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welcome back to the second hour of "360." we are live here in charleston, south carolina. a community that continues to sow extraordinary strength and grace, amazing grace, in the shadow of immeasurable sorrow. this is the scene right now, outside the mother emanuel church. hundreds of people have gathered. they're in song, they're clapping. people bringing flowers. they're bringing teddy bears, they're bringing notes, as they have been throughout the day, but now that darkness has come, people are still here, still coming to show their support. there was a huge turnout at a prayer vigil not far from here at the college of charleston. it was held in a packed arena, where songs and prayers for the nine people who were murdered and for their families. there was a lot more to cover in the hour ahead. new details in the church massacre investigation, including disturbing revelations about the confessed killer and how long, how long he may have been planning the attack. and if others knew about it or had hints about it. he made his first court

appearance today by closed circuit television. some of the victims' loved ones were inside the courtroom. a survivor was inside the courtroom, during the bond hearing. and they were given an opportunity to address the killer and some of them did. it was, i mean, an extraordinary display of grace. listen. families of ethel lance, is that correct? >> yes. i just wanted everybody to know, i forgive you. you took something very precious, nadine collier. you took something very precious to me. ly never be able to talk to her ever again. i will never be able to hold her again. but i forgive you, and have mercy on your soul. you hurt me. you hurt a lot of people. but god forgive you. and i forgive you.

>> representative of the family of myra thompson. >> i'm saying the same thing that was just said. you know, i forgive you and my family forgives you. but we would like to take this opportunity to repent. repent, confess. live your life to what matters the most, christ, so that he can change it. and change your ways no matter what happened to you. and you'll be okay. do that and you'll be better off than what you are right now. >> thank you, sir. >> tywanza sanders? >> we welcomed you wednesday night in our bible study. we opened our arms. you have killed some of the most prettifulest people that i know. every fiber in my body hurts.

and i -- i'll never be the same. tywanza sanders is my son, but tywanza was my hero. tywanza was my hero. but as we said in bible study, we enjoyed you. but may god have mercy on you. >> a representative of daniel simmons? >> although my grandfather and the other victims died at the hands of hate, this is proof, everyone's plea for your soul is proof that they -- they lived and loved and their legacies will live and love. so hate won't win and i just want to thank the court for making sure that hate doesn't win. >> thank you, ma'am. a representative of the family

of cynthia hurd. >> and i too, thank you, on behalf of my family, for not allowing hate to win. for me, i'm a work in progress, and i acknowledge that i am very angry, but one thing depayne had always joined in our family, is that she taught me that we are the family that love built. we have no room for hate, so we have to forgive. and i pray god on your soul and i also thank god that i won't be around when your judgment day comes with him. >> well, the hearing also hit an awkward and controversial note when the judge made kind of a left turn that few saw coming. listen. >> charleston is a very strong community. we have big hearts.

we're a very loving community. and we are going to reach out to everyone, all the victims and we will touch them. we have victims, nine of them. but we also have victims on the other side. there are victims on this young man's side of the family. no one would have ever thrown them into the whirlwind of events that they have been thrown into. we must find it in our heart at some point in time not only to help those that aren't victims, but to also help his family as well. >> joining me now is cnn legal analyst, sunny hostin, also, mark geragos is joining us. also, reverend george mccain, the national director of public affairs for the ame zion church. also a former pastor in charleston. he lost friends in the attack two nights ago. reverend, thank you so much for being here. i want to talk to you about the

outpouring of faith you have seen. i'm wondering if you were surprised by the judge's comments? >> i was very surprised by the judge's comments. very surprised, i guess, is the safest thing to say. it was out of the purview of what should be expected -- >> in the court? >> in the court, right, and even his personal feelings to be shared at that time was mostly inappropriate. >> to see the crowds that have been coming of out here, i mean, if this young man, and i don't use his name, if this young man wanted to start a war, a race war in this country, it seems, at least for now, he has brought a lot of people together. do you think that's true? >> i think god has brought a lot of people together. i think cause and response are two different things. he may have been a part of the cause, but our response is really what brought the people together. god does the unique thing here in charleston, which is different than anywhere in the world. i'm a native of new jersey, but since i've been in charleston since '87, i've experienced life

and community at an entirely different level. so our response here tonight is the example, is setting the tone that this is how america responds when we have crisis. and i think as you see, black, white, baptist, catholic, it's not about denomination, it's not about what side of town tor economic or social stratta, it's about the need to respond to one another in this moment. and we will be united. >> to hear family members, and i talked to a number of them say, talk about forgiveness. i mean, there is faith and there is strong faith, but that is an incredible thing, two days after you have lost your mother, your sister, to talk, to face the person who did it and say, i can forgive you. >> i'm sure they felt the same way, as much as they hurt, moments later. when you talk about, man shall not kill, you're talking about the fourth commandment. we're taught to forgive.

