>> we need to improve black boxes and technology and learn more about the ocean and the deep and the ocean floor. thank you for joining us. all my guests and analysts and experts here. experts here. "ac360" starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com >> the first dive by a high-tech sonar subwise aborted in the middle of the mission. we'll tell you why. and we're learning about a cell phone transmission from the plane itself. it came from the cockpit. and a killer take there's lives at two jewish facilities outside kansas city a day before passover. and breaking news on ebola. is it a single international flight from arriving here. we'll have the latest on the crisis in the ukraine.

we begin with the breaking news from the indian ocean. day one, using the underwater sonar scanning submersible bluefin-21. in a moment we'll take you down with it so you can see for yourself what it sees. first, though, the u.s. naval officer who is heading up bluefin operation. captain mark matthews. supervisor of salvage and diving. the bluefin spent six out of a possible 16 hours searching the seabed today. why was that? >> that's correct. it aborted its mission at about the six-hour point. what this vehicle was programmed to do was maintain an altitude of 30 meters while conducting a sigh-scan search of the area. one condition that aborts the dive is if it reaches its

maximum operating depth of 4500 meters. that's what happened in this case. the charted depth is between 4200 to 4400 meters in that rectangle that it is searching. we hit a deeper spot that when initially planned. we have to bring it up, reprogram it, shift away from that deeper area and adjust the search pattern. >> the bluefin is being used in the most-likely spot. what makes that the most-likely spot? is there other data that is pointing to that particular location? >> the information that tells us is the nature of the detection from the towed pinger locator we had in that area. it was the site of the highest signal strength or the loudest received signal. it is also where we had an

increase of signal strength as we drove into the area, gaining and losing the contact as we expect. and additional factor pointing us in that direction is the oil slick that was observed the other day. we are analyzing the water sample to see if it was a petroleum product related to the aircraft. and there's many possible sources of an oil sheen on the surface of the ocean. but it's -- you know, would be one explanation is that it was lubricating fluid or control oil from the aircraft. >> so just so i understand on the aborting the bluefin today, it's not manually controlled? it's just automatically set at a certain depth? >> you want a good signal return. so you program it to maintain a certain altitude. and you program it before it

goes in the water. you have rudimentary communication between the vehicle and the ship, giving the position where the vehicle is at you can command it to abort or start a certain pattern that you have programmed. >> are you seeing things? realtime from the vehicle or just data you get once it comes back up? >> so once you recover the vehicle you go through a four-hour process where you replace the batteries and download the data you collected. and you take two to four hours to go through the data and see what the vehicle observed. there's no live data link transmitting the information. >> do you have a sense of the area you're looking at based on the four pings that you did receive over time how big an area are you talking about and how long would it take the underwater vehicle, the bluefin that you have, to scan that entire area? >> so it would take approximately six weeks to two

months to cover that whole entire area. right now what we're doing is we're targeting specific areas based on the information we received from the towed pinger locator giving us an indication of higher probability areas or priority areas to search in. this is a tactical search. >> do you believe you have pings from two separate -- i know you can't say for sure they are black boxes but from two separate man-made devices? >> the best indication we have is we've got a very crisp indication that it's a man-made transmitter, at least one. so i'm more confident saying one than two. >> good to talk to you, thanks very much. let's bring in our panel. david soucie. david gallo.

777 captain and aviation analyst, les abend. and mary schiavo. david gallo is it a surprise that it retched its underwater depth? >> not a surprise to me. they are operating on the edge of their capabilities. much of the sea floor is right at 4500 meters. if they come into the south they are on the flank of an underwater plateau, it's more rugged. but they have the maps too. i don't know the accuracy of the maps they have. >> if they seem to be caught by surprised by this trench or depth does it indicate they don't have a good sense of the floor and what they're dealing with? >> it's tough to get down to that detail.

