. you're in the cnn newsroom. i'm martin savidge in new york. thank you for joining me. it's great to be with you. the fbi is getting an offer to help investigate a suspected cyber attack from north korea. that offer is coming from, wait for it, north korea. here's the gist of the statement. we didn't know who indict. we didn't do it. we're being framed. fit turns down that offer of a

mutual investigation, and continues to blame north korea for the computer attack on sony pictures. that attack resulted in the release of a private company's information and emails that toledo the cancellation of the release of a movie about an sasse destination plot on north korean leader kim jong-un. despite north korea's formal denial the fbi is fairly convinced that the sony attack started. so who in north korea is savvy enough, well trained enough to set something so destructively loose or so destructive loose on the world. people who studied kim jong-un are pretty sure they know. we go to soul for more. >> reporter: north korean soldiers, a technicolor force against the west. on state-run television a ridiculous bravado of the military. but there are unseen soldiers in kim jong-un's cyber war against

the west. they have no face and only known by a number bureau 121. >> what is bureau 121? >> they conduct overseas and enemy states. jong is a former north korea defector. he now in south korea independently attempting to crumble an agency nearly impossible to chase. bureau 121, a shadow agency with an unknown number of the regime's hand picked shadow agents placed in countries around the world. he believes there's approximately 1800 of them. though he says the agents themselves don't know how many exist. we can't verify his claims about the shadow group but he says he's obtained from a current operative hundreds of financial files hacked from south korean banks complete with names and other bank account details. >> is this cyber war the real war for north korea?

>> raising cyber agents is cheap. the world has the wrong view of the north korean state. that incorrect world view north korea was able to increase its ability to launch cyber attacks. south korea learned the hard way. banks across the country last year were paralyzed. atms frozen for days. media outlets went dark. servers jammed or wiped. north korea denied it was the source of a hack. but in the wake of the attack, south korea beefed up its own cyber forces declaring the online war as dangerous as pyongyang's nuclear ambitions. north korea exists in the land of over the top propaganda while experts say it wages its parallel war in cyber space led by a young man of the internet age ushering in a if you phase of the korean conflict. >> we'll dive into this story later in the hour talking about who else may be vulnerable and

you'll find out how far cheap it is to buy a hack like the one that hit sony. the price is remarkable. elsewhere overseas today the number of terror suspects held at guantanamo bay, cuba gets smaller. the pentagon confirmed four men were cents back to their home country of afghanistan. it is part of the obama administration's plan to draw down the detention center. six others were released earlier this month you'll remember. about 800 terror suspects in all have been held at guantanamo connected to the u.s.-led war on terror. 132 people are still detained there. president obama didn't mention that guantanamo release yesterday and he wasn't asked about it at his white house news conference. now first family is on vacation in hawaii. so let's go live to cnn's michelle kosinski who is in honolulu. nice to see you. congress rejected a full closure of guantanamo when it deleted it from the defense bill.

ten detainees have been released so how does it fit into the president's plan to close the place. >> reporter: last week the president said keeping gitmo open under mines our national security and that it must be closed. this goes hand in what happened that. the reason it wasn't announced at the press conference it was announced by the pentagon. that's where the news comes from. sometimes the white house doesn't want to announce something that officially needs to come from some other department or agency. so we think that's probably why. it was also interesting it wasn't asked about. we've been seeing these periodic releases. in 2009 the president signed an executive order to close it down wind a year but it's proven extremely difficult to do so partly because congress keeps these things in the spending bill to make transfers more difficult. there are instance like this one where transfers are possible. these are considered for very low level detainees not charged not convicted of anything. so they were released to the afghan government. in fact the afghan government

asked for this release specifically. but this isn't the only one we expect to see. in fact we've been hearing from thing pentagon eastern officials that there will be more in coming weeks and more in unspecified number in the next months as well, martin. >> all right. the president was also talking about that hacking incident with sony. let's listen to what he had to say here first. >> they caused a lot of damage. and we will respond. we will respond proportionately and respond in a place and time and manner that we choose. it's not something that it will announce here today at a press conference. >> michele, you know north korea has offered to join this mutual investigation. so what's the response to north korea's offer to help? >> reporter: yeah. i mean this all seems like another movie unto itself. it's pretty interest fpg national security council this morning put out a statement about that saying listen to

this, the government of north korea has a long history of denying responsibility for destructive and provocative actions. if the north korean government wants to help they can admit their culpability and compensate sony for the damages this attack caused. we'll see if that happens, martin. >> yeah. by the way, a movie probably that wouldn't be shown. michelle kosinski in honolulu, thanks very much. the president of cuba spoke to the people of his country today and had one main statement basically to the president, gratitude. >> translator: thank you people, we like to say thanks to this fair decision to the united states president barack obama. this obstacle has been eliminated to the betterment of the relations between cuba and the u.s. the whole world has reacted in a positive manner upon the announcements made last

wednesday. >> both presidents announced historic changes in the cuban-american relationship paving the way for future open travel between these two countries. more trade. more banking. diplomatic relations. and then, of course important,ly the lifting of that long economic embargo. patrick oppmann is in havana now. raul castro also had said his political system has to be respected. tell us how american capitalism and cuban communism are going to work together? >> reporter: well, you know, that's a very good question. at least in the short term they really won't because as you mentioned the embargo stays in place and that will prohibit a lot of american companies that would like to do business from doing business in cuba but raul castro said this was an important step forward. just one step, martin, that the u.s. shouldn't meddle in cuban affairs, shouldn't expect cuba

to alter its internal or foreign policy decisions to currie favor with the u.s.. basically the cubans and u.s. officials will be talking more. he certainly expects that u.s. embassy will be opened here. that the cuban intersection in d.c. will become a cuban embassy and high level contacts. but there's many important differences. we'll see if those differences can be worked out. raul castro certainly believes that the revolution will stay intact. single party form of communism will stay here intact but there will be more opportunities for him and president barack obama to discuss these things because raul castro today confirmed he'll be traveling to a regional summit in panama in april and president barack obama will be there as well. we'll see if they make more history there, martin. >> be very interesting. spent a lot of time in cuba and the people are wonderful despite their government. how are the people reacting to all of this news?

