attack. >> the gator was coming after him. on top of the water, he was coming. >> a florida teen's brush with a deadly wild alligator. another teen attacked by a shark. only one man knows what to do in a situation like that. jungle jack himself jack hanna. when politicians attack. a congresswoman versus a war hero. >> you know what, she's running for congress. >> i think that mr. walsh is being very irresponsible in his words. >> tonight, tammy duckworth fights back at congressman joe walsh who accused her of making too much out of her war record. plus, michael phelps, mark spitz. i'll get him to set the record straight, who's the best, spitz or phelps? >> the peak of both your power, who would win? i would like to say selfishly maybe i'd beat him. >> inspiring advice for today's olympians and his harrowing escape from a terror attack with the whole world watching. the whole world watching. this is "piers morgan tonight."

-- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com deadly danger in the great outdoors. a florida teenager lost the lower part of his right arm to alligator. a california man was in his kayak when a great white shark took a chunk out of his boat on saturday. just from the start of this month, there have been at least seven different attacks across the country by bears, alligators, a shark and a mountain lion. are the attacks on the rise? joining me now, a man who knows about this thing. he survived a grizzly attack himself. jack hanna is the director emeritus at the columbus zoo and aquarium. he's outside the venetian in scottsdale, arizona, and has a um could of his alligators with him. jack, welcome. >> good to be here, nice to see you, piers. >> it appears to be quite a

worrying time at the moment for attacks by animals. what do you make of what's going on? people are trying to equate the overheating, in other words, the extreme high temperatures we're getting, with this spate of attacks by animals. do you see that correlation? >> right. i see the correlation only from the high heat and the weather affects the food chain of these animals. it could be the fish for the alligator. the berries for the bears. betters came down much earlier because there wasn't much snow. really, the food source is what i think the temperatures affect. not necessarily the animals. almost lost my life to a gator once. i don't think the temperature of the water makes any difference to a gator. it's a matter of food source. people leaving food out. we can get to that when you ask me the questions about how each of these things happened. >> yesterday, a young 17-year-old, kaleb langdale, in moore haven, florida, was attacked by an alligator. in his own words. >> when the gator was about

right here from me, i take my left hand and i grabbed that skin up underneath him, trying to control him, and he just kept going. i pulled his head up. i wrapped my legs around him. he just went and dove. well, he started pulling me down and i knew it's either this bone -- i've got to lose this arm or i'm going to die. >> now, he very sadly lost his arm. it was found in the alligator hours later. doctors were unable to reattach the limb. interesting, kaleb told doctors that he said they always see alligators at this river in florida but they usually mind their own business. this alligator charged him in a way he'd never seen before. what do you think, jack? what could have caused the alligator to have behaved like that? >> several things. when i almost got it was when the alligators were next to their eggs. they have a nest. just like a bird, they lay eggs. the most aggressive creatures on the planet. they'll take down a boat if you

come near their nest. i think in this situation, the gator was there, it is breeding season. the young man, amazing how he knew that. he did the death roll. when i filmed a good buddy of mine in africa, lost not just this arm, gator took the arm off here. another crocodile got this one. so this whole part of his back. so that's what happens. whatever they grab, they're going to do a roll like this. that's what happened to that young man underwater. he was so smart, presenting his arm. if not, he would not be here talking today. think it's because, as i said before, it's because either breeding season and/or guarding those eggs. gators, let me show you something here, piers. gators also hunt with vibrations. right back in here, i don't know if you can see that -- i hope you can see the gator, because i'm not getting any closer to it. sensors are back in here. they pick up vibrations in the water. also, what happens to a lot of people if they're caught,

