something and prevent something tragic like this from happening. >> laurie, thank you so much. reporting from new york city. that's it for "the lead." i'm suzanne malveaux sitting in for jake tapper. i turn you over to my colleague, wolf blitzer, in "the situation room." happening now, put aside the protests, the appeal from new york's embattled mayor after the brutal murders of two new york city police officers. on alert, law enforcement agencies across the country are now taking special precautions after the new york city killings. will the latest tensions lead to a spike in crime? and internet down, why did north korea's communications network crash? i'll ask a key member of the house intelligence committee. i'm wolf blitzer. you're in "the situation room." police across the country are taking special precautions after the murder of two new york city police officers.

the nypd is investigating more than 15 direct threats posted on social media. under intense criticism for his comments on recent protests, the new york city mayor, bill de blasio, is calling the murders an attack on democracy seasoned a appealing for protests to be put aside until the police officers are buried. we're also getting new information about urgent efforts by baltimore authorities to warn police in new york city that the gunman went there with an intent of attacking and killing police officers. the naacp president cornell william brooks is standing by along with our correspondents, our analysts and our guests. let's begin with cnn's martin savidge who's on the ground for us in brooklyn. martin? >> reporter: good evening, wolf. standing outside at the memorial that has grown on the street here at the intersection where the shooting that take place on saturday has still caused this city to be in deep mourning and deep shock over what was the

broad daylight asass nati-- assassination of two of new york's finest. an update from authorities on the investigation this afternoon, we learned authorities are still trying to piece together the final hours of the suspect in this particular case. and they showed remarkable footage. they say it is surveillance footage gathered from a mall in brooklyn about three hours before the attack on the new york police officers. they say it shows the suspect walking and moving about here in the new york area. but there is still a gap of about 2 1/2 hours they really don't know where this person was. they're appealing to the public for information. meanwhile, as you said, the mayor putting out a call, there are all sorts of protests that have been coming both before and even being planned after this tragedy. the mayor is saying this is no time for that. please put them on hold until after the funerals of these

fallen officers. here's what he said at a press conference. >> this is across the spectrum, to put aside protests, put aside demonstrations until these funerals are passed, let's focus just on these families and what they have lost. >> reporter: there is a tremendous divide that is between the mayor and his police department. now, new yorkers have known this for some time. but the rest of the nation is finding out about just how bitter that divide is and how wide that gap is. and the officers say it's because the police are not backed by the mayor. wolf? >> certainly is bitter and that divide is great right now. the mayor, he got frustrated, as you know, with the news media when he was asked about some of the more extreme rhetoric at these recent protests in new york. he defended the protesters, right? >> reporter: that's right.

there have been some who have suggested that it was the protests that perhaps planted the seed in the suspect's mind to somehow to want to seek revenge against police officers. and that in fact he was shooting at a uniform. and that was brought up today about the rhetoric that some of these protests had used on the streets of new york. as you point out, the mayor got testy in his response. here's what he said. >> the question is, what are you guys going to do? what are you guys going to do? are you going to keep dividing us? i'm not talking every single one of them. but just in that question -- 25,000 people marched down one of our streets a few days back absolutely peaceful, no chants like that. what you managed to do is pull up the few who do not represent the majority who are saying unacceptable things, who shouldn't be saying those things. the few who want conflict attempt that and unfortunately so many times you guys enable

that. >> reporter: the "you" in the statement that the mayor is making there is a reference to the new york media. he believes in some cases they have been fanning the flames here. but, again, hearing from the mayor and also hearing from at least one of the fallen officers' families, there's a request that people take a time-out. that they reflect on all that's been said and done and allow for these funerals to go forward in peace. >> it is amazing when you saw that video of the mayor saturday night walking into the hospital where these two police officers were -- we're showing the video now. the corridor of police officers on both sides actually turned their backs on the mayor. they refused to look at him at all. i've been covering these kinds of stories for a long time, martin, so have you. i don't remember a time when police officers showed such disdain for a sitting mayor. >> reporter: correct. it was an absolute stunning moment visually when you looked

at that to see those officers physically turning their back. and when you talk to retired police officers, those who go back decades working in this city, they say never before have they seen a divide as great as the one they're seeing now. and that is truly a problem when you're dealing with a city deep in mourning. >> they have to work this out and fix it. martin savidge in brooklyn for us. we're also getting new information about the desperate effort by police in baltimore to warn the nypd that the gunman traveled to new york with murder on his mind. let's bring in our justice reporter, evan perez. he's been working his sources. what are you learning, evan? >> reporter: the urgent efforts by the baltimore county police department to try to warn the new york police department when they realized that this killer, that this shooter was actually in brooklyn. we have at 2:10 p.m., the

baltimore county police department detective calls the nypd. he gets turned around -- sent to another precinct but eventually spends 30 minutes talking about this instagram that this suspect had put out in which he threatens police officers. at about 2:46 p.m., the baltimore county p.d. faxes the wanted flier at the request of the nypd that shows the suspect and who they're looking for. less than two minutes later, a minute or two laerter, these tw officers were killed. they never saw it coming. >> it's shocking when you think about it, this is after he actually shot his ex-girlfriend in baltimore. so there was a little history there of how dangerous this individual was. you're also following the criticism of not just the mayor in new york but also the attorney general of the united states, eric holder. what are you picking up on that front? >> reporter: it's something that i've been hearing a lot from former and current cops who tell

me that they believe the tone that the attorney general and a lot of elected officials who have been dealing with these protests have taken, that they weren't doing enough to give the backing of police officers. today at a press conference, unrelated press conference, jim cole, the deputy attorney general addressed this question when i asked him about it. >> what you have to be able to do is have a conversation about isolated instances where we see profiling, where we see excessive force. and at the same time, we have to make sure that our officers are safe and that we do everything we can to make sure that the brave men and women who are part of law enforcement are protected as much as we can. and i think having the conversation about one is not undercutting the other. we have to have them both. >> reporter: wolf, the rhetoric that you heard over the weekend from the head of the nypd union was very strident and it was

something that certainly people at the justice department are pushing back on because they say this is a conversation that can be had. we can give backing to the police officers. at the same time we can talk about the need in some places for improvements in the way police do their work. >> evan perez with that late-breaking information, thank you. first wave of protests over killings by police, now growing fallout over the murder of two police officers. did one lead to the other? will the tensions lead to an upsurge in crimes around the country? brian todd joins us. what are you seeing? >> one top police union official tells us he believes the recent protests did lead to the deaths of those two police officers. and an ominous warning, a spike in crime across the country may result from this sequence of events. two fallen officers, a city

convulsing with tension. and tonight, a sense that the strain between police across the country and the public they protect is growing. police are angry that recent demonstrations turned into personal attacks against them. >> we can certainly blame them. i think to the extent that this deranged individual acted on saturday, there's little doubt he thought there would be a wave of sympathy from within the community based on what he's been hearing from the agitators. >> reporter: in the days before the police officers' murders, police has been assaulted in protests on the brooklyn bridge and at the staten island ferry. as the tensions escalated, police increasingly pointed blame at new york mayor bill de blasio, accusing him of being less than supportive and giving protesters too much leeway. the police union in new york circulated a form letter which officers could sign, saying they didn't want de blasio coming to their funerals if they died in

