right now, police are looking into whether this incident right here, the moment when riots were incited in ferguson, missouri. we're taking a closer look at where this new part of the investigation stands right now. and a brutal attack in kenya. 36 bodies are found in a quarry. christians separated from muslims and then executed. our reporter and her team went undercover into this embattled area and observed the dangers

firsthand. and ashton carter, do you know who he is? he might be the next secretary of defense of the united states. we're taking a closer look at who he is, what he's done and the massive work that would be ahead of him. hello. i'm wolf blitzer. it's 1:00 p.m. in washington. noon in ferguson, missouri. 8:00 p.m. in jerusalem. 9:00 p.m. in nairobi, kenya. wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks for joining us. to the developing story in ferguson, missouri. michael brown's stepfather is now being investigated by the ferguson police department for possibly inciting a riot. and it's over the comments he made moments after the announcement that the police officer darren wilson would not be indicted not case. michael brown's mother was speaking to a crowd of supporters and as she broke down, he stepped in to console here. here's what happened next.

>> burn this [ bleep ] down! burn this [ bleep ] down! burn this [ bleep ] down! >> let's go live to ferguson right now. ed lavandera is standing by. where does this part of the investigation stand, this investigation into whether the stepfather of michael brown potentially could be charged with incitement? >> reporter: we're told by the police chief here in ferguson that that formal investigation has been launched, that they have spoken with several friends of the stepfather, but that they have not interviewed him or talked to him yet. so obviously seems like it's in the very early stages of becoming a formal investigation. we spoke with ben crump, the

attorney for the family, last night and was asked if he was worried about any charges stemming from that video being filed against this stepfather. he said he wasn't worried, that it was an emotional moment and that he should not be judged or condoned for inciting the riot at that time. he did say that they were not worried about charges being filed. but the lieutenant governor here in missouri has talked about it and suggested that that should be looked into. that's what it sounds like the police in ferguson are doing here now. >> are people already complaining that this is even a formal investigation right now? >> reporter: there are a lot of people, especially when you talk to business owners who lost their businesses who are very much angry about seeing that video and that sort of thing, but a lot of people are also going to feel just the opposite, who are going to say, this is not something that will be celebrated and will probably anger a lot of people.

so it will be interesting to see how reaction to this continues to come in now that more and more people are hearing about it. >> tell us for viewers who are watching here in the united states and around the world, you're standing in front of what? >> reporter: this was one of the businesses that was burned down here along one of the main stretches where we saw several buildings that were torched and set ablaze last monday night in the hours just after the announcement of darren wilson not being indicted was made. but i should also point out, this is about two miles away from where the video was taken of that stepfather. and all of this was set on fire just moments after it. i think one of the things you're probably going to hear from those supporting the stepfather or the attorneys for him or the brown family is that a lot of the people who were on this street would not have been aware of the comments that he had made there about two miles away in front of the police station. it was in that immediate area where there was plenty of violence and plenty of

destruction that was done. several police cars were set on fire and a lot of businesses had windows broken out. but the main two areas where a lot of this damage was done was about two miles away from each other. >> ed lavandera on the scene for us, thanks very much. what happens now that the police have launched this formal inquiry, this investigation? let's bring in joey jackson, he's hln's legal analyst, also john gaskin, a community activist who often joins us on this story in ferguson as well. joey, what do you make of the legal arguments that potentially there could be a charge filed against the stepfather for inciting the riots, the looting, the fires that developed in the aftermath? >> there could be merit to them. this is extremely disturbing, obviously. i don't think anybody would support a reaction like that. but from prosecutors' perspectives, they'll say that whenever you instigate, whenever you encourage, whenever it's your spent to motivate a crowd

to do something that would be unlawful or inappropriate, that's when it rises to the level of inciting them to engage in that unlawful activity. from a defense perspective, of course, the argument will be, wait one moment, this was expressive conduct, it was conduct that was engaged in in the midst of some that was very profound. and that a lack of an indictment for something that was so significant. so he was simply being expressive, and ed's point that he explained, when you talk about rioting by people who may not even have heard the comment at the time. so how could you ascribe that to him? but certainly the police will investigate as they're doing to see if there's merit and claim to him, that is, mr. head, being somewhat responsible for what occurred. >> john, what's your reaction to this new development that there is this formal investigation under way right now? >> well, wolf, one thing that i've done along with the family is to promote peace and encourage people to react in a peaceful and dignified way. those were the requests of the family. but there really is no way to

