eastern, 8:00 p.m. pacific for a cnn special "shutdown showdown." i will turn you over to wolf blitzer. he is in "the situation room." a week into the government shutdown, a much greater financial crisis already looming. in ten days, the united states may start drowning in its own red ink but amid all the harsh words from both sides, a cryptic comment from the white house could offer a glimmer, a glimmer of hope. what if, what if the debt ceiling deadline passes with no deal and america can't pay its bills? we are taking a closer look at a very scary scenario. and twin u.s. raids aimed at high value terror targets in africa, a top al qaeda suspect is captured but an attempt to snatch an al shabaab leader has a different outcome. i'm wolf blitzer. you're in "the situation room." just seven hours from now

will mark one week since the start of the government shutdown. there is still no end in sight to that. yet the clock is already ticking toward a much greater crisis. ten days from now, the united states could start defaulting on its bills, unless congress votes to raise the nation's debt ceiling. there's also harsh new rhetoric from president obama and the house speaker john boehner. but the white house today may have signaled a possible, possible compromise in the debt ceiling. let's get the very latest from cnn's chief congressional correspondent, dana bash, who is here with me. what is the latest? because this is moving rapidly and potentially could get out of control. >> that's right. you know, it tells you everything you need to know that when the white house signals even the slightest wiggle room, even if it's not on anything republicans are demanding, it's taken as news and parsed very closely. that's what happened when the two sides -- happens, rather, when the two sides are so entrenched on twin economic crises. the government has been shut down since last week. the country could default next

week, and the president and house speaker spent the day talking past each other. >> the reason that speaker boehner hasn't called a vote on it is because he doesn't apparently want to see the government shutdown end at the moment. >> the president had us all down at the white house last week, only to remind me that he was not going to negotiate over keeping the government open or over the looming need to increase the debt limit. >> let's start with the debt ceiling deadline, just ten days away. the white house signaled some flexibility on timing. the president's spokesman said they prefer to raise the debt ceiling for a year but could accept shorter. >> we're not saying today that that ceiling ought to be or can be any particular length of time. >> reporter: but timing isn't that relevant if the president insists he won't negotiate anything as a condition to raising the debt ceiling. >> we're not going to negotiate under the threat of further harm to our economy and middle class families. >> reporter: and the house speaker says any hike in the debt ceiling must include talks on issues directly related to

the nation's debt, like entitlement reform. in an attempt to make the president look unreasonable, some 20 times sunday, john boehner said all he wants is a conversation. >> my goal here is not to have the united states default on their debt. my goal here is to have a serious conversation about those things that are driving the deficit and driving the debt up, and the president is risking default by not having a conversation with us. >> reporter: on the government shutdown, seven days in, still no end in sight. the president taunted the speaker for refusing to schedule a vote on a clean no strings attached bill to fund and reopen the federal government. >> if republicans and speaker boehner are saying there are not enough votes, then they should prove it. >> reporter: that in response to boehner insisting the votes are not there. but some of boehner's rank and file moderate republicans disagree. you agree with that? >> with respect to the speaker, i do not agree. i believe that if a clean c.r. were put on the house floor, that it would likely pass with

more than 218 votes. i believe comfortably. >> reporter: 195 democrats trying to call boehner's bluff signed a letter demanding a vote on a no strings attached bill to fund the government. that would mean 22 republicans would have to defy their leadership. now, on the question of whether a clean bill could pass the house, cnn has put a vote count together. right now, we have identified 200 democrats, including some delegates, and 14 republicans who have either publicly stated or told us they would vote for a clean continuing resolution, which of course means a bill to fund the government to end the shutdown. john boehner needs 217 to pass a clean bill. so by our count, he is short. there are five republicans who are, for lack of a better way to say it, squishy on this issue. but the thing to keep in mind is even though technically, when you go down number by number, we don't have the votes, two things. one is this is very much a chicken or the egg situation. several republicans have not said publicly that they are --

they would vote for this, and won't do so because why take the political risk if john boehner isn't going to put this on the floor. the other point i would like to make that is i was talking to a senior republican source today who said point blank the main reason john boehner is not putting this on the floor is because that would be the end of his speakership. >> gloria borger is here with us as well and ryan lizza, our contributor from the "new yorker" magazine. a quick follow-up on that. all 200 democrats, every single one, 200 democrats in the house, they are now committed that they would vote in favor of what's called this clean c.r., this resolution, without any strings attached, including the five conservative democrats who refuse to sign that letter over the weekend promising that they would vote for it. >> we know there are 200. my understanding is that five of those from a senior democratic source are actually delegates -- >> no, no, five conservative democrats who refuse to sign -- >> i understand. >> five separate nonvoting delegates who did sign. >> my point is i don't think

those five are on board yet. >> the five conservative republicans. >> exactly. >> because that would bring it down to 195. >> exactly. >> but i suspect, though, we did call those five conservative democrats and asked their offices if a clean c.r. comes up, would you sign it. i think they told us yes. that would bring it up to 200. you would still need 17 republicans and as you are saying right now, they probably have 14 based on our count for sure. >> we have 14 based on our count for sure. the thing is, there are five who are not answering us directly. but most importantly, there are people who are just not saying because there's no point in taking a political risk for something that's not going to happen. when i say political risk, it's because -- >> they don't want to have the threat of a primary. >> here's what i was told by peter king, the moderate republican from new york, charlie dent, in dana's piece, but charlie dent, if the speaker

were to allow an open vote, a whole bunch of other republicans would join. >> they don't want to buck the speaker, nor do they want to destroy the speaker. i think those are two things to keep in mind. the speaker doesn't want to destroy the speaker. so i think what we're looking for here is some form of immaculate conception where everyone can kind of agree that this needs to get done and sort of move on from it so you need to find someone who is really good at the art of contrivance because what we're looking for here in washington is a contrived way to get out of this problem because both sides have backed themselves into corners and it's kind of difficult to figure out how they're going to do it. >> is there any white house strategy now, serious strategy from the presidential level, that would allow some sort of compromise? i know it's not necessarily politically accurate word, but compromise to get the government off the shutdown and to raise

