say yes. 70% say no. the debate will continue online at cnn.com/cross fire. >> join us tomorrow for another edition of "crossfire." erin burnett "outfront" starts right now. >> i am not a perfect man and i will not be a perfect president. >> president apologizes again and again and again. >> we fumbled. that's on me. >> i feel deeply responsible. we fumbled the rollout on this health care. >> is this enough to save his presidency? is he waving the white flag on his signature legislation or did he stop the bleeding and save obama care? let's go "outfront."

good thursday evening, everyone. the president admits some failures but promises a fix. president obama trying to resolve his broken promise that if you like your health care plan, you can keep it. as we've been reporting, million of mers have been receiving cancellations notices as a result of obama care. today under enormous pressure, the president offered a fix. >> i completely get how upsetting this can be for a lot of americans. particularly after insurances they heard from me that if they had a plan that they like, they can keep it. to those americans, i hear you loud and clear. i said that i would do everything we can to fix this problem and today i'm offering an idea that will help. >> will the president's fix work? let me explain what it is. the proposal says you can keep the plan that you have if you like it for a year. but there is a big, big

assumption here. that is that the insurance companies will cooperate. we'll have more on that. as for the disastrous rollout itself, the president took the blame. >> ultimately, i'm the president of the united states. they speck me to do something about it. it is legitimate for them on speck me to have to win back some credibility. that's on me. i mean, we fumbled the rollout on this health care law. we should have done a better job getting that right on day one. that proved not to be the case. that's on me. i feel deeply responsible. i am not a perk man and i will not be a perfect president will. >> will the president rebound? dana bash is "outfront." a the love democrats will noting to those words. what was the reaction? >> well, for the most part, democrats on capitol hill thought it was good first step. they're not satisfied both substantively and politically. let's start with the substance

and you alluded to it. the president can only suggest to insurance company they reinstate these plans. he cannot force them to do it. that would have to have to happen legislatively. senate leaders say they will hold off on that for now. when it come to the politics, look, a lot of democrats on capitol hill made the same promise. if you like your health care plan you can keep it that they broke. there is a little reluctance to sit on the sidelines and let the president handle it. they want to get in the game and show voters back home they're working on fifls. and a recognition even among democrats that the poll numbers are not great. especially on the issue of trust. there is a little wariness about letting the president handle this when voters are saying, really? we're be so sure they can handle this. >> the president said with his chief of staff today. this is a full-court press.

giving that speech, answering the questions. but obviously the job was to sell worried democrats that this plan would work. how did they respond to mcdonagh in. >> we're told pretty well. we reported yesterday there was a very tense, intense heated meeting between other white house officials and how democrats. primarily over this issue. the house meeting in particular this afternoon, we're told because he actually went pretty far in trying to explain how to website was going on work better so that people will be abe to be enrolled. on this issue of people having their health care plans dropped. he explain the president's plan and came with this whole proposal which is what the democrats in the house in particular were asking for. why is it? it is because the timing of thought is surrounding the house. there is a vote tomorrow on a republican plan that would as far as democrats are concerned, dismantle obama care.

so democrats were really desperate for an alternative. they got that. we're told they are going on put them on the floor legislatively tomorrow so they have something to vote for. >> thank you very much. let's get to the floor. i want to bring you in. you heard the reporting there. let me put the question to you point blank. you met with the president today. you're one of those he's been trying to convince. do you support his plan? >> i believe the president didn't mislead the public. i believe we should fix the website and we should move forward. the fact is these plans, many of them are defective from the start. they lack essential quality controls. like these annual caps on care. some of them don't and clad for preexisting conditions or they do plan for it and they have

other problems with them. the fact is, if you go to a restaurant and you like it but that restaurant is defective and has health code violations, maybe the city will say you cannot go there and shut it down. >> you're going a lot stronger than the president. i'm surprised. even he himself is saying he misled the public. you're saying he did not will. >> well, i interpreted the president as saying, for that 80% of americans who rely on employee based health care, that will essentially stay the same. only it will be better because there will be insurance reform. for the 15% of americans who have no health care at all, they'll get it for the first time in their lives and have another alternative than the e.r. for the 5% in the private insurance market, look, i interpreted the president's statement all along saying, not that anyone unany circumstance ever will lose a plan. the insurance company have the prerogative to cancel plans

