like the survivors and families here today to carry on no matter how dark the night or how difficult the day. >> you may be gone but you are truly not forgotten. >> not forgotten, nor will they ever be. we'll be back for another edition of ac 360 later. pie "piers morgan live" is next. this is piers morgan live. welcome to the viewers in the jie united states and around the world. vladimir putin extraordinary plea for caution in a piece that will appear online tonight and on the paper tonight. he says a u.s. strike on syria could spread the conflict throughout the region and sites history saying relations between us have passed through different stages, we stood against each other through the cold war but

allies once and defeated the nazis together. the united nations was in establishment to prevent such devastation from happening again. we'll have much more on that from vladimir putin later and john kerry meets his counter part from moscow a few hours from now in geneva. will it solve president obama's syria problem? >> we won't play games here. >> who the russians proposed may be the best thing to come out of russia since vodka. >> this is receives from the president's serious speech last night, definitely not a hit. >> he just cannot follow through. he cannot speak to the nation as a commander in chief. >> i'll talk to many who couldn't disagree more. rick santorum and bill richardson and dean on the left and tom on the right, why the president needs to heeds the

lessons of iraq and my prime team interview with dianna nyad. we begin with the big story tonight, syria, the talks in geneva and how the white house handled the crisis. joining me is chief congressional correspondent, dana bash. this is a bit of a mess for president obama. now you have vladimir putin taking over "the new york times" pages to give the latest mission statement to the american people. >> it is really remarkable. just when you think the story can't change any more and get any more, frankly, sometimes weird, it has the. the idea that vladimir putin wrote in the new york times is fascinating because he knows how to get to the american people, but the idea of petting something like that really, and the substance of what he's saying really does hit home to the american people how difficult it is going to be for

john kerry to go on this trip where he's heading right now to meet with his russian counter part to find common ground because at it's core, what his message is in the new york times is the whole idea of military force is bad, is wrong. i mean, he's made very clear he's opposed and doing that again in this paper, and that's the opposite of what we're hearing from the president, both in private and public he says you need to keep military action on the table as the teeth to getting any diplomatic solution there. >> he says in this piece there is growing trust between him and president obama, but at the same time he also attacks him for using this phrase that america was exceptional because of the policies it follows and says almost bordering on arrogance is the way putin seems to read this, says it isn't exceptional and shouldn't be exceptional like that. it's a very strange piece when you read it from start to finish, but you can't help thinking what it shows the

american people is that the man calling the shots here is not their president, but it's the russian leader. >> that's exactly right. it really does remind you that this off ramp or lifeline that everybody went for immediately from administration to members of congress who are being asked to vote on something most of them didn't want to vote for, which is authorization is in the hands of this man who nobody trusts. you saw the senate majority leader on the senate floor today reminding everyone he was headed to kgp. on that issue of congress, this whole issue with regard to the president has scrambled party lines more than anything i can remember in recent history. and the president is getting blow back big time, even from those republicans who have been supportive of him like bob corker who helped write the resolution for a military autozigs. i talked to him today and he not only questioned what the

president said last night but questioned him personally and his abilities as commander in chief. listen to what he told me. >> i really do think they hurt our credibility around the world, just in the muddled way that they have dealt with this syrian issue. it's just a complete muddlement, if you will, and i don't know the president just seems to be very uncomfortable being commander in chief of this nation. >> what makes you say that? >> it's just the results. we have these conversations. it appears that it has an impact. i would think that most republicans who are at the lunch yesterday would have beleaved last night he was going to make the greater case, the strategic case for us in syria. i heard no word, not one word of it. these very good in app inner

personal setting. he just cannot follow through. he cannot speak to the nation as a commander in chief. he cannot speak to the world as a commander in chief. he just cannot do it. i don't know what it is. >> a remarkable attack there on the president. dana bash, thank you very much indeed. i'll bring in two men that disagree on syria. rick santorum the author of "american patriots" bill richardson former energy secretary and former new mexico governor. welcome to you both. extraordinary development front with this piece by vladimir putin in the new york times. i'll read you, if i can, first of all, bill richardson what he says about american exceptional list m. i would rather agree on a piece he made, stating the united states policy is what makes america different. it's what makes us exceptional. putin says it's extremely dangerous to encourage people to see themselves as exceptional whatever the motivation there are big countries, small countries, rich and poor, those

with long democratic situations. their policies differ, too. we're all different and when we ask for lord's blessings, we must not forget god created us equal. tough piece here. what do you make of it? >> well, putin is playing games. he's playing to the congress, to the american people in a way he's in the driver's seat but, you know, it also a product this president obama and president putin have bad chemistry and i think putin is playing a dangerous game. here is a guy that lately has gone after gay people. he's muffled the press. he's jailed the opposition. his old kgb self-is coming forth but the united states and russia need to work together to rid ourselves of these chemical weapons and i believe we are in

a way in a driver's seat by keeping the military strike option on the table, and we should go further. we should insist on dismantling these weapons, time certain. we should also move forward in other areas, one potential seize fire, mind ways to discuss a political settlement that involves -- that involves assad leaving, a weapons embargo. i know i'm getting greedy here but i think the security counsel debate -- >> okay. >> allows us to bring the issues up. >> let me bring in -- let me bring in rick santorum you heard what bob corker said earlier, a stinging attack on the president personally for the leadership he's shown over there. did you agree with it? >> the president's leadership failed in this regard and we're not in a position of strength. to suggest the speech last night was anything but another, you

know, obvious delaying tactic to something he doesn't want to do and is trying to find a reason not to do it has created putin the peacemaker out of -- here in the new york times today. this is -- this is what happens when we have weak leadership out of the united states and try to lead from behind, we allow others to take the stage and lecture us about what american exceptional list m is and who in fact should be leading the world. the bottom line is america is exceptional and we're created equal by god but not every country is equal because not every country is good and just and moral and has the laws we have in the constitution we have and the track record of enforcing those human rights we have. certainly, russia is no model for any of those things and is not equal to the united states -- >> it may not be. it may not be. where putin has got the upper hand here i think is in terms of the clarity of his own message. he says very clearly that no one