the line of duty. police turned their backs on the mayor after he came to the hospital after the police officers' death. >> that blood on the hands starts on the steps of city hall and the office of the mayor. >> reporter: de blasio's office calls it overheated and irresponsible. tonight, an ominous concern from howard safer, out of concern for their own safety, police across the country won't take the extra steps they usually take to protect the public. >> somebody gets a call that there's a domestic dispute in an apartment. they pull up to the apartment building, they don't see anything, they report it at unsubstantiated. >> reporter: without even going in? >> i'm not suggesting that would happen. i'm suggesting it's possible. >> howard safer says he remembers back in the 1970s and 1980s in new york when during a time of more violence towards police, the police were called,

quote, blue flower pots, because they sat in their cars not doing much. safer worries about how police are going to behave in heated situations if they continue to feel unappreciated, wolf. >> and you also got some perspective from the former new york city police commissioner howard safer on how bad the tensions are right now between the police and the mayor's office. >> that's right. remember, howard safer was commissioner during the diablo case. he says he's never seen it as bad as it is right now. >> they simply turned their back on him. showed their disdain. wouldn't even look him in the face. let's bring in our justice reporter, evan perez and tom fuentes.

tom, what worries a lot of people is copycats, not necessarily in new york but all over the country, guys who presumably on social media sites are saying they want to kill cops. >> it's already a concern and it's already happening. they've intercepted many social media postings already since saturday afternoon where individuals expressed an interest in killing police because of what happened here, that they wanted to do it also, they wanted to kill more police. so a direct reference to knowing that the police officers were killed on saturday afternoon. >> evan, i assume the federal authorities, the fbi -- you cover the justice department and the fbi for us -- they're very worried about this as well. >> reporter: they are very worried about it. even if most of these are just hoaxes, just threats, people acting out, they have to investigate every one of these. this is a very resource-intensive thing.

the other thing is, you never know when one of these persons, maybe somebody who has mental issues, will act out and will carry out something like this. and worse, wolf, the ones who don't even speak out. and so the question is, what do you blame this on? do you blake it on the protests? do you blame this on what's going on -- this time of year, there are a lot of people with mental issues act out. it's christmastime. it's not clear what's driving it. >> guys, stand by. i want to bring in cornell william brooks, the president and ceo of the naacp. he's joining us here in "the situation room." thanks very much for coming in. it's an awful situation right now. everybody's looking to calm things down. but i don't remember a time of such ugly bitterness between a sitting mayor and these cops. do you remember anything like this? >> no. and particularly at this moment where new york city is the

safest large city in the country and perhaps even the world. so for this to be happening now is extraordinarily disturbing. >> how did this get out of hand, this out of control like this? two young police officers brutally shot down in brooklyn for no reason, and the killer -- he posted on social media, i'm going to go kill two cops. >> absolutely. this is an extraordinary tragedy. certainly on behalf of the naacp, we extend our condolences to the ramos family and the liu family. but i think it's important to note here that we have a lone gunman with a serious history of mental illness and a long criminal history who acts out of a suicidal homicidal rage. we can't connect that to peaceful protests. peaceful protests aren't a cure for mental illness and irresponsible rhetoric is certainly not a cause for mental

illness. but at this point, we need to be careful and precise in terms of our speech and our conduct lest we make a bad situation worse. >> is the mayor right in saying, call off the protests from now in the aftermath of the eric garner case, the michael brown case? is the mayor right to say, at least for now, let's pay our respects to the families who have lost their loved ones and forego the protests? >> yes. i think there's a moment where one can exercise your constitutional rights and there's also a moment to exercise judgment, discretion and compassion. we have families attempting to bury their loved ones. we have a police department, a city, a country that is grieving. we need to be clear about this. we have a country that's grieving. let's honor the grief. let's take care of one another, console one another and tamp down on heated words. >> what do you say to those police leaders who blame the

rhetoric that we heard after ferguson and staten island -- let me play a little clip. here is the head of the police union in new york city, patrick lynch. i'll play this clip. >> there's blood on many hands tonight, those that incited violence on this street under the guise of protest that tried to tear down what new york city police officers did every day. that blood on their hands starts on the steps of city hall in the office of the mayor. >> those are strong words. are they fair? >> i don't believe those words are fair. we have to be more concerned about not blood on anyone's hands but preventing further bloodshed. we have to be concerned about that. and it does not help the situation to use such heated rhetoric. the tears of grieving families

are not law enforcement blue. they're not racially black or brown. they're colorless. we need to be concerned about grieving families. we need to be concerned about a grieving city. we need to tamp down this rhetoric. that's dangerous, very dangerous. >> indeed. of course, our deepest, deep condolences of the two police officers, rafael ramos and wenjian liu. cornell, we have a lot more to discuss. this is an explosive, sensitive issue. everybody wants it to calm down but it looks like it's really tense in new york city right now. we'll take a quick break. much more right after this. she inspires you. no question about that. but your erectile dysfunction - that could be a question of blood flow.

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new york's mayor under enormous fire right now for earlier remarks. he's urging a pause in the protests over police violence. says police must be respected. we're back with cornell william brooks, the president and ceo of the naacp. once again, cornell, thanks very much for joining us. people focus in on most of the protests -- there are tens of thousands. honorable, decent. but there were some who were ugly and terrible. we heard this in new york the other day. i'll play some clips because it's disgusting but presumably it gets picked up. listen to. >> what do we want? dead cops! when do we want it? now. >> you see a crowd going down a major street in street, what do you want, dead cops, when do you want it, now. they keep going on and on and on. how does that happen? >> it's misdirected anger.

the fact of the matter is people are expressing their anger in ways that are not only unconstructive but socially suicidal. when you attack police officers broadly, these are the protect charged with the responsibility of protecting you, protecting us. that does not help. in ferguson, within days of michael brown being killed, the naacp marched with law enforcement and young people, grade schoolers. we did that because we wanted to make clear that we're not anti-police, we're anti-injustice. the fact of the matter is, we're looking to bring about a better, stronger, more community-oriented style and strategy and tactic of community policing, we need police officers. we can't make them the enemy. when we do, we make ourselves the enemy because they're charged with -- >> but did some of the rhetoric that seemingly was anti-police in the aftermath of ferguson, the aftermath of staten island, the chokehold death, if you will, did some of the rhetoric

encourage some of these crazy fringe elements to go out there and start streaming "what do you want, dead cops"? >> i don't believe so. people have to take responsibility of their own actions. you can't blame the crowd for incidents of violence or acting out or bringing harm to your own community. people have to stand on their own feet and take responsibilities for these actions. on the other hand, it also means that people in the crowds should take responsibility for inciting bad behavior, using irresponsible rhetoric. we shouldn't use this kind of rhetoric when we're standing on the street. and we certainly shouldn't use this kind of rhetoric if we're public officials. >> and you would hope people in the crowd would tell these others, shut up, there's no place for language like that. i interviewed a pastor in new

york, he's been an inspiration over the years to many people. but he wasn't complimentary of the mayor of new york. this is reverend butts. >> i'm disappointed when i called the mayor's office to set up a meeting between several leading clergy persons in this city and several prominent businesspersons, the mayor did not reach back. this indicates that he is slightly out of touch. he's getting bad advice and as a resu result, the tension between the police and the community is heightened. it is, i think, a direct result of leadership. >> those are pretty strong words from reverend butts. >> very strong words. but i'll note that at this point where tensions are so high, now's the time to draw deeply upon the reservoir of trust, community capital, there are people across new york, ministers, priests, rabbis,