without regard to the affordable care act at all. >> that's a fair point. when someone says if you like your plan you can keep it, it meant it. if you like your plan, you can keep it. it may have cams. the world may not think that's good for you. if you're okay with it, that's your choice. >> ultimately it is not up to the president. the fact is, what i interpreted him as saying, during this whole period, is that if your plan, if you are the vast majority covered by employer-based health plans, you'll be in the same situation. could he have been more precise? sure. i think as he stand-up guy and he's trying to take responsibility and i appreciate that. in fact, any time people feel that they could have done better, i think it is good to try to come clean and say that. but i don't believe that the affordable care act is in any jeopardy. i think it is a good bill and i think we need to let it get fully implemented so with could reap the benefits.

>> so you think it is okay if someone likes your plan and were told they can keep it, that now they cannot keep it because as you say, it wasn't in come plinl with all these things. you made your argument. then people will have to pay a lot more. that's the reality for a lot of young people. the very people on whom this system rests, right? it will fail if young people don't sign up. and those are the people you're saying have to pay more. >> well, look, i'm not saying they have to pay more. in insurance companiful are that's the definition of it. >> i'm not saying it is okay. it is disruptive to their lives. they might have had expectations. for many. these plans. when these insurance companies were taking their premiums. when they go to get covered, they will final they're not covered on things they need to be covered for and that's not good either. i'm not saying it is okay. i think the president tried to stand up to that. let's me say one more thing if i may. the fact of the matter is that this plan is bad.

it does gut the affordable care act. it will undermine and set us back and bring us back to the bad old days when people were out pause of preexisting conditions. i'm a strong no on that. we've got to plow forward. this affordable care act is a great thing because we're going to be able to cover americans for the first time and have real insurance reform. >> let me ask you. what this has brought to the fore, isn't just a promise the president made. it is something else. as i indicated the rock on which all of this rests in materials of the exchanges which is the young, right? i was trying to figure out, if young people are going to go ahead with this. right? and i have to ask you. let me ask you how you get around two things. first of all is this, right? when you look at the first thing that took effect about obama care, it was young people got to stay on their parents' plans until they were 26. people love that. but that mean you have 15

million people according to the numbers we confirmed today. young people who stayed on their parntss' plans. they aren't going to go on and the exchange and pay a lot more. they'll stay on their parents' plans. you need those people to buy these plans so the older people who are suffering from preexisting conditions or other problems can get that care without a huge surge in premiums. >> we do need to get as many people in so we can balance the risk pool. that mean you need healthy people in there. young people should sign up. you never know when you're going to get in a car accident, get hurt playing basketball, roller blading and fall. i may not, you just don't know. life is unpredictable. aid young woman working in my office who had a serious chronic condition which she could not get covered for. and the bottom line is obama care, the affordable care act gave her a chance to get an affordable policy and save her life according to her.

i think young people will sign up. this is not easy. it doesn't help when you have republicans doing everything they can to try to stop access to affordable care. >> fair point. let me ask you one final question. >> look at this. this is, this says, boehner-upton bill is a step on the obama care repeal. look at that. they're admitting that this is not a good-faith effort to improve the bill. they're trying to destroy it. >> one final question, let me ask you before you go. that is this. i talked to some young people on our staff today. all of them that were able to stay on their parents' plans stayed on them. and one said, dwlung the truth is? and i feel badly admitting this? i would rather pay the penalty than go on one of these exchanges. the penalties are a fraction of the cost of actually signing up. right? so young people who feel, i know the government is telling me i'm morally obligated.

am i morally obligated to pay a lot of money and pay this huge hit? that seem to be the problem here. it is a math problem. >> a lot of those young people will qual faye for six distoo. in my state of minnesota, if you look at the fwoeks the bronze and silver plans, they're un$100 young people will get a chance to get real coverage where they don't have to worry about, i hope i don't twist my ankle playing basketball or get messed up in a car accident. young people will benefit from this plan and i think they should sane up. i'm encouraging them to sign up. if they get hurt or injured, need health care that they cannot afford, they're going to be in a real tough situation. the number one reason for bankruptcy is medical debt. at least over the last several years it has been. we want to spare young people from that tragedy and that financial hit. i think they should sign up.

