landfill. someone said a brothel in tuscany. i think that was jack gray. and lastly, better than the jeans anderson insists on never washing. all right. fine. that's what i call a burn on the "riduculist." that's it. i'm going to get rid of my candle. you can go back to the smell of rotted cheese. that does it for us. thanks for watching. ungrateful employees. "cnn tonight" starts now. this is "cnn tonight." i'm don lemon. you're looking live now. new york city, where the rules are changing when it comes to marijuana. pretty soon people are going to start getting tickets instead of being arrested for pot possession. well, you know i'm not unfamiliar with marijuana, and a lot of you watching right now could probably say the same thing. but in the wake of pro-pot votes in alaska, oregon, and d.c. last week are we getting ahead of ourselves? is weed spreading too fast? and speaking of changing the rules, there's news on another topic we talked about a lot, and that's the n word. the nfl wants to ban the word on the field. but is it realistic?

who can say it, and who decides? plus a former baltimore ravz cheerleader charged with sexually abusing a 15-year-old boy. adult women preying on teenagers. is it happening more often or are we just hearing about it more? we've got a whole lot to get to tonight but i want to begin with america's marijuana obsession. cnn's miguel marquez joins me with that. miguel? >> reporter: hello there, don. look, if you want to know where pot is going in this country, by 2019 about 17 states it is expected may have recreational pot on the books. and if you want to know where all of that is going, well, follow the money. that's just what we're doing here in vegas. the business of pot isn't waiting for laws to catch up. here in las vegas investigators taking a risk for possibly huge returns as the cannabis industry is moving fast to capture a market just emerging from the shadows. >> this is troy dayton. you're the ceo and co-founder of ark view group, which has invested in marijuana businesses for some time.

how is this business growing? >> well, in 2013 our research arm put this at a $1.5 billion industry, the legal cannabis market, growing to a $2.6 billion industry this year. that's a 68% increase. >> and you see that going on in years? >> absolutely. you will not find another industry growing at this clip. >> reporter: businesses like david hua and his meadow care app, operating for now only in california. >> how does it work? >> the menu loads up. you choose from flowers, topicals -- >> so i want a quarter ounce of mob boss. >> all right. we'll get a quarter of mob boss. let's do that. and then once you're done you check out and you place your order. >> and then how soon before it shows up at your door? >> an hour. hour or less. >> reporter: companies extracting oil from cannabis among the most popular with the concentrated oil used in everything from medicine to vaporizers to candy. >> how big has your company

gotten? >> this last year we've grown 400%. >> 400%? >> yes. we'll grow twice that much next year, definitely. >> reporter: and today's edibles not your dorm room pot brownies. >> our most popular product is the savory pretzels because people expect a brownie, they expect sweet, they expect sort of a snack food. our pretzels are not going to impact your sugar. they're not going to be unhealthy. they're something you can eat every day. >> reporter: businesses here just the tip of the green iceberg. in oregon and alaska, the two newest states whose voters said yes to recreational pot on election day, ark view conducted its own market research. in those two states alone in just the first year the estimated take of recreational pot, about $277 million. tax revenue estimated about $30 million. marijuana acceptance becoming law of the land. 23 states plus the district of columbia now allow medical marijuana. 11 more allow specific types of medical marijuana in limited

cases. on the recreational side marijuana legal in colorado and washington, now approved and coming to alaska, oregon, and d.c. in 2016 five more states will have pot legalization propositions on the ballot. by 2019 the possibility in 17 states and d.c., buying a joint as easy as buying a beer. >> public support for changing our marijuana laws is growing very rapidly. it's just a matter of time before we see enough states take this on and potentially see the federal government take this on. >> reporter: what the pot industry wants most, banking laws changed so they can operate like any other business. that would take an act of congress and a presidential signature. a tall order for a federal government which has so far decided not to partake. now, businesses, investors, and states are moving rapidly ahead. new york sort of crawling into it, i suppose. today new york city announcing