distinguished community leaders. it's time for all of us to reach out to all of us, to bring about calm, peace. >> here's an idea. tell me what you think about this. the naacp, the national urban league and other organizations organize a march, if you will, to support law enforcement, to support police. here's what i would make clear here. everything that we have done over the last several months has been in support of lawful, well-respected community-oriented policing. everything. we have already marched with the police. consider this, wolf. members of my staff, members of the naacp are police officers, are part of law enforcement. the fact of the matter is i began my career at a very distinguished law enforcement agency called the u.s. justice department. we believe in law enforcement so much so that we believe they have to honor their badges by operating in a fashion that wins the trust of the community. >> does it make sense to have a little demonstration in support

of law enforcement -- reverend butts told me a lot of members of his church are in new york who are cops and they need some support. >> i think it's important to not only demonstrate in a march but demonstrate in an ongoing way. it's not about just merely having a march but it's also a matter of standing with police officers for the best form of policing. that we're doing and that we have done. >> cornell william brooks, very tense time right now. let's hope there are no more copycats out there and that they can calm the situation down. as i said before, i'm really worried -- nonviolence is great. peaceful protest, everybody has a right to do it. but when you hear those ugly comments -- >> no place. it has no place. >> cornell, thanks very much for coming in. >> thank you, wolf. we'll have a lot more on the breaking news. also, there are new developments involving north korea. guess what? north korea's internet is down. who's responsible for that? we've got new information coming into "the situation room."

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we continue to follow the

breaking news in new york city where the mayor, bill de blasio, is asking people to put aside protests until after the funerals of the two police officers who were brutally killed over the weekend. but we're also following reports that north korea's internet system all of a sudden collapsed today. the reports come as the state department put new pressure on north korea to admit that it was behind the cyber attack on sony pictures. let's bring in our global affairs correspondent, elise labott, who's working this story for us. what are you learning? >> u.s. being tight-lipped about these reports that north korea's internet service is down. experts say it does seem to be a cyber attack. you've had these latest shutdowns of north korea internet service. this doesn't seem to be a blip. it seems to be something much more than that. others say it could be north korea pulled the plug on its own internet or perhaps their main chinese internet provider could have disconnected this. this happens as the u.s. is weighing its response tort cyber

attack on sony. north korea's denied its involvement and is demanding an investigation. today it was a tit for tat. take a listen to marie harf. >> as the fbi and the president and everyone has made clear, we are confident the north korean government is responsible for this attack. the government of north korea has a long history of denying responsibility for provocative actions. if they want to help, they can admit their culpability and compensate sony for the damages they caused. >> and the north koreans threaten action against the white house, the pentagon, the whole u.s. mainland. the u.s. is chalking it up to the usual north korean ret restrict but damaging words. >> chilling words. thanks very much, elise, for that report. while there are reports that

north korea's internet has gone down, there's no claim about who's responsible. our pentagon correspondent, barbara starr, has been working her sources and has more on the military options for u.s. retaliation against north korea if it comes down to that. what are you learning, barbara? >> reporter: good evening, wolf. the outages in north korea are capturing the attention of the online world. the pentagon like the state department is staying very quiet about who may be responsible for that. but make no mistake, some pieces are being put into place about military response and military options. after the sony attack, the pentagon moved quickly, beefing up its own cyber defense against north korea, cnn has learned. now the pentagon is looking into a number of classified options to quickly identify and defend against any future attempts by north korea to hack into military computer systems. at the same time, the military is preparing options for the

president to consider. >> we're part of the interagency discussion about the incident and about options that may be available. >> reporter: any military cyber response will be coordinated with the fbi which is leading the investigation. >> we take it very seriously. we will respond proportionally, as i said. >> reporter: one potential, an offensive, u.s. military cyber attack on north korea's limited online capabilities. but it may be tough. >> we know from defectors from this unit called bureau 121 or unit 121, that they have 3,000, 5,000 cyber warriors. they operate out of china, singapore, europe, as well as using computer nodes throughout the world. >> reporter: oddly, experts who track online outages around the world are reporting internet routes into north korea since sunday have been down. no one is yet saying this is a u.s. counterattack.

pyongyang not giving up on its fiery rhetoric saying, our toughest counteraction will be boldly taken against the white house, the pentagon and the whole u.s. mainland, the cesspool of terrorism. there are more u.s. options such as more sanctions and putting north korea back on the list of countries sponsoring terrorism. here at the pentagon, the big priority tonight is on making sure all the defensive measures are in place so u.s. computer systems, the classified military network, essentially, is safe from any north korean hacking. why not just go ahead and launch that cyber counterattack against north korea? well, there's always the concern that in that country, the u.s. doesn't have a lot of understanding how the leadership might react to something like that and they want to keep provocation at a minimum even while they contemplate perhaps a very secretive response. wolf? >> barbara starr, thanks very much.

let's get more now. joining us in "the situation room," congressman dutch rupersburger of maryland, top democrat of the house intelligence committee. thanks for joining us. what do you make of all of a sudden north korea experiencing an internet outage? what do you know about this? >> well, i wouldn't trust anything that north korea has said. they have plenty of propaganda. they threaten our country, the most powerful country in the world. but we have to really focus on how we're going to handle this situation. i think it's important we let the public know there are different types of cyber attacks. there's the type of attack that we feel that china is attacking our corrupt and other countries where they steal information, mostly from our businesses. we estimate we've lost over $2 billion in the last year cyber attacking our banks, cyber attacking our companies, our academia, our medical companies.

this attack is the first time the united states has received a destructive attack. one of our companies, sony. and what a destructive attack is basically, they came in to sony, they totally took out their systems and then they took all their information and they deleted all the information. and this is very serious. destructive attacks can be used against our grid systems, against our air traffic control. and we now as a country need to determine how we're going to handle this, how we're going to let north korea know that they would be held accountable for any other country in the world that will attack us. congress has a job to do also. >> if the internet's down in north korea, they have limited internet capability. but say it's down. a lot of people will suspect the united states did this, given the fact that the president said the u.s. will respond, it will be proportionate. the u.s. might not necessarily announce what it's doing. what's your sense if in fact the internet is down in north korea, was the united states behind it?