>> reporter: this was totally unexpected. just about every cuban i've talked to was born after the revolution which is the majority of the island. said they never experienced a day like the day on wednesday. seemingly out of the blue cuba so long forgotten certainly the united states seemed to be the center of the world and you have both presidents talking live about cuba talking about a better future for cuba. a lot of differences certainly castro and barack obama's minds about what that better future is. at least these two countries are talking, and almost all cubans i know are celebrating this break in the long standing diplomatic icy relations here, martin. >> remarkable change. open, than-- patrick oppmann th very much. would you know what to do if you were taken hostage. what if you see a way to escape. what if you're staring down the

barrel of a gun. what's your best move to survive? i'll tell you the five things you can do to make it through. plus, sony still reeling from its cyber attack but it's not the only one vulnerable to cyber terrorism. and it's not the only target. more on that as well coming up.

aaa says more than 98 million people will travel more than 50 miles from home for christmas this year and that's a record.

but a massive brewing storm could make a travel mess for two-thirds of the nation especially along the i-95 corridor. that will be beginning on tuesday. heavy rain and thunderstorms are expected in the southeast, midwest and along the east coast. christmas eve travellers will see even more storms. your best chance for a white christmas central rockies, wisconsin and northern michigan. if you're traveling abroad this holiday season you may want to be a little extra cautious. the state department has issue ad worldwide travel alert for u.s. citizens traveling to other countries in the wake of the recent hostage siege in sydney, australia. an analysis of past attacks and threat reporting strongly suggest as focus by terrorists not only on the targeting of u.s. government facilities but also on hotels, shopping areas, places of worship and schools. it extends until march. your chances of being taken hostage in a terrorist situation are very small.

but there are some specific things you can do to help improve your chance of a positive outcome. i spent some time in a training facility for police and civilians as well as the military and got five crucial tips to keep in mind if you are ever taken hostage. first of all you should know your chances much really being caught up directly in a terrorism act are extremely low. that said it can happen at the most unexpected times in the most unexpected places. number one, the moment you realize that a terror hostage situation is developing, if there is a door or an exit nearby use it. and get away fast. but let's say you don't get away and now you are a hostage. the experts say be compliant. no matter how uncomfortable it may seem to be. after all, bad guys have the guns. you don't.

you should do what they say. three, don't stand out. don't be argumentative. don't be combative. at the same time don't be cowering or crying in the corner because that too can make you stand out and make you appear to be weak. four, when a rescue does come it is likely to be violent. get down if you're not already on the floor. and once you're down cover your eyes and ears for protection. if possible get behind some kind of cover. but remain on the ground. don't jump up and attempt to run because even the rescuers have been trained to track a moving object. it could be disastrous. wait until you here the all clear. and finally number five than one could surprise you most. after all you've been through as a hostage, expect to be detained. history has shown sometimes terrorists try to escape with the innocents. you'll be taken to a place of safety, marshalled through and

then eventually investigated to figure out who is good and who is bad. you'll have that opportunity to eventually deliver that hand shake or hug of gratitude. it just might have to wait a bit. we've seen how vulnerable a big company like sony is to hackers. what about you or me. could someone get their hands on our private emails or pictures. of course. we're talking about that next hour but first a primer on the deep web. >> when you surf online you're skimming the surface. beneath the websites we all know and love there's actually a vast mostly unexplored zone called deep web. it's mostly boring stuff. government data and research papers buried in databases beyond the reach of search engines. just like the ocean the deeper you go in the deep web the darker it gets. at the darkest depths of the deep web is something called

tore. it's a secretive network developed by the u.s. navy. i want hides your location and lets you visit websites anonymously. it protects incriminate indianapolis and dicy dents. it's an illicit marketplace where you can find things for drugs to firearms. silk road the amazon of drugs operate in the deep web until it was shut down but a game of whack-a-mole. in a world where every day seems to bring new massive hack -- >> is my information for sale on the dark web right now? >> this is where the loot is bought and sold. chances are there's a little piece of your personal data somewhere in the deep web.

♪ ah, ♪ h it. ♪ push it. ♪ p...push it real good! ♪ ♪ ow! ♪ oooh baby baby...baby baby. if you're salt-n-pepa, you tell people to push it. ♪ push it real good. it's what you do. ♪ ah. push it. if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico. it's what you do. ♪ ah. push it. i'm pushing. i'm pushing it real good!

sony pictures went from a punch line to a rallying cry in just days. first there were the emails you know the ones we're talking about stolen by a shadowing group called guardians of peace mocking everybody from angelina jolie to president obama. some in hollywood have called it

something else such as cowardly and disgraceful. they've also asked what's next. president obama talked about that yesterday and he called out sony for what happened to "the interview". >> sony is a corporation. it suffered significant damage. there were threats against its employees. i am sympathetic to the concerns that they faced. having said all that, yes, i think they made a mistake. >> so will hollywood be scared to make isis say the villain in a movie. can anyone threaten a terror attack to stop the release of a film. will the studios be scared to make a movie that will offend someone. we'll take a look at all those questions for the rest of the hour. let's talk about this with our panel. michael daily, lauri segal and