that debt ceiling? is there something realistic that the white house is ready to put on the table that would convince john boehner let this thing end? >> we haven't seen anything. we saw the president speak today when he was over at fema. he didn't put anything new on the table. the thing we have been saying for a week and a half is if he's going to break his no negotiations pledge, he has to do it in a way that makes it seem he didn't break that pledge. >> how does he do that? >> one way to do it is they could add something to the debt ceiling increase that gives instructions for congress to enter into a budget negotiation, right? so it doesn't actually have the force of law but it sets up a process for the two sides to get together and put together some kind of bargain. >> and to pretend it's not linked. >> exactly. it would be instructions that you have to do x, y and z but it wouldn't have the force of law. >> a framework. >> the thing we're hearing also is you and i talked about this earlier today, dana, is that they seem to be kind of from both sides, they are talking about the larger picture more

now, this question of entitlement reform, what you could do after all of this is over, as opposed to just talking about obama care, obama care, obama care. the house speaker over the weekend was sort of not talking about it as much as he was, because it's clear they are all trying to look for a way out of this, and to figure out a way to contrive it -- >> remember, boehner never wanted the debate to be about obama care. he wanted it to be about social security and the sequester and medicare. that's the deal he put on the table. >> he owns it now. he owns that debate now because he's so deep into it. >> he does own it now, which is what is so fascinating, because the shutdown is so dependent and linked now to the debt ceiling. in fact, a republican source said to me just imagine if john boehner capitulated and he agreed to have a clean bill to fund the government on the floor. then where would we be in the debt ceiling? it would be argeddon. it would be an absolute revolt among conservatives. that would actually weaken his

hand when it comes to the debt ceiling. >> i think that's true. >> one possibility here is what if obama gave some policy concession in return for the obje abolition of the debt ceiling vote? >> forever, you mean. >> forever. so you're taking the nuclear device away from the republican party -- >> they wouldn't agree to that. no way. absolutely not. >> what would they want in return for that? medical device tax? >> no, they would want a lot more than medical device tax. you know, the debt ceiling, the question of the debt ceiling, in fact, if you look at the polls, people believe when you're raising the debt ceiling, you ought to deal with the debt. so they feel like they're on firm ground on that one. >> it's not an easy vote for them. they might want -- >> not an easy vote for anybody. >> i think that, if obama was willing to give something -- if obama could get the abolition of the debt ceiling, i think he could break his no negotiations pledge but like you said, republicans -- >> no.

there are some republicans talking about a short-term, you know, funding of the government tied to the debt ceiling, and i don't know that that's gotten anywhere. >> why doesn't the president just pick up the phone, tell john boehner, come over here, forget about harry reid, forget about nancy pelosi, forget about mitch mcconnell. just john boehner and him, one-on-one, the two of them start talking and it might not take a few hours, it might take a few days. why doesn't he do that? that's the way bill clinton used to work with newt gingrich during the shutdowns in '95 and '96. >> his position is as soon as you make that call and enter into negotiations, that you are encouraging john boehner and republicans, maybe democrats in the future, whoever, to use the debt ceiling as a source of leverage. >> but that debt ceiling has been used as that for 20 times. >> it hasn't been used in this way. we haven't gone this close, what are we, ten days out before the deadline. economic catastrophe in ten days. >> remember, america's credit rating slid because of this debate that was going on -- >> for the white house, they think they messed up. they think we entered into

negotiations and made this worse. >> exactly. that's why the white house says the president wants to break the fever. that's what his whole intention is. >> what can john boehner deliver, actually? if boehner were to meet with the president, can he actually promise something? >> he could promise an up or down vote. he could promise a clean vote. >> but according to our numbers -- >> if he wants to be a profile in courage, he could do something like that. if he decides you know what, i'm not going to be speaker after 2014 anyhow, i am going to make sure the government is working, and i am going to make sure there's no default. he could do that. if he wanted to. not saying he will. but he could do that if he wanted. >> he could also go on the house floor and sing show tunes. you're right. you're right. i just think at this point, like you said, he's so far down this road, it's hard to see how he gets out. >> dana bash, thanks very much. good work. just ahead, is there a way for the two sides to end the shutdown and prevent a debt default? we will have a debate later this

hour. republican congressman jeb hensarling and democratic congressman steve israel will be here live. they will debate. also, a pair of bold, risky raids against top terror targets. a key al qaeda suspect and an al shabaab leader. why did the u.s. act now? people don't have to think about

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very bold and very risky. the united states carried out twin special operations raids against high value targets in africa this weekend. one team grabbed a key al qaeda suspect in libya. the other failed to snatch an al shabaab leader in somalia. let's bring in our chief national security correspondent, jim sciutto. he's got the very latest. bold indeed, and very risky. >> no question. both these attacks show the administration's new focus on terror threats emanating in particular from africa. the libya raid connected to an attack that took place there years ago, the 1998 embassy bombings. the somalia raid, however, more forward-looking, driven by u.s. concerns about al shabaab's growing focus on attacks abroad, including targeting u.s. interests in the region, with sophisticated attacks like the one we saw in nairobi. the westgate mall attack in

nairobi, kenya, left dozens dead, a luxury mall destroyed and a country terrorized. it is attacks like this, bold, sophisticated and beyond somalia's borders that helped lead the u.s. to target al shabaab on its home territory. it was a daring operation, late friday night, s.e.a.l. team six, the same team that killed osama bin laden, launched from a commercial ship towards shore, aiming to capture the al shabaab leader known as ikrima. met by a hail of gunfire in a shoreside vil wila, the s.e.a.l team withdrew without their man. hours later and 3,000 miles away in libya, another daring operation. this one in broad daylight in downtown tripoli. the target, abu anas al libi, picked up by members of the elite u.s. delta force. his family said they surrounded his car, many in masks, and rushed al libi away as his wife watched in terror from a window. she spoke exclusively with cnn.