they're feeding gators, they relate food to people. that's why we try to tell people -- we'll get to the bear in just a second. gators have a very small brain. they've been around since the dinosaur era. they've come back by the thousands. you'll get hit by lightning before you get attacked by a gator. i think 22 people have lost their lives in 65 years. that's a terrible thing to happen. again, lightning kills more people probably than that happens. again, the sensor's here. they have double eyelids, by the way. you can see how their jaws are. this is a small one. i think -- you said his was 11 foot. this is only a 5 footer right here. can you imagine the size of the one that got that young man? two, three times bigger than this one. who knows, three, four minute, some people say 20 minutes at a time. by the way, one last thing. they can outrun any man on land. they can run 20 yards quicker than any human being on earth. they also can leap forward. you just can't go up to a gator thinking he's sleeping because

they feels the vibrations. >> it's not just alligators, jack. as i was saying at the start of the show. there have been a lot of sightings in strange places. not just parks and forest preserves. bears, for example, new hampshire, someone's kitchen. arizona, someone's backyard. north carolina, the same. new jersey, south carolina, california, maine and florida. all rather unusual places. mountain lions. one in nebraska within two blocks of a school. in iowa in a neighborhood. what is bringing these wild animals into these kind of areas? >> well, again, the population of lions is increasing. of the mountain lion, cougar, puma, all the same animal. the grizzly bear is increasing in montana where i live. in idaho and wyoming. these animals are increasing in numbers. people are increasing. people are camping out a lot more. the only word of advice i can give. only two years ago, my wife and i were hiking, sure enough, a grizzly comes up with two

2-year-olds. the one comes right at us. the one thing is the key. you do not run from a wild animal. mountain lion -- i'm association bear, black or grizzly. a fox, a wolf, whatever. do not run. young people have to understand this. carry your bear spray. bear spray. some people say mace. it's not, it's pepper spray. a big canister. that's what helped me and saved my you know what, my tail, when this bear came for me. it was a young grizzly trying to prove himself. it's very important, the brother spr bear spray. whatever that might be. a grizzly bear can run 100 yards in six seconds. six seconds. a football field. you cannot run -- it's a hard thing to understand, but you have to stand there and make noise. because the minute you turn, that's like a fleeing animal to them. they're not maneaters, a bear and/or a shark, whatever it is. like the shark thing you mentioned. that surf board or tidal board, they were around seals, right?

that looks like a big old seal. what would you do if you were a shark? i've had the fortunate experience to dive with great whites. disturbing as they say. a maneater. yes, because they relate man to food. if people feed the gators. if you leave your picnics. whatever state has black bears or grizzlies. you leave the food there at the picnic pace, they're going to come back. like the lady, the mother bear, went to cars all the time. that's because they found food in the car for the first time. they relate the car to food. >> the guy in california in a kayak. let's just take a look at this. >> now, that's, that's -- >> i mean, that's his kayak. actually got approached by a great white they believe. if you're in a kayak in the ocean, people are out there

swimming. it's very hot. a lot of people going swimming to cool down. what do you do if you get approached by a very large shark? this is the one in cape cod. this is the one actually -- there were two incidents. one in california. the bitten kayak. this is another guy. look at him. that is apparently a great white coming after him. >> is that on the east coast, right? the new york state, i can't remember where that one happened. where seals or sea lions or something out there. again, if there's seals in the area and you're surfing or whatever, kayaking or paddle boarding in that area, you can guarantee there might be shark, predatory animals in that area. my advice is probably get away from them and not do that. i'm a sissy. if i was me, i'd be paddle boarding, surfing, next to shore. the further you are toward the shore, the less problems you might have. these guys know. these surfers know. it's like an indy 500 driver or

maybe a nascar driver. they know when you go out there what they have to do what they're up against. these guys are good. if i was on a kayak or surf board, i don't know, i'd just paddle like crazy probably. i'd literally get on top of the board and not have any of my appendages hanging from the board. i'd let him get the board. once they take that first bite, by the way, that's where the shark, from what i've seen, they take that first bite and that's it. of course if it's part of your anatomy or body, that's a bad situation because then the blood flows and it's another situation. >> and, jack, very quickly, and finally, is it worse than it is normally? or is this just there's been a rash of stories making lurid headlines? >> i think -- i think it's a rash of stories in today's world, you know, with the media and all, texting, everything we have today. i think there's a lot more people it might be happening to. i do think it's because the weather's changing food sources

