they're looking at this legislation. >> they say in the infancy. do you think this actually could go through? >> it is entirely possible. it is now bipartisan. and, of course that, needs to happen before anything can get through. >> good idea from senator isaac son. thank you very much. >> thank you. >> that's it for us. thanks very much for watching. erin burnett "outfront" starts right now. out frond, north korea cuts all communication with the south and says a simmering nuclear war could break out at any moment. a new development in the movie theater massacre, should james holmes be spared the death penalty? and is the defense of marriage act a goner? let's go "outfront" and ask today. >> i'm erin burnett. "outfront" tonight, killing the

hotline. north korea cut all military communication with south korea. tensions between the two countries tonight tebrink. the north says a war could break out at any moment. today the united states denounced the move. >>. >> we think the provocative rhetoric is not constructive to insuring peace and stability on the peninsula. >> north korea packed serious punch. the military has unknown number of nuclear weapons as many as 800 short and long range ballistic missiles and $1.2 million fighting troops. all dangerously close to the 30,000 american soldiers stationed in south korea. the dictator says north korea is not a paper tiger. it wouldn't be smart to dismiss its provocative behavior as pure bluster.

matthew, how big of a step is the move today to sever the military hotline? >> well, they've done that before. but it's still a pretty big step. there are more than a million troops facing up against each other across one of the most volatile borders in the world. and so there are very few channels of communications between those two militaries. so when one of them is severed like this, obviously increases the possibility of a miscalculation of a misstep that could potentially escalate into something more serious. and that's one of the big concerns now. the so little trust between the two sides so little opportunity for them to communicate and coordinate. that could lead to something very dangerous indeed, erin. >> matthew, some people might say what were the hotlines really used for if they were only for emergencies? maybe they weren't really used. maybe this isn't that important. were they regularly using this line?

>> yeah, this line is used on a daily basis. it is a hotline in the industrial complex. it is a sort of free trade zone which is set up as a sort of rare economic bridge between north and south korea. and so it's going to have an impact on that. it may even disable that economic zone altogether and prevent south korean workers from going across the border into the zone into north korea. it could have a really big impact, economically and on the security situation on the ground, erin. >> matthew chance, thank you very much reporting live. >> the united states has more than 50,000 troops in north korea. he had royce says the chairman of the house foreign relations committee and he is out front tonight. good to see you, sir. thank you for taking the time. why do you think we are seeing what seems to be such incredibly quick escalation happening right now? >> i think the young man who has

taken control of north korea is himself very aggressive. and you have the election of a new female president madam park who i met with a month ago in south korea. remember, these provications have been pretty constant. and madam parks own mother when she was young was atass natured by the north koreans in south korea. so they are used to dealing with provocative behavior. they had one of the war ships blown up not long -- not too many years ago. >> right. >> lost 40 sailors. and so they're used to the shelling of their islands and so forth. and this kind of provication at times when the north korean leadership attempts to flex its muscle and use its power. what's unusual though is now we have north korea developing not only three stage icbms, but having nuclear capability, nuclear weapons. and they're looking to miniaturize those and be able to

put them on an icbm which would be a game changer. and this, of course, is of concern to the united states. >> that's right. in addition, north korea cut the phone line as we just reported. they've done, as you know, three nuclear tests recently. they test fired a long range missile. then, of course, there is the video of the past few weeks that we've been showing the viewers, white house, capitol and new york, you know, as going up in flames after north korean attack. pentagon spokesman george little says we take their rhetoric seriously and if you look at what they said recently, it's been extremely provocative, threatening and bell koes. what would you do beyond saying what george is saying? >> well, two things that the united states is doing right now. one is we're bringing more interceptors online in terms of california and in alaska in order to have the capability if there were ever a rogue launch from north korea. they're not to the point yet where they can miniaturize their icbms.

i would suggest before they get that capability of putting a weapon on an icbm that we go back to what we did in 2005 when we were confront bid provocative behavior. they were then counterfeiting our $100 bills. the u.s. treasury department froze the bank accounts, froze the accounts in the bank of delta asia and other bank that's were being used for hard currency by north korea which suddenly meant that not only could the dictator not pay his generals, but he also couldn't continue the production lines on his missile program. i think it's frankly time. new sanctions are being put in place. but we ought to put those types of sanctions that briefly were put in place in 2005 because that would shut down a lot of activity in north korea and we want to do that before they get the nuclear weapons. >> it's an interesting point. >> the capability. >> this just this month the national security adviser talked about the north korea situation.