angus houston must have seen some map but there can be crevices and gullies. and the fact they are tracking the terrain. they are keeping 30 meters above the sea floor. if the sea floor takes a dive so does the vehicle. >> there is a crunch depth for the vehicle. the pressure could -- >> my understanding is that 4500 is their comfortable operating depth and they could get down to 4900. but you don't want to go near that boundary. >> it does raise the question whether they will be experiencing this kind of aborted mission frequently. >> it does. and i don't know if david knew how deep it was. and i heard him saying the programming of it. what other programming things have to be reset when it comes back up. we were talking about doing 18 square miles a day. at this rate there's no way they

get that. >> mary, what do you take of this oil slick that will take a couple days to analyze? what do you make of it? >> well, i think it's a little late in terms of the number of days to still be existent this close to where the wreckage is. and whether it changed viscosity and floated away. but the good thing if it's jet fuel or lubricants or hydraulic fluid. they are specific to aviation. there are separate oil companies and they will know whether it's aviation or maritime lubricants. >> does anyone know what's involved in trying to determine if it is fuel from this plane or even just aviation fuel? >> a spectral analysis is what is usually used. on this aircraft you have a monitoring of that oil.

when it comes in they send it out to see if there is a break down of those oils. >> why would there be oil in the water? >> well, the engines on these rolls royce engines have 20 quarts a side. but you don't need much in a jet engine. it could be slowly dripping up to the surface. they're saying an oil slick. i wonder if it is just a fluid slick. it could be hydraulics. >> it's not something necessarily that would have been on the surface from the plane hitting the water. it could be coming up from the bottom. >> right. >> the arizona in pearl harbor is still leaking to this day almost 75 years later. >> this is a synthetic oil as well. it's different than a standard oil. but nonetheless it's lighter, yet, than the water is.

>> but certainly if that was the case and a question of bubbling up, it would give you a relatively clear sense of locate, wouldn't it? >> there are currents going in every direction but it's it would be close. it would be nearby, for sure. >> the other issue on the -- the possibility of this cell phone -- i don't know why i'm blanking on this. the cell phone pinging. does it surprise you to hear that? >> what surprises me is that we only got one. i'm not sure if they're just not telling us there were others or focussing on the co-pilot's phone. if it's just one it's very suspicious and awkward. i can't figure out why there would be one phone that would connect. >> we're going to examine that in our coming segment as well. we have to get a sense how low

you would have to be flying. they only have one side-scanning sonar right now. is this the right piece of equipment. i don't understand why not have multiple? >> you heard captain matthews say this is a tactical survey. they thought they could throw the dart a right at the bulls-eye. they got an area instead of a point to throw the dart at. we did things differently with air france. we said let's start to the west and sweep all the way to the east. >> and you had three? >> we had three vehicles at once. >> there's no reason you can't have multiple vehicles. >> they could do that. but he mentioned going to high probability areas. what we would rather do is start with a wide area. instead of doing a three by fire area, let's do a six by six area and if the aircraft is there

we'll see it. >> and what is happening in that first six hours of data what is happening to it? >> a lot of people staring at a couple of screens watching. it's a water fall display. line by line by line every second a ping and is painting a picture line by line like a tapestry. they are waiting for that to see what the texture -- what are they going to see on the bottom? rocks, sediment or something manmade sitting there. >> we're going to have more on the conversation just after the break, more on the bluefin itself. and in a "ac360" exclusive we'll see how it works. >> on board the rv resolution we have come here to see how the bluefin auv operates.

>> auvs like the bluefin-21 are the tool you use to conduct a wide area side-scan survey. >> bluefin robotics designs and builds these vehicles in quincy, massachusetts. >> if this were a mission what would it be doing? >> the radio instructions would be received and the vehicle would say i'm going to start. the propeller would spin up and it would dive. >> in the boston harbor the water is 40 feet deep. this autonomous vehicle is used to working in depths several miles below the surface. the bluefin-21 can dive two and a half miles. but flight 370's wreckage in the indian ocean may be deeper than that. it takes about two hours for the bluefin to reach the bottom where it can operate for another 16 hours. it scans the ocean floor as it

is mowing a lawn using side-scan sonar which identifies objects which stand out from the seabed. >> it's not taking pictures, right? it's measuring sound. >> converting sound to electricity and turning that into a numerical value and then into an image. >> when it returns to the surface, the scientists download the data to computers. the results may look something like this. >> this is a ship wreck in boston harbor. you can see there is parts of a steam engine right there. >> if something catches their eye, the navy will send down a high resolution camera. it can take black and white photos. it's a slow process moving at 3 nautical miles per hour made worse by horrendous conditions, freezing temperatures,