bob baer. michael, is the president right? did sony make a mistake here? >> i think so. you know, the mistake was making the movie with an ending like that but given that mistake, you got the movie, i don't know how you let some bunch of hackers threaten you and commit you not to release a movie. i mean i just don't get it. >> although i imagine that beyond just trying to stand up for a nation, for the right of freedom of speech there was a business decision made here and lauri let me ask you, what's the reaction from sony through all of this. >> i think when you talk to sources inside sony and also in hollywood, there's this sense of vulnerability. i got off the phone with someone who said we're waiting. we don't know what's out there. we don't know if something else will be leaked. we're using our personal emails because we're scared to use our corporate emails. i spoke to an insider in hollywood will this affect

censorship, will we be self-censoring ourselves in the future and her answer was 1,000%. nobody in hollywood is using emails and getting on the phone and talking to each other. this is unprecedented and the whole community is scared of the ramifications of this. >> bob, do you think sony here or the terrorists were finding or showing a new way to attack america? many in the industry knew of this threat but in the public we were not aware it could be so devastating. >> well, i think in the industry nobody quite believed that they could simply, you know, empty son chip's computers like this, including films, personal emails, the chairman and do major, major damage to a studio. i think we all sort of knew that could happen but never had. stealing a credit card number from a company is one thing. but the damage to sony is unprecedented.

i don't remember anything like this. it certainly is a wake up call for the rest of the industry and the rest of the united states that all these computers are vulnerable if they are on the internet you can get in them. especially when a state is behind it. probably north korea. >> we talk about how this was a cyber attack but, michael, the ramifications are very real. should the response on the part of the u.s. be real? in other words should there be some sort of military strike? >> they are going hack you so you bomb them >> this is the debate. each one is considered an attack on a nation. >> hollywood will win. i mean there's a reason why the north koreans are so worried about movies and all this because all people have to do is get a glimpse of the world outside korea through a movie and it changes everything. there's a north korean defector who speaks about the transformative moment for her when she saw a bootleg copy of "titanic". people now in north korea who risk their lives to look at one

of the big things is "desperate housewives." they are risking third lives to see what's going on wisteria lane. ultimately hollywood will win. >> lauri they talked about a christmas surprise, further developments presumably to cokc christmas day or there abouts. >> the same group posted online this morning said they are making fun of the fbi and they were also talking about a christmas gift. we just don't know. they might have pulled back because they decided not release the movie on christmas day. what sony said to me it's a waiting game. we have no idea. i can tell you, martin from the information that's come out, the trove of data that came out, the ceo of sony had his inbox of e-mail out for anybody to see. people are very concerned. >> sony has been hacked before

and we'll talk about that in a little bit. if a cyber terrorist really wanted to do some damage, hollywood probably would not necessarily be the top target. what do you think would be? how about say the white house? wall street? ahead we'll tell you how they are trying to hit those very targets. the mercedes-benz winter event is back, with the perfect vehicle that's just right for you, no matter which list you're on. [ho, ho, ho, ho] lease the 2015 ml 350 for $579 a month at your local mercedes-benz dealer. dad,thank you mom for said this oftprotecting my future.you. thank you for being my hero and my dad. military families are uniquely thankful for many things, the legacy of usaa auto insurance could be one of them.

if you're a current or former military member or their family, get an auto insurance quote and see why 92% of our members plan to stay for life.

i take prilosec otc each morning for my frequent heartburn. because it gives me... zero heartburn! prilosec otc. the number 1 doctor-recommended frequent heartburn medicine for 9 straight years. one pill each morning. 24 hours. zero heartburn. we saw how much chaos hackers caused by attacking sony. imagine what it would be like if they found a way to get in government servers or a bank and you better believe that's just what they are trying to do. here's cnn's chris. >> reporter: every day the government is under attack. cyber attack. there were 61,000 hacks and security breaches throughout the u.s. government last year. >> there's an adversary out there whose job it is to break into our systems. so, you know, somebody is trying 24/7, goits going to get much worse than it is today.

>> reporter: the white house and state department networks were targeted. cyber incidents involving u.s. government agencies are skyrocketing. that number hit more than 46,000 last year. >> cyber espionage is increasing at unprehe is denltsd rates. >> reporter: in 2013 hackers hit the army corps of engineers grabbing sensitive information. they allegedly stole data on nation's 85,000 dams including their location, and the potential for fatalities. >> people are stealing hard copies of paper work and passing it off to our adversaries. today they can do it digitally and take more data than in the past. >> reporter: in july of 2013 hackers infiltrated the energy department. they lifted information including birthdays, social security and bank account numbers. >> government and industry are in a difficult battle against cyber adversaries. they are always very

sophisticated actors out there and for them we have to assume an attack could occur. organizations need to be prepared. >> reporter: the government spent $10 billion on cyber security last year but that can't defend against an employee who is duped on clicking on malicious link. as one perfect told me there's no good defense against stew pipd user. that's a disconcerting phrase. hackers aren't about to give up. we can't let our guard down for a second. lauri, i got to ask is the government up to protecting its websites, up to protecting its infrastructure? >> i think the government is understanding the power of this cyber warfare and the fact that hackers are constantly trying to get into our infrastructure that they have the ability to do real damage. that number chris mentioned in his report, 61,000 cyber attacks on the entire federal government over the last year, you better bet they are putting a lot of

money into this. but that doesn't mean that they are unhackable. as we know they have been hacked quite a bit over the last year. they have to look into this. >> it's almost as if there's no way to stop it. michael let me ask you this. have we been slow either as a government or maybe as corporations to realize how much of a threat this is? >> you know, sony, i don't seem to have been on top of their game. they didn't tell their executives that hey by the way, guys, it's the real world and anything you write, any e-mail you send, any numbers you put out there, assume that they can be hacked. if nothing else i think all companies ought to tell people that send button is like sending to it yankee stadium and that delete button means nothing. you got to start with that. in this got start saying okay, you have to look at all the attacks and what they have in common. are there ways we can combat them. there's a lot of smart hackers but a lot of really matter good

guys out there too. >> the attitude would be just be mindful that it's likely to get out there sob careful how you say it or what you imply in your message. >> right. you don't want to make a threat to the president of the united states if you don't want the whole world to read you want. if nothing else every company in america ought to tell their employees that. >> bob let me bring you back into the conversation. we do this. when i say we i don't mean me, we the government has used the sequester net to attack other nations haven't we >> absolutely. we use the internet. we know the vulnerabilities. let me put it this way. the cia, it has an important intelligence report it put somebody at a typewriter. does anybody remember what a typewriter is. they write the report. type it out. one copy. hand deliver to it the president of the united states. no intermediaryintermediaries.

