this is just as delicious as they are. >> having fun there. we will see you back here at 10:00. "smerconish" is next. one week since a white police officer named darren wilson shot michael brown, ferguson, missouri continues to erupt in violence and anger. the bitter divide goes deeper than mostly white police force against a mostly black community. the heavily armed response adds to the growing tensions. we're covering ferguson from angles with great, insightful voices joining me. we are talking about the indictment of texas governor rick perry and more air strikes in iraq. general clark is with me here today. i'm michael smerconish. let's get started.

armored vehicles and officers in riot gear and gas masks were back on the streets of ferguson, missouri today after looting and protests broke out overnight. looters broke into several stores near where 18-year-old michael brown was shot and killed by a police officer one week ago. police say he just committed a robbery. missouri state representative jeff riordan joins us live from missouri. he is the member of the st. louis police officers association and retired police officer. joining me is lewis reed. mr. alderman, let me begin with you. i thought the release of the information by the police in ferguson was terribly executed. here is why. people wanted to know the identity of the police officer who shot mike brown. when we finally got that information, it came wrapped in a 19-page police report talking about a robbery. the chief then offered a

timeline. verbally offered a timeline where i thought he was suggesting a use of deadly force and robbery of cigars. later, the chief said darren wilson did not know brown was a suspect when he initially confronted him and later in the day, the chief told the st. louis post dispatch that initially he did not regard him as a suspect, but when he saw the cigars in his hands, things changed. is this what you get when the police department is thrust into the national spotlight and deal with the national media or is this deliberate on the chief's part to obfuscate and cloud the details of the case? >> michael, i worked with him back in the police division.

he is a great police officer. he is the picture of integrity. i don't think anyone should question his ethics. this is what happens, i think, when the public is demanding answers and they get puzzle pieces instead of the whole picture. i think it is a time for deliberation and allow the police department to finish its investigation and give us the whole picture, not just pieces of the puzzle when we only have the border and not the pieces. >> why not release that information on monday or tuesday or wednesday? why when people were looking to get the information of the officer and then we are told the information about the robbery? don't misunderstand what i'm saying. i as a member of the public, want to know everything, i'm questioning the manner in which that information was provided. mr. reed, the floor is yours. >> michael, i completely agree with you.

i think it was handled very poorly. you know, i hate to criticize the chief and the police department, but you know the fact remains that this thing has been handled poorly. if you take a look at the -- not last night, but the night before, there was no looting or any of that stuff happened. then when the chief released the name wrapped in all of this other stuff, including a video of the robbery, then you ended up having more tension on the streets and then when the police officers showed up in the riot gear and shooting off smoke bombs or tear gas again, we saw the looting come back again. you know, it continues to take away from the central point and that is getting to the bottom of what happened in that parking lot between michael brown and

the police officer. >> i think it also, gentlemen, causes more of a distrust in the police. i know that as these events broke yesterday on my radio program, i tapped into cnn because i wanted to report on them realtime. i immediately had callers who were disbelieving of the video. if we can, nora, can we show the video to the gentlemen and our audience of the person who makes this point. roll that tape if you can. >> i believe it took so long for them to do that because they photo shopped it. anytime a crime happens, they always show it. the crime. that would have given people a chance to say okay, do we want to be involved or don't we want to be involved. >> mr. riordan, regardless, you have that woman and others wondering if it were all photo shopped to try to cover up the police activity. >> well, listen, that is just

silly. the timing of the delivery of this information is a tough choice. you know, holding out on it may have been a strategic decision to let the crowd calm down and then you saw what happened when the video was released last night. an angry reaction. i'm not going to second guess the police investigation or arm chair quarterback. that say problem here. i think the cavelcade of the police officers on the investigation, there is no place for second guessing. >> to be continued for sure. thank you, gentlemen. i wish i had more time. i don't. the divide in ferguson goes beyond police versus the community. there is a much larger casm in the community. one that could be almost anywhere usa. and the show of force in ferguson. tanks and high power assault