here's what he had to say exactly. >> the united states will not accept north korea's nuclear state nor will we stand by while it seeks to develop a nuclear arm missile that can target the united states. >> i mean what amazed me about that is, of course, north korea already is a nuclear state. they already are seeking to arm weapons that could come and strike the united states. they've done all this, chairman, despite sanctions from the united states that have been in place since 1950. and i just wonder when you by this that, if you're another country, you say look, isn't the lesson here that you should do whatever you need to do to get a nuke. once you have one, the united states is pretty much powerless against you. >> well, here's the problem. the problem is what we have done since the '94 framework agreement is not put the types of sanctions, financial sacti sanctions on north korea except in 2005. and as a result -- >> so you think if we had the sanctions, it would have really

worked? of course they first got a nuclear weapon, at least the reports i've seen was 2006, after the sanctions, of course, and under president george w. bush. >> that's right. we talked to deinfectors who worked on their missile program. i talked to the top propaganda minister who defected through china. they all indicated that the regime if it's faced with those types of sanctions cannot get the hard currency and cannot sustain the support. and so i would go back to what was tried briefly in 2005 because it just cuts off the flow of the hard currency they need to pay the army to do their weapons buildup. none of that money comes back into the country to help the people in the countryside. i've been in north korea. they're all fending for themselves. the money goes into their weapons programs. and that's why it should be curtailed. that's why the bank accounts should be shut down. >> all right. thank you very much, chairman. we appreciate your time. of course, we'll be following that to see if sanctions will be

enough or if the united states will have to do more. if the u.s. is willing to do more. still to come, is the alleged colorado movie theater shooter about to avoid the death penalty? plus, paying big, big bucks for a picasso. elbows are being thrown, literally, over this one. and same-sex marriage hangs in the balance. why some people think the supreme court is going to overturn the defense of marriage act. and one of the most incredible -- i mean probably the most incredible bus craes

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(train horn) vo: wherever our trains go, the economy comes to life. norfolk southern. one line, infinite possibilities. our second story "outfront," plea deal. aurora, colorado movie theater shooting suspect james holmes is now offering a guilty plea in exchange for life in prison.

instead of the death penalty. prosecutors though haven't accepted the deal and they may still go for the death penalty in the shooting rampage last july in which 12 were murdered and 58 more wounded. "outfront" tonight, a former prosecutor and ann bremner. paul, bottom line, does holmes deserve to die? >> let's look at the crime. meticulously planned. he puts his body armor on. he's diagrammed the theater. he then enters the theater with a shotgun, fires a shot into the ceiling so people will look up and then he walks around with his glock and his smith and wesson automatic with high capacity magazines meticulously killing one person after another after another. in the end, 12 dead, 58 injured. we're not done yet though. he bob traoby traps his apartme the first person through the door would have been cut in half

by the explosives. does he deserve the death penalty? yes, does he. he probably deserves to die slowly the crime is so horrific. >> ann, do you agree? >> well, no. this is a case -- in colorado, the government has to prove that he's sane beyond a reasonable doubt. that is unlike many, many states. that is going to be impossible. the question of what he deserves isn't really the question here. the question is legally what's going to happen. and he's got a psychiatric hist w history. all these different things when accounting insane. and they have a diagnosis. he's been evaluated. so can they show he's sane beyond a reasonable doubt snt answer is no. so then the next question is it what do they do about that? >> let me ask you a question to follow up on that. it's not about what he deserves. i understand there is a legal issue. for many, this is more than that. this is human life. tom teeves, a father of a man named alex, a young man in that theater who was killed. i talked to tom recently. i asked him what he thought about the death penalty for james holmes. here's what he said. >> it is a struggle to be honest

with you. but i don't want that man on the street going out and killing your child because he will do it again when he's -- when they talked about the people, he could have cared less. they were objects to him. >> ann, can you tell a father like that he shouldn't get the death penalty? >> you know, my heart goes out to this father and everybody affected. this is a horrible case. and the visceral reaction is you want james holmes to die. but here's the problem. if they go to trial, the state, and he's acquitted by reason of insanity, then he's going to go to a mental institution and get out potentially. >> ann, he's not going to be acquitted. to establish that you are legally insane, you have to not understand the nature and consequences of your acts. there are so many planning issues here. this was a meticulously planned group of homicides over a lengthy period of time. and by the way, most killers who commit crimes like this have an