the cia operates that it's on the defensive all the time. it's not complacent and lazy like the rest of america. it has to keep secrets. another way is no thumb drive in computers. put things on paper. standalone. no computer in the director of operations is connected to the internet or any outside system. even then it's not considered secure and like i said we go back to typewriters. i realize sony is not the cia but you just have to assume if you write an earn mail it's a public document. >> i've seen attacks that were allegedly launched against iran and its nuclear program by the united states against its program there. >> exactly. that's a closed country, by the way, too. so pretty fantastic that we got in their nuclear system and completely, you know, messed it up. but, you know, i used to be involved in getting into bank documents in europe and we just

completely emptied their databases. it was very easy to do. and this is the kind of mentality we have to have if we want to protect our data. and, you know, this will have to happen a bunch of times before corporate america and government catches on about the threat out there. >> we mention ad couple of times for sony. why didn't they learn their lesson 2011 was another example. >> in 2011 there were 77 million user accounts that were stolen. you would have thought that. i spoke to a security analyst they should have learned. they are idiots they should have learned. what's interesting about this attack we talk about how sophisticated the attack was on sony. if you look at it, think of it like a robbery. you go into a home and do a little damage. take a pencil. they didn't going and do one thing they took everything and burned the place town. the sophistication was how much data they were able to take. sony never estimated that much

damage could be done internally. >> when it's a big company and take a sophisticated attack it makes the company look better. bob, what about the retaliation. could it turn to where the united states decides that a military strike is the appropriate way to respond to a cyber attack? >> i agree with mike. we can't bomb north korea. this is an irrational regime. they will set off a nuclear bomb somewhere. los angeles, for all we know. they are not really on the internet. their banks aren't connected with the rest of the world. what we have to do is get a protocol with russia and china to get this stuff because they can do a lot to control this and the chinese are affected by this as well so we have to have some sort of new trade diplomatic -- and tighten up the embargo as much as we're able to. there's not a lot you can do about a rogue state. they do what they want to do and

one that's insane worries me. >> that's the definition of a rogue state. say with me. sony hack could cost the company hundreds of millions of dollars but what if i told the equipment to carry out an attack like that costs about $500. scared yet? well plenty of companies are. that's ahead. when you don't get enough sleep... and your body aches... you're not yourself. tylenolpm relieves pain and helps you fall fast asleep and stay asleep. we give you a better night. you're a better you all day. tylenol®

you can buy anything on the web even a hack and it might seem incredible but hackers are looking for work on the web. ready to put their skills to any evil use and i want doesn't even cost that much. just hundreds of dollars to create millions of dollars of chaos. and lauri you found out how easy for this to happen. >> you want us to kill the leader of north korea. >> yes. >> what? >> the next sony hack is for sale in the dark corners of the web. to bring down a webpage for an

hour depending on the website only $2 to $60 on the russian underground page. to redirect people going for $175. what about day tack on sony. >> out of pocket 500 to $1,000 of coding time. >> all of these conversations available for purchase on an illegal form on the dark web. in the deep corner of the internet often accessed through encrypted browsers. fbi may have traced the sony attack to north korea but in the wild west of the internet you don't have to be a sophisticated criminal to launch a devastating cyber attack you just need an internet connection. >> up don't need to learn how to build a gun or be a coder in order to purchase something. >> many forums based in russia, brazil and china are making billions but not just anyone can enter. >> those people thinking they want to visit these forums and buy these capabilities the

second you enter the forum you have been hacked. >> as these online communities thrive more cyber criminals can get keys to major corporations. what makes the sony hack different it wasn't about money. >> the fact most hack attacks have a financial motivation behind it is different. geopolitics are now serving as a harbinger for attacks. >> and may level the playing field for smaller enemies every where that want something. >> if they want something how do we stop them? can we stop them. let's talk about that with our panel. lauri, is there a way to stop anybody or will there always be an opening and they will find a way in. >> it's an offense/defense game. you're a company you need to constantly try to break your system all the time. that's how you figure out if there are flaws in your system. one of those sites online where these underground forums makes $10 million a week. they have hacker hot lines where

you call-up and you're buying these hacks and you can get customer support because you get it if you pay for it. these are very sophisticated marketplaces. it's scary because you don't have to be that sophisticated of a cyber criminal. you have to click buy, put together some code and then put it out there. that's what's scary about this. >> like hiring a gun but you're hiring them for a virtual hit. michael is the time we wake up. as a nation maybe i go back i shouldn't send the memo, i should type it. >> we get horrible massacres enough so i'm not sure sony getting hacked will change anything. but i tell my kids, you know, there's no privacy online. i think everybody should tell their own kids and i think employees should tell their -- employers should tell employees and executives should tell themselves in the mirror. the other thing is everybody talks about the great damage

done to sony. i guess financially maybe and they were embarrassed but nobody got killed. nobody lost their life. and i think to back down and act scared of these guys it only intoxicates them and encourage them to do more. come back and taunt people and all that. i think you got to say to yourself we'll do our best to stop them. if they get in we'll be a little embarrassed and learn from it. you have to be hard back the home. like living in the wild west. >> bob, we're talking about the president, his daily brief. he gets it delivered on a tablet. you were talking about what the cia does. does it surprise you the president sits down there with his whatever device that is and gets his full brief? >> well, if it's encrypted it's fine but what i'm talking about is the really sensitive information that only the president should see. and you don't put that in digital form ever. and it's the same way with us.