as far as berries ripening. that might have a little bit to do with it. remember something, i don't think animals attack because of hot or cold. i've been working with animals all over the world. hot, 120 degrees, and i don't see that. i do see maybe because of food sources the bears came down early in montana, late one year. the berries aren't there. so they get in houses where people have the dog food out, chickens out. and that's what happens. >> well, jack, i come from a country where the most threat threatening thing is normally a tortoise so i will head out this weekend with great trepidation. i appreciate you joining me. "into the wild," check out your local listings. i really appreciate you coming on, jack. great to talk to you. >> yes, sir, thank you. >> coming up, a wounded warrior running for congress. her opponent said she should stop talking about her service. next, tammy duckworth has her say. brave knights!

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not knowing if i was dead or alive. >> tommy duckworth, democratic national convention in 2008. talking about the wartime attack that cost her the use of her legs. she was awarded the purple heart. now she's running for congress from illinois. so far, so good. her opponent joe walsh says she should stop talking about her service to the country which has created a national uproar. tammy duckworth joins me now. tammy, let me thank you for your service to your country. you are remarkably courageous. i think many people share that. having said that, does joe walsh have a point? he's a political opponent to you. he clearly believes that you have been -- let's not say manipulating it but deliberately overusing perhaps your military service and heroism and courage which is without any dispute to try and promote your political position. that's to his disadvantage. do you accept if you were guilty of that charge, that would be

unacceptable? >> well, i have to say, piers, i've not been talking exclusively about my military service. and, in fact, i think mr. walsh created this uproar because he didn't want to admit to the people in the district that he cast several bad votes last week. and, in fact, he was the only member of the illinois delegation to vote against a much-needed transportation bill that would have brought and is going to bring much-needed jobs to the district. i think he's just, you know, repeat things that are not true. he's just trying to shift people. i think it's really irresponsible of him to shift the focus away of really what's important in the district, and that's jobs and the economy. >> let's take a look at joe walsh in action talking about you. >> now, i'm running against a woman who -- i mean, my god, that's all she talks about. our true hero is the men and women who served us. it's the last thing in the world they talk about. that's why we are so indebted

and in awe of what they have done. >> that's not the first time he's commented on your military service. he said this on another occasion. i do believe as someone who respectses what tammy duckworth did as someone who is thankful and sorry for her injuries. i do believe she talks about her service too much. as a voter in this district, i want to know where she stands on issues. and i have so much respect for what she did. in fact, she sacrificed her body for the country. eh, let's move on. what else has she done? female, wounded veteran. eh, she's nothing more than a hand picked candidate. rahm emanuel hand picked her and dropped her in the district. just the language he's using is very insulting, very patronizing. also i think discredits him in the sense that you truly are somebody whose service is highly commendable. i come at this the from that position.

again, i suppose i come back to the bigger picture here. do you think the best way to call his bluff, tammy, might be to not mention your military service again, and to now fight him exclusively on the issues, so that he can't argue that? >> well, i've actually been fighting him on the issue, piers. he's the one that's bringing up the military service. he's the one that challenged me, you know, invited me to a town hall meeting during a weekend when i actually have national guard duty. so i've been talking about the issues. the fact of the matter is, he's voted three times for the ryan budget, which cuts medicare and medicaid as we know it. he wantses to s ts to extend t cuts. he's really not done anything for the district. and so when i challenge him on these issues, he comes back with these very false charges. you know, what's irresponsible about what he's doing -- i don't mind if he attacks me