we are expressions of forgiveness. romans 3:23. all have sinned. some may have lied, some may have stolen, some may have killed, but all have sinned. we know what forgiveness is. that's why we seek the lord daily. >> mark geragos, were you surprised to hear the judge in his remarks, to hear him so quickly reference the family of this killer? >> look, it's almost inexplicable. as somebody who's practiced criminal defense for decades, i see firsthand, yes, the family of the people that you defend, the family of the accused are victims, but for the judge to say it, in a case like this, from the get-go, is, obviously, inappropriate. and, you know, i talked about this off the air with sunny. if he knew that family and had, you know, some heartfelt reaction about that, then he

shouldn't have been hearing this case. he should have recused himself. the other thing i will tell you is that i've never seen, and maybe they do it at bond hearings there, but i've never seen expressions of forgiveness and that kind of forgiveness at a bond hearing. by the way, where this judge had no authority to grant bond. he granted bond for $1 million, but that was for the firearms charge. he has no authority to grant bond on the murder case, so this to some degree was just kind of kabuki theater for the media. and you got that mostly when you saw that picture that they did the video arrangement, where he's standing there, the accused, and he has the two cops behind him with the flap jackets on. the whole thing was kind of surreal. but you have to take your hats off. i have sat through countless, i can't tell you, of what we call these victim impact statements, i've never seen ever, ever this lineup of victims, especially this close to the event, with that amount of forgiveness. it was shocking. >> and sunny, we know the department of justice is looking

into this mass killing, both as a hate crime and a domestic act of terrorism, an act of domestic terrorism. does the federal case, does that really matter. that south carolina is a death penalty state if, who takes -- the state takes priority, right? >> i think the state will take priority. i think the federal government knows that the people of charleston, the people of south carolina need to have their justices. so the federal government will certainly take a backseat to this. but it is very important to know that the federal government is going to be working side by side with state investigators, so they are bringing to bear all of the resources of the federal governme government, including the fbi, the best of the best, and i also think what's very important here, is that now we are calling this kind of act, this kind of hatred and racism, domestic terrorism, by any account. we're talking about someone choosing to try to intimidate a group of people. >> and create a race war.

>> this is an african-american. >> and shooting a public official. and choosing this beautiful church, which has always been a storied sign to have african-american faith and community and social activism. that choice, i think, certainly makes it an act of domestic terrorism. and we do need to start looking at these cases like that. so this is a watershed moment, in my view, of the federal government's arm in terms of calling it domestic terrorism. >> reverend kaine, it's an honor to meet you. i'm sorry it's under these circumstances, but thank you for being with us. >> some powerful words tonight. sunny hostin and mark geragos as well. ahead, we have new details about what this terrorist was doing and saying in the weeks and days before the massacre. one of his friends is speaking out tonight about why he regrets not taking some of the killer's comment seriously. and you'll ask that question as well, why didn't he pick up a phone and call police? details, ahead. ♪ a good host, is a good host

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welcome back. we are live from charleston, south carolina, where today the confessed killer who murdered nine people in the church behind me, mother emanuel church, made his first court appearance in the last 24 hours. and we have learned a lot more about the attack and the events leading up to it. we learned, for instance, that a friend of the killer was worried enough that he took a gun away from him and now he regrets giving it back. here's what joey meek, his roommate, told cnn's brian todd. >> i took his gun and i hid it. and the next morning, i didn't want to get in trouble, with him saying i stole his gun, so i put his gun back in his trunk. >> reporter: how do you feel about that now? >> terrible. i mean -- i mean, terrible, but then again, i can't go back, because i was looking out for myself, really, because i didn't want to get in trouble for stealing a gun. >> well, again, the message of that is if you see something, you have some questions about somebody in your life, you've got to say something to somebody, to somebody in law enforcement.