>> wolf, i'm not going to comment on that. we'll let the public know what happens after we do the attack. we don't tell people that we're going to come and hold them accountable, what we're going to do until we finish. we have different agencies in our government coming together who will make a recommendation to the president, our commander in chief. then we will act and we have to make sure we do it the right way. we are going to be a standard for the world on how we deal with destructive attacks. it's just not about north korea. it's about terrorists. it's about isis hiring hackers to do these type of things. so we have to do this right. it's got to be strong but it's also got to be proportionate. but i'd like to talk, too, about what congress needs to do to protect our country. >> go ahead. >> chairman rogers and i and our committee, the house intelligence committee, have been working on legislation over the last couple of years. right now, our intelligence community is as good as anybody

in the world seeing these attacks coming in. but the intelligence community and our country can't share this information with the companies and the people being attacked. so our legislation allows more information sharing to allow our community, our government, our intelligence community, to let them know that attacks are coming. it's like being a forecaster, a meteorologist. when you see sandy coming up the east coast and you can't warn anybody. so we're able to pass legislation in the house, close to 300 votes, which is pretty good. our record in the last house hasn't been very good at passing bipartisan legislation. we got this legislation passed. it went to the senate and unfortunately -- even though senator feinstein and chambliss worked with us, we weren't able to get a bill passed. >> let me interrupt, congressman. harry reid, the outgoing majority leader, why wouldn't he let it come up for a vote? >> i understand there were a couple of senators that objected to it.

there were two senators. i'm not sure which senators they were. as a result of that, it didn't come to a vote. it was the last couple of weeks last week. but the bottom-line issue is we have to move forward. the next congress, we have to put this legislation ahead because now the public are starting to understand how serious these cyber attacks are. those of us that have been talking about it for years, we're now seeing what happened with target, our treasury department, we're seeing what's happened to the sony situation. home depot. and it's going to keep coming. these cyber attacks are serious. not only about the information that's being stolen but more importantly what happened here in our country with sony and the north koreans is that they had destructive attacks. and that can disrupt lives. >> what would be an appropriate, responsible u.s. response to north korea? >> i'm not going to talking about that, wolf. there can be sanctions. there can be a lot of things we

can do to make things difficult. put them on the terror list. but you don't identify to your enemy what you're going to do until you do it. that's the decision the president is going to make based on the recommendation from our military, from our intelligence community and other agencies on the best way to let north korea know, you cyber attack in the united states of america, you're going to be held accountable and we'll do whatever we have to do to make sure you don't do it again or any other country or terrorist group that wants to attack our country or our allies. >> any doubt in your mind that north korea was responsible for the attack on sony pictures? >> i can only base my information on the briefings that i've received. and i have a lot of confidence in the fbi, i have a lot of confidence in the people involved with this, that it was north korea. and north korea has so much propaganda, they've got a young, immature kid running the country. they're very irresponsible. to threaten us and say they're

going to attack our capital and our pentagon -- that's their propaganda. we want to make sure they don't attack us again. we'll do whatever we have to do proportionately to make sure that doesn't happen. >> how big of a threat is north korea to the united states? >> north korea's a threat to the united states because they have nuclear weapons. but north korea's more of a threat to the region. and that's why it's important we work with china if we can because china does not want disruption in their own region when you have a government like north korea that's radical, that's irresponsible, that has a very young adult who's now leader -- a dictator of a country because he inherited this. and he's totally irresponsible. he killed his uncle who coordinated with a lot of these other countries. so north korea's always dangerous. but believe me, the united states can stand up to what we have to do to protect our citizens. >> congressman, thanks very much for joining us. >> okay, wolf.

up next, dealing with the stream of threats from north korea. our experts getting ready to weigh in on how tough the u.s. could get with kim jong-un. at the top of the hour, new details from the investigations into the killings of two new york city police officers.

we're following the latest reports that north korea's internet all of a sudden has gone down. now in "the situation room" to discuss cnn law enforcement analyst tom fuentes, a former assistant director of the fbi. christian whiten, who was a deputy special enjoy for human rights in north korea. our cnn intelligence and security analyst bob baer, former cia operative and retired u.s. general mark hurtling. thank you very much for joining us. general, we heard the president vowing proportional response to this cyber attack on the united states. barbara starr just reported on possible military options. how likely is it that we can see a u.s. military response to what north korea did? >> if you're talking about a

conventional or a special operations force response, i don't think it's likely. although i do know general scott beradi is concerned and put his forces on high alert. but i don't think you're going to see a special operations attack against north korea certainly. >> christian, some sort of extreme military action seems unlikely, i grow. but is there any response that the u.s. can do in order to convince kim jong-un to stop what he supposedly has been doing? >> well, i think a real cyber counterattack could have some benefit or targeting the electrical system in pyongyang. we used nonlethal means in serbia in the '90s. >> but don't you think that the u.s., if they were to engage in

that kind of direct cyber warfare, the u.s. has a lot more to lose in this war than the north koreans do given the technological advances and the dependency on the technology here in the united states. >> that's right. in that sense, we do. but i think at some point, we have to push back. it's not just consequences who's watching this, it's vladamir putin, it's the chinese. if you can get away with a cyber attack on america, there just has to be some consequence. we talked so long, more sanctions on north korea respect going to make a difference. we should it back on the terrorist list. >> bob, when you heard the internet in north korea was down, what was your immediate reaction, what did you think was responsible for that? >> well, the timing, wolf, suggests it was the united states. i can't confirm that, of course. but it would be a warning, a

shot across the bow of north korea. but at the end of the day, even if we did bring it down, it's not enough. my solution always on north korea, and it's always been this way, deal through the chinese. we have to take this to beijing and say look, we cannot have a rogue state in your backyard. you can truly enforce the embargo. we cannot predict what kim jong-un is going to do, but you might, and i would put it in their court, because really they're the ones that can do something about north korea. >> christian, i just want to get back to you for a second. the official white house statement from the national security council was sort of nebulous. they didn't reject it, they didn't confirm it, they just said they're not going to respond. they had a nebulous statement. what do you think? >> i put my money on that we are not responsible for this. i wish we were in a way.

if you're undertaking an attack on a country, you're not going to call them out to fess up to what they did before. also the pentagon making the usual noises about an interagency operation. the fact that the fbi is still in charge of this. there's been no mention of the cyber -- rather than them doing -- them being the target of a u.s. attack themselves. >>io used to work at the fbi, tom. what do you think? >> bob baer is exactly right. china is a key player in this. china has increased its trade with south korea. china absolutely has an interdependency economically with the united states. they're only going to let north korea get out of line so far before they slap down. so working with china is the more likely -- >> some suggested that the

chinese were responsible for taking down north korea's internet. >> possible. >> general hertling, what do you think? >> i know there's about 1,000 protocol addresses in north korea. there are over 1 billion here in the united states. those held in north korea are held by the elite, the governmental agencies and some of these special units that do signer in north korea. this would be a whole lot easier to disrupt their network and services in north korea than it would be any place else. certainly china might have a role in this. but again, i go back to the words of the president. he's looking for a proportional response at the time of his choosing, and it happened immediately after the announcement on friday. >> guys, we'll continue our analysis, continue our reporting. obviously significant developments. tom fuentes, christian whiten, bob baer, general mark hertling, thank you very much for joining us. just ahead, the breaking

news. police across the united states right now, they are stepping up their precautions. and new york's mayor calls for a pause in the protest after the murders of two new york city police officers. inside isis. my interview with a werner who was given behind the scenes access by the jihadists, and he actually h lly lived to tell us happened. i have a cold with terrible chest congestion. i better take something. theraflu severe cold doesn't treat chest congestion. really? new alka-seltzer plus day powder rushes relief to your worst cold symptoms plus chest congestion. [breath of relief] oh, what a relief it is.

happening now. america's top law enforcement officer calls the ambush murder of two new york city police officers an assassination. stand by for more on the breaking news. plus, a major disruption of north korea's internet. is there any link to the cyber attack on sony pictures? new details on that and kim jong-un's brazen threats against the united states. a werner given rare access to isis terrorists on their own turf. stand by for our exclusive interview on why he was allowed in, what he saw, and how he got out alive.

