reformed. >> many want officer daniel pantaleo lock up for choking to death a father of six. eric garner's daughter said it's a national crisis. we begin with alexandra fields, who is live from new york's times square, what's the latest? >> the protesters flooded times square, they were on the west side highway, brooklyn bridge, they were in cities across the country. their message is clear -- they don't believe this story ends with one grand jury's decision and they believe they are shining a light on a problem which they think exists in cities across the country. why were you arrested? >> for standing and protesting. >> protesters in cuffs across new york. >> after some seven hours of marching. police cracking down as thousands of protesters gathered for a second night.

standoffs but no serious violence replicated across the country. nationwide, outrage garner's daughter says she appreciates. >> this is not a black-and-white issue. this is a national crisis. >> in chicago, protesters clashed with police after shutting down a major thoroughfare. and in d.c., protesters stage a die-in only blocks from the white house. >> no justice, no peace! >> all this after a grand jury declined to indict nypd officer daniel pantaleo in the chokehold death of 43-year-old eric garner. the grand jury sat for nine weers hearing from a total of 50 witnesses, 22 civilians, police officers and medical personnel. 60 exhibits were admitted into evidence, including video, records regarding nypd's policies and procedures, garner's medical records and photographs of the scene. but the details of the evidence

remain sealed. >> what video was they watching? because obviously it wasn't the one that the whole world was watching. >> the department of justice launching a federal investigation. >> too many americans feel deep unfairness when it comes to the gap between our professed ideals and how laws are applied on a day-to-day basis. >> new york mayor bill de blasio ordering retraining of the nypd's 35,000 officers. >> we're changing how our officers talk with residents of the city. changing how they listen. >> and dorj eric holder calling for reform. >> there are real, practical and concrete measures that can be taken. >> reforms civil rights leaders say is needed nationwide. >> when we shine a spotlight on the criminal justice system, when we shine a spotlight on the experiences of people, it points to a very big problem.

>> in cleveland, ohio, a two-year investigation by the justice department found what they call a pattern of excessive force by police. caused by insufficient accountability. inadequate training and ineffective policies. three hours south, the naacp and the montgomery county sheriffs department are investigating racist text messages exchanged by several deputies. part of the texts read allowed by dayton naacp president derrick forward. >> what do apples and black people have in common? they both hang from trees. >> the montgomery county sheriff has spoken out about the text messages, saying they tarnish the office and we're speaking about that case and other cases this morning. when you come out and speak to the protest, their message is broad. how communities are policed, who polices the communities, when force is used and if the force becomes excessive, who is held accountable. >> who polices the police we kept hearing last night,

alexandra. and in terms of how it goes with police, we hear between 60 and 100 people were arrested. a lot of people were taken into custody, later to be released or moved out of the way. we'll watch the numbers, thank you for the reporting. here's something else we know, new york city mayor bill de blasio is announcing sweeping changes. it means a three-day course to teach self-control curbing profanity and how to persuade suspects to comply without using force. that's a lot for three days. but last night was all about the people who want even more. huge and diverse crowds rallying around the perceived plight of minorities. the message was clear -- we want change. overnight, huge waves of demonstrators taking to new york city's bridges and roads, bringing the big apple to a standstill. thousands flooding the brooklyn bridge. >> no justice, no peace!

>> and shutting down times square! >> hands up, don't shoot! >> large crowds, largely peaceful, but this many people and this much emotion leads eventually to conflict. >> making an arrest here right now. >> nypd making arrests after a massive scuffle. >> there's already violent. they were slamming people down on the ground against the cars. >> they were very much overly aggressive. what a surprise, when has nypd not been overly aggressive to us. >> marchers were chanting -- whose streets? our streets! police disagreed. some staged a sit-in. arrested while singing and holding hands. but for all the noise, silence in brooklyn may have made the most impact. protesters staging a die-in, lying on the ground next to them cardboard coffins displaying the names of others killed by police. among the crowd of young and

old, friends of the garner family. >> what does this mean to you that there are this many people who showed up? >> i'm so happy that people of all cultures and ethnicities came out to show their support. we have to make a change because they're killing us off. >> what do you think eric garner would have thought of this. >> he would have been proud of this. because black people are adamant about making change, it's time for change. >> let's bring in the president of the national organization of black law enforcement and tom fuentes, a former fbi assistant director. gentlemen, do we believe this is just about bad apples, or do we have a culture with how we address and police certain communities? cedric? >> i think we have a real crisis in this country, it's being played out every night and we have a criminal justice issue

here. not just police. we hear a lot about police. and the changes that need to be brought about. but i think in a larger sense, chris, we're also talking about a criminal justice system that we need to sit back and take another look at. >> so, let's start with the police, though, i take the point, cedric. tom, let's start with the police, researchers did a study that showed many police officers often subconsciously view young black boys as far older and view them implicitly as guilty and are more likely to use violence against them. that's not a three-day training course away from being fixed. what do you do about something like that. do you even believe it? >> i'm not sure i believe it in the first place, chris, what mr. alexander said is very important. it's an entire system and that system is biased and i saw it every day when i stood in court for six years, three, four days a month in cook county, illinois. and the people that get the favorable treatment, it's designed for the lawyers,

frankly. if you come into court, white, black or otherwise, and you are well-represented, you're going to have a much better time, you're going to either get off or get a lighter sentence. and the poor people that don't have that, that rely on public defenders and unfortunately, that means predominantly, minorities, are not going to get the same treatment in the court system. that's the fact of life. because if we want to help those, not just three-day courses for police officers, not just, not just body cameras, which i believe in. but let's look at what happens in the courtroom, all across this country. i don't see this, i didn't see this in the federal system when i was an fbi agent, but i saw it every day when i was in court in the state and local system, that beef up our public defenders' offices so they don't have 50 cases in one day and don't take the time to represent. i think that's a critical part of this issue. >> i don't think you're going to get a lot of disagreement. but here is the practical -- >> but chris, you see the attorney general is not just the top cop, he's also the top

prosecutor. and i don't see any effort to look at our court system and look at patterns and practices of what happens in traffic court, in misdemeanor court in felony court, that has to be looked at, too. >> a lot this is under state control. it goes to the point of the next question, which is when you say it's everything, which is probably accurate, you wind up fixing nothing, because it's too big. so you have to look at the specific and you have to take on all of the issues where you find them. right now you're finding them with police and you have motivation and energy towards that. you have to deal with how to fix it here's my concern with that, cedric. the police are now culturally almost feeling forced to motivate against the change. you have the union head here at the nypd. saying hey, we feel like we got thrown upped the bus on this one. you have police officers taking to forums like police1.com saying another week of chasing around these thugs, this would

have never happened in the '80s and '90s, i miss those days. when you start getting us versus them with the cops, you have a problem. how do you get past that and towards a solution. >> what we've got to do is number one, we as a community and we as police, are going to have to find in the leadership, the leadership of those communities, from elected officials right down to those that are pointed to police chiefs, commissioners and whatever -- we're going to have to set an example, we're going to have to demand for the men and women that we're responsible for. in terms of providing leadership. and our attitude also, is going to dictate what their attitudes are from the top. now in regards to new york city, commissioner bratton, one of the most noted and respected commissioners in the country. and i have a great deal of respect for him. and i think that efforts that they're making in attempt to do something is three days long enough? certainly it's not. but it's a beginning. we have to build off of that. do that three days, but

throughout the course of the year, and throughout the course of those officers' careers, we have to have constant training, constant training. you can't have training once and think that's going to fix it. it's got to be repeated training over time. i think new york city is headed in the right direction. >> tom, let's say you start doing that and deal with your policing. the next big part in criminal justice winds up being adjudication, when you have cops in the spotlight for their behavior, do you think the time has come. on a global level, state by state, do you think the time has come to say prosecutors should not investigate their own cops. because it judd breeds a distrust of the system. >> well, that could be true, chris. and you could devise a system where you have at least prosecutors from another jurisdiction that come in and look when you have an officer involved death. and you know, think that would make sense and at some point might be the right answer. but again, many of the answers

that people have suggested in these situations, even when you have it, it doesn't solve everything. for example, i've heard so much about the lack of diversity in ferguson, if only there was more diversity in the police department. if you watch that garner video closely, you'll see that there's a black female nypd sergeant right there, at that scene. we haven't heard anything about what she's doing. because if she had told those patrolmen there's going to be no arrests, there would have been no arrests. so you know, you have diversity, in that sense, that you have, you know, minority representative as a police, not just one of the officers going along with the program, but a sergeant. the highest-ranking officer there. the other aspect is that not much has been talked about selection, police departments have to do a better due diligence on the front end, you see the police union, you see the effort. if you get bad apples, it's very difficult to eliminate them from

a public service job, whether they're policemen or firefighters or teachers or any other job like that. the key is don't select bad apples in the first place. have a due diligence system that identifies bad character, you know we heard this in the cleveland shooting for example, that that officers that shot the 12-year-old -- >> was in trouble. >> was in the process of being fired from a different department. and yet, cleveland hires him. >> pantaleo, the union south in front saying this was a great officers, doing the right thing, he was an eagle scout. he had been jammed up previously with three different guys saying he had not behaved the right way in an arrest. there's a culture that needs to be looked at and it's all about solutions if we want to see the anger and outrage go away, because there will be no reason for it to, otherwise, tom fuentes, cedric alexander, thank you so much for your perspective. coming up, we talk to former new york city police commissioner, ray kelly and get his perspective and also gwen

carr, the mother of eric garner. at although of news, so let's get to mick for the headlines. here's a look at the headlines, luke somers' family has released a video imploring al qaeda to release him. in the video the 33-year-old journalist's mother and brother plead for mercy, insisting luke is all they have. u.s. commanders tried to free somers last week, but failed. al qaeda released a video vowing to kill him. president obama will announce his pick to succeed chuck hagel as defense secretary. ashton carter, a physicist and former defense secretary with quite a long history at the pentagon. his confirmation hearings are expected to go more smoothly than hagel's did. united airlines flight from burlington, vermont to washington, d.c., forced to make an emergency landing after striking a bird on wednesday. the windshield was damaged.

shattered. 52 people on board the plane. the jet did land safely. everybody was okay. former president george w. bush weighing in on the building racial tensions here in the u.s. back in 2001 he spoke about ending racial profiling in his very first address to congress as president. then 9/11 happened and his initiative stalled. so what does he think about the gap of mistrust between law enforcement and minorities? listen to whey told our candy crowley. >> there are those who say you know race seems to be more of a problem with what a lot of people term a post-racial presidency. when you saw what happened in the streets of new york in the video, what did you think? >> i thought how sad. you know the verdict was hard to understand. i hadn't seen all the details. but it's sad that race continues to play such an emotional

divisive part of life. i remember back when i was a kid, in the '70s and there was race riots, with cities being burned. and i do think we've improved. i had dinner with condi the other night and we talked about this subject. and yeah, she just said, you got to understand there are a lot of black folks around that are just incredibly, more and more distrusting of law enforcement. which is a shame. because law enforcement's job is to protect everybody. >> interesting conversation she has there with former president. you can catch candy's full interview with former president george w. bush, state of the union. that airs sunday 9:00 p.m. and noon eastern. i'll look forward to listening to that. it's interesting to be a fly in the wall in his conversations with condi. we're going to give you a better window into the situation with the officer who choked eric garner to death. does he have a troubled history

