don? hello, everyone. i'm don lemon. you are in the cnn newsroom. it is the top of the hour. i want everyone to sit down and listen to this. black, white, hispanic, asian. everyone, listen. you are going get something out of this. watching the news this week, you might think that there was no more dangerous creature on earth than a teenage boy. in oklahoma, teens accused of killing a college baseball player from australia and the suspects supposedly killed for almost incomprehensible reason. because they were bored. in georgia, another teen on trial. the prime suspect in the murder after 13-month-old baby. antonio santiago shot between the eyes allegedly because his mother wouldn't hand over her purse. in washington state , a world wr ii veteran. a member of the greatest generation, wounded at okinawa, while serving his country. he survived a war, only to be

allegedly beaten to death. the suspects in this case, two teens. caught on tape. one now under arrest. police still hunting for the other. finally, a case that seems symbolic of the troubling time. a school backs crime scene when a young man decides he doesn't care if he lives or dies. picks up an assault rifle and heads to the nearest school with nearly 500 rounds of ammunition. a school bookkeeper talks him into surrendering. so what is the matter with kids today? some kids today. what's the matter? it is time for no talking points. tonight every generation asks this question. what's the matter with kids these days? in the 1950s it was the biggest roor source, children's, being corrupted. now every bit as worried about these things but the crisis has

life and death consequences. every day brings another grim headline. teens on the edge of adulthood and time when they should be deciding what they want to be, what kind of adult they want to become. instead making choices that guarantee they will breaux up old, in a prison cell. their decisions don't lead to an early grave. what is the problem? could it be music? songs and rap that glorify getting rich but not getting down to work. does that persuade teens not to look for a job but rather to reach for a gun? a hip hop pioneer says you can't stop artists who want to speak the truth. >> the way young people want to express themselves, bucking the system, something that i support. and some of the things they say that may make the adults uncomfortable, most cases, i support it. >> you are beg to hear more from russell simmons later on here on cnn. music doesn't explain the violence. do failing schools? no jobs?

no hope? if that's the problem how do you fix it? throw money at the problem? slap a coat of paint on the schools? open up a fast mood restaurant so a teen can earn minimum wage flipping burgers? how do you inspire teens who see such a bleak future ahead of them? >> it is my desire to see another generation of young people with passion. i believe in passion. i. >> i agree with civil rights icon john lewis. i want them to be passionate, not violent. but how? is the problem broken homes with parents that not only understand -- don't understand but sometimes don't even seem to care? that's if they are even around to begin with. how do you even begin to fix that? can you make it illegal for a father to leave his family? can you force mom to stay clean and sober when he i she doesn't want to? how do you fix that? today on the national mall civil rights activists spoke about the dire problems our society paces. senate candidate cory booker described the plague of

violence. >> you immediate to understand will is still work to do. when the leading cause of death for black men may age and younger is gun violence, we still have work to do. >> he's right. we still have work to do. but you don't want -- you don't want to hear muff on the mall today. i didn't hear enough on the mall today. excuse me, that's what i meant. what you didn't hear enough about was solutions. how do you fix a problem? not just a problem. a crisis, epidemic, ugly truth. elephant in the room. too many of those case i talked about, perpetrators are black. if we are going to be honest, this is an epidemic of kids, most of them black kids, committing crimes. the ones you see in the headlines, daily drumbeat of violence. relentless killing in the hood. that -- usually doesn't make the headlines except after a particularly gory weekend in chicago maybe or maybe in philadelphia. or in new orleans. we will ask mayors from two of

those cities what they think about that tonight and we will look for an answer. because when we ask what's wrong with kids these days, don't get this twisted. although we do want them to take responsibility for their own actions, we are not blaming them. what we are askinging is -- how might we, the people who know better, be failing them and how can we help them? young people, can you help us help you? that's tonight, "no talking points. i want to bring in two panelists that know a lot about the situation. psychology wendy walsh is in los angeles and columnist el si e granderson is here in new york and he is serious about this. am i being too hard on them m. >> what do you mean by them? are you speaking about us? are you speaking about the person raters? i mean, you have to define the "them" first? >> am i being too hard on the parents, first of all? >> as a parent, no. the reason why i say this is because you oftentimes see

parents very -- taking credit when the kids do good. you know. smiling, being there, for the graduati graduation. being there in case the kid win as sporting award or scholarship. parents are quick to be present for that. what we aren't seeing are parents being quick for the kids who aren't messily doing things that society approves of. when are you going to show up for those moments as well? >> quickly, am i being too hard on the youth? >> no. i don't think so. >> all right. wendy walsh, what do you think? >> i think in some ways you are because these kids don't -- they have a fighting chance from the beginning. you know, don, that my brand is all about relationships. while you may think i want people to have lovely romances i only care about nests for children and healthy nests for children. and when, you know, 14 million single moms are raising one in four american children and have to work full time, we are talking about a lack of a caring adult from the beginning. you know. from their most waking hours.

