>> that was a good movie. that was in 1995. so maybe saggy pants are here to stay and with more and more towns banning them, you can make your check payable to the "ridicu-list." that's it for us. thanks for watching. but on piers morgan, zimmerman's attorney explains the weight the mind of edward snowden, who is the man that revealed america's secrets. we brought you the story of the pot moms of beverly hills. tonight a man who had his own

struggles. why patrick is against legalizing cannabis. i want to begin with graphic and sometimes shocking testimony in zimmerman's trial. martin savidge has the latest. >> reporter: piers, today was a day the courtroom was transferred back to the faithful night where trayvon martin, the 17-year-old, was killed by george zimmerman. that's not in contest. it's been said that george zimmerman killed the teen, but whether it was done in self-defense or murder. we've seen so many images from this story but the first time we've seen the images of trayvon martin himself laying dead on the ground. it was a shock to the courtroom and the jury, as well, to see just a young teen lying life less on the ground. they had tremendous impact and humanized up to now has been an argument between defense and prosecution. those images extremely powerful, piers? >> martin, what were the key

points that came out from the evidence? it seemed to me one of them, there is no evidence apparently of dna on the gun. how significant could that be, of trayvon martin's dna i should say? >> there is an issue because there is talk there may have been a struggle over the weapon, and that at one point trayvon martin put his hand on the gun, reached for the gun. so to figure out whose dna, especially his would be significant. however, there will be those that argue, good, it was not good weather-wise that night and raining a lot. so in the hours it took to process, the scene, some of that dna could be washed away. i will point out a significant piece of testimony today was a first responder who talked about showing up and trying to revive the young teen. this is moments after he is shot. it was pretty emotional, take a listen. >> what did you do upon hearing those bubbling sounds from trayvon martin's chest. >> i called out to the crowd

gathering nearby and asked for sure ran wrap and vasoline, sir. >> what would be the purpose of that? >> was going to try to seal the chest wound, sir. >> he's literally trying to plug the wound, unaware of course, that the young teen had been shot through the heart. there was no way he could have been revived, but for the parents of trayvon martin, tracy martin actually got up and left when he saw that imagery. sabrina fulton, his mother stat there and listened to the last moments of her son's life. >> so far, martin, we know apparently there is no trayvon martin dna on the gun and no evidence of bruising on his fists. so if you're looking at this in totality, quite hard to see how this z has been the bruising

brawl the zimmerman camp would like us to believe unless he simply, as they tried to make us infer, banged zimmerman's head on the concrete. >> the prosecution is maintaining they look at the hands and they say -- of trayvon martin and there is no clear indication he was delivering some beating, however, then today they actually showed the photographs that were taken by the police and it was defense that said well, you can see the bumps there on george zimmerman's head. it's not a medical measure of the severity. that will come later. so really, what we have heard. this is the thing with this case. we all heard the evidence. it's whether or not we have been told it in the full fashion that the defense of prosecution believes. these are early days. there is a lot more to come. we'll especially probably hear from the girlfriend of trayvon martin who was supposedly on the phone when this transpired and that could be some really interesting testimony. >> that could be absolutely river visiting testimony because we think she was there for the last few seconds before the confrontation started. i want to bring in my legal

dream team on this. welcome, to you both. start with you gloria. pretty significant day, i think, because the more that we hear so far, the less evidence there is of a fistfight or any kind of conventional brawl. >> and we may, in fact, hear that there is no dna under trayvon martin's fingernails, either, and that would mean that he wasn't fighting, so we'll have to wait and see if that comes in. also, it's going to be interesting as to the girlfriend when she testifies, or the friend who may not have been a girlfriend, according to the testimony, her credibility is going to be at issue, and i'm sure that the defense is going to be attacking her big time because she's expected to testify that she heard trayvon martin say he's following me. which would not be a good fact for george zimmerman.

