7-6. that's her 14th grands slam title title. congrats to her. more of "the news room" straight ahead with poppy harlow. this is cnn breaking news. you're in the cnn news room i'm poply harlow breaking news this afternoon, the late whitney houston's daughter was found unresponsive in a bathtub full of water. police say that bobbi kristina brown, 21 years old, was not breathing when her husband and friend found her this morning in a home outside of atlanta. it is a disturbing echo of her mother's tragic death almost three years ago. whitney houston was found face down in a bathtub in the hilton hours before she was set to attend a pre-grammy party. whitney houston accidently drowned in 12 inches of water, and her death blamed in part on years of cocaine abuse.

we are covering every angle of the breaking story getting new developments as we speak, and the reaction to a new chapter in the houston family saga. let's beginning with nick valenci aerks valencia outside the hospital in atlanta where kristina is being treated. what can you tell us about bobbi kristina's condition, nick? >> caller: we showed up awhile ago in rosj well 45 miles north of atlanta. here at the hospital very little activity. i walked inside to inquire, of course because of strict hipa laws i got no information, and they actually asked me to leave the premises so we are waiting to hear back and we have requested information as far as the condition as far as bobby kristina and so far, we do not have more information, and just a recap, she was found at 10:25

this morning in her home by a her husband and friend. the husband and friend did atent to revive her using cpr techniques until the paramedics arrive, and she was reportedly brought here afterwards to north filton hospital and we are waiting to try to get an update on her condition. >> and, nick we have imnotwithstandings that right now we're working to get up for the viewers, bringing them as soon as we can, images taken as recently as late last night, obviously, but this unfolded at 10:30 a.m. as soon as we have them, we'll bring this to you. nick a lot of people are talking about any potential substance involved in this obviously, there was a lot of talk about whether she had struggled a little bit with drug use. look, this is a 21 -year-old girl here. we've all been in our 20s. we don't. to jump to assumptions here. are you hearing anything on that front? >> caller: well there's wide

spret speculation, else in 2012, there was a brief reality show, which was the look that she was dabbling in drug use or alcohol abuse, that of course we cannot confirm, and it was just speculation. you mentioned pictures she was active on social media, especially instagram, and according to the instagram, she posted a photo just a selfie at 2: 2:00 a.m. this morning, so we don't know the details or what may have led to her being found unresponsive. we know though that she was found in a similar situation that her mother was, which is, as you mentioned poppy, echoing a very uncomfortable time for family and friends, and people are concerned, especially in the atlanta area that the father and mother whitney houston and bobby brown, very high profile and prominent musicians in their time and many people here in the community are well aware of the issues that the family has

faced in the past which led to a lot of speculation, but officially, no word exactly what led to bobbi christina's current condition. we are waiting to hear back from the hospital and as soon as we do we'll bring you those details, poppy. >> all right, nick valencia thank you so much. standby. let's bring in don lemon and joey jackson. you know the family well a lot of sources learned about this this morning as we have. what do you know at this point? >> caller: well we know that police did do life saving measures on the scene to get her to breath and, again, as nick has been reporting, she's in the hospital. yeah, we know that it's been -- i don't want to call it speculation, but has been in the media that has been reported she has issues with drugs, and the family eluded to that as well. it's not a secret, and we keep

dancing around the issue and around the issue of it's just a coincidence about the bathtub. coincidences like that do not usually happen. for your mother to have died in the bathtub with 12 inches of water, and you to be found in the bathtub with water, i mean, that is, you know let's be just honest about that. she has been dealing with some issues and it's been publicly dealt with and she's been in the spotlight all her life having to deal with that and so i -- i would assume in listening to the family and to sources that michelle turner reports to as well has been talking to as well that she's going through some things and sadly, she's going through it publicly. i don't know if it's an attempt on her own life. i don't know if this was drug related, but the odds that she's found in the bathtub and her mother in the bathtub and it's a coincidence, that just does not happen. >> don, stay with me. i want to bring in joey jackson.