element of mental illness. i mean as a matter of fact, they would all be going to mental hospitals if they got off because they color their hair red and act strangely. this is a case, however, you can't make out insanity. because of the meticulous planning that went into the homicide. so i think prosecutors are going to win this case. >> you know, the thing is also it's not what i was going to say also, it's not just in sanity of the trial, you're not going to kill a mentally ill person. in the death penalty phase, mitigation and everything else, you have two things to get over as a prosecutor. also this is colorado. they have the burden of proof. can you prove he is sane? when he has diagnosis out there and he acted in a fashion that would be commensurate with vinding of insanity. so what he did planning, that is not the whole equation. >> you know very well that there's a major difference between legal insanity and clinical insanity. >> absolutely. >> there are lots of mentally ill people walking around with a diagnosis of mental illness. that doesn't mean hair legally

insane. and he is going to be very easy to prove he was sane at the time of the homicide. >> isn't it true, ann, we could all assume as citizens of this country that anybody who did something like this, anybody who does these mass shoot sgz mentally ill the way we define it. as a court would define it, isn't the burden for that a lot higher? >> well, the bottom line is in colorado it's one of the easiest defenses to prove which is you don't have the two part test which which is hard to show insanity. he has been shown to be insane. the fact is the prosecutors can't prove that he's sane. he's just like jared loughner or also in the newtown shootings with adam lanza, you have all the individuals that are schizophrenic, they acted in a fashion that is almost exactly like the person did that gave a basis first -- >> ann, every one is different. you have to -- >> sure they are. >> you have to examine the individual acts and state of mind at the time. and this guy has the planning that went into this is going to

lead to a conviction ultimately i think. >> i think that things like -- even the psychiatrist from the state are going to agree of the defense. it's a problem. it's a horrific case. i think the end of the day it will be a plea. >> we'll see what will happen on monday. there will be a ruling. there thanks to both. still to come, for months, actress ashley judd hinted at a senate run. she's flirted with one and she decided to let us know her decision today via twitter. plus, a billionaire casino magnet put his elbow through a painting by picasso. i mean honestly. and that's just where the fun started. and a huge landslide near seattle today, look at that next to those huge homes. we have a special report. as certified recovery specialists at lifelock,

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watching paint dry can actually be good fun-- bleh-- but you've got to be there to enjoy it.

our third story "outfront," a pricey, pricey picasso. how much would you be willing to pay for this masterpiece?

i like the pan down there. gives you a chance to consider what the picture is actually of. well, anyway, do you think that it is worth a record $155 million? because that's what that picture just sold for. maybe, you know, it does get a conversation going. the most intriguing part about it though is that the painting was actually damaged. we have the story "outfront." >> reporter: this is the tale of an art sale between two giants. although there is some mystery surrounding it, it's widely believed casino king steve win sold one of picasso's most famous paintings to steve he coulden for a record $155 million. that's the most any u.s. collector has ever paid for a piece of art. it's a painting of picasso's long time mistress. the title is la rev, french for the dream. >> it is of an extremely famous

picasso from one of the most celebrated periods, 1932. it's a picture of possession, of passion, of love. >> but the dream is not without its flaws. win, originally agreed to sell the picture back in 2006. but just a day after the deal was done, wynn famously put his elbow through it creating a six inch tear. >> i turned to the right and caught her right on the arm and poked a hole in the picture the size of the end of my thumb. we stood there in shock. i can't believe i've done it. oh, no! oh, no! >> reporter: the restoration took months. but cohen wanted it anyway. and ultimately paid $16 million more for it post tear. >> we stood there looking for it. and it is so infinitesimal. it was so amazingly restored. >> i think people are fixated on the fact that there is damage.

