been above reproach. this first family has brought no disrepute to the white house, and real patriots voice opinions based on substance, not smears. thank you so much for joining me. please don't forget you can follow me on twitter if you can spell smerconish. see you next week. you're in the "cnn newsroom." i'm suzanne malveaux in for poppy harlow. details coming in to cnn for from the multinational war against isis. kurdish officials in northern iraq now confirming a battle between isis fighters and peshmerga units just southwest of irbil. now, this battle did not end well for isis. we are told at least 34 militants were killed and kurdish forces now fully control the city and the surrounding area as well. elsewhere in iraq isis is

parading its trophies after overtaking a military base that was supplied and equipped with u.s. military weapons and vehicles. this video emerged just a few hours ago showing american-made armored transports humvees, and automatic weapons in the hands of isis fighters. u.s. military officials are not yet sure when or where that video was shot. also this weekend the u.s. military is discussing strategy and how they're going to support an iraqi military mission to liberate the iraqi city of mosul where between 1,000 and 2,000 isis fighters are believed to be dug in. the new u.s. defense secretary isn't committing to a timetable, but iraq's prime minister said this week they expect to launch an assault on mosul in the coming months. michael weiss is joining us here. he wrote the book "isis: inside the army of terror." despite isis' setback today, they have been able to run roughshod over iraqi troops

notably in mosul, where iraqi forces basically laid down their weapons and ran away last year. michael, what would make it any different when we project in the mos ahead that this is going to be a different kind of scenario? >> yeah. i don't believe this current timetable that's being floated of april and may there's going to be a massive offensive to retake the city. fist and foremost the u.s. says it will need 25,000 iraqi soldiers to do this mission. we've trained about 3,400 of them. that's assume ones we've trained are going to do their jobs better than the ones we trained who then abandoned mosul in june of 2014. added to which the people who are the vanguard fighting forces on the ground in iraq is two -- shia militia groups popular mobilization committees and the peshmerga. the peshmerga are will protect the kurdish areas of northern iraq might go into eastern mosul where there are kurdish communities. are they going to go house to house, street by street in sunni enclaves where isis is dug? in no. i have talked to government

officials and they tell me you have another thing coming here. >> so they're not going to do it. the iraqis we're not confident yet, u.s. officials not confident they'll be able to handle the job. how important is it for the international forces, the coalition to step in and do more if they really are going to make a difference when it comes to isis? >> i don't even know where to begin with that. the kurds need more and better weapons. one official says what they're using is ridiculous going back to world war ii-era rifles against isis running around with u.s. materiel. but the kurds are good fighters formidable. what did we do in 2004 when we retook fallujah? you had u.s. marines, i forget how many combat bring bri gads go into that city after it had been bombarded back into the stone age. there were civilian evacuation teams, things like that. i see no logistical capability on the part of baghdad to do anything remotely like that. the u.s. can bomb the hell out

of mosul. i doubt they will because a lot of civilians would be killed. the problem is there's no credible intersaysry ground military force in that country right now. >> how damning is it to the iraqi forces even for the sake of symbolism and propaganda that they see this video from isis that shows american-made weapons that used to be p their power, in their hands, now to the enemy's hands, not to mention iraqi bodies allegedly on that video? they're looking at that. what kind of psychological warfare is going on before the battle takes place? >> psychological information warfare is isis' greatest assets in this campaign. they're essentially rubbing america's and iraq's defeat into their noses. similar staging to what we saw in that awful video with the jordanian air pilot. we don't know what they're going to do with those kurds but my guess is probably kill them.

isis is sophisticated in their propaganda. i think they have vulnerabilities and weakness bus the way we're fighting them we're not exploiting them. frips a sunni national guard or armed sunni militias capable of turning the tide against isis. again, isis rules over sunni communities. that's their geostrategic heartland. they've been exposed from mixed areas. shia militias, will they go deep inside central mosul, house to house? if they do they'll be slaughtered. there will be ieds, suicide bombs. for almost ten years they cut pieces of pavement out of the road and put in these bombs that u.s. tanked would get blown up by or armored vehicles. i think they'll make mincemeat of these groups. >> michael, we have to leave it at that.

