enormous damages. >> and would malaysian airlines go along with that if it was determined the pilot for whatever reason brought that plane down in the middle of the indian ocean, would malaysian airlines step up and say, yes, we hired this guy and we're now going to pay off all these families? >> they'd be forced to, i imagine, if that were the case. but we're a long way from proof of that fact. this idea of homing in on the pilot admittedly would be at the top of my list but there are still things we can't rule out including the fact that this plane could have been commandeered. for all we know he was a hero that was trying to get away with a bomb on board from land. >> malaysian airlines no matter what will be shelling out a lot of money. >> they're going to pay, but once their defense goes into litigation, malaysian airlines turns over their defense entirely to their insurance underwriters. they mount a defense.

malaysian doesn't even have a say in what kind of defense they're going to mount. so they will aggressively challenge any suits. >> jeffrey, getting back to malaysia and malaysia government, the malaysian airlines, there are these two other cases, u.s. investigators concluded the egypt air flight was pilot suicide. a silk airline flight that crashed was pilot suicide, an indonesian airliner. if this were a similar situation, would there be pressure on malaysia, like the indonesians did, to simply deny it was mechanical failure they both claimed early? >> there would be that pressure because it's one thing for an international body or even the ntsb to conclude what the cause of an accident is, but an airline is not going to pay unless a court finds them liable. and that's a very different

thing. and here you have the additional complexity of a mail asian airline, mostly chinese passenger, wreckage that hasn't even been found yet that may be near australia. the question of which country's court is something that's going to be very complicated to resolve. there have been at least some initial efforts to try to bring a case in the united states. it happened in the past couple of days, but you know, this is very early. this could be just intercontinental ambulance chasing. so this is all going to take a very long time to be resolved, legally. >> peter, you were directly involved over at the ntsb with the egypt air investigation. what happens in a situation like this when there's a multinational investigation. how do you determine who really is responsible? >> well, it is very complex. sometimes in silk air, even though the ntsb determined that the probable cause was pilot

induced, u.s. courts ruled differently and family members got large settlements. >> from? >> from, i believe, the underwriters. >> from the insurance companies. >> that's right. >> underwriting the silk airlines. >> that's right. >> what about the egypt airlines, who paid for that? >> i'm not familiar about that. but i know there were multiple lawsuits that went on for years. >> this investigation, miles, and you've covered a lot of these over the years. this could go on and on and on, especially if they don't recover this, the flight data recorder, if they don't recover wreckage and it's possible they might not, we might never know really what happened. >> you know, and i hate to hear that said, but i think that's where we are right now. can you imagine if this could be enduring mystery, this could be like amelia earhart. it is quite possible if you don't find those boxes that you won't have a definitive answer. we can say all day long that we think the pilot did something but we have no proof. >> to find the proof you have to find the evidence.

if its as the "usa today" editor was suggesting they're honing in on some relatives, trying to get some more information on this pilot, we'll see what they come up with, we'll see what we come up with with ours sources as well, guys, thanks very much. tom foreman is standing by in our virtual studio. we'll give us a closer look at the step by step process the searchers are now using to identify a possible crash zone. i'll speak with richard quest about the batteries the plane was carrying. america's favorite lasagna. topped with a mouth-watering blend of fresh cheese and aged parmesan. it makes our lasagna a delicious centerpiece for this table this table and your table. stouffer's. america's favorite lasagna. ♪

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even though satellites are sending back images that might be debris from flight 370, it's still up to searchers in planes and aboard ships to find whatever's floating in the indian ocean, and that will take a slow, methodical amount of work. cnn's tom foreman is joining us from our virtual studio to give us a closer look at how it's done. >> a really impressive fleet if you think about all the craft out there to help them search in this area, 11 aircraft, 5 ships from all these different countries. but all you have to do is bring in the map of what they're trying to look for and you start realizing what a challenge it remains. all that they're up against. think about this. if you're coming out of perth and trying to get though this particular area where the objects were spotted, that's 1600 miles of travel before you even start doi ining your job. this is a big challenge. here is another way of looking at it. if you were to widen this out and look at all in this area they're trying to search in the southern corridor, if you look at this, 621,000 square miles,

yes, these planes have different capabilities, the ships have different capabilities. but as a practical matter by the time they make that trip and do their searching and get back, they can cover 5% of this grid on a good day. which means if the weather is right, the conditions are right, all the equipment holds up and everything goes perfectly, it would take them 20 days to work through just this grid and that's just a portion of what they're looking at. here is another way of talking about that. let's narrow it down to just the area with the potential objects in it. if you talk about that, you're talking about an area that's 12 1/2 miles by 12 1/2 miles. imagine taking off in a search plane from washington, d.c., in the morning, flying all the way across the country trying to get all the way out to colorado, so you've covered a tremendous amount of ground, then going down to the city of denver and within the basic outlines of that city, trying to fly all the way in and from the air spot a