that they were going to lower the fines, or the problems that one has if you're caught busted, smoking it out on the streets. rather than getting jailed and handcuffs and taken downtown, you just get a ticket and that would not give those young individuals a record going forward. so some good news out of new york for individuals who use marijuana there. don? >> you get a ticket and a summons to go to court, if you can remember to do it. miguel marquez, thank you very much. appreciate that. now i want to bring in the former police commissioner of new york, bernard kerik. neil franklin, a retired maryland state police major and executive director of leap, law enforcement against prohibition. and peter bensinger, a former d.e.a. administrator under presidents ford, carter, and reagan. i want to go to bernie first. bernie. you heard what miguel said. new york city officers now will ticket rather than arrest people for small amounts of marijuana. you're the former police commissioner of new york. what do you think of this? >> i think it's the right thing

to do, and here's why. realistically, cops were able to give summonses for joints and small amounts in the past. it's at their discretion. i think what bratton's trying to do is make it this is going to be the policy. and look, you have shootings in new york, violence in new york, other things going on. i personally would rather have those cops out there aggressively attacking crime than b.s.-ing around with small amounts of marijuana. >> peter, do you think that the change of policy is a mistake? you do. why? >> i do because i think we're messing with the laws that are on the books. and i think really the question in america is do you want more or fewer people smoking marijuana? marijuana's against the law, federal law. it's against the law in almost every other country. and what's happening is the mayor and his police chief have decided they're going to change

what is on the books in new york state and they're not going to make misdemeanor arrests -- >> peter, with all due respect, i don't think that's what they're saying. if you listen to the story that was before this, we were wondering if -- >> i heard the story. >> -- many states and places around the country are beginning to accept medical and legal marijuana. and so what they're saying is -- >> why do you think that is? >> -- they're not changing prosecution of it. they're changing how they deal with it. rather than taking someone to jail right away they give them a ticket -- >> the reason you've invited me on the program, this is a very important subject. most of the states that have passed this so-called recreational marijuana have done it because they've been funded by very rich people with $6 million in the state of washington. 3 million in the state of colorado. 20-1 in alaska. and the people that oppose this aren't putting up that money in advertisements, billboards, public information. the national institute on drug

abuse says this -- marijuana's addictive. it's not safe as medicine. in colorado the fourth-graders are selling pot in elementary school. and the arrests in the nation's prisons, they're not tens of thousands of people in jail or prison for the use or possession of marijuana. out of a million people, a million three in prison, less than 1/3 of 1% are there for the use of possession -- >> i want to go to neil -- >> arrested in new york commissioner kerik will be able to comment on this. >> okay. >> those who get arrested also are arrested in conjunction with other crimes. >> all right, peter, we don't have a lot of time here. i want to get my other guests in. neil -- sorry to cut you off. neil, i want to get you in here. you want to respond to what he had to say. go ahead. >> yeah, look, alcohol prohibition was also against the law, but it was one of the best things we did when we ended it. now, that was done state by state, just like we're doing

with marijuana today. my home state of maryland never supported alcohol prohibition. now, look, thank goodness for the voters. the voters have decided that enough is enough, enough of arresting so many people. an arrest is all it takes to destroy someone's life today with the technology that we have. every arrest for the most part goes into a data base where anyone can find out the information regarding arrest. and as for our young kids, selling marijuana in school? that's because of prohibition. drug dealers hire, recruit, coerce our young people into working for them, dropping out of school and selling marijuana. look, young people can go into school, they go into school every day, and they sit in a classroom. an adult cannot go into a classroom, cannot go into a school and sell anything. but when you have kids enrolled in skoolt who are hired by drug dealers, that's when -- >> these aren't hired by drug dealers.

fourth-graders selling to each other. and also this question about prohibition and alcohol. this is not a good comparison. if you want to have people -- >> it's an excellent comparison. >> no. 50% of americans drink alcohol. 27% smoke. 9% use marijuana. and the reason they don't use that much is because there's a legal sanction against it. if you want to open it up and let there be no sanction and people arrested can get those arrests -- >> here's the deal. here's the deal. >> by going to court -- >> the marijuana industry does exist -- >> neil, let him finish and then you can respond. >> they can get their arrest expunged. >> okay. >> they can stay off marijuana. and it's not a question of -- >> let minimum respond. go ahead, neil. >> look, like it or not, the marijuana industry does exist. it has existed for more than decades. it will exist tomorrow.