>> it's interesting. i think that if you -- i mean it is very cinematic to think of someone putting an elbow through a painting. i would probably have some things wrong with me, too. so, you know -- >> reporter: it's not just the price and the tear, the timing of the sale is what's getting so much attention. coming just as cohen's hedge fund sac capital settles two insider trading lawsuits paying the federal government a record $616 million. the headline, cohen settles wrongdoing, buys himself extravagant gift, a masterpiece. why would anyone pay upwards of $155 million for a single piece of art even one that was so famously damaged? art experts say that's because the very best of the best will appreciate the most. one likened it to buying a pent yo house versus a second floor apartment. a masterpiece is a masterpiece.

la rev will always hold its place in history and will hold its own place in cohen's $1 billion art collection until he decides to sell it for what could be another record price. and still to come, the supreme court prepares to rule on same sex marriage. if you go through what the judges asked today and some of the conversations, you actually might be able to tell a verdict. plus, ashley judd is dropped hints about a senate run for months. she's finally made a decision. and some of the most dramatic footage that we have ever seen. how the driver of this bus survived that crash. but your erectile dysfunction - you know,that could be a question of blood flow. cialis tadalafil for daily use helps you be ready anytime the moment's right. you can be more confident in your ability to be ready. and the same cialis is the only daily ed tablet approved to treat ed and symptoms of bph, like needing to go frequently or urgently.

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welcome back. we start with some stories we care about where we focus on reporting from the front lines. senator mitch mcconnell and karl rove are having a good night. they might have extra campaign cash. ashley judd won't be running for mcconnell's kentucky seat, saving rove some money.

the actress and democrat made at announcement today via twitter. writing, a serious and thorough contemplation, i realize that my responsibilities in energy at this time need to be focused on my family. for months as you may be aware there was speculation judd would run. the momentum grew enough to keep mcconnell and rove on their toes with videos and a $10,000 web ad attacking judd. she wasn't even running then. maybe she should consider it one day. this is the most amazing video i have seen in a long time. there was a bus driver in china and when you look at this video, you'll see he appears to be engaging in small talk with his passengers. okay. do you see what happened? a light pole came crashing through the windshield. now he's actually okay for the most part. he did rupture his spleen. he was almost decapitated or worse. but yet he managed to unbuckle his seat belt and help all 26

passengers off his bus. watch it come through. i mean that is a light pole. one passenger narrowly escaped being hit by the pole. the fact that these people didn't die. a car on the open side side of the highway crashed into the light pole and it fell just as the bus -- whoa -- was coming on. smab many of the $158 billion in stimulus that china unveiled last year should go towards make something better barricades on those highways. it's been 601 days since the u.s. lost its top credit rating. the pentagon is going to delay federal worker furloughs by two weeks. it doesn't do anything. the problem is all it does is delay the pain. and now our fourth story "outfront." supreme doubts. so much skepticism today from supreme court justices on the defense of marriage act. that act defines marriage as between a man and a woman. here's justice anthony kennedy considered the swing vote on this court. >> federal government is

intertwined with the citizens day-to-day life, you are at real risk of running in conflict with what is always been thought to be the essence of the state police power which is to regulate marriage, divorce, custody. >> chief justice john roberts was also skeptical about the motivation behind the 1996 law. >> it was enacted to exclude same sex married, lawfully married couples from federal benefit regimes based on the conclusion that was driven by moral disapproval. it is quite clear in black and white and pages of the house report which we cite on page 38. >> so that was the view of the 84 senators who voted favor of it and the president who signed it? they were motivated by an mus? >> it may well have been what gar it described as the simple want of careful reflection or

instirvegtive response to a class of people, a group of people who we perceive as alien or other. >> alien or other. the case against the defense of marriage act was brought by an elderly new york woman. she was hit about w. a $363,000 federal estate tax bill when her same sex spouse passed what way in 2009. had the federal government recognized her marriage which was valid in new york, she would have owed nothing. "outfront" tonight, senior legal analyst jeffrey toobin who was in the courtroom today. did you get the sense watching this that the defensive marriage act is going down? >> reporter: well, fair warning, i don't exactly have a perfect record on predicting supreme court decisions based on the oral argument. but, anyway, that said, it did look like there were five votes to overturn the defensive marriage act not on the ground that it was discriminatory against gay people but on the ground that anthony kennedy

suggested in that clip you just ran that this was a federal law that interferes with state power to regulate marriage. that looked like an argument that had five votes but that would be a victory for edith windsor and that would overturn the law. >> here's what i'm interested in. you think about this. if you're a conservative justice in, favor of states' rights. you would then be likely to overturn this. but, of course, this is a bill that requires marriage to be between a man and woman which is what a conservative justice believes that marriage should be. so when you are given such a choice, what do you pick? >> reporter: well, it depends on what kind of conservative you are. chief justice roberts, justice ka stee la, justice thomas, jut alito tend to be more traditional conservatives, big government conservatives. justice kennedy is usually conservative but he is more of a libertarian style conservative. and so he would be more