>> translator: everything happened rapidly. they grabbed him and shoved him in the car. i saw them doing this and saying get in, but wasn't sure that was my husband. the cars then sped off like a rocket. >> reporter: al libi, a senior al qaeda operative wanted for the 1998 embassy bombings in africa, is now on a u.s. navy ship in the mediterranean. ikrima, the target of the somalia raid, remains at large. the operations show america's increasing focus on the growing terror threat emanating from africa. in mali and algeria, al qaeda and the islamic magreb and just across the gulf of yemen, al qaeda in the arabian peninsula. unlike in iraq and afghanistan, now the u.s. is relying on smaller, swifter operations. james liddy is a former navy s.e.a.l. commando. >> the united states is showing once again that it's not going to let terrorists dictate the war on terror. a surgical strike makes a lot of sense to try to minimize the

casualties that would ensue if you had a larger footprint or bigger operation. >> still, these two raids show the difficulty of that strategy. one team gets its man, the other does not. both in high risk operations. that said, a u.s. official told me today emphatically the u.s. does not see the somalia operation as a failure, rather he told me it shows that we can quote, knock on their door anywhere in the world. it showed we can get eyes on them and guns on them very quickly. >> it also shows a lot about this president, president obama. he had to authorize both of these raids at the presidential level and it basically says to terrorists out there, it may be 15 years, 15 years since the u.s. embassy in tanzania and kenya were destroyed and a lot of people were killed, but the u.s. is going to come and get you, so just be aware of that. it sends a powerful message of where this president is coming from. >> no question. bin laden caught ten years after 9/11. but these are very risky operations, too. they will put boots on the ground, maybe not tens of

thousands, but a s.e.a.l. team six with life and limb at risk. >> i think he also is trying to send a message to zawahiri, the new al qaeda leader, especially those terrorists who killed the u.s. ambassador chris stevens in benghazi and three other americans. the u.s. will be patient, the u.s. is watching, just be ready, be nervous the rest of your life, because the u.s. is not going to forget and there's going to be an order to either capture or kill. i assume that was part of the thinking on u.s. officials. >> absolutely. to send a very powerful message. that's what they're saying now. they got one man, didn't get the other, but they have been successful in sending that message. >> as soon as i heard the president authorized these two missions, especially to get al libi 15 years after that, i thought this president was out channeling in golda mayer after the munich massacre, she called in her security commanders and said whatever it takes, no matter how long, you will find and either capture or kill those responsible for killing those

israeli athletes. the movie was a result, depicted all of that. i immediately said to myself well, this president has got that instinct in him. >> lots of movie material here, too. >> i think you're right. thanks very much, jim. coming up, some say it's a fiscal doomsday scenario. we are taking a closer look at what really happens if the government defaults on the debt. we also have two lawmakers here getting ready to debate. a democrat and a republican. huh, fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. everybody knows that. well, did you know that when a tree falls in the forest and no one's around, it does make a sound? ohhh...ohhh...oh boy! i'm falling. everybody look out! ahhhhh...ugh. little help here. geico. fifteen minutes could save you...well, you know.

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so what if there's no deal to extend the debt ceiling by october 17th, and the nation's bills come due with no money to pay for them all? cnn's tom foreman has been taking a closer look into that dire scenario. tom, lot of people are worried. tell us why. >> yeah, they're worried because of this. if you defaulted on your mortgage, if you didn't pay it one month, you know the consequences would go beyond your front door. it would affect your credit, it would affect your dealings with the bank, it might affect your standings in the community. in a worse case scenario, this is what some analysts fear about

a u.s. default, that it would set up a domino effect around the world in finances. how would this happen? on the day the government did not have enough money to cover everything it had to pay for, that would push over the domino number one, the default itself, and that would set up a difficult choice. does the government keep funding fully all the programs people are counting on, social security, the military, the department of agriculture, everything else, or does it focus more on getting interest to the people who gave it money before to keep running, paying those people back. either way you go, there are consequences because when those dominoes kick over, then you have what follows. consumer confidence, all those people out there who are counting on money who now don't get it from the government, they stop spending because they don't feel confident about spending. businesses who are counting on those people to come to them or perhaps like a lockheed martin, counting on big government contracts, they pull back from the economy because they can't count on that money and of

course, the stock market. everybody who is involved in investing on that, they pull back and that kicks it over to the next level of dominoes back here. now businesses start saying we have to lay people off. we certainly can't create jobs in this environment. investors say if businesses are in that much trouble, we can't invest in them right now. that means your savings, your 401(k), everything else you have in the bank, becomes worth a little bit less and if there's anybody out there who will still loan money to the united states at that point, they say this is not the safe bet it once was, our interest rates are going to be much, much higher. because the united states is really the cornerstone of the world economy, that could keep rippling beyond u.s. shores around the planet to many other places. people can argue about whether or not there are stopgap measures or whether or not all of this would happen or on what timetable. but the bottom line, wolf, is everyone will agree on this. it's a lot easier to push these dominoes over than it is to ever get them back upright again. >> good point. tom foreman, excellent