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. the new york city police officer accused of killing eric garner was not charged with a crime in the chokehold death, but this was not the first time that officer daniel pantaleo was in the middle of a racially motivated incident. two previous lawsuits were filed against him by three black men who say he violated their rights, eugene o'donnell is a professor at the john jay college of criminal justice and served 14 years as an nypd police officer. let's talk about the cases against officer pantaleo. there was one case in which he strip searched two black men in broad daylight on the street. he made them drop their pants and they say he subjected them to a really humiliating search. he touched them even inappropriately. you were on the nypd. what's that about? >> it's hard to say for sure, the nypd has to do a better job of looking at patterns and say whether or not this is bad situation that shouldn't have

occurred. settlements are made, that's not necessarily conclusive. >> that's what happened in this case, a settlement was made. you're saying that doesn't always mean guilt, it means you want it to go away. >> it's important to say a relatively number of small police people do relatively large amount of the work. sometimes a little bit of unfairness, you want to look holistically at a police officer's performance. >> in another case a black man said he was raeted for no probable cause and officer path lo fudged some details of the report. officer pantaleo was never charged, but somehow that one went away. >> the cops were deployed on staten island on this conditions patrol. which apparently was doing among other things, loose cigarette enforcement which seems to be the bottom of the barrel of criminal law. i think the root of this is the police looking for offenses that were so trivial they probably shouldn't be out there doing that. >> that's interesting. in other words, they were, eric garner was selling loose

cigarettes, you think the staten island police should have had bigger and better things to do that day. >> this was ratified by the prosecutor's office and the top people in the city government said this is a good thing to do. this is revenue enforcement. a few cents of tax revenue per cigarette. you put street cops who think the worst when they go into these situations with, lethal weapons, you move them forward and inevitably, if police do enough adversarial enforcement, there's going to be bad outcomes, that's inevitable. we need to reduce these trivial interactions. >> officer pantaleo was not indicted into eric garner's death. but now an internal investigation by the nypd into what he did starts. are police departments reluctant to throw the book at one of their own? >> new york city police department has in situations where people have died, has at a minimum taken people out of enforcement actions, they have lost their guns and never returned to patrol or didn't

return to patrol for very prolonged periods of time. they can discipline officers and fire officers after due process rights are adhered to. this could very well happen. we'll see. >> do you think officer pantaleo will remain on the force, knowing what you know. >> i wouldn't predict it i hope it doesn't get politicized, there's been a tendency to demonize this officer and i hope it won't happen, either. i don't see, as of this moment, any reason to believe there's anything malicious or especially bad other than a very terrible outcome at a very bad use of force, which the department has acknowledged. >> you don't think he was a bad apple? >> i don't know. i don't think he deserves at this point to be demonized, the department has a broken system for training people. the cops have no, they're left to their own devices to improvise. >> why is that? >> because the department has spent so much time on bureaucracy. it doesn't have any time left over to do hands-on policing. it's a scandal. ongoing scandal. finally this commissioner and this mayor are fixing that.

three days, expensive, perhaps could use a lot more training than three days for the hands-on stuff they do. >> i do want to play the other side, some people are speaking out in his favor and say that he was a good public servant. here is the head of the police union on that. >> the motto of what we want a police officer to be, he's a mature, mature police officer who's motivated literally by serving the community. he literally, literally is an eagle scout. he is a good man. and more importantly for us all here today, he's a professional police officer. >> so he says he's a good man, he says he's a model of what we want police officers to be. but can he stay on the street after something like this, just for pr reasons alone? >> i mean it's, his job is going to be untenable probably on the street. this is the union speaking, they have due process obligations to their members, it's important the officer not be demonized,

unless there's a reason to say there's some malice and fortunately nobody is demonizing mr. garner, we don't need to polarize this conversation. >> let's go back to chris. what is obvious is that the nation is in turmoil over this, specifically the deaths of michael brown and eric garner. now you have two potential presidential contenders and they're going on the record about it. that's when you know it's rea reached that level of dialogue. what they have to say may surprise you. how could switchgrass in argentina, change engineering in dubai, aluminum production in south africa, and the aerospace industry in the u.s.? at t. rowe price, we understand the connections of a complex, global economy. it's just one reason over 70% of our mutual funds beat their 10-year lipper average. t. rowe price. invest with confidence. request a prospectus or summary prospectus with investment information, risks, fees and expenses to read and consider carefully before investing.

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welcome back, we have possible presidential contenders for 2016 weighing in on the michael brown and eric garner cases. for more on what hillary clinton and rand paul had to say, let's get to senior political correspondent brianna keilar. what do we know. >> good morning to you, chris. as far as 2016, contenders, potential contenders i should say have gone, rand paul has stood alone when it comes to the vocal comments on the grand jury decisions in both ferguson and staten island. but hillary clinton changing that, speaking to a women's event in boston. saying she backs federal reviews, in both police-involved deaths, here's more of what she said. >> we have allowed our criminal justice system to get out of balance. and i personally hope that these

tragedies give us the opportunity to come together as a nation to find our balance again. >> i first saw the video, i was horrified and still am horrified every time i see it. as you know, eric garner, is gasping for breath saying i can't breathe, i can't believe this goes on. >> that was rand paul last night talking to wolf blitzer. you see the two candidates, potential candidates, they have areas of agreement when it comes to criminal justice reform. but hillary clinton focused a lot more on the state of relations between police and the black community. you saw rand paul focusing more on sentencing. saying that sentences for drug offenses, minor offenses, they should be reduced. so some agreement, but you certainly see some contrasts, rand paul saying taxes are to blame. the new york city cigarette tax more than $5 a pack. of course police were trying to

arrest eric garner, because he was selling cigarettes tax-free. you're seeing this contrast going on and no doubt we're going to see more of that as we head towards 2016. alisyn? >> brianna, thanks so much for that. let's talk now about some extreme weather, because heavy downpours are creating chaos in southern california. mudslides and flooding reported in riverside and san diego counties, emergency crews forced to rescue dozens of people stranded in their cars, california highway patrol says it has responded to 90 accidents in san diego county in one eight-hour stretch. let's get to meteorologist indra petersons who is keeping track of all of this for us. >> i want to give awe picture of yesterday's radar to give you an idea of what came through the region yesterday, it doesn't look like much, you can see one system training through the region, what you into he had to realize is that yesterday in san diego, they got more rain in one day than they typically see in the entire month. half of that came down in just one hour. so it doesn't seem like much,

only talking about an inch and a half or so of rain but that's what happens, all the rain clogged the drains quickly. today more rain is expected in through the region. what we're looking at is the low spinning. so it's different than the last system they just saw, can you notice it's staying farther north. the moisture source farther south. not that heavy rain for southern california, they have a little chance for showers, it's going to be concentrated more to the north. for the rest of us, a storm making its way through, the snow will be coming through the overnight hours, through cleveland this morning, we have a threat for some freezing rain. you're going to be watching that. here's the good news, a warm front pushes through for the bulk of this switching over to rain by the time we get to the weekend. good news, because really friday and saturday going to be pretty soggy, a big mess for the mid-atlantic and northeast. not snow. thanks. well another victim comes forward to accuse bill cosby of sexual assault, this woman says that the entertainer drugged and

raped her, in a chicago hotel. why is she speaking out now? we'll find out when she sits down with me for this riveting one-on-one interview. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ (holiday mhey! is playing) i guess we're going to need a new santa

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bill could bees attorneys are firing back at judy huth, the woman who says she was sexually assaulted by the comedian when she was just 15 years old. they are now suing her. huth's story motivated the next woman to come forward. pj maston says she knows of many more cosby victims who are still too afraid to speak out. >> i can name off 12 right now that i know of. 12 former bunnies that i know of, that are ashamed to come forward. frightened to come forward, married with families, don't want to come forward. but they were also drugged, and raped by bill cosby. raped. >> 12 women that we've never seen before. >> no. >> that have not gone to the media yet. >> no, no, no. we recently had a playboy bunny

reunion and we also have blogs and facebook pages that are restricted to only former playboy bunnies, when this hit the news, there was a lot of dialogue that went on on our website with a lot of the girls. a couple of which -- private messaged me and said, he did me, too. it happened to me, too. >> pj masten says she wasn't going to come forward with her story until she heard about judy huth's lawsuit and the claim she was sexually assaulted at just 15 years old. cosby's attorneys have filed a motion to have that suit dismissed. >> you don't do that to a child. a 15-year-old girl is a child. that's when i had to come forward. that was it for me. this man has to be held accountable. he's a serial rapist. he's been that way since the '60s. >> in her 20s, pj was a playboy bunny, working at club locations in new york, chicago and l.a.

the clubs were glamorous places and bill cosby, a friend of hue hefner's, was a popular fixture. >> when you say you were a bunny, that's a bit of a bygone era. what is a playboy bunny? >> a playboy bunny is essential lay server, we were waitresses in three-inch heels, five--inch ears and hats with ears. bill could be were was a headliner in gray gorge. >> pj says cosby invite thoerd lunch in chicago and took this photo with her. >> he jumped behind the counter. he was flipping hot dogs and making hot dogs. he made me a hot dog. everybody was in there laughing, it was a lot of fun. well the next day i got a phone call from him. he says, pj, why don't you come out to din wer me tomorrow night. i said okay, i'll meet you. he said meet me at the whitehall hotel. >> and you're not suspicious that anything is going to

happen. >> not at all. i went upstairs and there were four men in the room besides mr. cosby. they were watching sports. they were smoking cigars. there was liquor on the table. and they were playing cards. >> did he tell you who these men were? >> he mentioned their names, you know it's been so long. i don't recall who they were. but these were his friends. so he asked me, he says before we go out to dinner, would you like a cocktail? and i wasn't much of a drinker, i said i'll have a little bit of grand marnier. he was behind me and he poured the grand marnier in the glass with some ice, so i took the glass and i drank it. and the next thing i knew, it was 4:00 in the morning. i woke up in a bed. naked. bruised. he was laying next to me. and i slithered out of the bed. my clothes were all over the floor. i grabbed my clothes. i got myself together. i went downstairs, i got in a cab and went home. and took a shower. >> you don't remember anything

from the point that you had the sip of the grand marnier to the point where you woke up naked in the bed? >> i remember hurting really bad. >> your body -- >> my body was hurting. >> what did you think. when you woke up, let me stop you there. when you woke up and you say you were bruised. >> i know i was raped. i knew i was raped. there were bruise marks all over me. i knew i was raped by him. >> pj says a few days later she told her supervisor at playboy what had happened. >> and she said to me -- you know, that's hef's best friend, right? i said yes. she said well, nobody is going to believe you. i suggest you keep your mouth shut. >> pj says she's been in therapy for many years. trying to heal from her emotional wounds. >> what do you want to have happen to cosby now? >> i want to see his career destroyed. i want to see him made out to be exactly what he is -- he was a

role model for children with fat albert and all his tv shows and the hex tabls made him out to look like such a wonderful dad. he is a serial rapist. and he has fooled everybody in this country, and around the world for years. he's a serial rapist. >> be sure to join us on monday night at 9:00 p.m. eastern for a cnn special report, "the cosby show: a legend under fire" hosted by don lemon and me. >> pj was fascinating to talk to. >> what was her demeanor to come forward? >> once she made her decision, as you can tell, she said it as in strong language as we have heard. she said she was motivated because 15, that was a tipping point for her. hearing there was a 15-year-old at the time. who is accusing him of this. but again, she says, that in the

bunny world, of which she was a part of in the '70s, that there are many, many more women according to her who want to come forward. let's talk about the playboy bunny world for a second. she educated me. there weren't playmates, there was no nudity. they were waitresses, they were servers and there was a den mother who was taking care of them. they weren't supposed to be dating customers and clients. >> they were cocktail waitresses. >> when she told her den mother, her den mother said you zip it and you keep it quiet. >> i don't have a problem separating doctor huxtable from bill cosby. >> a lot of people do. >> that does seem to be part of the perception analysis. what is interesting to me is if even some of these people are telling the truth, right, let's look at it as cynically as possible. just some are, what did that require to cover that up for so long? what would motivate people to cover it up? i know the easy answer is always money and influence, they're

getting paid. but not everybody was on cosby's payroll. it would make you wonder what was going on there, if people knew this. >> such a good question. there were people who protected him and it was a different culture. >> we're likely to hear from more of those people coming forward. >> the hard thing is their proof is their word, the question is is that enough for other people. >> absolutely. we're getting into the racial tensions that are escalating across the country this morning. as study after study shows that black men are treated, thought of, and even looked at differently. we're going to get into why and the question of whether an ingrained bias can ever be reversed. new information for you ahead.