sympathetic to the argument that, you know, the federal government needs to leave the states alone. that gay people need to be left alone. he has traditionally been very supportive of gay rights although today he is much more interested in the federalism argument than the gay rights argument. >> do you think -- i mean some people have said does it matter what your personal relationship to this issue is into whether you should rule on it? we take chief justice roberts, his first attorney in the courtroom, does that matter in terms of his ability to rule. >> i don't think so. certainly, it's not evidence of bias. justices are human beings. they have families. they have religions. they have racial backgrounds. they have had previous jobs. some of them have been active democrats or active republicans. you don't have to be sealed off from the world to be a judgment you just have to be -- have the

ability to listen. i don't think there's any evidence that any of the nine justices have any sort of bias in a case like this. it's just a hard case. >> right. well, as you point out, they're all human beings. on any given issue, they may have a personal reference. it looks like this act could do, could go away. bu just like we were talking about with california's law, some of the justices wanted to say, look, i don't want to go there. i don't juan to touch the whole guy marriage issue. let me play little piece. >> i'm wondering if we're living in this new world where the attorney general can simply decide, yeah, it's unconstitutional but it's not so unconstitutional that i'm not willing to enforce it. if we're in this new world, i don't want these cases like this to come before this court all the time. >> kind of interesting, jeff f you're going to say you don't

want the case, why did you take it in the first place? but seriously, what's the chance that they punt on this one? they don't make a decision that is formal? >> there is an argument that would give the opportunity to punt. this is an odd case in one important respect. the plaintiff here says the law sun constitutional. the defendant here which is the obama administration also thinks the law is unconstitutional. so there was a lot of discussion among the justices about why is this a real lawsuit when both sides agree? so they could actually throw the case out on that ground that there is not really a controversy here. so they could punt on this. they could punt on yesterday's proposition 8 case. they were certainly very many suggestions that they might do that there. >> right. >> we could -- this whole thing could end with a thud. i sort of doubt it. i think at least this case will be decided on the merits come the end of june. >> jeff tube in, thank you. and now a massive landslide

in washington state. this is just incredible when you look at this and the dropoff from the homes. it has destroyed homes and threatening 17 others. look at that person standing there and there is a garden, like a park, and then just a drop. it is about 30 miles north of seattle. we don't have any reported injuries. a lot of earth, tons of earth have fallen offer the island into puget sound. jimmy lynn from our seattle affiliate is there. any indication when things will stabilize? it is just incredible when luke at these pictures and imagine this happening. >> reporter: erin, no word on when things will stabilize right now. but this thing is about 700 feet or over 700 feet wide. this thing is massive. i want to step out of the way so you can take a look at this one house evacuated. it has caution tape across it. this is one of several homes that were evacuated in this area. and just behind the house there is supposed to be a backyard.

what you see right now is the sound. but really there is supposed to be an additional 75, 80 feet of backyard. all of that slid down into puget sound. neighbors say it started just before 3:00 a.m. they thought it was an earthquake. it was so loud and the ground was shaking. officials on the scene say these slides are normal for this time of year because the ground is moist. they have never seen anything this big before. it's pretty overwhelming when you see it in person, erin. >> i can only imagine. you're saying they have never seen anything like. this when you look at the pictures, it is just -- you can't imagine being there how terrifying it would be to see all that earth just go. >> reporter: yeah. it's so true. and all afternoon my photographer craig and i, we were watching this slide continue to crumble and crumble. trust me, it is loud when the rocks start to fall. you're never sure how much rock is going to come down so they're trying to keep this entire area secure. >> all right. thank you very much.

just a -- wow. still "outfront," what killed thousands of ducks? a mystery has officials very worried. and is it time to tax e-mail? what's your preferred search engine? search engine, uhh, probably google. if we do a side by side blind test comparison, and you end up choosing google, you get an xbox. i'll bet you the xbox, you bet me your son. well let's look up what you need. okay, i would do the left. yeah? what?! i am a daddy! bing wins it! bing won. bing did win. people prefer bing over google for the web's top searches. don't believe it? go to bingiton.com and see what you're missing.

