help. the culture, as i was -- as i was exposed to it during '03, '04, '08, '09, a culture that action and force. it understands deeds over words. and i understand, again, watching the news, watching your reports, that iraq is looking for help. well, my experience has always been, when someone is looking for help, they will continue to ask for help until they get help. so the short anticipatswer is, think we should accepted troops in, that's really not my call. but i think there are a number of ways we can probably help the iraqi government if we deem fit. if we deem so. >> key word, if. all right, colonel king, thanks so much for joining us. thanks so much for your service to the united states. we deeply, deeply appreciate it. that's it for me. thanks very much for watching. i'll be back 5:00 p.m. eastern in swfigures "the situation

room." "newsroom"with brooke baldwin "newsroom"with brooke baldwin starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com all right, wolf of the thank you so much. it was a great interview. meantime, hi there. i'm brooke baldwin. right now, this ruthless strike force, jihadi militants fighting their way toward baghdad. so what happens? and this is the big if. if they make it to iraq's capital city? what we do know is this. is that iraq is on the verge of an all-out sectarian war. this terror group, isis, slaughtering dozens of iraqi soldiers. a mass execution in revenge for the loss of one of its commanders. american troops preparing for the worst. some 100 u.s. marines headed to the u.s. embassy in baghdad, as some embassy staffers are moved out. the obama administration also

considering talks with its long-time nemesis, iran, to look for solutions here to halt this advance of isis. joining me now our senior international correspondent, arwa damon, live in erbil, iraq. and let's begin, they're brutal. these execution videos posted by this isis fighter. can you just walk me through what we're about to see? >> reporter: it's absolutely chilling, brook. we do have to warn our viewers of that, and it really leaves no question as to why these fighters, this ideology, needs to be stopped. in this video, you see a bearded man with a gun standing over five individuals on their knees. he's calling them maliki's dogs, slapping them around. and then in another part of the video, he wants them to repeat after him. islamic state here to stay. two of the men do repeat it. they comply. the third man struggles to speak.

it's as if he's trying to formulate the words, but he can't. he seems to be very dehydrated, almost unaware as to what's happening around him. and then in a video that we cannot show at this stage, you see him dead. his jaw has been blown off. the executioner, the man with the beard, has a facebook page, brooke, and he's posted photographs to the facebook page of that execution. his name is abu hamza, tunisiat, and is boasting. of all of the photographs and videos coming out of these executions, we often don't know who the victims are. but in this case, we did manage to identify the man who couldn't speak. he was 37 years old, a father of three, brooke. he had two sons and a daughter. and according to people who knew him, he loved his children so much, he would do anything for them. in fact, the reason why he took

the job as a border guard was so that he could build them a home. brooke? >> the fact these militants have all these cameras and know exactly what they're doing, the role of propaganda and social media. we'll delve into that later this hour. but arwa, let me ask about the u.s. embassy, the largest u.s. embassy in the world, almost like its own city, a compound. what's being done to shore up the embassy in baghdad? >> reporter: well, the u.s. has historically been secretive about its own security measures. we are hearing they are taking out some of the nonessential staff, relocating them as diplomatic speak goes, sending in additional teams to try to ensure the security of the embassy. it's located well inside the very heavily fortified green zone, although at this stage, of course, the green zone's perimeter in and of itself is being protected by the iraqi security forces. although it is a unit that is very loyal to shia prime minister nouri al maliki.

there are also, as you have been reporting, preparations under way for an evacuation, should it actually reach that stage. although i can tell you, brooke, if we do reach that stage, iraq will not be able to come back and recover from that kind of violence. >> arwa damon, thank you. i see my next guest nodding, a man who knows the violence in iraq. michael holmes. how many times have you been to iraq now? >> 14 in all. went up at the beginning, and was there when the last u.s. troops came out in 2011 on the border there. and most recently there in january. >> cnn international anchor, you were there as recent as january. and just quickly, before we get into the q & a, let's take a look at the lay of the land. as we look at iraq heading toward baghdad, syria here, moving southward. >> yes. they basically -- their head quarter is here. this is syria, the border runs this way here, and that's where they were and based and doing damage to bashar al assad. now they have crossed over and heading south and gone through mosul. i've been there many times, a

huge city. and for them to take that is extraordinary. tikrit, saddam hussein's birthpla birthplace. they're in fallujah, and other places like that, knocking on the door. they're in a place that's a 45-minute drive. >> 9 million people versus what, some couple thousand militants. but the eye is on the prize, being baghdad. if you were isis, if you were this militant group, what would your targets be, typically in cases like this, it's the airport. >> yeah, absolute. and you hear isis often being described as a ragtag group of terrorists. >> do you agree with that? >> i don't think they're ragtag. i think they're very well-organized. i think they know what they're doing. they're operating in an operational way. they're operating as an army, rather than a bunch of people going around and setting roadside bombs. they seem to have a plan. yes, the airport would be -- baghdad international airport would be a prime target, because that would disrupt everything and stop people being able to get out. >> but you think they're already

there? >> well, look, you've got -- isis is already in fallujah and ramadi, parts of ramadi. again, only an hour or so from baghdad. they have been there since the end of last year, in force. running in there. they have access to baghdad. they have their way in there. look, i have heard people say there was a horrible bombing yesterday. these bombs are every day. when i was there in january -- >> you saw them. >> oh, yeah, every day. and -- two days, we had six bombs in an hour. so there are people inside baghdad now with the capability of to cause these problems. the targets were always shiite, so it was sunnis doing it. >> where did this group come from. for so many months, we, u.s., and cnn, were focusing on syria. and i'm wondering if there were almost blinders on and my producer put it almost like a snake pit of these militants. correct me. fostering, strengthening, no authority. >> yeah. >> and suddenly they're

emboldened and have this momentum. and boom, here they go. >> they were always there. they were part of the insurgency. you're talking about some brutal people, local guys. but what's happened is, they moved into syria. they're always down in anbar province, doing their thing when the u.s. took them on, did them a lot of damage. these guys regrouped, became what they are now. they went into syria, started fighting, got a lot of international fighters with them now. grew, grew, grew, got richer, as well. >> one of the towns taken last week, weren't they taken by more -- almost north african militants. from some of these videos, from what i understand, a general we're talking to later, they're using all these talking about propaganda as tools to get people from not necessarily iraq or even this region to come in to fight. >> a lot of people want to fight. if they're jihadis, they'll come from anywhere. i'll tell one statistic. the most foreign fighters in iraq during the war came from eastern libya. north africa. >> really? >> yeah. >> who is strengthening them, who is providing their money? do they even care about cold, hard cash, when they have these weapons, they use violence?