doubts poison gas was used in syria. there is every reason to believe it was not used by the syrian army but opposition forces to provoke intervention by the powerful foreign patrons and would be siding with the fundmental lists. reports that militants are repairing for another attack, this time against israel cannot be ignored. putin is saying no, it definitely wasn't assad, it might have been the rebels. is there evidence to the satisfaction of impartial observers saying it was definitely assad that ordered this chemical attack? >> yes, i believe there is incontrovertible evidence, our intelligence which i trust. assad and these people used these weapons. assad recently admitted he add chemical weapons when in the past in the last few days he said they didn't exist.

there is a credibility gap. and -- but at the same time i think this is the time to rally around as a country, forget the politics, forget what happened. i think the president, in my judgment, i disagree with senator santorum, has shown leadership and prepared to use military force. a surgical strike at a time when the american people are war weary. he says it's not national security interest. i believe him. it's for human rights, establishing international norms, war crimes are reason to take such action -- >> let me jump in governor because i watched the speech last night, and i couldn't really work out what president obama really wants to do, and that seems to me to be his problem. he says on one hand assad is a terribly evil man like the nazis and so on and on the other hand, the talk of regime change and

getting rid of him is gone and now the peace plan to the russians who want to keep assad in power. if i'm an american citizen, i would think what does he want to do? does he want to get rid of the guy? keep him there? attack him? does he want peace? does he wantous sign up to? >> and the problem there -- >> well -- >> he doesn't know. he doesn't know what he wants. to make the case as he did last night that the humanitarian demand for this, the fact that this could to lift rate other attacks and must be responded to and say yet, i'm going to wait and see if the russians can negotiate removing the chemical weapons from syria, which everyone knows will take years to remove and destroy and he's willing not to do military action if he gets deal he said he's willing not to strike syria. well what kind of message does that say that we should but if i can find a diplomatic solution, then we don't need to. well, let's find a diplomatic

solution, i'm all in favor because i don't think we should be striking syria when we don't have a horse in this fight. we have al qaeda on one side. we have hezbollah and russia and assad on the other side. this is a no-win proposition. as you know, i said that 118 months ago but now it is too late. we missed our opportunity. the president has dillydallied and we're digging a deeper hole. >> governor richardson, the other point putin makes in the piece, the rebels, nobody knows the conknit went and he is worried about the rebels em bolden themselves and perhaps coming to russia and atagging him and his forces or whatever they may go. and he's got a point, doesn't he? we don't know who the rebels are, do we? >> well, we do. >> i believe that general, the leader of the rebels is not al

qaeda. he's an ally of the united states of the international community of the european union, and what i think we need to look at here is taking this military strike is in the national sec e security of the united states. it's important for israel and not to give iran a foothold in the region and what the president said he's ready to do and said that in a speech, is the russians suddenly for a reason with the syrians probably because they didn't want a military air strike have said they are ready to pursue a diplomatic solution. we should tfocus on that. we should look at ways to not just eliminate, eliminate those chemical weapons from the region, have international inspectors, not politicians looking at those sites but also go one step further and arms embargo, finds ways for a political settlement, because the russians maybe are getting

tired of assad. he's a loser. it's a matter of time. >> i got to stop you in mid flow there, governor. terrific debate we'll carry on after the bread. howard dean and tom ridge. they will give me their thoughts. also, new york's top cop ray kelly will give me his thought on chemical weapons and their threat here in america. and i know the results will be fantastic! find out why more than two million members count on angie's list. angie's list -- reviews you can trust.

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choose double miles or 2% cash back on every purchase every day. what's in your wallet? [ crows ] now where's the snooze button? terrific debate we'll carry on divisions in the senate on syria have been fueled by a piece by vladimir putin in the new york times. joining me is presidential candidate and the first homeland security under president george

w. bush. welcome to you both. you heard the earlier debate there. obviously putin's piece tonight will get everybody going. what did you make of it? >> i think the story is over. putin now wears this and we won't attack. if they do use chemical weapons, putin will look terrible and we will attack and go to congress. i think this is over. >> what happens if he's really doing is buying time for his mate president assad and as the weeks and months drag on, it turns out that was the real game plan? >> he can buy time for assad to stay in power but he can't buy time for assad to use chemical weapons again, that won't happen. if it does, we'll do something about it. >> it will take months, years to deal -- >> the first half of the putin piece was right there are blocks of al qaeda who are on terrorist lists fighting with the rebels. that's a danger. the rest of the piece was

russian properrus russian propaganda. a good analysis on who could use chemical weapons and concluded that only the government could have used chemical weapons because of the vast amount they were used and the way they were delivered. you can't takes a sad or putin seriously when they said they didn't use chemical weapons. >> nor should we take the intelligence reports 100% given the problem with iraq. >> iraq is a huge problem. >> i'll come to that. tom ridge, this is from putin's piece. a strike would increase violence and unleash a new wave of terrorism and undermine multi lateral efforts to restore the iranian nuclear problem and the israel palestinian conflict and further deb stabilize the middle east and north america. does he have a point?