explanation. thanks very much. wall street clearly worrying about the debt ceiling mess. nervous investors sent the dow down another 136 points today. the s&p and the nasdaq indices were also down almost 1%. so what's the answer to the shutdown stalemate, the debt ceiling dispute? joining us now, two members of congress. republican jeb hensarling of texas, the chairman of the financial services committee, democratic congressman steve israel of new york, he chairs the democratic congressional campaign committee. i just want to make sure both of you agree with that dire scenario, congressman hensarling, first to you, that tom foreman just laid out. do you accept that? >> oh, i think it would be quite dire for america to default on its bonds, on its sovereign debt. that's why house republicans back in may put forth h.r. 807, the full faith and credit act, to say that the united states cannot default on its debt. basically it takes payment of

interest and principal on our debt out of the calculation of the debt ceiling and yet, the president has issued a veto threat on this. the only conclusion you can reach is that he wants to use this as a hostage to force congress to rubber stamp his spendthrift ways that are bankrupting our nation. that's not what the american people want. the debt ceiling is there for a purpose. it's like the smoke alarm and democrats want to unplug the smoke alarm and republicans want to go out and fight the fire. that's the difference. >> congressman israel, is that right? >> well, no surprise that i'm going to fundamentally disagree and quite honestly, i was in my district this morning in new york. people are tired of that kind of rhetoric. they're tired of the blame and the sound bites, wolf. they want solutions. and there is a solution to this. everything that tom just mentioned, the consequences of a default, entirely avoidable. jeb, you and i can go on the floor of the house, you just heard the bells ring, we can go on the floor of the house in an

hour, we can reopen the government, 195 democrats, that's 99% of our caucus, will -- [ speaking simultaneously ] >> one at a time. >> please let me finish. we will provide you with 98% of our caucus. if you can find 25 members of your own. that's step one. step two, we will negotiate a long-term continued responsible and balanced approach to our debt as we have. we will cut spending, we will work with you on that, we will generate revenues, we will work with you on that but you want us to negotiate with unreasonableness and you have thrown in the kitchen sink in these negotiations. >> steve, your party has become the party of no. the president and harry reid could not make things more clear that they refuse to negotiate. house republicans put on one, two, three, four different proposals on the table. we're not through negotiating, but we are through negotiating with ourselves. again, if you want to take the specter of default off the table, then why don't you call

upon the president, why don't you call upon harry reid to take it off the table and pass the full faith and credit act? >> here's why. >> when it comes -- >> let him explain. go ahead, congressman israel. answer the question that the congressman hensarling just raised. why won't you support that legislation so that there won't be this crisis raising the debt ceiling every few years? >> for two reasons. number one, because jeb's legislation has the absolute wrong priorities for the middle class. what jeb's legislation says is we can default, they accept the fact that we can default, and if we do, china gets paid first. so if you're on social security, you get in line. if you're on medicare, you get in line. if you're a veteran, you get in line. but an investment bank in china, you are first in line. that's the first reason i oppose this. secondly, it's not necessary. we don't have to have bills ordering the priorities for paying our debt. if republicans will simply agree to pay the credit card bills that they themselves have mounted over the past several

years. >> so the short answer is we're going to hold the specter of default hostage for our spending priorities. the very same spending priorities that have created more debt in the president's first four years than our nation's first 200. we are on the road to national bankruptcy. what you hear from the washington class is no, we'll deal with it tomorrow, we'll deal with it tomorrow. the debt ceiling vote, half the time we've had debt ceiling votes, we have attached to it something to bend the cost curve, try to put us back on the road to fiscal solvency. in fact, pay as you go, when your party was in the majority, was attached to the debt ceiling. graham rudman, the balanced budget act, the latest sequester, all attached to the debt ceiling. >> congressman, go ahead. >> let's end the filibuster and talk about reality. have you voted for farm subsidies? have you voted for farm subsidies? >> i don't believe in farm subsidies. you're changing the subject. >> no, here's the point i'm

making. jeb, please let me make the point. please don't -- i have listened to your point and i respect your point, but that's the problem with washington. one side believes that they have all the absolutes and don't let the other side talk. so let me talk just for a moment. both parties have been on the floor of the house and both parties in fact have supported different kinds of investments and spending. your party in fact has led the fight to support spending for things like farm subsidies. to now say that it's okay for us to do that spending but not pay the bill for that spending and hold the middle class hostage, i think is fundamentally wrong. >> i can tell you what the fundamental difference is. american families understand there is a fundamental difference when you borrow money for a mortgage, paying that mortgage versus canceling your vacation to las vegas because you can no longer afford it. okay, families every single day have to get around the kitchen table and prioritize. payments on our bonds are not

equivalent to funding the travel expenses for the alabama watermelon queen, paying for pottery classes and the thousands of other things that squander the hard-working money of the hard-working taxpayer. >> very quickly, answer that because i have one follow-up question for congressman hensarling. go ahead, congressman. >> jeb, we are all for sitting down with you as we have, as we did in the last debt ceiling cliff that you perpetrated on the american people, to negotiate specific spending cuts. the budget control act cuts spending by over $1 trillion. i supported that. we are ready, willing and able to negotiate going forward. we are going to support spending reductions. we also are going to support generating revenues because you can't say that you're not going to exceed the debt ceiling because you don't want to raise taxes on the wealthiest. let's take a balanced approach, the kind of balanced approach the american people want us to take. >> one final question for congressman hensarling. here's what the president said today, urging you, republicans, to do this. listen to the president.