she was found unresponsive in the bathtub. we don't know if she's breathing on her own or with a ventilate e but sources have been telling us that she is breathing, but we don't know if it's on her own or not. >> thank goodness. >> this is the selfie that nick talked about from bobbi kristina's instagram account taken last night in the red sweater at 2:00 a.m. eastern time. we're told selfie like we take and post on instagram, and can't read a lot from the picture, but that is the most recent image that we have of her, again, she was found at 10:30 a.m. eastern time this morning, just about eight and a half hours later by her husband and a friend in the bathtub. joey jackson, to you, as the investigation is in the early stages what are they looking at now? >> toxicology toxicology toxicology. first things first, we hope and pray she's okay and resolves itself in a positive way. as you look at the investigation

and determine what if anything happened to her and whether there's instances of abuse of drugs, we just don't know. certainly, as she's in the hospital toxicology tests examine what was the nature of the bloodstream and what, if any, substances were in the blood. it was february 11th, poppy, of 2012 of course whitney houston unfortunately died and so was it a coincidence that occurred? was she, you know, mentally perhaps having depression as a result of that? don't want to speculate. certainly don't know. the investigation will include all of that but most critical is what if anything was in the bloodstream. >> don, to you. can you talk about the relationship between a younger 21-year-old and a whitney houston. how close were they? >> as close as a mom and daughter could be. as i go back to recall images of houston during the grammy festivities back in 2012 there

was barely a picture with bobby kristina not in it with her mother. she was at the nightclub with her night, last night, she went to the nightclub and went back to the hotel. she was at the hotel with her mom. she was staying with her mother at the hotel the night that she died and went out to eat or went to shop or something, and then came back to the hotel, and that's when he mom had passed away. she could not get near her mother. the security at the hotel and police officers would not let her near the room. she became very sup jetupset was taken to the hospital that night and given sedatives and was on medication after that even during the funeral because she was so upset, so very close relationship with her mom. as i said. >> don, what do we know about her husband? she recently married a man named nick gordon but this was a man incredibly close to the family lived in the household while

bobbi kristina was growing up there. >> yes. he lived in the household. it was a family friend. they looked upon this young man as, you know, called him a cousin, right, or like a brother. people became concerned because they were -- they thought they were being intimate and developing a relationship. as it turns out, they were and they ended up getting married. the family has also been concerned about the relationship. that maybe he you know has some sort of power or influence over her they would rath eer him not have. >> doto you, joey jackson, you were here for hours covering the death of whitney houston. you look at this and good news is sources tell reporters here she is breathing, but look at this, think all this 21-year-old girl has gone through, losing her mother and all the pain

with that -- >> that's a lot. >> being in the spotlight, what do you think? >> it's a lot, poppy. growing up in the environment like that, having the mother be the star she was, and the dad, of course k being the star he is it's a lot to stomach. again, we don't know what, if any, ailment she suffered from was she getting help substances taking or not taking was it an accident? i think as the investigation unfolds, we'll learn. it's frustrating at this point, but, you know again, we hope and pray she's okay. we know kpapd to her mom. we don't want that to happen to her. >> our thoughts with her and her entire family. we'll keep you, of course updated on the stoifr. don lemon, thank you, and joey jackson, and nick at the hospital throughout the evening bringing us developments. we'll focus on other headlines. a startling number of gitmo detainees return to the life of extremism. despite that the outgoing defense secretary says he felt

pressure pressure from the white house to release more and to do it quickly. his exclusive interview with our barbara star coming up. you are so outta here! aah! [ female announcer ] the complete balanced nutrition of great-tasting ensure. 24 vitamins and minerals antioxidants and 9 grams of protein. [ bottle ] ensure®. nutrition in charge™.

well a freed gitmo detainee traded for sergeant beau bergdahl may have tried to reconnect with the taliban, i'm talking about the so-called taliban five. you remember the images five former gitmo detainees released months ago for exchange sergeant beau bergdahl held prisoner by the taliban, that american citizen. the troublesome revelation comes as we had an exclusive interview with chuck hagel who said there was clashes over the pace of the releases for other detainees. listen.