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ferguson, missouri. home to 21,000 people. a town of stark divide. according to the census information, 67% of ferguson's community is black. 29% is white. ferguson is predominately black, it has a dominant police force. it's police chief and mayor are white. joining me now are critic and writer, angela davis and author larry elder. larry is author of "dear father, dear son." what you have in common is you tweet a lot. you tweeted about this. let me -- i'll show you and the audience, one of each of your

tweets. you said you're responding to someone, i don't ever hear about unarmed white children being killed by police. do you see this in uneven terms? >> there is context in tweets. that was in response to the captain saying this not a black and white thing. though we saw community working together, the crime seems very black. i have been in new york for years. from rodney king to now, every one of these cases happening to be a black male. i've never -- i'd love to know about it, but i never heard of a young white male shot because he had a candy bar or a wallet in his hand or choked to death on the street. this doesn't happen to our children. >> does she have a point in saying that? >> i guess my point, michael and thank you for having me, this is not your grandfather's america. we have a black president reelected. i live in los angeles. we have back-to-back black

police chiefs. the average cop someone encounters in the street is a black person or female. the other thing is what makes us feel in ferguson, however bad it was, won't be thoroughly investigated? there is national scrutiny. we have eric holder who has shown no reluctance to sue people. whatever happened will be thoroughly investigated. i think it is unfair to the police officer just as it is unfair to a black guy walking down the street to be pulled over because he is black. it is unfair to assume what happened between an officer and black person happened because of the officer's racial profiling. >> continuing on the racial theme, nora, show one of larry's tweets. 53 cops. three are black. how many applied? why the three black cops work for this apartheid force?

>> you also have to understand what is doing the hiring. we are looking at what we are getting from the community is there is systemic racism. this is a layered generational problem. whether you apply and who hires you and who is calling the shots, that is also in question. i don't think no one wants to be a police officer. i think that is just the way that community has been organized. you don't see black leadership. when you don't see black leadership, particularly when it is this sensitive and on the ground, you want to see people have empathy and understanding like when the captain came in and how things changed. how he was engaging. police officers used to be part of the community. not policing the community. it is a very different dynamic. >> another of my visual aids today. nora, one more. hit me with the image from drudge. i knew an image like this was coming. what you can't see because we blurred it, larry, that is

michael brown giving the finger. is that a depiction fair use in a case like this or a repeat of trayvon martin and the grill shot? >> you will have this in a case of social media. whether or not the ferguson police department is unfair. i live in los angeles. compton. the people running the city, the city leaders and government positions of authority, michael, are almost all black. what do you want me to do because my constituents are now latino? i cannot fix a street light in front of a black home or latino home? >> is it racist to think african-americans cannot be represented fairly by cops? >> what is different is we are not focusing on what is

happening here. we're in compton and talking about ferguson. the tragedy that happened in ferguson. i do think that having compassion and being part of the community is critical, particularly when you have communities that are poor and in unrest and feel oppressed. this is obvious the community is traumatized and beyond stressed out. when you heard in the press release yesterday, a young father with five sons and he is scared to death. we never hear that voice of young black father saying i'm scared for my children. he felt comfortable to say that to the black cop and not the head of the police that was white. >> the chief. angela davis and larry elder, thank you so much. tanks, tear gas, snipers. armed police in ferguson driving battering rams that came straight off the battle fields in iraq and afghanistan. is it really necessary?

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the local police in ferguson have been accused of using excessive force and rubber bullets and tear gas. the state highway patrol says the violence must be broke. he walked along protesters to show he is committed to do things a different way. norm stamper is the former chief of the seattle police department. jason fritz is a u.s. army officer. norm, i have heard from cops from my show this week said the bad guys have a lot of equipment of their own. this is what we need to be competitive with them. what's your response? >> there are times and places and circumstances that demand the use of s.w.a.t. equipment and weaponry and tactics. no disputing that. armed and barricaded suspects and school shooter situations of any kind. on the streets of an american city day in and day out,