excuse or validate the actions of mr. head that day when the announcement was made. however, one thing that we do have to consider is that the announcement was made at night which angered many people. if you listen to the prosecutors -- really his almost op-ed to "the new york times" as he spoke and explained why michael brown -- why darren wilson was not indicted, et cetera, it angered many people. however, that does not excuse what mr. head went on to say. but we must also take a look at what the family of michael brown has done. his direct parents, leslie mcspadden and michael brown sr., they've been sincere and consistent in promoting peace, asking the community to act in a dignified way. since this ordeal in august, we have feared there would be rioting and looting. so i think it's a little early

to say that lewis head's statements is what caused all the rioting and looting because from what i've heard, many of the people that came over there to the police station to listen to bob mcculloch's statement and the press conference, many individuals, not all, but some came prepared to riot and to loot. so i don't think it's fair to say that his statements is what caused all the rioting and looting and took place on west florissant, which was a number of miles away from the police station. >> do you know, john, if mr. head, the stepfather, apologized, expressed remorse for those obviously very angry comments he initially made? >> no, i don't know if he has. but i would certainly hope that he does feel some remorse for that and would reach out to the community and simply apologize and make it known that he was speaking with emotion and in anger because this has been a very troubling situation for them. they have not been treated the best way from the prosecutor's office, from what i understand.

they really weren't even notified properly prior to the grand jury making their decision. so i can understand where his anger comes from. but i certainly hope he'll reach out to the community and simply apologize and ask for forgiveness. but i do understand his anger, i understand the family's anger because this has been a very rough and difficult situation because they have obviously tragically lost their son. >> joey, would it make any different, legally speaking, if he were to apologize, express remorse, say, i was so angry and so upset and i spoke stupidly at the time but that's not me? would that make any difference in this formal police investigation? >> i think it certainly could, wolf. here's why. at their core, prosecutors are -- it's a political entity. you're elected by the people and elected to pursue justice. at this point, i think the community may be more interested in healing than in finding someone to place blame on something that tragically occurred. now, obviously the statement is

deplorable. shouldn't have happened, rioting and looting shouldn't have happened. the issue is, who caused that, who brought that about and was he, that is, mr. head, a central figure in doing so? if no, it's another story. but an apology goes a long way in calming people and showing it was emotional and wasn't meant to entice people to violence. >> i spoke with an african-american woman who owned a hair salon there last night that was completely looted and burned down. she employed seven people, all of them now outover work. she had limited insurance. she doesn't know what's going to happen to her or to her employees. certainly what's going to happen to that hair salon. that's just one story that many businesses -- small businesses that were destroyed in the aftermath of that announcement that no indictment would go forward against the police officer in ferguson. guys, thanks very much. joey jackson, john gaskin. in just one week's time, the obama administration may have already made its choice for the

next secretary of defense. up next, we'll learn more about ashton carter, his time over at the pentagon, who is e h? what does he want to do? plus, the one key element that he lacks that both of his predecessors have. and are the president's actions on immigration reform legal? the secretary of homeland security, jeh johnson, was up on capitol hill today in front of the house leadership. representative peter king is standing by. we'll get his reaction to what he heard. and dozens of people killed in kenya. our cnn team went undercover in the same area. we'll hear about the dangers that exist right now, especially for christians. ...and the wolf was huffing and puffing... kind of like you sometimes, grandpa. well, when you have copd, it can be hard to breathe. it can be hard to get air out, which can make it hard to get air in. so i talked to my doctor. she said... doctor: symbicort could help you breathe better, starting within 5 minutes. symbicort doesn't replace a rescue inhaler