>> i have made it clear that i will not certify or sign anything to release a detainee as long as i'm secretary of defense unless i am convinced that it is in the best interest of the country and the substantial mitigation and risk condition verified as closely as we can verify. >> you brought it up you said it no everyone at the white house agrees with you. >> uh-huh. >> tell us more. >> well i think the press has been very clear on that and i think -- >> let's hear it in your own words. have you -- >> what i said is what i just said. not everyone at the white house agrees with me. >> on what precipice? >> probably on the pace of releases. >> because you've been cautious? >> because i had the responsibility and i play my own game here and that is because by law i am the one, the one official in government charged with certification of releasing detainees. i take that responsibility very

seriously. >> let me bring in republican congressman ed royce, chairman of the house committee on foreign affairs. thank you for being here sir, appreciate it. >> thank you, poppy. >> just your and reaction to what chuck haiggel said there. >> he's trying to protect u.s. servicemen. we know that 30% of those who have been released so far have ended up back on the battle feel and, of course the targets are americans, and so in is -- this is a case where the defense department is pushing back the pentagon saying no no this is very risky, but the white house wants to close guantanamo bay, of course and to do that they have to transfer prisoners out of there, and they do it without an end to hostility. >> it's important to tell the viewers the number you're talking about is from the september semiannual report from the director of national

intelligence which did, indeed find a 17% of the 620 guantanamo detainees released returned to military activity, 12% suspected of doing -- >> i have to correct you. >> that's what the report said. >> 12 % are evidence from a sing the source they returned to hostilities, and the remainder from multiple sources. they have returned. it's 30% returned. >> right. either way you cut it it's astonishing. >> right. >> you said the exchange of five taliban members from gitmo for sergeant beau bergdahl you called it a lousy deal. what do you do instead? >> poppy, first of all, to negotiate directly with terrorists something the united states tried to avoid. in a case like this where the taliban is still waging war, i think you have to continue to

hold them. think for a minute about who we released here. this is the defense minister, this was the individuals that were responsible for the single worst atrocity against civilians in afghanistan, 5,000 minorities slaughtered, women raped, sold into slavery, to put these men into custody in qatar where they are only going to be under observation for a year is to risks the fact that after that year is over most i believe, will return to the battlefield and will continue to target americans. it is not a good precedent to set. >> so what because when you also look at this report from september, it also says that the majority of those released that returned to militant activity were released under the bush administration. this happened in the previous as

mrgs as well administration as well. the question is what do you do then? not close guantanamo bay? keep them there? what other government can we trust? >> but we're looking now at those at highest risk the five that we've mentioned here yes, part of the taliban, but they had close ties to al qaeda. we're at high risk. my argument is against releasing those who are high risk because they are not only the most likely to come back into the fight, but they are the most capable once they are back into battle to be able to inflict major damage on u.s. forces or on our allies and that's why i call into question this strategy and i think you can already see by the con numb drum that it's put jordan in that was it was a bad precedent to set. i'll say this. as long as the u.s. and the u.k. resisted compromise with

terrorists or pay inging ransom to terrorists we were in a strong position. it was not switzerland or france trying to take kaptds in order to play them right in. >> running out of time but to say it clearly, saying do not release them keep guantanamo bay open and keep them there indefinitely? >> highest risk keep at guantanamo bay until we can resolve the struggle with the taliban, and i would suggest that with both the pakistani government at war with the taliban and with the taliban at war with us and with the afghan government we should not be releasing their senior leadership. >> but guantanamo be bay is the reason terrorists use to wage jihad against western nations. >> i heard the president say that. i do not believe that's the reason they wage terror against us the fact we hold them in captivity. i believe they wage a terror war

against us because they want to create and want people only to believe their way, they jihadist ideology ideology and that's why they kill minorities and target the west. >> good to have you on the program, thank you. >> thank you, poppy. just 15 years ago, it looked like measles was a disease that was no more in the united states. now more states are reporting a number of cases in a fast moving outbreak. how did this happen? how dangerous is it? we'll talk with the head of the national institute of allergy and infectious diseases next.

