you recently have joined cnn. white house correspondent -- >> rejoined cnn. >> rejoined cnn. i remember when you came on "reliable sources" when you were a young person. >> this actually might have been, by the way. i'd have to go back and check. >> i tell people it is. >> i tell people the first tv appearance i did was on your show. i think that's true. >> it has now become reality. it's a fact. >> thank you. >> you're quite welcome. was it a difficult decision to leave abc? >> look, i had been there since 2003. so, almost a decade and, you know, i started there and charlie and diane were on in the morning and pete jennings was on in the evening and ted koppel was on for "nightline" at 11:30. a place that i had so much respect for so many people who work there and still do have so much respect and affection. >> but -- >> but ultimately i felt it was time for me to anchor my own show and i really wanted it to be a broad show about a broad number of topics and not just

politics, even though that's how most people know me. and -- >> it will be a show, that will be able to fill that gap. but everyone at cnn and the tv xhubt knows that when there is no big breaking story, you have to provide a compelling reason to watch cnn. >> that's the hope. 4:00, what is on? what is tapper covering today? what are the six most important stories in national world, money, politics, sports and pop culture. what are those six or seven most important stories today? who is the big interview he has, who is the great roundtable he has? let's tune in at 4:00. that's the hope. hopefully from your lips to god's ear, it will happen. >> we will find out. good luck with the new show. jake tapper. >> thanks. >> thanks very much for joining us. "the lead" airs at 4:00 p.m. eastern starting monday. that's it for this edition of "reliable sources." i'm howard kurtz we're back here next sunday morning. the verdict is coming down this

morning, cnn has been covering it. we'll follow this throughout the day. candy crowley will give us an update in just a moment. "state of the union" begins right now. i'm candy crowley in washington. the two top members of the house intelligence committees are just ahead. but, first, a breaking story we're following. two star high school football players in steubenville, ohio, were found guilty of raping a 16-year-old west virginia teenager. they both wept and addressed the court after a juvenile court judge issued his verdict. i want to bring in now our poppy har harlow who has been following the trial in steubenville. poppy? >> i am. hi, candy, i'm with bob fits

simmons. the civil attorney for the victim in this case. we're not naming the victim. cnn's policy not to do that. but he was in the courtroom for all four days of this trial. i was there for the entire thing, as well. i watched you watch very closely the testimony of 28 witnesses. first question, now that the guilty verdict on all count has been handed down, how is the victim doing? >> she's doing well. i think she's really happy that this is over and, remember, she is a 16-year-old girl still and she's a high school student. she just wants to get back with her normal life, as does the family. it is a big relief to her at this point. >> we saw her mother in the courtroom as the sentence was being given and both of the young boys stood up and apologized, weeping to the family. the mother gave a statement afterwards saying, you are your own accusers. you accused yourself through social media and you said something very interesting earlier. if these boys would have approached the family days after

this happened, weeks, that it may not have come to a trial. you think they would have accepted an apology? >> i believe so. i think the family is a very caring, religious family and very strong. i was toll as we went through this thing that was probably one of the major things that they were looking for is what they heard today. maybe a little bit late but also redeeming qualities with the defendants, actually. >> one of the big issues in this has been all of the social media after this incident occurred and you said that you believe that remorse was not shown after the incident. we heard the same thing from the victim's mother. that they did not show remorse or compassion or moral code. >> i think so. like i said, it came late and sometimes that may be a lesson for people, that if you do make a mistake, a serious mistake, sometimes you need to own up to it and things might even be better for you. but it's a tragic day. we have a bunch of young kids that were doing some conduct that is totally unacceptable.