we'll have you come back because there's so much to talk about. >> sure. >> we really want to digest this. a little while ago i spoke to a former u.s. state department official and a correspondent in italy about isis' latest threat to invade rome. isis fighters are -- they are in libya, which is relatively short boat trip from the italian territory. people throughout the mediterranean are definitely aware of the this threat. listen. >> 72% of-in the latest poll didn't believe isis would invade. they think they'd mount some kind of terrorism. the authorities have been alarmed, they've deployed 4,800 soldiers onto city streets in rome to protect sensitive sites like synagogues landmarks like embassies, newspapers. they've the "charlie hebdo" massacre we

saw a few weeks back. there is alarm and they are trying to monitor sympathizers in the country. the officials have talked about sympathizers who could present a problem. but officials have said their biggest concern are the people they don't know. you have to remember that they don't know about, haven't identified -- you have to remember about 100,000 immigrants poured into illegally italy last year alone. >> david, i want to follow up on jamie's point because it's a good point, we have seen these terrorists strike already, paris, copenhagen other places. now you have this threat to italy and there are lot of people in the united states and elsewhere wondering is it safe to go to europe at this point. i mean is there a real concern about travel to that area? >> we can expect and we should expect more isis attacks. we've had a couple very recently. some of them were not people who were specifically trained by isis. they were followers trying to

emulate some of the things that they've seen isis do. trying to make a big scene. and they've accomplished that. and i think we need to expect more of that. europe certainly needs to be on the ready, needs to protect its borders to the extent it can. but we also need to go to the root of the problem. the root of the problem is failed states and countries that are on their way to becoming failed states. libya is in the latter category and moving quickly towards possibly becoming a failed state, which is very unfortunate, because with the u.s. and italy and france and the uk had great involvement in libya in 2011. we helped with the revolution helped defeat the 42-year dictatorship of gadhafi, but now we're not very engaged in libya. that's a problem. we need to help the elected government of libya with the security side of its effort to secure libya. that means training forces providing guidance to forces maybe providing weapons, and perhaps at some point we'll have to do air strikes again.

we need to confront isis and the islamic fanatics that are in libya before they become stronger. >> all right. david janeny thanks so much for an interesting conversation. we appreciate your time this weekend. rudy giuliani says he is getting death threats following his unusually harsh criticism of president obama. but the former mayor standing by his belief that the president does not america. more on that straight ahead. plus police in london raise alert over three teenaged girls who may be headed for syria. we examine the lives of western jihadists. ready for another reason to switch to t-mobile. get 2 lines of unlimited 4g lte data for just $100 bucks a month.

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disagreeing with the president of the united states the one thing, but former new york mayor rudy giuliani took it to another level this week saying the president does not love his own ton country, america. the reaction from some republicans was even swift. here's will ripley. >> new york's former mayor rudy giuliani is not back do you think. he's stand big his charge that president obama doesn't love his country, telling cnn's jim acosta in a phone interview he refuses to apologize. >> he said to me during this brief phone conversation, "i don't regret making the statement. i believe it."

>> reporter: giuliani addressed the firestorm following the comments. >> he said his office has received some death threats, that his secretary has gotten some death threats over the phone. >> reporter: while cnn can't verify the claim, giuliani says the majority of messages were positive, including one from bobby jindal, whose office put out a statement, refusing to condemn the former mayor but adding he should have chosen different phraseology. not all republicans are backing the former mayor's criticism of the president. >> i think it's a mistake to question people's motives. it is one thing to disagree on policy, and i try not to question the president's motives as being a good american or a bad american. >> reporter: giuliani's recent behavior is no surprise to some. >> he's going to double down, triple down, and quadruple down. >> reporter: professor doug musio says the man hailed for his leadership during 9/11 is tarnishing that legacy, gaining a reputation for controversial, sometimes inflammatory rhetoric. >> he's enjoying this. this is an ego trip. rudy's been out of the news and now he's on the news.