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charles barkley has weighed in again on comments about the ferguson protests this time, defending them against his co-host. kenny smith. particularly his comment that some ferguson rioters were quote scumbags. take a look at the latest iteration. >> maybe i shouldn't have used the term scumbags, but it's irrelevant. still there's no justification

for what they did. >> we've all been angry, or upset and emotional environments. may have done things out of character, when you don't have a voice, sometimes this leads to that. so figure out a way, a solution to give people a voice, so they feel they can be heard other than burning down things and looting things. >> as a black man, if i would have came out and said all the cops suck, all the black people would have said, i love that charles barkley. you're always in an awful, awkward situation. as my grandmother said, i'm gonna judge everybody by their own merits, i'm going to be fair. some people are going to agree with me, and some people going to kiss my [ bleep ]. >> no one can say it like charles can. what's instructive here, that's a show about basketball. and yet, what's going on in the country has gotten so big, even there, it's part of the dialogue. it's conversations like that going on all over the country. especially with the new study that suggests that white police officers, often view black boys

as older and more guilty, than their white counterparts, can that be true? and what does it mean if it does? how do you fix something like that. mark lamont hill, cnn political commentator, professor at moorehouse college and tara setmeyer, contributor to the "real news" on blaze tv. good to have both of you here, what is your reaction to what just happened between kenny and sir charles? >> charles barkley, he's charles barkley, the way he expresses things, he does it in his own way. the root of what he's talking about is a valid point. that difference of opinion within the black community is completely unaccepted. if you don't walk lock-step, you are called every name in the book. i get it every day. but charles barkley are talking about some aspects of the case, that more reasonable people who are trying to to be fair about what's happening.

not reacting in an emotional way. are unable or unwilling to consider. it needs to be considered. kenny smith, i think his response to charles barkley was a balanced response. it was reasonable. and if most people were reacting the way kenny smith did to the difference of opinion, we'd get a lot farther along. but emotions have run so high that rational thought, logical thought and trying to find solutions have gone out the window, that's the sad by-product of this. >> let's take one more bead on this, mark. what you do here for many african-americans when they hear something like what charles said, is he's acting like he doesn't know. like there's equal stakes here between the men who get excessive force used on them and the officers involved and that's naive. is that an informed position or a bias in and of itself. >> i don't want to call him naive. i don't want to call someone unreasonable. because they have an emotional response. right now young children

essentially or early teens are being killed in the street. and that's something that requires an emotional response. i don't think that an emotional response, an intellectual response, competing response, i think we can be emotional and smart about this. what makes people frustrated about charles barkley is not that he's naive, but that oftentimes he's lacking some level of nuance in his analysis, yes, there are good police officers, i have friends who are police officers, that's not the problem. the problem is that it's a systemic issue. if the police play a structural role in our communities that's problematic at the moment and historically as well that becomes a problem. a police officer might be well intentioned. i don't know what's in darren wilson's head, i've never run around calling darren wilson a rabid racist. i don't know what was in his head. i don't know what was in the officer who killed eric garner's head. if you see a black body in public space and that requires in your mind demands a greater response, more intense response

than for white bodies, that's a problem and the empirical data shows that. >> could you say that's true because officers come across more people of color in their policing because they're in higher-crime districts and that winds up meaning that they're in more minority districts? do you think that's the explanation in and if so, is that acceptable? >> we can't dismiss that. >> that's not the explanation. >> take on that factor and i'll come to the reverse. >> sure, this is the problem with this discussion. because there are, it's multifaceted. there are definitely issues to be discussed about police brutality. the abuse of power, can you go from civil forfeiture, which is a problem, that cuts across, black, white, yellow, green. that's everyone. to what's going on in high-crime neighborhoods, and in minority communities, why the crime rate is so high, there's a criminologist in the university of missouri, david clinger who did a study over 10 years, there were 1265 homicides in st. louis. 90% of them were black. 90% of them were black on black.

>> that's almost the same for whites. 86% of whites are killed by whites. >> but my point in that is, that what we talk about there's an epidemic or an open season on young black men being gunned down in the street because of rogue racist officers is not the case. only 2% of the homicides in st. louis over ten years were from cops. not necessarily white cops. so this, we need to put it in perspective. there are issues that need to be resolved and each one of the aspects that we can address reasonably. i don't think that that's what's happening right now. when you see the crowds and masses of people, i think their anger is misplaced. this is, to, for what what's happening. >> so what's the question, mark? >> no, no, it's not the question. because right now, because right now as i understood the question we're talking about why police do this. and in the instances where it happens. we can always talk about black-on-black violence, we can talk about cancer and cigarette smoke. all of these things kill black people. right now we're talking about

law enforcement. oftentimes we're asked to chase red ball of black-on-black violence. and yes, there is a high rate of crime with black people in some neighborhoods, that's true. but that does not explain why police see 12-year-old boys and think they're 20. yes, police encounter more black criminals, there are police officers who only encounter white criminals because they're in white neighborhoods, they still think black men are if more guilty than they are to answer your question about why that is historically we've had scripts in our society about who and what black people are, they're less intelligent, more prone to violence, less moral, all of these things. if that's what we consume in our society. it has to do with the movies we consume, the music that we listen to. the kind of -- but it's not just that rap music becomes the kind of scapeboat. >> it's a contributing factor. >> from the economy to the

cultucul culture we live in. >> to tara's point as we end this segment. we're going to do a lot of them. we now have an opportunity to talk about things we often neglect. will we talk about them when the urgency of the horrible outcomes is gone. it's multifaceted, thank you for taking a look at it mark lamont hill and tara. this discussion is for you, what do you think, message us on facebook.com/newday or tweet us directly. this someone of the story weers following. there's a lot of news for you this morning. let's get to it. no justice, no peace! >> this is very different from last night. >> bigger protests in the wake of a grand jury decision not to indict a police officer in the death of eric garner. >> they're walking down hudson. >> we have to make a change because they're killing us off. >> hands up, don't shoot.

>> they were very much overly aggressive. >> there's people laying on the ground. >> race continues to play such an emotional part of life. >> this is not black-and-white issue. this is a national crisis. >> we have allowed our criminal justice system to get out of balance. i think it's very clear that this was excessive force. >> he gave no consideration to my son when he was choking him. >> good morning, everyone, welcome back to "new day," it's friday, december 5th. protestors take together streets for a second night. thousands of demonstrators, across the country, outraged over the grand jury's decision not to indict a white new york city police officer caught on tape, choking and killing an unarmed black man. >> the demands are justice in the name of eric garner, they say the entire system needs to be changed. as new york's mayor makes a move to do just that, ordering retraining of tens of thousands

of new york city police officers over three days, let's give you complete coverage here, starting with alexandra field live in new york's times square right now. alexandra, good morning. >> you know at this protest, grown tremendously, these are larger protests than the city has seen in a long time. overnight we saw demonstrations popping up in all areas of the city. and also in a number of cities across the country. there have been arrests, but these are largely peaceful protests, the message is full of passion and the people who are out in the streets say that this is about eric garner, but it goes beyond him. >> why are you arrested? >> for standing an protesting. >> protesters in cuffs across new york. >> they wouldn't let us walk through times square. >> after some seven hours of marching. >> police cracking down as thousands of protesters gathered for a second night. >> standoffs but no serious violence replicated across the country.

nationwide, outrage, garner's daughter says she appreciates. >> this is not a black-and-white issue, this is a national crisis. >> in chicago, protesters clashed with police after shutting down a major thoroughfare. and in d.c., protesters stage a die-in only blocks from the white house. >> all this after a grand jury declined to indict nypd officer daniel pantaleo in the chokehold death of 43-year-old eric garner. >> according to the new york supreme court the grand jury sat for nine weeks hearing from a total of 50 witnesses, 22 civilians, police officers and medical personnel. 60 exhibits were admitted into evidence, including video, records regarding nypd policies and procedures, garner's medical records and photographs of the scene. but the details of that evidence remain sealed. >> what video was they watching?

because obviously it wasn't the one that the whole world was watching. >> the department of justice launching a federal investigation. >> too many americans feel deep unfairness when it comes to the gap between our professed ideals and how laws are applied on a day-to-day basis. >> new york mayor bill de blasio ordering a retraining of the nypd's 35,000 officers. >> we're changing how our officers talk, with residents of the city. changing how they listen. >> and attorney general eric holder calling for reform. >> there are real measures that can be taken. >> reformed civil rights leaders say is needed nationwide. >> when we shine a spotlight on the criminal justice system, when we shine a spotlight on the experiences of people, it points to a very big problem. >> in cleveland, ohio, a two-year investigation by the justice department found what they call a pattern of excessive

force by police. caused by insufficient accountability. inadequate training and ineffective policies. three hours south, the naacp and the montgomery county sheriffs department are investigating racist text messages. allegedly exchanged by several deputies, parts of the text read allowed by dayton naacp president derrick forward. >> what do apples and black people have in common? >> they both hang from trees. >> montgomery county sheriff has dock out speaking forcefully speaking about the text messages, saying they've tarnished the office. we're talking about these different places this morning, that's what you're hearing from the protesters out on the street. yes, they're talking about eric garner and michael brown. but also talking about broader themes, about policing and justice. and you've heard them, too, chris. >> the question is what will the talk lead to? let's talk solutions and bring

in senator kirsten gillibrand. she sits on the armed services committee. i hear tell that you met with u.s. attorney general nominee loretta lynch and you said you think there should be a probe of what happened with eric garner, why? >> i think there needs to be an investigation by the doj. in new york today, america today, someone committing a low-level crime shouldn't end up dead and their family deserve as day in court. i think having loretta look at this case is important. i think she is uniquely positioned with her civil rights background as well as the trust she enjoys with law enforcement. she has a reputation of being very fair. >> do you think it's about the crime or the altercation between police and in this case eric garner. no matter what they were stopping him for, it's about what happens once they ask him to reply and he doesn't and how they respond and use force. is it a little red herring what the underlying crime is? >> correct and i think it's the use of deadly force for a

low-level crime that's the problem. >> so the feds do their investigation. not often the greatest promise of change. the federal investigations. so if you look at what the problem is here with the grand jury, do you identify the fact that a prosecutor wound up investigating their own police, as part of the problem here with transparency and faith in the process? >> well, i think the reason why we need a department of justice investigation is so the country can feel like there was a fair hearing. and i think loretta as i said is uniquely positioned because of her experience. and because of the work she's done previously and the trust she does enjoy with law enforcement. that i think she can look at this case from top to bottom and people can feel that it has had the appropriate review. given that a man has died. >> would you support having special prosecutors or having independent investigative bodies when cops are in the focus of excessive force? >> you know, every community will make those decisions about how to manage their law enforcement. but i think our mayor is working

very hard to put reforms in place as well as additional training. >> you speaking of the mayor, the former mayor, rudy giuliani, says if blacks don't want to get in trouble with cops, let them focus on the amount of crime going on in their communities, specifically black-on-black crime. that's the real problem. do you agree with that? >> i think these are very, very difficult issues. the concern i have is a very serious conversation that's taking place in america. that there seems to be two systems of justice. what we need is fairness, we need people to know that they are safe in their communities. and we have a lot of work to do. >> you're going to stay on this and we will follow your efforts there. another pervasive problem that you want to take on, is sexual assault in the military. so this study comes out that says it declined in the past year from 6.1% in 2012, to 4.3% in 2014. unwanted sexual contact.