mountainous terrain and complete darkness. but even diving blind there is much hope that the bluefin-21 auv will see something. randy kaye, cnn, quincy, massachusetts. >> amazing technology. you follow me on twitter tonight. coming up next we'll look more at the cell phone transmission from flight 370's flight deck. reports about that and what it could mean. we'll be right back. t they're g, get married, have a couple of kids, [ children laughing ] move to the country, and live a long, happy life together where they almost never fight about money. [ dog barks ] because right after they get married, they'll find some financial folks who will talk to them about preparing early for retirement and be able to focus on other things, like each other, which isn't rocket science. it's just common sense. from td ameritrade. it's just common sense. we did a 27-point inspection on your chevy,ce,

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mission was aborted after six hours. and as far as we knew up to this point not one single cell phone trach transmission had been received. but there was something that came from hamid's phone itself. whether anyone said anything on it could speak volumes. pamela brown joins right now. what are you hearing about the co-pilot's cell phone being on during the flight? >> we are learning from sources with knowledge of the investigation that the first officer's phone was not turned off like it should have been and was on 30 minutes after the plane communications shut off. this is according to information that malaysian shared with u.s. investigators a while ago. and that data is from a cell tower from penang, malaysia 250

miles from where that plane turned around indicating it detected a signal from the first officer's phone. >> there is no confirmation of calls that were made. >> that's right. officials have been pouring over phone records. and there is no indication that anyone placed a phone call on that plane. the transport minister in malaysia wouldn't rule out the possibility that he tried to make a call and that is a possibility. we just don't know. >> does it raise suspicions even more about what was going on in the cockpit? how are investigators looking at it? >> it adds to the mystery and refocuses attention back on the cockpit. it says that the phone was turned on and that the plane did indeed turn around and it was flying low enough to connect with a cell tower but it doesn't tell us who was alive or dead or tell us a motive. it is curious because experts say that crews are supposed to

turn off their phones in the cockpit. it's rare for the phones to be on when they are flying. and this is malaysian sharing information with the u.s. we don't know how reliable this data is. >> i guess this means that the plane was flying low enough to be picked up by a cell tower. does this mean that no one else on the flight had their phone on? >> at this point the information that was shared with u.s. investigators was focused on the first officer's cell phone being detected by the cell tower, anderson. there is a possibility that the passengers phones could have been on. but at this point, the only information we have is that the first officer's phone was detected. >> i appreciate it. we will be running through a scenario in just a moment about how low the plane would have to be. les, do you buy this?

are you skeptical about this? >> i'm really skeptical. >> why? >> number one on or checklist we have to shut off our device. i don't know whether the co-pilot had it off or left it on. we have all left our cell phones on. but this is the violation of thester ill period. >> what is that? >> this is the period we should be talking about cockpit operations below 10,000 feet or any activity flying the airplane. generally in the u.s. it's below 10,000. but like you brought up, anderson why were -- had the handshake, it doesn't make any sense to me. and why would the co-pilot use this form of communication for various scenarios. if he was locked out of the cockpit on a nefarious scenario, possibly. but he would not know where he was. >> we just don't know what could

be behind it. >> the fact it was a brief one and never made a connection would be typical if it is flying over a chelf flying too fast to communicate but just made a connection. did it make a connection or try to transmit? we don't know. >> mary, even though the instinct is that it wouldn't make sense for the co-pilot to turn on his cell phone there is nothing that makes sense about this tragedy so far. it could have been that he was trying to make contact. we simply don't know. >> sure. it could make sense if you had a catastrophic event just after they said "good night malaysian 370" and they had a catastrophic event that took out communication. the pilot could have said i'm going to go down low we don't want to go back into air space as unidentified aircraft. he could have had a scenario

like that. will there are a million you could think of. maybe they were trying to contact somebody. and couldn't. >> and also why wouldn't anybody's phones on the plane have been on? >> we've been on flights -- >> everybody -- >> exactly. so it's curious. >> particularly if there was something going wrong on the aircraft. with you have been getting tweets about this from the beginning, why weren't there cell phone calls and the information we always had up until now was, they were never within range of a -- of contact that would pick up a cell phone call. but if this report is true and they were close enough to pick one up from penang then other people on board that plane with phones on should be able to pick it up. >> i think there would have been awareness. you would have lights on outside the airplane. people would have been aware