personally, but when he says a veteran is not a true hero when they speak about their military service, he's now discouraging veterans from speaking about their service. at a time when young develops coming home need to be talking about the leadership skills they developed in the military. extraordinary feats of courage. these things make them better employees. they should be talking about their service. his attacks on me actually is going to affect other veterans. that's very irresponsible for say thing congressman. >> i imagine john mccain and colin powell might have a thing or two to say. about someone's character. a gallup poll on memorial day showed just 34% of veterans back president obama while 58% support romney. why do you think he's struggling so much for the hearts and mind support of the veterans? >> well, you know, i think there's a difference between

what -- how president obama has gone about serving our veterans. he's done it actually in a very quiet way. most veterans don't realize he has increased the budget for the department of veterans affairs more than 18% over his time in office. and, in fact, the president has given v.a. the largest budget increase in over 30 years. and so i think part of of what we need to do is talk about the very good things that have happened for veterans in the last three years. we've certainly turned around the v.a. i was very proud of the work i was able to do, searching with secretary shinseki, reaching out to female veterans. the work we did with partnerships with states and communities and cities to make sure our veterans got the help they need. coming back to what congressman walsh is doing, he's shifting the focus away from the real work that needs to be done in washington, and really raising the partisan rhetoric at a time when the people in this district really need us to come together and find practical solutions.

>> i think he's also committing a massive own goal. absolutely nobody agrees with him. i think you're perfectly entitled to talk about what you did for your country. the fact you got a purple heart says it all. i think he should zip it. and concentrate on his own game. anyway, tammy duckworth, thank you very much for joining me. >> thank you. >> coming up, one of the greatest swimmers in olympic history, mark spitz, his inspiring advice for today's olympians. and whether he thinks he can beat michael phelps. [ male announcer ] let's say you need to take care of legal matters.

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mark spitz is a true olympic legend. spitz was swimming the way into the record books. 40 years later, he remains an icon, an american hero, and he's here. mark spitz, welcome. >> my pleasure. >> what's it like being an american icon? >> probably a little better than not being an icon, you know? i was sort of thrusted into that opportunity in 1972. i didn't realize my performance was going to elevate myself to a level where people would be looking at it as something special. >> i remember it vividly. i was 7 years old. it was the first olympic games i'd ever watched on television with any kind of real interest or being old enough to understand what's going on. you were like this incredible fish. every time you went in the

water, everyone else had to get out of there and you just destroyed everyone. you had the most incredible mustache anyone had ever seen. >> you know, i -- >> now gone. >> i grew that mustache out of spite because my college coach said you need to look like the all-american boy. i went to the olympic trials. had intentions of shaving it off. all my competitors in the press were talking about it. i go, wow, they're not figuring out how to beat me, i might as well keep this thing. shave the thing off the day before the competition. i had a chance to swim in the olympic venue just one more time in the evening because we never had a chance to practice in the pool in the evening, the russians were there, and i got in the water and the russians let me swim in a side lane. one of the questions were, are you going to shave this thing off? i don't know why, i just came up with this thought, no, i'm not going to shave it off. doesn't it slow you down? no, i deflect the water away from my mouth and i'm much more smooth. every russian swimmer that was a male had a mustache the

following year. they figure it must have been good. it worked for me. >> you became this huge poster boy for american sport afterwards. what are your memories of that olympics? other than michael phelps, no one's ever been in that position. you had said at the previous games you thought you would win everything and you hadn't. you came with a bit more pressure at the '72 games. you swept the board. talk me through what it was like. >> i had a difficult time from 1968 olympic games in mexico city where i was expected to win a lot of gold medals. i just look at my performance of winning two gold, a silver and a bronze, that is pretty remarkable. the problem is i didn't win a gold medal in two events i held a world record in. one of them, i got a silver medal. it cost me a place on a relay. and the other one, i qualified first in the prelims and got dead last. it was the first event in the olympic games in the 200 meter butterfly. there was a guy named doug