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we're back with tonight's "outer circle." we reach out to our sources around the world. tonight we go to china. 1,000 dead ducks have been found floating in a river. this comes just a couple weeks after 16,000 dead pigs were pulled out of a river near shanghai. our david mckenzie is in beijing and i asked him what killed the ducks. this is one of the most popular food markets here in beijing. it has a pretty good reputation. but there is a whole series of scandals breaking here in china on food safety issues. the latest is this. 1,000 dead ducks found in the province in this river. authorities don't know what caused it. they say the people are safe. comes off the back of tens of thousands, more than 10,000 pigs found in a river near shanghai. now in both cases, they don't know what exactly caused these mass deaths. they are saying to the public they shouldn't be worried but there is a growing sense of fear

in china about food safety issues. erin? >> i would not trust the officials. all right. now to pakistan. an attack similar to the one on the teenage activist has happened. a female teacher was gunned down on her way to school. her son survived the attack, saw the whole thing. nick robertson is in islamabad and i asked him what the teacher's son said happened. >> the more we're leerng about this the more chilling it's becoming. the sun went to school with his mother. they were walk ago long towards the school. the all girls school where she taught. two men approached them from behind, fired three shots at his mother, he said. she was hit in the head. he was covered in blood. she dropped down. they fired three more shots. he says he was forced to run away when he came back he saw something no boy of his age should ever witness. he was there as his mother died. now a husband has said already the school she was teaching at in one area became too dangerous. the government moved him away. he is very critical that the government is not doing enough

to protect young girls and teachers from going to school to teach them. erin? >> all right. nick, thank you. now let's check in with anderson koomer with a look at what is coming up. >> we're going to cover the second day of hearings in the supreme court taking potentially history making cases on paige marriage. we'll talk with jeffrey toobin who was in the court and talk with nfl punter chris kluwe of the minnesota vikings. he is an outspoken advocate for gays and lesbians. he's been following the court proceedings closely. we're going to talk about the possibility that the nfl may have an openly gay player. after that massive manhunt, we know this is how rogue ex-cop christopher dorner's manhunt ended. now the money may not be paid since dorner was killed and not capturedment we're going to talk with a senior correspondent and a former lapd counter-terrorism chief, john miller. erin? >> see you in a couple minutes.

and now our fifth story "outfront." i'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news. it may be time to tax your e-mail. like i said, i am only the messenger. your inbox may be grateful. don't you feel like you get hundreds of embarrass a day? i would love this they were taxed so people would stop sending them. california floated the idea of taxing e-mails to fund your local post office. don't roll your eyes. this may not be far fetched. the law prohibiting such a tax expires next yearment for those of new congress looking for a way to raise revenue, i'm giving you an idea and a lot of people will hate me for it. "outfront" tonight, stephanie miller, and editor in chief of lines magazinement if you're e-mailing with your company and co-workers that, is free. it's personal e-mails where you sign up at home and have to pay and get a cell phone.

a certain number of e-mails free and then you start paying. what do you think? >> listen, i'm with you. i think it won't affect most of us. it's going to affect spam. can i take this opportunity, erin, on national television to say, no, i do not need a penis enlargement, thank you. i'm really sorry what happened you to and your family overseas. i'm not going to send you money. i'm happy i won the nigerian lottery, no thanks but no thanks. i mean seriously. this is most of the mail we all get, right? >> that what a totally genuine e-mail i sent you and it hurt me you never wrote back, stephanie. >> i appreciate it, thanks. >> that's what i'm here for. >> then where does it stop? you know, i also think that a lot of the tweets out there could be taxed so we can shut some of the nastiness up. we could tax text messages. we could tax postings on facebook. >> to answer your question, it stops in the berkeley city council like a lot of terrible ideas. no, this is like taxing, you know, horse and buggies or

taxing cars to keep horse and bugies business. why are we taxing the great new thing so that we can prop up the bad old thing? it's completely backwards. i me that it's coming in berkeley, which is not a punch line, it's the home of the free speech movement 50 years ago, for crying out loud. and we're going to put a punitive tax on one of the greatest free speech instruments in our lifetime. it's absurd. >> but ryan, there is something to be said. i hear your point about the horse and buggy. what about this? we've always paid to send mail. now the way in which we send mail has changed. why should we not still be paying? >> the fundamental issue of the cost of sending unalthough as i say ted mail is super low so even if one in a million people responds, it's still worth it for the spammers to send it to you. we have these amazing things called private companies that have actually mostly stalled this problem. these days, most of this unsolicited mail you get goes into a spam folder and those services are getting better and better over time. we had ideas like an e-scam,