>> right, tom, from all that you've seen so far, would you rather be in the defense or prosecution camp? >> well, piers, because the law so much favors the defense, i mean, this is one of the best self-defense statutes for a defendant i've ever seen and one of the most pro-defense states in america when it comes to raising self-defense. because the law favors them so much, you would have to assume at this point the defendant is in better shape, however, the prosecutor gave a very powerful opening statement. he controlled the courtroom. he's already raising questions about what zimmerman has said repeatedly about what he did. i think the prosecution is in better shape than a lot of people think, despite this very pro-defense law. >> is the problem, though, tom, that in the end the only person that might have been able to answer the key questions is dead, trayvon martin, and that we may have circumstantial evidence, the people giving evidence like the friend of his and so on, but unless somebody

can actually say for a fact how this alleged confrontation started, very hard to see how you can get to a conviction. >> well, that's true, unless he takes the stand and gets caught in lies and i suspect he will. yes, the defendant has an advantage in that he is the only one alive who can testify to what happened in this alleged struggle, however, if he tells lies, if he gets caught with biases and problems that the forensic evidence points out, he could see a conviction -- >> and even -- >> go ahead, gloria. >> even if he doesn't testify, tom, and piers, then the whole issue of whether his prior calls reporting crime -- or perceived crime in his community will come into evidence. the prosecution wants those prior calls in because they want

to try to show that he was profiling african american men, that he did mention the race of some of the people he suspected were on the hoa property prior to that particular incident, and they want to try to establish what they need to establish for second-degree murder, which is evil intent, indifferent to human life, hate, spite, all of those elements to prove second-degree murder. >> but thomas, florida is probably the best possible place in america that george zimmerman could wish to be tried because the statute law there is so heavily skewed in his favor? >> well, yes, and also remember, the burden of proof in every state of america is beyond any reasonable doubt. that's the highest burden we know in our system of justice. when you combine that with these very pro-defense statutes on self-defense the prosecution has a hard time this guy told

stories i don't think will stand up. you have the tape where basically he's being warned do not follow him, get away. my understanding is that homeowners association he represented had a policy, don't confront peel people, call the police, let them do it and he had a deadly weapon him. there are a lot of problems with the defense but they have an advantage at this point in my opinion. >> the key thing, gloria, in the end of the human reaction of this jury. we discussed this yesterday. you got all these women, mainly mothers and will see this young, light body laying on the ground of trayvon martin, the 17-year-old, the iced tea can, the skittles, the sweatshirt. this is a young teenage boy

slain by somebody with a gun who physically in court now looks huge and very powerful. how much could that until the end sway, do you think, this final decision? >> well, i think their heart must go out to the parents, especially the mother of the deceased trayvon martin. on the other hand they may feel here is a homeowner trying to protect the homers where other mothers live and fathers with their children and trying to do what he is -- what he is trying to do, which is make sure that there is no crime in the neighborhood. did he go too far? that's going to be the question. did he commit a crime? so the emotions of the mothers on the jury or the women on the jury, could also flip the other way. >> right, thank you both very much indeed. from the george zimmerman trial in florida to the supreme court's ruling on the voting rights act. here is the author of jim crow ending racism in post america.

welcome to you. let me ask you michael why is there such an angry reaction today? spell it out to me. >> it's good to be on the program on a day or week with where americans are so concerned with civil rights and equal justice in the country. as to your specific question, i think people are concerned about issues of race in the country and particularly this voting rights decision because it's a sad and tragic decision. the -- particularly when you think about the 50th anniversary of medgar who fight and die to register people to vote in mississippi. when you got nelson mandela one of the greatest fighters for voting who is fighting for his life in a hospital. this background is particularly troubling when you have this decision come down. it -- to strike down the voting rights act, which is the most democratizing piece of legislation we passed in this country where 800,000 new voters

were registered within two years after the passing in 1965 is really sad, and for the majority to basically say that while racism continues and they recognize that, that it's up to congress to prove it today, i think is really sad, piers. >> but it is sad and pretty extraordinary that you have to have the first african american president of the united states coming out blazing with furry, the supreme court decision like this. it's almost, all the steps he took forward for america with his election being thrown right back at him. >> piers, we made tremendous progress in this country and as you mentioned, we elected and reelected the first african president but progress doesn't mean race is significant in this society in terms of hardships and opportunities that individuals endure, and i think for us to look at the supreme court majority decision, the only thing i think they did right is to say that history --