they said good, we're making progress. you say no. >> well, there were 20,000 incidents of sexual assault, rape and unwanted sexual contact last year alone. and if only you know, 2 out of 10 are reporting these crimes, we have a serious breach in our system of trust. and unfortunately the retaliation of brave victims who have come forward to report their crimes has continued. no change on the level of retaliation. 62% of survivors who reported that they were raped were retaliated against. it's unacceptable. so what we really need is accountability. and all we've heard from the military for 25 years is zero tolerance for sexual assault. and what we truly have is zero accountability. >> you know similarly, we have two similar issues between the first problem that we're dealing with with policing and this one. one is, you asked for an independent review of these cases from the take it out of the military justice system and put it outside of it. you lost that fight early on. we'll see how it goes. but do you believe that's the answer, to remove it from the military? >> well my suggestion is not to

remove it from the military, but remove it from the commanders. because what we have, if commanders are holding all the cards and making all the decisions, they have biases. they want to, they don't necessarily want these cases to come to light. it makes them look bad. so who i want to review these cases are trained military prosecutors. people who have no skin in the game. people who are going to weigh the evidence, make the decision on evidence alone. not on whether they like the accused or not. and that's what we have today. so we need these trained independent prosecutors to be able to create transparency in the system. and actually have cases going to trial. on the merits. on the facts and on the evidence. >> it sounds to be not only a sound argument in this regard, but also with regard to the other issue that we're discussing, that you know, when the cops are involved with something, do you see those two as analagous? >> well you want to make sure there's no biases in the system. that's why we have to look at it that's why you have to make sure it's fair and that justice will be done. but in the military context today, chris, the survivors tell us, they don't feel justice is

possible. they don't believe their commanders will do anything. and they've either witness order experienced retaliation for those who have reported crimes. and so you have a system that's not working and if you're unwilling do change the structure and really create transparen transparency, you're not going to solve the problem? >> how do you deal with that culture. if you want to talk about the culture in the police, it's nothing compared to the culture in the military b. what you say to whom and respecting your command chain. how do you deal with that? >> well, you need some level of independence. and i think that is the key that's missing. you need trained prosecutors, because right now the commanders who make the decision about whether cases go to trial, they're not trained as lawyers. they have no legal training. so they'll make that decision based on things other than evidence. and that's what's wrong with the system. so in order to guarantee civil liberties, both for plaintiffs and defendants, you have to have the decision maker be independent and have no biases. >> 20,000 case as year, 55 cases

a day. you say that is not progress. and it is important to point out, while many of them are women, men are involved as well as victims is that true? because that's something the military does not like to acknowledge. >> more than half the victims are men and so if you know anything about the crime of rape, it's a crime of domination. it's a crime of aggression. and it's nothing to do with romance. and so what we have are you know extensions of hazing, extensions of bullying. really aggressive behavior. and the post traumatic stress disorder for rape survivors is so high and unfortunately, the incidents of suicide rates amongst men and women in the military who have experienced sexual trauma is high. so if someone cannot come forward and report that they were raped, then they can't get the services they need to recover. and to somehow heal. interesting also, the percentage of people willing to report and make their name public went down. that's why i know the system is not working. there's not faith that justice is possible. >> senator kirsten gillibrand,

thank you very much for joining us on "new day." we will stay on the story of sexual assault in the military, lets us know how we can be of help. we have two guests coming up with important views, ray kelly and gwen carr, the mother of eric garner, we'll get their take on what happened and why. we have lift-off, folks, moments ago, the unmanned orion spacecraft launched from cape canaveral. it launched atop a delta 4 rocket. the spacecraft will orbit earth twice before it splashes down into the pacific ocean about 600 miles off the coast of baja, california, it should happen around 11:30 a.m. eastern this morning. it's hoped to eventually take astronauts deep into space, eventually as far as mars. an emotional plea from luke somers' family begging his

captors to release him. american commandos tried to free the 33-year-old journalist last week, but failed. in the moving video luke's mom and brother say they don't know why al qaeda targeted him. >> luke spent the last two years making yemen his home. he's a good person and he's only been trying to do good things for the yemeni population. >> please show mercy and give us an opportunity to see our luke again. he is all that we have. >> the terrorist have threatened to kill somers by the end of this week. in about three hours, president obama is going to announce his nominee to succeed chuck hagel as defense secretary. the president is expected to select ashton carter, a physicist and former deputy defense secretary with quite a long history at the pentagon. his hearings are expected to go smoother than hagel's did. actor mark wahlberg seeking a pardon in massachusetts for a 1988 assault conviction. the actor was arrested in boston when he was 15 or 16 years old

for trying to steal alcohol. and hitting two men while he tried to evade police. when he was arrested, he had a small amount of marijuana on him. in a statement, wahlberg said since that time, he has dedicated himself to being a better person and a better citizen. >> he does seem to have turned around his life. >> it was 25 years ago. >> when he was a teenager. all right. let us know what you think, if he should be exonerated for that. what evidence, meanwhile, did the grand jury hear that made them decide not to indict the new york city police officer who choked eric garner to death? a forensic scientist joins us next to examine the evidence. how could a luminous protein in jellyfish, impact life expectancy in the u.s., real estate in hong kong, and the optics industry in germany? at t. rowe price, we understand the connections of a complex, global economy. it's just one reason over 70% of our mutual funds beat

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. the grand jury that made the decision not to indict officer daniel pantaleo studied the evidence for nine weeks, they watched the same video that the rest of america saw showing the chokehold leading to garner's death. what convinced them that the officer should not be charged. let's look at the evidence with a forensic scientist. dr. k, great do see you this morning. let's start with the chokehold. the so-called chokehold. i want to know what you see when you look at the still frame. we have frozen the video to the moment where the chokehold begins and we've learned in the past couple of days, there are many different kinds of chokeholds, some are restraint. some hit the carotid artery.

what do you see? >> the forearm is under his neck. pantaleo's right arm goes under his arm. which is unusual for a chokehold. one could argue that this is a take-down method. but it does appear to me that there is a pressure that is exerted on the neck. the medical examiner thinks this is a compression, most likely this is compression of the veins, of the jugular veins and carotid arteries that leads to lack of oxygen going to the brain. unconsciousness in matter of seconds. >> it wasn't unconscious yet, or for many seconds, the next thing that happens is that he is forced to the ground. and he's still talking when he's on the ground, even though you can see they're restraining his head against the pavement. this is the moment he's saying i can't breathe. >> he's still talking. that tells me that the airway was not obstructed or not completely obstructed. air was capable of moving across the vocal chords. but he had trouble breathing. because in this position, a big

man lying prone, and with people on top of him, exert pressure against the chest. that prevents the chest from expanding, that prevents the lungs from expanding. and inhaling air. he had trouble breathing, no question about that. >> the grand jury saw this video. they reached a different conclusion. they heard from the officer, officer pantaleo behind eric garner. what he told them was during this moment of the fight that you just saw, that they had, he had gotten backed up against a plate glass storefront window. he felt they might go through the window. he had to take eric garner down to the ground as fast as possible to avoid that from happening. >> it's difficult, if not impossible to really get into the mind of police officer pantaleo. but it does appear to be a very forceful encounter. i think the size of mr. garner

intimidated the police. they felt they needed multiple people, they needed to bring him down. that he said he was under arrest. he -- quote-unquote resisted. and they felt they had to take him down. when you're dealing with somebody like that, you don't know underlying conditions. this fellow had asthma, he was, had diabetes, he had sleep apnea. there may have been anatomical issues in the throat. this is a dangerous situation here. you've got a combination of compression of the blood vessels. you've got pressure on the chest. there's a recipe for disaster. again, he still might have been saved had ems rush to the scene and -- >> here they are, they did come to the scene and they stried to save him and tried to resuscitate him, was it after the chokehold? was it too late? >> some people would say he was in the process of dying. however, what ems normally does is check the vital signs. i mean, my understanding is,

that one of the responders, whether it was an emt or advanced emt, i don't know. there was a check of the pulse, but there weren't any other vital signs taken. if they noticed a problem of breathing, respiratory rate, if they noticed a blood pressure problem, they could have treated him. he ultimately died of cardiac arrest. that was secondary to what we see here. >> when you look at the video evidence, the transcript of what the officer testified to as not been released. we do know from a "new york times" article. his attorney said he felt he was on the ground having to protect eric garner from the other officers rushing to the scene and having to protect officers from eric garner biting them, that was his fear. do you understand why the grand jury reached the conclusion they did. >> unfortunately we're not in the grand jury, we don't know what they heard. but it seems to me that they interpreted police officer pantaleo's testimony as meaning

there was no intent to do harm, but only to subdue. i think they bought into that and felt a crime was not committed. i think people seeing the video would start to think about excessive force and i think police training might have prevented this tragic loss. >> dr. ckoblinski, great to see you. every year we hear from the state of the union address. he's invited by congress 0 give it will that happen next year? some members are saying no. we'll take it on on "inside politics" with john king.