criminal, actually. and we all need to move on and learn lessons from this thing. i think it's the most important thing and that is that our children are out there doing some things that we really need to take a closer look at. we need to decide where our children are at all time and we need to properly instruct them. we can't be friends of our kids any more. we have to be parents. >> on piers morgan tomorrow night where were the parents in all of this? one more question for you, sir. my question is, why were you in the courtroom the entire time you weren't prosecuting this case? you are the civil attorney and are there civil charges that this family is going to file? >> i can't speak to the civil. but an important thing you can do to a victim in a crime, provide guidance it them. to be in court and provide their testimony and discuss legal

issues that prosecutors oftentimes don't have the time, excuse me, don't have the time to do. but that's an important service that you can perform. >> so, no decision yet whether you'll file civil charges. i'm sure it has been discussed? >> no decision at this time. >> thank you for joining us. >> you're welcome. >> appreciate it, sir. candy, back to you. >> thanks to poppy harlow in steubenville, ohio. a 16-year-old and 17-year-old have been found guilty, delinquent, as they say in juvenile court by a juvenile court judge. one has been sentenced to two years in jail and another to one, at least one, that is the minimum. they both could serve until they are 21 years old. just recently, we also heard from the ohio attorney general mike dewine. here's some of what he had to say. >> there seems to be an unbelievable casualness about rape and about sex.

it is a cavalier attitude. a belief that somehow there isn't anything wrong with any of this. rape is not a recreational activity. we cannot bring finality to this without the convening of a grand jury. we have 16 witnesses who wouldn't talk to us. this community also desperately needs to know that justice was done and desperately needs to know that no stone was left unturned. >> again, that is the attorney general of ohio. mike dewine saying this investigation isn't complete. they will, in fact, convene a grand jury and see what else they can find out. we'll be right back with house intelligence chairman mike rogers and ranking member dutch ruppersberger. axiron is not for use in women or anyone younger than 18. axiron can transfer to others through direct contact.

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with me now the leaders of the house intelligence committee dutch rupperdberger and mike rogers. i want to start off with israel. the president is making his first trip there as president. one of his goals is to convince the prime minister that the u.s. really will not allow iran to

develop a nuclear weapon. he said in an interview recently that the u.s. believes iran is at least a year away from developing nuclear weapon capability. prime minister netanyahu has always had a shorter timetable for that. what accounts for that difference? >> think about where israel is in the world. egypt is no longer a reliable partner for peace, syria is a mess and getting worse by the day, and the number of weapons systems and jihadists that are flooding syria and have the potential to have those weapons systems throughout the lavant is concerning and oh by the way, have iran threatening to annihilate israel and clearly pursuing a nuclear weapon. the analysts are close. there are some differences and mainly it's this thing called the dash, so everybody agrees

that iran is pursuing a nuclear weapons program and the last part of it is, can they take the highly enriched uranium, weaponize it and put it on a missile for use. there is the debate, how long would it take to accomplish the last piece of that. that's where the united states analysts are saying could be a year. i wouldn't be as certain where the president is, and the israelis believe it's going to be sooner than that, and that's why the pressure is mounting for some action, maybe other than sanctions, for iran so they get the signal that we really won't tolerate them getting a nuclear weapon and proliferating nuclear weapons across the middle east. >> would you agree, congressman? >> i agree with what the chairman said. >> when you agree with him, do you mean you also think it's the timetable is shorter than the year t president laid out? >> well, some of this is classified, but let's just say this, whether it's short or long, i think it's important to know and especially for israel to know that president obama has

clearly say we will not tolerate them having a nuclear president. you know the president and netanyahu will be meeting in israel which is good. i know that relationship has not been what it should be but i think the fact that the president is going there and i think he'll reaffirm that we will not tolerate iran to have a nuclear weapon. not only for israel but the whole region. >> we can't afford to be wrong about where the line is. we can't afford to miscalculate when they have it. >> you can't trust iran. they're a rogue nation, exporting terrorism, they're cyber attack is out there. so we have to deal with that issue and i think right now the president going to israel that there hopefully will be some agreement between netanyahu and the president. >> let me move you on to something that james clapper, who is the director of the national intelligence agency, said tuesday at the senate select committee about a cyber attack. >> when it comes to the succinct threat areas our statement this year leads with cyber, and it's