joining me now, drew griffin, as well as brian todd. drew, today we did get a fuller picture, a fuller picture about the shooter's behavior, while in police custody. what he told police. what have you learned? >> reporter: we know that he was picked up by the shelby, north carolina, police and taken to that police station in north carolina, he was put into a room where the fbi first questioned him and then the charleston police detectives questioned him. that entire conversation or conversations were videotaped and audio taped. and according to our cnn affiliate, wbtv in charlotte, this shooter was speaking very freely, apparently, admitting that he had done some research and specifically targeted the emanuel ame church, because of its african american history and relevance within the community there. he also said that when he was going into the church, he had hid his glock gun, his pistol, in that pouch, and you can see that pouch that he's wearing in

the surveillance photo that has been handed out by the police. and also admitted, supposedly, to having seven clips of ammunition. if they were full and for that gun, that would be a round -- 91 rounds of ammunition that he went in there with. again, he said that while inside the church, he thought about actually not shooting anybody. then had second thoughts about that, decided to go ahead with it. and anderson, according to this wbtv report, he was surprised he got away. he never thought he'd get out of charleston. when he did get out of charleston, he decided to drive to nashville, reportedly because, he says, i'd never been to nashville. anderson? >> and thought about not shooting people because they had been so nice to him. yet nevertheless, despite them welcoming him in, embracing him into the bosom of the church on that night, he took out that gun and killed people. brian, you spoke, as we just showed you, his friend, earlier,

what other details did he give you about this guy? >> reporter: joey meek said, on this night, recently, when the shooter talked about wanting to start a race war, and wanting segregation, that he had really had a lot to drink, that he had had a liter of vodka, which is an extraordinary amount of vodka for anybody, but for somebody of a small stature, as this shooter, from the physical descriptions of him, that's an astounding amount of vodka. but he said, when he had that vodka, he started talking about a race war, and that's the point he decided to take his gun from him and just hide it somewhere. he, a view hours later, joey meek said he didn't want to be accused or caught, having stolen a gun from someone, so he put it back in the shooter's trunk and he feels terrible about that. he also said that the shooter had a six-month plan to do, quote, something crazy. he didn't know details of what that plan entailed. but, it does indicate, anderson,

that the shooter may have had some kind of a plan to do something extreme for quite some time. >> a lot of missed opportunities. if you know somebody who says they have a six-month plan to do something crazy and a gun, you would think somebody would pick up a phone, drew. i know you spoke to a pastor for the family earlier. >> the family had had a couple of meetings today and there was a gathering this morning at the shooter's sister's house. the pastor, actually, the reverend from the church behind me, his name is tony mets, came out and gave us really the first statement or glimpse that we got from what this family, this shooter's family, is feeling. here's what he had to say. >> what they've asked and what i ask is that we continue to hold all these families in our prayers, and that the whole world, our nation, charleston, our community, understand that we love them, god loves them, and we want the best, and we want to continue to hold those people in our prayers.

>> and anderson, since that statement was made by the pastor, the family did release, late this afternoon, an actual statement, in which not only they offered their condolences and sympathies to the victim's families, but also, you could tell that they were watching those families during that bond hearing, because they thank them for their outpouring of forgiveness that they gave to their son, brother, who is now in custody for these heinous crimes. anderson? >> and brian, the roommate told you about what seemed like a dispute within the shooter's family about his purchase of a gun, right? >> that's right, anderson. and that adds another really disturbing layer to this story. joey meeks said that the shooter's parents did not want him to have a gun. and i asked him why not, and he said he doesn't really know, just some instinct that they had. but, they did give the shooter some money for his 21st birthday in april, and that they divided up the money that each parent would give him so that he would

be able to buy the gun and put it in his name. they did not buy the gun outright for him, but there was a dispute within the family, they didn't want him to have a gun, had some inkling that maybe something bad would happen, but in the end, they appeared to give in, split up the money and gave him the money so he could buy a gun and put it in his own name. between that layer and the layer o of this friend, joey meek, having taken the gun from him at one point and given it back, there are points along the way, anderson, where you think, this really could have been prevented, and whatever was nit way of it, for whatever reason, didn't prevent it. >> brian, appreciate your reporting, drew griffin, as well. just ahead, we'll be focusing attention where it should be tonight, those who were killed here and murdered here. the nine people whose lives were taken away. cynthia hurd was a librarian with a passion for books. she worked for three decades at the charleston county public library. she worked her way up the library system.

her brother shares fond memories, coming up. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

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♪ i once was lost ♪ but now i'm found