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let me give awe look at your headlines. massive demonstrations, in parts ever new york city to a standstill overnight. hundreds of people arrested. while protesting the verdict in the eric garner case. in chicago, demonstrators choked traffic on the magnificent mile delivers their message of social injustice. and in d.c., thousands of protesters gathering outside the department of justice, they were heard chanting, no justice, no peace. new jersey governor chris christie has been cleared in the so-called bridgegate scandal. the democrat who led the investigation said there was no evidence that the governor was involved in the bridgegate. there was an allegation that the governor christie had closed bridge lanes in apparent

represe represe retribution. a manhunt is under way in a suspect in a triple homicide. this man, 33-year-old andre sevals, fatally shot a pastor at his church and murdered his own wife and another woman at a nearby home in bradenton. police have issued a warning say he may be armed and dangerous, the killings appear to involve a domestic dispute. here is quite a story, this fellow is going to have to tell, a 13-year-old arizona boy has a pretty good idea the challenges that face santa. he got stuck in the chimney of his own home. this unidentified teen locked himself out of the house it happens, i've done it. this is where we differ, he decided to use a an extension cord to rapel down the chimney to get back inside. he was not successful in his efforts, luckily the young man had a cell phone, he was able to dial 911. it took an hour for first responders to get the seventh

grader out. we're told he's going to be just fine. the chimney not so much. they had to demolish it to get him out. young man, while ingenious, is going to have some explaining to do do mom and dad. >> resourceful, he had an extension cord to lower himself down. >> i think the conversation starts, honey, you're not mcgyver. >> let me tell you, that's not how the conversation starts. that kid was hoping he would be stuck in the chimney for a long time. >> the conversation with dad -- that's why we hopefully have two parents. >> demolish the chimney. all i'm going to hear is see, that's why i need a phone. let's get to "inside politics" on "new day" with john king. happy friday. >> done a lot of stupid things, but never been stuck in a chimney. >> he's not santa. >> happy friday to you as well. let's go "inside politics." it's been a busy week, it's going to be a busy day in washington. with me, julia pace of the "associated press."

margaret talent of bloomberg news. the president has a meeting at the white house with incoming governors, including the incoming governor of texas joining the lawsuit against the president over immigration. the speaker allowed a vote, he's hoping it mollifies conservatives so they don't now go shutting down the government. the house said the president doesn't have the power to do what he did by executive action. but the senate won't even take up this bill. but the politics of this are getting quite toxic. >> it's interesting. we've had this start to roll pretty quickly after the president's executive orders. what i think will be most interesting in the conversations with the governors today is what the president's response is. because while the house had the vote, it is largely symbolic. but these governors are looking for ways to if not totally roll back the executive orders in their states, at least change what their states can do. it's possible that they could be effective and then if they do have momentum there, what does the house and the senate do next year when republicans have full control. >> on policy side, a lot of republicans say we should first we pass this thing in the house that says he doesn't have the

power to do it. but it's politically symbolic, but won't get anywhere. they say let's do border security, other things. do you respect the republicans will pass several pieces through the house and a newly republican senate? to try to challenge the president's policy? >> i mean you're seeing it play out now with boehner and mitch mcconnell hoping to sort of minimize this keep it as a political fight. and not as a fight that actually threatens a real shutdown. as they game it out, as the establishment leaders game it out in both chambers, they don't win, right? it's looking like there will largely be keeping the government funded through next october. we all know, anything can happen and what's so interesting about today is abbott of course the attorney general of the incoming texas governor, is not only joining the lawsuit, leading the lawsuit. i mean so president obama had his bourbon meeting with mitch mcconnell and now i bet the president would rather climb down the chimney than get stuck with two hours with these guys. >> however, the president thinks this benefits him. he's doing policy, his approval

rating among latinos has gone up. we'll watch as the politics play out. but the conservative base is furious, or still, again, i don't know what the right word is, with speaker boehner and leader mcconnell. we'll see how it plays out. some republicans are saying we're so mad at the president, don't invite him up to give his state of the union address. it seems a little petty. we do that in washington every now and then. speaker boehner was asked, would you not invite the president to address the nation from the house chamer. and the speaker trying to show off his sense of humor says no way, he wants the president to come. >> the more the president talks about his ideas, the more unpopular he becomes. why would i want to deprive him of that opportunity? >> now, it is funny. and we like humor in politics, but did also to me is just a, one-sentence or two-sentence snapshot of how after the election, if you hoped of some sort of a circuit breaker, some sort of a reset button where they would say let's put the sniping aside and have a more

civil, productive environment, forget about it. >> you've got senator cruz saying let's have a full-on fight. let's fight it with every spending bill and they have boehner, the voice of reason saying i don't want to fight about it, i want to embarrass the president at every turn publicly and trying to take advantage of every situation to make him look bad. there's no goodwill. >> from the white house perspective, they think, it's been political ping-pong since the election. >> they're going to be keep talking about things like tax reform and infrastructure spending and trade deals, areas where you might see some compromise. they know even on those areas where there's broad agreement with republicans, it's going to be really difficult to actually get something done when the atmosphere between republicans and the white house remains so toxic. >> we heard michaela mention the chris christie story. a lot of republicans are making their decision whether or not to jump in in 2016. hillary clinton tells top aides she's got a few things to check off on her list. as we wait for candidates to jump in, let's hear perspective, first from secretary clinton and

former president george w. bush. this is secretary clinton yesterday, at an event in boston. reflecting on what she thinks is very important, critical from her experience for any president. >> it is such a challenging job. and you need people starting in your family, but going to your friends. beyond a larger circle. who will really be there for you and continue to treat you like a human being. because you can easily lose touch with what's real. what's authentic. who you were before you raised your hand and were sworn in to office. >> well let's take this on for a second. whether you like or dislike her politics and people watching view her through her own political prism. she does have eight years as first lady. a unique perspective and then in the senate working from the other perspective of how this works and how stressful the job is. >> both hillary and jeb have a

better understanding of the presidency than anybody else could. if you haven't actually had the job yourself. what think is so interesting about clinton talking about the people you surround yourself with, your circle, is that when she ran for president in 2008, one of the problems she had is that she surrounded herself with too many people. people with different interests, people in bill's camp. people in her camp. there was a lot of in-fighting, a lost leaks coming out of the campaign. that may be giving us interesting insight into how she's thinking about shaping her campaign. shaping the people she wants around her and knowing the importance of that group. >> and jump in, margaret, first let's bring george w. bush into this. he's talking p his brother jeb. in an interview with candy crowley you can see this weekend, listen to george w. bush, the former president, his dad was president as well. jeb bush has been through this twice, talking about how his view of the presidency and how jeb would process that. >> when you're weighing the presidency, you think, do i fear success? in other words, can i handle it if i win? you know, on paper it seems like

you know, a maybe easy task. on the other hand when you start thinking about the implications of being president, some people go i'm not sure i could handle that and back off. the other thing about it is the fear of failure. jeb doesn't, nor does he fear success by the way. >> interesting little piece of brotherly love there. you know, can't fear failure or success. >> like if you unpack clinton and bush camps in some sord of freudian lens, it's fascinating. the brothers, first lady versus the senator versus the would-be president. to me, warren buffett's decision to give hillary clinton money. no doubt whatsoever what she's about to do. >> we'll find out early in the new year. margaret, julie, thanks for coming in on a friday. one of our big events in washington next week, final episodes of the "colbert report" coming from washington, d.c., that guy will be stopping fwoi make an appearance on one of the

final shows, we'll have a little fun for that. >> we'll miss that character. >> we'll miss that character. i don't know if we'll like the real colbert so much. >> i'll miss david letterman, life is full of change and transitions. >> thank you, john for that beautiful profound thought on this friday. make sure to watch john king and his "inside politics" panel break down all the best political news of the week, every sunday at 8:30 a.m. eastern time. and president obama calling for sweeping changes to law enforcement. so we'll talk to one big-city police chief who is trying to train his officers to see their own bias.

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that's funny, for that price with comcast business, i think you get like 50 megabits. wow that's fast. personally, i prefer a slow internet. there is something about the sweet meditative glow of a loading website. don't listen to the naysayer. switch to comcast business today and get 50 megabits per second for $89.95. comcast business. built for business. welcome back to "new day." the recent events in new york and ferguson have highlighted what many identify as as a central issue in this country -- a fundamental lack of trust between police and some of the people they're supposed to serve and protect. president obama has organized a task force on policing, comprised of law enforcement community leaders and representatives department of ju justice to try to tackle this

problem. the next guest was at the white house when the president made this announcement. he's had to take on the task of rebuilding police/community relations in his own big city. baltimore, maryland police department commissioner joins us this morning. good morning, commissioner. >> good morning, miss alisyn. how are you doing today? >> i'm doing well. thanks so much for being on "new day" with us, what's been the reaction in baltimore to the grand jury decisions of the past couple of weeks? >> i think there's been a visceral reaction for the community, much like the rest of the nation. we've had protests that have been out, and a numb of the protests have been led by young people. where our university town, we had a lot of major universities and you feel that there is a deep-rooted upheaval, that has taken place. >> when you watch the video, of eric garner's arrest and death, what do you think of the tactics that the nypd was using? >> i want to address the tactics, i don't have enough

information. my good friend bill bratton, think what you hear from him is that he is not tone-deaf to the issues he's very much aware of the relationship he's trying to build. he's brought in to address that situation, much like i've been brought in to address the situation of the public trust within the city of baltimore. i've had the opportunity to do the same thing in the city of long beach, in the city of oakland, in california. >> i want to talk about some of the things you've done. they seem to be exactly what police departments around the country are talking about right now. you say that you have had to train your officers to be aware of their own bias, everyone has bias, of course, it's our blind spot. so how are you opening your officers' eyes to that? >> the first thing you have to start with is to understand that if crime is, if crime is down, but that community is no better off than what it was prior to you going in, then you haven't served the community. number two, you have to understand what your particular community wants from you.

communities change on a regular basis, based on demographics, so those expectations, you have to ask, you have to survey, you have to have an understanding, make sure that officers understand that they have, we all come with biases, to understand those biases, and how they can impact your ability to do your job. but i try to push on our officers and make them understand, i demand that you have a reverence for life, you have a reverence for human life and we change our tactics to make sure we have, everyone goes home safe. and in the city of baltimore we've had a reduction in excessive force, a% officer-involved shootings are down and 50% officer complaints are down. we haven't stopped our challenges, but we're moving in the right direction. >> those numbers are so admirable. any police chief across the country would want the numbers that your department has, how have you changed your tactics to do that?

>> the training first of all, like i said number one, you have to understand that our job is to reestablish and affirm the public trust. skt community what they want. because we in fact do work for them and we have to meet their expectations and we have to teach officers to slow down. you don't have to move in so quickly. we try to teach them to deescalate. we teach them a course called fair and impartial policing, we're bombarding them with a lot of different training. a lot of different changes going on in a short amount of time. all of that train something good, but you need to have good supervision and good leadership to slow your officers down to give them the direction they should be taking. >> it's so interesting to hear you talk about this. what everybody has said in the ferguson case and the staten island case this week, is it escalated so quickly. someone was dead so quickly in the space of sometimes 90 seconds, it changed the course of their lives and history in that way. so the idea that they can get

everyone involved in that incident, to slow it down, take a deep breath, and deescalate is exactly what people are looking for. one other point i want to make about your department. last year you saw a 300% increase in calls from the community into your crime stopper line. how did you get that community involvement in solving crime? >> i think we're pushing to be transparent within our community. when we make mistakes, we go out front and we share with the community. we made these mistakes. we share with them how we're going to correct the mistakes and we're going to get better as an organization. i have no tolerance for scandals, i have no tolerance for the misconduct that's there. and i think that my command staff is starting to techo the same things. i think the community is starting to understand that we take their needs seriously. and when they believe, when they feel that we take their needs seriously, they come out and support us. the only way you're going to address crime in a systemic way, is to make sure that you have the cooperation and the partnership of your community.

that you work in a way that they expect you to. >> do you have police officers from those neighborhoods? >> a lot of our officers, are born and raised from the city of baltimore. especially the more tenured officers that are here. we're recently starting to get some officers coming in from new york, from pennsylvania, from delaware. our recruiting efforts are very heavily focused on the city of baltimore. because that's what the mayor wants, she wants the home-grown people that are here and we're building programs like our explorer scout program, our college cadet program to bring baltimoreans into the police organization with diversity. >> commissioner, i know you went to the white house, you've had these conversations, you've been part of the conversations with president obama. what are the president's ideas of change? >> the interesting thing when i sat with the president on monday, he feels it deeply. he's taken this seriously. he's going to push this definitely. i think -- much like myself where i grew up in south-central

los angeles in california, i understand what it's like to come from an impoverished community and see the only point of government is law enforcement. which makes it so critical, it was the fact that a police officer touched me in a different way, that i wear this uniform today. and i think what the president is saying and what i'm trying to get across is, we can be a force that turns around a community to bring hope and to bring success and a vision of success for a community. >> commissioner anthony bass, great to hear your inspirational record there. nice to see you this morning. we want to take you to a city that is at the center of the war on isis and it is literally hanging on by a thread. our cameras will give you an up-close look at what fighting is like on the ground in close, inside kobani. next. right now, you can get a single line with 3 gigs for $65 a month. 3 gigs ... is that a lot? that's about...100 app downloads, 45 hours of streaming music, and 6 hours of video playing.