history matters and clearly, history matters and changes have occurred, but they also need to understand that racism matters, and that while history is changing, racism continues to exist in our society today. >> on the subject of race, we've had the whole paula deen scandal this week, and she was -- her sons were interviewed by cnn's new day. let's take a look at what they said. >> before i had my tonsils taken out, i was 7 years old and nervous and my parents gave me hank aaron pajamas and my mom and dad told me the story of the challenges the hammer faced. they told me he's a man of charter and the challenges he overcame because of his color was unacceptable. >> what is your reaction to all this? because we are talking about it on the show yesterday, if you put every american on the wroth over the age of 65, 60, have you

ever used the n-word i would have to suspect they would say yes, i have at some stage in my past. do you think it's right she's been thrown to the wolves in the way she has? >> i think you're absolutely right, piers, me included, i would have to admit that as well as most americans would. i think what is important, though, is context and the context -- it's not the word but the context the word is used and about values. we have to be real concerned about values now. i don't know what the specifics are, and i think we need to watch prejudging and stereo typing people. we need to let the facts come out, but i do believe that we need to listen to what she says tomorrow on "the today show" in terms of context she's within using the words and see whether or not she has repenting. see whether she wants to have an apology, see what we think about

the truthfulness and the sincerity of that apology, i think is very important what context she delivers her apology in. >> just a final question and a brief answer, if you don't mind. do you believe in the context of all this going on this week, is america in your view a more or less racist country since barack obama first got elected president? >> well, as i said, i think we've mentioned -- we made tremendous progress, but i think we also see how the president has been treated when people stand up in congress and say you lie when, you know, individuals treat the president differently than they have treated other presidents, more disrespectful than they have treated other presidents. i think we need to think about whether or not that differing treatment has anything to do with race, and i think if you

really look hard, if americans really look hard at that, they will understand that race is still significant in how the president is treated even today. >> professor, thank you very much indeed for joining me. >> yes, my pleasure to join you. when we come back a daredevil thanks god, how nik wallenda made it across the tight rope and how joel osteen helped. he joins me next. >> yes, jesus. praise you. praise you, jesus.

>> lord, help this cable to calm down, command it in your name, jesus, with the authority of god praise you, praise you jesus. >> i would be praying, too, if i was doing that. that's nik wallenda asking for help. he didn't have a harness but joel osteen close by. he prayed with him before the stunt and there watching as the daredevil reached the other side. joel osteen joins me live. are you how? >> hey, doing great, piers, great to be with you. >> you're down at your lakewood church in houston which i passed by a couple weeks ago and felt spiritually moved and i thought the only person i know alive in the world who probably says

jesus more often in 20 minutes than nik wallenda is you. what did you think of this guy standing there, risking his life? >> i was like millions of other americans, nervous and very concerned. you know, it's an amazing sight. he looked like a little speck out there in the middle of the canyon but all i could do is pray like he was praying, as well, ask god to help him. >> i didn't see anything like this. i didn't know it was on. i discovered it from twitter. my producer said turn this on and i was utterly gripped when i realized he had no safety apparatus whatsoever. you as a pastor, there is a man repeating over and over again jesus pray, god, and so on, if he had fallen, what would you have said? >> you know, i didn't really think about it. i guess my thoughts were piers,

that, you know what he was doing, what he loved to do. he felt like he is fulfilling his destiny of doing that. he comes from seven generations of it. nik is a great guy. if he had fallen, i would have to cross the bridge when we got to it. it would be tragic but focused on the fact that he made it through, and you know, we're happy for him. >> let's take a little listen to nik during his extraordinary walk. >> lord, help this cable to calm down, command it in your name jesus with the authority of god praise you, praise you jesus. >> now he's a devote christian and also had, obviously, the family go back decades, centuries doing this kind of thing and many members of that family have died in the pursuit of these gorgeous achievements that they do. when you were saying the prayer with nik and his family before the walk, how did you pitch it? what did you say to him?