hard to overemphasize its significance. we see indications that some terrorist organizations are interested in developing offensive cyber capabilities and as cyber criminals are using a growing black market to sell cyber tools that fall into the hands of both state and non-state actors. >> as clearly as you can, tell me what the threat is that he's talking about. >> well, there are different levels of the threat. there's the criminal threat and the organized criminal threat. as a matter of fact the credit card in your viewer's wallet today will get hit about 300,000 times, people trying to get the information through the credit card company to steal money from them. the next level up is cyber espionage, mainly by the nation state of china stealing intellectual property, in other words the blueprints that allow to you build your product and have a job, they go in, steal it, repurpose it and use it to artificially compete in the world market. that costs us real jobs and lastly the highest level is the military or cyber attack meaning

they could shut down a financial institution, our electric grid, and cause significant damage and harm to our economy. >> and this was the head of sort of our top spy guy saying this is the number one threat so my guess is he's not talking about criminal activity getting your credit card. he's talking about terrorists, and yet we hear we're maybe two years away from the capability and that's what we were told. >> we're not two years at all. we're having attacks as we speak right now. >> by terrorists? >> by nation states. >> we certainly know that china is, or we believe china to be behind some of this industrial spying but i'm talking about the last thing that he said about, and we know that terrorists are looking to do the kinds of things you talked about, shutting down -- >> different issues there. we know that terrorists, non-nation states are seeking the capability to do cyber attacks. >> right. >> they're probably not there yet. here's the other problem, a non-rational actor, iran, is already at the shores of the

united states with cyber attacks, and that's what's so concerning. i think that's why all of us, dutch and i have been working so hard on that. >> let's talk about that. we have attacks, wall street has we have the capability from other countries including iran to knock out our grid system, to attack some of our banks, china has probably stolen more trade secrets, the largest amount of theft in the history of the world and we have got to stop this. one of the issues out there, mike and i have been working on this for two years and we put together a bill that would pass in a bipartisan manner last year. went to the senate and failed and we have to move forward and people are saying why do we have to continue? and in that one year we've had more attacks, "the washington post," "the new york times" are getting attacked, and they're getting stronger. what keeps you up at night, i'll say spicy food, weapons of mass destruction and destructive cyber attacks, and we have the

capability to stop this, but we have to pass our bill. our bill is only 37 pages. our bill deals with privacy issues and we're still working with the white house and the senate and working with the privacy groups to try to get a bill that will protect our privacy and protect us from the cyberattacks. >> let me ask you about a more traditional threat, that is north korea. it seems to me that the worry level of the united states has gone up since we got kim jong-un. why is that? because we have sort of always thought yes, north korea, it's a rogue state and it's private and we don't know what they're doing but now there seems to be some sort of urgency about their nuclear capabilities. can they reach u.s. shores? >> they certainly have a ballistic missile that can reach

u.s. shores. they recently had their third nuclear test and you know, there was lots of speculation about the test, lots of warning to the north koreans not to do it. they have a 28-year-old leader who is trying to prove himself to the military and the military eager to have a saber rattling for their own self-interest and the combination of that is proving to be very deadly. the sheer threat that they'd openly threaten a nuclear attack against the united states is problem enough but their military movement along the dmz, the demilitarized zone in north korea a whole new set of problems for us. it's the largest military in the world still in uniform. this is something that we have to take seriously and you can see they're looking for some provocation, not just along the border but there's some islands that they're interested in, a few years ago they fired artillery on the island. this is very concerning as we just don't know the stability of their leader, again, 2years old, we're just not confident that we know who wouldn't take those steps. >> we knew his father better. >> yes, absolutely. >> i have to move on to a different subject simply because

we were told that the fbi interviewed a man in connection with the 9/11 attack in libya. do you know if he was involved in the benghazi attack? if he was, should he come here for a trial? >> look, first the issue of trial is whether you come to the united states for a trial, a civil trial or whether you are a prisoner and gitmo. i think it depends on a case by case basis. when you do go into the process of the civil court and you're what they call lawyered up, a lot of times that's when the information stops yet history shows some of the people we have taken to civil court even after a lawyer we've gotten information from so i think you have to look at the issue case by case what happens. i can tell you this, we as a nation are the strongest country in the world and we need to show that we can try people and convict people and our country and protect witnesses and everything else. so there are a lot of issues here but it's got to depend on a case by case basis. >> congressman, was this man involved in the benghazi attack?