the question is who's going to regulate it? who's going to control the industry? if you think the drug dealers are currently doing a great job, if you think the cartels are doing just a wonderful job in recruiting our children into this business and wreaking the havoc that they do in our communities, if you think they're doing such a great job, then let it stay that way. but i personally think that we should take control of the industry and regulate it. that's the best thing we can do. >> is that possible, bernie -- hang on, peter. bernie kerik, is that possible, what he's saying -- peter, let me -- there are other guests on the -- there are other guests on the program. >> i want to make one point. the cartels are selling the drugs in colorado, not the regulated legal shops. >> okay. >> they're cheaper than the regulated shops. and that's who's selling the pot in colorado after legalization. >> all right, bernie, go ahead. >> the regulators have not won. >> peter, please be respectful. there are other people on the panel. go ahead, bernie. >> i couldn't hear your question. go ahead. >> so let's talk about what he

said, that we should regulate it some way instead of having kids go into schools because it's unregulated and having people recruit people perhaps in his estimation that it should somehow be regulated. is that possible? >> it is possible. but i've got to go back to one thing. nobody changed the laws in new york city. the laws didn't change. the law didn't change in the state. it's the processing of the arrest. that's what's changed. and the processing is going to be more expedient. it's going to be faster. it's going to be quicker. and it's going to keep cops on the street enforcing the law and going after violent criminals instead of running around chasing people smoking pot. the laws have not changed. >> they're not doing that now. >> go ahead, peter. >> they're not going around chasing people smoking pot. that's not happening. the police commissioner -- >> we're arresting -- we're arresting 600,000 people every year in this country for marijuana possession. so we are chasing them. we are wasting time doing that. and it's a big problem for law

enforcement. it's a huge distraction for law enforcement. >> peter, as bernie and neil are saying, they don't think that they have the manpower to deal with this. there are other issues that are more important. >> there are probably less than a handful of people in rikers island or the cook county jail simply there for the possession or use of marijuana. arrests, yes. lots of them. but they're made in conjunction with other criminal investigations. with traffic cops -- >> that's not true. >> well, you're saying that. >> thank you very much. thanks, bernie. thanks, neil. thanks, peter. appreciate all of you joining me this evening. we'll continue this conversation. we have got much more to come on america's marijuana obsession. as you can see, it gets pretty heated. our dr. drew pinsky says marijuana is addictive and can be a lot more dangerous than you think. he is here with me tonight. plus a former cheerleader accused of sexually abusing a 15-year-old boy. do we see abuse differently if

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americans' attitudes about marijuana changing. but is pot use a gateway to experimenting with harder drugs? dr. drew pinsky is an expert on addiction and he is the host of hln's "dr. drew on call." good evening, sir. did you see that conversation before? man, oh man. >> i did. yeah. and it's -- you know, the drug marijuana inspires passions on all sides. it's really rather extraordinary. i've never seen anything like it. to the point where i can't even have any kind of rational conversation about what i've observed clinically without getting -- boy, my twitter feeds just light up with me being attacked for how dare i say

something that in any way besmirches the implication that somehow pot is anything other than healthy and wonderful. >> i was just sharing some of my twitter exchanges with the folks in the studio and we were having a good laugh about what they said, right? yeah. so you've said that marijuana can be extremely addictive. so clear this up for us. addictive? gateway drug? >> yes. well, the gateway, those are two separate issues. the addiction, i am not here saying that marijuana's going to be addictive to everybody. certainly not. and no more so, maybe even less so than alcohol. alcohol, let's remind ourselves, alcohol in terms of the impact on the health of this country vastly -- >> alcohol more dangerous you say? or more addictive? >> well, people forget, alcohol is carcinogenic. the withdrawal from alcohol is the only drug withdrawal that is commonly fatal. it affects more people. it affects more of us. it is easy to become an alcoholic the way our culture endorses alcohol. i'm not saying that we need another problem in cannabis. the idea that a good drug and a