>> well, piers, i prayed that god would give him strength and skill and that the gifts god had given him would come out to the full, that he would have focus and not be districted, that just he would be at his best and the top of his game and the winds wouldn't be too strong. a prayer of peace and appeasing, too, piers before the walk, an hour or two before, nik -- i was more nervous than he was. he's an extremely calm, peaceful person. he just believes he's in the palm of god's hand doing what he's supposed to do. so he's an amazing man, and we just prayed for peace and strength, though. >> he's a remarkable guy. he bent down and kissed the floor and gave these perfectly rational interview and i thought mate, you just crossed the grand canyon on a little wire. it was extraordinary. there he is like he had gone to the store to my milk. >> he just amazed me, as well.

i was back there in the trailer with him and more nervous than he was. he talked about and said joel, i don't let thoughts of fear enter into my mind. you think of fear and anxiety and what about this, this causes you to fall. i program that out and like you said at the first, if we walked across that wire, we would be praying, as well. so, you know, he just -- i think another important thing his dad said, nik is not foolish. he's been doing this since he was two years old. he's incredible skilled and talented. they use the best science, the best technology and engineering so i think that's important that people don't think he's this foolish guy trying to put his life at risk. this is seven generations what he believes he's called to do, so we're thrilled it worked out. >> the power of prayer and christianity in america, pretty awesome, isn't it? >> it really is. again, that's what he said.

he said, joel, this is the way i'm supposed to use my gifts i feel is to bring glory to god, i'm in a unique position. this is nik talking. that prayer brings him strength, peace, the whole family is supportive. they are fine people and just, you know, again, i celebrate what they are doing. >> are you going to be buying a pair of his jeans, which are apparently the hottest jeans in america? >> i didn't know that but maybe i will. i guess so. >> i can't see you in jeans somehow, joel, you're always so great in your suits. >> you would laugh at the jeans i'm in now if the camera pulls it out now. >> i don't know if the camera can do that but if it can, do it. >> i don't know. >> what do you plan next with nik? he is obviously planning more death-defying stunts. will you be with him every step of the way? >> i would love to. i felt honored.

it's exciting. if i can offer any peace or prayer it's great for me but he talks about walking skyscrapers in new york, whatever he wants to do, you know, i'll be there and do the little part that i can, but i don't know, i just -- i -- they are good people. >> joel osteen, a great pleasure talking to you. >> thanks, piers, great to see you. next, searching for snowden, the nsa leaker is somewhere in the moscow airport. is snowden addicting to risky behavior? morning because my back hurt so bad. the sleep number bed conforms to you. i wake up in the morning with no back pain. i can adjust it if i need to...if my back's a little more sore. and by the time i get up in the morning, i feel great! if you have back pain, toss and turn at night or wake up tired with no energy, the sleep number bed could be your solution. the sleep number bed's secret is it's air chambers which provide ideal support and put you in control of the firmness.

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snowden is still in the transit area as a transit passenger. >> mr. snowden is a freeman. the faster he chooses his ultimate destination, the better for us and for him. >> russian president glald -- vladimir putin. what is driving him? i want to ask dr. drew pinsky. dr. drew, this thing about edward snowden i find fascinating. what is going on in his head right now? what you've seen about him, form get the politics and the law, what is going on in his head? >> the one thing i can tell you is it's not an addiction to something of a high, high risk that something of thing. addicts are the thrill seeking population. i see no evidence of anything like this in this guy. there is probably more something to do with his relationship with