some means of taxing e-mails proposed in the mid '90s and turns out they weren't really necessary. a couple businesses tried them out and they were hard to enforce. you mentioned text messages. already people are migrating from one technology that becomes crappy and clogged with spam to another technology. and that's why something like this would actually be unenforceable. so leave it to private sector innovations to solve the problem. >> stephanie -- go ahead. >> i was going to say, erin, these guys obviously do not get as much hate mail as i do. if i could get one less e-mail a day calling me the c word i would be happy. let's take a look at the mail i've gotten -- >> i've got to agree with her on that, by the way. >> oh, look, oh, we can get viagra for 75% off, erin. and oh, look, we can help some woman cheat on her husband. i mean, come on. most of this stuff is spam. and the legislators and the congress people that are too chicken to do this, they have people to screen all their mail. most of us don't. right? >> well, there's a thing called an e-mail filter. i don't know what you use, but i

haven't seen my cousin from nigeria e-mail for more than a year because there is a spam filter that works, a spam filter that no government gave me, no tax created, no bureaucrat. >> come on, maybe the government needs to be the ones to tell us you're talking too much, spending too much. maybe the government needs to be the one to tell us to shut our trap. >> to do this, they would need to install government surveillance on every e-mail server and probably every computer. >> i'm going to bet they already have it. >> that's a whole other -- >> that's a whole other -- by the way, i think they're going to do it. >> a drone can already see what you're writing. >> no reason not to fight it. >> but the thing in terms of funding the post office. what about that argument? i understand about the horse and buggy. isn't there some sense in that? we're sending -- got the numbers. 12.1 billion business e-mails a year. a 1 cent tax on each of those, you're getting some money. >> what the post service does now, the bulk of what they send is what i like to call physical

spam which is worse for the environment. it's rather unpleasant and now the postal service is saying the federal government has undermine them by saying they're saying we have to adequately fund our pension, that's crazy talk. so postal employees are funding ads on my television that are visual spam that are telling us this is some grave injustice they should fund these crazy pension obligations they have built up over years. the u.s. postal service, maybe there is a reduced place for it. maybe if they deliver five days a week rather than six, that would make sense. but i don't see every other industry should have to subsidize postal carries. there are a lot that can use those resources. >> fair point. half a million or more employees, they aren't able to switch that fast. i'm not saying -- that's why their so scared. >> the government is not a jobs program. it just isn't. it shouldn't be, rightfully so. and the fact that congress won't allow a single post office to shut down is part of the problem. if you lift the mandate and open everything up to competition, it would be a much different story. >> thanks very much.

sorry to worry you. i think they're watching you. right now. "outfront" next. the essay, justin bieber and a 15-pound newborn.

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justin bieber has had a rough time lately. during his recent tour in london, he got into an altercation with a photographer. now being accused of assaulting one of his own neighbors in california. it's been bad. but it's been worse for his mom. patty moletti was a single mother who helped guide her son to stardom. she is obviously distressed by her son oh's recent troubles. she spoke to "access hollywood" today saying, quote, i mean, he's growing up. he's 19. i mean, he's not my baby. i want to be able to take away free will sometimes and be able to do everything for him, but -- we feel for bieber's mom. can't be easy being the mother of the most famous young man on the planet when he does embarrassing and stupid things and you wish you could fix it. but as tough as it has been on her, we have found a mother who has had a tougher time lately.

this would be jade, the young woman in britain. a month ago she gave birth to her son, a difficult birth. and during the procedure, the baby went five minutes without oxygen and was given a 10% chance of survival. but he got through it. and within a few weeks, he went home. so what's the problem? his size. jade told the bbc, i'm quoting her, when his head came out, that's when they realized how big he was and then his shoulders got stuck. and that's when everything kicked off. really, that's when it got really scary. yeah. her baby was born much larger than doctors expected. how much larger? 15 pounds, 7 ounces. natural birth. aww. george king was almost 16 pounds at birth. he was born wearing clothes for 6-month-old babies. he is the second-largest natural