if you have any secrets -- i don't have any secrets myself but if i did i would go see somebody and tell them at the very least fax it. someone having a fax intercept on your phone is likely to be the government and that's it. but e-mail and the rest of it. a couple of years ago i worked for the united nations against hezbollah which murdered the prime minister in lebanon and they used a foolproof system a closed-circuit of cell phones, prepaid all the rest of it simply by getting into the telephone system using data analytics we caught these guys and hezbollah is the best on technical stuff. what it tells me you have to go back to carrier pigeons and forget cell phones. i have access to a software system that marty can take your phone over and completely control it. that means send out fake emails if i want. listen to your calls. logon to illegal sites which

would frame you for a crime. it's a catastrophe. the digital age if you want to keep a secret. >> just shows you the people of a certain age now could be of great value to tell people how to use the telephone and the typewriter. were the people you talked to, lauri, surprised at the extent and just how hard this seemed to hit sony? >> i was surprised how they were not surprised at all. i spoke to a guy who used to do security for sony in 2006 and 2007 and he said they were gearing up for this. that that was his quote they stopped working with them later. he said he just described how much work needed to be done and i'll tell you something, martin, going to these hacker conferences there's a couple a year where you have these guys showing you to bob's points how much of your information they are able to steal, how much how someone can sends you a link and you click on it and your whole compute certain over. we're entering this age because we're so much connected than we

were. there were capability as little while ago. because we have these devirks we have connected homes we're so much more at risk now we have to encourage people to invest moreno security in general. this is at least opening the nation's eyes because this was hollywood and a popular community people. >> it could have been a lot worse. thank you all very much for joining us. after that one hack one a-list celebrity really tried to rally support for sony. :pride to persuade hollywood to come to son chip's defense. no one wanted to join him. so is free speech dead in hollywood? that's ahead. from down here. smile for grandma! or text pictures from up here. ok, there we go, should we send a photo? you can even make calls, way over here. talk and text over wi-fi, with wi-fi calling on iphone 6.

only from t-mobile. now get iphone 6 for $0 down.

north korea's anger over the "interview" is certainly not the first time they've been upset with hollywood. communist countries freaked out over the award-winning film "the deer hunter" when "slinlder's lips" was debuted, muslim countries called it vial propaganda. and in 2003 iran called the release of "the 300" an act of

war. now that sony have apparently given in to the hackerers demand, is freedom of speech dead in hollywood when it comes to films? >> through the years movie studios have pulled their punches. sometimes they won't remove something they think is offensive. they'll cut something. in this case we're not talking about just about freedom of speech. we reserve the right to release movies and then we can boo them, protest, picket them. i've written horrible things about movies i hated but i never advocated not showing them. i said give me the chance to get a free ticket and yell boo at the screen. in this case they were dealing with international very credible, terrorist threats. >> right. >> so, of course, it gets more complicated now that north korea said we had nothing to do with this. how dare you call us bullies, and if you don't cooperate with us on an investigation we're

going to do something to you. >> let me just bring out that fareed zakaria of cnn had a chance to speak to the president of sony. let's play a little bit of that and we can talk about their response. >> why not release it online in some form or the other. video on demand. >> there are a number of options open to us and we have considered those. and are considering them. as it stands right now, while there have been a number of suggestions that we go out there and deliver this movie digitally or through dod, there has not been one major dod video on demand distributor, one major e-commerce site that has stepped forward and said they are willing to distribute this movie for us. again, we don't have that direct interface with the american public so we need to go through an intermediary to do that. >> back with michael musto again. let me ask you this, michael, do you think it is possible the studio will release that film in any way? >> they say that they actually

want to and making this more complicated than the plot of "the interview" sony said we had every intention to release it, it's the theater chains didn't want to show it. >> that's true. >> and you have another subplot with president obama saying you should have contacted the white house and sony said we did. this will make a great movie. i hope somebody releases it some day. >> george clooney is involved. he said he tried to start a petition and got no traction from anyone to come to the defense of sony. >> and he's george clooney. everybody loves george clooney. i do feel sympathy for sony, to decide whether you are going to bravely and boldly release this movie despite the threats or you're going to cower and try to do what you think is going to save lives or prevent violence. it's a very tough situation. i'm actually all for freedom of speech and expression, so i hope this sees the light of day even though this movie is apparently not "citizen cane."

>> no, it's not. maybe if sony said if it was, we would have stood up and fought, but it's a relatively low budget and minor film for them and if people were frightened to show up at the movie theaters at what is the peak holiday viewing time it would have a devastating impact on hollywood which hasn't had a very good beginning to begin with. >> when i saw the trailer i called my friend that i think we have a front-runner for the golden razzies. they did a movie called "this is the end" which was hilarious. and all the hyperbolic and gross-out movies like this one, sony says they want to release it. i think we'll see it in some form. somebody has to be brave enough to say we'll show it and someone might be brave enough to show up and watch it. >> i would love to go. i would love to go. i think all the publicity has made it that way for me. michael musto, thank you for joining us. >> thank you. >> you can see the complete

interview with michael lyton that's tomorrow morning a "fareed zakaria gps." don't forget tonight at 7:00 eastern, "black fish" the story of a seaworld trainer killed by a 12,000 pound orca in 2010. it gained international attention for the way that it challenged the concept of keeping killer whales for entertainment. that's tonight at 7:00. i'm martin savidge. i'll see you after the break. the mercedes-benz winter event is back, with the perfect vehicle that's just right for you, no matter which list you're on. [ho, ho, ho, ho] lease the 2015 ml 350 for $579 a month at your local mercedes-benz dealer. [ shutter clicks ]

hi there! [ laughs ] -i'm flo! -i know! i'm going to get you your rental car. this is so ridiculous. we're going to manage your entire repair process from paperwork to pickup, okay, little tiny baby? your car is ready, and your repairs are guaranteed for as long as you own it. the progressive service center -- a real place, where we really manage your claim from start to finish. really. ♪ easy as easy can be bye!