authority. i think about this, you'll take it upon yourself to take on the entire nsa -- >> isn't there a touch of, you know, he has seen manning and these guys become global figures -- >> it could be -- >> maybe a loser geek who thinks i know what i'll do, i'll become a global super star leaker. >> to be fair, we're purely speculating and just talking off cuff on this guy. yeah, i think there might be something to that. people these days, how else do you make your slash? first time in history fame as a motivator showed up when you ask people what they want to do, e don't do to have a family -- >> i want to be famous. >> i want to be famous. perhaps, perhaps that's a piece of who what is going on now. >> let's move to anthony wiener who extraordinarily, a new poll in the race to new york city mayor has stormed to the lead 25%, what does this tell us

about america's power of forgiveness? do leopards change their spots? will we have one of the most powerful politicians in america hold by somebody sending photos of his weaner to other women? >> they don't change subtenially. they do not change unless there is some intensive treatment to somebody. >> does it make him ill fitting to hold an office -- >> that i'm not in position to say but change is difficult, really difficult, even when somebody goes off the rail from behaviors that caused lots of trouble, to change subten live is a difficult problem for people. >> he's a strange charter. i met him a few times, interviewed him. he took on donald trump, super confident before this happened but doesn't show confidence now. he has been through a disgrace that would bring many men crashing to his knees never to recover and he's out there

center stage saying look, there are other pictures of me that haven't come out yet, i'll take my chances. >> some people don't experience shame no matter what you do. that may be part of the syndrome. we don't know. perhaps he understands the public -- one thing we like to do is raise -- humans tend to rise people up but we like to destroy them. we like to feel -- >> i think in america -- >> we like redemption. >> i was told by a hollywood producer once every great movie is four parts, build up the charter, knock them down to the pits and redemption and glory and this is where weaner is head. >> we love that. to one extent to another it relieves us of our guilt of knocking them down. this country loves the under dogs and the person that is under the difficult circumstances, we love to see

that. >> i like anthony wiener. he's an interesting, intelligent guy. >> by the way, just because we talk about these liabilities you have, doesn't mean he couldn't be a great leader or politician. >> most greatly -- >> many, many of my favorite leaders had -- >> all of my favorite leaders were completely flawed. >> significant psychiatric problems, really, flawed. they were struggling with something. >> let's talk to one of my best flaws, which is starbucks. they are bringing in calorie counters. some of it is quite terrifying, actually. i popped down to starbucks, grab a scone as we call them in england. >> i call them scones. >> you schooled me as i would be seen as under classed. >> scone. >> the queen would say scone. >> you think it's funny. >> there is a scone. this apparently, let's get this calorie counts of these is 460

calories. >> yes. >> the muffin is 360 calories. i mean, these are a huge amount of calories which i thought was a snack on the way to work. >> people, listen, my dietitian i work with people think they are doing something healthy getting the brand muffin and 400 calories. cashes are loaded with calories. there are ways to do it -- here is the bottom line. we thought by putting the calories on these items that people would have a less of a tendency to order high -- >> does that work? >> does not work. >> i'm not sure about this. >> the data is out. >> the data may not work at the moment but when i go into whole foods down here for example, i now do battered into submission by various personal trainers, i do look at calorie counts. >> i do, too. >> you say scone, as opposed to scone, you're not every man and most of us cannot with stand the habits. like weaner and everyone else, change is difficult. everyone agrees we must continue down this path, it gives people a chance to be good with their

diet. if you are just looking the yummy stuff, you don't have a chance. >> i think we should ban niche the scone. >> from america? >> 460 calories, that's a big mac. you got a coffee there. a grande none fat misto. >> pretty good. >> 750 calories. i would go grande tea, 210 calories. what struck me is apparently a grande black cup of coffee with no milk is 5 calories. >> that's right. >> that's the trick, to go in, think about having the scone, the muffin and the tea and in fact, have a grande black cup of coffee. >> yes. >> and skip the gym. >> and -- and -- no. >> i'm working this out. the perfect recipe. >> black coffee will suppress your recipe, too. it's a good strategy. we have to say no to the yummy. >> i like the yummy, dr. drew. >> you take the yummy out of

life, what are you left with? >> your point is well taken. i agree with you but gives us a chance. we have a problem in this country. you can see it wherever you go. we're at a time when people have to ride on scooters and we need lifts because we let this roll out of control, and it's a major issue, diabetes and hypertension and gives people a fighting chance. we ought to have it in other places, too, where people can see -- >> it's another good idea, the calorie count at starbucks, a very smart guy and i'll applaud him but never eat a scone again. >> thank you. >> always. should smoking marijuana be legal? patrick kennedy had his own struggles with addiction. he'll tell me what changed his mind about cannabis.