>> the last individual in the broader world community that the united states, our president and republicans and democrats should take advice from is vladimir putin. he has the ocho daudacity to ta about trust and unrest in the middle east. at the end of the day, i think that it's a failure of the -- our approach over the past two years and it began with the moral in decision or indifference of the broader world community when we let the assad government for the first six to 12 months use weapons to kill a lot of people. now suddenly, the moral am b ambiguity changed and now the world is concerned about the chemical weapons and at the end of the day, if you take this to a logical conclusion and let's say there is some kind of diplomatic resolution, where is the accountable? where is the punishment? it's the extent the little boy in the neighborhood has a

slingshot and busts windows along main street and find him and he says he's not my slingshot and admits and it you take the slingshot away, what have you done? what's the accountable? i don't think we should take this very seriously. i think putin filled a void. unfortuna unfortunately, the world and president obama created this situation but their indifference and when you draw a line in the sand, you have to defend your word and -- >> president obama talked about the red line being crossed and regime change and getting rid of assad and this week john kerry saying an unbelievably small strike. what message does that send from the american military, never mind anything else? >> things changed a great deal. as this started out. the general clearly prowestern was leading the syrian free army. today he may lead it in the name

but the bulk of fighting is being done by other al qaeda affiliated. things changed dramatically. although i supported the p when he called to go to congress, which i thought was a good move, i actually think that armed intervention would be dangerous because i don't think we want to pick sides. imagine a government over throwing assad having al qaeda in it on the boarder of israel -- >> if you don't take any action -- let me ask you this, tom ridge. if you don't take any action having said my red line is the use of chemical weapons. if you as the leader of the united states of america then don't do anything when somebody crosses that line, you had said where does that leave your authority? >> well, it diminishes whatever credibility you may have had or may have build up over the past five years and one can argue he hasn't been as assertive on certain occasions as some of us wish he had been. i think the president backed himself into a corner.

at one point in time, he expressly gave the impression that he was prepared to act alone, and then suddenly, obviously his consultation perhaps not with the military advisors but political and domestic he chooses to go to the congress of the united states. one question that needs to be ask is you did not seek the endorsement of the congress when you went with france and libya, why now? i tell you what, there is a subplot nobody is talking about and that's the expanded influence not of russia, they are filling the vacvacuum, the leadership the united states provided but iran. iran, you take a look at the map. go east to west. iran, iran is now more influence in iraq than we do. we spent $2 trillion and 4500 men and women dead. they are controlling and working with assad providing weapons, flying over iraq even though we asked iraq to deny them access to the air space and by the way, they are helping with hezbollah and go inside the map into

lebanon and look at the other countries in the region and nobody wants to talk about the bigger issue, the expansion of iran's influence in the region and that's that's a significant plot in this. >> i totally agree and one of the things the president must do is cut off arms to who we disarmed who were our allies ed essentially and he's getting away with impunity. we may be occupied by syria but have to stand up for people who can't defend themselves when every single one has updates. >> give me an update -- >> the state department did help negotiate a solution that removed the 50 or some odd people that survived. six were kidnapped and will probably be extraditeed to iran where they will be tortured and murdered. we owe these people. when we disarm them, we promise them in writing, each one has a piece of paper in writing that

said that the united states would protect them. we have not done that, and mawh we are arming a stewing of the government, i have no idea. >> final word to you, tom? >> the 52 people that were basically political assassinations, piers, shot with their hands tied behind their back, at the end of the day, every one of them may have been buried with a written guarantee from the department of defense when they surrendered means of self-defense sometime agrow and concerned about the remaining 3 00. here is where the u.n. can do something, they ought to put blue helmets until the united states knows how to get these defenseless prodemocracy iranians out of iraq because sadly, iran has more influence in iraq than the united states of america. >> okay. well, the state of affairs,

thank you very much indeed. what about chemical weapons here in the u.s.? i'll ask new york's top cop next. and later my prime time exclusive with dianna nyad. she beat the elements and take on critics who cast doubt on her extraordinary achievement. (growls) (man) that's a good look for you. (woman) that was fun. (man) yeah. (man) let me help you out with the.. (woman)...oh no, i got it. (man) you sure? (woman) just pop the trunk. (man vo) i may not know where the road will lead, but... i'm sure my subaru will get me there. (announcer) love. it's what makes a subaru, a subaru. to help protect your eye health as you age... would you take it? well, there is. [ male announcer ] it's called ocuvite. a vitamin dedicated to your eyes, from bausch + lomb. as you age, eyes can lose vital nutrients. ocuvite helps replenish key eye nutrients.

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michael scott carlo. >> my uncle, i was only three when you were taken from us and we love you and miss you very much, and president obama please do not bring us to another war. >> an extraordinary plea to the

president during the 9/11 victim's ceremony. today marks 12 years since the terror attacks and comes as america is facing new threats and the possibility of a confrontation with syria. joining me is police commissioner ray kelly. welcome to you. what are your thoughts each year on 9/11? i know you weren't the commissioner when it actually happened but what do you go through emotionally on this day? >> there is a lot of different emotions. i lived there on 9/11 and a block away from the world trade center site. certainly the moments and 146 and 9:59 when the building fell. i actually saw the south tower and the height of the floor and i saw the south tower fall.

i was a police commissioner and i was sitting in the basement on the world trade center and having. i thought about that, just a horrendous site and there were thousands of people dead or injured. >> that kind of thinking, the unthinkable goes with the territory of your job and people had never predicted what may have happened on 9/11 with these planes being hijacked and bombs bringing down huge buildings. did you expand when you came back to run the police department in new york, expand that thinking, the unthinkable element of your work? i mean, did you have a whole lot of people now who literally just sit there trying to work out any possible way that an attack can come? >> in a sense, yes. we brought in experts from the federal government. we have also created a group of

first-class analyst from some of the top in the country. we think about a nuclear event or a dirty bomb. that's what we're paid to do. we've had 16 plots against the city since september 11th. >> remarkably, i would say remarkably there is not another attack since 9/11 but looking at syria and the chemical weapons and the possibility they have a lot of stuff and could get in the wrong hands and how this stuff gets moved around, how worrying is that to you as the police commissioner of new york, a terror target, sarin glass and stuff like that that may well lurk from syria could get into dangerous hands? >> it has to be and is a concern for us. we have table top exercises, that sort of thing to attempt to plan for it.