we want to welcome our viewers in the united states and around the world. i'm wolf blitzer. you're in "the situation room." >> this is cnn breaking news. >> let's get right to the breaking news. the attorney general of the united states, eric holder, now condemning the execution style murder of two new york city police officers in the strongest terms, flat out calling it an assassination. new york city officials just released new information about their deaths and about the gunman who killed himself. there's huge concern right now about the safety of police officers nationwide. some big city departments are on alert. they are ordering new security precautions. the congressman who represents the brooklyn area where the two officers were killed is standing by. there he is, along with our correspondents, our analysts. we're covering all the stories. the breaking news happening right now. first, let's get the latest and go to cnn's martin savidge. he's on the streets of brooklyn, joining us right now. martin? >> reporter: wolf, as you point

out, behind us here there is this memorial. it continues to grow. new yorkers here are still in shock and mourning. many felt they had to come here in person just to see this site for themselves. alerts have gone out nationwide. but many are also struck not just by the violence but the question, could it happen somewhere else and they're reminded how divided the leadership is. moments after murder. this video shot from a brooklyn balcony looks down on a street, capturing the frantic efforts saturday afternoon to save the live of two new york police officers shot as they sat in their patrol car. one is in an ambulance. another wheeled across a stunned and shut down street. less than a block away at a subway station, suspected

shoot shooter ismaaiyl brinsley kills himself. at the hospital, officers rafael ramos and wenjian liu both die. the result of what authorities say was an ambush. >> this was a cold blooded assassination like we haven't seen before. >> reporter: the gunfire had barely subsided before the finger pointing began. exposing to a nation what new yorkers already knew. a deep and bitter divide exists between mayor de blasio and new york's police force. as the mayor walked through the hospital after just meeting with the families of the dead patrolmen, new york's finest could be seen turning their backs. the head of one new york police union blamed the mayor directly. >> there's blood on many hands tonight. that blood on the hands starts on the steps of city hall in the

office of the mayor. >> put aside protests. put a i side demonstrations. until these funerals are past, let's focus just on these families and what they have lost. >> reporter: today, the mayor called for an end to protests after his police commissioner said the killings may have been linked. >> it's quite a panic, quite obvious, that the targeting of these two police officers was a direct spinoff of this issue with these demonstrations. >> reporter: on social media, suspect brinsley commented on the deaths of michael brown and eric garner after grand juries in new york and missouri decided not to bring criminal charges against authorities for their killings. he wrote, i'm putting wings on pigs today. they take one of ours, let's take two of theirs. brinsley made that post even as he drove from baltimore bound for brooklyn saturday after earlier shooting his ex-girlfriend. baltimore authorities tried to warn new york police of the

potential danger following brinsley by his cell phone, even transmitting this wanted picture with his poster. ♪ we shall overcome >> reporter: in new york, the warning was about to go out when reports of the shooting came in. there continues to be vigils held throughout the city. there's one going on right now. but there's also talk of protests similar to the ones that were seen in the weeks leading up. despite the mayor's request for a moratorium, it remains to be seen if that will be honored. the first funeral of a fallen officer is expected to take place saturday. wolf? >> martin savidge in brooklyn for us. thank you very much. let's get more on the breaking news. the attorney general of the united states eric holder publicly describing the deaths of those two nypd police officers an assassination. let's bring in our justice reporter evan perez. evan, this is pretty extraordinary for the attorney general to go ahead and say

these two police officers were assassinated. >> wolf, the attorney general is responding because there's been some criticism of him and the department for some of their investigations of police departments around the country. and also for at least in the view of some officers, not giving enough backing, not giving enough support to police officers. today, he had a conference call with activist groups, with civil rights groups to announce a new deputy attorney general sally yates from atlanta. in that call, he said he reminded everyone that his own brother was a former port authority police officer in new york. and described that experience, and he said that it's not possible -- it's not only possible but necessary to have both a responsible dialogue about ways to reduce excessive uses of force, while at the same time condemning threats to law enforcement officers and taking steps to protect cops on the beat. that's one of his concerns now that the rhetoric has gotten out

of control and he wants to make sure people understand he supports the police and also making sure that these families know that he supports them. >> the assassin, the murderer of the officers, ismaaiyl brinsley, he shot and injured his ex-girlfriend. then he drove to new york or was driven to new york, maybe went on a bus, but he got to new york. the baltimore police, they were trying to get some information to the nypd. you're getting new information on how this unfolded. >> right. this was a frantic effort, wolf. about 2:00 in the afternoon, 2:10 is when the baltimore county police department realizes that he's in brooklyn, and they want to make sure that the precinct up there is aware of this. they have a 30-minute conversation, the detective from baltimore is having a conversation with the new york detectives to describe what's on these instagram threats and to make sure they can get this information out to the officers. he sends a fax with a wanted

poster of the suspect, brinsley. less than two minutes later, these officers were dead. it's not clear whether this information could have gotten to the officers in time. >> that was the best technology they had, a fax machine if >> it is a fair criticism of that. the nypd says they're trying to install new ipads and smartphones, giving each officer this technology so that they can get this information more quickly. a lot of times, wolf, officers get this information when they show up for roll call in the morning or the afternoon before their shift starts. >> evan perez, thank you very much. good reporting. let's get more now on the political backlash against the new york city mayor. miguel, we've seen some strong reactions from police. the head of one of the city's largest police unions. tell us what's going on here, because this is really tense. it's no good for anyone that there is this awful relationship right now between the mayor and the cops. >> this is a major city, and

mayor de blasio here is on his back foot, if not under extraordinary pressure from his own police department in an extraordinary situation going on here. the patrolmen's benevolent association, one of several police unions for the new york city police department, their president pat lynch has come out with withering, scathing attacks against mayor de blasio, saying blood is on his hands. they are upset over the way the mayor has handled the protest here over the michael brown shooting in ferguson, missouri, and they have grown after eric garner. the police there were not indicted in that -- the death of that individual either. and those protests have grown angry and sometimes calling for the deaths of police, as well at times. those are the things that they have been most angry about. when the mayor then talked about his own son, the mayor has a mixed race family. when he talked about his own son dahntay and the fact that he

talked to his own son how he should handle the police, that infuriated the police even more. it's just gone to a very bad place here with the rhetoric. unbelievable given the death of two officers like this has occurred. >> the mayor, he and the police had a tense relationship since before he took office. how did that tense relationship begin? >> reporter: this was the stop and frisk issue was a corner stone of mayor de blasio's campaign. he said he wanted to end it. it amounted to racial profiling in this city. at its height in 2011, some 700,000 new yorkers were stopped and frisked under this policy. 80% were black and latino. wolf? >> stand by. i want to bring in congressman jefferies, he represents the area in brooklyn where these two police officers were gunned down, rafael ramos and wenjian liu. congressman, what is it like in your district right now?