>> we're not sure yet. we have pretty good indications that he is highly suspected of being involved and again, the problem with criminalizing this is that it lengthens the process. it slows everything down, and the key to these things is getting information soon. so you don't want to bring somebody, have them mirandized which tells them you don't have to talk to us and by the way we'll pay for a lawyer in an enemy combatant situation, that is exactly the wrong thing to do. when you criminalize it, it slows things down and more importantly doesn't allow you to get the information you need to protect the united states. >> congressman mike rogers and congressman dutch ruppersberger, more trouble spots than time, we appreciate your time this morning. >> thank you. >> thank you. next, two iraq war veterans who also happen to be newly elected to the house of representatives. and later, president obama deploys his charm offensive to woo republicans but has he forgotten the democrats? our political panel weighs in,

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it's like a sauna in here. helping you save, even if it's not with us -- now, that's progressive! call or click today. no mas pantalones! ...and we inspected his brakes for free. -free is good. -free is very good. [ male announcer ] now get 50% off brake pads and shoes at meineke. welcome back. let me introduce you to our next guest. she served in the hawaii national guard and handling logistics and operations for 3,000 troops. he was an infantry platoon and led combat operations throughout iraq. both were elected to congress

this past november and both are with me now. and republican congressman tom cotton. thank you for coming here with your brand of expertise. i want to ask you, looking at the war now and how you felt about it when you first touched down in iraq and how you feel about it now, is there a difference? >> i'll start off here. when i was activeivaated for du it was my team activated and i was serving in the state legislature and like many of the other legislatures this was not expected at that time. i was serving my constituents and going surfing on the weekend. and found out this deployment of close to 3,000 hawaii troops was happening to iraq. i was not on that first mandatory deployment roster, but

knew very quickly that there was no way that i could stay home in the comfort of my house and in hawaii and watch my brothers and sisters deploy, and recognizing the necessity to stand with them, as they went off to combat. the experience completely changed my life, and was very big motivator in recognizing what are the true costs of war, seeing that on a daily basis, and bringing that experience here to congress, where we have a very real responsibility of making those decisions about when and where our troops go to combat, and i remember those names and my friends and people who were lost every single day. >> do you find that you just look at war and the declaration of war, although there wasn't one in this case but nonetheless is different, having served? >> the iraq war wasn't just a noble war. i joined the army after 9/11, after the iraq war was started, i joined in part because i wanted to fight on the front lines. i served there in 2006.

before the surge started frankly after i left iraq toward the end of 2006 i was worried we were losing the war but after the surge i felt that we succeeded and we have a generation of veterans now who are going to be leaders all around the country, the same way the world war ii generation was, the same way the vietnam generation was, john mccain and the u.s. senate, fred smith, the founder of fedex, my father who is a leader in our small town. i think you'll see a generation of leaders coming across the country. i'm a veteran, tulsi is a veteran. i met last week with a friend from ft. benning. and we have accomplishments in iraq we should celebrate and accomplishments over the next several decades we'll make it a better place. >> let me bring you back now ten years later. i put it to jeb bush, the former governor of florida, obviously the brother of the president who went into iraq and showed us the statistics of so many people, saying it was a bad idea, it wasn't worth it and here's what

he had to say. >> a lot of things in history change over time. i think people will respect the resolve that my brother showed both in defending the country and the war in iraq. but histrewill judge that in a more objective way than today. the war has wound down now and it's still way too early to judge what success it had in terms of providing some stability in the region. >> congresswoman do you think it's too early to judge the success or the lack thereof in the war in iraq? >> it's one of the problems we've seen today as well as we saw throughout the time we spent there is victory was not clearly defined. we had many different things, taking out saddam hussein, we