we have chemical detection devices deployed in the city to help us, but quite frankly, if in fact some sort of chemical agent is used, the first thing you would see is people falling and we have an extensive system of cameras that may help in that regard. definitely, a chemical attack something we have to be very much concerned about. >> one of the key strengths of america is when america is perceived to be very strong. are you concerned, as some people are, that the president's apparent wavering of what action to take in syria, sends the wrong kind of signal and message and therefore makes cities like new york perhaps a little more vulnerable? >> our job is to prepare. the president makes those decisions. our job is to be prepared as best we can in the event there is any blow back from actions taken overseas, taken in syria. that's what we're doing. we have conten again see plans that if in fact, we do go

forward in syria, that we will deploy additional resources to predict kilo caey locations. >> what is your sense of new yorkers that you built up in your time working in the police department? >> new york is very resilient. they are tough. interesting, someone told me, and i've heard it a couple times, the population of new york city has basically turned over. like 50% of the people who live here were not here ten years ago. so there is an inflex of new people. but i think the spirit is strong. new yorkers pride themselves on being tough, resilient people and i think god forbid there is another event, we'll rebound and, you know, if it's such a traumatic event on september 11th, now it's a little bit in the back of people's heads that we'll be able to rebound very quickly. >> final question, commissioner, did you believe that new york is a safer city than it was on

september the 11th? >> oh, undoubtedly, no question about it. we invested a lot. the federal government invested a lot. we've been able in someway shape or form with the federal government to prevent these attacks. we're much stronger. there is no guarantees. there is always a possibility of something happening here. >> commissioner, good to see you sgh thank you, piers. good to see you. i want to turn to howard who dropped his son off before heading to the world trade center. they lost 658 employees that day, including his brother and the if i were reopened two days later. this is what howard said at the time. >> it's going to be a different kind of drive than i've ever had before. it's not about my family. i get to kiss my kids tonight, but other people don't get to kiss their kids. and i just have to help them.

>> a global work force nearly 12,000 people and the chairman and ceo. howard, good to see you again. >> great to see you. >> when i see that clip, the raw emotion you must have gone through and the families involved, so many lives wrecked that day and you said before you weren't sure you could ever rebuild it. i was at your offices. you had a charity day where the trading profits around the world go to charity. how much have you raised? >> we raised $12 million today for 100 charities around the world and remember, i was here last time and said we would go to oklahoma with the money. so september 23rd we're going and take care of those families. >> amazing thing, dr. ruth, king, julianne moore, prince harry. amazing coming together but the reaction to fitzgerald since you took charge and said i need to rebuild this company. i need to pay the families of

those who died and look after them and you've done it. >> think about 658 people you can't -- there is nothing i can personally do that will make a darn pit of difference if you divide by 658 so we had to have a company, a serious company and that was the drive we had and set out to rebuild the company for a pure purpose and i think the only reason it worked is because it was a pure purpose. >> a new documentary, "out of the clear blue sky." what did you make of it? >> when somebody makes a documentary, you sit around. obviously when this was a family member of one of our senior executives that got killed, we weren't able to defend ourselves. just around with a camera and she just did it. we really had no control what would come out or how it would work out. what it is is a raw story of what happened. it's extraordinary because we made it through.

if we fell over in the middle, it would be a different ending. because i'm sitting here talking it's an extraordinary tale he we came together. >> amazing film. one point before you go, america's place in the world right now, you have a global business with 12,000 employees, are you happy about where america is in terms of it's authority? many questioning it at the moment. >> i think america has given up a lot of ability to stand strong on fundamental points. they allow things to waiver. i mean, is chemical weapons allowed or not? if it's not allowed, then why are we talking about it? he choose not to act. i think ultimately what america is supposed to go back to is the lines in the sand and bring the world along with them or let the world lead. i think america has led in the past and it would be great to see america lead again. >> great to be at your firm

today. incredibly inspiring. thank you for having me a. great honor and congratulations to what you do. amazing and to think where you were september 11th all theose years ago and now it's a remarkable thing to watch. good to see you. >> thanks, so we had our memorial at the 9/11 memorial this evening and all together as a great group of families. especially today, as people are looking for more low, and no calorie options. that's why on vending machines, we're making it easy for people to know how many calories are in their favorite beverages, before they choose. and we're offering more low calorie options, including over 70 in our innovative coca-cola free-style dispensers. working with our beverage industry and restaurant partners, we're helping provide choices that make sense for everyone.

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. tonight a record inspired american and under scrutiny, 64-year-old dianna nyad swam from cuba to florida in 53 hours without a shark cage. he made history and then the questions started. >> people, people's individual reactions mean everything. so i'm sure this swim will the ratified in due time, and that's fine, but just don't care about it. >> tonight she's here live and unleashed to defend her open water record and tonight, dianna nyad the prime time exclusive. welcome to you. >> piers, i appreciate it. i wondered if you would allow me a brief moment to say on behalf

of my team we express our sincere respects to those who suffered their losses on 9/11, let us say that first. >> absolutely can and good of you to say that. here is my take of this. you're 64 years old and swam for 53 hours, 110 miles and there are people banging on about whether you touched another boat for a few seconds. i mean, i couldn't swim a mile. so what is your reaction to the critics you've come out chomping at your record? >> well, you know, i guess it's two-fold. number one, fair enough. you set a big record like that, i mean, my god, not just me, people have been trying since 1950 to get across. it did seem nearly impossible. most of my crew thought it was impossible, so someone does it, whether me or somebody else, it better be vetted. it better be vetted right down to the end degree. was it fair? it fair and square?