bad drug, that whole notion is completely flawed in my opinion. it's just humans and how the human biology interacts with these molecules that cause certain motivational disturbances. and states. some is a pleasant component and the other is this drive disorder we call addiction. and it's just simply a fact that i have treated marijuana addiction very commonly. in colorado, where it's now legal, you're seeing an increase in referrals for treatment for cannabis as a primary and secondary drug. it's just a fact. >> the question, as you say, we don't need one more. and i understand what you're saying. but -- >> i didn't say we should -- listen, i'm not saying people shouldn't decide what the laws are. that's up to the people. i'm just saying to use one problem to fend another is a mistake. >> i understand that. i get you. so why is one legal and the other one not legal? alcohol versus marijuana. >> i would say that's bizarre in my opinion. that's completely bizarre. that we have -- that goes under the heading of there being good drugs and bad drugs, which is simply not true. tobacco is good and cannabis is

bad? that's anathema. that's not a fact. that's just simply ridiculous. so our laws are kind of bizarre as they pertain to substances. but you know, i'm not sure that i want -- the fact that it's illegal does help me help those patients that do have problems controlling their relationship with cannabis. and it is for some people, they love it. they just love it. and it becomes very problematic for them when they start having side effects from its use. it usually takes many years before people start to have trouble with it. some people don't. they just continue on using. but when they love the drug, they fall in love with it very quickly. usually after the second or third exposure. and they preoccupy about it from that point on -- >> all right. let me get in here. >> -- and eventually down the line the effects start wearing off. >> because i have you here i want you to weigh in on something else. this is another story in the headlines. women that are now being charged with sexual abuse of teenage boys. here's cnn's jean casarez. >> reporter: who can forget these faces? mary kay letourneau and debra

lafave. both teachers. both married. and both having sexual relations with their teenage students. lafave pleaded guilty to having sex with a 14-year-old boy. >> my greatest regret would probably be the fact that i put this young man through this. >> reporter: letourneau convicted of raping her student vili fulau. following a prison sentence the two married. beautiful women preying on boys. and now we allegedly have another one. >> may we speak to you? >> reporter: former baltimore ravens cheerleader molly shattuck is facing rape charges, unlawful sexual contact and providing alcohol to a minor for allegedly having sex with a 15-year-old boy at a beach house in delaware labor day weekend. she's recently divorced and well known in some circles, having published a book entitled "vibrant living," promoting a healthy lifestyle. allegedly she contacted her victim through her own son. she has pleaded not guilty.

>> she's just a classic example. she is no different than an abusing priest, an abusing rabbi, or a parent. >> reporter: so are more women committing sexual crimes with minors, or are we just hearing about it more? it could boil down to more young male victims gaining courage to speak out. >> it was a time when everybody just pretended this isn't really a problem. >> reporter: but there is a problem. experts say a profile of these women may show they are lonely, want to control someone, and want a lot of attention. but sexual relations between a minor and an adult women is a serious crime. >> there was a time when boys would have been told you know, they were lucky they got to be with an older woman. >> reporter: but do beautiful women sexual offenders get a better deal than their male counterparts? many believe that's the case. lafave's attorney seemed to sum it up best. >> to place an attractive young woman in that kind of hellhole is like putting a piece of raw

meat in with the lions. >> reporter: lafave was given seven years probation. but notoriety for life. >> as you can see, my face has been plastered on every internet address, every news outlet. >> reporter: and if attention is one motivator for these women, their names can become household words. letourneau even had her own lifetime movie. "all-american girl." but is it worth the ultimate title for some? registered sex offender. jean casarez, cnn, new york. >> all right. so here's dr. drew again. dr. drew, molly shattuck is the latest to grab headlines. 47 years old. allegedly made sexual advances on a 15-year-old friend of her son. is it about power? psychological issue? what's going op here? >> reporter: in my experience when i've had to deal with female perpetrators, more often than not they themselves were sexually abused in their