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israel will soon have new elections after the prime minister benjamin netanyahu sacked the finance minister and the justice minister and called for the dissolution of the country's legislature. netanyahu said, quote, during the last few weeks, the ministers have intensely attacked the government that i am leading. i will not tolerate ministers attacking the government's policy and its head from inside the government. early elections coming up in israel. seems that president obama has chosen his nominee to replace chuck hagel. barring any last-minute changes, administration officials tell cnn that ashton carter is the president's choice. he's a former deputy secretary of defense. he certainly was on the short list when hagel was picked nearly two years ago. homeland security secretary jeh johnson was also reportedly on the list. while ashton carter does not have any military experience,

his time at the pentagon over the many years is certainly expected to help bolster his resume. the u.s. senate is expected to take up the nomination next month. we expect to hear from the president about this nominee in the coming days. the first thing on the new defense secretary's plate will be the battle against isis in iraq and syria. the questions about the administration's strategy in both of those countries, syria and iraq. joining us now from capitol hill, pennsylvania democrat senator bob casey. senator, thanks for joining us. >> thanks, wolf. >> i know you have strong views on isis, syria, iraq. but give us your reaction to where the president is likely to name ashton carter to be his nominee over at the pentagon. >> well, wolf, in he does name ashton carter, i think it would be a great choice. he's got broad experience in the department of defense, knows it well and also knows capitol hill and the dynamics of dealing with all of the complexities of the

department of defense, especially now when we have a major engagement against isis and have other challenges that are -- other national security as well as fiscal challenges. he would be a good choice. as a pennsylvanian, we're particularly proud of him. ash is a native of southeastern pennsylvania. we're very happy about that. >> i'm sure you are. let's talk a little bit about this important op-ed you wrote in "the washington post" the other day about the obama administration's strategy as far as isis is concerned. you wrote, a recognition that the bashar al assad regime in syria also must go and a strategy to address the underlying issues that created the space for the islamic state to emerge and metastasize. you say those are missing elements in the president's strategy. you want him to get a whole lot tougher with the assad regime, is that right? >> i do. that's based upon my record. i've been calling for a much more aggressive posture as it

relates to mr. assad now for a couple of years. i will say this. first and foremost, the president has done the right thing to take on isis, to work very hard to build a huge coalition, something on the order of 60 countries. so he's done a lot of good here. and we've made progress. a lot of air strikes, a lot of intelligence, a lot of training and a lot of effort making sure that our folks aren't doing the fighting on the ground, which i think is an important part that folks in the region have to do the fighting. but i do think this part of the strategy on assad doesn't seem to make sense to me when on the one hand we're saying we want the well-vetted syrian opposition to be trained and to be helped so they can take on the fight against isis and at the same time mr. assad is able to bomb the opposition almost with impunity. there should be some degree of pressure, some pushback on that. and if the administration has ideas about that, as to why they can't go in the direction that i would seek or that i would hope, i wish they would explain that

to us. >> you want u.s. air strikes to target syrian military positions loyal to bashar al assad? >> if our military suggested that would advance the strategy as it relates to isis, i would certainly favor that, but to have almost no pressure of any kind, even diplomatic or other kinds of pressure against mr. assad, when our stated policy has been and what i believe to be the right policy which is that he must go, it doesn't seem to make sense. so i think that part of the policy needs some work. and that's why this review that the administration often has undertaken will continue to, as well as the role that congress has to play -- we've got to debate these issues. we've got to make sure that we're engaged with the administration in asking the tough questions and demanding answers. >> senator casey, thanks very much for joining us. >> thanks, wolf. still to come, clashing over the president's immigration actions. the homeland security secretary jeh johnson gets grilled today

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up on capitol hill today, the homeland security secretary jeh johnson faced off with the president's critics on executive action of immigration reform. it questioned the legality of the president's decision. listen to this. >> this is not a permanent solution. but it is in our existing legal authority to issue, to fix the broken system. and we feel we had no choice. >> what do you say to someone who believes the president took

action to change the law? >> we did not change the law. we acted within the law. i believe if we could strip away the emotion and the politics on this issue and you brought me the right group of members of the house of representatives, i could negotiate a bill with you. and i'm offering -- i'm issuing that invitation again. i believe we could do it. it should not be that difficult. >> joining us now, the new york republican congressman, peter king, a member of the house homeland security committee as well as the intelligence committee. what did you think? did the president act within the law? >> no, wolf, i strongly believe that he acted outside the law. let me just say, i have great respect for secretary johnson. he's a very good lawyer and a very honest pepperson. but i do believe the executive order went beyond the

constitutional powers the president has. when you have at best a gray area for the president, why he issued the executive order now, he could have done it at any time in the last six years. if he thought it was an important issue, he could have signed the executive order before the election. it could have been a campaign issue so the american people could have led their views be known. why didn't the president say he was going to wait till july to do it? instead, to me, it breaks down the faith that's needed between the government and the people. >> did ronald reagan and george h.w. bush break the law when they revised the regulations as far as immigration -- illegal immigration to the country was concerned? >> to me, it's a question of degree. at that time, what reagan was doing was basically continuing enacting of legislation that was already passed. he was clarifying and expanding what had already passed.

