as much as we cover it, we're always shocked by these numbers. remember you can follow us here on twitter. tweet me, tweet the show. please be sure to join us again live tomorrow where you can dvr the show. these it for me. thanks very much for watching. i'm wochl blitzer in "the situation room". let's steph into the "crossfire." >> it is absurd that the u.s. can't write a law to control its own border. >> that would mean that this republican congress would actually have to do something. the debate starts right now. tonight on "crossfire," what should happen to the flood of children crossing our border. >> the immediate problem is to send the message if you come here you can't stay here. >> we have spoken in very clear and candid terms within they'll be sent home. >> on the left were stephanie cutter, on the right, newt gingrich. in the "crossfire," ted strict

land, a democrat former governor of ohio and bob early a former republican governor of m.d. plus the yous rage of the day. tonight on "crossfire." welcome to "crossfire." i'm stephanie cutter on the left. >> i'm newt gingrich on the right and in the "crossfire" tonight, two former governors. every month about 10,000 children come across the american border seeking asylum. the prospect of actually stopping them seems to be beyond washington's grasp. if we were a competent serious country we could fix the problem this week. congress would pass a law, the president would sign it and the government would enforce it. unfortunately, the bureaucracy seems to be stupid, the congress seems to match it and add to that the president's massive incompetence and you get a total

fiasco. >> strong statement to follow. >> that's right. >> it's awfully easy to throw out throwaway lines and place blame but there's not one piece of evidence that this is lax inforcement or insecurity at the border. it's law that's being enforceds and a group of children that need to be treated humanely. this is a national crisis and we need to make sure that everybody understands that there are children involved here. >> i'm going to shock you. >> i'm going to introduce you. in the "crossfire" tonight, former ohio governor ted strictland who is now the president of the center for american progress action fund. and former maryland governor bob rks urlich. shock me. >> i halfway agree with you. >> so tell me exactly what you would do right now to deal with

these children. >> there's been a bipartisan failure here. both parties when republicans told the white house and the congress, democrats control the white house and the congress, no one is taking it seriously. the republicans are negligent. my problem with the democrats -- >> tell me how they're negligent. >> enforce the law. >> we didn't build the fence. we didn't get a build on it. but my problem with the democrats is they don't appear to be interested in a law. >> you understand what this problem is. it's not about a fence that you're building. it's a current law that says if you're coming from these three countries, then you're not turned away from the border. >> and we're seriously not endporsing this law. >> we're enforcing it. that's why the children are coming in. >> by the way, the headline this afternoon is probably what needs to be done with regard to this narrow issue. don't forget, this is part of a much larger issue. children will be sent home. some are legitimate refugees.

>> that's the law. >> and the fact is we're dealing with two separate issues here. >> correct. >> one issue is an imglags system that was broken. >> correct. >> we had a bipartisan group of senators, republicans and democrats pass a comprehensive bill. >> a year ago. >> i wish newt was the speaker, he would do something. >> you're on record. >> the second problem we're dealing with are the kids. >> that's right. >> and we've got to remember that they are by and large children. we are a country that values children. and we've got the deal with them. >> but, ted -- >> if a humane way. >> let me ask you a question. there's all this talk about being humane, being compassion, being caring. i do some work with gallop. last year they asked the question would you like to leave your country and if so, where would you like to go. their estimate was 165 million people want to come to the united states. but here's my question.

we're going -- we've gone from 8,000 children under george w. bush to i think an estimated 80,000 this year to potentially 160,000 to 200,000 next year. at what point does it become simply totally unimaginable. >> newt, we're not talking about children coming from all over the world. we're talking about a specific crisis that's ooh occurring in three specific countries that have absolutely lost control of their society, murder, rapes. >> wait a second. you just -- >> a particular crisis, we've got to deal with now and that involves children and we need to do it humanely. >> in terms of violence, you just saw wolf blitzer's report on chicago this weekend. >> that's right. >> so my question is this. because political asylum used to mean you were a specific person under presh smur from a specific regime. now we have this new standard,

we only have three countries this year, maybe in a few years we'll have ten countries. but those three countries have a bomb bind population of 39 million people. >> what is exactly your solution here? this is the united states of america. >> yes. >> if you are being persecuted in your own country -- >> the children aren't being persecut persecuted. >> it's the murder capital of the world. >> you want to move them to chicago? >> we need to treat this -- >> rep bills out there, marco rubio, bunch of house members, it deals -- >> come on. let me tell you how the president has led. record amount of border security. >> remember that line? >> record amount of border security called for more immigration judges to move these people through the process faster. how about a comprehensive immigration reform, a reform bill that's been sitting in congress for a year. >> how about a unilateral ad hoc