childhood as well. that issue kind of feeds into this. but i think there's something more important to remember here, don. in jean's little piece there she didn't point out why this is such a harmful crime. this harms these young males. our culture as that law professor pointed out used to say oh, these boys are lucky. the facts are, and they are facts, these boys have more psychiatric problems, more depression, more suicide, more substance abuse, personality disorders, more anti-social behavior. they are profound profoundly affected by these experiences. so they don't believe they do, and oftentimes they don't realize the impact it's had on them until years and years later. these young males need to be protected from these perpetrators just as much as we would wish to protect a young female. >> dr. drew, we're going to get our money's worth out of you tonight. so stick with us. >> fair enough. >> up next, are cases involving female sexual predators rare, or are there a lot of them that go unreported? and are male victims more reluctant to come forward? we'll get some answers.

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shattuck the woman you just heard of, former nfl cheerleader accused of abusing a 15-year-old boy, they are shocking but how common are they? roger kenneth, anti-violence advocate and child protection specialist. mel robbins, cnn commentator and legal analyst. and dr. drew pinsky is back with us. we're hearing there are more cases. we've heard about so many cases of sexual female predators lately. are there more of them or just are we hearing about more? and i say that, i preface that, i want to ask that to you, roger, because we just got a press release from gloria allred saying she's going to hold a press conference tomorrow. she represents five young men who are abused by their teacher. the teacher is also in prison for molesting some of the boys. this is at grand rapids university preparatory academy. how common is this? >> i'd say it's very common. and honestly, don, i don't believe that the numbers are getting higher. i just believe it's being reported more and perceived more. sexual abuse, whether of males

or females by males or by females is something that has ridden the tide of humanity for millenia. it has always been there. there's no rhyme or reason. it's cross-cultural. it has nothing to do with socioeconomic status or ethnicity or anything. from time to time within the human population individuals arise that seek to harm children sexually. it's just the way it is. so i do not believe that we are seeing any more of it particularly. i just think we are perceiving it more. and those are good things, actually. it's because the stigma upon victimization is lowering. it's because there are more children, particularly males, who are willing to come forward and state that they've been victimized or admit it. >> that wasn't always the case, though, right? >> absolutely. >> males were more reluctant to come forward. >> correct. particularly males. >> so mel, have a field day with cases like shattuck's, the 15-year-old boy being abused -- having sex with an adult. if true, though, is this a case of child abuse?

>> well, it's a case of rape, don. i mean, the age of consent in delaware is 18. and they do have some of the so-called romeo and juliet laws that say if you're a minor and you're engaged in consensual sexual activity with somebody that is within four years of your age you can legally consent. but this is a woman, don, who was 32 years older than this kid and based on some of the facts being reported clearly went after him. so this is not a case of statutory rape but of a predator that went after a kid. she's buying the kid beer. she's taking him for the weekend -- >> mel? >> yes. >> i said comics have a field day because most people will say most guys will say, man, when i was 15, i wish i was as lucky -- and dr. drew, you mentioned that a little bit earlier. i'll let you weigh in. but mel, you understand the mentality of most -- that's the

male mentality. >> well, i think that is the male mentality of about a decade ago. and i agree 100% with what roger was saying, and i agree with what dr. drew was saying in your previous segment, that the more people talk about this and they realize that one out of six boys and one out of four girls are the victims of either molestation or some kind of sexual assault before they're an adult, the more that people are going to come forward, don. >> so clearly, dr. drew, we're talking about there is a double standard in terms of how we perceive female sex offenders. wouldn't we react differently if the predator was a 47-year-old man instead of a 47-year-old woman? >> we absolutely, absolutely we do. and the point i think all three of us are trying to make is that we should not because the impact on the victim is potentially just as deleterious. in the past we sort of looked the other way or because of the male motivational system assumed, well, he's being gratified in some way, but the reality is he's being shattered in fact and the trajectory of his development is being