the measles outbreak spread to at least 14 states, and it is growing. health officials say a student in barred college in upstate new york has the disease and may have exposed other people to it because he took a train from here in new york city to niagara falls. most have been vaccinated and most are vaccinated as a child. also bard set up a measles vaccination clinic to be safe. our media correspondent, elizabeth cohen, shows how fast they spread and how it's not just con they yous jous but it can be deadly. >> if someone has the measles, 90% of the people close to them also get the measles if they

have not been vaccinated. you don't have to be in the same room as someone with measles to get it. if they were in the room an hour or two before you, it's lurking in the air, and you can get it. when they get measles, it's a sore throat runny nose pink eye, and then the rash begins. it starts at the hairline and moves down from there. it's red. it's itchy. now, most people recover from measles and are fine but some get terrible complications. they can get pneumonia, have brain damage and for every 1,000 people who guess measles, two or three will die. the center for disease control recommendations children are vaccinated between 12 and 15 months and get another dose at 4 and 6 years old. most of us have been vaccinated against measles, but there's a set of people not vaccinated. babies under the age of one are not routinely vaccinated and

those with cancer they can want get vaccinated either. all of us get vaccinated to protect them and that's what's called herd up munty. right now, the outbreak is centered on california and western states. however, it could spread across the country because people travel. people might not even know they have been infected with measles. get on a plane, come to another state. >> all right, elizabeth cohen, this is our guest, director of the national institutes of allergy and infectious diseases. thank you for joining us, doctor. what stands out to me and is troubling is the disease is so preventable, the vaccine is incredibly effective. >> that is correct. of all the vaccines we have against any illness, any virus, measles is one of the most effective. as you mentioned on the piece, measles is also one of the most contagious viruses we have and there are serious potential complications with it and when you put all of those ingredients

together it's unfortunate that we don't make completely universal use of the vaccine in those people who can take the vaccine. that's really very frustrating because this could be avoidvoidable. >> talking about this, it's an important point, right, talking about ebola, we emphasize the fact this is not airborne. you need direct contacts with someone to catch it. not the case with the measles. >> no. >> this can be airborne for hours, and you can still get it. >> it's the e pitmy of airborne insfex infections. some confuse diseases as being airborne. this is truly airborne. if they sneeze or coughs it gets in there and just floats around, literally for up to two hours. it's the interesting situation where you could go into a room after someone walks out of the room and coughed and sneezed, and you can get infected. again, another reason why it's so important to be vaccinated. >> so i wonder if you think

there should be mandatory isolation for the people that are now known across 14 states 84 people to have measles. here's the thing. children under 12 months cannot get the vaccine. so they still have to be out and about, at doctor checkups et cetera, making them incredibly vulnerable. >> first of all, the recommendations are, certain, if you have measles, you need to be in a situation where you don't infect others where you could isolate, and if you have exposed or potentially exposed todocumented measles you need a 2 1 day period not to expose to others. but children with measles are contagious four days before they get the rash and four days after they get the rash. >> 63% of the people with measles now in the outbreak are older than 20. can adults get the vax teen and it works just as effectively? >> oh certainly. for example, if someone who is not been vaccinated they can

get vaccinated and the recommendation particularly if you're going to be in a situation where you might get exposed, it's a two-part vaccination. you get vaccinated one time and then if you're an adult, you should get the second one no sooner than 25 days after the first. as you mentioned correctly, when you vaccinate your children the first vaccination is 12 to 15 months of age. followed by one, and then four to six years old. those not vaccinated are clearly vulnerable and that's why you see adults either not vaccinated or in some individuals, the immunity wanes so that after several decades, you may get waning of immunity the reason why you see some adults in the cohort of people who have been infected. >> dr. anthony, thank you for the expertise, appreciate it. >> you're welcome. >> a quick break. we'll be right back. above all...is health. so we quit