approach. we'll let this group? >> we have a comprehensive -- >> you have to have a foundation, a denominator ap and the denominator -- >> how about congress? we have a bipartisan -- >> mexico takes their law seriously. one marine locked up down there. >> do you disagree with senator mccain and senator graham, this is the answer to solve or immigration crisis in general? >> we all know -- >> this amendment lack it. >> i don't understand what you're saying, though. you saying that mccrane and graham don't have credibility? >> i agree with them. you have to have border -- >> that's the law. it passed the senate. >> let me point out for a second, stephanie, because you said early earlier, the current problem with children has nothing to do with the law. they're entering the country

legally under the law. it would be very easy to reverse the feinstein amendment and simply go back to the stat kus quo of 2008 and say, you know, we're not going to automatically have a presumption that you get to come into the u.s. because you happen to be from these three countries. that's all it would take, a very small bill, one paragraph long. and this particular problem would end the following day. >> i remember gonzalez, one kid, the right wing, the conservatives wrs clambering to let this kid stay here simply because he came from a communist country although his father was a good man and wanted him back. these kids are coming to us from these terrible situations. newt, you're a good man. bob, you're a good man. stephanie, you're a good woman. we're all good people. but good people care about kids and we've got a crisis and we need to deal with the current crisis. we may need to change the law at some point, but right now the

united states of america has an obligation to take care of these kids. >> well, so you disagree with the administration? >> well, i think the administration should be going after the smugglers. >> we all agree with that. >> and i think we should be going after the leadership in these countries. >> what the administration is saying now is, though, we're going to process the kids, we're going to decide which ones stay, which ones we're going to take back and they're following the law. i agree. i praise the administration for following the law and doing the right thing. >> i don't think anybody disagrees with that. >> that law was passed in 2008 signed by president george bush. it had a good motive, to keep children from being returned to traffickers or pimps. >> in a moment we're going to return to this. i promise you. there's a lot more to discuss. in a moment, i'll show you how this humanitarian crisis is bringing out the worst in some americans and i'm not talking about anyone here. what was the border patrol budget last year, $900 million,

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welcome back. now the answer to our "crossfire" quiz. the border patrol budget was $3.5 billion in 2003. that's over one billion more than when president obama took office. so those who pay obama hasn't been proactive on border security are actually dead wrong. if we want to solve the humanitarian crisis, we need to change the current law. and we need to deal with the children who are already here. one thing we don't need are demonstrations staged by national anti-immigration groups. these protests are disgusting. the signs are tax money for you, hell no, protect your kids from diseases. these protests are not reflect of of most americans. don't you think this debate tends to get out of control? >> of course it does. >> shouldn't we condemn some of

these -- those are buses of children. >> i condemn hard right and hard left. anti-intellectualing with, anti-american, pro-american culture. let's not pretend we have a law. open borders. i'm equally aghast of that stuff that i see from the left regularly these days. >> do you condemn those protests? >> i condemn boast sides. the forty of us could probably draft a bill. there is a worldwide difference between the path to citizenship, path to legalization. i hate when the right and left, the moniker debate. it's pro-life, pro-choice, they mean nothing. they're signals, catch phrases, emotion laden in order to generate a response. you have to define your terms on this issue.

and speakers talked about it. we have to have a bill in congress. >> so -- >> it has to be led by the president. >> so there is a bill in congress. i want to ask you a question -- >> there are many bills in congress. >> the bill that was passed by a bipartisan senate, democrats and republicans, sent to the house a year ago, that's a starting point. do you think that house republicans who lead the house of representatives should try to move something? because right now they're just saying no. >> yes, with one caveat. something substantive -- maybe this is it. maybe this headline is it. something substantive has to be down with regard -- >> to this current crisis. >> the immediate crisis, the humanitarian crisis, the ongoing crisis this administration lacks credibility. >> a couple of facts on that. governor, please join in here, a and, newt, you too, of course chblgs he ge

chblgs. >> he gets to talk too? >> i love stephanie's facts. >> the president has taken lots of criticism from people on the left for the highest deportation rate every, higher in bush in five years than bush did in eight years, record investment in border security, strong enforcement using new technologies and drones on the border. so what is it that he hasn't led on? i just want to know what you're talking about. >> his rhetoric doesn't match that -- >> his rhetoric. >> the speech, it's an unserious approach to what needs to be a comprehensive reform. >> but if the senate bill was given a vote, if my former colleague and my friend from ohio, speaker john boehner would just simply let the house vote, we know this problem would be solved. >> i agree. >> we know that the votes exist

in the house of representatives to pass the senate for a bill similar to that. >> depends on the senate. >> we should try. >> no. fact here. but the fact is and all three of you agreed on this earlier. this thing which is currently catching the american public's attention is an enormous increase from 8,000 children under bush's last year to over estimated 80,000 this year to potentially 160,000 to 200,000 next year. these are legal. they're walking up to the border saying i am asking for political asylum, they're reading exactly what they're supposed to say. let's be clear. nothing you're describing right now would change that. just a second, stephanie. one of the reasons no normal person thinks the president succeeded is because you look up with 60,000 kids come in, you've ear being told the border is being controlled and you're like wait a second, how come there are 60,000 kids coming in.