in this case, we have such a sharp disagreement in the country. for the president to take this unilateral action defies the letter and the spirit of what a president's powers are. i don't think it's right to equate what president obama did with what previous presidents did because of the nature and scope and how far his executive order went. >> i believe it was then president bush who did change the regulation and allowed about 40% of the illegal immigrants who were then in the united states to remain as a result of what was then widely seen as amnesty. >> but at that time there was very little objection from the american people. the fact is now, this is such a controversial issue, there's so much difference between what the president wanted and what congress wanted, we've just gone through an election where the american people, i believe, voted against the president's position. having said that, i do want to see legislation. and i think if the president had waited till january -- conceded

all the points you just made, if the president waited till january and said, i'll do it july 1st, an extra six months doesn't matter that much. he could have focused attention on the issue and we could have had constructive legislation. to me, i think he's just trying to score political points and it's going to cause much more harm in the long run than good. >> the president keeps saying, go ahead, house of representatives, take up what the senate in a bipartisan fashion passed, go ahead and take it up and i'll negate that executive action and there will be a new law he'd be happy to sign on the books. >> the american people elected us. under the constitution, we have the powers as far as naturalization. and if the president wants to get it done rather than scoring political points, he would have his opportunity between january and july, that would be an opportunity for real negotiations. and at that time if it doesn't work, he can issue his executive order.

congress can take what action we want to take in reaction to that. but he would have had the opportunity to deal with the new congress. and i believe speaker boehner and majority leader mcconnell do want to have immigration reform. if nothing else just for the selfish purpose of this not being a major issue in the 2016 presidential race. >> peter king, the republican representative from new york, as usual, thanks for joining us. >> wolf, thank you very much. still ahead, some surprising numbers just coming out. our brand-new presidential election polls. john king is here with me. we'll break down the numbers. i think you might be surprised.

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welcome back to our viewers in the united states and around the world. i'm wolf blitzer reporting from washington. the race for the white house in 2016, who's in, who's out, who leads in the early polls. on the republican side, mitt romney, yes, mitt romney is still the front-runner. but the two-time presidential candidate keeps on saying he is not a candidate. that would put another former governor on top of the republican polls, at least right now, that would be jeb bush, the former florida governor. he says he is considering a 2016 run. >> i don't know if i'd be a good candidate or a bad one. i know -- i kind of know how a republican can win, whether it's me or somebody else. and it has to be much more

uplifting, much more positive, much more willing to be practical now in washington world, lose the primary to win the general, without violating your principles. it's not an easy task, to be honest with you. >> let's bring in our chief national correspondent, john king. walk us through these new cnn poll numbers on the republican side. >> you say, mitt romney says he's not going to run. he says that. but if romney runs, he would be the front-runner if you look at the numbers. 20% for romney, you see governor christie, governor huckabee. if romney does not run, then jeb bush is at the top of the pack at 14%. ben carson still right there. dr. carson, his fox news platform as a commentator, his books are popular among evangelicals, these are well known names to conservatives. the most important thing from

the republican side is this is name recognition. but we've always known who's next. john mccain was next, bob dole was next, george w. bush. these poll numbers in some ways are meaningless. but in other ways, very consequential. if you're especially those governors, you're looking around, can you build a staff, raise enough money? you have to make those decisions over the next several months. and no front-runner on the republican side, makes those decisions harder. >> i bet a lot of our viewers are surprised by dr. ben carson, brilliant nooeurosurgeon, pediatric neurosurgeon. and he's at the top tier. >> a prominent role as a fox news commentator. african-american conservative who says, push the social issues, also push for fiscal conservatism. what's working for him right now is he's not a politician.