appearing as military officers, military soldiers, i think is a huge mistake. the police in america belong to the people, not the other way around. >> people may recall your involvement in 1999 when you had to deal with the wto in seattle. i know, norm, you have the regrets of use of chemical agents in those protests. >> i have huge regrets, michael. that was the worst mistake of my 34--year career. i have made other mistakes, but that one was an absolutely unnecessary decision on my part to authorize the use of chemical agents against nonviolent, non threatening protesters. >> jason, i think the argument i heard from norm and others all week long, if law enforcement is armed to the teeth, it might have a contrary to reaction what

they are looking for. it may cause more violence from the response they are dealing with. my question for you as a veteran, does it operate the same way on a battle field or in an iraqi neighborhood? >> of course, it does. especially if the crowds are protesting against excessive force on behalf of the policing or controlling element to respond with more force and more control, it causes just more inflammation in the crowd. >> i guess local communities have been offere by the department of homeland security and they are hard pressed to turn it down. when they say to mayber mayberry r.f.d., they say we will take it. >> i think that is happening.

post-9/11, we have seen the federal government providing assistance to local police agencies that those agencies and their communities can really do without. i think it is a huge mistake for municipal law enforcement, but particularly small rural police departments in the country to go after m-raps and military-grade weaponry. some of these departments have one and two and three people in them. >> jason, as you watch the events not only in ferguson, this came on my radar screen when radley wrote about it. i thought about the boston marathon bombing and the equipment i had seen rolled out in the streets of boston. as a veteran, as you are watching police department responses, are you ever looking at the equipment and saying, my god, we didn't have that when we were over there? >> i would say the most equipment i saw we generally had. we did not have tear gas and things like that. it is not so much the equipment

they have, which is shocking to see on u.s. streets, but the fact these police don't look like they're trained in how to use properly for what they are trying to accomplish. it is police officers who are moderately trained on using military equipment acting how they perceive military would act. it is not the same. >> in other words, they lack the training you went through before you use that equipment on a battle field in iraq. >> correct. one of the main indications for me, especially in ferguson, was the pictures of the snipers that were highlighting themselves on tall vehicles on the streets having employed snipers in iraq before, this is not what you do with snipers. you want to put them places where they cannot be seen to counter precision shooting. >> i have taken note of the political reaction of this. these images that we are showing right now on cnn have brought together strange bed follows like rand paul who may not

agree, but are concerned about the military of police. norm stamper and jason fritz, thank you for being here. doppler radarren johnson wa michael brown when he was shot and killed. and texas governor rick perry will have to report to the county jail to be fingerprinted and have a mug shot. two felony counts against the potential 2016 contender.

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by now, you have seen the store surveillance video showing what police say is michael brown accompanied by dorien johnson robbing the convenience store. brown is seen stealing cigars from the store. upon walking out, brown is in a scuffle with the store attendant who is apparently stopping him from leaving. this is what dorien had to say. >> we were not causing problems with anybody. we had no weapons. >> dorien johnson has gotten a lawyer and has made several tv appearances along his attorney. they join me now. mayor, good to have you here.

did you know of your client's presence at what has been described as a strong-arm robbery before yesterday's release of information? >> yes, i did. i interviewed with dorien about two and a half hours before he retained me. then he told me the whole thing. just as long -- three or four days ago, we met with the fbi, we met with the justice department, we met with the prosecutor's office and representatives of the prosecutor's office. particularly the detective with the st. louis county police department. we laid this story out. dorien told them what he did when he woke up. he told about the story about he and mike going to the ferguson market. he told the story about big mike getting the cigarellos. they knew in advance that these things occurred. >> here is my question, counselor, why not put that information out on your terms? i know in my civil practice, if

i had a client about whom i had issues and not sure how they play, i would be the one letting the public know than my adversary do so. you know what the net net was of this when they released that information to police, they wrapped the officer's identity around the 19-page police report. >> yes, they did. that was a strategic move on behalf of the police department. it was tantamount to a hand grenade on the table. the chief had been released of duty. the county chief had been relieved. they were mad the governor took over the departments. they knew they had to release the name. they did it all in conjunction. like throwing a hand grenade down on the table. >> my question is why didn't you release that information at some point sooner than allowing them to do it yesterday? >> we knew what would happen. the media has an attempt to

distract the real issue. whether or not the officer used excessive force with big mike. it had nothing to do with what occurred at the store. >> your argument is it is irrelevant to the use of deadly force. i guess i should ask this. in the mind of the officer, if we accept what we have been told thus far and in the mind of the officer when he happens upon the scene and not knowing the two individual connection to the robbery, but sees the cigars, how does that change the dynamic? he is not just looking at two individuals walking down the street. he is looking at two individuals who may have been involved in a strong armed robbery. of what significance is that? >> this incident happened last saturday. a week ago today. the officer did not start -- the police did not start talking about the fact that the officer saw cigarellos until yesterday. they never indicated this officer saw cigarellos.