>> if republicans and speaker boehner are saying there are not enough votes, then they should prove it. let the bill go to the floor and let's see what happens. just vote. let every member of congress vote their conscience and they can determine whether or not they want to shut the government down. >> so why not just allow an up or down vote on a clean resolution without any strings attached, if you have the votes, fine. if speaker boehner says there are no votes there, the president says there are, why not simply allow the vote? >> well, we have bipartisan support now to pay our veterans and the president said no. we have -- >> why not allow a simple up and down vote on this resolution? >> why don't we take votes that have already passed the house with strong bipartisan support to keep our parks open, the president has said no, to pay our veterans, the president has said no, to fund the womens, infant and children program, the president has said no. >> all of that is true but the question is, are you afraid --

here's the question. are afraid the president is right if that clean c.r. comes up for a vote, it will pass? >> no. i'm not in the least. but they are theorizing about a bipartisan vote. instead we have bipartisan support in the house and the only person who is trying to ensure that key functions of the government are shut down is the president, harry reid and a number of their democratic congressional allies. we are getting 25 to 35 democrats on all of these votes so why isn't the president opening up the government? again, he wants to use it hostage for his radical spending agenda that's helping bankrupt america and keeping -- >> final thought, congressman. >> we have 195 democrats willing to support reopening the government in the next 15 minutes on your budget, jeb, on your $998 billion budget. take yes for an answer. >> we'll leave it on that note. i suspect that vote is not going to happen any time soon.

unless the speaker decides he wants that vote to happen, and so far, he has said no. the president says no on all these piecemeal pieces of legislation that congressman hensarling is supporting together with all the other republicans. good debate. let's continue this discussion down the road. thanks very much to both of you for joining us. >> thank you, wolf. up next, new information on the chase that locked down the u.s. capitol and should the nfl's washington redskins change their name? president obama enters that controversy as well. a simple question:ple how old is the oldest person you've known? we gave people a sticker and had them show us. we learned a lot of us have known someone who's lived well into their 90s. and that's a great thing. but even though we're living longer, one thing that hasn't changed much is the official retirement age. ♪ the question is how do you make sure you have the money you need to enjoy all of these years. ♪

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getting new information on why the u.s. navy s.e.a.l. team six ended its somalia operation. let's bring in our pentagon

correspondent, barbara starr. what are you learning? >> reporter: new just at this hour, navy s.e.a.l.s on the ground in somalia, reported at that compound they were seeing children emerge being used by al shabaab as human shields. there were children standing between the navy s.e.a.l.s and their target in the middle of an intense firefight. it was seeing those children, we are told, that made the navy s.e.a.l.s make the decision to abort the mission and retreat. they could not get to their target. they had children standing there. they decided to back off. we now know after several days why the navy s.e.a.l.s now retreated, because that is not something that navy s.e.a.l.s do. wolf? >> obviously a good point. we'll have more on this in the next hour as well. barbara, thanks for that new information. we are also getting new information on that car chase here in washington that ended near the u.s. capitol with the shooting death of a young mother whose baby was in the back seat. let's bring in our crime and justice correspondent, joe

johns. he has been combing through some newly released police reports. what are you finding out? >> that's right, wolf. this new information comes to us from this, the search warrant affidavit that d.c. police filed so that a federal magistrate would allow them to search the car miriam carey was driving last week here in washington, d.c. the affidavit tells us a little bit more about how all of it started at the white house. it says she refused to stop her vehicle at a white house checkpoint which we knew, and made a u-turn to try to get away. the u.s. secret service officer attempted to block the vehicle with a bicycle rack, apparently, but the vehicle pushed over the bicycle rack and knocked the officer to the ground. after that, the wild police chase we all know about up pennsylvania avenue toward the capitol, where officers apparently opened fire twice on miriam carey's car before ultimately striking her, apparently carey was shot by u.s. secret service and u.s.

capitol police after she drove over a median strip and refused to stop while driving her car in reverse. carey's child, who was also in the car, was removed from the vehicle uninjured. so this gives us a fuller understanding of what happened even as the family of miriam carey is making the case publicly that the shooting was unjustified. >> this issue will continue for some time, i'm sure. joe, thank you very much. still ahead, more news, including on a much lighter note, the number one movie at the box office. jeanne moos gets astronauts to review the film "gravity." the controversy over washington redskins' name heating up thanks to president obama. sfx: birds chirping.

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is. a simmering controversy heating up once again right now thanks to the latest remarks by president obama. he's directly waded into the debate over the name of the washington pro football team the washington redskins. cnn's brian todd is here with more. >> the president has spoken out in favor of changing the nickname. that has drawn a strong response from the redskins, but it's given nate i have been american groups in the new momentum in the 40-year-plus campaign to get rid of the name. a standoff, neither side budging, the president firing a newsmaking salvo, about you this drama over the snick name of the city's nfl franchise. native-american groups feel they have new momentum. >> it's about the way our children are affected by the

imagery of washington as name and mascot. >> reporter: they are making a new push after the president's remarks if he were the owner of a team and the name offended a sizable group of people, i would think about changing it. >> there should not be a name change. it's not about race, it's not about disrespect, but about loving the redskins. >> davis cited a poll this year showing four out of fife -- and the only poll, which asks native-americans specifically about it, taken almost a decade ago. that surveys show the 9 out of 10 were not bothered by the name. what do you make of the polls that many -- and others don't want the name changed. >> you shouldn't be using that to sell a national sports team. >> refers to the definition, is chess it's usually offensive.

nfl commissioner roger goodell stepped lightly into the controversy. if we are offending one person, we need to be listening, but redskins' owner dan snyder, said recently he'll never change the name. with both sides dug in. is it a realistic chance it will ever change? >> it's a realistic chance if it affects sales, if suddenly it's no longer one of the most popular, you know, merchandise drivers for the league, i mean, it generates a tremendous am of money for the league. if that changes and people stop voting with their pocket bocks, yeah, it will change. >> those that cover sports in washington say that won't happen anytime soon. still on the line, but the both sides say they will meet next month.

other teams about indian-related names, no problems with those names? >> nos people who speak out about this saying that those -- they're offended by the actual logos. if you look at the logos of some of those teams, some of those the not so -- but the names itself, because it doesn't have to do with the color of use you are skins, redskins does, and that's kind of where they draw that line. >> thank you for the report. a rocky yen lie debut, have the glitches been fixed? our medical team takes another test drive.

a real-life astronaut think of the movie "gravity"? that's next. at a ford dealer with a little q and a for fiona. tell me fiona, who's having a big tire event? your ford dealer. who has 11 major brands to choose from?