russell that beat me. there was a reason i basically had this fire in my system to be able to want to actually go for another four years. i found it kind of difficult to work out and train. but i had a focus it the focus was to do the best i could. and over the course of what i learned was a mistake of not being able to swim allthose events in one particular competition, i started to do that. and the year before, in houston, texas, i won the four individual events, broke three world records and got the sullivan award, which was the best athlete as an amateur in america. i realized i had the capacity to be able to accomplish this at least in theory, on paper. thank goodness my coach has encouraged me and i went forward and i was successful. >> when you're standing there having won the seventh consecutive gold, putting you into a pantheon of olympians, very rare small number, and playing the anthem for the seventh time, what is that emotion like? >> i was so happy it was over. >> it must have been exhausting, wasn't it? >> it really was.

the program started on a monday and continued on through the following monday. so over an eight-day period of time, i swam every single day but friday. and so i was in the water 13 different times. we had the prelims, the semifinals and what have you. each day that i swam and i won a gold medal, it was like one brick shy of a load getting off the cart. so therefore i felt i was actually having a better go of it. i was exhausted by the time it came to my last individual event, the 100 meter freestyle. the last stroke i took at the olympic games, i don't think could i have taken another stroke. i literally had one drop of gas in my tank at the end of that. so thank goodness it ended. >> what does it take to be a true olympic champion do you think? what are the qualities that anybody needs to get there? >> i think a coach. i mean, and the support of your family and a good system. being in a program where there's a lot of great athletes is a very enlightening thing. my family moved me from one town

to santa clara, california, where i was coached with this guy named george haynes -- >> you were a naturally. your family said even as a young kid, you ran into the sea to swim. like a kind of main yniac, is t right? >> i didn't run into the sea with the thought i was going to swim 26,000 miles and have a 14-year career and become a seven gold medal winner. >> how many miles you swam? >> kind of calculated that out. there were a lot people that swam the same amount i did. what made me a champion -- >> what made you different? >> i hated the idea of losing. i built just one day at a time. i became a world record holder in the 400 meter freestyle. my first world record. i swam with a guy that was my inspiration on the team. and i broke his world record. >> you broke 33 world records, is that right? >> yeah, i actually broke two world records that from a technicality should have been counted. because they were done in the same day by the same person, i didn't get recognized in the

order chronologically of breaking it. if i broke it in the prelims and i went a little faster in the finals it only counted the final time and not the first time. >> only 35 world records? >> who's counting? >> you are. that's what makes you clearly the edge. that's the edge, isn't it? it's that kind of mind that says, i may have won 33, but it should have been 35. it still rankles with you. >> i walked off a plane in -- was it australia, and it was 220 2000 for the olympics games there. so, what is it? everybody's sort of silent. i said, well what i did, i analyzed swimming sort of like baseball statistics. from the very first world record you ever have, not counting prelims and semifinals, just the time you were in the final, and you have to take your collegiate and what they call short course program away because that was in a 25-yard pool so you couldn't

break a world record. you swam approximately 75 times. you had basically 33 or 35 world records. so almost 50% of the time, you actually broke a world record. more importantly, last two years of my career, i swam 20 imtoo times,entimes, en and i broke a world record 19 of those times. my competitors at the olympic games were second-guessing whether they trained, rested enough, whether or not the room was quiet enough and the food was good at the olympic village. watching mark spitz time and again become successful. he uses that success one day after another. it's quite arduous to be able to get to that level of training and -- to win on a daily basis. it really helps if you're multitalented to be able to use that moving forward. >> let's take a short break and come back and talk about michael phelps.