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thank you, ping. reliably fast internet starts at $89.95 a month. comcast business. built for business. we turn now to syria and the desperate fight to live in kobani. our nick paton walsh is one of the few western journalists reporting from there. what is it like to try and survive there as a civilian, raise a family? nick shows us what life is like for families and for children who still live there among the ruins. >> reporter: kobani feels haunted by those who are still alive in it. inhumane enough that the noise of coalition warplanes above is of strange comfort. the destruction so near complete, the fight is more now for victory alone, not for its

spoils. here, they've even given up on hospitals. this, the last one,tened by a car bomb. the wounded now taken straight to the border. from the ground level you can see what months has done. it's impossible to imagine the city sustaining life any time in the near future but still the fighting persists, the shelling almost constant, so much of it caused by crude homemade devices like this. there are civilians here, those who refuse or cannot flee and children besieged, who cannot be protected from indiscriminate, constant shelling. yousef can list of their friends who left. they show us their only option, what they do when the blasts start. their uncle taught them to hide like this.

this couldn't be further from play time, though. there are the remnants of lives enjoyed, but also of lives taken early. alif walks us to a spot where, a week earlier, his young daughter was killed by a random mortar, the sort that is still falling. three to four mortars fell near us, he says. "the first we escaped from, the second we escaped from and then the third fell on us." "my daughter was 7 years old, 7 years old, and she died. god bless and help us." he has six daughters, and the 150 sheep they live off here, after isis attacked their nearby village. he could not leave the flock or the family car, and flee to safety in turkey. "she was 7 years old" he says, "she was so beautiful, small, and people who saw her felt the need to lift her up and down and

play." he went to her grave the day before and sat there for 30 minutes. it is the graveyard that tells you about the near future and the more distant one, a trench dug for the dead they expect next to those they have already buried, headstones from rubble. again, a morbid playground. too young to fathom the fight around them that will decide what kind of life survival here could leave them with. nick paton walsh, cnn, kobani. >> compelling and heartbreaking look. our thanks to nick. we turn to a second straight night of protests in new york and across our country after a police officer is cleared in the chokehold death of eric garner. the protest bigger, intense moments unfolding coast to coast. we'll take you live to the ground with the latest.

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medicare open enrollment. you'll never know unless you go. i did it. you can too. ♪ this is very dpiifferent th last night. >> even bigger protests in the wake of a grand jury decision not to indict a police officer

in the death of eric garner. >> reporter: they are walking down hudson. >> we have to make a change because they're killing us all. >> hands up. >> don't shoot. >> hands up. >> don't shoot. >> race continues to play such an emotional divisive part of life. >> this is not a black and whitishwhit white issue. this is a national crisis. >> i can't breathe. is there there's a larger question of restoring a sense of common purpose. >> i think it's very clear this was excessive force. >> he's a mature police officer who is motivated literally by serving the community. >> he paid no consideration to my son when he was choking him. >> good morning, welcome back to "new day." it is friday, december 5th, just about 8:00 in the east. chris cuomo and alisyn camerota here, sweeping changes, that's what's promise in the death of eric garner. thousands hit the streets to protest the grand jury decision. officers in the predincinct whe

eric garner was killed will begin wearing body cameras today while on patrol, one of the things the mayor is ordering. >> protesters are demanding daniel panteleo be locked up in the death of the father of six, and let's begin our coverage with alexandra field live in new york's times square. good morning. >> reporter: good morning, alisyn. frustration mounting and demonstrations growing. overnight nypd says more than 00 arrests were made in connection with the demonstrations, compare to 83 arrests the night before, one sign of how many more people were out here on the streets. the police department hasn't talked about what kind of charges are related to those arrests but certainly a lot of people getting out here talking about their frustration, not just in this city but in cities around the country. >> reporter: why were you arrested? >> for standing and protesting. >> reporter: protests across new york.

>> they wouldn't let us walk through times squire. >> reporter: after several hours of marching, police cracking down as thousands of protesters gathered for a second night. standoffs but no serious violence replicated across the country. nationwide outrage garner's daughter says she appreciates. >> this is not a black and white issue. this is a national crisis. >> reporter: in chicago, protesters clashed with police are shutting down a major thoroughfare. and in d.c., protesters staged a die-in, only blocks from the white house. >> no justice. >> no peace. >> reporter: all this after a grand jury declined to indict nypd officer daniel pantaleo in the chokehold death of 43-year-old eric garner. >> i can't breathe. >> reporter: according to the new york supreme court the grand jury sat for nine weeks hearing from a total of 50 witnesses, 22 civilians, police officers and medical personnel. 60 exhibits were admitted into

evidence including videos, records regarding nypd policies and procedures, garner's medical records and photographs of the scene, but the details of that evidence remain sealed. >> what video was they watching? because obviously it wasn't the one that the whole world was watching. [ bleep ]. >> reporter: the department of justice launching a federal investigation. >> too many americans feel deep unfairness when it comes to the gap between our professed ideals and how laws are applied on a day-to-day basis. >> reporter: new york mayor bill de blasio ordering the retraining of the nypd's 35,000 officers. >> we're changing how our officers talk with residents of the city, changing how they listen. >> reporter: and attorney general eric holder calling for reform. >> there are real, practical and concrete measures that can be taken. >> reporter: reform civil rights

leaders say is needed nationwide. >> when we shine a spotlight on the criminal justice system, when we shine a spotlight on the experiences of people it points to a very big problem. >> reporter: in cleveland, ohio, a nearly two-year investigation by the justice department found what they call a pattern of excessive force by police caused by insufficient accountability, inadequate training and ineffective policies. the naacp and the montgomery county sheriff's department are investigating racist text messages allegedly exchanged by several deputies, parts of the text read aloud by dayton naacp president derek forward. >> what do apples and black people have in common? they both hang from trees. >> reporter: the montgomery county sheriff believes the text messages have certainly tarnished that office. there is a lot of conversation happening on the streets and in a number of different cities, about how our communities are policed and who does the policing. we've got these cases that have

brought this conversation forward, eric garner, mike brown, they are the flashpoints but now generating a much wider and very passionate kind of conversation, alisyn. >> we want to continue that conversation right now, alexandra. thanks so much. we bring in greg meeks, democratic congressman from new york, good morning. >> good morning. >> as salexandra said there is conversation happening, people are calling for change. where specifically do you think we should start? >> you know, i think that first i'm pleased that the people that are calling for change are americans, they're black, they're white, they're hispanic, asian, that's where we immediate to start from, when you look at the demonstrations in the street that's a very good thing, because the change these to be in the criminal justice system and i think that the mayor is right here in new york, and others can follow with the retraining of police officers, because there seems to be a problem on how police patrol communities of color, and that

has, that relationship has to change. >> there's a problem with the police and also seems to be great frustration with the grand jury process and if there's a problem with police how they are prosecuted and investigated. it's been pointed out many times there seems to be a conflict of interest. you can't ask a district attorney to investigate or prosecute the very police with whom he or she is an ally the rest of the year. so where do you go with that? >> that was one of the reasons why i was shocked especially in new york, as well as in ferguson. i'm a former assistant prosecutor myself. i know that in these cases, theres aknow way that you should be able to not be able to get an indictment. look, here in new york, and that's why i think that one of the things that has to happen, and i hope that loretta lynch and the attorney general, eric holder, look at this very carefully, i think that we need to know exactly what took place in that grand jury room. >> why isn't staten island releasing that?

wouldn't that help the transparency? why isn't this district of staten island able to release the investigation as they did in ferguson? >> i think it has to happen and that's a big question and if they don't do it on their own i think that's again, i will be calling on black folks have to do oftentimes, the federal government to make that happen, because something had to go wrong. what was his instructions to the grand jury? did he ask for an indictment. how did yhe cross-examine the police officer when he was on the witness stand, because the d.a. is in complete control in the grand jury proceeding, and so either he did not want an indictment so therefore he did not go after the detective in an aggressive way, as you would do ordinarily in a grand jury proceeding or, so we need to know that, and that is something that i think is very important to have, to know as far as transparency is concerned in this particular process. >> so are you calling for a special prosecutor going forward in police cases or even going further and having an

independent body investigate this? >> what i think needs to be done and what i think that the attorney general holder is in a perfect position to do that, i think we need to have a complete review of what is in place within the criminal justice system, and the relationship between prosecutors and when there are trying cases against police officers, and i would hope that in the practice and pattern of investigation that the attorney general will be conducting, that that is included therein so we can try to make sure that we're not doing something on one specific case and we can make sure we're doing something that can be nationally done bus this is a national issue and problem that we have so i hope that in his report that attorney general holder includes the grand jury process in that, as he reports back. >> would the independent body solve this problem? should that be the findings of the review? >> well, i want him to look at it, because i see here in new york, for example, when we had the case over in howard beach we

had an independent prosecutor come in and that was the right thing to do. i also know, for example, we have a d.a., bob johnson in the bronx or newly elected d.a. in brooklyn that have tried these cases and generally we've had indictments so it may be we're at a point there has to be a change. i would like to see the attorney general in looking across jurisdictions of states to do a complete review so that question make sure we're doing something comprehensive that's going to get to the root of this problem and solve it, and that's something that's just something we had' do in the short term. >> do you think there will be civil charges in the eric dwarner case? >> i hope after a thorough review the attorney general does, that there will be charges. i look at the tape, all you have to do is look at the tape and it seems clear to me that mr. garner is not only was he

violated and killed, his human rilgts was violated. it was a human rights violation that we have to address and i think that there should be a prosecution of the police officer. >> congressman greg meeks we look forward to seeing what congress can do about this national conversation and what happens with the federal investigation. thanks so much for coming in. >> good being with you. >> let's go over to michaela for more news. >> nine minutes past the hour. bill cosby's attorneys firing back at judy huth, the woman who says she was sexually assaulted by the comedian when she was just 15 years old. cosby's legal team claimed huth tried to extort cosby for a quarter million-dollar and she attempted to sell her story to a tabloid about a decade ago. now they are suing her, seeking dismissal of her lawsuit, and monetary damages. a showdown on immigration brewing in the oval office. president owe pa ma plans to meet today with seven newly elected grns. one of them is suing him. republican greg abbott is leading a 17-state lawsuit

against the president's executive action on immigration. this meeting comes as part of obama's outreach effort after democrats were trounced in november's midterm elections. just over an hour ago the unmanned spaceship orion successfully launched from cape ta canaveral. it will orbit earth twice before it splashes into the ocean around baja, california, around 1:0, when the rocket becomes fully operational, orion will be able to carry people into deep space with the ultimate goal to transport passengers to mars and back. a severe flu season could be on tap even if you got a flu shot. the centers for disease control says that anyone who was recently vaccinate kd still come down with the flu in the coming weeks because the virus has mutated, meaning vaccines may not protect people from at least 50 strains of the virus. it's too late to make a new vaccine to protect against the new strains in time for this year's flu season.