we have done that. we provided now all our logs. there is just no -- no doubting. it was clear that we went from the rocks of cuba to the sand of florida without ever touching that boat without ever getting out on the boat, without ever using fins or, you know, anything that would be untoward. our team is squeaky clean. i'll tell you the negative reaction i have to being scrutinized and that's my team. i have my head handler bonnie the most ethical person on this planet and our navigator is a clear genius and our doctor is the number one boxed jelly fish expert in the world. we had 44 people out there and for them to be cuted we would do anything against the rules, that irked me but i think we're getting past it now. >> let's go through the cheat sheet and i want you quick and

foirm responses to these. first and foremost, did you get any assistance? did you have anybody help you touch a boat to get a rest or anything of that nature? >> never, never took a rest, never touched a boat, never got out on a boat. >> okay. unequivocal. >> out in the open ocean the entire time. >> that's the first question. you couldn't have been more unequivocal. after 27 hours of swimming you went from 1.5 mph to more than 3 mph which many marathoners say was deeply suspicious. >> you know, it's just pure math. i can't imagine. i can see from a lay public who doesn't understand currents but people from the marathon swimming world, you have to know you're in the gulf stream, you can pick up the navigation l charts and any website available that shows these things and sometimes you're going with in current whatsoever, so then of course, you're just going the exact speed you swim. other times you're going north

against an eastern faced current and now you're going with a little bit of your own speed added with a tiny bit of an interest earn current. now you go north with an exact current, if you got lucky, which i did that day, then you add those two vectors together. if i'm swimming at 1.7 miles per hour and i have a current at let's say 2. 2 miles per hour you add them together and you're close to 4 miles an hour. it's easy. >> i did see an ocean expert confirming it was all most the perfect conditions for you, that the currents were aligned in the way you described. so let's leave the viewers on a cliff hanger. we'll come back with two more issues. is it true you didn't eat or drink for seven hours, which people say is impossible and second you're wearing a wet suit and some people saw that's naughty. we'll find out after the break if that's naughty or not. [ tires screech ]

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. that was diana nyad's arrival in key west after swimming 110 miles from cuba. she's back with me now. number three point we left the viewers on this cliff hanger,

they say you didn't eat or drink for 57 hours right in the middle of three. what's the truth? >> piers, never happened. we've got careful loggers out there. apparently a doctor said from the university of miami she had terrible stomach issues because of taking in the salt water. she had a lot of trouble taking in solid food. that doesn't mean you don't eat. my handlers, bonnie, they make me nutritional supplement drinks. i'm always taking in food, every half hour, 45 minutes, every hour. seven hours never happened. pure fiction. >> the last one says that some are questioning that you violated the traditions of the sport by using a specialized mask and wetsuit to protect yourself from gelly fish? >> they're the most dangerous jelly fish in the world. they're fatal. i didn't use any neopreen

because that's against the rules. but i used this to protect myself life and death. it's not an aid believe me. you wish you didn't have this thing on. so difficult to swim in, cumbersome digging in salt water. but you need to be protected. in many areas of the world those types of suits are allowed, just not in the english channel. so i tell you something, piers. we swam fair and square squeaky clean across that thing. and no one's going to take our joy and our moment that the world was inspired by away from us. nobody. >> it's very generous of you to say we but i had nothing to do with it nor did anybody else. you were the one doing the swimming. it was a absolutely extraordinary feat of endeavor. you'll be pleased to know that edward morrison one of your early critics has apparently done a u turn tonight and now accepts you did swim from shore to shore. that's quite good news. looks like some of the critics who have the old green-eyed element monster to their work are beginning to realize that

maybe, just maybe, diana, you are as extraordinary as it seems. >> perhaps the dream really did come true. i tell you, piers, it did. >> well, all i can say is, i couldn't do it in a month of sundays what you did. i think the 64-year-old -- you don't look 64. you look great. it's an astonishing\feat of endeavor. i'm delighted you've come on the show. what's next? any new big plans in the pipeline? >> piers, to hearken back to 9/11, as we come on the anniversary of hurricane sandy in new york city, we have built a pool. we're going to put anytiit in harrold's square. i'm going to swim around a bunch of new yorkers and i'm sure a couple of londoners such as yourself are going to dive in the lane next to me and we're going to raise a whole bunch of money for those people still put out and homeless after hurricane sandy. >> well, good for you.

you are what i love about america, diana. and i'm thrilled to have you on the show. thank you very much indeed. >> thank you, piers. appreciate it. >> great woman and a great effort. and just stop being so damn churlish out there trying to sniper her. this is an amazing achievement. we'll be right back. dad. how did you get here?

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maybe as you've never seen her before on zblarch i've read a couple of times jennifer aniston, the two of us have been dumped more than any other person but it's not true. >> on her ex-lance armstrong and the best. >> i can't put the best into a dialogue. >> that's tomorrow night. "ac 360" starts right now. later tonight the showdown with syria and where the struggle against global terrorism stands 12 years after the attacks on 9/11. so much has happened since those planes came from literally out of the blue and shook the world in two wars and nearly constant covert waw. now secretary of state head to geneva for talks about his russian counterpart. remarkable new statement from russia's president. if nothing it gives us more

reason to say we can't trust russia more doubt. "washington post" says the cia has begun delivering weapons to rebels after months of delays citing administration officials and thanks very much for joining us. and the table tonight, christiane amanpour. andrew sullivan. form ever muslim extremist joins us to talk about the radicalization of the fight in syria and how he changed his mind. we begin with vad minute putin's new op ed piece in the "new york times." what do you make of this, andrew? putin is saying there's no american exceptionalism, no democracy movement inside syria. are you surprised? >> i think the argument about american exceptionalism is interesting and i think it's important for americans to hear it. that's what the rest of the world feels a lot of time. whether americans take for granted that because we are an exceptional country we can do