mothers, people, parents every day take vicodin or medications to help cure their pain or for anxiety, insomnia. cannabis is a medication, i know my typical dosage, it's weighed out and i know how to space it out, just like someone would take tylenol. >> one of the beverly hills pot moms interviewed on friday. they use cannabis because it makes them better parents they claim and deals with pain and anxiety. should it be legalized?

that's what we're talking about gone to pot. america's marijuana obsession. joining me now is patrick kennedy and kevin summit the director of the drug policy institute of the university of florida and neil franklin retired police major against and dr. drew pinsky. >> pot moms. patrick, start with you. because you at one stage in your life were in support of legalizing marijuana for medical purposes. now you change your mind. why? >> well, because i found out the facts, and the facts are my initial thinking was like most americans, i didn't think it was any big deal. frankly, i thought people who had cancer or some medical need, every member of my family has

had cancer, so i wouldn't begrudge them using something to mid gate the effects of chemotherapy for example, but then i saw from looking at it further and i was asked to be on the national institutes of drug abuse board and really learned the science, piers, and when i learned the truth of the impact going down this road towards legalization, it occurred to me my original position was wrong. i hope anybody that sees the facts and see they are wrong will admit it. i will admit it. i was wrong to initially think it was something harmless about medical marijuana, because now what i've seen is there a commercial industry behind this medical marijuana and will move down the track like in colorado to be fully legalized and my fight is for mental health and addiction and trying to treat addiction but the best way to

treat addiction is prevention. what i really worry about is with this reducing the kind of harm, perception of harm of marijuana which is really out there now thanks to the movement towards legalization, that more people will use, piers, and if more people use like i did when i was a teenager, nine out of ten addicts, which i became, started when they were teenagers, and one -- >> okay, okay. >> -- that this move will increase the number of young people who will end up using this because they don't think it's any big deal because of this notion that it's medical -- >> okay -- >> i think that's a dangerous notion. >> let me bring in dr. drew

here. because, you know, when we did the show on friday. i find it fascinating the arguments, sanjay gupta seen as a respected medical guy, he's very firmly, look, there is no evidence he's seen that marijuana is any more harmful than alcohol or tobacco and on that basis, why should it be treated differently? >> that's a bizarre argument. that's what hits the road on this. if you want to look at a bad drug, the drugs that have the most serious impact on this country, a bad drug, alcohol and cigarettes are bad drugs. the fact they are legal doesn't make them any less good or any more good. they are still bad. so the question is do we want to throw another one into that -- >> unless you're prepared as a country, kevin, to out law all cannabis, all alcohol, all tobacco -- >> or legalize everything. >> or legalize everything. to me, i remember -- i touched on this on friday, but when i broke a few ribs, i remember

getting -- not addicted but i think you call definitive in four or five weeks because of the pain to both vicodin, which i took for the pain, and ambien for which i was trying to use to sleep. >> by the way, in terms of people dying in this country now, these classes of drugs -- >> those are legal. >> i was stunned by the power -- >> doesn't make them bad drugs, though. if you had cancer, they would be good. >> my point is no one can tell me from what i experienced that marijuana in controlled doses, potentially legalized and therefore the actual substance isn't anything unpleasant is any more harmful -- >> but piers, consistency isn't the highest virtue. alcohol and tobacco are horrific examples and i talk about this in the book that the legality of the drugs is no argument for marijuana to be legal. actually, it's an argument to keep marijuana illegal. we have big tobacco and liquor lobby. i worked in washington. we saw the influence. they target kids and minorities and make sure they go after the ones addicted. >> are those limbs, are those organizations going to pick up cannabis? >> there is already evidence they will. >> you've already removed everything yummy, the scones and you want to take away my cigar i have every three months, what am i left with? >> your bong.

