries most rattled by the fall of mubarak was saudi arabia and israel. strange allies. you think the israelis are looking at this with great concern? >> i think they are looking at it with great concern. but egypt serial in no position to threaten the israelis right now. even under mubarak they were in -- the military's in no condition to threaten the israelis. what morsi can do going short of breaking the treaty is he can empty egypt/israel relations of any content in meaning without facing the international criticism of breaking the treaty. as tareq says, the muslim brotherhood does not believe that israel has fulfilled the treaty. and that's why they are opposed to any normalization with the israelis. >> steven cook, tareq masuod,

pleasure to have you on. thank you. next, imagine a system that could fingerprint and track nearly 1/5 of humanity. it is not a pipe dream, it is being implemented in india. i'll speak with the man behind the plans. a lot of patients are using toothpaste to clean their dentures. you really want to be careful, you can't use something as abrasive as a toothpaste because it will cause scratches. as a result of those scratches, bacteria will get lodged in that denture and as they multiply in the mouth the odor can get stronger. i always advise my patients to use polident. it has specific agents in it that can kill bacteria. using polident daily, you definitely will not be creating the scratches.

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imagine creating a system to track 1.2 billion people. photographing them, fingerprinting them, cataloging them, giving them all i.d.s. my next guest is not just imagining that system, he is tasked with making it a reality

in india. the chairman of india's unique identification authority. his previous claim to fame was as one of the founders of emphasis, india's pioneering technology firm. welcome. >> thank you, fareed. >> so explain how does one even think about this. and there are so many parts to it, but let's just first start with the technical things. you were taking india's entire population which previously had rarely been counted and try to give every single person a by metric i.d.? >> that's right. we enrolled 200 million people in the last three years since the project began. and we are -- we're using the biometrics to give them a unique number which -- so that they don't end up having more than one number. what's most important is that this is a digital online i.d. so we're taking people, many of whom have no i.d. whatsoever, and taking them to -- like a leapfrogging of identity. >> why is this so important for

india? when one hears about this, that these people are supposed to get loans or grants or various things from the government, and most of it never gets to them. i remember the prime minister gajy saying of the one dollar we send, on average the poor people receives ten cents. ten cents. the middlemen take up the rest of the money. >> actually, there are two primary drivers for this. one is that we have -- we still have millions of people who don't have a formal identity or action animalment of their existence -- acknowledgment of their ex-sense by the state. unless you have a formal aagement, you can't get a bank account, can't get a mobile phone, can't get entitlements, can't get a job, rent a house. everything is linked to basic identity. this in some sense you can think of as a massive inclusion program to get the poor and marginalized and the identitiless into the formal economy. that's one part of it. the other part is that the

indian government spends something like $60 billion a year on entitlements and benefits to millions of people. and they need to make sure it reaches the right beneficiaries. by having this system we can make sure that people's scholarships, employment goes to the right person, either into the bank account or whatever account. both it makes government expenditure more efficient, equitable and is a government exercise. >> you were an entrepreneur in a space in india that is famously free of regulation because the indian government basically didn't realize it existed, the high-tech space. >> they didn't realize it -- >> that's mythology. now in the heart of government, how much more difficult is it to deal with the bureaucracies -- which is worse, the bureaucratic or political object stack else? >> i think the way i see it simply is in the private sector, the number of people is much less. you convince your management team, your boss, investors,

analysts, you know, you want to do something, go in new election, buy a company, whatever. in the public space, you are answerable to a lot more stakeholders. the government, parliament, bureaucracy, activists, journalists, the judicial system, the investigators. i learned the amount of time you invest in evangelicalizing and investment building is more in the public space and crafting a strategy which is sort of acceptable to everybody really takes a great deal of time. that's why the big difference to me -- between the two was. >> do you think you'll face obstacles as you try to do this because there will be people disempowered? after all, when you employ benefit to people, it used to be there would be a village chieftan who would take away the benefit. there would be bank managers who -- all these people. usually this seems to me the

largest act of disintermediation i can think of. >> sure. once we have millions of bank accounts and people's money goes electron cloudy to processing into the bank account fully auditable and they can withdraw it at any location by going to any atm, it obviously change the empowerment game. the way we see it is, while this could be some people disenfranchised by this, look at those more enfranchised, powered. they will become allies for change. our goal is we acknowledge any change there will be position. it's more about how do we get allies who support this change. for example, because we use the banking system, the banking system will support this. we've cleared allies and, of course, the people themselves. they see their lives improving, they will be the best ambassadors of this. >> you first came to international fame as the man who told tom freedman that the world is flat. >> i mentioned it -- >> the first page of the book.

do you look at the landscape of eamericaing markets and the way that they have competitive advantages or at least a level playing field, and do you think something has changed because you're seeing a slowing down of the bricks. you're seeing india's slowed down, china has slowed down. brazil has slowed down, russia is slowing down. have these countries and there's an era of cheap capital where everyone was booming, have you hit a brick wall? >> well, i think certainly the message is there's one set of drivers or levers that they hear fr from, $100,000 per capita, it's about institutions, getting a level playing field. it's about regulation, creating entrepreneurs, competition. then the thing gets much more complex, i think. that's why a lot of countries are facing challenges of migrating to that world. >> are you bullish about them

still in. >> absolutely. i think the fundamentals have not changed. there may be some tactical issues, but the fundamentals have not changed. >> pleasure to have you on. >> thank you, fareed. >> we will be back. so what i'm saying is, people like options. when you take geico, you can call them anytime you feel like saving money. it don't matter, day or night. use your computer, your smartphone, your tablet, whatever. the point is, you have options. oh, how convenient. hey. crab cakes, what are you looking at? geico. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. those surprising little still make you take notice.

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happy birthday. i'll spare you the singing, but today's a big day for the international criminal court. it turns 10. and i'm sure the hague is throwing a big bash.

the birthday brings me to my question of the week -- how many verdicts has the international criminal court handed down over the past decade? is it a, one, b, five, c, seven, or d, 25? stay tuned, and we'll tell you the correct answer. go to cnn.com/fareed for more of the "gps challenge" and great content from the global public square. if you ever miss a show or gps special, go to itunes.com/fareed. this week's book of the week is "land of promise: an economic history of the united states." by michael lynd, one of the founders of the new america foundation. lindh is a highly intelligent thinker and writing and has given us a revealing history of the american economy, family sizing the crucial role that the state has played in making america an economic superpower. it will unsettle many of your cherished beliefs. now for the "last look." south korean and american troops

storming a beach by sea, by air. shells exploding overhead as amphibious vehicles race toward the beach. no, the world hasn't finally run out of patience with north korea. this was just a drill. but the date of the drill was telling. june 25. doesn't ring a bell? it is the 62nd anniversary of the start of the korean war. to add to the symbolism, smoke bombs dropped in the shape of a "v" for victory. the correct answer to our "gps challenge" question was a, there has just been one verdict handed down by the international criminal court. the sole verdict was a guilty one against thomas lubanga, a former leader in the democratic republic of the congo. he was convicted of abducting children and forcing them to serve as child soldiers. 15 cases have been brought before the court. all of them