republicans and democrats, if they share one thing, it's disgust with politics as usual. he's a new face as a nonpolitician, it helps him. he's going to be a factor if he runs in this race and he is actively exploring it right now. can he be the nominee? that would take on obama-like lightning bolt. >> he was a fox news contributor but no longer because he is thinking about running for that republican presidential nomination. what about the democratic side? >> no clear front-runner. 65% -- look at, this hillary clinton, 65%. the republicans look at a muddled field. she's the overwhelming choice of democrats. 10%, elizabeth warren. 9%, joe biden. bernie sanders at 5%. andrew cuomo at 1%. if you look at this, if hillary clinton doesn't run, it gets interesting. loyalty to joe biden, the vice president, jumps to the top at 41%. but look at elizabeth warren. she doubles to 20%.

clear signal to senator warren who's said repeatedly, i'm not running. if secretary clinton does surprise us and bow out, there's a huge opening right there. >> everybody thinks she is going to run, though? >> yes. two or three people might say not. but looks like -- >> all of her activities are designed to get that in motion very soon. >> democratic activists, fund-raisers, democratic staffer, all parked out in camp carolinas, waiting. >>en jo, thanks very much. john king reporting for us. there have been numerous rumblings about the possibility of another government shutdown here in washington as deep rifts continue on spending issues in congress. today republican leaders from both the house and the senate gathered to talk about their strategy going forward. let's go up to capitol hill. our chief congressional correspondent dana bash is joining us. dana, walk us there what's going on during, first of all, this lame duck session. >> reporter: the headline is that republicans are really determined not to allow the government to shut down.

nine days from now, december 11th, is when the government runs out of money. so time is ticking here, wolf. and what house republicans did this morning was have a meeting to figure out how to try to keep the government running and still appease many conservatives who say, if you want to push back against the president's excessive order on immigration which most republicans want to try to do, the best way to do it is with the power of the purse and to do that without taking it to the level that we saw last year which is government shutdown. listen to a conversation that i had with one of the rank-and-file conservatives about this in the hallway. was there any discussion in there about needing to avoid shutting the government down? >> that's not even a topic we're going to discuss at this point. i don't think it's an issue we're going to address. we're not taking that bait. >> reporter: why is it bait? >> that's been the president's biggest bully pulpit, trying to

scare the american people into thinking we're going to shut down the government. >> reporter: so in practical terms, it means there's going to be a bill that is going to be passed before congress leaves, before this lame duck session is over that's going to fund the government for the most part through the next fiscal year, next september. but they're going to carve out the part that deals with homeland security and do a stopgap measure on that to preserve the ability, maybe in the next congress, to try to deal with that -- with the immigration issue via the power of the purse. but basically they're kicking the can down the road which isn't making conservatives happy. but it's just the reality that republicans know they're facing here with the democratic senate still and more importantly democrat in the white house. >> dana bash up on the hill, thanks very much. still ahead, a massacre overnight along the kenya/somalia border. why are situatichristians now b targeted? your pocket right now? have in i have $40, $21.

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>> reporter: it was the early morning hours in a mining quarry. they were overcome, these attackers came in, we understand they lined them up, they were decided into christians and muslims, the christians were asked to repeat the basic tenets of the islamic faith. she were executed, some beheaded and left in that quarry to be found by red cross workers a few hours later after the sun came up. al shabaab have divided out the christians from the muslims and sent that message that if you are christian in any of the areas that we are able to get to, you are not safe, wolf. >> sometimes we hear those reports that if you're a christian, they will give you a chance to on the spot convert to islam to save your life. but apparently that didn't occur this time? >> reporter: yes, in the bing,

perhaps in an attempt -- a p.r. coup, they are saying, we will allow you to convert to save your life. sometimes they were gunned down because they would decide it wasn't convincing enough. but increasingly, we have this horrible attack when christians go home for the holidays around this time in kenya, buses were full. they attacked a bus, they brought people down. again, it's this awful, kind of methodical almost psychopathic nature, are you a christian? and then shooting at point-blank range. >> it's a shocking development. they divide up the people. they ask who the christians are, who the muslims are and then go ahead and execute, as you point out, occasionally behead the christians. shocking development. we'll stay on top of this story. thanks for joining us and keep up the excellent work that you've been doing for cnn. let's get more now on what's going on, these radical islamist