if you work a ten-hour day and have a commute time, you are gone during a child's most vulnerable time and can you not schedule teaching moments. >> i am just -- wendy -- wendy, that's why i don't have a kid. >> right. i understand because you know too much. >> right. i'm so -- so then if you are not going to take the responsibility for a kid you know that you have to do that, here's what -- am i wrong? isn't that what it is -- goes along with having kids? >> there are other countries like iceland and sweden who have lower marriage rates than we do. but they have much better cultural supports. they have child care, really good education. good child care. i did research on teen violence today on the internet and i will tell you, some of the -- very complicated question. some of the factors are -- besides caring adult in the home, how safe does a child feel at school? how attach reasonable doubt they to their teachers? is there gang activity? how much can they access a gun? there are lots of factors.

it is a very complicated question. >> we are just beginning. quickly -- >> i agree. there are lots of factors. i keep hearing her eliminate kids being part of the factor. they have to at some point also be -- >> they are children! >> once you are 15, 16 years old, you can still make rational decisions. you may not necessarily have the best back ground but as -- >> okay. wendy, l.z., stick around. we are just beginning. we will broaden this conversation and need your unique perspectives here. great stuff coming up. a conversation a lot of you have been waiting for. i shared thoughts on how to fix problems among black youth. many of the people found that advice controversial, including hip hop mowing up richard simmons who responded to suggestions of his own after much pleading of the folks of social media, the two of us sat down to discuss race, music, hip hop's influence on the black community and many more things. here is a preview. >> we also want them to be truthful to their art and say what is on their hearts.

what's on their hearts sometimes is difficult to digest and we have to look at that and see if that's a road map and something we can fix. >> is there a way of doing that without calling someone a bit bitchwhore? >> some of the things they say are difficult to digest -- >> and ignore want i still can't tell a poet. can i not tell a poet, no, they are not my leyriclyrics. >> next i will be joined bhars of would big u.s. sou-- two of biggest mayors. other young men, murder. we will ask our mayors what they are doing to try and stop that. ñe

the violence we have been

talking to by evens is not confined to cities but can feel like the epicenter of this plague and city lead verse to tackle the problem with shrinking budgets. how do they do that? our next guests are trying to find new solutions. we are talking about solutions now. their cities need them as arguably they are -- two of the most dangerous cities in the country. but it is getting better in both cities. let's hope. mitch landrieu is the mayor of new orleans. thank you so much for joining me this evening. are you doing okay? >> thank you. >> doing great. thanks for having us thanks for the opportunity. >> according to the national league, the city's homicide is the leading cause of death for males between the ages of 15 and 24. and then we know the statistics we heard so much about young black males. so, mayor nutter, recently had you to close 23 public schools. and lay off 3800 workers. your city had to borrow $50 million to open the schools.

but the state is pouring $400 million into a new prison. why can't that funding go into the school systems and other programs to get youth off the streets? >> there is month question we need more funding for education and use dollars we have in the best interest of children. what pennsylvania needs is a new funding formula that takes into account student population, whether english is your first language or not, issues of poverty and the like. much like 47 other states in the united states of america. i'm going to to be focused on that particular issue. right now what i needed to do is to make sure schools on on time and safely. not withstand something of the personnel reductions. the focus has to be on education, young people, what goes on in school, after school, on the weekends, during the summer, and so we beefed up many of our after-school programs as well as summer programming to make sure our kids are safe and they are learning and they are working with caring, nurturing

adults. >> okay. mayor landrieu, i want to get this school question out of the way as well. i want to talk about -- specifically about other things. i want to ask the same question. as new orleans is building a new prison, is this our new reality? giving up on schools to make room for teens who will inevitably end up behind bars? >> you know, it is one of the things that we face in this nation. we are bogey to have cadillac prisons and not have schools that work. we have to get priorities right. you are never getting to the issue and mayor nutter and i want to talk about tonight. which is there is a culture of violence that's develop order the streets of america. that is a catastrophic event. almost epidemic. what you see is the lives of young african-americans taken and epidemic levels and they are being killed in many instances by people that know them. that's not a problem that this nation has really wanted to talk about. mayor nut her the courage to do had a as just the immediate past president of the conference of mayors and need to focus on it