>> reporter: giuliani continues making front-page news this weekend, bringing up old claims about the president's past. >> we haven't even mentioned some of the other communists and leftists who educated him as a young man. >> reporter: former obama senior adviser david axelrod dismissed the familiar criticisms in an interview with cnn's michael smerconish. >> i can't climb into rudy giuliani's head and explain why he said what he said. what he said was despicable and completely inconsistent with the man i know and i think the man most americans know. >> reporter: but giuliani remains defiant, even as he risks stepping farther away from his image as america's mayor. will ripley cnn, new york. want to bring in our senior political analyst and former presidential adviser david gergen. good to see you. we've seen this kind of rhetoric building more and more throughout the years but even in will's piece we saw some republicans who were distancing themselves from giuliani's remarks almost immediately

there. one of the things that the professor brought up in that piece, he said that he thought it was about giuliani trying to get attention. do you really think that is the political cal clue queue lus here he just wants to be relevant and try to get attention and risk potentially the legacy he had for being someone of the people america's mayor? >> i don't think he was looking for attention. he was in an event he thought was off the record at a private restaurant in new york and didn't know that anybody was there from the press. he's a defiant man, likes to stand up and be tough. he's a new yorker. i'm a fan of his time as mayor, he was a very good mayor, especially after 9/11. i think on this particular issue he's wrong, it's wrong to question a president of the united states about whether he loves america or not, and especially wrong because here we have a black president for the fist time who has by the traditions of the

african-american community have been so different, what they've lived through has been so different. of course they may have different views about what america should be and what the american experience has been. but to question their patriotism i think is just wrong. i think it's a question now, what are the other presidential wannabes going to say? are they going to step up or shy away? i think stepping up to it is the gutsy thing to do. >> what do you make of what's going on here it? 's baffling to some people and the republicans who have reached out to me quietly who said they think, you know, he's lost his mind. why is he doing this? why is he saying these things? is there any advantage in any way to try to shape the narrative going into 2016 for the republicans since we are a country that is debating the efficacy of war? >> i don't think there's any benefit to republicans to

present this tif he doesn't love his country. it drags up the old controversy about his birther, was he truly american from his birth. i don't think that serves a useful purpose. we have far more important things to talk about. rudy as i say, was in a nonpress setting he thought, but said something he shouldn't have said. now he's defending himself to the hit. that's his nature. the rest of us a ought to move on. the real news this week was this fight against isis and how it's being characterized by the white house and whether in fact we're pulling together an alliance that can defeat it or if we're going to be halfhearted about it. >> 2008 this played out, right, where we heard all these suggestions about president obama, he's not like us didn't grow up like us you know, the other, you know, kind of the boogeyman, if you will. going into 2016 whoever it is they're going to need the millennials, hispanics, african-americans, a whole coalition of voters to put them

in office. what who do the republican candidates need to say in response? 'we've seen scott walker who didn't really say anything about giuliani yaes's comments except for he loves america. what should they be say ing?ing? >> i think they have to say, look he made a mistake. as much they may respect him, let's call it what it is. a lot of us would love for president obama to call islamic terrorist what it is. in this case the republicans themselves ought to be clearer about what they think about what rudy said. as i say, i respect him but he was wrong to do this it was divisive has overtones that are ugly. i just -- it's -- i think it's sort of insulting to the

president of the united states and indeed to the presidency to question the patriotism of a president. republicans need to be tough on their own convictions. people don't like the dancing around. call this things as they are. >> all right, david. we'll have to call it there. appreciate your time. >> okay suzanne. >> good discussion as always. coming up officials in london desperately trying to track down three teenage girls who are believed to have run off to join isis. while this is happening, u.n. released a new disturbing report about the group's treatment of women and children including selling them as sex slaves. [engine revving]

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please come home. we love you. that's the heartbreaking message today from the family of british girl who's feared to have run off to join isis. the 15-year-old took off tuesday with two other friends. jim sciutto explains the threat these girls face and the likelihood it will be found before it's too late. >> reporter: the senior british diplomat tells me the recruitment by isis of women and girls is quote ark clear and disturbing trend and warns that the girls involved in this particular case are at risk of sexual and other exploitation if they make it to the war zone in syria. these three young british schoolgirls are believed to be the newest foreign recruits to isis. caught on surveillance cameras at a london airport with luggage in tow, london police fear they fled britain for syria to join

jihad. >> we don't know how these three girls have come up with this plan. we don't know what has enticed them what has encouraged them to go to syria, but we obviously believe that they're heading towards syria. but we just don't know how it's happened. the parents themselves are mystified. >> reporter: the muslim girls have been missing since tuesday when they boarded a flight headed to istanbul, turkey. this is the same airport that ayet boumeddiene entered syria before her husband carried out the deadly shooting at a paris kosher market. she is still wanted by french police and now believe inside syria. turkey has been a key transit point into syria for recruits to isis and other extremist groups. turkish and european authorities are still struggling to stem the flow. dhs secretary jeh johnson told wolf blitzer thursday that the u.s. is tracking these movements as best it can. >> we have systems in place to track these individuals as they come and go. it's difficult to pick um