trror groups like isis, al shabaab. is there really a threat that they could affect the states? just a little while ago, the house foreign affairs committee finished a hearing to examine what the obama administration is doing to counter the threat. let's talk about all this with the chair of the middle east and north africa subcommittee. congresswoman, thank you for joining us. you heard that report from nima. al shabaab go ahead and divide these people into two groups, christians and muslims, then they go ahead and execute the christians. it's shocking. what can the united states do about this? >> it is shocking. it's horrific. it's grotesque. it's barbaric. terrible crimes that have happened in the not-so-distant past in the world. these islamic terror groups will stop at nothing to establish

their extremist caliphate throughout the world. they will accept nothing other than their hateful ideology as a sign of true islam, which is a perversion. and it doesn't matter what form it takes, whether it's al shabaab, whether it's al qaeda, whether it's the taliban, whether it's isil, they have one global jihadist network at play and that is anti-western, anti-democracy, anti-christian. and it's to establish this extreme caliphate throughout the world. so we've got to be ever-vigilant. we haeldeld a hearing on foreig fighters and that's alarming the number of foreign fighters that are joining this fight to destroy everyone's way of life. it's frightening. >> so what can the united states do about all of this? >> well, first of all, we need to continue to work with our allies. clearly, many of our allies are not doing enough.

turkey, for example, claims to be in this fight with us. but look at all the flux of the foreign fighters coming through turkey into syria, into iraq to join the fight in isil. other countries that are very worried about this, we just met with the king of jordan and he tells us he's very worried about the influx of foreign fighters to join in this enemy fight. so it's a problem worldwide. we need to get more of our allies into the fight. we have jordan, we have other allies. but how are these foreign fighters getting to syria and getting to iraq because they have country leaders that are willing to look the other way. and we've got to be honest with our allies and say, turkey, you're not doing enough, you're not stemming the flow of these foreign fighters. some of them, sadly, are even coming from the united states. not as many. most come from the middle east and for western fighters, they're coming from uk and

france. but, still, there are over 100 who have come from the united states. we need to make sure that these foreign fighters don't come back to the united states to do us harm. >> one final question. you have confidence in the likely new secretary of defense nominee, ashton carter, to replace chuck hagel? >> well, i think a lot of it will come out in the hearing. is he willing to buck the president? will he be an independent thinker? is he going to be a yes-man? because it seems like the president is not looking for anyone to disagree with him but to follow his dictates. i think the president made a lot of hay at the beginning of having a team of rivals around the table. now he's getting -- assembling a team of yes-men and women around the table. we don't want that. we need to bring the fight to isil to get our allies involved, not to be a yes-man for the

president. >> representative, thanks very much for joining us. >> thank you, sir. still on the way, the homeland security secretary jeh johnson testifying before the house homeland security committee on the president's controversial immigration reform plans. and should the president make a trip to ferguson, missouri? our political panel standing by to weigh in.

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no shortage of topics for our political panel this hour. cnn now learning the white house debated sending president obama to ferguson, missouri. decided the trip at least right now is too difficult to get it right. the homeland security secretary jay johnson. he's also been testifying today at a sometimes testy hearing on immigration reform. and early polls in on the 2016 presidential race here in the united states. who's really running? joining us now to discuss all of

this and more, our chief political analyst gloria borger, paul begala and newt gingrich. newt gingrich, of course, the former speaker of the house of representatives. newt, let me ask you quickly. you think the president should go to ferguson, missouri, and meet with the michael brown family? >> no. i think the president has failed to take honest statements about some -- what i think are some obvious facts. he ought to be saying to people, don't rob stores. don't push around storekeepers half your size. don't disobey the police. this whole totally one-sided version, which, by the way. i think this is a very one-sided story. and i think the president, frankly would simply stir more trouble if he were to go to ferguson. i think he ought to stay out of it. there's no case to be made here