particular trash can or a particular person or a particular car, something relatively small. that's essentially what they're trying to do. in most cases they're only going to have two or three hours over the city to look before they have to fly all the way back to refuel and start again the next day. so wolf, that gives you a sense of why this is so difficult even with all these great tools out there. something spotted in the water, finding it is a big, big challenge and will remain so. >> a huge shot, especially when the water is choppy, dangerous weather, not easy to fly around there, certainly on boats either. all right, tom, thanks very much. a source who recently worked on malaysian airlines 777s tells cnn the pinger batteries on flight 370 may have already stopped sending signals from the flight data recorder, voice recorder and so-called black boxes. the information comes from a recent audit of the airlines, parts, storage and maintenance

procedures. let's bring in our own richard quest who is in new york. ripped, explain potentially the significance of this development. >> according to a source told us that the batteries on the underwater locator beacons, according to this audit, they discovered the batteries were being stored in a too humid area and against what the manufacturer said should be, which was in a cool area. now, because of obviously the humidity in malaysia, storing the batteries for a prolonged period of time in this area could degrade their operational performance by up to 50%. if that is true, then, of course, the battery's now being activated with the crash into the water, those batteries may already have been exhausted and come to the end of their useful life. so in other words, there may be no pingers. that is according to one source who basically said he told

malaysia to start storing the batteries properly in cool surroundings. they did so for a while, but then went back to the old ways. now, on the other side, the makers of the pingers, they say that, frankly, the pingers and the batteries, they're designed to work in all sorts of extreme temperatures and that shouldn't really be a factor. it's more the age of the unit rather than the batteries and such. but it is a worry. i would say, wolf, since this is the battery at the end of it. this is the pinger. now, of course, on the side of the ping per, you have the battery that will provide the source to keep going for 30 days. now, wolf, i would say that until we have some form of confirmation one way or the other, at worst this is a worrying possibility that those pingers may already have stopped transmitting if those batteries were improperly stored.

>> and they would only have 12 or 13 or 14 days left if they were properly stored. what you're saying here and we have one of these flight data recorders here with the battery here, the pinger here, if it's not emitting any noise, any sound, any indication at all right now, even if they find the debris, it may not make much difference. is that what you're saying? >> yes. they found the black boxes on 447 two years after the pingers stopped, so it's not an open and shut scenario, but certainly, look, if these batteries were improperly stored by malaysian airlines and if it's proven that that degrades the operational performance, then frankly, the searchers' task has just got that little bit more difficult because they've still got to find the debris field. they've still got to work out where it is. they've still got to find the plane. and this best opportunity, wolf, to do so with the pinger may

just have got a little bit more remote. >> what do you make, richard, of this "usa today" report, the newspaper "usa today" report quoting a high ranking malaysian law enforcement source suggesting that the pilot, the senior pilot, the 53-year-old pilot deliberately took command and diverted that plane, flew over the indian ocean for whatever reason, u.s. sources telling us we have -- that they have no confirmation of this whatsoever. they've not come to any definitive conclusion. what do you make, though, of this "usa today" report? >> i think it's like every allegation against the pilots of this plane. we clearly know that somebody did something and the plane was turned deliberately. that's the phrase being used. if you look at the flight plan or the flight path, it was clearly moved deliberately west and then south. so yes, the body of evidence that somebody did something is growing by the day and in doing so, wolf, starts to diminish the

mechanical option. but -- and here's where i disagree with "usa today" and all those who would happily try and convict one of the pilots -- you cannot, you must not go that next stage and say it was one of the pilots because, to use the phrase that i'm afraid you've heard me say so many times over the last three weeks, we just don't know. >> good point. they're quoting this high ranking malaysian police officer as coming to this conclusion. i suspect based on circumstantial evidence. one of the things they point out was that the 53-year-old pilot zaharie ahmad shah, he had the expertise to do this. the junior pilot, the 27-year-old, on the other hand, was relatively new to a 777 and had only flown in it, what, about six times, although this was his sixth flight. what do you make of this point that the senior malaysian law enforcement officer is telling "usa today"? >> until i've heard it

officially, i'm going to leave that firmly where it belongs, a piece of the jigsaw on the table but not part of the picture. it's simply too risky, it's simply too -- it's simply too unfair, wolf, in my view, to basically be judge and jury on a man whose -- you know, miles o'brien summed it up earlier. this man could have been saving the plane, not dooming it. >> richard quest, thanks very much. good work. appreciate it. up next, the grim prediction from the governor of washington state where the death toll is now rising after a devastating landslide. we're also monitoring the takeoffs as planes head toward the southern indian ocean. they're looking for any sign of flight 370. your eyes really are unique.