>> thank you very much. we appreciate your taking the time with a fierce defense of the president. the president addressed reporters today when he gave that apology that you heard congressman ellis say he didn't need to make. he accepted responsibility. he spent a lot of time focusing on one word. >> we fumbled. we did fumble the ball. two fumbles. >> fumble. what does this may not for the future of the obama white house? "outfront," shawn spicer, host of "crossfire." then congressman he willis, i have to give him credit for some courage. he said the president shouldn't even apologize for promising people they could keep their health care plans. when you have defenders like, that you have some real defenders. do you think admitting fail you are a so profusely as the president did today is enough? >> i don't think it is enough but it is definitely a first step. first of all, you can have a broken website. you can recover from that.

you can't recover from the sense of a broken promise. he had to get out there and say, listen, i made a promise. i'm going to do everything i can to fulfill that promise and do everything i can going forward. and i think it is very interesting to me. you have republicans saying this guy is so air ganlt. so high handed. he was contrite. he took responsibility. he didn't blame anybody else. i expect republicans to say he did today what we've been wanting him tad and give him credit. >> are you going other give him some credit and agree with the word contrite? >> i think van is giving a little too much credit. i think it sounded like "my bad." like i left the keys in the car. like i fumbled the ball. this isn't a game. million of people gregt notices saying your health care has been taken wax you have to find a new plan, a new doctor. and we're acting like you locked the door by mistake and we have to get the other guy to let us

in. this is aer is a just subject and i think he is minuimizing i. the point that congressman ellison was getting to, people are not looking at what the president actually said. let me read it for you quick. these are his actual words. actually any insurance you have would be grandfathered in so you could keep. so you could decide not to get on the exchange better plan. i could keep my acme insurance, a high deductible catastrophic plan. i would not be required to get a better one. we can debate the merits of whether or not congressman ellis was getting into, whether or not it is good or bad policy. but that's not what we were promised. >> a fair point. as the president said. he did apologize. i want to follow up where you said, he was contrite and didn't blame anybody else. he did have one point where it was a little vague. he said he didn't know about the

looming problems with the health care website. maybe because people didn't tell him. >> on the website, i was not informed directly that the website would not be working. the way it was supposed to. ly been informed, i would not be going out saying this would be great. you know, i'm accused of a lot of things, but i don't think i'm stupid enough to go around saying, this is going to be like shopping on amazon or travelocity. even a week into it think thing was that these were some glitches that would be fixed with patches. as opposed to some broader systemic problems that took much longer to fix. >> the line i'm holding in on, had i been informed, i wouldn't have said this was great. >> true. >> implying someone may have known. let me put the question to you. how is it the president didn't know the problems were horrific? it would seem either somebody lied to him when they shouldn't

have, or the people that were putting this in place were so incompetent, they didn't realize the scope themselves. which is worse? >> something wept wrong in the white house. i worked there. one thing i know with this president. he is a famously hands-on president. listen, you work in the white house, you write something, you know there will be one person in that building that reads it. his name is president obama. something went wrong in that white house. they need to figure out who is responsible but i think the president stepping forward and saying the buck stops with me and trying to if i will it is a good thing. i'm shocked that i've not heard republicans saying, listen. this is what we were called for. instead they are trying to kick the guy. >> you get the final response. >> one, he didn't know what was going on with the nsa that we were doing merkel's phone calls. he didn't know the justice department was taping reporters' phone calls.