it is an attempt on the ferguson department to weave the cigarellos for justification. >> you believe this officer coming upon the scene without knowledge of the robbery and without knowledge that these individuals may have played a role in the robbery, but rather to him, they are two african-american teens who are walking down the middle of the street when they should have been on the sidewalk. >> that's right. he confronts them as police officers often do and said get the f on the sidewalk. and then it went ugly after that. >> i had calls in to my radio program yesterday. we showed footage on cnn today from individuals who were just totally disbelieving. going to say that maybe the video was photo shopped. it will be difficult to convince a jury of what happened in the case. there are so many conflicting opinions. >> i'm glad you said that

because basically it is our job now to stay focused on the matter at hand. the matter is what happened when that officer shot or chose to shoot big mike. i think the issue here is whether the officer used excessive force when he shot the young man. as a result of that, we are looking for the police report. we need to have that. two, where is the autopsy report? they want to release video and photos of what happened in the store, release the photos of the autopsy report so we know what type of condition big mike's body was in. >> final question, what do you expects the forensics will tell us relative to big mike? >> i think forensics will tell us that big mike was not in that car as the police department wants to assert. the forensics will tell us that big mike was shot at the car like the police department in ferguson does not want to admit. >> freeman bosley, thank you for

your time. >> thank you. this cannot be good for texas governor rick perry. indicted on two felony counts. this time, u.s. forces take aim at an all important dam and want to get it back from terrorists. generally wesley clark is here to talk about the u.s. intervention. you're finally here. long way from the sandlot. first game in the majors? you don't know "aarp". because this family is enjoying a cross-country baseball stadium trip they planned online at aarp travel. it's where your journey begins with inspiration, planning, booking, and hot travel tips from real pros. if you don't think seize the trip when you think aarp, then you don't know "aarp". find more surprising possibilities and get to know us at aarp.org/possibilities.

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president obama says a mission to rescue thousands of terrified iraqis from terrorists has been victorious. >> we broke the isul siege of sinjar. we helped save innocent lives. >> days after the president announced advisers were heading to iraq to help iraqis from militants, he said the mission did what it was intended to do. advisers will be going home soon. hundreds of other troops in iraq are staying and isis targets are continuing as terrorists sweep into northern iraq. i want to bring in the former commander of nato, wesley clark. general clark, i have been looking forward to chatting with

you. i made notes to say to general clark, i guess it was a good week in iraq. nuri al maliki is relinquishing power. yizidis are getting help. there is ever a good week in iraq in the foreseeable future? >> i think we will have a year, several years, or decade or more of trouble in the middle east. the whole region is in turmoil one way or another. some suppressed or repressed by authorities. some of it comes out and a lot of it is due to its young people without jobs. it's rising expectations and resentment of the west. it's protection of what they believe are the truths of god. so there's a lot of elements to this. it was a good week in iraq.

we did through working with the kurds and with the central intelligence agency providing military assistance to them on an urgent basis. the use of aircraft to bring in strikes, yes, we helped a lot of the yizidis get off the mountain. the bulk of them escaped. there apparently is still cell phone communication up there. we hope they will all be out of there. this is a problem far from over. the ultimate solution is going to be the nations of the region have to come together and eliminate this islamic state as they call themselves. so in that respect, the new prime minister in iraq, yes, that is a very hopeful sign. for whatever reasons, nuri al maliki had become so sectarian. he had become so vicious against his opponents, that he, himself was a destructive factor in the future of iraq.