it must be awful over there. >> we certainly are a wounded city right now, although we remain resilient. this was a tragedy for the city, tragedy for the country, tragedy for the police department. most importantly, it's a tragedy for the family of officer ramos and officer liu. so the first order of business is making sure that these two heroes are buried with dignity and respect that they deserve, that they are xwiven a hero's sendoff. then we are going to have to come together as a city to prepare the damaged relationship between the police and the community, so that we can make sure that there's an appropriate balance between effective law enforcement. we support the police department, we need the police department, but we also want to make sure there's a healthy respect for the constitution and the civil rights of all communities. >> the police officers, the police union are really angry at a lot of the statements politicians have made. not only the mayor, but the attorney general, even the president and presumably you for

the aftermath of ferguson and staten island, where there seemed to be statements critical of law enforcement. here's clip of an interview you did with our christiane amanpour. i want to give you an opportunity to give context of what you were saying. >> i was really struggling as a father as to what to say to my oldest son in particular about what this verdict or failure to indict means in terms of his everyday interactions on the streets of new york. i was comforted by the fact that i called and he got home safety. and i've got to worry every day about what could happen to him, not just from the robbers, but from a bad apple on the police department. >> it's that kind of statement that police officers are saying -- and it's fair or unfair -- that could have inspired some of these kinds of anti-police rhetoric and actions we saw with this one guy who killed these two police

officers. >> first of all, this was a deranged individual, a coward who engaged in this assassination of these two officers. someone who had a dramatic criminal record in two states. there's no way that this individual should have had a gun. one of the public policy implications of this tragedy is figuring out how to deal with the gun violence problem in america. and i don't think that any criticism of the police department in terms of the few officers that engage in the excessive use of force should be conflated with this tragedy. these officers did not deserve to die. but eric garner did not deserve to die. and clearly there's an issue in terms of equal protection under the law for everyone, which is contained in the constitution and we want to make sure that's brought to light. everybody on both sides of the debate are going to have to conduct themselves in a responsible fashion moving

forward. where there's been heated rhetoric on either side of this issue, as the mayor has urged, everyone needs to restrain themselves, particularly during this period of mourning before these two hero officers are buried. >> after the period of mourning, would you support a rally among your supporters in support of the police in new york city? >> well, in fact, i think on sunday, there are already plans under way that i support and plan to be involved in of several religious leaders coming together with police officers who regularly protect and serve our communities, as well as activists and individuals concerned about instances of excessive use of police force. together, to begin to heal a wounded city. certainly those are efforts that not only i support, wolf, but will be actively involved in moving forward. >> stand by, congressman. we have more to discuss. i want to take a quick break.

we'll discuss what i've never seen before. a lot of other people have never seen before. a sitting mayor goes through a line where police officers are standing and they turn their backs on the mayor of new york city, refuse to even look him in the face. much more with hakim jeffrey, the congressman from brooklyn. we'll be right back. sea captain: there's a narratorstorm cominhe storm narrator: that whipped through the turbine which poured... surplus energy into the plant which generously lowered its price and tipped off the house which used all that energy to stay warm through the storm. chipmunk: there's a bad storm comin! narrator: the internet of everything is changing how energy works. is your network ready?" creeping up on you... fight back with relief so smooth... ...it's fast. tums smoothies starts dissolving

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we're back with congressman jefferies who represent the brooklyn area. the attorney general of the united states, eric holder, is now publicly calling the police officer's deaths assassinations. congressman, do you agree this was an assassination? >> absolutely. it was a cold blooded assassination by a deranged individual who should not have been on our streets, should not have had access to a gun. it's a terrible tragedy. these two officers are the type of individuals that we want on our police force. officer ramos was raised in brooklyn, was raising a family himself in brooklyn. of course, patrolling and protecting the streets of brooklyn. officer liu not only patrolled

the streets of brooklyn but also lived in brooklyn and was preparing to start a family. he had just gotten married two months ago. >> it's so sad, this happened just before christmas. it would have been sad any time, but especially now. our deepest condolences to their families. congressman, do you remember a time ever, i don't remember it, but maybe you do, when police officers turned their backs on a sitting mayor as we saw in new york city this weekend? >> well, it was very surprising to see. i think quite unfortunate. as people on both sides of the political divide have indicated, i believe mayor rudolph giuliani suggested this was appropriate to occur. i understand that emotions are running high, but as the family of officer ramos said yesterday, we need to figure out a way to come together to get through this pain together. and bill de blasio is the mayor. will be the mayor for the next three years. and he's elected to lead us all through this traumatic moment.

we're going to have to brink together rank and file officers though, wolf, in terms of real dialogue with communities of color in particular in the city of new york to have an honest discussion how we can move forward together. >> has the mayor done enough to support and protect nypd officers? >> i think the mayor has arct articulated strong support for the police department. under this mayor, crime is at an all-time low. so the police department continues to do its job and be extremely effective. but we, of course, got to figure out a way to get through these most recent traumas that have aris arisen. >> how worried are you about copy cats, some deranged individuals who can get access to a weapon, and they feel it's a good moment right now to go out and kill a cop? >> that's always a concern. we have to denounce that type of

activity in the strongest possible terms, make sure that everyone is vigilant, not only the police departments, but to make sure every single american is paying close attention, monitoring social media, identifying any possibilities as to individuals who may try to duplicate this heinous criminal activity. but wolf, we also have to deal with the violence problem that we have in america related to guns. we have 5% of the world's population, but 50% of the world's guns. more than 275 million guns are in this country. and since the tragedy in newtown, connecticut, more than 24,000 additional americans have been killed as a result of gun violence. you know, if this doesn't serve as a wakeup call for us to do something about this problem in terms of this cop killer having access to a weapon all too easily, despite his aggressive criminal record, i'm not sure what will wake the country up.

>> hakim jeffreys is the democratic congressman from brooklyn. our deepest condolences to you and everyone in your district over there. how sad to lose these two officers, rafael ramos and wenjian liu. thank you very much for joining us. >> thanks, wolf. let's bring in our panel right now. joining us, the community activist john gaskin, our cnn anchor don lemon, our cnn law enforcement analyst tom fuentes and our cnn legal analyst jeffrey toobin. jeffrey, this is an awful situation. you lived in new york. you know the mood over there. do you remember a time when there this was bad a relationship between a sitting mayor and cops on the street? >> going back to john lindsey. he had a very bad relationship with the police department. but that was a long time ago in the '60s. i think the union leadership of the new york city cops has been totally disgraceful.

the kind of language they're using, saying the blood is on the hands of mayor de blasio is ridiculous. there is nothing that mayor de blasio said that inspired this evil man who killed his girlfriend or shot his girlfriend earlier in the day, this psychotic to kill these two brave police officers. i think the union officials have done nothing but poison the relationship in the city, and i don't think you can blame mayor de blasio for that. >> don lemon, go ahead and react to what we just heard from jeffrey. >> well, you know, listen, i think at this point, i think the congressman was exactly right. everyone should be very careful of their words and we have to ratchet things down instead of up. i can understand that the police department is upset. they just lost two of their very finest. and in a situation that obviously did not have to happen by a deranged man. but everyone should choose their words. the mayor is being criticized

for his words. the police department being criticized for their words, they both are. and i think we have to be very careful at this point. so i'm going to moderate my words and be careful of my words, maybe some things i would like to say, because i would like to ratchet the situation down instead of up. >> we all would. tom fuentes, you used to work at the fbi, and they're worried out there, not only the fbi, but local and state law enforcement. there may be deranged people who heard those chants, tiny numbers in new york city, they heard those chants, what do you want? dead cops. when do you want it? now. they heard that, and they may be inspired to go ahead and kill a cop. >> right. and i don't condone what the union leader said. i thought that was over the top also. but it's more than just the words that have escalated that have caused the police to be angry. the other issue they've talked about is since the protests

