prevent dangerous climate change. denmark, the best performing nation overall, was awarded fourth place. thanks to all of you for being part of my program this week. i will see you next week. good morning. i'm brian stelter. it's time for "reliable sources." this morning, too little, too late. calling her sources back, one of the sources is refusing to talk to the writer again. she will tell me why. plus, torture in hollywood. the movie "zero dark 30" is a story now refuted by a new senate report. what should we believe? and home for the holidays. an emotional plea to the iranian government by the brother of jailed washington post reporter jason razion. please, let him come home and be with us. it's the holidays and we all

just want to be together. new developments in a year's long standoff between the government and a "new york times" reporter. attorney general eric holder has decided that james risen will not be forced to name his confidential source. he talked about a botched plan for the iran nuclear program. risen was facing the prospect of jail time because he was refusing to give up the source. now sources tell cnn evan perez that it's off the table, jail time is not a possibility and risen will not have to reveal that source. very good news for risen and his family. also, new information about the disturbing and now refuted the rolling stones story.

a brutal attack discovered by a woman named jackie at a uva party but the story did not add up and it's gotten even worse since then. three students who talked with jackie after the assault are contradicting parts of the story. one of them, randall, claims that she was never contacted by her even though she declined to comment. we don't know what happened that night and should take rape victims' assertions very seriously. but we know the question for us is did she ignore facts in order to fit the narrative she wanted to write? i want you to hear what my next guest has to say about that. she's a friend of jackie, a fellow uva student, who also spoke to the journalist. her name is alex and she joins

me now from charlottesville. >> thank you for having me. >> more importantly, how is your friend doing? >> she's -- it's a chaotic time for her so she's hanging in there. >> and when is the last time you spoke to her? i saw on wednesday her and her family retained a lawyer. is she still in touch with you? >> she was in touch with me earlier this week. i'm sure she has a lot going on. so -- >> i think i should ask, before you get into the dealings with the reporter, do you believe her story? >> from the three friends that saw her and moving forward, everyone that she told has always been that she was raped. so i'm definitely not questioning that. >> when this case got a bunch of attention, you were quoted as

saying you believed her account was 100% true. do you still think it's 100% true? >> i think some of the details we're finding out may have some discrepancies due to trauma. that's something that comes along with being a survivor. you don't know what happened that night and one thing that she might have done is try to fill in the blanks herself and might have filled it in with something that isn't entirely quote/unquote true but something that she believes may have happened to her that night and it got lost with the traumatic events. >> so do you put more accountability on the reporter who decided to report her story and not the early fact check? >> i'm not blaming jackie for this situation. sabrina had the responsibility to look into this case more and she would have noticed the inconsistencies. >> what did you experience with

the reporter? she was on the campus for a long time. she interviewed you and a lot of other students. what were your impressions of her? >> i think she had her heart in the right place. she wanted to bring light to this issue at uva and at campuses across the nation but she had an agenda and part of that was blaming the administration for a lot of the sexual assaults. >> what were some of the questions that she asked you that made you feel that way? >> when she asked about my own assault, she kept asking if he was keeping tabs of the drink and i kept having to say that over and over and i felt like she wasn't satisfied with my perpetrator as someone who wasn't clearly monstrous. >> let me go into more detail about that. to be clear, you are a rape

survivor. this happened your freshman year at uva? >> it happened my second year. >> so it happened last year? >> yes. >> tell me what you told her about it because i've seen you quoted elsewhere saying that you felt like sabrina erdley chose the most sensational and extreme story to talk about. >> right. i don't like to use the word typical but the type assaults that we see on college campuses do deal with alcohol and they are not as clear cut at all what was in the "rolling stone" article. what we see is people will be at a party, at a fraternity or an apartment and they will be drinking and then one person has drank a lot more than the other, they are in a state of blackout or unconscious and then their perpetrator rapes them and that was similar to my case, where i had drank a lot of alcohol that not, was unconscious and came to with him on top of me. so very -- it's a very clear-cut