>> well, nobody knows for sure. but the thinking is that there are a lot of extremist sunni individuals, wealthy people, were places like kuwait, saudi arabia, funding these guys. they picked up $400 million in mosul, robbing banks. >> it's like the wild west. >> and they have the ability, too. because up in ruca, access to oil pipelines. some say they have a billion dollars in the bank. >> michael holmes, 14 times in iraq. come back. this story is not going anywhere. thank you so much. just ahead, i mentioned this general a moment ago. we'll talk live about why president obama's military options are not realistic at all. we'll walk through those. plus, the u.s. captured the leader of this group terrorizing iraq right now but let him go. and on his way out, he told a commanding officer, and i'm quoting him, "see you in new york." and back here at home, a father

who says the mother has kidnapped the daughter, because she doesn't want to vaccinate here. hear from the father coming up on cnn. cnn "newsroom." it's just the strangest thing... the warning signs of alzheimer's disease, may be right in front of you. it's alright baby. for help and information, call the alzheimer's association or visit alz.org/10signs peoi go to angie's listt for all kinds of reasons. to gauge whether or not the projects will be done in a timely fashion and within budget. angie's list members can tell you which provider is the best in town. you'll find reviews on everything from home repair to healthcare. now that we're expecting, i like the fact

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if you're a current or former military member or their family, get an auto insurance quote and see why 92% of our members plan to stay for life. count on cortizone-10. with the strongest, non-prescription itch medicine for fast relief. and 7 moisturizers. cortizone-10. feel the heal. welcome back to cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. i want to stay on iraq, digging deeper on the crisis and unfolding and talk with the general who commanded u.s. troops. first, take a look. another look here at images surfacing out of iraq that purport to show how fast and how easily iraq's government troops

are falling. these pictures are being posted on jihadi sites worldwide. and claim to show the execution of iraqi security forces. i should adhere, cnn cannot confirm the authenticity. but then there is this video. this was posted on youtube following piles here of iraqi forces' uniforms discarded on a sidewalk in mosul. the question many are asking, how could the iraqi military fold so quickly, considering the billions the u.s. spent training iraqi security forces, building their capabilities, et cetera? one of the people asking those very important questions is retired lieutenant general, mark hurt ling who served from 2007 to 2008. general, welcome. >> good afternoon, brooke. >> let's just begin, quite simply, with the cities where you were headquartered, mosul and tikrit and now in the hands of these militants. you're watching this unfold, changing every day. general, your impressions. >> well, my impressions are

first of all, you're right. it's difficult. we haven't just been -- for those of us who have served there, we don't just focus on this when the crises occur. we have been watching northern iraq, because we have left a part of ourselves there. they were stationed -- our headquarters in tikrit. my responsibility was for all of the north. and in that responsibility, we trained five iraqi army divisions that are actually getting some of the heat for giving up their uniforms, turning down their weapons. but i think there have been many contributions to why this occurred. part of it is the fact they're dealing with the worst of the worst sunni extremists. al baghdadi is an evil, evil guy. and -- >> his group, isis. >> correct. and i think that's contributed significantly. and as michael holmes said a minute ago, they have a strategy, an operational plan. this is not a bunch of ragtag individuals. >> that's exactly what he said. they are smarter than the world wishes they were. and let me point out this "washington post" op-ed you

wrote recently, outlining sort of how the iraqi military really folded. and just to quote you, one of your examples, even before the u.s. forces left, american-trained leaders were being replaced with more and more favored officers from sects, tribes, weren't chosen for their competency, abig mistake. that's the title of your piece, "iraq is crumbling." you offer up a myriad of solutions but nouri al maliki isn't adapting. is his inability to lead proof enough that the u.s. must get involved? >> well, and that's the thing. i think the president's national security team is faced with some very difficult choices. and there are no easy answers. and there are certainly no right answers, brooke. this is a situation where if you go in and back up the government of iraq, you're basically backing up an individual who has caused some of the problems by his actions over the last several years. mr. maliki has not been as

inclusive as he should have been with the sunnis and the kurds. now, that doesn't account for the extremists we're seeing leading the attack. but it might account for how these individuals might be supported. the iraqi heartland in the north and in the west are certainly supporting, whether they want to or not, some of these extremist forces because of both the pressure and the violence, but also because they have seen their central government not care much about the inclusion of the other sects within iraq. >> so if you don't necessarily want to bolster this leadership, what are your options if you're the president of the united states? >> let me revert back to my earlier statement. there are no easy -- >> right. i hear you loud and clear. >> no right solutions. the problem is, the president is faced with a couple of conundrums. first of all, can he support maliki, and against sunni extremists and perhaps some people who are less than extreme. and cause problems in other parts of the world.

as arwa said before, maybe saudi arabia, kuwait, uae. these are sunni republics. or does he not do anything and upset the entire shia world. what are the kurds reacting. and what are the ways they're reacting to this whole situation. so, again, no easy, no quick solutions. for those of you -- for those of your listeners who would suggest, well, let's just go in and use f-16s or unmanned aerial drones, that might help in a couple specific and unique instances. but that certainly isn't a war-winner. we had many more air force and uavs when we had a hundred plus thousand troops and it was still difficult fighting terrorists. . >> what would change the balance of power on the ground? >> it's not going to happen quickly, that's for sure. >> sure. >> but i think as others have said, we've got to bring the politicians together. this is not an army problem.

it has been perceived to be an army problem, because of the way the divisions of the iraqi army faded away. but they faded away because of a reason. and that's because of a lack of support by the government, and some sectarian divides within the country. it's a very challenging culture, and we can't just look at the army as being the issue here. it is how the army was supported. >> i understand. >> by the government and by the people. >> you said at the top of the interview, i jotted it down, you left part of yourself there some time ago. quickly, did you at any point predict this would happen? >> of course not. i don't think anyone predicted this will happen. although there have been some indicators in the last year that this kind of violence could occur. general flynn gave a briefing in january, saying this could happen, and he thought it would happen in 2014. but he tint think it would happen this quickly. going back to leaving a part of yourself there. i think all soldiers who fought and families of those who made the ultimate sacrifice are watching this very closely, and they're thinking, was it all for

naught. it wasn't. we gave iraq the chance. yeah. we gave them the chance, and i think to a degree it was squandered. but it could potentially be regained, but it will take smart people to figure out how. >> we'll be watching for those smart people. general hertling, thank you so much. coming up, with iraq on the brink of a potential civil war, iran offers to help the u.s. but how smart is it for the u.s. to do business with iran? we'll talk about that. also ahead, a woman is facing federal charges for allegedly kidnapping her own daughter. she is on the run, because she says she doesn't want to vaccinate her 2-year-old child. stay right here. 2 for $25 guest favorites! get your all-time favorites like creamy chicken alfredo. plus unlimited salad and breadsticks and dessert. 2 for $25 guest favorites at olive garden.

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a florida mother has taken a stand against vaccines by taking her toddler and going on the run. the fbi has just charged megan everett with flight to avoid prosecution. just last month, the state of florida charged her with kidnapping. here's the story. everett and the father of his 2-year-old lilly share custody. on the day everett was supposed to drop lilly off, the father found a letter from everett instead, according to court documents, and in part, this is what it read. quote, i love you and lilly loves you. you are a great dad. if i let them take her and vaccinate her and brain wash her, i wouldn't be doing what's right. i cannot let a judge tell me how my daughter should be raised. we will miss you. but i have to leave. >> my daughter deserves to be safe and happy and i don't believe being on the run is, you

know -- psychologically okay for a 2-year-old. i do fear for my daughter's life. i do fear she is not in a safe place. you know, she gets injured, i don't feel she would seek medical attention. >> cnn legal analyst and mom, sunny hostin, joins me here. clearly, this mother thinks what she is doing is in the best interest of her child. that said, would prosecutors give her mom -- this mom any lenience because of that? >> reporter: not at all. now we're talking about a kidnapping case. and we're also talking about a father who clearly disagrees with that. most courts, brooke, do agree, you have to decide these cases based on what's in the best interest the of the child. but certainly, kidnapping, as the father just said, is never in the best interest of a child. and the fact that she disagrees with having her child vaccinated is one thing. we have all debated that at one time or another. >> could that be used against her? >> reporter: you know, i think that what is going to be used against her is the fact she sort

of flouted these court orders, this custody agreement, and took her child. but i will tell you, this is a debate that moms have often. this vaccination debate has been in the forefront, i think, ever since, you know, jenny mccarthy for years sort of came out against it. and i will tell you, there is no federal vaccination law that doesn't exist. but each state does require certain vaccinations and immunizations for public schools. if you want to put your child in school. but there are always exemptions. and that's something this mother could have done. there are medical -- >> there are exemptions. she should follow those paths. >> absolutely. there are exemptions, medical exemptions. there are philosophical exemptions, believe it or not. personal belief exemptions. so the law does provide for situations like this when a mom doesn't want to vaccinate her child. but you cannot just kidnap your child. and i think what is really interesting, in the note she left, she said, "you are a great dad."