and can't get distracted. this is one the country has to look at and deal with and try to solve. >> i spoke with you -- >> don, i want to make sure we are clear on -- i want to make sure we are very clear on one particular fact. as you laid into -- at the beginning. the prison that's being built is not in pill del. it is not being paid for by philadelphia. this is a state facility and another county outside of the city of philadelphia. i understand your main point. >> we were making the point of should we be looking at putting money in other places than prisons? i hope that didn't come off the wrong way. i'm glad you clarified. >> looking to putting monday gli schools. >> right. that's exact will what i meant. you and i speak occasionally and i used to live in philadelphia. >> i know. >> first of all, as you listen to my no talking points, i'm sorry, i'm passionate about this, i know people say oh, we immediate to talk about raceism

and all of those things. yeah, that's important. am i being tee hard? don't you think we immediate to stop the bleeding first before we move on and talk about other things? >> well, let me just -- >> absolutely. >> this is -- this is really -- >> go ahead. >> this is really clear if in fact any american was walking down the street and they saw two young men fall in a hole, those men were in danger and not one person that would walk by them without saying we have to rescue them. there's something going on here. we have to stop. so there are lots of other issues we king deal with but the most important thing we have to do right now is to stop the shooting. everybody wants to talk about who did what and why. we can talk about whose fault it was. at the end of day not everybody is to blame. everybody is responsible for fixing the problem. it is my opinion, i think mayor nutter shares this, this is such a catastrophic event that we now have to just stop for a second and stop the shooting and stop the violence and then we will work on the other things later. >> do we -- >> i want to encourage you not

to apologize. be straightforward. passion is important. you know, we immediate to make sure we are dealing with the issues straight on. folks beating up other people, stabbing other people, shooting other people, whatever that issue was, we can't excuse it. i know that everyone doesn't have the greatest upbringing. but -- some level of personal responsibility comes in here and as the mayor -- mayor landrieu said we all have an objectly xwags and responsibility. all this finger pointing does -- often making excuses doesn't lead to good outcome and good result. unfortunately we find the young people -- dead is dead. that's all this debate and discussion afterwards. we need to be on the front end and making sure that kids are getting service and support they need. some have mental health challenges and some are strugglinging in schools. there are warning signs we immediate to identify and be prepared for. you know, if you are in seventh grade reading a seventh grade reading level that's a serious problem. that's a student who probably is going to drop out of high school

and often then it is too late. >> i think that's the quote of the evening. sitting here with l.z. granderson. when you said dead is dead, she right on. that's -- >> at the end of the day, does it matter, you know if it was by a white hand or black hand? if you were gay or straight, male or female, if you are a victim of violence and you are dead -- >> that's it. thank you, mayor. don't go anywhere. i want to -- you to stay around. thank you so much. next, we are going to bring in columnist l.z. granderson and psychologist wendy walsh again. i want to get their reactions to what you both are saying. does your dog food have? 18 percent? 20? new purina one true instinct has 30. active dogs crave nutrient-dense food. so we made purina one true instinct. learn more at purinaone.com people wait for this promotion all year long. and now there are endless ways to love it... from crispy to spicy to savory.

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problem can feel too big for any of us to solve. teen violence but how can we turn away knowing that this crisis isn't just their fault? but it is all of our fault as well. they have to take responsibility. it is still all of our fault top talk about this i want to bring mayor landrieu of new orleans and mayor nutter of philadelphia. psychologist wendy walsh and columnist l.z. granderson here with me in new york. wendy, you didn't get a chance to weigh in on this. what did you think the mayors saying about this? they said to basically don't apologize. we should be stronger in our message to young people. >> we should be stronger and also ask those wonderful voters who put hose gentlemen in office to approve legislation that puts more funds to help young families and help with education and instead of just incarcerating people and spending money. way too much money too late. if you invest a little bit in the early years, it is important.