rape in the sense that you know it's rape but it's not what she was looking for of where we had a very innocent victim and a very monstrous perpetrator. >> when you say innocent victim, you sound like an innocent victim. >> self-blame is a huge issue for survivors and i guess that comes out sometimes. >> i wanted to ask about a few quotes that were from you in her article. she writes this 9,000-word article. you appear in it a couple of times. she wrote, talking about frat culture, social culture, how girls who are drunk always get in, it's a good idea to act drunker than you really are. also? you have to seem very innocent and vulnerable. that's why they love the first-year girls. did she quote you accurately? >> that is something i said. i think it's definitely true that the fraternities play a significant role in sexual assault. we know that you're more likely to be sexually assaulted in

fraternities. it seems like she was looking for a story that had to be in a fraternity. >> so you felt like you were quoted accurately in the piece. did you see other inaccuracies, though, elsewhere in the story? >> i mean, just from the information that we're getting from "the washington post," it's very clear that there needed to be fact checking and verifying of the story in general. so i definitely see skr discrepancies now. >> it seems like you doesn't trust the reporter anymore. >> i think that she should have fact checked and i'm really upset and angry like a lot of people are that that didn't happen and now we're in a very difficult situation. >> has she been back in touch with you in recent weeks? >> she has contacted me since the article and in recent weeks, yes. >> so tell me about that. when did she reach out to you

and why? >> i am under the impression that she just wants to know what's going on and i think that's a fair question because i think there's a lot of confusion of what happened that night and she, like everyone else, wants to know and i basically can't tell anyone else any more than what i've already said. >> i know that "rolling stone" is reporting the story, reviewing the story, figuring out what went wrong but i haven't heard that sabrina herself, the writer herself, is getting back in touch with her sources. i guess it suggests that she herself is also re-reporting her own story and trying to get to the bottom of it. >> i'm not really sure. i haven't responded yet. >> why haven't you responded? >> i am in the middle of exams and i have two more next week and a paper due tonight so i don't have that much time to talk to her. >> so it's not that you resent

her and don't want to deal with her? >> i feel her intentions were good. i just feel like the job was done poorly and i am upset with that aspect of it but also know that she was trying to come from a point of advocacy. but as a reporter, you can't be like an advocate and support a story and listen to it and think everything is true and then report on it without trying to figure out if it's true. my job as an advocate was never to question jackie's story or question the details because i didn't need to but the role that she's in as a reporter. >> right. >> she needed to do that. >> so as we wrap up, what's your takeaway throughout all of this? >> well, it's never been about this one story. we know that there are many, many stories of sexual assaults on the grounds. we want to say that we want people's main message to be, regardless of what they think of this article, taking away that

this is an issue and if they are willing to engage and help us to try to prevent it by either intervention programs and things like that, then that would be the best outcome that we could have of this entire chaotic situation. >> alex, thank you for joining me. >> thank you. >> and i do think we'll hear something from rolli"rolling st in the day to come. the question that everyone in hollywood is asking, can sony pictures recover from the cyberattack? i have two guests with answers. stay tuned.

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getting a preview of a cyberattack. considering the details that poured forth regarding the torture of prisoners after 9/11. also consider the awful stories being told by bill cosby's accusers. the extraordinary cyberattack directed at sony pictures, airing so much dirty laundry, we'll wonder how the company will ever recover. it's been a mountain of private information dumped on to the internet by hackers. why? many are pointing to north korea as a urs so of the hack, potentially in retaliation for this sony movie, "the interview" about two goofy reporters who

want to interview kim jong-un. >> you two are going to be in a room alone with kim and the cia would love him if you could take him out. >> huh? >> take him out. >> for coffee? >> no. take him out. >> you want us to kill the leader of north korea? >> yes. >> this hacking happened a couple of weeks ago but the leaks keep coming and one sony executive told me he considers what happened to be a terrorist attack. that serious for his company. there's been a lot of revelations, lots of leaks but also real damage done. look at this exchange that came out a few days between scott rudin and the head of the studio, amy pascal, about president obama. seems like there's clear racial overtones here. pascal says, should i ask him if he liked django? rudin responds 12 years a slave. when i discovered that some of