the cdc is suggesting that you get a flu shot because it apparently will lessen the severity of the illness if you get it. >> they also suggest you just wash your hands a lot. >> a lot. >> that's another good way to avoid it. >> i don't know why i need to know that. i don't think i want to know that the vaccine -- >> you would be mad, you would go to your outrage if you got sick, you'd be like why? i got a flu shot. >> i go to my outrage because it's my reach of motion. it could be anything. i didn't have a blueberry doughnut this morning and i'm outraged about that. that's easy. i don't want to know. if you're going to make me get the vaccine don't tell me, by the way, you may still get sick. i show that as disincentive. speaking of actually valid outrage we'll get a little bit deeper into eric garner's death. there's a rallying cry for change in new york city and across the country, but it is based out of here right now so we'll bring in former new york police commissioner raymond kelly. he knows about how the nypd works, he put a lot of the rules

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to get richard to his campbell's chunky soup. it's new chunky beer-n-cheese with beef and bacon soup. i love it. and mama loves you. ♪ eric garper's mom says her son was treated worse than an animal, claims the police officer who put had imin a chokehold and left him to die

showed no mercy. she said she could never forgive officer pantaleo for killing her son. here is gwen carr joined by her family's lawyer, jonathan moore. good morning, thank you for joining us. >> good morning. >> miss carr, how are you doing? >> a little better than i was two days ago. >> we're sorry you and your family are experiencing this. what happened when you found out that there would be no indictment of the officer? >> i was very distraught, disappointed, and felt like i was failed by the system. it was not a good day for me. >> how do you explain the grand jury's findings? >> i really can't explain it. i just can't see how there was no indictment. i mean, looking at the tape, listening to the medical

examiner's report, that's reason for indictment right there. we actually didn't need a grand jury for an indictment the way i see it. >> because the coroner ruled it a homicide. >> exactly. >> as you know, officer pantaleo has said that he's terribly sorry about this, that he wished that this hadn't happened. he didn't intend to kill your son. >> you know, i really wonder who wrote that paragraph. i guess after the decision his attorney probably told him we have to put something out there and probably his secretary wrote it. he may have never even read what was written. >> you don't feel that it's genuine. >> i really don't. even if it was how am i ever going to forgive someone who murdered my son so viciously, left him on the hot pavement to die that day.

no help from no one, ems, all these trained people, no one helped him. >> mr. moore, have you gotten any insight to the grand jury's process, the evidence they saw and why they came to the conclusion of no indictment? >> of course it's a secret at this point. they're not releasing the transcripts or even the exhibits that were given to the grand jury. >> are you calling upon them to release it? >> yes, i think this case cries out for transparency, a case of great public importance so let's see what kind of presentation they made to the grand jury. i don't think they did a very good job. let me tell you one example why. they offered i munlt to all of the other officers other than pantaleo at the beginning of the process. this was not just one officer engaged in misconduct. this was a group of officers and to start the process by giving all the other officers immunity

so they could come in and back up pantaleo and do whatever they wanted to to to try to get him off suggests that the d.a. really wasn't aggressively going after an indictment in this case. >> mrs. carr, most of us have come to know your son only through the video of his arrest and ultimately death that we've seen. what can you tell us about your son? >> well, my son, which was my first born, was my life. he was a very considerate person, even though, you know, he wasn't perfect. most times none of our children are, but i loved him. he loved me. he loved his siblings. he was always protective of them, and very protective of his children, and they loved him dearly also, even people in the

street, people who i have never met before came up to me since this incident happened, telling me things about my son i never even know, a homeless man came up to my granddaughter when we were rallying and asked is eric garner your son? i'm sorry, is eric garner your father, and she replied yes, he said "you know, your father fed me every day." she said, "really? i didn't know that." "yes, he fed me every day he would buy me a sandwich whenever i seen him" and my heart was just so, you know, lifted to hear this man, you know, talk about my son, things that i didn't even know about him. >> your granddaughter, erica, was on cnn last night. >> yes. >> and she talked about how she does not think that this was a racial incident. let me play for you what she said.

>> okay. >> -- issue of race, do you think it's a racial issue? >> i really doubt it. it was about the officer's pride. it was about my father being 6'4" and 350 pounds and he wanted to be, you know, the top cop that brings this big man down. >> you're nodding, mrs. carr. do you agree? >> i do agree with her, because for some reason, officers are, some officers are intimidated by larger black men. >> but she's saying it could have been a 350 pound white man and the same thing would have happened. >> and she's right, because the size, because if you look at pantaleo, he's a little man, and he sneaked up behind my son and grabbed him, which he didn't have to do that. my son was no threat at that time. if you look at the video, he's talking to them, but he has his hands up at all times. they know that he wasn't going to try to attack them or

anything. he wanted to be a hero, and he went behind him, and put him in a chokehold, and brought him down, and then he wouldn't let him go, as my son begged for his life. he still held on, so it was like a thrill kill. >> what do you stye people who say that, had your son simply complied with the officers that this wouldn't have happened? >> he was complying. what more could he do? he had his hands up. >> what do you want to see happen? >> i would like to see a just decision in my son's case. the jury didn't give us a just decision, from things that i heard, witnesses who went before the grand jury, i heard that they never even looked up at them, or they might have been in there five minutes and never even got eye contact with the grand jury. i thought that was, that's very

disrespectful. >> well, mrs. carr, we are sorry for your loss. we appreciate you coming in, and sharing your personal feelings with us. best of luck to you, jonathan moore, thank you for accompanying her. people are feeling for your family. >> and i appreciate it. i appreciate all the protesters, keep on protesting. traffic was stopped last -- i was on my way home on the west side highway, the traffic was held up, the protesters were walking past us, i had to let my window down and you know, some of them, the first person who recognized me was a white gentleman, he came and said "this is eric garner's mother" he came over, he went to shake my hand, other protesters wanted to take a picture with me, i was sitting in the car, and i was so thrilled, so thrilled, even to be held up in traffic, and they were coming by and they were standing for my son.

i thank them, i thank them so very much. keep up the good work. >> thank you. thank you for sharing that, miss carr. let's go over to chris. >> it's a family in need of healing and a nation in need of healing. you have the protesters, as we were just hearing, bringing new york to a standstill, they're fighting for justice, they say, over their choking death of eric garner. ahead we'll have former new york police chief ray kelly, he knows the nypd inside and out, about why this happened and what needs to happen next. breathe through your nose... suddenly you're a mouthbreather. well, put on a breathe right strip and instantly open your nose up to 38% more than cold medicines alone. so you can breathe and sleep. shut your mouth and sleep right. breathe right. so you can breathe and sleep. and i quit smoking with chantix. people who know me, they say 'i never thought you would quit.' but chantix helped me do it. along with support, chantix (varenicline) is proven to help people quit smoking. it gave me the power to overcome the urge to smoke.

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...and let in the dog that woke the man who drove to the control room [ woman ] driverless mode engaged.

find parking space. [ woman ] parking space found. [ male announcer ] ...that secured the data that directed the turbines that powered the farm that made the milk that went to the store that reminded the man to buy the milk that was poured by the girl who loved the cat. [ meows ] the internet of everything is changing everything. cisco. tomorrow starts here. welcome back to "new day," a couple minutes before 8:30 in the east. another night of protests across the u.s., thousands marching, mostly because of the grand jury decision in the eric garner case. i say that because many people are marching about the michael brown case but in new york, the sheer volume of protesters highlighted the tension between police and the community that they serve. let's bring in former new york city police commissioner raymond kelly. good to have you, commissioner, as always. thank you for being here. >> thank you, chris.

>> first how the protests are going in new york city, do you believe that this is happening the right way here? are the police doing the right thing? are the protesters doing the right thing? >> the right thing, that's an interesting question. obviously they're tying up traffic. there's a lot of concern, and there's a lot of emotion involved here. i think the police are doing a good job. i think sometimes you have to prevent people from blocking traffic or taking a bridge, and you know, that's something that i would hope the leadership is looking at doing, but what we've seen is the demonstrators able to take over streets and bridges for a significant period of time, that impacts on a lot of people's lives. >> what can you do without escalating the situation and turning it into something that's a real disaster. >> they made 100 arrests last evening, but you don't always have to make arrests. the police department of new york is the biggest in the country, 35,000 uniformed officers. you can mass officers to prevent some of these things from happening. >> do you think it's wrong they're taking to the streets and protesting over what

happened? >> no, absolutely not. that's what we're all about here in this country. people have very deep concerns about two decisions, michael brown and eric garner case. we understand that. >> when you look at this garner tape, you've seen it. you look at what the officer's doing there. were you surprised there was no indictment? >> no, i think you can't put yourselves in the place of the grand jury. we weren't there. i don't know what they saw. i don't know if they did it frame by frame, i don't know what the officer said. >> do you think we should know? >> i'd like to know, and obviously new york lawyers. >> he hasn't asked the prosecutor or -- >> a portion of it, you got some information. >> he's not going the disclosure route. you think they should be? >> at this jink tour i'd like to see more information, yes. >> there's something about it that doesn't make sense if you look at the video in real time, it looks like he's choking the guy, he goes down. >> i think it's important to remember that chokehold is restricted by an internal regulation. >> right.

>> it is not against the law, and many police departments in the country this is no problem. >> true. >> so it is a regulation. >> right, and it was very important to you. you were out front about it from day one. >> i juaned the regulation, put in the regulation 20 years ago because we had a series of cases, no question about it, very sensitive when you go near someone's neck and resulted in the death of other people in the history of this department and other departments. >> whether it's legal or not i feel we're getting caught in the beads. he gets behind the guy, he chokes him, the guy goes down saying "i can't breathe" he dies, it screams of excessive force. >> well, again, we don't know exactly what was presented to the grand jury. >> then you get why this happened and race comes up, unarmed black man, selling cigarettes, maybe, maybe not, who knows if he even had the cigarettes there, that's unclear and he winds up dying and this is what happens because blacks don't get fair treatment by the cops. it's a cultural problem. do you accept that? >> do i accept that? i accept that as being a perception on a lot of people.