so-called broken travel -- >> what does that mean broken travel? >> where you fly to country a and then you go to country b on the ground saying we don't know that fact. >> reporter: a senior british diplomat tells cnn that women are a new and growing target for isis recruiters. the terrorism research group track estimates that nearly 1 in 6 isis foreign recruits are women. and that isis recruiting network extend all the way to the u.s. homeland. in october, three teenage girls from colorado were intercepted at frankfurt airport in germany as they were trying to make their way to syria to join isis. it was their parent who is tipped off the fbi. another american 19-year-old shannon maureen connolly was arrested at denver international airport in april last year on her way to an isis camp near the turkish syrian border. she was sentence fod four years in prison after confessing she

wanted to become an isis bride and wage holy war. the three british girls are friends with another british girl who traveled to syria in september. police interviewed them at the time and did not consider them to be likely isis recruits. >> joining me now, former fbi assistant director tom fuentes. tom so, we're learning now that these girl ss could be headed to isis. this composite at the same time we've got this very disturbing very alarming report out of the united nations describing the horrors that women and children are facing under isis. and i just want to tick off a few of them you see there. women and children sold as sex slaichs. many children sexually assaulted in prisons. parents being forced to give their children to isis and children being used as suicide bombers. i don't understand for the life of me why anybody voluntarily would be a part of this group. what do we make of this? if this is really happening in this poortart of the world, this is

absolutely tragic. >> suzanne, that's true terribly tragic. we've had the three young girls from colorado that wanted to join, were intercemented in europe and brought back by the fbi. it appears by the debriefings of some of these girl theys ear attracted to this macho, tough guy, cool guy, they're so strong behead people burn men alive, make our local street gangs look pitiful. they don't look at what's going to happen to them when they get there. they think they're going to be exalted as biker girls or something when they arrive and that's part of the mistake they make signing up to go over there and are too young and stupid to be talked out of it generally. >> what does happen when they get there? three teenagers from london take off tuesday morning, no warning, meet with possibly somebody to help them get into syria.

what is in front of them? >> once isis knows not to take them as hostages don't believe they're there to fight isis or for humanitarian or journalism purposes when they learn or believe that they're there actually to join isis we don't know all the details. are they give on the a soldier as a war bride? give on the a group of soldiers you know, to be their war brides? we don't know for sure all of the details of that. what we do know is there is something appealing to them about being with these bad boys. >> are they promised anything on the internet? we know isis has a wide recruiting effort through social media. do we know what they are actually saying to lure young girls to them? >> they don't tell them they'll be mistreated abused raped, and sold. they tell them they'll be honored, this will be great to

have them join the cause, join the caliphate, join the soldiers helping to build the islamic state and the holy caliphate there. i think the message to them is they'll be special when they get there. >> it's just sad beyond belief. thank you so much. appreciate it. we'll get more into the discussions of what their fate might be once they're in turkey and whether their parents or the government can do anything to get them back at that point. thank you. coming up the u.s. plans to support a major offensive against isis and iraq. the entire strategy was laid out for everybody to see, including isis. is that going to backfire? if you're taking multiple medications does your mouth often feel dry? a dry mouth can be a side effect of many medications. but it can also lead to tooth decay and bad breath. that's why there's biotene available as an oral rinse toothpaste, spray or gel. biotene can provide soothing relief and it helps keep your mouth healthy too.

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months after iraqi troops dropped their weapons and head t out of mosul, they are said to

be headed back this spring supported by the united states to try to retake the city from isis. mosul is the second largest city in iraq and holds great strategic importance. ben wedeman explains the challenges that await iraq's army. >> reporter: pentagon officials say the united states is planning for some sort of iraq iraqi-led offensive to drive isis out of mosul, but a video posted on facebook showing one battle about 100 kilometers northwest of baghdad indicates the iraqi army is still on the back foot when it comes to fighting isis. in this video you see isis fighters having overrun this iraqi base in the desert. they clearly got their hands on dozens of american-made m-16s, a mountain of ak-47s, mor or thes ammunition ammunition clips, armored personnel carriers and humvees.