well, the court is going to look at that and say, so he's a great dad -- >> right. >> but you are still taking his child away from him. it's not going to end well, i think, for this mother when and if and hopefully they do find this child. >> hopefully they do. we'll follow up when they do. sunny hostin, thanks so much. and just ahead the u.s. captured the leader of this group terrorizing iraq but left him go. and on his way out, told a senior officer "see you in new york". and the u.s. and iran have similar interests in taking down these militants. will they talk? christiane amanpour joins me live. don't miss it. spokesperson: the volkswagen passat is heads above the competition, but we're not in the business of naming names. the fact is, it comes standard with an engine that's been called the benchmark of its class. really, guys, i thought... it also has more rear legroom than other midsize sedans. and the volkswagen passat has a lower starting price than...

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bottom of the hour. you're watching cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. iraq. iraq says it killed some 200 hard core islamist fighters in air strikes west of baghdad. the dead are said to include a commander. the militants, though, are reported to have captured at least two more cities, and to have ambushed some of those iraqi shiite volunteers who have taken up arms to try to stop them before they get to baghdad. but the really big news here, which could actually rearrange the whole idea equation over there, the united states and

iran. think about it. long-time foes, are talking about joining forces to try to stop the killing. and that would represent a dramatic shift. so you know the whole world is watching this one. here is john carey. >> let's see what iran might or might not be willing to do before we start making any pronouncements. i think we are open to any constructive process here that could minimize the violence, hold iraq together, the integrity of the country. and eliminate the presence of outside terrorist forces that are ripping it apart. if -- obviously, americans feel powerfully about not putting boots back on the ground in iraq. so we'll consider what options are available to us. but you cannot allow that march, i think. i mean, it's our basic judgment of most people in the region that you can't just let them run whole hog over the country for any number of reasons. >> so you heard him there.

secretary kerry saying, you cannot have isis running wild in iraq, so you might -- you find yourself teaming up with iran. he did mention air strikes as another possible option. but again, iran. just for good measure, another round of talks over iran's nuclear program began today in vienna. and at least one report says the top american diplomat, william j. burns, might mention iraq with the iranians at those talks later this week. christiane amanpour with me now live from washington. she, of course, our chief international correspondent. and christiane, the u.s. and iran here, fierce rivals since iran's islamic revolution. what would cooperation even look like at we're talking about iraq? >> reporter: well that, would be the huge question. i don't think anybody envisions the u.s. air force being air cover for iranian revolutionary guards on the ground. that doesn't seem to be something that's within the realm of possibility at the moment. so that is a real question. what kind of cooperation would it take. but don't forget that iran has,

in fact, cooped wirated with th united states before. for instance, just after 9/11, just around when the united states went into afghanistan to dislodge and defeat al qaeda and the taliban. and also in the post political solution for afghanistan. so there has been a cooperation there. but by the same token, there is a huge amount of conflict between the u.s. and iran over syria. they both back the different sides. but they both have a common interest in making sure some terrorist group like an al qaeda offshoot, which isis is, gaining even part control and foothold in iraq. it's a huge big deal, this. it's redrawing borders in the region for the first time, you know, in practically a hundred years. and isis has been empowered by the festering wound that is syria. and nothing has been done to stop that. and it's been able to cross border into iraq. and do what it's doing there now. >> so as it is this huge deal, and i'm sure you being in

washington, you understand, talking to people, how this is a big deal. when americans hear this, they say wait, hang on a second, you the u.s., talking to iran? by the same token, let me ask you this. how do iran's leaders explain to their people they may, and this is the may, be cozying up to as they have put before, the great satan, the u.s.? >> reporter: i don't think there's any cozying doing here. and both do have some very, very hard challenges in this regard of trying to persuade people that this is in each side's national interest and vital interest at the moment. that's up to the politicians to figure that out. on the truth is, though, what actually can be done. that is a hard question that they're going to have to grapple with. i just talked to iraq's ambassador to washington, and he said we have no time for discussion. something has to happen right now to halt the advance of isis. they don't believe that isis can take baghdad. and not many u.s. commanders

believe that either, because baghdad is so massive. 7 to 9 million people. now, unfortunately, has become sectarian, mostly shiites in some major parts of the city. and they presume the defenses of baghdad would be much, much stronger than they have been in other towns and cities like mosul, tikrit and elsewhere. but you do have this situation that many people are just beginning to wonder whether they're going to have to accept. and that is a de facto end of iraq as we know it. a partition of iraq. kurds, the west al qaeda-like rump statelette, and then shia dominated baghdad and on down south. and that is in nobody's interest, brooke. >> one scenario, it's been thrown out before, and you mention syria a moment ago. and christiane amanpour, i mean, talk about irony. barack obama, iran's rowhani, syria's assad. all three of these faces on the screen have the same foe. these isis militants who, as you

pointed out, crossed from syria into iraq wishes leads to another bit of irony. these isis terrorists are the same guys, you know, calling freedom fighters as long as they're attacking assad and not our ally, iraq? no? >> reporter: no, they're not freedom fighters by any stretch of the imagination. isis and al qaeda is a threat to everybody. everybody. and we've seen it. they are not the freedom fighters. the people who the united states have identified as moderate opposition are different. those are the people who the u.s. and others have identified inside syria, who actually are battling isis, and the jihadi al qaeda like groups there, which is one reach we're told they haven't made as many in roads against assad recently, because they have been stretched with no support on a two-front war against the al qaeda isis types, and trying to battle assad, as well. >> but when it comes to isis, wouldn't rowhani, assad and the u.s. be on the same side?