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first of all, records are always made to be broken. no matter what they are. anybody can do anything they set their mind to. you know, i, i said all along, i want to be the first michael

phelps, not the second mark spitz. >> mark spitz is back with me now. how did you feel about that? he doesn't want to be the second mark spitz. he wants to be the first michael phelps. >> we saw michael come on the scene four years before in athens. he came away with six gold medals and two broz ed nze meda. i knew he had the capacity to attempt to break my record. i just knew it was a matter of time. if he just stayed healthy for the next four years. i actually felt a tremendous relief. i mean, records -- you heard the cliche, records are made to be broken. why should my records be exclusive, that you can't break my records? and it was just a matter of time that somebody would come along. listen, i inspired somebody not even born to try to achieve a goal for himself, primarily,

which is michael's goal, not mark spitz's goal, to do the best that he could. in the process, my record got broken. well, why wouldn't i be proud? the fact he was able to do that. >> when i interviewed him, apart from being physically very impressive, he had an aura about him of invincibility. it was a guy who just knew he was head and shoulders -- in fact, in his case, massive wingspan shoulders, above everybody else. he had that aura and swagger. you have that too. do you recognize that in a true champion? >> i think what a true champion has is the ability to know his competitors. everything about his competition. and then try to make one or two less mistakes than those he competes against. and on a regular basis that they do that, quantitatively saying, that he may have only been 4% or 5% better than anybody, but since it was always 4% or 5%

better than anybody, the illusion was he was so grand, and that's what makes a great champion. and that they're able to repeat that time and again. regardless of the conditions. not every time you come to a swimming pool do you feel great. or if you're in track and field. or boxing. mohammed ali. a lot of times he felt terrible. but he knew he had to rise to the occasion. >> you and michael phelps, no goggles, wear a cap if you want. i know you didn't. the old-fashioned way. right now, the peak of both your powers. who would win? >> i've been asked that question before. >> have you ever honestly answered it? >> and i've answered it the honest way. based on what i've just previously said. if i was great because i knew everything i needed to know to beat that other person, then i would have to know everything that would be necessary to beat michael. and likewise, he would have to know everything to beat me. so the answer is, we'd have to tie. however there was a --

>> -- a tie -- >> there was a caveat to that. somebody else who posed that question said, yeah, but you won by greater margins so therefore you knew how to beat your competition by greater margins. well, i'd like to say, you know, selfishly maybe i might beat him so i would have to say relentlessly, yeah, of course i would want to beat him. wouldn't matter whether i had a cap on or a fur coat, as long as we all had the same. >> i couldn't imagine you looking me in the eye and saying anything different. he, i suspect if he's honest, would say he's beat you. that's what makes the pair of you such huge olympians. >> well, i think that when i look back, that obviously you've posed the question that's never going to happen. the reality is that some day there will be another michael phelps who will say the same things that michael said which is i just want to be myself. the benchmark of who they are and the watershed is really to identify trying to implement and emulate that person to the best you can. >> do you get along?

are you friends? >> i haven't talked to him that much. in the environment i've actually met him is actually handing him an award. the first time i actually met him is when he qualified to swim at the olympic games for athens. i whispered something in his ear. the press really said, well what did you say? i said, well, it's private. eventually they sort of pullled it out of me. what i said to him was, i know you can do this. just stop listening to the press but give them all the time they want. >> what do you make of all the drug abuse in sport? particularly athletics and olympians? you see great champions toppling down like dominos. caught cheating. what do you think of it? >> i think the international olympic committee has done a great job of trying to police, you know, drugs. they were the first to do it back in 1968, olympic games in mexico city. and they -- they're not perfect. they try to get as best they can all the offenders. but i think there's a little bit of design to let the best fall

through the cracks. they list all of the performance enhancing drugs, about 6 to 9 months ahead of time, so that those athletes who get a whiff -- if you're on this stuff, don't take it anymore. then that gives a drug buffet of everything else out there to be taken that they knowingly won't be tested for. so the old school drugs seem to make the list first before the new school drugs. and drug companies do not make performance enhancing drugs. this is all off label usage that has been discovered and experimented from the communist coaches that were back in the '80s and '90s. so you have to say to yourself, if it's only going to improve my performance by 8% or 9% max and i'm not getting a gold medal, why am i wasting my time doing this? it's a waste. >> is there a simple answer, you just ban the cheats for life? >> the question is -- the penalty is great enough to where you're out of a sport for four year, the odds are you're not going to get that second chance because that's almost a lifetime in sports at that elite level.