it is a very wise move that we combine to put pressure on him and get him out of there. >> how much concern, sir, do you have been mission creep? here on cnn, we have the documentary of "the sixties." this is similar to how all that began. >> there may be similarities as a lot of differences with that. i don't think mission creep is the factor here. i think how do we bring the nations of the region together to confront a common threat when each nation is so different and so many are divided and having their own internal troubles? it is a real task for u.s. diplomacy and leadership. we will use diplomacy and economic persuasion and work the price of oil, which is very key in this region and we will use

our military to advise, assist, train and deliver ordinance. hopefully we will not have to put a lot of ground troops in there. you cannot rule it out as you look ahead years down the course. this is a whole region. this is different from southeast asia and thus far, we don't have the same level of super power rivalry that is the major factor here. although russia is involved, it is not the same as the 1960s. >> with regard to isis, i want to ask if you believe our failure to build a more moderate syrian opposition was a failure that left a big vacuum in syria? i ask you that question, sir, because you know secretary clinton said we left a big vacuum when she sat for an interview. do you share that view? >> i wish we could have done more with the opposition. i wasn't on the inside. i'm not really capable of

weighing the sides of the argument. here is what i saw from the outside. normally what you need if you are going to provide assistance is you need political leadership that can command the loyalty of the men and women who are doing the fighting. when you have a situation where there isn't political leadership, then you are putting weapons into various armed groups. in syria, there were hundreds of groups. you don't know the outcome. particularly in the middle east, where it is only hard to tell who is on your side and who is not on your side. who will not be on your side tomorrow although they say they are on your side today. it is confusing and difficult area to work with. maybe we could have done more. that's an inside baseball kind of discussion. from the outside, what's clear is right now, it would be helpful if we had a strong political leadership for the syrian opposition that they can command the loyalty of the force

that can resist both isis and assad. that is what we really need. i hope they'll come together. they are still talking about it. >> thank you, general clark. we appreciate your service and time. texas governor and potential presidential hopeful rick perry now facing two felony indictments. in our need to know culture, did we really need to know all those details about robin williams' suicide? let me get this straight... [ female voice ] yes? lactaid® is 100% real milk? right. real milk. but it won't cause me discomfort. exactly, because it's milk without the lactose. and it tastes? it's real milk! come on, would i lie about this? [ female announcer ] lactaid. 100% real milk. no discomfort. come on, would i lie about this? this is a woyeah!esitating on a life-changing decision. at university of phoenix, we-

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texas governor rick perry has been indicted on two felony counts. accused of abusing his power to get the district attorney to resign. he threatened to veto funding for the county unless that representative stepped down. the presidential candidate will have to report to the jail to be booked and fingerprinted. errol lewis joins me now. they say all politic is local. this is getting into the personalities. >> what happens is the local prosecutor who covers austin, the state capital, is an anti-corruption investigator. they were looking at whether or

not it was right for rick perry to tamper with the funding of a cancer research product. wre rick perry got back at them. the representative there's videotape of her acting out. do you know i am? i'm gawk to do this do that. she agreed to step oun and not run for eelection, it wasn't enough for rick perry. he said, step down needily or he would eliminate the funding, he made good on the threat and that's why he got indicted. >> this woman lost the confidence of the public she serves. doing a public mitzvah because she's a drunkard trying to get her out of office. >> he pushed it too far. she was already going to leave. for him to squelch it, eliminate all the funding, not just for

the cancer, but all of it. that amounts to, according to the grand jury, possibly po organization co-oergs co coercion which is a felony. >> he's been on a rehabilitation tour with some success it seems among republican loyalists because he wants to go again. what now? the only person who got ahead of a mug shot was frank sinatra. i don't know if you ever saw the sinatra mug shot. can a presidential candidate survive a mug shot? >> that's not his biggest problem. it's that he's polling in 5% and and% in iowa and new hampshire. always especially tough for rick perry because he doesn't do well in those states. he wanted to sort of maybe somehow coast through and make it to south carolina and prove himself in a region that really might like him.

much harder now with or without a mug shot. >> 20 seconds left. big question. does he smile for the mug shot ar pull a nick nolte. i'm serious. should he smile or look grim? >> i advise him to not smile, actually. >> not smile? i'm p.o.-ed about this, it's not funny. >> rick perry thinks it's a laughing matter. >> appreciate you being here. this week we saw an icon's death. something happened afterward i think will tarnish his legacy. . if it doesn't work fast... you're on to the next thing. neutrogena® rapid wrinkle repair has the fastest retinol formula to visibly reduce fine lines and wrinkles in just one week. neutrogena®. do you guys have identity theft protection? [ male voice ] i'm sorry, did you say identity distribution? no. protection. identity theft protection. you have selected identity distribution.