>> yes. because as i said, nobody wants isis anywhere. because that is an al qaeda-like extensional threat. and that is why -- but don't confuse isis with the moderate opposition in syria. that's all i'm saying. and top u.s. commanders are now saying that it may now be the time to start draining that swamp in syria. because there is no border anymore between that part of syria and iraq. and these al qaeda-type groups isis, one of them, is moving across with impunity. and look what it's done now. claimed a really large piece of territory as its rump statelette. whether it can hold on to it or not, we'll have to wait and see. but one option is to really arm and equip the moderate opposition in syria and see if they can by force of arms create some kind of political resolution in syria, and drain the swamp so that these isis people don't have any room to maneuver in syria, at least. >> christiane amanpour, your expertise is invaluable. thank you so much. especially in this part of the world.

and you're in washington. we need to make sure we watch christiane tomorrow night, moderating the cnn town hall event with hillary clinton. and you can watch that live tomorrow at 5:00 p.m. with a replay at 9:00 eastern. do not miss it. christiane amanpour. coming up next, i'll see you in new york. that is what the leader of the terror group causing chaos in iraq said when he was released from are u.s. custody back in 2009. wolf blitzer just talked to the man who heard those words. wolf will join me next. and later, a pilot who flew skydiving missions but had never been on a skydive himself, had to make an emergency jump. the only problem, once again, never jumped out of a plane before. we'll talk to him live in a minute. but first, one of cnn's newest family members, mike roe made a name for himself by getting dirty. he'll impact your world. during his eight seasons of "dirty jobs," mike learned all about the hard working men and women keeping america running.

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let me show you this picture and just take a good long look at it. because you will see abu back . "time" calls him the most dangerous man in the world. but did you realize that al

baghdadi here was once in u.s. custody held at camp bucca in iraq for four years when he was released in 2009. his parting words, apparently, to the camp's commanding officer were this. "i'll see you in new york." last hour, that commanding officer talked to our own wolf blitzer, right here on cnn. >> we had many of the most dangerous folk in the world there at camp bucca. and we had them in a certain area, identified them and put them in a certain compound. to be honest, he was not in that compound. he did exhibit certain events, and he did exhibit certain tendencies and behaviors. but while he was dangerous, he was not one of the most dangerous, at least at the time. >> wolf blitzer joining me to talk a little bit about that interview. and i'm just curious off the top, did colonel king even understand what al baghdadi meant at the time when he said that? >> he said to me he thought, you know, the unit -- the reserve unit that colonel king was responsible for, a bunch of guys from long island, camp bucca, named after a firefighter who

died on 9/11 at the world trade center. and so when he uttered the words, and i think the precise quote was, "i'll see you guys in new york." the assumption -- he didn't take it as a direct threat, although now colonel king said to me, he sees it with hindsight as a direct threat, referring to another 9/11 in new york, something along those lines. he didn't really appreciate how determined, how sophisticated and how passionate this al baghdadi was as far as creating this new terrorist organization designed to go after not only targets in syria and iraq and elsewhere, but also the united states. >> do we know why the u.s. let him go in 2009? >> the assumption was, he was being released. he was being handed over after four years in u.s. captivity at this military prison at camp bucca in iraq. handed over to the iraqi government in 2009, because the u.s. was beginning its process of withdrawing and the iraqi government was going to take charge of these dangerous prisoners. and so they assume, when he was

sent to another military -- iraqi military prison, they would take care of him. he didn't appreciate, didn't realize the iraqi government of nouri al maliki was going to release these guys fairly quickly and they were released. >> and now he is the most dangerous man in the world right now. we just got word the president of the united states, will be meeting with his national security team tonight. do we presume they will be talking iraq? >> they are -- according to the white house officials, there are fundamental options, military options, on the table. the president flying back from a weekend in california. he gets back to washington late this afternoon, early evening. he's going to go into a meeting at the white house with his top national security advisers, and they're going to review what the white house is now suggesting are fundamental military options. we don't know what the president is going to decide, if he's going to decide on a specific military plan. but we do know, there are a lot of options, including drone strikes, air strikes, the only thing the president so far, as you know, brooke, has ruled out is boots on the ground. u.s. troops going back into

iraq. but other than that, there will be a various options at the disposal of the president. he wants the iraqi government, nouri al maliki, the prime minister, to do the right thing. take the steps he's refused to take over the past few years since the u.s. withdrawal. and i think the ball is really in nouri al maliki's court. >> wolf blitzer, see you at 5:00 eastern on "the situation room." thank you, sir. and one note to all of you. anderson cooper is currently on the ground in iraq. he will be reporting from baghdad on the crisis there. watch anderson live tonight from baghdad, ac 360 tonight, 8:00 eastern. much more on our special coverage, of course, on iraq. but coming up, a pilot is forced to make his very first skydiving jump from a crashing plane. we'll talk to him live about those moments before his brush with death. d it doesn't even fl. we build it in classrooms and exhibit halls, mentoring tomorrow's innovators. we build it raising roofs, preserving habitats and serving america's veterans.

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at age 21, a pilot in the st. louis area has risen to the challenges of the job like few others before him. take a look. that was the plane he was flying in saturday. normally wreckage not the sign of a skilled pilot. but in sean martin's case, actually a testament to how well he can perform under life threatening pressure, because he watched his plane crash after jumping out of it. this was his very first skydive. so what a story. i had had to talk to you, sean ken martin, joining me live from carmendale, illinois and chad myers to talk altitude and when you should and shouldn't jump. sean, glad you're a-ok. and you're a pilot who flies this plane for fly free skydiving. but you choose not to jump, at least before saturday. can you just tell me, when you're looking out of the plane and thinking about it over the weekend, what was going through your mind? >> well, just when it initially happened, of course, i had a fear that it was the sky diver

himself who hit. so, of course, i was afraid on his condition. but it turned out he actually didn't hit himself. it was just his equipment. so that was a good thing. it was a relief for me to know no one got hurt and it was equipped that caused the damage to my aircraft. so that was a relief when i found that out. but when it first happened, i was thinking to myself, like, okay, what's kind of going on? like, all right, what's wrong? what do i need to do type thing. and as i started going through my head, the normal procedures for losing my flight controls. >> so because this sky diver, his equipment, had hit the plane, you're sort of losing control or you're realizing quickly you can't land the plane. either you go down with the plane or you use that parachute. did you just so happen to have a parachute, or did you always have to have one just per -- >> we always operate with one as a pilot. so we always go up with a parachute on, so -- >> okay. so sean, you've got to explain to me, though. what this quick decision was to

finally say, i'm jumping. >> well, it actually took some time. of course, when it initially happened, i had sustained the damage, but was able to level the aircraft off, but i had no other elevator control after that. so i couldn't climb the aircraft or descend the aircraft. the only way i could get down was pulling the power out and having the aircraft slowly descend that way. so in that case, when i was doing it, i was thinking about making the emergency landing and going through those procedures. now, i was contacting the radio over on festus and the owner was able to hear it over there. so he got into a plane with another pilot, they came up as i was coming down. and they viewed the damage, and they reassured my fears that i was going to have no elevator control to even perform a landing. so at that case, we decided that it was the right decision for me to actually jump out. so i made it all the way down to about 2,500 feet, and at that point, we -- i decided to circle over to illinois to the

farmlands there, because i wanted to get away from festus and crystal city. >> just in case, heaven forbid. and let me jump in. you mentioned 2,500 feet, chad myers. that's way low for someone wanting to jump out of -- >> you did not -- you did not have a lot of time to think about that. it the chute open right away for you? >> yeah. i pulled the handle as soon as i knew i was clearing the aircraft, pulled the handle as hard as i could. >> absolutely. now, everybody wants to know. this happened on saturday. thank you sleep in a holiday inn express on friday night? >> no. i actually did not. i slept at home. but yeah, i was definitely ready to go for saturday. >> sean, did you -- do you do this again? voluntarily? or are you finished with skydiving forever? >> no, actually i'm not finished skydiving. with the place i fly for, fly free skydiving, i want to do a tandem skydive with them and have the full experience from

11,000. and, of course, have the plane make it down to the runway. >> amazing. sean kinmartin, phenomenal story. glad you were able to share with us today. >> trying to take some of the urgency away from the president. the president this week is 90. good job, sean. well done. >> thank you. and coming up next, we turn the page to breaking news on the urgent situation in iraq. officials now telling cnn the specific military options the president will be deciding between. we'll analyze the different options as we're just getting word what they may be right after this.