so the craziness of the rules is most people don't actually know what the rules are. i remember there was an incident. the world swimming championships in 1999 in perth australia. there was somebody from china that brought in human growth hormone. they also had the masking drug. the masking drug's penalty was basically two years which superseded the actual four-year penalty. which meant if you cheated the cheat, instead of having a four-year penalty, you only had a two-year penalty. which brain trust at the ioc figured that out? since the chinese brought the drug in, less than two years prior to the olympic games in sydney, they altered the rule to make it a six-month penalty so at least the chinese could then go ahead and compete in the olympic games. so there is sort of a twisting of the rules. >> if i was running it, i'd be quite straight forward. i'd test every single athlete after every single event. anybody found guilty, that's it for life. trust me, within two years, there would be no more cheats.

>> they do test every single athlete that gets a first, second and third place and one at random. but that's for the drugs that are on that list. if the drug is not on that list, there's no way they're going to find them. >> it's sad, i think. sad that it's so prevalence. take another break. come back to another sad event. back at munich, your great, great year at the olympics, this dreadful incident involving the murder of israeli athletes. i want to talk to you about your memories of that after the break. [ male announcer ] this is the at&t network.

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they've now said there were 11 hostages. 2 were killed in their rooms. this is yesterday morning. 9 were killed at the airport tonight. they're all gone. >> a moment seared into olympic history. the massacre stunned the world. the olympics went on. mark spitz won seven gold medals at that olympics. mark, you're jewish. a shattering event. what are your memories of it? >> well, for me and the whole swimming community, swimming was over before this happened. we finished on the evening of monday and this happened into the early hours, as we know, into tuesday. i had gone out with a gentleman -- two gentlemen. a photographer for "sports illustrated." still is a photographer. he created two covers on "sports illustrated" for me.

and a guy named jerry kuseenbaum who wrote a bunch of articles for me for "sports illustrated." they took me to dinner. we had a great time. everybody was cheering. wanted to throw me drinks. i don't drink. at the restaurant that evening. at 9:00 in the morning, i woke up and went to the press conference. they were the first to greet me in the fan with the ioc officials and the swim coaches from america. i said, did you hear what happened? i said, i don't know anything. well, there's about 1,500 press people in this room and there's been a lockdown. we don't know what's going on. supposedly, there's some activities, terrorist activities, there in the village. they had these high-powered zoom lenses in the press center right next to the village. we saw for the first time that athlete come out with that hat on, talking to what appeared to be a hostess. but the hostess was really actually a crisis knee gonegoto.

we had no sound. we didn't know what was going on. this was happening almost like in slow motion. i went back in with, now, police to get back into the village. and then the chancellor of germany was in the village. and then the chancellor of germany was in my room. saying everything's fine, we're going to take care of you. this was about 10:30 in the morning. by 5:00, i was ushered out -- this was complex. went down into a car. had an army blanket put over my head, drove out of the village so nobody knew that i was in the car, taken to actual municipal airport and flew to london. >> had you been identified as a potential target? >> that's a great question. i don't think so, because here, obviously, they must have had this well-planned years in advance, or months in advance. here i was a jewish athlete, american. i was winning all these gold medals. everybody knew where i was. if they had a change of heart and a plan, they could have immediately come to my room instead of the compound where the israelis were staying. so i didn't really feel that i