>> alcohol has a history of wide use dating before the old testament. marijuana doesn't have that wide spread history, so i don't see why because alcohol is legal, marijuana will be. i could careless if those marijuana moms who are, you know, net worth a couple million dollars are smoking, you know, marijuana on the weekdays. this isn't about them. this is actually about kids or people vulnerable for addiction, one in six kids who try pot will become addicted. you see them every day in the treatment center. >> we see a lot of marijuana addiction and the long-term effects on the developing brain are more substantial than i thought. >> the research shows it. >> they won't legal wise it for under 18. >> sanjay gupta made the point that below 25 years of age -- >> that's right. >> before the brain is completely fully formed, it can be more harmful. >> exactly. long-term iq. >> i heard from you two killjoyers, what we'll put the case for the defense of legalizing marijuana.

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did it work and are you in favor of legalizing cannibis. >> piers, obviously it didn't work and it's not working now. we're a group of volunteers, thousands of volunteers, we've spent our career on the front lines with the war on drugs. we have decimated communities, mainly poor, black communities and it's time for a change. don't get me wrong, i feel for what they're saying. obviously it's more appropriate to educate and retreat. look what we've done with tobacco over the past couple of decades. we reduced consumption by about 40%. we're not sending anyone in prison or shooting anyone in the streets. let me talk about prisons.

our families in the black community have been devastated. 1 in 9 is the number of black children with a parent in prison compared to 1 in 57 for white children. the law enforcement community has exercised these prohibition policies, mainly in poor communities and communities of color. whether that's by design or happenstance, the fact is, it does exist and it won't change i would be curious to find out how mr. kennedy, how prison helped you beat addiction. >> well, let's ask patrick kennedy that very question. >> yeah, let me thank you, neill, for your service as a law enforcement officer and agree that the war on drugs has become a war on people. i was the author of the mental addiction act.

i salute you for your debate, and bringing this forward. but as you know, neill, the tobacco and alcohol industry target minority communities. >> yes, i agree. >> and to think that they're not going to target members of your community with the same aggressive marketing is something that ignores the fact. >> let's learn from the past. >> we need to change our policy, but it's not a lock them up or light them up approach. we need an approach based on the pub luck health -- >> let me bring in -- let me bring in kevin. i'll come back to you. kevin, at the moment it's a massive drain on america financially because they're putting all these people in

prison unnecessarily, ruining families and lives and a huge expense. weighed against the power of brand marijuana and what we know will happen if it's legalized, which is less harmful to america's national interest? >> the good news is those aren't the only options. drug courts are things that happen within the criminal justice system. they get people off that are addicted. right now doctors, physicians are not trained in addiction. and less than a third of our medical schools get two weeks of training on addiction, yet we're saying we want to call this a health issue. let's try these health interventions first before we potentially go to something that's irreversible. the best way to reduce incarceration is treatment and intervention. >> i'm slightly on the fence

about this, but i'm lending myself more to legalizing because it's better than the alternative. >> we'll find out what the implications are. >> dr. drew, patrick, kevin and neill, thank you very much. we'll keep going over this on the show, so we'll have you all back and debate it all over again, because it's something everyone in america is talking about. we'll be right back after this break. look at them kids...

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that's all for us tonight. anderson cooper with the george zimmerman trial starts right now. good evening. welcome to our special continuing coverage. self-defense or murder, the george zimmerman trial. every night this week, we'll be digging deeper with the best legal team around and frequently with the principals in the case themselves. tonight, powerful, emotional testimony about trayvon martin's final moments and a legal battle over the 911 tapes. from six months before the 911 tapes that were recorded before the shooting, recordings the state believes will speak to george zimmerman's state of mind to his unjustified suspicion, they say, of trayvon martin. first, the latest on everything that happened today from martin savidge who joins us now. so, what new evidence do we hear today in the courtroom? >> reporter: it was ph