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in just over three hours, team usa faces its first test at the world cup in brazil. they will face ghana and what could be a must-win game for both teams. the u.s. looking for redemption after losing to ghana in the last world cup tournaments, last two. both teams need to win, since their next opponents, germany and portugal, will be favored to advance. top of the hour, you're watching cnn, i'm brooke baldwin. new information and breaking news into us here at cnn as the fighting in iraq threatens to explode into an all-out civil war. the u.s. is taking steps to protect american citizens in

baghdad, while weighing how to respond to the crisis. so we are now hearing from multiple u.s. officials what the obama administration is considering. and it includes air strikes. so let's go to the white house to our senior white house correspondent, jim acosta, with this news. jim, what are you hearing? >> reporter: brooke, we just heard from the incoming press secretary, josh earnest, who is talking to reporters on board air force one, as the president is making his way back from the weekend trip in california that the president will be meeting with his national security team here at the white house later on this evening to review options for a potential military strike against those isis militants in iraq. we should caution, the president, from what we understand, has not made a final decision. but i am hearing, brooke, from a white house official that he has a fundamental set of options before him that includes military options, military action. at this point, though, those options i'm being told could be tweaked or changed somewhat. so we're in the middle of the process, not at the end of the

process and that's why the president is meeting with his team tonight. >> jim acosta, thank you so much. bob baer, national security analyst and former cia operative, let me bring up my e-mail. when you run through the options the white house will be weighing, more surveillance flights, manned or unmanned, but not armed. develop more intelligence for the u.s. go solo or proceed with the iraqis. use air strikes if sufficient and withdraw further americans in advance of any action. you look at those, and none of them are a real surprise, other than possibly air strikes. my question to you, bob baer, with isis always on the move, no command post, no bases, how do you even consider air strikes without much more intelligence? >> reporter: well, i think you are going to have to set up in anbar province and around mosul a no-drive zone. just warn people to stay off the roads. i mean, you have to get those pickups off the roads. you have to stop them from moving toward baghdad, because a fight for baghdad would mean an

all-out civil war. and this is in extremist attacks, not going to solve the problem. frankly, i think that anbar and the sunni are pretty much lost to the rest of iraq. and we're talking about partition. but right now we have to cauterize the damage. because it's not just iraq. we're talking about the entire gulf taking part in this. in a sense, a lot of money coming out of saudi arabia and the other gulf states. as well as people being recru recruited. we just cannot let this spin out of control. >> cauterize is a great word. you know, when you look at iraq specifically, one by one, these cities are falling. and with the speed at which isis is ripping through, not just syria, but coming over the border into iraq, it's staggering. you look at the red, and that's isis. take a listen to what senator lindsey graham told cnn. >> this is another 9/11 in the making. the fbi director has warned us in congress that syria and iraq present a direct threat to our homeland. you've got foreign fighters from american and western europe

occupying the space, operating with impunity. get into the game, mr. president. >> this here as we are reminded of an ominous phrase from the leader of isis in 2009, "i'll see you guys in new york." bob, do you agree with senator graham? >> oh, i think so. i've been talking to people on the hill, and various intelligence organizations. and they are truly afraid, as they told me. we have been saying the wolf has been at the door the last ten years. well, finally, it's here. and these are people that don't advise -- wanted out of iraq in the first place. they are completely in a panic. both on the hill and in the administration. >> how do you kill the wolf if you can't trust nouri al maliki, which' lot of people seem not to? >> al maliki has got to go. this shia government has failed utterly. they have wasted $15 billion in training. they have got to go. we have got to work with iran and find a government that works. now, whether that means again, partitioning the country or

going into an all and out war, regional war, that's beyond my expertise. but something has to be done. >> who is supporting this group of militants? they're no ragtag group. from everything i'm seeing and reading and hearing, this is a pretty sophisticated, thinking-ahead kind of group, correct me. where are they getting this financial support? rjt it's coming out of gulf arabs. i call them jihadis. but they are clearly well-financed, someone was e-mailing me today those trucks, they recognized them, they're driving around and they were purchased in kuwait. i don't know if that is true or not. but that's the sentiment on the ground, as a lot of money is coming out of saudi arabia and the united arab emirates, as well as qatar. >> are they growing? >> they're absolutely growing. there is a big effort for isis to recruit saudi citizens to

come up and fight. i think what we have missed all along is this sectarian differences in the middle east, shia and sunni, have gotten out of hand because of syria. syria went on for too long. it's infected the whole region. >> so it's not news, the sectarian differences and the in fighting for years, given everything that's happened in syria. and perhaps lack of an involvement. what needs to happen next to kill the wolf? i'll ask you that in a different way. >> well, we need to get to the gulf states. and convince them, this is not in their interest. they have got to stop the money from flowing up to isis and these other groups. or into syria. we have to put an end to the syrian conflict immediately. an immediate end. more arms in this part of the world isn't going to help. if we do air strikes now, it's simply to slow it down. so it doesn't get out of hand. it's not a solution. at the end, it's going to be a political one. but everybody has to participate, including iran, and turkey, and saudi arabia.

and if they want to fight this out in iraq, there's not much t the united states can do. the problem is, once you get these jihadis trained in the streets, and figure out how to use weapons and explosives, they very well could end up in chicago or new york. >> ooh. that's a frightening thought. bob baer, all right, so you say nouri al maliki needs to be out. yes, the u.s. needs to talk to ea iran. appreciate you take the time today. jihadi militants capturing yet another city on this deadly march toward baghdad. and as the fighting in iraq threatens to explode into this all-out civil war, you have the u.s. taking steps to protect american citizens in baghdad, while weighing how to respond to the crisis overall. american troops are preparing for trouble. you have some 100 marines headed to the u.s. embassy in baghdad, as some embassy staffers are moved out. senior international correspondent, nic robertson, is live in baghdad for us.