was in the cross hairs. >> awful day, though. >> it was terrible. you know, the olympic games today is modelled based on the security not only for the athletes, but for the press, the media, the spectators, and the citizens of the host city. and the international olympic committee has done a great job over the years to protect everybody. but it's totally different. here i became a real gigantic event as a sports celebrity winning seven gold medals. then it became a news event. then all of a sudden it became a tragedy. and then it became elevated at a much higher level, and we're talking about it right now, 40 years later. >> quite extraordinary. as london approaches, a lot of american athletes are competing, bound to compete and so on. what is it like to represent america as an athlete? >> well, you know, i just watched the olympic trials recently with my son, and we noticed that in swimming, we only take two per event, and the third place person that got left

home had the third fastest time in the world, that had he been brought, he might have been winning a medal. so it's quite a big honor to represent the united states in your sport. for your sport. there's a lot of training that goes behind getting to that level. a lot of pressure. but the reward is standing on the award stand. you know, just watching it. all just unfold your success. that's why you see people cry. >> because when they play the anthem and all the work is suddenly worth it -- i can see even now, you're emotional about it. >> well, it's kind of strange because i didn't have an opportunity to enjoy any of it. so to me i was on a mission. i just didn't have any time to reflect whatsoever. >> do you swim these days? >> i try to swim a couple days a week. i walk for about 45 minutes to an hour to try to stay in shape and clothes are very revealing. >> you're looking great, i have to say. how old are you now?

>> i'm 62. >> wow. unfortunately, you look better than me. >> i don't think so. >> i try and swim, but i don't think i go at quite the same speed you do. do you time yourself? >> that would be a big mistake. >> where do you swim? i'm fascinated by this. >> well, there's a master swim program at ucla here in los angeles. and there's a bunch of guys that used to be swimmers, competitive swimmers, and a bunch of people that never really had a chance that believe that they would like to be a competitive swimmer and there's masters programs all over the world. i went back to munich a couple of years ago, about six or seven years ago, they had the world master swim championships. a meet where they had almost 12,000 athletes, timed event only. it's like carpet. it's like watching fruit getting processed in a mill. these swimmers kept going off and off and off. in some events, they had actually started the race before the last person got out at the other end. but there was such excitement and enthusiasm. so i believe that sports is really great, you know?

and i think that there can be self-expression -- >> when you get in the pool at these masters, you still want to kill them, don't you? be honest. >> you know, i'll tell you a funny story -- >> do you ever lose? >> i get in a slow lane so i can win, how's that for an snans. >> have you lost a swimming race in the last 30 years? >> not really. [ laughter ] not really. >> markspitz, it's been a real pleasure. thank you very much. coming up, a preview of an interview with actor robert blake, without a doubt the most outrageous, controversial, explosive interview that i've ever conducted. tank brain freeze cake donettes rolling hot dogs bag of ice anti-freeze wash and dry diesel self-serve fix a flat jumper cables 5% cashback signup for 5% cashback at gas stations through september. it pays to discover.

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we'll end tonight's show with a preview of my interview tomorrow night with actor robert blake. blake, a hollywood legend, great actor, acquitted of killing his wife, but then found liable in a civil action brought by her family. the interview was full of emotion. he laughs one moment, he erupts in rage the next. he sounds completely unhinged at times and other times honest. it's a really remarkable encounter. here's some of the explosive conversation. >> my father hates me because he knows i'm his brother's kid. they tried to get rid of me and

they couldn't. >> did they ever tell you that they loved you, your parents? >> never. they didn't even talk to me. they paid more attention to a dog than they paid to me. well, tell me where i'm lying. because if you don't know i'm telling you the truth, you must have a little scratch in the back of your head about where i'm lying. tell me where i'm lying? >> i'm not saying you're lying. >> you're saying you don't know if i'm telling the truth. what the hell is the difference? >> i'm saying i've met you for 20 minutes. >> why are you being so defensive? >> i'll ask you another question, mr. research. how come i was arrested for murder? and i stayed arrested for four years. three in my front room where i couldn't leave because i was still under arrest. a fellow named specter was arrested for an hour in one home and was a free man for four years, then he was found guilty and he's in san