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when the patriots take the field for tomorrow's big game the super bowl, their former star tight end, aaron hernandez seen here scoring the touchdown the last time they were in the super bowl he be not even be able to watch the game this year because he remains behind bars and fighting for freedom right now in a massachusetts courtroom. his murder trial is underway. hernandez and two alleged a accomplices charged with killing oden lloyd. the prosecution and defense laid out cases, gave opening statements. talk about the trial that captured the nation's attention, and joining me now is don lemon and joey jackson, and, guys thank you for being here. let me go to you first, danny. opening statements who made the better case? >> totally difference cases for each side.

for the prosecution, they have a strong circumstantial case. the defense gave a lot of information about the theory of the case in the openings. first, when you have a difficult case as on the defense, you fall back on old tried and true tactics. they did just that. with what i like what they used was the police in this case they focused in and once they focused in on the one defendant, they ignored all the other information and evidence and maybe a bad guy got away. the other the defense focused on which was effective or ultimately not effective is the whole it does not make sense. why a guy everything going for him do something so dumb? it's a variation of the -- this was such a stupid crime, how -- who would do something so dumb? anyone agrees from a planning perspective, this was not a well executed crime. >> so to you, joey the defense got a boom by things thrown out not admissible in court.

one, a key message from the man murdered saying who he was with. >> well, it just said n. nfl. >> pieces were thrown out, rightfully so. the defense wanted to exclude that. they got their wish. the prosecution did this saying look what was the motive here? why do it? because oden lloyd knew about two murders he committed in 2012 and would have said something. guess what? the judge said you are not to talk about the 2012 murders. >> alleged. >> allege murders. reason being because it's propensity evidence. do you think the jury would give a fair trial knowing he may be involved in two other murders? that was excluded. in addition to that he's sued by alexander bradley for allegedly shooting him in 2013 in february -- >> in the face, right? >> in the face.

the jury will not hear that. what else? there was ammunition seized from the home .45 caliber, matching the ammunition found add the scene excluded from evidence and also a picture of him, aaron hernandez, with a gun.45 call ler from 2009 excluded as well. just like the one he's carrying after the crime in his home. the defense did a great job of leveling the playing field here to make it a fair fight. >> you've been watching this play out because it's all on television. >> i think it's amazing in the sense that when we -- we in the court of public opinion, right, the people at home and journalists, we see everything. we see open shut case body near the home the videotape, of course that's a gun. he tried to scrub his -- the security system and the cops got it off the security system. to me, it's -- it's interesting sitting by as a bystander watching this if i'm in the courtroom and don't know all the things as you have been saying

then it's not as open and shut as you think. also, being inside the courtroom with the mom and then the two sisters on opposite sides. that's really -- i mean, in is a courtroom drama unlike any other. >> for ten weeks. >> on the jury, by seeing the parents, the mom walking out, based on things she sees. >> the judge has to watch that. in the category of courtroom antics, that could affect a jury. the judge has to watch behavior by family members. >> exactly. >> the jury is reacting to that. >> and tonight we have the special downward spieshl on aaron hernandez at 11:00 p.m. thank you. more to talk about this hour and throughout the evening. quick break, back in a moment. t in shape. not to be focusing again, on my moderate to severe chronic plaque psoriasis. so i finally made a decision to talk to my dermatologist about humira. humira works inside my body to target