had a civil war that really between the shia and the sunni and we also had the threat of al qaeda and terrorists, and our i think miscalculation there of fighting this unconventional threat, these unconventional terrorists who know no allegiance to a specific flag or country with very conventional tactics. i think as we look through the past and we look forward to the future we look to the threats we're facing today, for example, north korea, you know, you talked about this a little bit earlier, countries that have very specific capabilities that have nuclear weapons that have missiles that are within range of places like hawaii and alaska, where the people in my community are very concerned about what kinds of actions we'll take. >> i guess the question is though do you think ten years out it was worth it or do you think it's too soon to tell? >> again it's a question of what does worth it mean? was it worth it to the lives that were lost there? was it worth it with the trillions of dollars that we've spent there? >> go ahead. >> i would say it was worth it but it was also a little bit too soon to tell because there's nothing ever certain in human

affairs but if you look at the accomplishment of our troops in iraq, they deposed an evil tyrant who was an aggressive international dictator, he invaded across two boundaries, he demonstrated the ability and the will to use weapons of mass destruction. he was believed by every western government including senior high-ranking officials in president obama's cabinet now to be developing new weapons and in violation of numerous united nations resolutions. there are certainly missteps in the early days of the war, 2003, '04, '05, '06 just like abraham lincoln did after the civil war, but we did turn it around after the surge. but still there's no certainty in human affairs. we have to continue to be a leader and try to foil the iranian regime or bashar al assad's regime in syria to ensure the gains in iraq we've seen in the last ten years remain in the next ten years. >> let me turn to you, congresswoman, you alluded to,

veterans, so many of them now, and a lot of the figures that are coming out of the va right now don't speak to a country that really is committed to helping these veterans when they come back. i think we're going to pay out like $59 billion, almost $60 billion, for vets and their families in this fiscal year. the average time to complete a claim, 261 days. the backlog is more than half a million claims. do you think that the va is doing its job? >> no, not to serve every single veteran that's coming in, both the new generation of veterans from those who served in iraq and afghanistan as well as those who served in vietnam and korea and other conflicts in our past. without a doubt, we need to do better. we need to do better in congress to make sure that we as a country are fulfilling our responsibility to these veterans who have sacrificed so much, to their families and get the respect in services that they have earned. >> and what is that going to take? do you think general shinseki

has done a good job as head of the va? we talk about this all the time and we need the pentagon and the va to make a seamless transfer out of the services to the va. it doesn't happen. it's been ten years since the war started and five years, four and a half since the obama administration took over, what's it going to take? >> i think general shinseki is an example of the many public servants at the va and he is a decorated veteran himself. i've dealt with va officials in arkansas and washington here and they want to do the right thing. they may lack the resources and best practices. in some ways the department of veteran affairs is like an insurance company or claims processing company. they don't always have the best and most modern practices and one thing we could do in congress through oversight is help to ensure they get the training and resources they need. i think the will and the desire

are certainly there to serve veterans if you look at an organization like walmart, my home state just announced a new initiative where they're going to hire every veteran who applies for a job, as long as they have a clean background check, they want that experience there. the country certainly appreciates veterans and wants to serve them. >> good intentions just don't get them those benefits soon enough. >> right which is why i think it's important and i appreciate tom's service and being able to work with him as well as other veterans serving in congress and the u.s. senate because it is going to take all of us having a concerted focus, commitment and effort to make sure that the resources are there, that the focus and attention doesn't wane if it's not at the top of the headline. >> i thank both of you first of all for being here today, most of all for your service both on the battlefield and now in congress. i hope you'll come back and talk to us. >> thank you. >> great to be here. when we return, he placed seventh in this weekend's conservative straw poll but for a man who has never spent a day in politics, he brought up some pretty big faces in the republican party. dr. ben carson is next.

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>> if you just, let me just say you magically put me into the white house --

[ cheers and applause ] >> a very enthusiastic reception for dr. ben carson yesterday at the cpac conference just outside washington, d.c. conference participants cast their vote for president in a straw poll. rand paul won that poll but newcomer dr. carson finished in seventh place and beat out many well-known republican politicians. joining me dr. ben carson, including i should say sarah palin. >> i wasn't even on the ballot so i don't know how i got any votes. >> i think you were on the ballot but nonetheless, it is surprising, you are well-known in the world of neurosurgery and medicine.