♪ was blind ♪ but now i see >> incredibly moving scene here in the last hour of "360." the crowd just breaking into song of "amazing grace," as a bagpiper began to play. we have more singing right now outside the church by the makeshift memorial, where people have been bringing flowers for days now. we want to focus as we have over the last two nights on those who were taken away from us, those whose lives were cut short in the hail of gunfire inside mother emanuel church. we remember tonight 54-year-old cynthia hurd, a charleston native. she worked for 31 years at the charleston county public library, dedicating her life to books and to helping others. earlier, i spoke with her brother, former north carolina state senator, malcolm graham. what do you want people to know about cynthia? >> cynthia is a wonderful lady. she's beautiful. she's personable, she's sharp,

she's candid, she was full of life. she loved people. she slofed her family. she loved her community. and she loved god. and so, she is not just a name on a piece of paper. she is not a victim. she's a christian and on wednesday, she celebrated a big victory. >> the fact that she was killed in the place that she loved, doing what she loved. does that -- does it offer some solace? >> a little. you know, i mean, she was in a church. she was in a place -- she was in the presence of god. and she was in the place where she grew up. i mean, she knew that church backwards and forwards. she was in the youth choir, she spent her easters in that church, our mom was in that church, we buried our parents, services in that church.

it's a place where she felt probably the most comfortable. and so, the fact that she lost her life there in the presence of god, it gives me some comfort. >> she really seems to have dedicated herself to service. i mean, she worked her way up through the library system here, and the libraries really are about service. they're about helping people in the community. >> we used to joke all the time, you know, i used to be an elected official and she would talk about constituent service. and she said, i've got a constituent, too, and it was the people who walked into the library, and she felt very passionate about that in terms of helping kids learn to read, helping kids learn to write, helping them pick up the right book. she did more than just the library stuff. she went beyond the walls to the library and outside into the communities. and really cured in a special way. and 31 years of service to the library system here in charleston speaks volumes. and the fact that they are willing to dedicate and name a

library after her means that her legacy will live forever. and that's something that i'm grateful for as well as the entire family. >> at the hearing today, i don't want to use this person's name, but family members were there and they spoke to the person who did this. and some of them spoke about forgiveness. and i'm wondering what you thought about that? >> it's too early for me to forgive. if my sister was walking across the street and was struck by a car, i could forgive immediately. if she was in a tennis match and something happened to her and -- i could forgive. this was premeditated. this was calculated. this was hate. so over time maybe i can get to the point where i say, i forgive. today i cannot. today i want the judicial system to do its work, to fulfill its obligation and to penalize this guy for what he's done, not only

to my sister, the members of the emanuel ame church, and what he's done for this community. in time, maybe, i can forgive. but today i want just for my family. >> is there one particular memory of your sister that you hold on to, that you think about? >> you know, cynthia and i had a real strange relationship. we talked, you know, often, but, you know i suffered a loss. i ran for congress and lost. and, you know, i guess i needed counseling. and she just basically told me, man, get over it. and don't look backwards, look forwards. she was -- always saw the bright side of something. and when i only saw doom and gloom, she was able to paint a different type of picture or a different perspective. she was so many other things, other than a victim. and so, we celebrate her life.

sunday would have been her 55th birthday. and so we celebrate her life. and we won't look back. and she would tell me, she would say, look forward. so we look forward to all the -- her receiving her glory in god in heaven. >> thank you so much for talking to us. >> thank you. >> sunday would have been cynthia hurd's 55th birthday. she and eight others here at the church behind me, their murder certainly has reopened old wounds in charleston and across the state. take a look at a picture right now. the u.s. and state flags fly at half-staff above the capitol dome, but the confederate flag, also on the capitol grounds, by south carolina law, cannot actually be lowered. it has to remain flying at full staff. the controversy, when we continue. so this beauty can be yours and 10% financing.ment oh larry, lawrence.

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the statehouse in south carolina's capitol, the only flag that is not flying at half-staff is the confederate flag. it's actually padlocked into place by state law. in 2000, a larger confederate flag was removed because it used to fly over the capitol dome, but in exchange for removing it, all other tributes to the con fed rassy, including the flag on the lawn, became untouchable,

without an override by two-thirds of the state legislature. the church massacre has renewed calls by some for the flag to be taken down. here's what senator lindsey graham said earlier today. >> at the end of the day, it's time for people in south carolina to revisit that decision would be fine with me, but this is part of who we are. the flag represents, to some people, a civil war and that was the symbol of one side, to others, it's a racist symbol, and it's been used by people, it's been used in a racist way. but the problems we have in south carolina and throughout the world are not because of the move here or symbols, it's because of what's in people's heart. how do you go back and reconstruct america? what do we do in terms of our history? >> joining me now, south carolina state representative, david mack and south carolina state senator, vincent shaheen. to you, what does it say to see the confederate flag, not only flying, but flying not at half-staff? >> i'm not surprised.