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announcer ] over 100,000 businesses have already used zip recruiter and now you can use zip recruiter for free at a special site for tv viewers; go to ziprecruiter.com/offer5. breaking news just into cnn. sorry to tell you about this as we welcome our viewers all around the world and here right in the united states. the islamic extremist group isis now claiming the japanese man they were holding hostage is dead. and that they followed through on their promise to be head him. his name kenji goto 47 years old, a journalist. he and another contractor captured late last year by isis and isis killed the other man and threatened to take the life of goto and apparently they

have. the mill tonights changed demands from money, and instead, they said they want a prisoner swap just a short time ago, isis did release a video clip that appears to show the violent death, beheading of kenji goto. we'll go straight to will ripley following the story from the beginning live in tokyo. this is disturbing news exactly what every, will hoped would not happen. the wife of the man pleading the japanese government the jordanians working on a deal and in the end, it did not happen. >> caller: yeah poppy, this is japan waking up to devastating, although sadly not surprised news as we approach 6:00 a.m. here. people here have been afraid of this ever since the first isis video came out featuring kenji goto and yukawa. when japan did not pay the ransom and the deadline passed

the country braced for a video like this. when goto appeared alive holding the photo of yukawa it was, of course devastating for the death of one japanese citizen, but there was a considerable amount of hope that because isis had decided to keep goto alive, perhaps it would not end like this and now we see, sadly, it has. >> and, will we are not showing the viewers the video. it is isis propaganda and we're not going to show it but i wonder what you know what you glean from it in the early going why they decided now to ultimately give up on those negotiations it appears nay were going on with jordan for the prisoner swap and ultimately behead goto. >> caller: unlike the other videos which strayed away from the typical isis propaganda style, we believe that the executioner in the video is the voice with a british accent so

familiar to many and like other previous isis videos it shows -- does not show the actual beheading itself it cuts away as the knife approaches. hard to say those words, poppy, because you think about his wife his wife just a day ago, who finally broke her silence. i can only imagine how devastating this is for her and her family goto's mother who's been speaking to reporters so many times over the last week. i think what makes this so stunning and shocking poppy, beyond the propaganda and beyond the fact that you know there's a whole discussion happening about isis and what needs to happen now, but people in japan feel like they knew kenji goto so many friends in the journalism community and coverage for the past week has people have learned about him, learned about his trips to war

zones, to report about the plight of women and children and his compassion for people who were suffering and his fairness and so people you know while initially were perhaps less sympathetic because these two men chose to go in dangerous territory, they grew to really feel a connection with kenji goto and root for him as they heard from his mother and wife. gosh it's just terrible. >> so glad you bring that up. because in is a man really renown journalist there who left japan, could have reported anywhere else in the world, and he maid the choice to go there to tell the stories of syria refugees of children of innocent people suffering under the regime suffering from the civil war that's raging in that country, and he said interestingly, will he was not concerned about safety going to syria because he was japanese. according to a friend he said

i'm not american, i'm not british. i'm japanese, i can go. look what happened to him. stay on the line with me, will, live from tokyo. let's go straight to our reporter in aman tracking this. when you look at what the jordanian government was doing, unlike the united states they were willing to discuss this prisoner swap for a female convicted terrorist, a woman name blowing up a hotel taking 60 lives six years ago. they were willing to -- it seemed consider giving her back in exchange for the jordanian pilot that isis is holding hostage and this japanese citizen, kenji goto. where did this fall apart? >> reporter: well what seems to have happened poppy, what we saw earlier this week a few days ago with the last recording that came out, demanding the

senior jordanian government produce her to the border by thursday and the jordanian government at that point said they were not going to do this. they said their priority has been their pilot, saying they needed proof of life. something they say for weeks they have been getting and asking for through indirect negotiations through indirect channels they have been having to secure his release, and the jordanian government said they did not receive that and insist insisted on the position. when asked about the fate of kenji goto the risks he was in if jordan did not provide her to isis the response was, yes, goto was patientrt of the negotiations, but for the jordanians their priority is their own citizens the pilot. they would have come under criticism if they handed over this woman who many jordanians see as part of what they described at the time as the 9/11 of jordan and they were