derailed and he will realize it years later. he will sometimes feel lucky when he's 15. at 25 not so much. and i want to take quick issue with what roger said. the problem with sexual abuse in the last 20 or 30 years, i have seen it expand. and it feels to me like when somebody's a perpetrator they don't perpetrate on one child. they perpetrate on many. and a certain percentage of those are going to become perpetrators. unfortunately, that's just the way it works. so it has an exponential growth built into it. and i think after the so-called sexual revolution we unleashed a certain amount of this in a way we had not seen before. >> yeah. and jean casarez said in her story before this they are victims, right? but we should say that shattuck denies all the charges here. is the penalty penalty the same under the law for women and men? first to roger -- >> yes. >> go ahead, mel, since you answered. >> yes, it is the same. but whether or not a judge sentences somebody to the same conviction is kind of left up to the judge's distraction.

i looked at some of the recent cases, don, in delaware. there was a guy that was convicted of very similar charges that was sentenced to 25 years. a woman convicted of those charges in 2007 was convicted to three years. so there is a difference in terms of how judges treat them. and just one more thing to dr. drew's point. one of the things about predators is it's about access and about the fact so many kids have smartphones and social media accounts grants more access to people that they otherwise might not have had. >> roger, you were saying? >> first of all, i very much respect dr. drew, and i'm so proud to be next to these two professionals, but i'm going to fire right back at dr. drew. i disagree. >> sure. >> vehemently on one point. in fact, the vast, vast majority of people who are sexually offended against do not themselves become predatory people. it just doesn't work that way. >> that's true. but a certain percentage do. >> well, correct -- yes and no,

though. there's a lot of psychological research that's come out recently suggesting that sexual offenders who are caught will self-report when they're in front of a judge or probation officer in order to get a lighter sentence or to frankly use an abuse excuse. so i understand what dr. drew's saying. again, i have a lot of respect for him and i think what he's saying is correct. but i would take issue with the idea that we have an exponential problem because more people are being offended. i honestly don't believe that's true. i think the numbers -- and again, i very much agree with mel, when she says one in four -- one in four girls and about one in six boys. those numbers are correct. but honestly, i don't think they've changed. i think it's always been that way. i think we're just perceiving it more. >> dr. drew, i'm up against the clock. you know how this works. you wanted to say something about what he said? >> we have to just look at the data. that's what will determine who's right and who's wrong here. but it's a massive problem either way. we all agree on that. >> thanks, everybody. appreciate it. coming up people busted with small amounts of pot in new york may be able to walk away with a ticket instead of an arrest record. but will that open up a whole new can of worms? we're going to debate it next.

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new york city's about to change its policy on possession of small amounts of pot, difg

police the option of writing offenders a ticket instead of taking them into custody. joining me to talk about whether that's a good idea is charles blow, cnn political commentator and "new york times" editorialist. l.z. granderson. and of course we couldn't get enough of mel robbins. l.z., talking about pot now. >> why are you starting with the brother with the dreadlocks talking about pot? >> because you look rastafarian. are you familiar with marijuana -- >> i'm sorry, what was the question? >> nice, l.z. >> ticketing them for the offense instead of arresting them, is that the way to go? >> i think so. when you look at the science -- honestly, we need to be having a grownup conversation about this across the nation period and really look at the science versus the fears of the past. you have to remember this war on drugs started with president nixon. and his dislike of hippies. in addition to what was happening with our veterans

coming back from vietnam. where marijuana was placed in our lexicon started with president nixon, and we haven't changed since then. and we've changed a lot in this country since president nixon. it only makes sense we would reevaluate this as well. >> do you think it's a good idea what new york city is doing? >> absolutely. it's a good start. it shouldn't be the end of it. >> we heard from you the last segment, so i'm going to go to charles now. do you think it's a good idea? >> well, because there is such an extreme racial bias in the way that marijuana arrest policies are conducted right now, you have to offer some relief just in order to be fair. what the data show us is that black and whites use marijuana at about the same rates. however, blacks are about ten times more likely to be arrested for marijuana possession than their white counterparts. if you look at that and you say if you turn that upside down and