let me show you what the democratic congress said over the weekend about president obama. it's worth looking at. >> with all due respect i think he's one step behind. they knew this was happening a year ago. last year and again they're just not reacting fast enough at this time in my perm opinion. >> this is a democrat on the border. member of congress, who is saying that the president is a year behind the curve. >> but we would be in better shape to deal with this current crisis in we had passed comprehensive immigration reform -- >> why. >> well, because we would have had resources that would have been directed toward this current crisis rather that not having the resources. >> do you know the number of children who have been returned home has been going down? it's gone from i think 8,000 down to 1200 at the very time that the number coming in as exploded? >> but again, we keep talking about comprehensive reform.

we have to define our terms. does that mean you have to learn english, pay back taxes. >> that's what the senate bill did. >> with regard to the people who have done the right thing and are here legally. i've read it. i know. it's in my book. read my book. these are starting points. those positions are not going to hold water with many democratic members in the house and you know it. >> let's have a vote. bring it to the floor, let's have a vote and i believe we would pass a bill in the house, it would go to congress and we could finally bring the issue to a conclusion. >> >> do you think republicans in the house would support that? >> i think some republicans hide behind more security as cam flaj. i think a lot of republicans and a lot of american public believe this administration lacks credibility in this issue. that the republican administration lacks credibility in this issue and there's an unserious approach to really stopping this, is what i

believe. >> i want to speak for myself, but you have a pattern here for the country. you have a v.a. that doesn't work, irs that doesn't work, border patrol, and i agree with stephanie. all of the members look good until you say, how come all these kids are coming in. well, that's different. so every time you turn around, there is something different. i think frankly, at least on the republican side, the level of the credibility this president has. no accident that last week in the poll he was named as the worst president since world war two. while i think that is mostly republicans saying that, there is a big intensity saying, why would you trust this guy with additional power. >> invite the speaker, invite members of the house leadership. >> to drink -- >> i think he meant the speaker -- >> from the time barack obama was elected president, the house, not the senate, and not everybody in the house, there is good people in the house that

would, republicans, that would like to vote on an immigration bill. but for some reason, they are not even having a chance to cast a vote of, to have a debate. i think if you were speaker, something would be happen ppg. >> why isn't it occurring? >> because i think the level of distrust, starting with obamacare, is so deep, hostile sit so deep, that is t is very hart to see how you get things done. >> one thing without justice reform, lends itself to true honest to god solution. that's it. >> stay here. we want you at home to weigh in on today's fire back question. should undocumented children be returned to their home countries? tweet yes or no using hashtag crossfire. we will have the results after the break. we will also have the outrage of the day. you will be amazed to find stephanie siding with one of the

most right wing political bloggers. ss.

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welcome back. now it's time for my outrage of the day. it's no secret that i'm outraged by john boehner's decision to waste our tax dollars by suing president obama. you can read his phony excuses for the lawsuit in an op-ed he wrote for cnn.com. but i never thought i would agree with blogger eric eriksson. something he write today is right on target. quote john boehner and the house republicans may lack the

testicular fortitude to fight president obama but i would kindly ask that he save the taxpayers further money on a political stunt. newt, you agree. >> impeach the president, secondary officer, cut off funding or follow lawsuit. >> a fifth option, let the supreme court read the option and rule on law -- >> and stop acting extra constitutional and -- >> get something done. stop the do-nothing congress. >> operation of powers. >> and gradually grinding restricting his powers again. >> from bain are's perspective, he has it make his case to the country. >> don't take it from me. take it from many conservatives.

like shutting down the government a year ago. it wastes taxpayers' dollars. >> we bring eric in one night to talk about those things. >> let's check on our fire back results. >> should undocumented children be returned home to their countries? >> 74% of you say yes. 26% say no. >> who what would jesus do. >> the federal government is not working well and those numbers reflect. >> i think this is a moral issue. this particular crisis involving these kids is a moral issue and we need to recognize it as such. >> how many countries can we extend to? >> this is a particular crisis, newt. confined to three countries. they are not only coming to america. they are going to other countries. >> showing sovereignty --

>> thanks for the great debate. the debate continues on cnn.com/crossfire as well as facebook and twitter. from the left, i'm stephanie. >> from the right, i'm newt gingrich. erin burnett "outfront" starts right now. >> two passenger jets nearly collide. close calls in 72 years. how unsafe are our skies? and the new million dollar mercedes, 21 feet of luxury. at that price, shouldn't it drive itself? let's go outfront. good evening,