things other countries cannot do. at at some point the other countries are going to say why? what gave you the right to do all this stuff. so in that sense i think the op ed is kind of refreshing in the sense it reminds us of what the rest of the world sees when they see america. even though america is do doing it for good reasons and with good intentions, i think there is a -- putin represents this quite perfectly. there is a sense of who do you think you are? >> he says my working and personal relationship with president obama is marked by growing trust. i appreciate this. i carefully studied his address on tuesday. i would rather disagree with the statement he made on american exceptionalism, stating that the united states policy is what makes us exceptional. it is extremely dangerous to encourage people to see themselves as exceptional whatever the motivation. >> he's said who do you think you are, putin. he has these really poisonous

relations. it hasn't always been like that. remember good old boris yeltsin? he was a russian president the u.s. could work with. they did in bosnia and kosovo and elsewhere. >> i thought the interesting slip in this op ed was his identification with stall lin. he didn't see the great breach between the soviet union on democratic russia that yeltsin did. he referred to our, us, russia, including united with the united states against hitler against stalin. so he this the soviet union is part of his country's tradition. >> his old kgb background, isn't it? >> i put a lot of stock in the putin p.r. machine which is a lot of what this is. i think there is an important point he makes about whether or not it would be illegal to do this without a u.n. resolution. basic will i what this move would be would be the u.s. taking an action for a violation of a treaty to which the country who offended is not even

signator, u.n. has yet to authorize any military activity. we've cast the entire discussion as a violation by syria of international norms. this to me could set a new precedent and a new international norm where a country who has not been attacked is not in imminent threat of being attacked, could move and make a military action on another country because they feel like no matter how horrific the thing that they have done is -- >> two problems with that, charles. one is we've said it umpteen times, weapons of mass destruction are banned under international law. actually there is a 1925 convention. i know a long time ago the geneva protocol syria did sign up to. it was after americans, french, british soldiers were gassed by the germans in world war i. i think getting back to the putin editorial, though, the op ed, what is completely nuts about him is that he has this perfectly rational debate about why we shouldn't do military,

why we should do diplomacy. that's his view. that's much of the world's view, frankly. then he goes on to say that while none of us doubt that cream cal weapons are being used, there is every reason to believe it was not used by the syrian army but by opposition forces to provoke intervention by their powerful foreign patriots. then he goes on to say the reports the militants are preparing for another attack, this time a chemical attack against israel. there's no reason to think that. the foreign policy magazine or web site online is suggesting, according to a western diplomat who they're quoting, that the u.n. investigative team is about to give its report and its evidence points to the only people who could have used this was the government. they will not put that in their report because it's not part of their mandate. human rights watch, which has rightly said that crimes are being committed by both sides, puts the crime of chemical warfare at the foot of the assad regime. this is the stuff that makes people not take him seriously. >> but the core point is that

use of force in the world at large should only be sanctioned in self-defense or by u.n. security council action. now look, that's the international system. and yet listening to you and this debate in america is as if that doesn't exist. we have an obvious right to do whatever we want. >> that's not a rule russia has used. putin has not used that in chechnya. operated at will where they wanted to. funded covert wars all over the place. >> it's not about the number of bodies. we had 100,000 bodies before the series of chemical attacks even started to stack up. it's not about the number of bodies, just about the munitions used. that's the basis of our moving at this particular time. >> and also remember iraq where we didn't get final u.n. permission and we launched a war, and with disastrous, disastrous consequences. and he's playing that card. he's reminding the world of that

card. >> i want to bring in somebody very skeptical on this russian deal. former bush administration national official currently senior fellow at the brookings institution for middle east policy. christiane was quoting him last night. what do you think of putin's op ed in the time and arming of the rebels by the cia in the "washington post"? >> i think putin's gotten inside obama's head. i think this is an incredibly clever device. some of it is just russian propaganda. a lot of it is putin reflecting back to obama, obama's own world view and his own self-conception. you can feel this as obama was moving close to making the decision to use force, you could see the pain on his face. he was having to put together a coalition of the willing. he was having to work outside the u.n. he was having to make another war in the middle east. he was having to be george bush. which is everything he doesn't want to be. and putin is writing this letter to him now and saying, do you really want to be george bush?

do you really want to say that america is exceptional, something that you've said wasn't true in the past? >> no, that's not true, by the way. that's not true. >> that is true. come on. >> he has always said the united states was an exceptional nation. >> not true. >> what i find remarkable about this is finally putin is saying something that the republican right in this country fuse to ever accept. >> andrew, obama was famously asked during the 2008 election if he thought america was an exceptional country. and he said yes, i think that americans think it's exceptional just like the british people think that britain is ex sensual and greek people think that greece is exceptional. >> he said on many other occasions -- that's true. but in many other occasions and his speech last night quite clearly thinking of america as an exceptional country, journey towards justice to be a completely exceptional case. it was a republican smear that he department believe in this

country's special role in the world. putin has now debunked that fear. >> i would just say that the values that are expressed in this op ed are very much the values of liberal well-educated americans, the exact milleiuu that obama comes from. there's a lot in there. what he's challenging him to do is say, barack obama, do you really not believe all this stuff in do you really want to go against international law? it's very hard for barack obama to read this and say, you know what, putin is wrong. >> can i just say on the exceptional thing, because i always go back to obviously decades of immigrants who have come to this country. i mean, people like myself, like yourself of course, people who come to be educated, people who come to work here. why do we come here? because it's an exceptional country. why do we believe the principles, the morals, the everything that america stands for? because so many countries in the world simply do not. and why do we believe that there is a world order? because for many, many decades,