my private e-mails to sources at sony were among the now public and leaked files. none of my communications were embarrassing but it does not feel good to know that now the world can see who my sources were. there's that and also the fallout in hollywood because that's been immense. look at this picture of angelina jolie greeting or not greeting the sony chief i was just talking about. this was after the revelation of an e-mail between pascal and rudin in which amy pascal called jolie an immature brat. with me now to discuss all of that, andrew wallenstein and cnn's own don lemon. don, usually you're interviewing me. i'm interested in hearing your reaction to those e-mails i was reading talking about president

obama all referring to films with african-american themes. >> i didn't find it funny, obviously. i hate to call people's actions racist. they were certainly racially insensitive and i think it really makes the point of what chris rock has said about hollywood when he wrote the essay saying hollywood is a white industry and has a racial problem. it certainly does. and this highlights it. >> we see documentary evidence of it in a way we rarely see? >> right. think about those antiquated conversations that they were having. you would think that was back in the 1930s or '40 or '50s when people would talk in that manner. >> what is the fallout in hollywood? >> it's just amazing. and you have to wonder about the executives at the center of this, how this is going to impact their future. what we talk about with regard to obama is one thing but when you're talking about people like angelina jolie, adam sandler, kevin hart, this is going time

pact the studio going forward. you better believe there's going to be some impact. >> that's interesting to hear you say that. part of me thinks that -- and don, tell me what you think about this. part of me thinks, this is hollywood, this is how things are. everyone in hollywood knows it and maybe they know it's a nasty business. >> you are selling a personality. you're going to talk about people as if they are products. >> andrew, do you think there will be a price to pay for sony pictures in particular? will some talent choose not to do business with them in the future? >> oh, it's quite possible. let's not forget certain stars probably have very fragile egos, probably had no whied that some of the comments out of these e-mails were what the executives were thinking. so, you know, i'm not saying that sony is going out of business now or something like that, but you better believe every star and their representatives are going to think twice. >> yeah. >> andrew, you wrestled with

this for days, this issue of whether to publish this content. it's been on my mind as well. you actually wrote about it for a variety. why do you think it's defensible to be quoting from these very private e-mails? >> well, a very tough decision for us and one we made with a very heavy heart. on the one hand, i don't like being treated as a pawn by the hackers, which i believe is what has gone on here. and it's also -- let's not forget people are drawing comparison like edward snowden. this is not information that had to come out for the public good. but ultimately, the decision lies in the fact that regardless of whether variety would have abstained or not, dozens of publications were talking about this, blogs, amplified by social media. we had some of the most powerful people in hollywood calling us this week talking about it constantly, some pressuring us

not to do this. but, you know, my prime director, as editor-in-chief of variety, is to stay relevant, to be talking about everything that everybody in the business is talking about and ultimately that tipped my hand. >> when you say folks were pressuring you, were folks from sony calling you? >> no, no, folks from sony were not doing anything pressuring like that. >> but it does do a service, i have to say, because it exposes black diversity in hollywood and then hollywood, again, does have a race problem and i think when you put it there, there for people to see, they have to deal with it. so i think it does a disservice by publishing them. >> one of the things by putting it out there, one of the first publications was from fusion, the website owned by disney. their justification is they were showing the executive salaries and how almost all of the top executives are white men as are many of the cases in other production companies.

from the beginning, the sony picture hackers saw journalists as part of their tool kit which gets to what you were saying, andrew, you don't want to be a pawn for these anonymous hackers at the same time there is content out in the public domain. >> yeah. i mean, essentially we've done their bidding. we've maximized the exposure to this content. i don't do that lightly. on the other hand, we have to be part of the sfrgs. >> andrew and don, thank you for being here. >> thanks, brian. we're just getting started this morning. when we come back, another secret revealed to the world this week. that's how the cia uses the media, how they leak information that makes the agency look good and why some reporters now look bad because of it. as we go to break, this year's nominee for the golden globes were announced this week and this is the best tv comedy category. notice transparent on this lit, amazon.com's first global nomination ever.