i want to add to those big city mayors did you know that rural teen violent crime has now reached the same rate as urban cities. it is happening everywhere. >> mayors, go ahead and respond. go ahead, mayor nutter. >> we are certainly aware had a violence is rising in rural areas. and what doesn't get discussed is also the issue of suicide. in both urban and rural areas. i mean, the focus here is -- on where we are utilizing resources we have. i cannot sit around hoping for that wonderful day when money is going to fall out of the sky or come rolling down the hills from upper pennsylvania. i have what i have. i continue to fight and advocate governor corbett about school funding and it is an underfunding problem across the commonwealth of pennsylvania. in the meantime, when mayor landrieu and i do is we deal day to day with what's going on our streets while we are fighting other battles some where else.

and often, it is -- really about having a conversation with some mom that, hey, i'm sorry that your son has died but i'm in the going to say, but joe joe had a bad life and therefore that's explanation why your son is dead. this is serious business and requires serious action and responsibility and -- raising our children while making sure parents are parenting and not trying to be friends with their kids, going out with their kids, they have a curfew, you go to school, you don't mess with other people, and these are serious messages that are proven to be helpful as well as funding. >> okay. i understand what you are talking about. when you say the percentage is going to -- just by sheer numbers, will are more people in cities than there are in rural areas. and so when you look at the sheer number of people being killed, and this is just -- racking -- i read this. tracking homicides in chicago, this is from a report from 2012. i'm going the read it off here. 26-year-old unknown male shot

dead, caused bay gunshot, 36-year-old black male. dead, caused by gunshot. august 20. that's august 18. august 18, 28-year-old black male shot dead by gunshot. august 18, 24-year-old black male shot dead. these are just random. august 17, 19-year-old black male. august 17, 18-year-old black male. on and on. august 17, 49-year-old black male. august 16, 34-year-old black male. 23-year-old black male. 57-year-old black male. it is heartbreaking. why do we sit here and say okay, it is the white man's fault. yes. there's institutional and structural racism. but someone does not put a gun to your head, so to speak, and make you go out and kill someone, mayor nutter. >> that's -- well -- >> it is right. real deal is -- go ahead, mayor landrieu. >> month. just going to say, mike and i agree on this completely. there are a lot of reasons for this. not any one of them is necessarily paramount but there are a lot of people unemployed

not picking up a gun and shooting somebody. there are millions of americans that own guns that are not picking up a gun and shooting somebody. there are millions of people that came from single parent families that are not doing it. it can't just be that. what mayor nutter and i are trying to call the nation into commune on is we had a catastrophic health problem where a culture of violence is developed and ought to attack this problem just like we were fighting a war in afghanistan and on iraq and colombia. we have not done had a. it is not just about money. money is involved in it. it is not just about organization. we all have to, number one, say it is an unacceptable level of behavior in america. too many people are getting killed and it has to catastrophic level it is we have to think about and we all have to deal with. >> l.z. granderson -- >> serious health issue in the united states of america. >> i was going to say, i -- >> saying violence is a serious health issue in the country. >> right. will is a bit of a delay. >> go ahead. >> you know, i go to -- as i was

moving to chicago, i wrote a piece why aren't we addressing gang violence the same way we do with terrorism. there is a certain level of passion we as americans have about the word terrorism. we don't allow terrorism to be taken lightly. we didn't aloit to be celebrated in popular culture. when someone is murdered because of terrorism the entire nation feels it. it is not just relegated to the parents. what i hope to see is a course of dialog we start looking at gang violence nation wide and the way we look at terrorism. so when someone in oklahoma reads a story about a series of people being shot and killed because of gang violence in chicago, their heart goes out to those people. it is not just dismissed as blacks are killing blacks or related to gangs. look at it the way you look at a terrorist attack in which oh, my god, this is a threat to national security because -- in -- end of the day, it is a threat to national security. this is our work force. this is our brain power. these are our inventors and entrepreneurs who are dying. these aren't just random

lifeless individuals. these are people that could be part of a major part of our future and so we lose this intellectual capacity, intellectual accounts of people that are going out by death, threat to our national security if my opinion. >> mayors, i want to ask you this. do you think that too many people make too many excuses for young people and for their parents and their family that -- many ways and maybe the media is as well, do we coddle people way too much? first, mayor landrieu and then mayor nutter. >> i completely agree with what your panelist said. we spent $14 billion during the wars in iraq, afghanistan, and the war on drugs. standing up police departments in those countries with what weigh call nation building. the other thing, too, is i don't think the nation has really adopted the opinion that was just stated. this is a catastrophic problem that affects the whole country.