what -- there is a pattern hear on this whole area, too, about what he does and doesn't know. the big he shall iryou've is that he did blame big government. he said the problem is it is too big. the way the government is set up in material of procurement and stuff. you cannot be the champion of big government and then blame big government for the failure to implement the program. that's the biggish you a. we have a government too big, too out of control. you cannot go blame the size of government that you inflated as the problem. >> i agree on something. the procurement process of the federal government has developed for itself is terrible. that's why the pentagon is paying $100 for a screw. that's not big government per se. that's a particular set of problems that can be fixed. >> so let's extrapolate that. >> let's not forget, there's 40 million people who got a shot at

health care now. women who are not being discriminated against. obama care is working. you have a couple million people who are in trouble now and we're trying to help them. don't erase the 40 million people in better condition. america's government can and has done good stuff. >> i'm going to hit pause there. thank you very much. we have much more coverage of president obama's health care. we'll talk about whether his legacy, whether it is safe, whether he can recover. plus, what the one-area extension may not for the millions had a have gotten it. meet a man had a says it won't help. we went to the fwrounld to find people dealing with this. >> plus, young people. we've done the numbers. we'll show you exactly why that is so crucial. i have a 401k retirement plan. i started part-time, now i'm a manager.

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when you think about it, isn't that what retirement should be, paying ourselves to do what we love? ♪ tonight president obama bowed to public pressure by waring from one of the pillars of his health care reform. he won't make give up your current health care plan if you like it for another year even though that plan may come nowhere close to meeting the qualifications of obama care. it is very unclear whether this fix will mean people who get the cancellations notices will get their plans back. washington state has said no way. it is the insurance regulators

in each of the states that will make that choice. not the white house. dan simon is "outfront" with the story of one man who may have been saved by this announcement, at least for now. >> reporter: in 2009, steve brown did his homework. researching and shopping around for the best insurance policy. >> the plan we had met our family needs. it was a good plan, low deductible, expensive but it met our needs. >> reporter: that's why brown who lives in san francisco was upset to learn his policy was being canceled because of obama care. because of the requirements of the new laws, we can no longer offer your current individual health benefit plan, read the letter from his insurer, anthem blue cross will. >> one of the reasons i was so surprised. i did not have a sub par or a sham insurance policy. it was a great policy to begin with. over the last couple years actually got better because they had to comply with state and federal law to expand health care for women, to have a

stronger preventive care. >> reporter: the insurance company suggested a new plan. he said they did not make it clear what the add benefits would be but they did make it clear it would cost 27% more, along with a higher deductible. >> to say we're having to cancel it. it is not obama care come plinlt and it will come more. you'll have a higher deductible and a higher out of pocket expense and not really better benefits shocked me. and then it became irritating. >> reporter: even with the president's quote/unquote fix today. >> those who got cancellations notices do deserve and receive an apology from me. >> did that give you some comfort hearing from the president? >> it was nice to hear him acknowledge there had been a mistake. but i'm still feeling uneasy. emthat insurance company may provide their policies. it is not a guarantee that they will. >> reporter: a million people in

california received similar termination letters. it is not known how many would have had to pay higher premiums. the state insurance commissioners are asking company to resinglto changt he. even show they say you it doesn't mean should you automatic will he keep your policy. there may be better ones available at a cheaper price. brown hasn't really dug into that yet. he just may bite the bullet with a higher premium and deductible because he like his network of doctors. consumer advocates say there is a benefit to this. >> the fact a million californians received termination letters was scary for a lot of people. >> as opposed to people shrugging their shoulders and saying this is the way the market works think anding there is nothing to be done about it, people are at least now engaged in the fact, this is a policy issue. >> an issue that seems more

complicated than ever. cnn, san francisco. >> in order to prevent preet yums like you just saw, they need 30% of the people who enroll to be young and healthy. thats what i was getting at. the number are integral to the success or failure of the law. tom is "outfront." you've been looking at this, since it is so crucial. exactly how these insurance plans are set up so they could remain affordable which is all that matters to young people who buy really cheap plans with really high deductibles when they have the choice. >> everyone knows how health insurance is supposed to work. you have a lot of people who pay money to an insurance company. as they get sick, the insurance company pays for their care. the rick of anyone being hit with medical bills, it works as

long as they're generally healthy. as long as they pay this more than they take out. unobama care, as you noted. this whole system is being expanded to include a lot of new folks. the uninsured. and they must fit into this equation. meaning this cannot be a whole bunch of people out here with serious illnesses or chronic health issues. it must include 40% healthy people. that means august noted, young people. why? because people over 65 are roughly 2.5 times more likely to be healthy. they may not want health insurance. they may want to spend the money but have this to have it. >> here's the question, whether young people will sign up. not only are they the people, if they're allowed to keep their plans for cheaper would be more likely to do so rather than getting the exchanges in the short material. that is a big problem for the