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breaking news out of boston. we're learning from a public safety source one firefighter was killed this afternoon in a massive nine alarm fire in the city's back bay neighborhood. boston emergency medical services say it transported 18 patients to area hospitals. the boston fire department says the blaze broke out in the basement of a brown stone quickly climbed up a four story building, more than 150 firefighters and 20 or 30 trucks responded. in washington state rescue crews are using bulldozers, shovels and their hands in the hunt for victims of last weekend's deadly mudslide. two dozen people are known dead. today the washington governor told cnn jim shutto he expects a big increase in the death toll. >> the death toll stands at 24. do you expect that death toll to rise significantly? >> yes.

i don't think anyone can reach any other conclusion. it's very sad we've not been able to find anyone living now for about 36, 48 hours. it's extremely discouraging and the most discouraging thing is, you know, we were hopeful that we would find folks who might be protected by a car or a structure. but the force of this landslide just defies imagination. the cars that have been found have literally been twisted into corkscrews and torn in half. >> let's go to george howell who is joining us from near the disaster area with more on the very latest. george? >> reporter: wolf, just a few minutes ago officials tell us that they did find more victims today though they are not releasing any numbers the official number that we have at this point is that 16 people died in this mudslide and that investigators, the search-and-rescue teams found eight additional victims yesterday but they have not yet removed from the mud. today we spent some time trying to learn more exactsly about

what's happening there on the ground and we learned that more resources are on the way. it's a slow laborious process moving through the mud and debris searching for victims. this video the very latest taken from the disaster zone as the rescue and recovery operation continues. even the mayor admits. >> this project is so big, we can't do this ourselves. the magnitude of it and the severity and the distance material traveled and the energy that it took to get there is, is something that you can't wrap your head around. >> reporter: locals began digging right away, trying to help each other. but now more regional and state resources are in play. to cover the one square mile of land officials tell us there are seven excavators on the ground to help sift through the mud. five gravel trucks to load and

remove debris. one bulldozer on site. 16 timber cutter and 85 urban search-and-rescue crews along with dozens of volunteers. two black hawk helicopters are also en route to search from above. with so many teams and crews on the ground you find tent cities like this where search-and-rescue crews are setting up for the long haul and now we know more federal help is also on the way. >> the emergency declaration was focused on making sure there were resources right away in terms of emergency response. right now they are looking at expanding that to help with debris removal and ongoing efforts as we look to recovery in that area. >> reporter: it's help that congresswoman knows will make a big difference in the days and weeks ahead. although it's welcomed in these parts -- >> we pride ourselves on our resiliency and self -reliance.

>> reporter: so with all the equipment and trucks out here we hear from officials that it really comes down the volunteers and the search-and-rescue teams, the boots on the ground, people searching, scanning, looking in those void spaces where homes may have been demolished or cars may be buried in the mud, wolf, as they don't look for victims. the next news conference, we hope to get more information in the next two hours. latest information we have is 16 are confirmed dead and additional eight remain in the mud not yet recovered, wolf. >> our heart goes out to all those folks. thanks so much, george howell reporting. it's now thursday morning, the sun is up in western australia. stand by. we'll have an update on the latest from the search area from malaysian airlines flight 370. it's a growing trend in business: do more with less with less energy. hp is helping ups do just that. soon, the world's most intelligent servers, designed by hp, will give ups over twice the performance,

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take another quick look at the breaking news in the mystery of flight 370. the search for debris is resuming with a very specific new target, 122 objects spotted by satellite in the southern indian ocean. experts call this a credible lead that could, i repeat could lead to a break in the case. those planes are taking off right now. meanwhile conflicting reports about the investigation into the captain of flight 370, cnn sources say there's no hard evidence to suggest the pilot was solely responsible. the newspaper "usa today" is reporting police in malaysia are focusing in on their suspicions the pilot deliberately diverted the plane. that investigation continuing.

remember, you can always follow us on twitter, tweet me @wolf blitz blitz blitzer. thanks for watching. erin burnett "outfront" starts right now. next breaking news investigators focusing on a pilot and co-pilot tonight. what exactly happened in the cockpit of mh-370. the usa day report says the pilot was to blame. new satellite images shows 122 objects floating in the water. and breaking news from the pentagon tonight new intelligence just coming in showing russia close to invading. let's go "outfront". good evening, everyone. i'm erin burnett. we begin "outfront" with the breaking news. the