this is not just a black issue. it is not a racial issue ask not just an a much can't american issue. absolutely it deals with personal responsibility and it is an issue that we are afraid to talk about. yes, i think we let everybody off the hook. i think that what mayor nutter and i are calling people to, we have to stop and look at this because it is really having an impact on the future of america. >> mayor nutter? >> don, what many of us are working on and mayor landrieu and i -- lead thing effort called sites united. this is now 20, 30-plus mayors across the united states of america focused on the issue of violence with young men and boys and certain given the numbers, particularly focus, on african-americans but certainly all violence is bad and in our cities. it is about best practices and about resources and about working with family programs and so many others. i will try to understand better some of the reasons that people do the things they do. i won't accept them.

i'm not going to baby folks. if you can pick up a gun and shoot somebody in the head and then order a pizza, then clearly will is something wrong with you. that's serious business. mom write is not coming to get you or to read you a story right now. you are going to jail. unfortunately your life will be altered. you also changed someone else's life for ever. so -- i want us to work october and use our resources and panelist earlier, mayor had an drew and i and many others have been talking about the fact that folks in our communities are acting like domestic terrorists. and i believe in the war on terror overseas but i would like to be able to walk down the street and be safe as well. the security we put together, tsa, homeland security, fly on an airplane, i would like to be able to walk around. that level of safety as well. this is about priorities and about resources and it is about folks being focused on what is really going on in o the streets in america. if these numbers were reversed,

that 40% to 08% of homicide victims in the top 25 cities in the united states of america are black men, if those numbers were reversed, let me assure you that the entire united states of america would be trying to figure out how to change that dynamic and those facts. >> wendy, it is going to have to come from within. help us out here. >> amen. >> i want to actually disagree with something you said earlier. you said these crimes may not be racially motivated in the sense that white people didn't cause their problems. but this is a problem of families and work life balance and lack of males in the household. and i will say that the breakdown of the african-american family was caused by white people. it was from pulling babies out of women's arms to sell them and hundreds of years ago to only giving social welfare programs to black women in the '50s if they didn't have a man in the home. in other words, institutionalizing the idea of single mothers. so i will say that this is a breakdown of the family. we immediate to find a way on

get more men of all races back into their families. helping with these teenagers. >> before i respond, go ahead. >> i want to make sure that you don't insult the overwhelming number of single mothers, some of whom are single black mothers, who are doing the right thing. >> doing great. >> raising their children. not getting in trouble. and let's make sure we don't insult the great work that they are doing and -- unfortunately, more than likely, somewhere tonight in philly, and neengz and chicago or somewhere else, some young man is going to take another young man's life and i don't think they are going to be thinking about racism from 100 years ago or baby snatched out of somebody's home. >> i'm not blaming the mothers. they can use our support. >> they are making bad mistakes. that's all i'm saying. >> right. but even though it is -- >> we pay for it every day. >> yeah. >> even though those great mothers can use support. i'm a single mother myself. >> listen, before the stroke of

midnight tonight, 40 more people will have been killed on the streets of america. every day. it is a relentless drumbeat of death. we need to look at it and deal with it. this is the united states of america. we sent somebody to the moon. we can solve this problem if we acknowledge that it is a problem and if we say that we are not bogey to accept it anymore. we deal with it and can fix it. it has to be something that's important to the rest the nation and i believes the. >> wendy -- 2019 respond saying i preface it with you saying we understand the structural and institutional racism. we get that. in the moment you are committing a crime month one is standing over your shoulder saying you have to do this. that's all i'm saying. >> in the 15 years -- >> i was raised by a single mother. i get. >> it in the 15 years before that child picks up that gun, where is the after-school paid for by the single moms? where is the good early childhood education and the help and support in our culture? i'm a single mom and i could use it. >> i would definitely agree with you. i mean, when -- when the country is going through the greatest --

recession, 33 states spending more building prisons instead of education. i agree with you that. i was a single dad. i have a partner now but i raised my son as a single dad. i want to speak for all single parents. we are not demonizing. we are saying those parents negligent need to be held responsible and the kids that commit the acts cannot be removed from having person am responsibility. >> thank you. thank you. we are running out of time. my producers are saying we have to move on. there is not enough time in the hour for this. we will talk much more about in and continue the conversation. mayors, thank you. wendy, thank you. l.z., thank you. coming up, for weeks there has been a battle on twitter and blog between myself and russell simmons. the battle has been over race and my controversial advice to some of the black community. invited russell on the show and he said yes. our conversation and emotional one coming up next. bookstore exciting and would always come to my rescue.