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brilliant. let's get out of here. warp speed. ♪ her busy saturday begins with back pain, when... hey pam, you should take advil. why? you can take four advil for all day relief. so i should give up my two aleve for more pills with advil? you're joking right? for my back pain, i want my aleve. so what do experts think of "gravity"? here's jeanne moos. >> reporter: who better to review the movie "gravity" than a guy who doesn't just talk the talk, but has actually walked

the space walk? >> what you see is not just a bad day, but a bad day on steroids. >> reporter: on his two flights into space, he never had debris crash into him as sandra bullock does. instead of being flung into space, his space walks were like a slow dance. >> just allow a -- >> reporter: nod a body slam, but when it comes to realism. >> i was decided when i saw the accuracy of my accuracy and payload bay and tools. i wasn't looking at sandra bullock. i recognized my wire cutter. >> reporter: what he did not recognize is sandra's heavy breathing. stop panting. >> that's not helpful. no, that is not helpful. when you're breathing heavy, you're using more oxygen. >> reporter: maybe it freaks you out to see sandra untethered

floating off into blackness. >> i didn't like that, either. >> reporter: astrophysicist nitpicked via twitter, noting that nearly all satellites orbit earth west to east, not east to west as in the film. he pondered why her hair, otherwise convincing zero-gravity scenes did not float freely on her head. >> it kind of poofs a bit. >> reporter: the real astronaut doesn't quibble with the spacesuit. it's what's under it. >> the undergarments were not accurate, but again, it's a movie. >> which would i rather see, sandra bull loy in boy shorts or the fancy underwear with tubing that they wear under their space suits? while the movie astronauts were having their tethers severed, the worst thing that happened to mike was a hole in his glove. then you started going -- >> no, no, no panting. >> reporter: he says he misses

hip up in space. >> for me i'm an astronaut, not a movie critic, but i give it a thumbs up. >> reporter: just an astronaut. an astronaut more worried about holes in his glove than holes in the plot. jeanne moos, cnn, new york. happens now, new fighting words between the house speaker and the president. >> the president would rather default on our debt than to sit down and negotiate. he doesn't apparently want to see the government shutdown end. >> the government shutdown drags on, a second crisis is days away. could there be a hint of hope amid the finger pointing. plus one week into enrollment for obama care. we're seeing firsthand while some americans can't sign up. the website still has some declareding problems. inside the capture of a wanted

al qaeda operative. his wife talks to cnn exclusively about the u.s. raid that nabbed him. we want to welcome our viewers in the united states and around the world. i'm wolf blitzer. you're in "the situation room." one week into the shutdown, the -- and president obama is warning it could be an economic catastrophe. the united states will run out of money to pay bills ten days from now unless congress votes to raise the ceiling. even as the war of words heats up. let's go to jim acosta. he's got the very latest. >> reporter: white house officials are indicating that president obama is open to a short-term innic in the nation's debt ceiling. that has the potential to pull the government from the brink of

default, but it's not stopping both sides from engaging in a blame game over the shutdown. >> i'm here at fema for a couple reasons. >> reporter: in the eye of a shutdown storm that's still raging, president obama stopped by fema to point out the agency is rattling with -- and to accuse house speaker john boehner of blocking a vote. >> my very strong suspicion is there are enough votes there, and the reason that speaker boehner hasn't called a vote on it is because he doesn't apparently want to see the gust shutdown end at the moment. >> reporter: but there could be a few breaks in the clouds over washington. the president promised to work with republicans on health care and the budget if they end the shutdown and raise the nation's debt ceiling. >> i am eager and ready to sit down and negotiate with republicans on a whole range of issues. >> reporter: another hope 68 sign? with a potential default on october 17th fast amuch pros, white house officials said the president is willing to september a short-term increase

in the debt limits, instead of racing it for one year as most democrats prefer. >> i'm simply saying we have never stated and are not saying today that a debt ceiling ought to be or can be any particular length of time. i'm not ruling out the specific duration, and i want to make that clear. >> reporter: republicans complain it's the president who's risking default, pointing to this comment made by white house economic adviser gene sperling. >> the president strongly believes that if he were to sanction negotiations with those threatening default, that would actually increase -- not decrease the chances that we as a country undermine or full faith and credit. >> reporter: sperling went on to say that the president believes such negotiations would only encourage more brings manship. >> this morning the senior white house official said that the president would rather dwalt than to sit down and negotiate. really? >> reporter: a new cnn/orcp poll

finds americans are furious over the shutdown with 63% angry with republicans, 57% with democrats, and 53% with the president. what's worse? nobody in washington seems to know what might happen in the nation goes into default next week. >> i can't tell you. we've never gotten to this point. it's very dangerous. >> reporter: as for that idea of a short-term dead ceiling increase, a house republican aide tells cnn that would have to go along with spending cuts, but wolf at this point, that is something that the white house is not even willing to look at. they say a clean debt ceiling increase is the only thing they'll look at at this point, wolf. >> the rhetoric on both sides still very angry and furious. thanks, jim acostsa. we heard john boehner suggest that -- to errands the government shutdown very quickly if he simply wanted to. cnn has been counting votes out there. let's bring our dana bash. the vote count shows it potentially could be very tight?