you're in the "cnn newsroom." i'm martin savidge. it's great to be with you. our attention tonight is on guantanamo bay, cuba. the u.s. detention there is still open nearly six years after president obama signed an order to shut it down. but the number of people up there is shrinking. the pentagon has confirmed that four men were sent back to their home country of afghanistan in addition to six others released earlier this month. about 800 terror suspects in all

have been held at guantanamo connected to the u.s.-led war on terror. after this release, it will remain at 132. i want to bring in robert bair he is a former cia officer and cnn intelligence and security analyst. bob, who are these men that have been sent back to afghanistan this morning and what do we know about them? >> well, as you said, marty, they're suspects. there's no evidence that they've killed americans. they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. they may have connections with terrorist groups but it's not something that military prosecutors can prove and at this point there's absolutely no reason why we can't let them go. and they will go back and some of them almost certainly will join a terror group and eventually be caught again or proved to be terrorists and there's just nothing you can do about it. just like the police when they arrest suspects that they can't bring a case against, they have to release them, go on to commit

another crime. i don't see any difference at all. >> whose job will it be to try to keep track of these suspects? i assume somebody will try to keep tabs on them. >> they'll end up on lists, biometrics and indicia associated with them they'll keep track of them. they'll go back to afghanistan, who knows what will happen to them then. a lot of these people frankly will go back to peaceful lives but, again, let's not get excited about this right now. some of them will join terrorist groups. >> we know that congress has struck down the outright closure of guantanamo in the new defense bill but that doesn't stop the release of more detainees. can president obama shut it down without congress approving. >> i hope they shut it down. after all we are going to normalize relations with cuba and i could see at one day that base is at least jointly administered with cuba if things go well. we have to come to a system, the world does, to deal with these jihadists a way to put them

behind bars and, you know, put them out of the business. >> i wanted to ask you real quick, there is a report now, and i'm switching gears now to isis. isis has banned devices with gps tracking. smart move on their part? belated? what do you think? >> no. these guys are very good. you know, what surprised me about isis is they've gone to mobile wi-fi. i mean, they only go for a couple minutes. they have simply looked at the snowden documents that were leaked and they have found a hole in our coverage. national security agency, you know, a lot of young kids from europe and the united states are showing up there that understand their way around computers and communication system. they're getting better and it's really a tough catch-up game for the national security agency. >> yeah. i think many people have been impressed with sophistication. even when it comes to just the video presentation.

bob baer, thanks very much. moving to north korea, moving on that is, the state-run news agency there today blasted what it called america's childish investigation. that concluded north koreans were behind that sony computer hacking. hackers broke into sony servers and they threatened to attack movie theaters that screened "the interview" a comedy film about a assassination plot against kim jong-un. the guardians of peace issued a new message taunting the fbi and congratulating the bureau for its investigation. experts say the hacking required a high level of technical knowledge and north korea may have had some help. here's cnn's brian todd -- >> reporter: the cyberforensic evidence all points to north korea according to the fbi. the computer code, algorithms, the ip addresses but that's not necessarily a clear path to pyongyang. >> it's all circumstantial

evidence that can be faked. >> reporter: scott borg's cyb cybersecurity group monitors hackers across the globe. despite north korea trying to develop sophisticated hackers there's elements that went beyond their skill level. >> the biggest one they were able to carry on with activities inside sony's network for so long without being spotted. moving possibly data without anyone noticing requires a lot of skill. opening documents all over the place in order to download them and have no one notice requires quite a bit of skill. >> reporter: and they just didn't have that even recently? >> that's right. earlier this year there was no sign of that level of skill. >> reporter: he believes the regime may have outsourced some of the sony hack but to whom? >> i think the most likely, this was hacking talent that volunteered to help them or criminals that they hired. or someone inside of sony who provided them with all kinds of

inside access. >> reporter: u.s. investigators have evidence that hackers stole the computer credentials of a sony system administrator to get inside access but could another government have helped north korea? one analyst says another u.s. enemy may be involved. >> there are signs that suggest iran may indeed have helped. because they have worked together on missile development for many years because iran has been a major client of north korea weapons. >> reporter: cnn reached out to iranian officials about that. they didn't respond. the white house maintains north korea acted alone. >> we've got no indication that north korea was acting in conjunction with another country. >> reporter: north korea denies hacking sony but if pyongyang pulled this without any outside help it would be the greatest success for their shadowy hagging group called bureau 121. >> north korea probably doesn't need the help. they've been investing in their cybercapabilities very heavily and they've had trial runs with

attacks on south korea media and banks. >> reporter: and one analyst points to a key reason why other governments may not have helped with the hack. they said most governments wouldn't be foolish enough to hand hack tools to north korea given their erratic behavior. brian todd, cnn, washington. not anyone loves the decision to bring kuj ba and cu united states closer. so, should cuba turn the fugitives over to us? we'll talk about it. when you don't get enough sleep... and your body aches... you're not yourself. tylenolpm relieves pain and helps you fall fast asleep and stay asleep. we give you a better night. you're a better you all day.

tylenol® which means it's timeson for the volkswagen sign-then-drive event. for practically just your signature, you could drive home for the holidays in a german-engineered volkswagen. like the sporty, advanced new jetta... and the 2015 motor trend car of the year all-new golf. if you're wishing for a new volkswagen this season... just about all you need is a finely tuned... pen. get zero due at signing, zero down, zero deposit, and zero first month's payment on select new volkswagen models.