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a conversation that many of you have been asking for a few weeks ago on a segment in this show i said five things the black community could use to fix some of our own problems. dress appropriately, stop using the "n" word, respect where you live, finish school, plan for child or stop having them out of wedlock. they were intended to promote self-empowerment, not a cure for racism. many people found them controversi controversial.

among those people, russell simmons. in an open letter with his criticism of my points and suggestions of his own. the next week, i wrote him back and sent an invitation to join me on this show. he accepted. this week we sat down to talk about race, hip hop, empowering our youth to be better. here is our conversation. >> so we are here. thank you for coming. >> happy to be here. i have my opinion about something and you have your opinion. we can disagree without being disagreeable and disagree and it is fine. it doesn't mean i don't like you or you don't like me. we just disagree. >> i am a person that loves diversity. sometimes if a black person that's revered in the community that says something that's -- conservative and i think is part of a mindset that is hurtful to the community, people will say the problem with the black

community -- kids have their ass crack showing. problem with the black community is they need education opportunities and need job opportunities. these realities are the ones we immediate to bring up and we are talking about uplifting our children. >> that's true. >> that's first. >> when you want to improve something, where does the first place -- where is the first place you look? >> here. i look inside. when i want to improve -- here is what i learned. i say this, this -- >> okay. >> let me -- >> no. this is too good. why didn't you -- why didn't you write a letter that said -- i understand what don lemon was saying. we need to take person am responsibility. >> i should have said that first. then said -- >> then say here are the points where i disagree with you? >> you have to say things in a way they go and instead of bounce off. personal responsibility, i wouldn't include the cultural expression so much. here is what i learned. i'm a vegan.

i meditate wise a day. i have these kind of -- i was -- years ai took every single drug. i learned morning meditation is greater than late might drinking. the only way to move people towards -- give them another chance, give them the education, give them the opportunity, give them things that -- are cleaner, more inspired, that's -- that's every day my job, even if a rapper comes mind and says things that you object to or that we both -- uncomfortable but something you don't like, my job is to give them a little more clean, little bit more of an inspired idea. >> do you think that we are in a crisis? >> we are in a crisis. first thing -- >> what do we do then? >> a few things. >> what do we do? the answer to that question and a lot more just ahead. plus, you know my panelist is dying to weigh in. stick around. too big.

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russell simmons admits will is a crisis among young people especially african-american youth. how do we fix it? what do we do? here is our conversation. >> do you think that we are in a crisis? >> we are in a crisis. first thing -- >> what do we do then? >> a few things. the greatest course of the destruction of the fabric of black community have been the prison industrial complex. the greatest. when i was a kid, my friends went to jail for using drugs. 40 years now. they have been locking diseased people up, dumping them back in the community without hope or chance for employment.

so people become part of this cycle of the prison system. and those people have brought cash if you say to the prison culture, because -- all of these innocent but diseased people have been educated and violent criminal behavior and sent back into the community. many other things, you know, the lack of education opportunity, the lack of -- equal high quality edges indication. this is a -- for me, this is the kind of subject that we have to bring up and talk about. if we go school, no books and -- teachers aren't teaching, and the students are in -- kind of situation -- they don't -- ever have a gym class. they don't have an art class. without art there is no way -- you have to -- exercise the creative muscles. that's why we raise millions of dollar force the arts. those are the kinds of things that we can do to change the condition that creates poery and makes you uncomfortable. >> i didn't say it makes me

uncomfortable. some people in america are uncomfortable about the reality expressed in the mouths of rappers. >> don't mistake my passion for not -- that i don't like hip hop. i think it is an art. i think people like jay-z and c kanye west are great artists. kids are dying every single minute and it is because, as you said, we had the responsibility or there are people being educated in prison culture. i think that helps perpetuate that education in prison culture. and -- i don't understand why you can't see that. >> i do see that the expression of our reality, you know, reaffirms it to some degree. it is certainly important that artists tell our truth. >> do you think that hip hop can be better? rap and hip hop can be better? >> i think each individual artist has a responsibility to say what's on their hearts. and some of it is not pretty. so i think that there are reflections of our reality and some cases sad reality.