america has policed a world order that we actually want to live in now, i know there have been problems since iraq and with the iraq war. but we want to live in a world that is safe for democracy. we want to live in a world that is safe for human rights. we want to live in a world where journalists and others can speak freely and not get imprisoned. >> the point putin makes -- i don't want to take him that seriously but there is a serious point here. when american exceptionalism means we get to do things we wouldn't let anybody else do, like torture prisoners, then you've gotten an american exceptionalism defeating itself. >> you are right about that. you are absolutely right about that. that is why this is such an incredible moment. i know we're talking about syria, but you're right. and president obama, let's face it, came to office not just as the anti-war president or the president who wouldn't start wars but would end wars but also the president to restore america's credibility and its moral standing in the world. and when he came into office, that is what happened. there was a massive outpouring

of refavorability for the united states and popularity for the united states with his election. so i do think that is very, very important to consider. and i also believe that what you say, andrew, in terms of you shouldn't just be throwing military weight and might around the world. it's true because look what we did see in the iraq of 2003. but there is precedent for humanitarian intervention. you know, the united states and nobody stepped in in world war ii. in fact, they turned refugees away and people got slaughtered. you know? they didn't step in in rwanda and 1 million people were slaughtered. in three months. we witnessed that. >> were we supposed to stop that? >> yes, we could have done. >> do you believe that if this effort fails this, russian-syrian effort fails, do you think president obama is in a better position to get to rally support for military action? or do you think with the passage of time, the passage of weeks he's in a worst position? >> no, i think he's in a much worse position.

because if you just think about it in terms of domestic politics, his own party is very angry with him right now. i don't know if you saw in foreign policy.com carl levin came out and expressed extreme frustration. he asked his party -- he put them on the spot asking them to either vote for him and against their own constituents or to take the side of constituents against the president. they felt in a horrible position. they don't want to be put in that position again. and he's zigged and zagged so much here that we've lott allies. nobody wants to hold the line with him anymore. everybody's kind of going their own way now. >> i'm sorry. that's just completely bonkers. the u.n. security council including russia and china we've now added to the chorus of countries that have admitted that syria has chemical weapons and are committed to a process to find them and destroy them. to add russia and china is a huge deal. >> i don't call russia and china

al allies of the united states and the op ed you have in front of you from putin says assad didn't use the weapons, the rebels did. the difference between our view of syria and our interests in syria and putin's interests and view of syria is enormous. you can't ignore that. >> but on the question of chemical weapons it's quite clear that we can have an agreement. in fact, we seem to have an agreement. unless you're denying that. are you denying that russia has said it wants to -- >> i'm noticing that the white house put out a report now, or drew attention to a report that we are now arming the rebels. something that putin is very much against. we have very different interests in this conflict. we don't have the same interests as the russians. >> the united states last night said he didn't want to enter the syrian civil war. was he lying? >> he is involved in it already. we're giving arms. he doesn't want to but we are involving -- we're a party to it. >> senator mccain says that obama told him in the white

house that they wanted to be more involved, that they wanted to arm the rebels or have greater connection with the rebels. >> that's not my impression from what the white house has said about its position. and it's not what the president said last night. >> but it is what mccain and others -- >> said they were told in the oval office. >> do you believe john mccain? >> here is i think a danger. and we can talk endlessly because it's really vital this situation of who is the opposition. we're smearing all of them as being crazy islamic murderers, extremists. but so does the west now. that narrative has taken hold. whereas there is a moderate opposition. and the fact that the united states and the west have not backed them has simply allowed them to be overtaken by those who have got money and weapons from elsewhere. that we don't like. >> we've got to take a quick break. our conversation is going to continue the mike, i appreciate your perspective. just ahead the man who spent years inspecting iraq's chemical

weapons. last night said it would take about 500 to 1,000 inspectors. he has almost doubled that today. a former islamist joining us in the fifth chair. a look at moscow where sunrise is about 40 minutes away. we'll be right back. of getting something "new." and now, there's a plan that lets you experience that "new" phone thrill again and again. and again. can you close your new phone box? we're picking up some feedback. introducing verizon edge.

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quick update on the word reported in the "washington post" the cia has begun sending weapons to the rebels in syria. we just got reaction from the natural security council spokeswoman she declines comment except to say quote we aren't able to provide inventory or timelines for every type of assistance we provide for the syrian opposition. interpret that as you will.

>> what's interesting is they didn't comment on something they promised to do. >> in our fifth chair tonight, author of "radical my journey out of islamist extremism." he has unique insights into the world of this religion. great to have you in the fifth chair. >> thank you. >> first of all, there's so much debate about the makeup of the rebel movement in syria. how do you see it? what is the size of the extremists? how powerful are they compared to the moderates? >> it's incredibly diverse. in terms of numbers, the fsa have the more numbers. but by all accounts the most effective fighting force at the moment on the ground is jabat, the al qaeda ail life. as christiane mentioned earlier they are increasing in strength as each day goes by that we aren't providing any form of meaningingful assistance to the

free syrian army. >> where are these extremists coming from? >> coming from the region. we currently have in syria the most amounts of foreign fighters who are european born and raised muslims in any other conflict. so more than afghanistan, more than bosnia, they are all currently flooding to syria from britain alone there's 200, from across the european constant there's roughly 800 who have left their own countries of birth and origin, their own societies and have gone abroad to risk their own lives. in many of those cases they've joined the al qaeda affiliate and they're learning how to kill, how to fight, how to make bombs. of course one day they'll return to their home countries. >> this is obviously a weird question. but is this something you would have done back when you were an extremist? back when you held these beliefs? >> so i didn't belong to a jihadist group to a revolutionary group that attempted to overthrow governments by military coups. i traveled to egypt, to

pakistan. >> quite a sentence by the way. quite casually. ways going to stop you right there and be like we need to talk about that a little bit more. okay. >> yes. so the distinction being, of course, a military coup wouldn't target civilians. >> people who don't know about you, you were arrested and imprisoned in egypt. it's really when you were in custody in egypt that you began to change your mind. >> this is a crucial point. it comes back to this point of humanitarianism. i was radicalized because of what i witnessed in bosnia with the massacre. my belief at the time that nobody was there to help and intervene on behalf of the muslims in bosnia. my exit from the radical group they joined was when amnesty international adopted me as a prisoner of conscience in egypt. and on principle began campaigning for my release despite knowing that i believed them to be my enemy. and i've written in my book