that i think is not one-sided on the president's case. >> paul, you agree? >> no. the president's the president of all america. and there's a role to heal. i think the timing is problematic right now. give it a few weeks, few months. he's bringing people to the white house. there is a set of policies here. when he was in the state senate, he wrote a law that required that interrogations in a police station be taped. that protected cops from false charges of abuse. and it protected people who were accused of crimes. the kinds of things he's talking about now, putting body cameras on cops. the notion, by the way, the notion that somehow the lesson here is don't mess with the cops. how about don't shoot a kid in the street who is unarmed. i think that's kind of a good lesson, too. >> i think at this point, the president who, by the way, is african-american. can we forget that. understands the anger of the african-american community, understands the distrust that

that community has for the police department in ferguson. but, at this point, he also understands as a constitutional lawyer and as president of the united states they've got two department of justice investigations going on right now. at some point, he's going to to ferguson. right now, he's acting as a president should act. >> let's get to some politics. newt gingrich, i want you to react to these polls. on the republican side, you heard john king report a little while ago. mitt romney doing very, very well, even though he says he's not running for the republican nomination. ben carson, he's well known in conservative circles right now, not necessarily well known across the country. he's doing well, and jeb bush, the former florida governor doing well right now. i know it's still early. a year or so before all of the debates get underway in iowa and new hampshire. but that year, as you well know, newt.

that goes very quickly. >> well, paul will remember better than i do, but i believe at this point in 1991, governor mario cuomo was probably the front runner and dick gephart was doing well. and relatively weak compared to all of these guys. i think these polls are nonsense for the moment. i will say i do think dr. carson is doing sort of an astonishing job of becoming none of the above. he's becoming, if you don't like regular politicians and don't like regular politics, he's beginning to really gather those votes. and i'm told that in iowa, he now has a chairman in all 99 counties, which is a nontrivial achievement. >> i think ben carson's going to attract some attention. he's had a perch at fox news. but i also believe and, newt, you would know this better than any of us, you went through this last time. everybody gets their 15 minutes.

and his is coming a little early. and it may continue, and i think these polls at this point are all about name recognition. and the republican base knows who carson is right now. >> it's not just name recognition. you talked earlier about ferguson and anger in the african-american community. i think it's there, but it's pain, too. there is anger among right wing white people. i'm quite sure it's misplaced, but it is there. and dr. carson compared the united states of america and said, this is a quote, it's very much like nazi germany. holy smokes. that's some serious anger he's tapping into that anger. and there's a lot of it out there. i think 10% is the beginning for him, not the end. i think he's going to go much higher. >> you know how these things go. in the last election, we saw up and down, up and down, newt gingrich was the beneficiary. >> newt, i don't want to lose you, but you could take these guys. >> no, no. i think we have lots of runners in the republican party. we have no front runners.

and i mean, romney, i think nominally is a front runner because of the name i.d. i think there are lots of candidates out there. and my guess is, we'll have 10 or 12 candidates before this is over. and nobody today could tell you with any accuracy which of them is going to survive the gauntlet and be the nominee in early -- early 2016. >> i think everybody else is right. it's still very, very early in the process. we still like looking at the polls. >> you're not running, right? you're not running, right? >> i haven't totally closed the door, but certainly not opening it. i do think carson is something more than -- i think there are a lot of people are looking for somebody different. they're tired of traditional politics and politicians. and he is a pretty good vehicle for expressing that. whether or not he can survive, who knows at this stage. but there are also a lot of very competent people. governor kasich, governor

walker, governor perry, huckabee, there are going to be a ton of people playing before this thing is over. >> well, let me just be precise. because, of course, you said something just intriguing. are you thinking about running once again for the presidential nomination? >> no, i think it's very implausible. i think it tells you how early it is. people could decide as late as early as september or october of next year. so all this pressure get people out there tells you as much about the news media need to talk about it as it does about the actual calendar. there are people who are very serious. i think governor perry has some 500 people coming to austin this month. clearly rand paul is ramping up a serious campaign. scott walker is a serious contender if he wants to run. >> good stuff for us to talk about.

we'll have plenty of time. >> that's it for me. i'll be back 5:00 p.m. eastern in the "situation room." amanpour is coming up next. for our viewers in north america, "newsroom" with brooke baldwin starts right after this. >> hi there, thank you so much for being with me. i want to begin with the emotional outburst from michael brown's stepfather on the night the world learned the officer who killed brown would not be indicted. what he screamed there was no doubt controversial, but now ferguson police are trying to determine if what he was yelling eight times over was, in fact, criminal.