it became an internet sensation at the very least after a prayer breakfast in which you openly challenged some of the president's principles as it applies to the economy. so when you look at what's happened to you over the past five weeks, how do you explain it? >> well, i can easily explain it by all the correspondence i've gotten from across the country, particularly from a lot of people who said they had given up and they didn't feel that there was anybody who represented their views in washington, d.c., and now they felt energized again, and i think basically what i've been talking about, if you distill it, it's not really right stuff or left stuff. it's logical stuff. you know, it's talking about what has happened historically to people who don't control their budget, and a whole host of other things, in terms of destroying the harmony in the nation and pitting people against each other, how those things are not useful. i think a lot of people resonate with that. they don't have to be democrats or republicans. they just have to be logical

people who want america to succeed. >> and yet i imagine a lot of folks who contacted you were republican inclined since it was seen as a direct critique of obama administration policy. >> i'd say i got a lot of mail from people who said i am a a democrat but i resonate with what you're talking about. i think a lot of democrats are just as interested in harmony and progress as republicans are. >> when you look at -- well first let me ask then, do you consider yourself a republican? >> i'm a registered independent. >> but you lean more -- you were at the conservative republican, i know they asked you to come, but would you say in general that you lean republican? >> if i were asked to come to a democratic convention and to give my views, i would be happy to do so. >> be careful what you say, dr. carson, you may show up there. tell me, one of the things that we're awaiting is a republican look at what went wrong in 2012. as a voter, as someone more than interested in politics as an observer right now, what would you say the republican party did

wrong? >> well, i don't think that they were able to connect with the people to create the level of enthusiasm that was necessary, you know, and i think a lot of the problem is a systemic problem, because i think the way that we elect presidents is not good and a lot of people who live in blue states say what's the point of me voting? a lot of people who live in red states say what's the point in me meeting? my vote really doesn't count so they don't vote so we need to reexamine this situation. >> dr. carson you are going to stick with us and join our panel which is coming up so stay right there. when we return, conservatives did cast their first votes for 2016 and a son inherits his father's place at the top of that straw poll, our political panel is up next. >> i was told i got ten measly minutes, but just in case, i brought 13 hours' worth of information.

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two who came out on top were young leaders, rand paul got 25%, marco rubio got 23%. you look down the list there was paul ryan, chris christie, in other words the top recognized, dr. carson got a good chunk of change there, so we showed that indeed the party is revolving around these new leaders in the conservative movement. we also have a couple of different tents. we've got libertarians, tea party activist, establishment conservatives so the whole idea of the cpac is to bring the whole tent together. >> although, senator paul might object to the, close to isolationist which has never been among the three things that reagan conservatives have stood for, what do you think it says, if anything? is this just a party in search of itself? >> well, as someone who was part of the democratic leadership council in the early '90s on staff. >> moderate, trying to moderate the democratic party? >> a group of democrats who were trying to lead the party out of the wilderness at the time and successfully did so, what you see out of cpac as an outside

observer it's a chance for people to introduce themselves. i'm not sure that anybody, any american walked away with an understanding this weekend that the republican party has made a decision about where it's going to go. i think that's still a really big question. i think what you saw were as al said some leaders come in and introduce themselves. it's a little bit of the big pageant before you get into the miss america show, and i think what you saw were some early introductions. i think it's kind of a no hits, no runs, no errors for the republican party. there were moments of disappointment. i think when you saw what ann coulter had to say about immigration that was disappointing because both sides think there's somewhere to move forward but mostly it was a moment for everybody to say we have a lot of work to do in this party. >> i thought you saw the fusion that the republican party is going through politically, when

you have the full retribution in terms of bipartisanship, that if you work on consensus, we're going to primary you from the club for growth, and i think that with the ryan ii budget came out, same as the first one, i think you see a party trying to define itself and i think the cpac was one part of their definition and right now, the definition that has the upper hand and i think it doesn't speak well for electoral politics down the road for republicans as a whole. >> since you brought up ann coulter i want to bring up a quick bite, ann coulter a conservative columnist and commentator and this is part what have she had to say talking about undocumented workers and the pathway to citizenship or legal documentation. >> if amnesty goes through, america becomes california and no republican will ever win another national election. >> is that a good message for republicans to have out there at this point? >> well, i don't know that it's a good message for anybody, because you know, we have people here. they're an important part of our economy, and all we have to do