willing to give that up. a lot of jordanians backed the government saying they were happy to see her go as long as it meant their own captive, the jordanian pilot returned. it would have been very difficult for the senior danon government to explain it to their people if the jordanian pilot had not returned. it's important to mention at this point, there's no news about her at this stage, poppy. >> we know the fighter jet went down months ago over raqqa and taken hostage, but have not heard of his fate at this point in time. thank you for that. standby. peter, to you. what does this tell you? i mean isis was asked repeatedly for proof of life of the pilot in order to get their -- to him back and now

they executed the journalist kenji goto. >> the lack of proof of life is disturbing on the jordanian pilot. how do you have a negotiation on the issue without proof of life? you know, every time isis produced one of these we've found unfortunately except in one case which is the british journalist they've eventually been executed. it seems that their willingness to negotiate is really very very limited. and we saw that at the beginning of this poppy with the demand for $200 million. that's just a completely unreasonable demand that was never going to happen. when we've seen hostage exchange we've seen numbers in the sort of low several million dollars at most. so no government was ever going to kind of agree to that. so it raises a big question poppy. i think we still have an american female who a 26-year-old aide worker being held by isis. we still have a british hostage held by isis. there may well be others.

what is their fate? the only i think good thing that has come out of this -- it's difficult to say good thing -- there is one thing that has come out of this that is new, poppy, which is that we have -- seem to have a way to speak to isis that we didn't have before. we have been -- there was an american journalist called theo curtis who was being held by al qaeda in syria. he's free. he's back in the united states. and there was basically it was the qatari government that facilitated his release. there may be some way in to speak to isis. of course they haven't been shown to be rational negotiators. but now we have some form of communication with them that we didn't have in the past. >> so on that point, peter better again, thank you. stay with us. chris voss to you now, a former fbi hostage negotiator. these lines of communication were open. there was some hope. but without that proof of life did isis simply give up and say we're going to yet again do

something as brutal as gruesome as barbaric as this just to show them meet our demands immediately or else? >> well first of all, i think the lines of communication have always been there behind the scenes. i'm not sure whether they're trying to cover up they didn't have the ability to comply with the negotiations. to me it's a little bit more of a temper tantrum based on people of an inability to negotiate as opposed to being irrational or not being able to -- >> good point. a lot of us have been asking here and talking about can isis even be trusted to negotiate with. >> i think they can. i think they're eminently predictable. it's been my business in hostage negotiators business for a long period of time. the reason we engage in these communications is to understand

what they look like when they're telling the truth, what they look like when they're lying. everybody has a set of rules. and once you learn how to navigate the other side's rules, that's how you beat them at their game. instead of trying to get them to navigate within your rules. that's the first step for dealing with isis. i think jordan did a good job here actually. >> bob bair to you, what is your take on this? it was just last weekend we were discussing this. there was hope that some deal would be reached so that kenji goto could be released. to you, bob >> they are described as unpredictable in the sense they can be very reasonable for long periods of time and sound calm. and for no apparent reason they'll just flip out. and they'll do what we would consider things that are psychotic and not in their interests. you have to keep in mind their

execution of these hostages over the last year or so has alienated them so much from the west that it's costing this many lives. i mean i don't think we would be as engaged in iraq and syria if it weren't for these executions. so at the end of the day, they may think they're rational but in fact they're not. they are just bringing down this movement much more quickly. >> to you, tom fuentes, what do you think this does if anything in terms of changing the game in this what has become a protracted battle against isis and the best way to fight and defeat isis? because now it is all too common that we are having to bring this news that yet another hostage, whether it is an american a british citizen, now a japanese citizen, being beheaded by isis. >> well we have to look at what is their real goal in the whole situation, poppy, from the time that they had the japanese hostages as well as the jordanian pilot. and what i mean by that is when