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the senate's torture report might be the purest example of red news, blue news that we've ever had on this show. on the left, the revelations about cia's interrogation of prisoners was a confirmation of people's worst fears, that our nation lost its mind and its morality in the immediate aftermath of 9/11. on the left, the report was a much needed document. on the right, it was partisan. it was treated like a democratic attempt to shame the bush administration. or even distract from more timely issues. >> the united states of america is awesome. we are awesome. but we've had this discussion.

we've closed the book on it and they have stopped doing it. the reason to have this discussion is not to show how awesome we are. this administration wants to have this discussion to show us how we are not awesome. >> the united states is awesome and at the same time not entirely awesome. obviously both things are true. let's go over to the blue news. rachel maddow did not think the treatment of prisoners was awesome. >> we knew before today that the cia had tortured people after 9/11. what we did not know before today was exactly how they did some of it and exactly how much of it they did and how they tried to conceal it while they were doing it and after. but the other thing we did not know is just what a mess they were as they tried to invent this program out of whole cloth. >> so she's saying lots of news came from the report. now, this is the thing about red

news/blue news. you probably never heard what maddow said on fox. except if they played a clip and made fun of her. let's not talk about the red news/blue news noise of this. the senate report this week makes it pretty clear that the cia funneled that was false. the cia disputes that conclusion. our guests on both sides of the journalist source relationship, bill harlow, a cia spokesman and coordinated some of the push back against the senate report this week and michael isikoff, the investigative correspondent at nbc news now at yahoo!. thank you both for being here. >> good to be here. >> is there a sanctioned leak from the cia where the agency puts out positive information? one of the takeaways from the

senate report this week is that there were times when the cia would leak information that made the interrogation program look favorable. >> well, i think the word leak is pajoritive right there. he wouldn't look at it as a leak. a leak to a reporter is something that some other reporter got. so the job with the agency spokesman is to provide information as best they can on an unclassified basis to reporters and that's what they did. >> michael, i see you smiling. have you been on the receiving end of this? >> well, i have certainly been on the receiving end of information from bill and others at the cia. i think, look, one of the disturbing things about the report is clearly there's a political red/blue foot fight over what the conclusions of the report were. but the real merit or advantage

of the report is internal cia cables, internal cia e-mails that shed a lot of light on this program that we've been talking about for years with limited information and it gives us a much fuller picture and it tells us a lot of things that, frankly, bill and others at the cia public affairs shop were not saying about the program. >> bill, does the cia in the future need to be a little less secretive with journalists and do a better job perhaps communicating its point of view to journalists? >> certainly. and i recognize when i was there i had one of the strangest jobs in america. >> i bet. >> the chief spokesman for an organization. >> right. >> that's an oxymoron quite in itself and it was a struggle to provide information to the media and it has a difficult ahead of them but, that said, there still is a requirement to protect

necessary secrets and while we may be debating this now, if people were to put out information which caused damage to national security, we'd be having an entirely different discussion. >> on the flip side of this, michael, are you less likely to trust what you're told by the cia and other government agencies? >> well, i try to always be skeptical, brian, not just of the cia but government agencies. it's a reminder that what we are told at one point in time about especially covert operations, often when we learn more, when it's put under a microscope, the picture looks very different and that applies particularly to the covert operations the cia has engaged in today, the drone program where we know president obama himself had said last year that we are haunted -- some of us are haunted for the rest of our lives by some of the civilian deaths who have been caused by this drone program.

how many civilians have been killed or injured? how many -- who has been held accountable when that happens? we've never gotten answers from the agency about that and i think a report like this is a reminder that we have to keep pressing. >> i have to wonder when we're sitting here in 2022 whether we'll be discussing results of a drone report. up next, a busy week for the president. why is he doing so many interviews and does he have a different message for each reporter? i'll sit down with two of the anchors who sat down with him this week when we come back. tha. it comes in oral rinse, spray or gel, so there's moisturizing relief for everyone. biotene, for people who suffer from a dry mouth. i was out for a bike ride. i didn't think i'd have a heart attack. but i did. i'm mike, and i'm very much alive. now my doctor recommends a