that something would be have been happening that wasn't correct. >> we will show you what it looked like from inside the cockpit and what would have brought the plane there to get that signal. and what we are learning about the three whose lives were taken in an attack aimed at killing jewish people the day before one of the faith's holiest days. so we talked about her options. her valuable assets were staying. and selling her car wouldn't fly. we helped sydney manage her debt and prioritize her goals, so she could really turn up the volume on her dreams today...and tomorrow. so let's see what we can do about that... remodel. motorcycle. [ female announcer ] some questions take more than a bank. they take a banker. make a my financial priorities appointment today. because when people talk, great things happen.

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we've been talking about the information that flight 370's co-pilot may have had his cell phone on indicating that the plane but low enough and close enough to a cell phone tower to make a connection. it opens the door to a variety

of possibilities and it helps to explore them just as investigators are taking a look inside a 777 simulator. if this report is accurate and it's based on pamela brown's u.s. source's with information they got from malaysian law enforcement sources. the co-pilot's cell phone did make contact with a cell tower in penang in malaysia. how low would the plane have to be flying for that to happen? >> that's a good question. let's show you. we are flying over penang and dropping now from 10,000 to about 5,000 feet it. begins with a steep turn, a bank, ankle. and also, into a strong descent. you know, we're thinking that of course initially when the aircraft went off course it was at 35,000 feet over the south china sea and night, not

daylight. so it seems to fit the story that the aircraft turned back went over the northern part of the malaysian peninsula and was descending and when it got to penang it could have been 5,000 to 4500 feet and at that point this connection was made. there are reports who say 3,000 feet and others who say 15,000 feet. it's difficult for the simulator to tell you the exact altitude to be at but it fits with what had been reported earlier but it's the weird thing is why was it on? >> although it is lower than earlier reports. and a 777 flying over penang, malaysia at 5,000 feet is pretty noticeable, isn't it? >> that's a recreational area. that's a resort type area. it's going to make some noise, yeah. that's why the whole thing adds

more to the riddle. >> people would notice it? >> yeah, even at night. >> and it's unusual for a co-pilot to be using his cell phone while in the cockpit particularly at this stage of the flight? >> yeah, i mean, mitchell can talk more about this. but this fits into the whole sterile cockpit thing. >> you should be focused on your task especially below 10,000 feet. it's unheard of be to be on the phone. >> the cell phones are shut off. the pilots know that. it's not something you forget. >> it's per the checklist. it's on the checklist. >> if this was on, what does that say to you? >> it says to me that something abnormal happened. it was outside of the standard operating procedure which is in itself rare and unusual. >> just out the window of the plane. is that the ground that you are -- as you were turning just

there is that the ground that we see there? >> yeah, yeah. you can -- at 4900 feet doing about 238 knots. you could be over the water somewhat and still presumably connect with a cell phone tower. i don't know the geometry, but that would be possible in theory. >> the other -- >> exactly how this happens we don't know. >> and the other question is that this would be the only phone that thoopd be on an a plane of 239 people is virtually impossible. >> but what they are doing is focusing on the investigation for the co-pilot. they had that cell phone number and checking against the records. are they checking for every cell phone that was on there? other cell phones are probably connecting to this tower. >> you would think that is

something they have checked on. >> they said they did. >> i want to thank our panel and martin, thanks very much and mitchell. coming up we remember the lives cut short by a hate crime near kansas city. the victims include a man who was driving his grandson to a singing audition. both of them gunned down. also ahead, the news on the ebola outbreak of guinea. dr. sanjay gupta is there in the panic. whey they are doing to try to keep the virus from leaving the area. ♪ ...work with equity experts... who work with regional experts... that's when expertise happens. mfs. because there is no expertise without collaboration.