president obama's shift in u.s./cuba relations now prompting for fresh calls for cuban return one of new jersey's most notorious fugitives her name is jo ann chesamard. she's the only female on the most wanted terrorist. she's a convicted cop killer who escaped from an american prison in the 1980s and fled to cuba. our jason carroll has more on the push to return her to u.s. soil. >> learn a lot from people? >> reporter: she's somewhat of a cause celebre in cuba called on to speak about issues such as equality and human rights but it wasn't always like this. in fact, she didn't always go by the name asada shakur. >> the most wanted terrorist

list. >> reporter: her given name is joanne chesimard. last year she became the first woman added to the fbi's most wanted terrorist list a $2 million reward offered for her capture in connection with the fatal shooting of a new jersey state trooper in 1973. >> while living openly and freely in cuba, she continues to maintain and promote her terrorist ideology. >> reporter: back in 1973 she was a member of the black panther party. in 1987 she while a fugitive in cuba talked about what happened the night she and two of her companions were stopped while driving on the new jersey turnpike. >> we ate. we got back into the car. and shortly after we were stopped. by the police. >> reporter: she claims things turned violent almost without warning. >> gun in my face and i put my hands out like this.

in a matter of seconds i was shot. >> reporter: when the shooting had ended, state trooper wernor forester was dead. chesimard and another man charged with his murder. what happened out here on the new jersey turnpike took place decades ago, but one chilling detail is still very clear to state troopers. according to the fbi, frster was shot at point-blank range with his own gun. a jury found her guilty of murder and she was supposed to serve a life sentence but two years later she was broken out of prison by three armed members of the black liberation army. and after hiding out for years finally surfaced in cuba. she was granted asylum by fidel castro. since then state officials have fought for her extradition. in 1998 christine todd whitman had this message -- >> you are holding up the ability of the cuban population to enjoy a better relationship

with the united states by your presence in cuba. >> reporter: now an historic shift in u.s./cuba relations. could it translate into an extradition agreement? one that would finally force chesimard back to u.s. soil to be held accountable for her crime. >> what cuba wants always is to get into a swap situation. and for u.s. officials that's a very difficult road to go down. >> reporter: over four decades since the shooting troopers here in new jersey are still waiting for justice. jason carroll, cnn, new york. my next guest is slamming president obama for not making her return part of his landmark deal with cuba. with my daily beast special correspondent michael dalian. what do you think the odds that chesimard will be extradited back to the u.s.? >> my guess zero. i mean, by the americans taking the step that they took, i mean,

how are we going to force cuba to give her up unless there's some deal we don't know about. unless there's some understanding that we don't know about. but castro's kind of got what he wants. i mean, we can use our credit cards and deb bit cards down there. they can go down to the beach. there will be american money going down there. i'm sure wall street -- >> there's still a trade embargo in place. >> but it's the steps towards that. i can't see at this point i'm holding the trade embargo up, give us joe ann or we're not going to do that. >> perhaps as time progresses and the relationship grows closer between the two governments eventually someone says it's time we talk about the return. >> that's possible. i'm just saying if you are talking about in the immediate foreseeable future. i don't see it personally. >> i want to talk about how -- you wrote about this. i want to read your quote exactly. you said, quote, unless cuba sends american fugitives back, you might consider following the now lifted embargo with your own

personal boycott. do you think that americans are really going to boycott over -- >> no, i don't think they will. but that doesn't mean they shouldn't. >> but it's a point of conscience here. >> this is a police officer who was murdered in the course of his duty. shot twice in the head with his own gun. she went to trial. she was convicted. she broke out of prison. and to me i -- you know, i don't want to be sitting on a beach with her. >> do you think that eventually someone is going to say, all right, we'll make an exchange for her and we find someone else? i presume there are other captives that we still hold. >> well, it's possible. i think we have a couple of their spies still in jail. i suppose it's possible. >> you don't strike me as a man who is full of hope on this, though. >> i don't. i think that -- not that i'm an expert on cuba, but if i'm castro of the castro regime, i want to still send a signal to people that, you know, we're still the castro people. we're still communists.

we're still, you know, we're not like them and one way they can do that is by holding on to joanne chesimard. >> hopefully you're wrong and they'll have a change of heart. michael daly, thank you very much. and just in to cnn, we should bring this to you, a huge protest at the mall of america outside of minneapolis. you're looking now at pictures from moments ago that were inside that mall. the protesters at one point were holding up their hands in a gesture from ferguson, hands up, don't shoot. people also had signs declaring black lives matter. cnn affiliate kare reports mall officials warned protesters against the demonstration since the mall is private property. and, of course, today happens to be the busiest shopping day of the holiday season. in a desolate part of texas, a huge building has a lot of

people upset. it's a brand-new immigration detention center. but it's not an ordinary one. we'll tell you why it's made so many people angry. but first, time to check in with dr. sanjay gupta for a look at what's ahead on "sg md" at 4:30 eastern. >> martin, scientists are in a race against time to find new ways to treat common infections before it's too late. we'll take you to the north of the arctic circle where research teams are on the hunt for the next gentlemen ration of antibiotics. that's ahead on "sg md."