there is a perception in the african-american community that they don't get fair treatment in many, many encounters with the police department. i would like to point out that, in 2013, there was a poll satisfactory with the new york city police department, 70% of people approved the actions of the nypd, and it was 58% african-american community, so the notion that there is this great schism between african-american community and the nypd simply was not the case in 2013. now, if if you keyou keep talki it, continue to fester and become more of a problem. >> you think that our talking about it is creating the problem? >> no, i think the politicians and certainly in the campaign in 2013, it was made an issue, and continues to be an issue in the political sphere, so yes, i think that adds to the problem. >> but do you think that it's not just highlighting a reality

that cops in high crime districts tend to be minority districts have a rough he and less dignified relationship with the police? >> that's what the issue is, what people are saying, is there tension in some minority communities between the police and the people who live there? sure. >> can you change that? >> i'm sorry? >> can you change it? >> you can work to change it. >> how? >> more communication, having a more diversified police force. the nypd police officer rank is ma north minority and the police officers born in 106 countries so a lot of effort has been made. i think we made a lot of progress. when you have an eric garner case, a michael brown case, certainly it sets us back significantly, but in the big picture, certainly from my vantage point, having been in the business who years. >> sure. >> a lot of progress has been made. >> and it gets to then how do we improve? you have to deal with culture, with conversation, with the community, you work for them, not against them. what happens when the horrible happens? do you think prosecutors should

investigate their own cops? >> prosecutors are elected. we have five district attorneys elected in new york city. they are representing the people. now in certain instances i could see where you need a special prosecutor, but in normal cases, when i say normal cases, some encounter between the police and members of minority community, i think the d.a.s can do the job. >> they're making all their cases with these same men and women. these are their people. the guy out in staten island, these are his cops that he makes cases with all the time. and so he goes before the grand jury, do you think he's as aggressive with that defendant being a cop, as he would be if it were eric garner? they usually go in there wanting an indictment. the grand jury is a tool of theirs. >> the districts in new york city that i know of, we all hold them to the highest standards. you think they do a terrific job. in certain instances maybe it calls for a special prosecutor. i wouldn't say in a normal course -- any time there's a

police investigation you need a special prosecutor? i don't think so. they'd be against it quite a bit. >> inside baseball but people trying to figure out how this happened, probable cause is a bar you could have hopped over easily. staten island is where this happened, they made a movie "cop land" basically about staten island a lot of conservative people, a lot of first responder families there, and that maybe if this had happened in another burrough you would have gotten an indictment but not there. is there anything to that? >> the grand jury as i understand it is made up of 14 whites and 9 or 8 african-americans, so that's pretty representative, and actually the demme graphics of staten island a larger percentage of whites in that jury that reflected. so i think that's a pretty reasonable construct of a grand jury to look at this case. >> you think going forward changes can be made, the first thing we've heard is three-day

training for 22,000 cops and that's going to be the sweeping change. that's not going to be enough. that's just a first step, right? >> as far as training is concerned i'd like to point out the nypd is the only major police department that had its training credited on the commission law enforcement accreditation. it took four years to do, renewed in 2009 and 2012. so the training i think has been well done. is a new training going to make a difference? we'll see. i don't know who devised it and put it together, i don't know what expert input we have. we'll have to see. >> could be something that just sounds good. >> we'll talk about it for a while, there's always an answer down the road. >> that's right. you started this conversation with kind of adding that, you know a lot of politicians say this, and you know, and now they're saying they got the solution and it's in training. do you think that the police can become scapegoats in a situation for politicians who don't want to deal with underlying social issues? >> sure, absolutely. we've seen that throughout the

history of modern policing. the police are easy to bash. in this city, you have record low crime rates. last year we had 333 murders. in 1990 we had 2,245 murders and a million fewer people living in new york than we have now. the city is safe as it's ever been. yet still people want to blame the police for a myriad of things. >> pushback, how did you get it that way? part of it is the economy and the external factors but whether it's stop and frisk, you had strong feelings about, broken windows policy, brattin and you were architects of that, that the people who you police on that level pay too high a price for too small a crime. this guy was selling cigarettes, gets rushed by a handful of officers, he winds up dying. >> people who live in the communities i think have a strong relationship with the police, contrary to what you may see in the media. they need help. they want help. the president said that the

other day, that these communities of color need strong police, and it has absolutely transformed neighborhoods throughout new york, you know that. you've been here your whole life, neighborhoods you never go to 20 years ago now have million-dollar condos in it. that's because of the low levels of crime and the feeling of public safety. >> you do not think that this should be representative of the nypd overall in terms of its reputation. >> in terms of what? >> the eric garner situation. >> the new york city police department does terrific work every day. it's made this city that was crime-ridden in 1990 the safest big city in america. >> commissioner kelly, you're certainly a part of that legacy and we appreciate you being on "new day." >> thanks, chris. >> alisyn over to you. the final jobs report of the year is in and there's a big surprise inside. details ahead. ♪

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we're getting a look at the latest jobs numbers. christine romans is here to wreak them down for us. >> it's a strong jobs report, a strong jobs report, 321,000 net new jobs created in the month, 321,000, the unemployment rate still 5.8%, which is basically the lowest since 2008 and the labor department saying that there was broad strength across job categories. i'm looking in the numbers, technical consultants, business professional services, computer systems workers, tech workers, accountants, high skilled manufacturing, lots of different kinds of jobs here so not just the low-paid retail jobs anymore, it's a lot of different jobs in here and that's something that's encouraging. we are on track for the best year of job creation since 1999,

2.6 million jobs added so far this year and the trend really important, ten months in a row of 200,000 plus net new jobs created. why do people not feel this? wages are not growing quickly. so the kinds of jobs are getting better, there are more of these jobs but wages are not growing along with it, and that is still a real problem in the economic recovery. make no mistake this is a strong jobs report. >> great way to end the year on the jobs number. christine romans have a great weekend. >> you, too. after the grand jury decision and the wide protests, what's next? how does the reconciliation start?

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show them they're not alone. and show off a pair of depend. get a free sample at underwareness.com good to have you back with us here on "new day." a conversation is taking place all across the nation, how do we rebuild a broken trust with police and how to make sure minorities are treated with respect by all officers who want to dig deeper. we've got quite a panel, michael smerconish, charlie rangel, democratic congressman of new york and l.z. granderson. it's a delight to have you all here. i want to if you'll allow and indulge me to take this beyond the politics and talk about what we can be doing on the ground level in our communities. one of the things that i think we've all realized, there's a two-pronged aspect of this, what's going on with law enforcement and the criminal justice system and what's going on in our communities, they're

inextricably linked. congressman, what can we be doing in terms of seeing how law enforcement is interacting with our communities of color. >> there's two problems. one, as awkward as it is, we have to say that this great country of ours has a cancer called racism. until you admit it, there's no way in the world to deal with it. the police only symbolic of attitudes people have. they're not born with it. they learn how to do it and they treat people differently because of their color. you know, when people thought that long ago we were picking cotton without any names or culture and 60 years ago there was a question as to whether or not we had civil rights, whether we had voting. i say that because we've come a good distance from where we were when we were brought into this country. >> we have a long way to go. >> we have to admit it.

when i marched with dr. king i never believed i would hear lyndon johnson say what he did. i was out there politically more than believing in my heart we'd turn this country around. when the dogs came out, when the kids got womaned in church, when white folks said oh my god, that could be me, things changed, and things are changing now. >> l.z., things are changing but it's 2014, and we've just seen what's happened in the last few months, and we see the rage, we see the frustration, we see the misconceptions, we see the stereotypes, we see the biases. how do we begin to change attitudes, to foster understanding both within the black community, but with also the other communities of color and within the white community? >> well, it definitely starts with admitting we have a problem. >> fair enough. >> by we i don't just mean white

people, all of us. tons of studies have been conducted that shows inherently we have some level of implicit racism, some level of implicit bias. it's not race-baiting or racism to admit that we all have this problem and then the second part of it is looking at there's a difference between racist and racism and institutionalized racism. you can have institutionalized racism, have longlasting impact on a minority community without having racist people saying i hate black people. >> you have a system that is racist. >> case in point if you look at our education system, we know one of the precursors for longstanding academic achievement is preschool, early childhood development. when you look at the number of facilities available in minority communities, when you look at the disparity along racial lines among black people suspended from preschool versus their white counterparts you see how not necessarily racist people but a systemic racist, have

racial impacts on a community, those are the sort of things we need to begin evaluatinevaluati. >> michael, you have had a chance to talk to people cross the country. >> incessantly. >> what are you hearing from people from alli ilks, backgrounds and races. >> i entertain telephone calls from all across the country, i answer phones for a living, we've had four high prchb profile the incidents that ended in the same way, trayvon martin, mike brown, tamir rice and now eric garner. something changed and it doesn't make any of this worth it but perhaps there's a silver lining. i'm seeing, hearing something different now with regard to the garner case and the tamir rice case in cleveland that i didn't hear with regard to mike brown and trayvon martin, and that is that when i hear a voice on the phone and if i could discern if they're african-american or if they're white i pretty much used to know which way this call was going to go. these two incidents with the presence of the videotape have

dramatically changed that, and now i think that there's far more of a consensus than i recognized in the prior incidents of people being offended regardless of their ideological perspective or their racial perspective. >> congressman, that's really interesting, we saw the video from the protests we're seeing across the nation, remarkably here in new york last night, spike lee even mentioned it, that it's a beautiful thing to see new yorkers coming out in support of eric garner and his family. how do we make this conversation one that we can have not just in times of crisis. the relationship is important to establish when there isn't just a problem. it has to be one that is sort of part of the fan rick of our society. >> some politician said no good crisis should go to waste, and it's a time of crisis that ministers and rabbis and everyone, you know, they deal directly, right, and they should be able to say that god didn't want people -- when god gives

birth to these little kids, they haven't the slightest clue as to who to hate and who to dislike. >> we're born with a clean slate. >> if ever they had an agenda just like in the civil rights movement, you had nuns, you had rabbis, you had people of all faiths saying this is wrong, and it made you feel good that you were trying to correct something. so don't wait for a crisis. take advantage of this one and i really think that if we had education about what people have gone through, my buddy used to be, by the time he got finished telling me how irish are treated. >> different perspective. >> and then the italians would come and they still are suffering with "the sopranos" and whatnot, and they are treated really mean by people who they don't have to have an interchange with, even today. if you can put your feet or kids' feet into shoes that we

have to walk because we are the kids from the slaves, i think as americans you would say thank god i'm born in america, thank god it's time we can change and thank god we can get rid of this cancer we have. >> walk another mile in another man's moccasins is what i like to say. the three of you care deeply about the nation, the conversation we're having and the three of you are all fathers. i'm curious how this conversation has gone with each of you, and what it has been with your grandchildren even. michael i'll start with you. you have three sons, a daughter. the conversation around this, and what you want the conversation to be with your kids and i'll get your reaction in the last two minutes. >> let's be fair. i've never had to have the kind of conversation with my three sons that these men have had. >> there's a conversation to be had. >> oh we've had a conversation, believe me, at our dinner table this is the sort of thing that gets discussed constantly, but it's not the same type of a

conversation that would take place if we were a family of color, and that in and of itself is quite heartbreaking and i've had any number of people share with me the types of comments they've had to make to their own sons how to deal with law enforcement if they should find themselves in an interaction with police that i've never had to have. >> l.z., quickly, and i'll get the congressman's response. >> i'm in a blessed place right now, in my household we're going through the college application process, and so we're talking about my son's future, as these event are unfolding and he wants to go into higher education. he wants to go into policymaking because he wants to impact education, because he sees the through line between the racial disparity in terms of public education and many of the ills that he sees happening including what's happening with michael brown, and so education is what the focus of our conversation has been about. >> congressman, final quick thought, 30 second. >> well, i would say it's national security. we have so many damned enemies, we cannot afford to be fighting

among ourselves because of color and background, because my son is a marine, he gets offended when i tell him to act any differently because someone else has a uniform that he thinks is inferior to the one that he wore as a united states marine. so people don't like the attitude especially men, do you tell them they have to get rid of their respect for themselves because someone's a bigot? but listen, we got a long way to go, and i hope we all are correct that this could be the turning point in terms of how black and others live and work together in this great country of ours. >> i have loved this conversation with all of you, congressman, michael, l.z., really a delight, thank you so much. >> thank you. >> ending on the right tone, to be absolutely clear, america's strength has always been found in its diversity and that's why we're going to keep telling this story and figure out the way forward. there's a lot of news on that front, we'll get it to you. >> have a great weekend, everyone. "newsro "newsroom" with carol costello starts right after the break.

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