whites were being arrested at ten times the rate of blacks for the exact same level of usage, if you believe that that would be okay, then maybe you can make this argument. if you believe there would be a large hue and cry about that, you have to submit that this is not a fair application of the law and you must offer some level of relief. >> and you're talking about the level of relief is what the mayor is proposing. >> exactly. >> let me ask you this, charles. what about the potential for racial profiling with these tickets? because these tickets don't really reflect race and arrests do. >> i'm sorry. i didn't understand what you were saying. what do you mean the potential for racial profiling? there's already racial profiling. >> but racial profiling in this as well because the tickets don't reflect race. >> listen, there's rampant profiling that exists all across law enforcement and we are trying as a society as best we can to stamp that out.

and if we can -- every step we can take along that path to eliminate racial profiling in our application of the law we should take those steps. is this a perfect one that would eliminate racial profiling completely? of course it's not. there are human beings who are still on the beat who are applying the law. and that's going to be a part of the application. >> i want mel to get in. mel? >> well, charles, l.z., great to see you guys. i can just tell you anecdotally, don, straight out of law school, i was a public defender in manhattan. and what i saw firsthand practicing in new york city is exactly what charles was saying. most of my clients that were taken into custody and arrested for marijuana possession-related offenses were african-american or latino. it was very rare that you saw the white guys. so i think charles is absolutely right from the racial standpoint. i just personal disclosure think

marijuana needs to be legalized. it needs to be taxed. the people who possess marijuana and smoke it should not be in our prisons. that they should be out on the street. and one of the things that i think is great about the fact that it's just a ticket is when you're talking about arrests, don, it also means taking somebody into custody and searching them. which is yet another and deeper violation of somebody's liberty and that's why -- >> it's also -- >> it's also what it does to your record. and many times people can't get jobs because of minor things, repairing small amounts of marijuana. i understand that. but there's also a question about if the ticketing part -- the reason i asked charles. if the ticketing part would be fair because tickets don't often reflect race as arrests do. that's a question. go ahead. quickly, because i have to move on. >> if they're profiling they're profiling. but i think people would rather get a ticket and pay a fine than get thrown into a holding pen and spend the evening in the tombs. >> and having that on the record for the rest of your life. stand by, everyone. coming up, we're going to talk

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history in this country from hate speech to hip-hop. but who can say it and who can't and who decides? i want you to listen to this. this is from the "washington post's" interactive project. it's entitled "the n word." i have to warn you, okay? you're going to hear that word. here it is. >> when was the first time you heard the word nigger? >> i'll never forget that day. >> his little son came outside. he said, we don't want no niggers around here. >> i was born with the word. >> how does hearing the n word make you feel? >> like my ears are bleeding. >> i'm totally desensitized. >> trash. >> there's also the power of that word to wound, to make you take a knee. >> it is misleading and can be confusing. >> it's not really confusing. you just want to say it. >> you can't have a conversation about the n word without talking about white guilt. >> who is saying this word? >> i hear it on tv. i hear it in movies. i hear it in music. >> people are integrating on a faster level today than ever before. >> it's not black no more. >> white people are not driving around going look at these -- i'm not a nigger. i'm not ignorant. >> i'm a nigger addict.

>> we're discussing a word. >> back now with charles blow, lz granderson and mel robbins. so charles, we have talked about this so much. i think you september me a text last year and said how much longer are you going to talk about this n word? and now it's back in the news. listen, i know it's an important subject. i'm tired of debating it. do whatever you want to do with it. >> you just toss td to me that way? >> i'm like you know, we have talked about this. i don't think we're going to change many people's minds on it. people who want to say it are going to say it. and people who don't they're going to stick to their guns too. >> right. you set it up perfectly. you know, there are a lot of historical roots to this word. and it is a racial slur. and it was used that way as a form of hate speech directed at african-americans. and now a lot of african-americans are trying to reclaim, desensitize, defang the word. and you can have arguments or discussions about whether or not that is the proper thing to do.

a lot of people who have been the recipients of hate speech can sometimes adopt those words and try to smooth off the rough edges of those. on race and bias, however, i prefer to look at, you know, deeds rather than words. whether or not people use hate speech back and forth can be find of a bit deceptive. it's kind of impolitic to do in public. very few people actually do it. but the deed and the hate behind it can still be present. and if you pay attention to the deed a bit more than the word i think we get a long way -- >> but they're talk about using it on the football field. and i can -- people aren't going to be saying hey, you know, using it -- >> you can have those discussions. you can have discussions about the propriety of whether or not -- >> let me ask you a question. do you use it in your personal life? >> do i? >> yes. >> no. >> you do? >> no.