began after the garner grand jury decision, the protest in new york, the protests have turned uncreasingly ominous for the police. there's been a gradual ratcheting up of violence. we saw that last week with the punch in the face of the one officer and the two officers that were beaten and had to go to the emergency room. so i think what police are asking for is, what about us? we have to stand out here and are we automatically now punching bags and that's okay? >> john gaskin in the aftermath of ferguson and on staten island, there's been a new movement out there but the deaths of these two police officers, is that going to change what you and so many others have been trying to create? >> i think we should certainly be very careful with the words we're saying as we're out marching and protesting. we certainly don't want to undermine justice, and we certainly don't want to promote any type of behavior that could

turn violent and could cause what we just saw this weekend. i think the gentleman that killed those officers is certainly an outlier for this situation. it appears he had some mental issues there. what we also have to look at is the family of michael brown and the family of eric garner put out statements early on encouraging protests to remain peaceful and encouraging people to not take matters into their own hands, to remember the police officers are people just like we are. and not only do black lives matter, but all lives matter. no life is more valuable than the other. >> tom, you want to react to that? >> yeah, when i heard the family's statements about let's not have violence, it reminded me back when rodney king, following his beating, said, can we all just get along? it kind of, you know, harkening out for let's ratchet down the rhetoric and find a way to get along with each other.

>> jeffrey, there's a new poll out there. half the whites thought the u.s. criminal justice system treated whites and nonwhites equally. are you surprised by this finding? >> not at all. this is the life we live in the united states. and that's really why the garner and brown cases have struck such a responsive chord among so many people, that the experience of black people and white people with the police is very different in this country. it is not anti-police to say that. it is simply factual to say that. raising these issues is not something that should get people criticized. it is certainly not incitement to murder to simply raise these issues. the only murderer in this is a lunatic who had nothing to do with the protesters.

he is an evil, deranged man, and to associate him with the protesters is to demean a reasonable cause. >> you're going to have an extraordinary hour later tonight at 10:00 p.m. on cnn, don. give us a preview. >> it's going to be very emotional. we're going to have four of the rescue workers who tried to save these two officers. when my producer spoke to them, they said if we could still be working on those officers right now, we would be working on them. if you read the accounts, they kept saying i was looking into the officer's eyes and i kept saying come on, officer ramos, stay with me, stay with me. it's very emotional. that these volunteer rescue workers had to go in, some of whom had come off of a call, an unsuccessful cardiac arrest call and then have to go out to save other people. i think everyone understands you can criticize police and not be

anti-police. but i've been in new york city off and on since 1991. i've never seen anyone brazen enough to punch a police officer in the face while cameras are rolling. but for people to be out on the street now, openly punching police officers, people should be out protesting, they have every right. but we need to check ourselves, because you should never punch or harm a police officer. >> and you should never issue some of those threats that they were chanting. a tiny number of the tens of thousands of demonstrators and what they put on the sidewalk, kkk, outside of the police headquarters, that has no place. thank you very much to all of you. just ahead, another breaking story we're watching.

have the tables been turned on kim jong-un? north korea has now suffered a major enter set disruption in the aftermath of its cyber attack on sony pictures. a cnn exclusive coming up with the first werner allowed to report from inside isis territory. why was he allowed to leave alive? i have the worst cold with this runny nose. i better take something. dayquill cold and flu doesn't treat your runny nose. seriously? alka-seltzer plus cold and cough fights your worst cold symptoms plus your runny nose. oh, what a relief it is.

cyber experts now say north korea's internet service has suffered a major disruption. could it be some kind of payback for the cyber attack on sony pictures? this as north korea makes new and brazen threats to attack the united states. our global affairs correspondent elise lavin has the latest information. what are you learning? >> reporter: cyber experts say it could be an attack on north korea's internet systems. tonight, u.s. officials are being very tight lipped about what happened. but they say they are preparing a response to the sony hacking. as the war of words with north korea escalates. kim jong-un mobbed by adoring

north korean workers. lashing out at the u.s. whom he says is responsible for the film portraying his assassination. while denying involvement in the sony hacking, north korea warned it was "sharpening bayonets to do damage thousands of times greater." threatening cou ining counterac against the white house, pentagon and the u.s. mainland. >> they have a long history of denying responsibility, and if they want to help here, they can compensate sony for the damages they caused. >> reporter: today in new york as the u.n. security council took up north korea's bleak human rights record, the u.s. ambassador said pyongyang is threatening the rights of the rest of the world. >> it is exactly the kind of behavior we have come to expect from a regime who threatened to take mersiless countermeasures over a hollywood comedy.

>> reporter: in an exclusive interview with cnn, the president stopped short of labeling it an act of terrorism or war. >> i don't think it was an act of war. i think it was an act of cyber vandalism that was very costly and expensive. we take it very seriously. >> the president does not understand, when you destroy economies, when you are able to impose censorship on the world, especially the united states of america, it's more than vandalism. >> reporter: administration officials say the white house is considering sanctions against north korean officials, banks and companies and wants china to reign in north korea's ability to launch further attacks. today, beijing condemned the attack but said there is no proof north korea was behind it. >> really tough financial sa sanctions are going to have an effect on china too, not just north korea. a lot of these institutions are in china, and the danger there is, it might trigger some sort

of trade war with china. some economic retaliation by them. >> reporter: today, a new poll found nearly half of americans believed sony pictures made the wrong decision to cancel the release of the film "the interview," agreeing with president obama who told cnn this could set a precedent for other dictators around the world to follow in. today, sony executives say they're exploring ways to release the film, perhaps on the internet. >> thank you very much, elise, for that report. let's bring in bob baer and peter beinart. bob, what is the most likely response to north korea? >> i think the north koreans are going to come back at us. the pentagon's taking defensive measures, but it's american businesses that can't defend themselves. they haven't spent enough on

cyber security. the north koreans can hit us when they want and there's not much we can do. and the embargo is already very tight. if the chinese aren't going to step up, our response is very, very limited at this point. >> when the president says there will be a proportional response, what does that say to you, bob? >> i think an attack on the commuters, but that's not going to be enough. remember, the north koreans to be an enormous risk in attacking sony like this. they knew there would be a response and they still did it. at the end of the day, this is an irrational regime and no one in this country can tell you what they're going to do next. >> what kind of response, peter, do you anticipate? >> i think bob makes sense. it's probably likely there will be a response, unless maybe the chinese are pressuring them very strongly not to behind closed doors. i think the united states has

always had trouble responding to north korea's provocations, whether it was its nuclear program or ballistic timissile tests. the united states needs a strategy of political, not military, but political regime change which has to do with trying to find a way of changing the incentive structure for beijing, which is the one country that could bring down the north korean regime if it wanted to. >> are these aggressive actions the rhetoric that we're hearing from north korea, just kim jong-un's way of trying to stay relevant internationally? >> sure. i also think you have a regime that is built whatever legitimacy it has amongst its own people based on the idea that it remains at war with the united states and has to protect its people against a very hostile enemy. i think you see regimes like this tend to often need these

confrontations for domestic legitimacy. the question for the united states is, what could be a long-term strategy of regime change to convince the chinese that the down side of the chaos of this regime falling and their fear of u.s. troops on their border, which is a very significant chinese fear, how could we begin to mitigate that so that we can change the chinese calculation? >> what is your reaction to the north korean internet going down today, bob? >> you know, it's not going to do much. it's not going to make any difference. for all we know, the chinese could have done it. it's not going to affect them at all. did the u.s. cyber command take it down? it's possible. it's a covert action, and they certainly wouldn't announce it and the fact that they have denied it makes me wonder. >> bob baer, thank you very much for that. peter beinart, thanks to you, as well. just ahead, north korea's idea of entertainment.

it's a very serious business. why would isis terrorists allow a werner in their midst and let him leave? exclusive interview coming up right here on cnn. you total your brand new car.