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welcome back. it seems like the president was everywhere on tv this week. he was on univision talking about immigration and b.e.t. talking about ferguson and race and talking sports and politics and on comedy central, on the

colbert report. he was trying to keep up with stephen colbert. >> are you still president after the midterms because the republicans are quite surprised that you're doing anything at all. that shellacking didn't rattle the presidential seal off your podium? >> look, the election didn't go as well as i would have liked. you notice, i made a little correction there. >> obama is on ryan seacrest's radio show. you got a very funny obama on colbert, defensive obama on univision and somber obama on b.e.t. i'm going to bring in jorge ramos and john johnson who interviewed him on b.e.t. thank you for being here. jorge, you were confrontational

with t in the interview. >> why did you deport 2 million people? >> jorge -- >> you were deporting families. >> you called me deporter in chief. but let me say this, jorge. >> you could have stopped the deportation. >> that is not true. >> jorge, tell me about your strategy there. >> well, whenever you're talking to the president, it's a unique opportunity and you have to use that opportunity to get new information but at the same time you have to challenge the president on couldn't verntrove issues. i think an interview should not be the same with your guest. even though i agree with what he has done on immigration, i have to challenge him that he deported 2 million people and

destroyed thousands of families. it's not an agenda. i have to ask him about that and probably he didn't like it. >> how does a president change when talking about race? what's your impression? >> it's a difficult challenge when you're talking about the country being so torn in different circles. his approval ratings drop somewhere else, very similar to the immigration issue. the moment he talks about immigration and ending deportation, you see another sector of the country begin to have approval ratings or in opposition. we're in a very interesting time and it makes it challenging to talk about race from a president that's got to serve so many different demographics. >> i've been thinking about what the message is behind all of these interviews and now ryan seacrest next week. maybe the message is that the white house is juggling many balls at the same time, walking and chewing gum at the same time, that it's able to handle

many topics at the same time. >> let me say something, brian. what he's saying is that he's an active president. he's not a lame duck president. i think this is very important. this is a person completely involved in race issues, completely involved on immigration. >> i think to jorge's point, what we're dealing with is a president who wants to show what the white house has the ability to do without congress where some of his initiatives are going to be, whether it's through executive order or utilization of mechanisms like the doj. he wants to be very aggressive in saying, here's where we're going to use our authority to be able to address these very pressing issues. that's very different. i think the difference between the african-american community and the latino community is that there have been much fewer interviews on television with african-american press. so i think this interview was incredibly important because there have been fewer interviews with african-american press. so we were glad to get the interview but i hope that in

between now and the end of his term there's going to be a lot more conversation with the black press, not just on radio but on television. >> brian, it's a much more assertive president, a president establishing his power and he realizes perfectly he's not going to be able to work with congress and i'm remembering what he mentioned in his book, he warned about how power can change you in the white house, the isolation that the white house creates and i think president obama is going precisely through that process right now. >> i recently at an awards dinner here in new york, you said that you assume you will probably never speak to that person again and yet you've interviewed the president five times. >> if you're all the time protecting your access to your sources, it's going to be a very

different conversation. it's going to be, how are you doing and i hope you're having a great day. that's not what we should do as journalists. so whenever i'm talking with someone important, i'm assuming two things. first, that i just have to ask the questions that nobody else will. and the second one is that it might be, in this case it hasn't happened thanks to the president, but it might be the last time you talk to that person and then if you take that attitude, it's going to be a completely different interview. >> jeff, jorge, thank you both for being here. >> thank you so much. next on the program, a story that you've got to hear. a washington post correspondent who is living every journalist's worst nightmare. he's been imprisoned in a foreign country for five months now. and coming up next, his brother makes an emotional plea to the iranian government for his release. don't go away. for lotus f1 team, the competitive edge is the cloud. powered by microsoft dynamics, azure, and office 365,

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144 days is how long journalist jason raiseon has been held, and we don't know what might lead to the release and still don't according to the washington post. we just know that he should haven't been imprisoned in the first place and so we have been keeping in touch with martin

baron and now the family is speaking out to plead for his release. >> thank you, ali, for being with us for this difficult occasion. >> thank you, brian. >> and what do we know about where he is being held and what he is experiencing in detention? >> well, we e know that he is held in teheran, and we know that he has health conditions as well with his back and we know that he is depressed and taking a toll on him. >> the only person who is visiting him is his wife who was held and then released, and what has she told you about the conditions in the prison? >> well, we have not talked about the conditions inside there, and she doesn't have access to the room obviously, so i can't tell you that. she does know that he is, you know, it is cold. e she has been able to give him some warm clothes, and that, you