>> no. l.z.? >> no. >> mel? >> absolutely not. and in fact, i find it really confusing to try to explain to my kids why it's -- the word with the a instead of the e-r in the end is in so many music lyrics and why it's okay in some circles and in my mind it's never okay. don, i think a lot about shannon sharpe. remember with the richie incognito story where he was being bullied and the n word was being used, you know, to bully the player. one of the things shannon sharpe said really struck me, which is if it's going on in the locker room it's because some of the african-american players are letting it go on. and so i just have a zero tolerance policy but i also feel like i'm not -- it's not a subject that i have i guess the proper authority to talk on, so to speak. >> i understand, l.z. i understand all sides of it. and i'm not the word police.

i just think that people should be more responsible when they use it. so if you want to use it, fine. but if someone uses it around me i'll say i don't like that word, don't say that word. but i don't know how you feel about that. >> you know, to answer your question before, i don't use the word. my son doesn't use the word. our house-old doesn't use the word. but the word is heard through various forms of pop culture. but with respect to the nfl, it's important to remember that the only reason why the nfl is having this conversation is because white men were caught on tape saying the word. it's not because the players were saying the word on the field. it's because they had two high-profile cases, one of which was mentioned by name, in which white men were seen saying the word so, the nfl felt it needed to do something then. very much in the way in which ray rice was caught on tape with domestic violence and then the nfl decided to act. it's important to remember that part of the conversation as well. this is about protecting the brand of the nfl and not about having a larger conversation that we're trying to have here about whether or not this word has a home in our vocabulary in

today's time. >> but i do believe it's really important too for us to say that if you are a historically maligned population and there are particular slurs that have been used against you then it is up to you and your community to work out -- >> charles, but -- >> i'm sorry. i'm going to say this. work out whatever use or not use, debate it, deal with it on your own. the rest of us who are not part of whatever historically maligned population that is, just let you deal with it in your community on your own. there are more than 250,000 words in the english language. we can use other words. and if we have four or five that we don't touch because that -- you know, somebody else is dealing with it, just deal with it and just let that group deal with how they're going to deal with that word. i don't see the big argument. >> quickly, l.z., i'm up against the clock. >> i just think that conversation to me just seems

like it's not productive. you know, african-americans have always had ongoing conversation about what's best for african-americans. there's always been opposing views, an ongoing conversation. so this notion that we can have a conversation and come to one conclusion, i think we're just chasing clouds. >> rainbows. >> at the end of the day if you want to have it in your household then have it in your household. if you don't you don't. i'm not trying to police anyone's language. i think it's silly. and i think it distracts us from the real issues. the real tangible ills that are hurting the african-american community. saying the n word isn't one of them. >> exactly. i agree with that. >> coming up, in ferguson, missouri police and citizens bracing themselves. a community on edge waiting to find out whether or not the grand jury will indict officer darren wilson in the shooting death of michael brown. a report from the streets of ferguson when we come right back. did someone say burn? try alka seltzer reliefchews. they work just as fast and are proven to taste better than tums smoothies assorted fruit. mmm... amazing.

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11:00 p.m. on the east coast. this is "cnn tonight." i'm don lemon. there's a lot going on around the world and we're going to get you up to speed on everything you need to know. if in ferguson, missouri, first, police stocking up on tear gas. residents stock up on guns days before the grand jury decision on whether or not to indict officer darren wilson in the shooting death of michael brown. reports from iraq the leader of isis may have been hit in a coalition bombing. is it a turning point in the