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hey, one last thing. earlier this week, we knew the identity of the shooter in ferguson, i sent the following tweet. i said, odd we know exactly how robin williams died, too much, but not the name of the officer who shot mike brown.

what we still need to know more about mike brown's death, but i think we've heard too much about the manner in which robin williams took his own life. i watched that press conference by the marin county, california sheriffs office coroner's division. the lieutenant was briefing the media and he was remarkably graphic in his level of detail. now, you might think, well, michael, could have turned it off. i didn't. to accentuate my hypocrisy i'm talking about it. learn the manner, found in a bedroom. a suggestion his wife slept secret separately. not completely clothed, in a raised, but seated business. tried to cut his wrists, a belt found around his neck. over the top. an immediately blowback via twitter. the lft defended his handling in response to an inquire fri nbc he said in an e-mail, the sheriff's office understands how

the release of the information you heard yesterday may be viewed by disturbing as some and unnecessary by others but under california law all that information is considered public information and we're precluded from denying access to it. "usa today" wrote on the subject and quoted craig harvey, chief coroner investigators with the l.a. department of the coroner saying we got the same blowback from michael jackson's death. he further noted the coroner's office is a public records office "so all that information as uncomfortable as it might be is fair game." hold on. i get that the california public records act necessitates the release of such information to the public. having read the law, i don't see a requirement that it be off nerd a press conference and broadcast nationwide. wipe not release the information through a report, documents would limit the sensationalistic aspects. there's something more dignified in reading the black and white as compared to seeing it on tv,

being disseminated by individuals with limited media experience. when a tragedy strikes a community unaccustomed to the media glare we meet a public servant embracing hirs 15 minutes of fame, few equipped to handle the media spotlight. not only did i think the robin williams availability was in poor taste i'm concerned about its effects. robin williams was revered by all age groups. i worry details of his behavior can have a contagion attack. i share with with the former president of the psychological association. he agreed and told me something else. he said he was concerned williams' stature would diminish in the eyes of many who looked up to him because of their misunderstanding of depression. a notion bolstered when some publicly criticized williams as cowardly. i understand the importance of maintaining the public right to information. i am calling for

censorship. that's it for me. have a great week, and i will see you back here next saturday. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com i hope that being a saturday you got wake up on your own with no alarm. i'm christi paul. good morning to you. fleer atlanta. >> i'm victor blackwell live in ferguson, missouri. 10:00 on the east coast. 9:00 here in ferguson. you're in the "cnn newsroom." victor, i miss you in the studio, so glad you're there covering everything going on in ferguson. there has been breaking news there overnight as looters hit more stores there. right? >> yeah, that's right. we want to show you video from just a few hours ago. the rain's coming down now, but earlier, a few hours ago overnight, actually a s.w.a.t.

team in riot gear with the gas masks, armored trucks, reminiscent of what we've seen earlier in the week, pointing military-style weapons marching slowly towards people who gathered in the rain outside the ferguson market and liquor store there, and we've got the numbers from our affiliate wmov. >> right. reporting some 200 protesters. they're there, as you can see. and that eventually they were met by about 100 officers. now, police reportedly say there was also at least one shooting. we understand, at a nearby intersection whip the victim rushed to the hospital and an officer hurt by either a brick or rock that was thrown? >> yeah. this is coming one week to the day after 18-year-old michael brown was shot. the reason all of this began. he was killed by a member of the ferguson police department, and just yesterday the city's police chief named the officer who pulled the trigger, his name is darren wilson. 28 years old, and the