know, that the toll of being in solitary is adding up. >> any particular story that they were upset by or offended by or bothered by or anything like that? >> well, we with went back to look at them, and we looked at the so rirs, and we are wondering about that and one of the last stories that he wrote is about the iranian national baseball team, and he really loved to be able to give people outside of iran a better view of what society is like there, and what real life is like there. and jason didn't really -- sorry about that. >> that is okay. go ahead. >> so, i don't think that jason would have done anything that would have provoked him. >> i have a brother named jason, also, and i am sitting here thinking about and wondering

what i would have thought about if my brother would have been in an iranian prison at times. are there times that you are mad at him or lash out like that. >> i wouldn't say lash out, but that's a great question, because you go through the entire spectrum of emotions. i mean, if nishgs i would say that the biggest thing is guilt. i'm living parts of my life normally when i'm with my son, and when i'm sitting down at thanksgiving dinner, and when i'm sitting down to any meal, i think about jason and he does not have access to the basic things that we take for granted everyday. you know, there are times when i say, you know, i didn't sign up for this, and it was not my job, but i need to take care of my brother and i need to do whatever i can to bring him home. >> and what is the message today for the iranians? >> well, brian, i think that really what i want to say is

that looks at this objectively knows that if there was any basis for these charges they would have brought them a long time ago and i would say, please, just go back to look at with what is there and realize that jason shouldn't be there. he has been in jail for almost five months, and please, just let him come home to be with us, and it is the holidays, and we all just want to be be together. >> ali, thank you for being h e here. >> thank you, brian. >> and we will keep you up to date on jason's case, and what is going on with him. and now, coming up here, we are go back to the topic that is coming up from earlier in the ho hour, and the torture report and what is happening pr from earlier in the hour, and i want to go to look at the movie "zero dark 30" and show you what the repo report shows coming up. o clean a

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welcome back. the news this week was dominated by the news of the torture report and it ogot us to thinking about the media shaping reports of human terror and i was thinking about fox ads being a big ad for torture, and so looking at the knew wannuances,t about the big screen? i went back to look at the scene dramatized about the killing of osama bin laden the and it was the number one film in the box office and went on the make more than $130 mill yop aion and ear five oscar nominations, and "zero dark thirty" is not without controversy and now it is with more controversy.

the torture scenes were crucial to the plot, because they said that the information was crucial to the information that went to capturing osama bin laden. >> look. when you lie to me, i hurt you. >> and these movies can be influential and misleading. this week the senate committee's report rerejected what the cia said after the raid and you remember, they said that the interrogations provided key intel. take a look. >> the facts of the matter are that people against whom we used these interrogation techniques provided us at least one of the strings of information that led to last week withend's events. >> but the senate report disputes, that and it says that the vast majority of the cia's claims about this were inaccurate, and not surprisingly the cia director disagrees. >> the detainees who were subject odd the enhanced

terrorist techniques provided information useful and was used in the ultimate operation to go against bin laden. >> at the same time that brennan was speaking, the chair of the intel committee dianne feinstein fired back and her office said in the tweet, the study definitively showed that eits did not lead to bin laden. and she said that the cia had been cooperating with the filmmakers leading the director of the film to say that no single scene was responsible for leading to the manhunt and capture of bin laden, and two years later, all of that is still being debated. our media coverage continues

24/7 on cnn.com, and we will have more on the sony hack and the story on "rolling stone" and stay tuned with us as "state of the union" with candy crowley starts right now. a miracle on pennsylvania avenue. congress passes a compromise budget, keeping most of the government operating through september of 2015. today -- >> the yeas are 56, the nays are 40. >> senator chuck schumer on capitol hill's strange bedfellow moment and what it says about washington and the campaign trail. then -- >> hands up. >> don't shoot. >> reporter: massachusetts governor deval patrick joins us for a conversation on america's great divides, race and politics. then the nation's premiere spy agency condemned for brutal interrogation of terrorist suspects in the immediate post-9/11 era. >> there were no easy answers.