a few days ago the u.s. government opened the largest-ever facility set up to receive, house and process the flood of families arriving in the country mainly from central america. cnn's nick valencia is joining me now and you i were both on the border in texas and we wnti witnessed as people came across. tell us why it is needed. you and i know but for the general public. >> this detention facility is for the family units. that surge that we saw happen this summer of unaccompanied minors, children accompanied by at least a parent. usually a mother. dhs, department of homeland security, they think that this is a solution to house those tens of thousands of immigrants that cross the border this year. immigrants rights groups and human rights advocates say not so much. >> reporter: whind the

chain-link fence and just beyond the dusty dirt field sits the largest immigrant family detention center in the united states. the facility quietly opened this week in dilly texas about an hour outside of san antonio. while the surge of unaccompanied children fleeing central america spiked this summer, months later the federal government continues to work to solve the problem. >> those who came here illegally in the past who have been here for years have committed no serious crimes and have become integrated members of american life. are not priorities for removal. >> reporter: but they are candidates for unnecessary trauma and prison-like conditions according to immigrant rights groups who oppose facilities like the one in texas. >> it's the wrong side of history. when i see these pictures of dilly, many people say it reminds us of the japanese internment camps that we had in our history. certainly we don't want to repeat that. >> reporter: with 2,400 beds the detention center in dilly will essentially replace a separate

facility in new mexico which was closed at the end of 2014. a victim advocate said at a cost of $260 million per year to the american taxpayer there are cheaper and more moral options. >> whether it be churches who are in charge of these individuals who can be responsible for them or community-based organizations or even one of our most criticized program, you know, giving these individuals electronic bracelets. at the very least that would be an option that would not cost the taxpayers money. >> reporter: dhs would not respond to specific criticisms of the centers but did say the facility in dilly, quote, promotes and highlights the border security aspects of the border security actions president obama announced on november 20th. they've had a high detention percentage this year. they've caught more than 68,000 trying to cross the border this year. the problem, though, martin is trying to figure out what to do

with them after they're detained. >> getting back to the opponents of that detention center, what exactly would they like to see? do they have an alternative? >> you heard from one, but principally what they want is legal representation for the undocumented immigrants. they say that if these undocumented immigrant family groups are given bonds or all allowed to reunite with their family groups that would be a more humanitarian option. the problem with that, though, martin statistically speaking once these family units are let go given the court dates they very rarely show up for the court date that they're given. martin? >> nick valencia, thanks very much. >> you bet. coming up an american success story for the holiday season. misty copeland a ballerina who dedicated herself for ballet long after most girls give up. she persevered to make history and inspire others. that's ahead.

♪you better pledge ♪ your allegiance♪ ♪you're not the only one ♪listen up forefathers ♪i'm not your son ♪you better help the children ♪let them have some fun ♪some fun ♪some fun.

when you don't get enough sleep... and your body aches... you're not yourself. tylenolpm relieves pain and helps you fall fast asleep and stay asleep. we give you a better night. you're a better you all day. tylenol® doctors have been prescribingdecade, nexium to patients just like you. for many, prescription nexium helps heal acid-related erosions

in the lining of the esophagus. there is risk of bone fracture and low magnesium levels. side effects may include headache, abdominal pain, and diarrhea. if you have persistent diarrhea, contact your doctor right away. other serious stomach conditions may exist. avoid if you take clopidogrel. nexium 40 mg is only available by prescription. talk to your doctor. for free home delivery, enroll in nexium direct today. christmas is just five days away. if you're a kid, you can't wait. if you're a parent you are, like, oh, my gosh and families everywhere are now flocking to see what is always a holiday tradition "the nutcracker" ballet. misty copeland is starring in the lead role as clara in new york. she's living out what really is a dream for a lot of aspiring ballerinas but her pathway to the spotlight was very different than most. randi kaye tells us why. >> reporter: she's long been called an unlikely ballerina.

but at 32 years old, misty copeland is the first african-american soloist in two decades at the prestigious american ballet theater. her story is different than most ballerinas. you took your first ballet class at 13. >> yes. >> reporter: which is a pretty late start in the ballet field, right? >> it is. it is. >> reporter: months after that first class at a boys and girls club in san pedro, california, people were calling misty a prodigy. she was just 17 when she joined the american ballet theater, but not everyone was quick to accept this ballerina who didn't look at all the rest. "dear candidate thank you for your application to our ballet academy. unfortunately, you have not been accepted." "your achilles tendon, turnout, torso length and bust." did you ever receive a letter like that? could you relate to that? >> i did.

my teacher said keep that letter because you're going to want to look back on it one day. as an adult i was told that i didn't have the right skin color. i was too muscular. i was too curvey. my breasts were too big. i was too short. >> reporter: you wrote about an experience years ago where your friend overheard an american ballet theater staff member saying that you didn't fit in with your brown skin. especially in a ballet like "swan lake." do you remember how that affected you? >> yeah. i get emotional right now just thinking about it. i tried to understand the person's perspective. and how deep rooted it is in the ballet culture. it's so easy for them to just say these things out loud and not understanding the effect it can have on someone. >> reporter: misty proved her critics wrong and played the dual role of the white and black swan in "swan lake" in australia. and will reprice the role for the washington ballet and the

american ballet theater next year. i want to ask you about one moment when you saw you in front of the met. is that -- did your heart just skip a beat? >> it was overwhelming and i didn't see myself up there. i saw a black woman. and that was the part that made me so emotional to see a black woman representing ballet, representing america's national ballet company on the front of the metropolitan opera house. i was, like, that's change. >> reporter: randi kaye, cnn new york. >> good story. all right. one more before you go. and it's one where everybody gets ready to say, ahh, in unison. we're talking pandas. a pair of female panda cubs in japan has visitors there flocking to the japan park. staff at the adventure world say the babies which were born on december 2nd weigh just over one pound each. the zoo plans to start soliciting names for the cubs

very soon. adventure world by the way has seven of these rare giant pandas on site. "cnn newsroom's" continues at the top of the hour. right now keep it here for "sanjay gupta, m.d. ""i'll see you in a bit. welcome to the program. why is mumps going around the national hockey league? we got that story. plus, we put together the top ten health stories of 2014. some of them are going to surprise you. what do you think number one is? but, first, it is a race against time and what the world health organization calls one of the biggest threats to global health today. now, we're not talking about ebola. we're not even talking about influenza. we're talking about common infections and what happens when we can't treat them. progra perhaps the biggest medical breakthrough in history was the discovery of antibiotics. the first was penicillin, but compounds like this one have