they put the demand out for $200 million, that wasn't a serious demand. but what they've gotten and i think did meet their goal completely was they've got the whole world to become very sympathetic to the japanese hostages particularly the last one, kenji goto. the whole nation of japan to learn to revere this man and root for him and hope for him. so they commanded the world stage, the worldwide media all this time. and when they got tired of it they killed him. and they got what they wanted. they got nonstop attention and coverage. we think it was irrational. but on the other hand from their point of view possibly very rational. >> tom fuentes, stand by. i want to go to aaron mcpike our white house correspondent in washington, d.c. let me read this statement we got from nse spokesperson bernadette nilan "we have seen the video purporting to show

that japanese citizen kenji goto has been murdered by the terrorist group is irk l. we stand in solidarity with our ally japan." >> are we hearing anything else out of washington? >> reporter: poppy, i would point out the national security council put out a very similar statement last weekend. obviously this is news to the white house as well. what i would say is because this video is somewhat different than some the videos we've seen in the past you can be sure that intelligence officials and other defense department officials as well will be really looking for what kind of clues they can glean from this. we've been talking for the past couple of months about how the defense department is saying they're having a lot of success with the air strikes and fight against isis happening in iraq and syria. obviously it hasn't stopped these executions but maybe with this new video they can get a little bit more from those details. i'd also point out in the last week president obama has spoken with the prime minister of

japan, and obviously they'll be working closely with the japanese building a bigger coalition here to see what more they can do to stop these executions and stop isis from some of these actions. >> absolutely. aaron mcpike, stand by for us in washington. i want to get back to jurmana krachi. this is the wife of hostage who has just been beheaded japanese citizen kenji goto speaking out just yesterday. listen. >> my husband and i have very young daughters. our baby girl was only three weeks old when kenji left. i hope our oldest daughter who is just two will get to see their father again. i want them growing up knowing their father. my husband is a good and honest man who went to syria to show the plight of those who suffer. i believe kenji may have been

also trying to find out about haruna yukawa's situation. i was extremely saddened by the death of haruna and my thoughts go out to his family. i know all too well what they are going through. >> that was the wife of kenji goto just yesterday. let me go to jurmana krachi in ahman, jordan. >> reporter: poppy, there are lots of questions here about that demand for the release that isis had put out for the release of saw gee da alarysajida al-rishawi. they were questioning whether it was more to try to embarrass the jordanian government and put pressure on this government that is seen as one of the greatest enemies of isis in this part of the world here locally of course there was a lot of pressure on the government there was a lot

of concern that if sajida al-rishawi was not released if jordan did not comply with that and the jordanian pilot had been executed there will some sort of trouble in this country because of the tribe that the jordanian pilot came from and the pressure the government was under to do this. but also because of its relations internationally with japan, for example, putting jordan in that very, very tough situation over the past 10 days or so. because japan did set up a crisis center here in jordan when that $200 million demand first came out by isis for the two hostages. japan sent its highest level delegation here with the deputy foreign minister. they set up a crisis center. they were trying to juice jordan as a regional headquarters to try to coordinate whatever efforts there were to secure the release and negotiate. and it does seem this is a feeling here one of the things isis was trying to do possibly here is to embarrass jordan by asking for something that the country could not really

deliver, and really sabotage its relations with japan and other countries internationally. >> thank you very much for your reporting on this tonight and throughout. stand by. wie going to continue to cover this here on cnn. the tragic breaking news. let me reset this all for our viewers. breaking news here on cnn. i'm poppy harlow. 4:00 eastern. we begin with breaking tragic news. the latest development to the hostage situation overseas. the islamic extremist group isis releasing a video a short time ago that appears to show the beheading of a japanese man, a journalist they were holding captive. officials in tokyo and in washington are working to confirm the authenticity of the video that isis claims is 47-year-old kenji goto being killed. he and another japanese man were captured in syria late last year. they were shown alive together by isis first as a ransom demand isis demanding $200 million for their