>> that's great but -- understand the influence they are having on the young people or the people who are listening to their songs? >> many -- most artists understand. and i don't believe that there is anything we can do to stop a poe fret expressing the truth. only thing we can do is change that truth that -- if it is uncome frtable to us. >> do you think dash the question, do you think rap and hip hop can be better? >> absolutely. >> okay. how so? >> each individual can be better but as an overall culture it has to express our sad reality. the way -- young people want to express themselves by bucking the system, something that i -- support. and some of the things they say that may make the adult us uncomfortable, most cases, i support it. i'm not of course there are lines. we hope their expression can be one that uplifts people but we also want them to be truthful to their art and say what is on

their hearts and sometimes it is difficult to digest and we have to look and see if it is a road map to something we can fix. >> is there a way of doing that without calling someone a bitch or a whore? >> i think some of the lyrics are very harsh and some of the things they say are very sexist and difficult to digest. >> and ignorant. >> and ignorant. i still can't tell a poet, you know, i cannot tell a poet, no they're not my lyrics and my songs but i can't tell a poet what to say, and i will not. listen. as i said, i listen to hip hop. there are certain things i like. don't think that i think all hip hop is bad or i'm against hip hop. i just want people especially -- >> you want people to be better. >> i want young black men especially the people being killed to be better, the industry to be better. that's it. people want me better as a journalist. same thing for those guys. what do we do from here? we should start a discussion and have a process. each individual has to go out and give what they can. >> right. >> what you've been doing is

giving what you can and your intentions are good and i respect you for it. >> thank you. >> i'm holding you to that, russell. we'll talk more about this tomorrow on the show. you'll mare of our conversation including what russell simmons has to say about that controversial video, quote, harriet tubman sex tape sunday, 6:00 p.m. eastern right here on cnn. you can also see it, this interview, soon at cnn.com. our friends are working hard to get that on our website for you. and next, i want to bring back my panel, columnist granderson. he has a lot to say. he's been shaking his head. and psychologist wendy walsh, their reaction to the conversation you just saw, next. to possible collision threats. and in certain situations it can apply the brakes. introducing the all-new 2014 chevrolet impala with available crash imminent braking.

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>> okay. idiosyncraeologically he is makt of sense. artists speak their voice but plenty of the hip hop artists are speaking provocative sex designed to objectify women and not create the human urge to bond we all have. these tough young men in the hip hop videos want love like anybody else and they deserve love. we're not really hearing their truth just hearing provocative stuff designed to sell music really. that bothers me. >> l.z., these guys who make millions of dollars a year, their kids are going to private school. they aren't letting them sag their pants. they're not telling them to have kids out of wedlock. >> the thing that kind of cracked me up watching the interview and i love russell simmons. i grew up with hip hop and the whole nine, i credit hip hop with getting me out of the hood and into college but i grew up on public enemy tribe and people like that. the notion that they're telling the truth at 35, 40 years old

with tens of millions of dollars in the bank and you're talking about the hustle and the struggle it's like i want you to tell the truth of where you are right now. everyone who is a really popular artist right now is speaking wherever they are right now. they're speaking for where they think is going to sell records. that is the disingenuous part of that interview. i know russell simmons knows this. all his boys are not still serving in the hood. some of them live nice and comfortable. they need to talk about that as well so the airways aren't flooded with this one picture of despair. >> when people say not that i'm living in the struggle, i take the a train every day or the d train to harlem. i walk the streets of harlem and the bronx every day. i live in the neighborhood. i see what's going on. i'm not taking limos around so i don't have millions of dollars. i'm just speaking for what i see as a young person who would like, i think my parents and especially women would like to see especially our young men do better. >> absolutely. i have a 16-year-old son, you

know, and my goal is for him to be way better than me. >> i have to go, guys. thank you. great conversation. anthony bourdain, parts unknown congo next. but not energy or even my mood. that's when i talked with my doctor. he gave me some blood tests... showed it was low t. that's it. it was a number. [ male announcer ] today, men with low t have androgel 1.62% testosterone gel. the #1 prescribed topical testosterone replacement therapy increases testosterone when used daily. women and children should avoid contact with application sites. discontinue androgel and call your doctor if you see unexpected signs of early puberty in a child, or signs in a woman, which may include changes in body hair or a large increase in acne, possibly due to accidental exposure. men with breast cancer or who have or might have prostate cancer, and women who are or may become pregnant or are breast-feeding, should not use androgel. serious side effects include worsening of an enlarged prostate, possible increased risk of prostate cancer, lower sperm count, swelling of ankles, feet, or body,

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