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. crime and punishment tonight, investigators are planning to pursue federal hate crime charges against the suspect in the shootings that left three people dead outside a jewish center this weekend. this is not a story of a coward with a gun but the story of the three people whose lives were cut short and we want to tell you about that. liam corcoran drove his grandson to the jewish community center

to join in a sing competition. he was just 14 years old. he was a high school freshman, reat was, as you will hear in this video. ♪ oh, say can you see by the dawn's early light ♪ ♪ what so proudly we hailed at -- >> his mother had this to say about the death of her son and her father -- >> i prayed and prayed and prayed that he would survive. but i've later found out why he didn't. i know they both died from head trauma and i feel confident from what i heard that they didn't feel anything. they didn't know it was coming. they were ambushed. so it's going to be really hard and i wanted to tell people that last night at the vigil. this isn't easy. >> reat's uncle also spoke about his nephew and father and why he

is not wasting time thinking about the shooter. >> it takes no character to do what was done. takes no strength of character. it takes no backbone. it takes no ethics. all it takes is an idiot with a gun. so there's no need to focus on that. >> and that's why we are not focusing on that and not using the killer's name tonight. we wanted you to know the names of those who died. terry lamano was also shot. she was a warm, loving and beautiful person. >> reporter: just hours after her father and son had been killed, mindy appeared at candle light vigil in their honor. >> i'm the mother of the boy who

was killed. >> i went to the vigil last night. i heard that individuals from reat's school would be there. he loved school a and loved his friends. >> 14-year-old reat underwood was getting out of a car when a man almost 60 years older than him ambushed him in a hail of gunfire. ♪ oh, say can you see by the dawn's early light -- >> reporter: reat underwood loved to sing. he was at the jewish community center to audition in a singing competition. his grandfather was there, too, supporting his grandson. reat's mother says he planned to perform the hit song, "cups" the lyrics, when i'm gone, you're going to miss me when i'm gone. >> i was lucky enough to hear both of those songs before he left the house. i waited and had him sing them one more time and i got to kiss

him and say i loved him. >> reporter: reat had just earned a role in a summer production of tom so youier and was a debater too. when the grandfather was not playing the role of popeye he was a doctor. he then moved to the kansas city area so he could do things like take his grandson to a sing competition. >> we don't know why bad things happen to good people. nobody does. we choose not to focus on the why or what happened or -- it really doesn't matter. to us -- the fact remains that, you know, two of the people we love most in our life are not here with us and we do take comfort that they were together.

>> reporter: terry lamano was visiting her mother at a jewish assisted living facility. she was supposed to be celebrating her 25 it's wedding anniversary. she was honored today with the words from her son. he wrote my mom was a beautiful soul. she always thought of everyone before herself. the world needs more people like her. she was a warm, loving and beautiful person. >> just so unbelievable. obviously, i mean, for the families to speak out today takes tremendous strength just one day after this horrible, violent act. did they talk about why they wanted to speak out? >> it was one of the first things they talked about. and they said that they didn't -- mindy said she didn't want to hide from this. she had go so much attention from family and friends.

they wanted to share in the grieving process. and she talked about going to the ceremony yesterday, the vigil with her son's friends and thought it was important because of. that one of the things she is hoping for is that her son, on his own accord had checked off the organ donor box and she is waiting to hear if some of the tissue or organs might be able to help save someone else life. she is hoping his legacy will carry on that way. grandfather and grandson will be memorialized saturday afternoon here. one service for both of them. >> just ahead, tears and confrontation in the blade runner murder trial. and a deadly virus with fears it could go global. dr. sanjay gupt that with a look at the crisis.

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up close tonight, breaking news on the deadly ebola

outbreak. is it a tough fight, one that officials hope does not go global. the swift and bloody killer has structure the country's capital and it is a short distance from the international airport. a person may fly to the other side of the globe and spread the virus. that has not happened but is it a concern. more than 100 people have died in the last four weeks. you can be infected with one drop of saliva or blood hitting a break in your skin. i understand the death toll is continuing to rise? >> there was some unwelcome news in regard to the numbers. since april 10th the death numbers have gone from 101 to 112.