viability of the entire system. but also, when you look at them staying on their parents' plans. they were allowed to and they did in overwhelming numbers. it seemed like very easy thing. >> that may be the problem. >> it would seem to me if i had the option, i would stay on my parents' plan. keep my existing plan or faye penalty which is a heck of a lot cheaper than getting into an exchange before i would buy an expensive plan. even if i felt a little guilty about it. >> if you look at the 40% they have to have. we cope talking about it. 3 million or 10 or 12 million sign up. here are the three reasons why they're concerned about the young people. you noted the website problem. if you have people come in to try and it doesn't work the first time, everyone knows it is harder to get them to come back and try again.

the second problem, 26 and under. this is one of the most popular features of obama care. the idea people could stay on their parents' insurance until they're 26 years old. that cuts out this entire group. of course, there is the question of the penalty, erin. i've talked to a lot of analysts, the penalty for not getting insurance the first year, even the second year, maybe even the third year for some people is simply not high enough. it is not going to push some young people to buy. they're going to say, i'm counting my pennies and i can pay the penalty and take my chances about getting sick. if that happens on a large scale, then that 40% threshold starts feeling the pressure. the whole washington establish

many will be talking about that. >> tom foreman, thank you very much. explaining why that is so central to the problem today. still to come, our coverage tinls of the president's health care announcement. the hugely significant development today. we're going to talk about the fact that he can make whatever promises he wants today but the insurers aren't on board. and things get even weirder in toronto. facing new accusations, making an unbelievably vulgar comment. i know there has never been anything like this said in front of cameras before by a politician. i got this. [thinking] is it that time? the son picks up the check? [thinking] i'm still working. he's retired.

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numbers don't lie. that's the problem the president is facing. number don't lie of course was the title of your op ed. you're talking about enrollment number for obama care and the president's poll numbers which have taken a real hit. obviously case approval rating for the president, 54% approval is now below 40. the president says he does not care about polls. really? >> no. now, look, he's trying to look past the polls where he says, i can get my mojo back. we can get my agenda back on track. at the moment he kept saying today, i'm not perfect. i'm not a perfect president. i'm not a perfect man. what he needs to get is productive again. if you look at the poll numbers, that's causing the paralysis of his presidency. the approval rating is bad and people have lost, starting to

lose faith in him personally. they say he was not honest about that if you like your doctor or your plan you can keep it. the president is trying to turn it around. the question is, can he? it is a huge question mark. out in the country, can he make peace with those people who got cancellation notices? that depends in part on their state says okay. and it depends on whether the rates go up. so that's the problem and the question in the country. here in washington people say no, sorry, mr. president. thank you for coming out today but we think congress should do something. your fix did not go far enough. so politically he did not stop the problem. >> and i want to talk about insurers in a moment. it is not just about republicans as john boehner, the congressman points out. he still wants to get rid of obama care. it is and not just those in congress that are angry with the president.

i don't need to say who he is. you'll know it when i play it. >> i personally believe even if it takes changing the law, the president should honor the commit many to federal government. >> why did bill clinton do that? >> he didn't say anything president obama doesn't agree with. the fact that he did say it tells you a lot of you don't criticize the leader of your own party even if you're a former president when they have good high poll standing numbers. a lot of republicans did not like medicare part d. some did not like the iraq war. they chemical their mouth shut until the tide turned. when did it turn? when public opposition to iraq went off the charts and the katrina moment happened. and people started to think, this president cannot run the government in a competent way. that is president obama's challenge. if people come to the conclusion, he cannot get the government to do most basic things. like have a website. he said this would be like buying an airline ticket. some people see this as a potential katrina moment.