and nic, before we get to these horrendous execution videos, i heard you say the u.s. embassy there is in impenetrable. do we know how close the isis fighters are to baghdad? >> reporter: if you put a line on the map, if you did google earth and put the ruler on, if you drew it out to fallujah or the base north of back aba, you're talking 30 to 40 miles. if you're talking to an isis cell that's already in baghdad, that's building suicide bombs like the one that went off in a cafe full of shia workers on sunday morning here, killed 17, wounded 14, those kind of cells are in and armed the city. they could be within a couple miles of the embassy. look, nothing -- i would never say anything is ever utterly impenetrab impenetrable. i guess we would stay away from

that language. but the reality is, the green zone is super secure, and the embassy is behind many, many layers of security in that zone. let's say the isis tried to lob a mortar or artillery round or something that flew over the city and landed in there. yes, that's a possibility. and you don't want additional staff in that area when that's a possibility. and there are indications isis wants to get around this city and get within shelling range of it. >> we talk about isis, and it's certainly not news these militant groups have cameras, take footage of horrendous acts, post it to social media. i mean, it's propaganda to recruit. but let's talk about these execution videos which are horrible to look at. but what's the back story? what do we know about what we're seeing? >> reporter: there's an escalation to this material that isis is using. when they swept south, they released when they were in

tikrit a video showing hundreds of what they said were iraqi security forces being rounded up and made to walk off. then they released 24 hours or so ago these still images of what they said were iraqi security forces, again, being led away and put down and made to lie on the ground and executed. now what you have, these videos showing interrogations that show execution. these are not just propaganda videos. these are documentations of war crimes. i mean, we should be really clear. isis here is providing the evidence for future war crimes trial, should anyone be able to catch up with them. that's going to be the tough part. the message and the problem began dahere is to any government forces, if we're coming get out of the way. but what they're also trying to do here is something that's -- that's -- that has currency here in the region. they're trying to stir up these

sectarian tensions. now why would they do that? they want to cause chaos, they want to have a big fight. yeah, everyone gets that. but look, what they want, what the leader of isis wants more than ever is more recruits. and the way he does that is to radicalize the sunni population. so he encourages the shias to go crazy against the sunnis in a sectarian blood bath. and that would drive more sunnis into his force. that's what he's all about. that's what this is about. should he ever be caught, this material could be used in his trial in a war crimes trial, brooke. >> war crimes documentation. important differentiation from propaganda. nic robertson, live in baghdad, thank you. coming up next, one thing the u.s. is considering to try to control the violence in iraq, work with iran. is that the best move? what would both countries gain from working with one another? we have a live report for you, coming up from tehran. also, this: >> now it's time, all aboard for the train of death. >> this is obviously a certain

danger. attached when the train is in motion. >> this is incredibly gripping. this is karl penhaul, one of our correspondents, aboard the so-called train ever death. thousands of children are making this very same voyage illegally, getting into the u.s. we will show you the dangerous journey and why border control is not able to stop them. next, on cnn. [male vo] inside this bag is 150 years of swedish experience in perfecting the rich, never bitter taste of gevalia. we do it all for this very experience. [woman] that's good. i know right? gevalia. now they're part of our 2 for $25 guest favorites!r one olive garden dishes. get your all-time favorites like creamy chicken alfredo. plus unlimited salad and breadsticks and dessert. 2 for $25 guest favorites at olive garden.

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deepened today with the fall of yet another city to isis rebels. iraq's government fought back with air strikes near fallujah, just west of baghdad. the government says it killed more than 200 militants, including an isis commoner. b commander. but the question here, which presents the biggest threat, isis or iran? it must be isis, at least in washington's calculations, because the obama administration is making noise today about talking to tehran. another round of talks and iran's nuclear program kicked off this morning in vienna, austria. and the united states is reportedly thinking of reaching out to the iranian team regarding iraq. cnn's rosa sayah is there right now. iran is right there, next to iraq. what is iran's interest? what is iran's main worry as to what's going on next door? >> reporter: brooke, it's very easy to see on the surface why

washington and tehran would benefit if they partner up in some capacity when it comes to what's happening in iraq. consider what iran wants. they want to protect the maliki government, the shia-led government, don't want baghdad to fall and also beat back this rising sunni insurgency in erir. and it just so happens, that's what washington wants, as well. and that's why you see these talks about the possibility of washington and tehran, creating an alliance. that's why these talks are picking up. and maybe the best indication that this is a real possiblity is what senator lindsay graham said, no less a republican, coming out and explicitly saying the u.s. should sit down and talk with iran. it hasn't happened yet. it may not happen. but if it does, it would make headlines and be a watershed moment for much of 35 years these two countries have been bitter rivals. just a few years ago, the u.s. was openly saying we would consider a military strike to

curb iran's nuclear program. but now they're sharing what seems to be a very common and compelling cause. and we should point out, if this happens, it won't be unprecedented, brooke. 2001, tehran provided some valuable intelligence to washington. and they both partnered to beat the taliban in afghanistan. and that's an indication of how strongly iran feels about pushing back any kind of militancy that's approaching its borders. as you mentioned, the nuclear talks in vienna, it could be the u.s. and iran will go to the sidelines and discuss this further. >> we will be watching and listening for the whispers for the conversations. reza, thank you so much. in tehran for us this afternoon. coming up next, this is the journey. thousands of children are making to illegally enter u.s. it is so dangerous, this voyage is actually called the train of death. we will explain why it is so difficult for border patrol to stop these kids from entering

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firefighters are working in swing shifts, just to fight this wildfire in central california. it's called the shirley fire, threatening at least a thousand homes and has grown to more than 2,000 acres with only a fraction contained. stephanie elam joins me live. and stephanie, set the scene for me. how much are firefighters able to get a handle on? >> reporter: well, brooke, they're feeling confident today that they'll be able to make some progress on this fire. if you look behind me, you can see that it is a bit smoky. but the fire is really burning in the outreaches of this

community. and we are pretty much in eastern part of california right now. but they are feeling confident, despite the fact that it is so dry here in california, and that is part of the issue here. take a listen to what one fire official, richard hadley, had to say about it. >> right now, the fuels, the drew fuels, the unburned fuels, are the driest they have ever been in history across the state. so we're seeing conditions in june that we would typically see in september at the end of the fire season. >> reporter: and also, keep in mind too, the people who have been evacuated, some are really close to where we are right now. they're expecting to hopefully get back in their places. the pio i talked to, the man you heard from, hoping that's going to happen. but there is one major concern here. and you may be able to see around me. the wind. if the wind kicks up, it will burn these hot spots, and that's what the firefighter are going around digging out and putting out, because the fires can sometimes blow below the earth

because they have to shut fires down so they don't jump over to fresh kindle that has not burned in a while, brooke. >> that's what's so crucial, the fact of the wind for these firefighters. stephanie elam, thank you so much. and now to this story. the numbers are absolutely staggering. thousands of unaccompanied children pouring into the u.s., making this harrowing journey to get there. 60,000 are expected to cross the u.s. border just this year. some as young as 4. and border control is not equipped to properly take care of all of them. the majority are coming in from el salvador, guatemala, honduras. but the path they're taking is far from new. cnn's karl penhaul actually roland rode this train of death, acting as a free ride to the american dream. take a look. >> reporter: some call it the beast. to others, it's the train of death.

but to all these illegal my migrants, it's a free ride bound for their american dream of washing dishes, picking lettuce, other carrying bricks. >> we want to work. if you were born over there, your life is going to be different. you're going to work, go to a nice high school, go to a nice college, you know. i don't think we're stealing their money or their jobs, you know. >> reporter: they come from guatemala and honduras. that he spend days clinging to cargo trains as they grind through southern mexico, up toward the u.s. border. human rights groups estimate thousands have died falling from trains like this. some of them mutilated under its wheels.