and this has really been the case going back months as far as the situation in anbar province goes. time and time again, isis has overrun these bases and got their hands on more and more american-made equipment. the worry is of course, if the iraqi army is going to be given the task of driving isis out of mosul are they up to it. the united states has conducted a crash training course. they're currently about 3,200 iraqi soldiers undergoing that course. 2,000 have already graduated. but going a into mosul, a city of almost 2 million people, some of the inhabitants who were hostile to the iraqi army before it was driven out, is going to be difficult and kurdish commanders we've spoken to, for instance have said even in small village where is they've managed to drive isis out, isis has left behind dozen and in some towns hundreds of ieds

that's made it almost impossible for the original inhabitants to move out. when you're talking about driving isis out of a city like mosul it's going to be a gar gaj want task. ben wedeman, cnn, irbil. >> joining me now are jack kingston former republican congressman from georgia, and don buyer, current congressman from virginia and former ambassador to switzerland. thanks for joining us. an interesting discussion we've been having throughout the day. congressman kingston should the u.s. military have announced this the way they did, the timetable, the plan going forward in mosul? several military officials believe it's no surprise that they know anyway it's going to happen but, you know, they're not exactly sure if it's going to compromise the mission. what do you think? >> i don't know why you would tell your enemy what your plans are, particularly when it's in

doubt because you only have 3,600 iraqis at this point who are trained. you're going to need 25,000. americans are limited to the 2,600 guy who is will be doing the joint terminal attack control who stay behind so, it's doubtful. when we made our announcements in 2003 that we were invading iraq or in 2004 going into fallujah we had the ability to do that we had the army the fors on the ground but we don't have that at this point. announce eight head of time gives them an advantage. i don't know why we would do that. >> congressman buyer, there are two points that came out from discussions with military officials today. one that they felt that in some way it was a signal to the iraqi forces look don't worry about it whoever's going to be joining you, we got you. u.s. support, this is going to be a real tough battle to fight. the other thought was perhaps there would be some defections on isis' side because there was

this heads up that this was going to go down in the spring. do you buy any of those arguments? >> there's history. general mcchris cal in 2010 announced the plan to take back hellmann province alerting the taliban we were coming also gave hope to the civilian population. there's less than 2,000 isis fighters in mosul right now. we're talking about five iraqi brigades up to 25,000 people. it will take some time which is why secretary carter has said the timing is uncertain, we won't go until we're ready. we want to know isis that we are coming. >> congressman kingston talk about the u.s. role, the strategy in iraq because we do have advisers intelligence officials on the ground in iraq their president has been clear he doesn't want boots on the ground doesn't want combat troops back inside iraq. but when you have fighting

that's going on shg, if you're an intelligence person or a vise visor or not, if somebody's attacking you you'll take on a combat role there, in some ways turning it into a de facto combat mission. is it appropriate to put u.s. boots on the ground in iraq? >> absolutely. if you're going to fight, you have to fight to win. we cannot be half pregnant here. that's one of the problems we've had in the middle east. we done have clarity, don't have an object they've we're going to say here's our measure of success, our definition of victory. we have to have that. i served on the defense committee over ten year represented every branch of the military particularly the 3rd infantry, probably the most action in the middle east more than any other infantry division, and i heard it over and over again. unfortunately, you have to have boots on the ground to coordinate your air strikes. you have to have it to send the signals to the civilians, here's the way out, here's how you can join us. you have to -- in this case if

you're trying to minimize collateral damage you have to go house to house. you can't do everything from the air. and to say that we're going to do that with the very army have them up front, the iraqis these are the folks who a year ago put down their weapons and ran after we had spent billions of dollars in ten years training them. i think the case is there to have american boots on the ground. that's tough to say, but again, if you're going fight, you have to win. >> a very tough thing to say in light of the fact of how much was invested under president bush to turn the region around, to turn iraq around. he said he wanted this region to be, you know freedom and democracy and we are seeing the vacuum, the power vacuum that's happened and now the mess to follow. so it certainly puts people in a difficult position to defend that and support that. i want both of you to stick around because we're going to talk about what understanding isis how that could actually be a key in defeating them.