some said let's keep it in the democratic party. unless the president changes the tide quickly, this could be his energy shortage, a reference to jimmy carter. >> thank you very much. i now bring on the civil war. it is dem versus dem. a month ago we were talking about the gop waging a civil war and they still are. now it is the demes on the front line. this one-year fix that allows people to keep their health care plans is not makinging a lot of democrats happy. maybe completely impossible to implement. a group of democrats went into the white house this week angry. candy crowley is "outfront." a lot of people not on board with the president's one-year fix. mary landrieu among them. she said i'm going after letting them keep their plans permanently. and democrats agree. is there a real rift here within the democratic party? >> sure. on this issue. and i think you kind of heard that in the president's voice. i think he was trying to offer them a little bit of cover

saying, i'm the team head here. i'm the coach. i know i put a burden on these democrats. i can assure you that in that meeting, the democrats said, let me tell what you i am hearing at home as i prepare to launch my re-election bid which many of them are including those that you mentioned. so absolutely. and i think you heard it a little bit tonight with keith ellison. there are those who go, hey, stop apologizing. you shouldn't let these substandard insurance policies be okay for another year. and rob rice said stop. these are bad insurance policies. don't let it happen. then you're hearing the moderates and many up for re-election in purple states going, not far enough. we need a legislative fix. they want to vote on it so they can take it back home. there is also this problem. the democrats are arguing. do you let people deem their plan for another year or for

forever? here's the problem themselves cannot control it. and neither can the president. the insurance company who were dragged kicking and screaming with nasty thing said about them went along with preexisting conditions and everything. they get to decide whether they'll extend these plans and in washington state, this is a state by state thing. they're saying no way. sorry. we're not going to do it. the president is saying, keep your plan for another year and people still may not be able to. >> exactly. you can say, i told them to go ahead. i told them to keep it for another year. i can't control the insurance coil. for some democrats that won't be enough. they want legislation that says you have to offer what you were offering before. the insurance agencies are already out there. a spokesman saying this is going on hit premiums really hard. the new alliances splitting over there. i think the white house argues, we did what we could but the insurance companies won't allow

it. i think democrats, many democrats on capitol hill won't let that be the last word. >> thank you very much. still to come, some of the other key stories we're following at this hour. the rob ford scandal turns foul and gets even weirder. toronto's mayor holds the most bizarre press conference in political history. yes, more bizarre than yesterday. yes, you must hear this and it is next. ask about the air optix® contacts so breathable they're approved for up to 30 nights of continuous wear. serious eye problems may occur. ask your doctor and visit airoptix.com for safety information and a free one-month trial. jim, i adore the pool at your hotel.ver had to make. anna, your hotels have wondrous waffle bars. ryan, your hotels' robes are fabulous. i have twelve of them. twelve? shhhh, i'm worth it& what i'm trying to say is, it's so hard to pick just one of you, so i'm choosing all of you with hotels.com.

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there are new allegations against rob ford including drinking whifg driving and lewd comments to a female staffer among others. ford says that's all lies and he got so angry with the accusations that he hit back with this vulgar response. >> take legal action against the wait per said i was doing lines at the beer market. that is outright lies. that is not true. you know what? it hurts my wife when they're calling a friend of mine a prostitute. she is not a prostitute. she is a friend and it makes me sick how people are saying this. olivia, it says that i wanted to eat her [ bleep ]. i've never said that in my life to her. i would never do that. i'm happily married. i've got more than enough to eat at home. >> "outfront," bill weir. we should have come to your face after that because it is so shocking. this is may ofrt fourth biggest city in the united states. >> after i scoop my jaw off the

floor after hearing it this morning, i think i realized what that is. that's andy kaufman in a great costume. because who says this? you get thrown out of truck stops for talking like this. then he went on to the floor of the council wearing his toronto argonauts jersey. they were very disappointed. it is the playoffs. and the councillors turned their backs on him. he does this manic mood swing. he has the impulse control of a 13-year-old boy with that first press conference. that line, it seemed like he worked that line out before he came. on it wasn't extemporaneous. a few hours later he changes out of jersey and apologizes. >> let's play the apology here. here's that. >> i want to apologize for my graphic remarks this morning. yesterday i mentioned it was the second worst day of my life except for the death of my father. for the past six months, i have

been under tremendous tremendous, tremendous stress. the stress is largely of my own making. i have apologized and i have tried to move forward. this has proven to be almost impossible. >> so what happens next here in there are 500 pages of police reports in which a lot of these allegations that he responded to in that vulgar way are detailed. >> it is project brazen two. that's what the police are calling this. those were basically interviews that have been given in order to get search warrants. none of it proven in court. i think probably the video. some surveillance video of this long time buddy. his who is now indicted for extortion and drug dealing. he is not helping his cause in keeping in power. now they're trying to take his power away from him after that press conference and we haven't talked about his poor wife. >> she was there today.