en route to the u.s. border, many more have been robbed, raped and kidnapped. the mexican authorities do little to prevent them riding or to deter gangs from preying on them. >> now for many of those people, either by train or by paying, the journey is made in vain. cnn's rosa flores heard the horror stories of those who made it to america, only to bety ported right back to their own country. >> reporter: this is the extreme poverty honor durans are trying to escape. where homes with indoor kitchens, doors that lock and glass windows are a luxury. people sell just about anything door to door to put food on the table. they tell us about 90% of this community of about 3,000 is unemployed. when i can't feed my kids, says this mother of six, i'm very

tempted to give the american dream another try. she has already been deported once. it seems everyone knows someone who has taken a stab at the dangerous trek, like this woman's son. there's danger everywhere, she says. ten died down the street. and mothers are left praying. the communities on opposite sides of this river are a glaring example of the breakdown of law and order. on one side, you've got a gang-controlled slum, where crime is rampant. on the other side of the river, you've got a neighborhood watch community taking security into its own hands. setting up a checkpoint with armed guards, only allowing residents inside. before this, gangs were notorious for raiding this neighborhood to rob, assault and kill.

slowly, says this guard, we forced all of the known criminals out. but the poverty, they fear, is here to stay. rosa flores, cnn, san pedro sula, honduras. >> rosa, thank you. we should note, the vice president, joe biden, will be traveling to discuss the crisis. he will emphasis children to migrate to the u.s. illegally will still be subject to deportation. coming up next, violence escalates in iraq. people are turning to social media to inform the world about the atrocities there. but a new app is letting them to that anonymously, in an attempt to stay safe. next, a look at this app, and what iraqis are secretly sharing. picks up the tab every time, which is great...what? he's using you. he probably has a citi thankyou card and gets 2x the points at restaurants. so he's just racking up points with me. some people... ugh! no, i've got it.

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correspondent, laurie segall. and laurie, company officials say the last three days whisper has seen the number of users double. what are these posters saying? >> reporter: it's pretty interesting, also, that the name is whisper and really giving folks a bit of a voice. and they're called -- they're called whisperses, right? these postings, if you look at the app, scrolling through, everyone is anonymous postingses from all around the world and seeing an in flux come in from iraq right now. let me get to what they say. one, the u.s. embassy in baghdad is evacuating that one is very interesting. that was reported before the media actually reported it. they put that out there on 8:00 a.m. eastern time and the media reported a couple hours later. another one, we're fine in baghdad, but we are ready for the worst. so brooke, you just get the sense of fear. and another one, we're waiting -- our miserable deathses, as isis is progressing towards baghdad. and how folks are trying to deal with this. a user posted i'm trying to escape by my writing poems and

story. and brooke, you're also seeing cultural confessions, too. one user posted about being able to realize his sexual identity before something catastrophic happened. he posted a whisper saying, "i'm gay and single in iraq and that makes me feel empty. i want to find a boy friend before a bomb goes off." it's really heartbreaking stuff. really a taste of the culture and what's happening on the ground there, brooke. >> with everything that's being shared, you talked to the ceo of whisper last month. did he have any idea, any inkling, people would be using it as they are? >> reporter: it's always so interesting to see social networks come out and then be used for all sorts of things. and he hinted at it. he said this isn't just for high school people to tease each other. we don't want that. we want this to be a safe place that anyone, regardless of their ethnicity, their background, can post and feel safe and they have a voice and can talk about the government. they can be a whistle blower, but post anonymously and be heard, brooke. laurie segall, i want to stay on

social media and expand the conversation. my next guest embraces isis to their advantage. michael weise is a contributor. michael, nice to have you on. >> thanks for having me back. >> so talking with social media, you wrote this piece in "politico" saying these isis fighters are, know, in particular don't seem to have any restrictions on what they can and can't do on social media. how do you mean? >> yeah, well, there is actually one restriction, typically speaking, which is don't post anything about upcoming military operations. which would give the game away, of course. but anything else, from beheading people to crucifying people in syria. you have to understand, isis is not just a terrorist group, and i would say it's not just even a conventional or guerilla style military apparatus now. it's functioning as a state. it has government facilities. it provides medical treatment and, you know, food supplies and it's controlling the dam in

syria. and much of the oil supply in syria now in northern and center line iraq. in that respect, it's important to think of isis as something that is trying to be a quasi state entity. and, indeed, they use social media very well to their advantage. and i think, you know, it's important to understand, what they're putting out is propaganda, and no one should take it at face value. it should always be cross-checked in terms of what they claim to be doing versus what they actually are. but there is an app they're using themselves, and we were talking about whisper. just before i sat down, i read a very good piece in "the atlantic" called "the dawn of glad tidings," an app you can download, basically controlled by i don't know who. probably isis central command. anyone who downloads the app, will have tweets that central command posts to their twitter account, as well. it's like a force multiplier effect for isis' propaganda, make them seem like they're everywhere throughout the internet so the hash tag baghdad would bring images suggesting

we're going to bring hell and fury on the city. so it has an effect on the crisis, which is what they want. >> insane. and i think it's important to reiterate what nic robertson was saying. listen, brooke, this isn't just propaganda, they are documenting war crimes. so -- >> yeah. >> it's clear that it's at that level. but then we read this article, and i don't know if you've seen this, michael. but "the wire" is reporting that twitter has suspended multiple isis accounts for obviously the violence. but there is the criticism, because by doing that, that negates the opportunity down the road to prosecute war crimes. >> right. i think the incentive for doing that and western governments will argue this, we want to stop the recruitment effort. they're using this as kind of a rallying cry or casting call to get fighters not just from the region, but all over. in the uk, there is something like 400 foreign fighters from britain who have gone to join

the civil war in syria, probably most with groups affiliated with isis or certainly not the moderate free syrian army types. so absolutely. there's going to be this sort of attempt at censorship. but isis is clever and find ways to circumvent this. they're saying they should use the tour system, which is kind of like the shadow internet. >> right. the underbelly. >> exactly. so now i think, you know, as we try to adapt to their methods, they're going to adapt to ours. so i don't see them quieting down any time soon. >> this is a whole new way of covering stories like this. in real-time and watching how this gets ahead, sophistication sound like the understatement when it comes to this group. michael weise, come back to the show. >> yeah, thanks for having me. and a programming note, anderson cooper. anderson is in baghdad. he will be anchoring "ac 360" live tonight starting at 8:00 eastern. do not miss that. coming up next, back in 2006 it, joe biden made a suggestion on how to fix iraq.

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the crisis gripping iraq has become so dicey that now the united states and long-time foe, iran, are considering actually joining forces to contain this. according to reports, these two sides could hold discussions as early as this week as both have sent teams to vienna, austria for talks in iran's nuclear program. the u.s. and iran. is this a good idea? joining me from washington, ben jones and s.e. cupp, hosts of "crossfire." beginning with you, s.e., flat

out, should the u.s. be talking to iran about iraq? >> hell, no. no, iran has one singular interest in iraq and that is to prop up you and continue to prop up a shiite regime. iraq has had a shiite regime for some time now. it's been overtly hostile to iraq's sunni population. so if we want iraq's sunni population to go running into the arms of sunni isis, then the first thing we should do is bring iran in to conduct negotiations or to get iran's help in dealing with this. that will engender absolutely no trust with the sunni population that very, very much want to keep interested in this process. and opt miss stick about the possibilities for iraq's future. >> so a hell, no from you, s.e. van jones, do you agree? >> well, i think you can talk to anybody and there's no harm in talking. i agree with s.e. there is a danger we actually drive some of the sunnis further into the arms of extremists.