where the heart leads mind can follow. it was amnesty's humanitarian intervention on a microlevel for me that led to my journey now i'm somebody who whereas before i was fighting democracy i'm now standing for parliament in the u.k. for the 2015 general elections. if we can replicate that experience that happened to me on a microlevel, on a macro level say for example in syria, we can go sway to stemming the flow of fighters that are joining jabat. >> you go out and talk to people who held the same ideals that you held and tried to kind of hold it up to logic. >> when i left the group, i basically decided to challenge the former ideology, to challenge what i now call the islamist ideology. i go to countries like pakistan, go speak to the students on the ground. i visited the city where molala yusef was shot and we had a big debate challenging the taliban attempting to generate alternative discourse around

this whole agenda. >> may i ask you? what has happeneded to your face in that period? >> it's very possible around in fact the majority of of muslims in this world are muslims that have no track whatsoever not with terrorism but the version of islam i refer to as militantism. to impose any given interpretation of the religion over society. most muslims in the world, the vast majority of them, are of the faith variety rather than the ideological variety. >> but in most muslim societies, the notion of separation between religion and politics is really not understood or even send let alone embraced, right? >> i wouldn't put it that simply. i think that that's of sort of modern times. that's the way in which it's been going because the most dominant voice, those who are shouting the loudest are those who adopt this ideology of islamism. if you look at the history very briefly, islam is being unique in that sense that it's never had a clergy. it's only with modern islamism,

the iranian revolution was unique that it reintroduced the idea of a politicized clergy that were ruling in god's name. before khomeini the sheite muslims believed that no man had the right to rule in god's name until the mess sighiah returned. so modern day islamism is attempting to bring about the very thing it despises which is western catholicism before the reformation. i refer to it as the bastard child of colonialism. frankly that's what it is. >> how do you try to convince people about the syrian opposition? because it is quite heart-breaking. we've discussed this many times. we reported it 2 1/2 years ago. the first people who came out on the streets in syria were kids w scrawled slogans on the wall against assad, mimicking what happened in tunisia and egypt. they were tortured to death, bodies returned to their families. this is what started the original sort of uprising in

syria. and all of a sudden, it has devolved into this sort of terrible situation where every single member of the opposition as i said earlier is being speared as a jihad terrorist extremist. >> i think christiane -- >> it's true. it is not true. this is why people say that intervening in syria would not be in the u.s. interests. >> obama an and kerry constantly -- >> now when they want to do military action. >> one second. they constantly say there is a vetted moderate opposition. and i think that people do understand that there's more than one kind of opposition. they don't know what we just heard here, what the size is, what the intensity of those different types of opposition are. and i think that two of the things that give americans real pause are, that the punish and leave in place policy here, we

don't want assad to fall now but eventually. we're not sure that if he falls now what happens to the chemical stockpiles, and if the more vociferous fighters get in control of those or the more moderate ones. the second thing that people are not really clear about, is this like smacking the hornet's nest? do you by bombing agitate something that either has repercussions here at home in terms of terrorist attacks or at our embassies abroad. i think both of those questions are real questions people have. >> especially when we have a baathist dictated in sectarian divided country. we couldn't stop 100,000 people killing each other and had troops. the idea we could stop it from afar seems bizarre. also in a revolutionary situation when these institutions and government structures have collapsed, what matters is not who has the most numbers but who has the most zeal and the most determination. we've known that in every revolutionary situation. >> so there are three reasons that people are concerned about when it comes to syria.

one is the chemical weapons. two the foreign fighters who are joining the groups on the ground and three is the dangers of a regional war. the problem is that this is one of those typical wicked problems or a crisis scenario where all three of these reasons apply if we do something and they apply if we don't do something. what do i mean by that? well, the threat of a regional war is already unfolding before our eyes and we haven't even intervened. in iraq last month, 800 people in one month were killed by bombs. civilians. >> we see how successful the surge was. >> but that was an invitation. i've always opposed the iraq war, by the way, but i think syria is different. >> you were in favor of military action in syria. >> i wrote an op ed that with certain conditions two things need to happen. one, we need to disable our sensibility to launch jets against its own people as we did to gadhafi and somehow make sure those chemical weapons are disabled. the technical tis of how to do that with the chemical weapons is a matter of discussion.

but those two things are vital. those three worries that people have about the risk of a regional war, foreign fighters joining extremist groups, those three reasons i mentioned are happening whether we intervene or not. >> what's the greater threat, though? we keep hearing that the greater threat is doing nothing. that is the administration's line, that if you do nothing the threat to america is much greater and the threat to the syrian people and that the chemical weapons will -- the risk of them escalating the usage of those weapons is almost aassured. >> and that the moderate forces there will become weaker and weaker and extremist movements stronger. >> i think by ipt veening we're boosting the side extremist groups aren't fighting on one side of this conflict. hezbollah has come from a foreign country as a foreign intervention to join on the side of assad. by doing so, they defeated the opposition fighters in the battle of hosai.

by doing so they sparked an irreversible trend toward sectarian which led to countries -- >> this has been going on in the middle east and reviving in the middle east for quite some time, long before the syrian conflict. look at iraq. we were told there was sectarianism there. shoe sure enough you remove -- how do you control the chemical weapons without assad? >> that's a good question. you can try to answer that in just a moment. we'll pick up the conversation after a quit break. mine was earned in djibouti, africa. 2004. vietnam in 1972. [ all ] fort benning, georgia in 1999. [ male announcer ] usaa auto insurance is often handed down from generation to generation. because it offers a superior level of protection and because usaa's commitment to serve military members,

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