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the massive cyber attack on sony pictures is being blamed on north korea, and the apparent motive is anger over the now canceled movie comedy mocking the dictator kim jong-un. in north korea, comedy is no laughing matter. in fact, it's a very risky business. cnn's kyung lah takes a closer look. ♪ >> reporter: welcome to primetime programming on north korea's only television station. a cartoon explaining how to bomb the enemy. to traditional dance, praising the supreme leader. this is entertainment alla north korean regime. to the western world, all of this is strange. a little twisted, and certainly devoid of any humor. would you have ever made fun of

kim jong-un? i couldn't dare, he says. that's a path to death. kim knows because the defector and now anti-north korean radio host was once a comedy writer for five years with the north korean military. come comedy write? well, sort of. is it dangerous what you can make jokes about? among writers, said kim, the ones executed most often are the comedy writers. go too far in a punchline and it's prison time. often for the entire family. the goal of comedy is not to laugh but another method to enhance loyalty. it is little wonder north korea fails to see the humor in this movie. joking about the supreme leader and killing the character on the

big screen is punishable by death. kim understands why the movie would push north korea to launch a cyber attack. something the regime denies doing. this former comedy writer is now in the unfunny business of reporting news from the outside world, sending it via proxies into north korea. he doesn't joke as he reads about the global crisis surrounding "the interview," because he wants his former homeland to understand the serious consequences of what began as a comedy. kyung lah, cnn, seoul. just ahead, a westerner embedded with isis. you're about to see a cnn exclusive.

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the first westerner granted extraordinary access. the author managed to get out to tell his story. he is with us to tell us how he got in. why he was allowed in, what he experienced. first, this special report.

on the rare and dangerous journey. >> it is an extremely rare glimpse into continuer workings of the most dangerous terrorist organization in the world. german author managed to visit isis territory, both in iraq and in syria. >> they are only 1%. a 1% movement in the islamic world. this 1% movement has the power of a nuclear tsunami. it is incredible. i was so amazed. i couldn't understand this. >> he spent several days in mosul, iraq's biggest city conquered by isis in june. he even visited the mosque where there was a speech earlier this year. he also met with child soldiers. >> how old are you? >> 5. >> i am 13. >> he even managed to get access to a kurdish prisoner in the

hands of the extremists. >> what did they tell you what would happen to you? >> our captor said we have islamic state fighters in prison with the kurdish regional government. you are prisoners here and we will trade you back for our fighters. they didn't say they would kill or slaughter. >> reporter: he says people living in isis controlled areas are in fear of the harsh penalties for infringement of the stringent laws. there is also a single of stability. according to him, fighters say they often manage to defeat much larger armies because they're not afraid to die. >> it took you how many days to conquer? four days. >> we didn't kill 24. we killed a score of them. so they got terrified and ran away. we don't retreat. we only fight and god almighty

will help. they do not have a solid ideology so they ran away. they came to fight for the tyrant, fight for money. >> during battle he learnedle of the isis fighters wear suicide vests, willing to blow themselves up rather than be captured. in one interview, the he tauks about conquering europe. >> it is not a question of wanting. we will. we'll kill 150 million, 250 million, 500 million. we don't care. >> reporter: atrocities they've already committed suggests they're serious about the threats. the visit to the islamic state shows a brutal merciless the group but one that won't go away any time soon. >> joining us now from germany, thanks very much for joining us. what a harrowing story. how did you get isis to allow

you to go inside? why did they trust you in. >> i don't know if they trusted me. i had to find a way to go to the country. i was writing a book and after a certain time i found out that there was no valuable information. so i wrote on 80 facebook addresses of german jeetists and i got 18 answers. and out of 18 answers, i found two and with one of them, he was from i.s. i had discussions during seven months. and in this seven months, i not only discussed with him the problems of this terrorist organization. i also asked him if i could come to this country. and if they would give me a guarantee. and we negotiated this guarantee. at the end i got a guarantee from the office of the cal fath.

the only problem was i didn't know if it was really given by them. this was my risk. i had so many discussions with them that after a certain time i believed and i trusted him. and i was right. they treated me not rightly but correctly. >> there were so many stories of germans who were beheaded, arrested, held, released, some of them if countries or others paid ransom. you must have been scared you would never get out of there. >> of course, i had many fights with my friends. i listened to them. and i have done this several times i met leaders of the taliban. i met al qaeda people. and i have one rule.

when i write something, i try talk to both sides. i met several times assad. i was criticized for that too. and i thought after five meetings with assad, it was time to meet isis. >> now they clearly controlled where you could go. did you have any opportunity to see the lawsuit is per is going on there? we've seen the videos. we've seen the beheadings and the mass graves and the killings that have gone on. i assume they restricted where you could go. >> no. there was not really a restrict. they said you can now go to mosul and i did. and i had certain requests. i want to see certain people. i wanted to see arrested kurdish fighters and i saw them.

but there was a censorship. they controlled all the photos that my son has taken. out of 800 photos, they deleted nine for security reasons can you tell us what those nine pictures showed? >> it showed young foreign fighters. and they didn't want that the families could have problems in the united states and europe. and i met many american fighters. not only from arab origin or from pakistan, i met a guy from new jersey. so it is an incredible movement. and it was for me very difficult to understand this and to, the enthusiasm of the young fighters. this is something i've never seen in war zones and i have been in many war zones. i've never seen such an

enthusiastic movement like i.s. and there is other thing. we underestimate this terroristic movement. they are much stronger than we think. they have now conquer ad territory with the area which has the area of great britain. even bigger than u.k. it is really huge. >> you got out alive. that's an amazing piece of work that you did. thanks very much for joining us. i assume we'll continue our conversations down the road. we appreciate it very much. the and i'll be back later tonight. 8:00 p.m. eastern. i'm filling in for anderson cooper. and don't forget, 10:00 p.m. eastern, don lemon will have a special interview with the four rescue work here's tried to save the nypd police officers who were gunned down in their squad car.

remember, you can always follow us on twitter. please be sure to join us tomorrow in the situation room. you can dvr the show so you you can dvr the show so you won't miss a moment. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com the man who assassinated two new york city police officers. what he was doing in the hours before the shooting. and police nationwide on high alert for copycat attacks as authorities investigate at least 15 online threats against new york police. and north korea's the internet goes dark across the nation. is this a responsible to the sony attack? let's go "outfront." a good monday evening to all of you. we begin with breaking news. assassination. at