>> very tight. >> cnn has been done our own count, to see whether a clean funding bill would actually pass. what they have done is identified 200 democrats that had vote yes. that does include, as we talked about last hour, five conservative democrats who didn't sign on to a letter over the weekend. that means that all house democrats have pledged to vote yes. as for republicans, the key here, 14 republicans have publicly stated or told cnn that they would vote for a clean, continuing resolution to fund and reopen the government. that's three votes shy needed to pass a bill in the house right now. as you've heard, wolf, from charlie dent in the last hour, he told me, told you earlier in the day, that many republicans would vote yes if given the opportunity, but wolf, the issue is senior republican sources insist to me that this is kind of a nonstarter, because john boehner still says he will not bring ink this up. part of the reason why maybe we're not hearing from some of

these other republicans to fill in the blanks of those three is because why take the political risk? way say publicly they're going to vote for something that could, you know, result in attacks from the right within their own districts and from around the condition? the other interesting thing i was told is that a republican sort said the conservative backlash against not just those members but the speaker would be, quote, god-awful. another republican sort said, speaking of john boehner, that would be the end of the speakership. that would be to go around and force a vote on a clean resolution parent is not going to go anywhere, either. let's get an update on the enrollment for obama care insurance policies. a surveys find that roughly 100,000 people at the very least have created accounts online to explore their coverage options, but there are still serious glitches, serious problems even after the administration promised to improve the site. let's bring in our elizabeth

cohen. your team tried to create an account. what happened? >> well, we tried it last week and couldn't do it. then we tried it this week. we did it through the federal site, because we live in georgia. like most sites, they're using the federal site. so you get this page, and then you get let's get started. that was good. then you have a page where you create your identity. and that worked. that was good. then we got to the page where you answer security questions. these are all things you need to do to create an account. last week we got stuck on this page. we wouldn't make this page work. this we're, this is a good sign, we managed to make that work. so we got to a page that then said "please wait" and then this is where it didn't go so well. it said your account couldn't be created at this time. so we've been trying since tuesday of last week, still unable to create an account. >> pretty embarrassing. what about other folks out there? are they getting through this process? >> you know, the federal

government says that many people are and people have been able, unlike us, to go on and create accounts. they also note that the phone lines, doing it by phone has been very successful. they say there's very little wait, just a matter of seconds and you can talk to someone. we'll continue to monitor the so-called glitches and see what happened. thanks very much. still ahead this hour, i'll talk to a republican moderate who told me earlier in the day he does believe the house would vote to end 9 shutdown if given a chance president i'll ask charlie dent about what he thinks about cnn's tally that suggests maybe not yet. new information coming into "the situation room" about why a second suspect got away. [ crashing ] [ male announcer ] when your favorite food starts a fight, fight back fast with tums. heartburn relief that neutralizes acid on contact and goes to work in seconds. ♪ tum, tum tum tum tums!

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washington to deal with the government shutdown. >> in 2004, obviously, i worked very, very hard to replace a president. this is not what i had in mind. very funny. kerry also had some serious warnings, though, to terrorists after two u.s. raids in africa, with very different outcomes. we'll have reports from the region right after this.

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get 50% off new brake pads and shoes. route now u.s. authorities are explain how another high-value suspect got away. we're learning more about the raids over the weekend. the successful mission in libya and aborted operation in somalia. cnn spoke exclusively with the wife of the suspect who was grabbed. adas al libi. >> reporter: his family says al libi, one of the most wanted men in the world wasn't even hiding, so they were shod when u.s. special forces showed up. al libi was in his car, his escaped blocked by four vehicles. his son shows me the car he was driving. shattered glass from the smashed-in windows, the only evidence of the raid that they

say lasted moments, and not a single shot was fired. over the past hours since we got here, there's been a constant stream of visitors, women and children coming in to see the wife of abu anas al libi, they say to offer support to the wife. she says scherr children were asleep when he left for prayers. he came back as the sun was rising. >> translator: >> translator: it was before 7:00 a.m. i was waiting for him. i rushed to the window at the sound. i saw a mer sids-type minivan outside the house with a number of masked and unmasked men. they are carrying pistols with silence her. >> reporter: she claims they appeared and sounded libyan. she says her husband is an innocent man and denies he was involved in the 1998 bombings at the u.s. embassies in kenya and

tanzania, claiming he had left al qaeda two years before that. >> translator: i'm sure of what i'm saying. he did not take part in any bombing anywhere in the world. he participated in the jihad in afghanistan. he was a member of al qaeda, and personal security for osama bin laden, that's true, but he did not take part in any operation. now on the other u.s. raid in africa over the weekend, this one in somalia, sources say it was aborted after a fire fight. we're joined by cnn terrorism analyst paul skier check. barbara starr reporting it was apparently aborted after the suspected terrorists in somalia came out with children in front of them as human shields. what do you make of that? >> well, very, very interesting indeed. clearly this was aborted. they weren't able to capture this very important al shabab

figure. we've been learning new information from a leaked kenyan intel, also from a former western secret agent, who actually penetrated al shabab, and spent time with the guy they were trying to target. he was in his late 20s, spend time in norway between 2004 and 2008. he's a kenyan nationality, and has really emerged as a key figure in terms of them -- in the last 1 months, but also been the point guy for the western recruits going into somalia, and also the other foreign fighters. we've learned today that one of his top ambitions was to use these western fighters to launch an attack back in the west, wolf. >> it suggests to me the fact that commando, paul, the special forces were going in to capture him. they wanted to get him and start questioning him, as opposed so imp simply what the u.s. often

does, sending in the drones and just launching a missile and killing this guy. >> well, that's absolutely right. if they managed to capture him maybe they could have started to take apart of wing, and it raid followed two weeks exactly after the attack on the westgate man mall and this operative was near the top of the suspect list when it came to sort of plotting attacks in kenya, so some speculation he may well have been involved in summer way in that terrible attack. >> would you anticipate more drone strikes against these various targets in somalia? they've been going on for a while, as you know. >> i think we can expect the united states to ramp up the precious against al shabab. it's a terrorist groups that's promised more attacks in east africa, including against american interests, so great concern from the united states. the leader of this group is trying to transform it from a militia insurgent group into an

al qaeda affiliate, into a terrorist outfit, launching attacks across the region. >> my conclusion since the president approved both these operations, the message he's sending out there, you can run, but i can't hide, no matter how many years it takes, the u.s. will find you and bring you to justice, either capture you or kill you. that's the message that's being sent out. thank you, paul. up next, republicans willing to go against john boehner and voight to end the shut jon. i'll speak with charlie dent of pennsylvania, stand i by live. are there enough votes on the house? stand by.