>> she was there. and the canadian media, politer than us. family is hands-off. he brings her to that conference after saying what he said. instead of taking back darr out of that press conference, he chooses to go through this scrum. i wonder if he's playing the sympathy card to his base. look at the camera, the journalists ganging up on us. my wife. but even the premiere of ottawa, like their governor is opening the door. if things get really ugly, they may have to step in. >> when you talk to people with this, there isn't a mechanism to get rid of him. >> there is not. i talked to the guy who had the losing campaign who is a big time political consultant. his name is jamie. he had this to say. it blew me away when we talked about, how do you get this guy out of here? >> there is no mechanism to get rid of him. the only way he can be removed from office is if he is convicted of an offense and

incarcerated. >> oh, really. >> both. he can be convicted and still stay in office. >> unless he is incarcerated. >> you are some generous folks up there. >> so if he appeals, he could run again. but it looks like he's not. maybe the best idea came from mary margaret mcmahan, a cowboyor there who. he needs to duct tape himself. >> that might be the best thing when thing like that come out of your mouth. >> of course, you went to toronto to talk to people to find out the truth on this story. still to come, why the ivory trade might be a threat to national security. pretty shocking, right? you could be funding terrorism and not even know it yourself. [ male announcer ] at his current pace, bob will retire when he's 153, which would be fine if bob were a vampire. but he's not. ♪ he's an architect with two kids and a mortgage. luckily, he found someone

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today a 6-ton stockpile of elephant ivy highlight what is a worldwide threat, not just to the elephant population but american national security. anna cabrera is out front with tonight's "money and power." >> reporter: six tons of

elephant ivy tusk destroyed, to crush the elephant ivy trade. >> it's not just an animal problem, animal and people problem. >> reporter: while elephants live in the other part of the world, this is a united states problem. according to the international fund for animal welfare, a nonprofit organization, the united states is the second largest retail market for eloquent vent ivy only behind china. we went behind the scenes at the u.s. animal property repost torety. 1.5 million items confiscated around the country. more than 1100 ivy specimen have been seized, everything from small statutes to large elephant tusks and again, that's just what was seized. experts believe this represents just 10% of what is actually being traded illegally. to get the ivy, poachers have to kill the elephants. >> they cannot possibly

reproduce as fast as they are being killed, and they are being killed from airplanes with machine guns, al 'trtillerartil >> reporter: with ivy fetching up to $1,000 a pound in places like beijing, investigators believe the criminal organizations are using tusks to buy weapons and sustain activities. >> what we're seeing is a level of engagement, a threat to world order, a threat to national security. >> reporter: robert is part of a u.s. task force on trafficking. he says a sole cushion could come with new laws to go after the illegal proceeds, not just ivy. some an activists want to see a ban on the sale of it all together. they hope to have a plan by the end of the year. right now it is legal on some

level to buy and sell ivy here in the u.s. you can buy it on auction sites, ebay, antique stores but you cannot bring ivy into the u.s. since 1989 there is a ban on exports and imports. once it makes it in, it's hard to distinguish, what is old versus what is new, what's legal, versus what is illegal. >> anna, thank you very much. pretty shocking. a lot of people probably thought the u.s. got rid of that, right? second largest market after china. thanks so much for joining us. we appreciate your time. "ac 360" starts after this. customer erin swenson ordered shoes from us online but they didn't fit. customer's not happy, i'm not happy. sales go down, i'm not happy. merch comes back, i'm not happy. use ups. they make returns easy. unhappy customer becomes happy customer. then, repeat customer.

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-- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com [ male announcer ] find gevalia in the coffee aisle good evening everyone. i'm anderson cooper coming to you live from manila in the philippines with the latest on the disaster here and the relief efforts on going in tacloban and cebu. we have correspondents aroun