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lease the well-equipped volvo xc60 today. visit your local volvo showroom for details. they have laid out the horrific plans time and time again, but are there things about isis we still don't know? in a new article from "atlantic" magazine from graham wood, he talks act what they want. is understanding them key to defeating them? i discussed the article with graham wood a critic of that thinking and a counterterrorism

official. >> between a tradition that draws from the text of islam and a tradition that draws from these texts well properly, in a way that a muslim scholar would, for example, be pleased with from any part of the world of islam. >> i think at the senior levels of isis leadership it is hard to know whether they really believe what they're saying. a lot of people around baghdadi are former officials. the one consistency in the baath party is they like to commit genocide. i think for the foot soldiers yeah it is compelling. it's a nary they've's really powerful that you're going to be a soldier and you're about right and wrong, about the end of the world, about standing up for the truth and creating utopia and the vision that jesus is going to return being messiah in islam, is power fulful. >> i want to bring phil into the

conversation conversation. how do you counter something like this? we've heard from the president or the summit that some of it is poverty and jobs and opportunity and people are dit illusioned in some of the herein countries and there needs to be another way, propaganda being a powerful force in this. if you have folks who believe this is going to be the next coming and they'll be a part of the end of the world on the good side, on the winning side how do you counter something like that? >> let's separate out the leadership and what was referred to a moment ago as the foot soldiers because in my experience those are vastly different people in terms of how you believe and how you can potentially divert their beliefs. right now if you look at the leadership of isis, my judgment based on when we at the cia used to interrogate al qaeda guys -- and al qaeda is not the same by a large margin as isis -- but when we used to interrogate the leadership they are true believers and once they go down that path of indoctrination over

the course of years or decades, you can't turn them back. they are never going to go home again. in that case to be blunt, that's a kill or capture operation at the upper 1% of isis. to contrast that that with the foot soldiers in my experience in both the united states and overseas, the foot soldiers may believe that they understand the message of isis including the senseless killing. they don't. >> joining me again to discuss jack kingston former georgia congressman, and don beyer. thank you both. congressman beyer, does it matter if we understand what they want isis this terror group, when we are already seeing what they are capable offing to? >> it does matter. we're going to need an "all of the above" type strategy. we're going to need the brigades in mosul, the peshmerga and make

sure the kurdish can do what they can. the president talked about economic opportunity, jobs hopelessness but there are 70,000 to 90,000 social media messages a day coming out of isis. we have to be able to counter the propaganda and the messages. we have to do it all together if we hope to succeed. >> congressman kingston we know from from the yagss the report coming out that they are raping children they are selling them into slavery, they are killing, i mean, the brutality of what is taking place in this part of the world is absolutely unbelievable. how is it that you get to people and the propaganda machine and stop what some people believe is an ideology that they're going to get to the promised land in some way, the end of the world, the apocalypse and have all that is good in the world and be on the right side? how do you even fight something like that in a propaganda way?

>> you know, i do think you have to understand them and i do think -- and i hope somebody in the white house reads graham wood's articles in the "atlantic" and watch the interview you had with him today. the president is still denial they do not have a religious background if you will, a belief system that is religious. it might be a twisted form of islam, we'll all agree on, that but the reality is they believe they are on the side of good against evil and they believe when they recruit people and they sign up, they are fighting on the right side of god or allah or whatever and the reality is the only way you can break that spirit is to defeat them. you have to have victories and show look they're not expanding anymore. that's why taking mosul is important, but also to counterattack them. it's interesting the president doesn't want to give them their religious due because he believes that will trigger some kind of a mass world

recruitment, yet when he says we're going to go into mosul, that's going to be the same thing. you're darned if you do and darned if you don't if you're going to pray around with this religious label, but you have to go in there and break their spirit because if you don't, they believe that allah is on their side and that victory belongs to them. >> congressman beyer you are shaking your head. jump in weigh in. >> i don't think that's fair to the president. it's clearly a war against isis and he clearly understands isis has these thousand-year-old archaic, religious ideas. what the president is trying to point out is the great victims of isis has been muslims and we're going to need most of the muslim world -- jordan, syria, turkey turkey fighters in iraq -- if we're going to beat isis. >> don, i'm in agreement with you, most of the victims have been muslims, but the reality is that their own leadership says find an infidel, crush his head with a rock poison him, and

uer rome and break your crosses. >> but the president is saying they're not religious. my point is they believe they are religious. so the president can declare what he wants, but in the fight for good and evil they believe they are on god's side. that is why it is important. so i'm not saying that you know this is islam, but it is a twisted form in which they have embraced. >> i agree i don't think it's fair to say that the president doesn't understand. >> i have to leave it there, you both had your say, thank you so much. i appreciate it and we'll have you back.

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