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the nation's debt ceiling. all three stock indices were down at the closing bell with the dow losing more than 136 points. i'll talk about a possible debt disaster with the republican mott rad republican who's been feeling squeezed by the tea party, among others. stay with us.

the partial government shutdown and the debate over the debt limit have moderate republicans caught in the middle. republican lawmakers who are backed by the tea party have been in the driver's seat at least so far, using the debate to take on obama care. let's discuss one of those republican moderates, congressman charlie dent. thanks very much for coming in. >> thanks again for having me, wolf. great to be with you. >> since we last spoke, we've done a survey of all 4432, 433, because of some vacancies, members of the house, and we found that 200 democrats -- every single democrat in the house would vote for what's called a clean continuing resolution, clean bill, without any strings attached to end the

government shutdown. we've only found 14 republicans who are publicly willing to make that commitment. that's not enough. you need 217. you think you would get it. tell us why. >> you just said 200 democrats, 14 republicans. actually the number of republicans prepared to vote for a clean continuing resolution is greater than 14. those are 14 publicly declared. i saw another analysis that i think there were 26 republicans who had publicly declared they would vote for a clean continuing resolution. i believe there are many more who privately told me they are -- they're on not any of thinks lists. i believe a clean cr would pass comfortably. i'm not here to predict the number, you i think it would clear the barrier. >> what does it say that only you and 13 others are publicly willing to say you would vote for that legislation that would reopen the government?

i believe it's more than 13 or 14. >> but the fact that only 13 plus you are willing to say so publicly, and all the others, they may privately be willing to go ahead when it's all said and done, but they're reluctant or afraid, whatever, to tell us that they would vote for that so-called clean continuing resolution. unfortunately you get to see a lot of that around here. all i can say in my state i believe there are five who are declared publicly they would vote for a clean cr. again, i know that many members are concerned about primary pressure, but i tell my colleagues we cannot govern out of fear. a shutdown is not in anyone's interests. as much as we may object to obama care -- as i told you before, i voted to delay it, to fricassee it, but as long as you have a senate controlled by harry reid and a president named obama, maybe we can get a change

in the health care law, but you suspect we have to do it outside of this continuing resolution. it's time to step up, do the right thing. >> you're from pennsylvania. there are a few republicans from new york or new england who agree with you, but almost all the republicans, especially in the south and midwest, they're reluctant because they're afraid there could be a primary challenge to them. they see what's happened to other moderate republicans, especially senate republicans, who were challenged by tea party opponents. many of them went on to lose in the general election. how worried are you about a challenge potentially from tea party leaders in your district? >> well, look, again, i don't govern out of fear. you know, what we're seeing in the house right now, there are a lot of folks we want to see passed. this is the hope yet, vote know crowd. the violence again other they

wanted somebody else to vote for them. i can explain myself to my constituents, and frankly most of them agree. i have very conservative republicans, but many of them are very practical people. we have a lot of common-sense conservatives who have a great sense of governance, and this is one of the things we must do. again, i don't know how many republicans will vote for you for this cr, but i will guarantee you, there will be enough for it to be enacted into law. >> you can go over the head of the speaker john boehner and force the vote on the house floor by joining the democrats and supporting this discharge motion as it's called, to force an up-or-down vote, but you are not ready to do so? >> as i mentioned earlier, that discharge petition would not be ready for primetime until october 28th. so it's really not a practical

response. i expect we'll have the government funded well before october 28th. that is the soonest. in fact the democratic members cannot begin to sign that discharge petition until saturday the 12th. they would likely not be able to have any consideration of that until october the 28th, so it's really not a practical response. we have to get to this issue much sooner than that. that's why -- it might get you a headline, but not a solution. >> congressman carly dent, thanks very much for coming in. >> wolf, thanks again for having me. >> remember, you can always follow what's going on here on twitter. god and tweet me at wolf blitzer. you can always use the hashtag sitroom. thanks for watching. "crossfire" starts right now. tonight on "crossfire" -- the shutdown stalemate. there's plenty of blame going around. >> the president 'refusal to

negotiate is hurting our economy. >> pay our bills and prevent an economic shutdown. on the left stephanie cutter, on the right s.e.cutt. >> edward markie, and republican senator john thune, who criticizes president obama for not negotiating. getting passed stuck on stubborn, tonight on "crossfire." welcome to "crossfire." i'm s.e.cupp on the right. speaker boehner didn't want to attach ted crews' crazy demands, but then he did. speaker boehner didn't want to shut down the government, but then he did. now he's denying there's enough votes in the house to reopen the government without those crazy demands on obama care.

listen to what he said on abc's "this week." >> they are not prepared to schedule a clean vote? >> there are not the votes in the house to pass a clean cr. >> well, there are. there are enough votes. plus 24 republicans have come out in favor of passing a clean cr, and ending this shutdown, but we could reopen the government today if only speaker boehner would reopen the business of leadership in the house. we could end this. >> i take issue with the create ideological demand park, but putting that aside -- >> why? >> president obama has a bigger problem. that's a looming default on our debts. believe me, no matter how incompetent he thinks republicans are looking over this shutdown, he knows that ultimately it's his credibility god his legacy on the line if we