is look to our north, canada, where they have a very functional guest worker program, and if we initiated that, allowed people to be here legally, work, be registered, pay taxes, go back home, and to continue along the pathway of citizenship, if that's what they wanted to do, just like anybody else, why do we have to make it into a big political issue. >> and yet it is. >> we had immigration, the evolution of the conservative movement on the issue of immigration is nothing less than astonishing. congressman labrador headed that panel. the panel talked about moving forward and agreeing on an immigration reform package that covered all of the concerns of the conservative movement and frankly if there was not unanimity a wide consensus that's the way we're going. >> yet she represents a part of the party. >> she has an audience but if you would have looked at this last year you would have never

had a panel like this or reaction from the audience like we had. there's been tremendous progress towards a bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform package and one that includes the concerns of most conservatives, concerns that have lasted for 20 years or more since the reagan 1986 situation, we thought we needed more in the enforcement side. i think raul and the other members of congress are working on that. so by the time this thing is over, i think most of the wants and needs of all sides of the aisles are going to be met. >> go ahead. >> coulter's comments do nothing but try to stir up state divisions that we saw for the last three, four, five, six years, us versus them. they're not part of us. those kinds of, you know, barely muted commentaries i think we've gone way beyond the coulter sense of what immigration should be. it's a broken system, most americans agree to that and there is an opportunity here for

some bipartisanship and to come up with a solution to the broken system. >> it would take it off the plate for 2016 which i think you all would probably be happy about, republicans. >> well it needs to get done and frankly the window is very narrow. forget '14 or '16. if it doesn't get done it may get put on the shelf for a long time. >> it raises a challenge that the republican party has. they have some big entertainment celebrities, political entertainers on their side of the aisle that i think could prove to be really challenging for the republican party. >> donald trump. >> donald trump, you think about radio talk show host that we could name a few, who have the potential to derail those republicans who want to work. they are the first to lay down threats about who they will support and won't support and the first to wield that bat of anti-cooperation or obstructism. >> i don't think that is going to be as big a problem if people are willing to sit down at the table and discuss things without having hardened positions. that always seems to be the case. we just need to soften those

positions and let everybody explain the reason that they have their positions and what the rational conclusion is to that position and let's talk about it. the multitude of counselors is safety, as it says in proverbs and we need to begin to live by it. >> kiki, i think both sides frankly have folks who cater to activists. that's not unhealthy. you know, we're living now in an era of new media and media celebrities that take a very strong position and i think that side of the aisle has as many participants as ours. both sides of the aisle are coming up with some pretty committed activists. >> i want to move you to a problem sort of inside the democratic party and also brings the other story of the week, which is the president charm offensive. i want to play for you real quickly something that the house democratic leader nancy pelosi said to me last week.

we were talking about changes in entitlements in order to kind of bring the budget under control and here is what she said. >> if the point of it is to take trophy, let's raise the age. that doesn't save money. it's a trophy, it's a scalp. >> so, along with this. we seem to have the former speaker of the house, you may not touch entitlements and we have the progressive wing of the democratic party saying, no, you may not touch entitlements and, yet, everyone says you cannot bring down spending without touching entitlements. do you trust the president to protect medicare, social security, medicaid? >> i'm holding the president to his word through the campaign that those were important programs that other things can be done to create savings, to generate revenue, you know, the progressive caucus budget reflects that. but, i think, also, we have to understand that this is also

philosophical fight as much as it is a fiscal fight. there is the idea of shrinking government and medicare and social security have always been seen as the political targets of some of my colleagues on the other side of the aisle. so, obviously, this is not just about fiscal policy, it's about political philosophy. you can talk about reducing spending, but when you're working families or young people trying to get that dream in this country of ours, the doesn't look the same from the perch. when we return, pope francis delivers his first sermon to the faithful. the headlines are next. [ pilot ] now when you build an aircraft,

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