11 more deaths now being reported just over the last few days. that's the wrong direction, anderson. a lot of the care being given to these patients is happening behind me. we have unique access here. this is the doctors without borders isolation camp trying to isolate patients. it's remarkable work they are doing and dangerous work. and just getting the testing to get these numbers that we're talking about, just getting the testing can sometimes be pretty risky. take a look. a simple blue box potentially carrying one of the most dangerous pathogens in the world going to be tested. in less than four hours we'll find out if it contains the ebola virus. simply getting the blood samples is a life threatening job. one of the workers has a

nine-month-old baby at home three. pairs of gloves, booties and layer after layer of gowns. they go in to see the patients, every inch of their bodies covered. nothing in, nothing out. even a drop of the virus can infect you and we all have breaks in our skin. this is a pain staking detail and process you have to go through to interact with the patients with ebola. this is as close as we can get. they have taken the blood samples and put them in this blue ice chest over here. it's highly suspicious that contains ebola. w.h.o. technicians have been just hand delivered the blue boxes. they will have the results just two hours from now. but a few years ago being able to test for ebola on its own

turf was impossible. blood samples had to be taken out of central africa and flown to the cdc in atlanta or the w.h.o. in geneva. pilots would not fly with the pathogens and it could take days or weeks to get the results. >> two of these are positive. >> two of the three patients now have confirmed ebola? >> yes. >> and it's incredible. i was reading your blog about this on cnn.com that the number of health care workers who have died from this because they're really the ones who are under constant exposure. in the past ebola rarely made it out of these remote areas of africa. there are now outbreaks in the capital of guinea. how big of a cause of concern is that? >> i think it's a real concern, anderson. you know, in some ways it was a

grim reality because ebola kills so many people, nine out of ten people in the past have died and because it killed so quickly it didn't spread. people would die too soon. but now, two million people here and international airport and an incubation period. it could take from 2 to 21 days after you have been exposed before you develop symptoms. could someone be on the other side of the world during that time? that's the concern. it hasn't happened anywhere in the world. it has not left africa as of yet but that's a concern. it's what the doctors are trying to prevent. get these patients the treatment they can. >> where the reservoirs and where it comes from there's so much we don't know. how contagious is the virus? you are right outside the tents and you don't have a mask on. how risky is this to you and others? >> yeah, first of all, with

regard to the mystery, you are right, 1976 is when they first identified this and we still don't know from where it comes and why it goes away. we don't know how to treat it or vaccinate it or cure it. so the more we don't know than we do know. so that's part of what adds to the fear surrounding ebola. there's a lot of science here that is important. this is not an airborne virus like the flu. me standing outside these tents, i'm really not at risk. i have studied this and feel comfortable being here. few but if you are around patients you have to cover every square inch of your skin even a drop, if it gets on your skin and there is always breaks in your skin that can cause an infection. here i'm okay. you go inside where the patients are and it's a different story. the doctors without borders, you have worked with them, they're

the ones doing this, putting the suits on and taking care of the pash patients. >> it's a great group. it's remarkable that these health care workers continue to treat patients even though 14 have died in this outbreak alone. for more information on how you can help those suffering from ebola right now go to cnn.com/impact. a russian war plane gets close to a u.s. navy ship in the black sea. the latest from the eastern ukraine. lways watch out for myself. with unitedhealthcare, i get personalized information and rewards for addressing my health risks. but she's still gonna give me a heart attack. that's health in numbers. unitedhealthcare. became big business overnight? ♪ like, really big... then expanded? ♪ or their new product tanked? ♪

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busy night for breaking news including the crisis in ukraine. at his request, vladimir putin spoke with president obama on the phone. president obama calling on mr. putin to get the russian groups to leave. a russian war plane came close making a dozen passes over a u.s. naval ship in the black sea. the tension between the ukrainian government and the progovernment accompli progovernme progovernment militias is getting worse. >> the law enforcement and police and military are nowhere to be seen despite the deadline for protesters to vacate

buildings and the threat of anti-terror operation we have seen social media video suggesting that the ukrainian army is on the move. that could be the harbinger of something to come. but the people say that the prorussian protesters. >> you talk about prorussian protesters. are these also russian troops or mercenaries is this the same play book as crimea? >> it's harder to discern who these well-trained militants are here. they are not as obviously russian servicemen as those in the crimean peninsula who had the same gear with their insignia contain off. these are trained and know what they're doing but not that same sense of them being a part of a broader force. but there are similar tactics. they are backed up by protesters who move in too.

and is it coordinated with the straw teenagic points they take. >> our coverage continues next with cnn international. welcome to our viewers in the united states and all around the world. >> coming up this hour, latest search to find the missing malaysian airlines unexpectedly cut short. tell you why this vehicle had to return to the surface hours ahead of schedule. >> also and. >> why are you getting emotional now? >> another grueling day him. we will preview the testimony which begins in just a few