but we have to take a step back and rencognize, we are living i a multipolar world. as americans, we're used to being the only power that matters. george w. bush started these wars, kicked over a hornet's nest, hurt the bank, and now we have to deal with the consequences. part of the consequences are, you've got to talk to people like iran and russia. >> so you say yes. given the dangers. >> i think it's worth talking. what you do, after you talk, that's another question. >> okay. let me take you back. this is because everybody is thinking, what could iraq look like down the road. and actually, to do that, let's go back to 2006, because this plan put forth to end full-scale civil war in iraq, back when the u.s. forces were actually still fighting there. and here's the idea. take a look. you split iraq into three sections, roughly comported to what we're seeing now. you have the kurds in the northeast, the sunnis in the heartland, shiites in the south, all bound together in this loose confederation. that's -- an idea, and van, actually an idea put forth by

senator joe biden at the time. do you see that as plausible, might we see this resurrected? >> well, i think that's kind of what is beginning to emerge. and i think that the whole world has an interest in trying to keep some kind of confederated state there. but i think the idea that you can just go over there, start a war, throw out the existing leadership, have an election and everything is going to work out fine, that region has been held together very delicately for decades, if not centuries. and george bush had a plan to win the war. he didn't have a plan to win the peace. and that's why we got this humpty dumpty scenario over there. >> s.e., would you like to respond to your colleague on the humpty dumpty issue. and do you think the par tiss tissueticianing of iraq would be smart? >> it's something to consider if you're looking at the geo politics of that region. let me promise you this, isis is not running into iraq because no one heeded joe biden's advice in 2006. isis is running into iraq, because there is a power vacuum there. and that's what these groups, isis, other the al-qaeda lined groups, that's what they do, ex

employed power vacuums. if you look at syria, mally, that's what they do. and this is a power vacuum we created. yes, we went into iraq, we can litigate whether that was a good idea or not. but we went in and then we left before stability had been completely achieved. so we created a power vacuum. and now we're left to deal with it. joe biden also said that iraq was going to be one of president obama's greatest successes. it looks like he was happy to accept responsibility and the credit, when iraq was stable. but by the same hand, you have to take this same kind of responsibility for iraq's instability now. >> all right. each of you got the presidential jabs in both ways. we'll call it even. van jones, s.e. cup, we'll watch tonight, 6:30 eastern on "cross fire" here on cnn. did the irs unfairly target tea party groups? that's the question some in congress want answered. but we may never find out,

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visit tripadvisor rome. with millions of reviews, tripadvisor makes any destination better. the irs tends to be unforgiving when it comes to deadlines, submitting paperwork, right? but the agency finds itself in a bit of a bind over e-mails from a former official.

it says some e-mails from lois lerner were lost because of a computer crash. lawmakers want those e-mails all part of this investigation into whether the agency did target tea party groups over tax exempt status. to washington we go to the chief washington correspondent jake tapper. jake tapper, so lost e-mails, huh? are lawmakers buying that? >> well, it seems to be splitting down party lines. republicans are very skeptical already. the house ways and means committee and house overseethe committee say they're looking into this. lois lerner is having a closed door meeting with orrin hatch later today. you know, because there are questions here not only about the credibility of the claim that two years worth of e-mails from 2009 through 2011 disappeared because of a hard drive that crashed but also because of testimony that the acting irs director gave before congress just in march when asked about the ability to store and back up e-mails.

take a listen. >> that's one of the brilliants of the e-mail system. you go in and you check the sent box, the inbox, and you suddenly have all the e-mails, correct? >> right, they get taken off and stored in servers. >> they get taken off and stored in servers from the commissioner. so there are questions about how could one person's hard drive crashing obliterate all of these e-mails especially when the government has laws requiring the storage of these e-mails, brooke. >> okay. :00. we'll watch for it on "the lead" at the top of the hour. jake tapper. >> the biggest sporting event in the world, the world cup. in mere hours the u.s. takes the pitch for the first game. we're live in brazil with a preview. >> hi, brooke. yes, i certainly do. we're just over two hours away. excitement is building for the grudge match of all grudge

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best players, nicest guys. tony gwynn has died at the age of 54. he played his entire career 20 seasons in all for the san diego padres. he was so adored fans called him mr. padre. gwynn won eight national league batting titles and had this incredible career batting average of .338. those achievements made him a first ballot hall of famer. he believed the cancer that ended his life was actually caused by chewing tobacco. and tonight, the united states begins itset world cup adventure when it goes toe to toe with guana. they have knocked the u.s. competitionings in 2006 and in 2010. so tonight, basically a must win for the u.s. team.

lara baldesarra is live in natal, brazil. might this be sweet redemption for the u.s.? >> it most certainly is. this is all about that grudge match. the 2010 world cup usa was eliminated in the knockout stages bygone na. none of the players are actually saying that. they're saying they're going in with a clean slate. there's only six guys on this roster who was on the u.s. national team roster in 2010. either way, all fans feel this is a match they need to get some redemption out of. i just saw a whole group of american fans just walking to be here in full force tonight cheering on their team. everybody wants a little payback after what happened last time in the world cup. >> they want a little payback. the u.s. coach who apparently some time ago wasn't really sure if his team was capable of making it all the way changing his tune been winning the world cup. >> yes, he did come out and say

it's not a reasonable expectation for the usa to win the korld up with. not the popular thing to say, but it is a little bit honest. however, most recently in his press conference yesterday he said he still is going out there wanting to win like all the 23 guys on the roster. they're playing every game to win. he said the drive is exactly the same. whether he thinks it's reasonable or not they can win, they're going in, they're going to go out there, win all three games. if they do, that would be extremely impressive because the usa is in the toughest group in the entire world cup. winning any of these games would be impressive for the usa. >> you've been studying the statistics. yes, this would be sweet sweet redemption for america. prediction time. how is it looking? u.s., guana. >> i don't know. i'm going to become the most unpopular person, brooke. >> totally putting you on the spot. >> u.s. is going to lose, 2-1 to

guana. i hope it doesn't come true. i really, really do. but that's what i think. we'll see. do you have a rediction? >> gosh, i hope it's the u.s. but i'll take your word for it. enjoy brazil either way, my friend. lara bald sarah, thank you. we'll be watching in a couple hours. how about this starbucks is adding a perking for some of its employees. company helping them earn a college degree. starbucks also offer full and part-time employees a generous tuition reimbursement benefit for arizona state university's online studies program. so for employees going to college as a junior or senior, they will get full tuition reimbursement for two years, translation, that's about $30,000 for those who will be freshman or sophomores, they'll get 22% of their tuition paid for two years. that's about $6500. and get this, employees aren't required to stay with starbucks

after earning their degrees. how about that. to me the entire interview with the ceo of starbucks, go to cnnmoney.com and stay right here. we're going to washington. "the lead with jake tapper" "the lead with jake tapper" starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com president obama could decide on an iraq strategy within the coming hours as terrorists massacre the iraqi security forces trained by the u.s. i'm jake tapper. it this is the lead". you see this man? moments after this video was shot, he showed up dead. executed like hundreds of others by the islamist terrorists threatening to overtake iraq. what is the u.s. prepared to do about it? air strikes? maybe, but is the u.s. also considering a partnership with iran? the country that the u.s. government officially considers a state sponsor cienfuegos terrorism. and the politics lead today on the 40th anniversary of the publication of the legendary