i voted against the so-called compromi compromise. i voted against -- >> the compromise that moved the flag. >> that moved the flag. and there was another separate bill that called for two-thirds vote in both the house and the senate in order to change anything on the statehouse grounds. i voted against that. but nerves are raw right now. a lot of pain. we had a minister and nine people, good people, who lost their lives in this way. so it renews that. and i would say to senator lindsey graham, as far as the con fedderacy, a good time was not had by all. >> for him to say, it represents who we are, the we that we're talking about, is not everybody. >> like i said, a good time was not had by all. the confederacy, everything is embedded in slavery, you go up

the street, there's a large statue of john calhoun. so we nude to move forward. >> you were saying there's even a statue of a gynecologist who used to experiment -- >> that is on the statehouse grounds. >> that used to experiment on african-american women. >> c. marion simms, i think is his name. and he's called the father of gynecology. he used to work on african women without anesthesia, and they used to die, you know, constantly, roll up, get another one. he'd do work. and he's honored as the father of gynecology. senator shaheen, the idea that the u.s. flag and the state flag of south carolina are at half-staff and the confederate flag is flying at full staff, what do you say to those, you know, who say, look, that's just part of the history here. >> you know, i say that the future is more important than our past. i sat in the state senate next

to senator clementa pinckney who was assassinated just two days ago. i was with him hours before that happened. by a racist killer. if we're ever going to move this state forward, we have to realize that people look at things differently and symbols do matter. and if we're going to move forward, we can haven't a racially divisive symbol flying in the front of our statehouse. i called on its move last year when i ran for governor, because i felt like it was the right thing to do, because i felt like leaders need to lead. and all too often in this state, we hear elected officials just saying things to try not to say anything. >> representative, i mean, this is your community. to see people at that bond hearing today, survivors, people who have lost their loved ones two days ago, to see them talk about forgiveness, i think a lot of people were just stunned by that. were you surprised, and what did it make you feel?

>> i knew several of the folks, and obviously, senator clementa pinckney and their families, and i think i don't want people to mistake that kindness and that forgiveness for weakness. those are families that voted, they work with neighborhood association meetings to move our community forward. and i think the attitude with people needs to be that we have to fight. we have to fight together. we have to build this community. we have to make sure that, you know, the person that assassinated those folks the other night, some people are just plain evil. there's no other way to put it. just plain evil. we're going to have those. i think it's very key that we mobilize and move forward from here. >> senator shaheen, for you, i know -- sorry, go ahead. >> well, it's really raw right now, anderson. and i have been down there in the church with clementa before, and david, it's good to hear your voice. those folks down there, they

have a long history of dealing with track, with pain, with suffering. and i think what you saw and what you're seeing from our community down there is a long history of coping with really terrible things happening. but that doesn't make any of this okay. reshd remember that our friends were just killed brutally. and if we can do anything in this state to bring people together, to remove symbols that divide us, we ought to do it. that should be their legacy. their legacy should be that we move forward. they are the strong people in this whole affair. those nine people were the heroes. they are our heroes right now. >> yeah. well, representative mac, i appreciate you being us, and senator shaheen, as well. still a lot to talk about. the crowd behind he, still hundreds strong here at this hour. i'll take you down into the crowd to show you what we have been seeing and to hear the

voices of the people who are still gathering outside mother emanuel church. we'll be right back.

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welcome back. i'm right outside mother emanuel church here. this is the makeshift memorial, which has just been growing, each day, as people come, they bring flowers, they bring balloons, they bring teddy bears. people just want to take part in this. you see people from all around

charleston, from all around the state. and if you look, there's crowds now of hundreds of people here. they have been here for hours now, after the prayer vigil ended, many of them came here. there's someone preaching right now. we have heard songs as well. people clapping. i want to introduce shamiqi gray came down. you were involved in the prayer vigil. what is it like being here tonight? >> it's amazing, it's very powerful. everyone is coming together. it's not like we're singing individual hymns. i actually came down to help a friend. we had our own prayer vigil down the street. he was like, come on, help me sing. we came down here and we sang songs that we know, other people were singing songs. it's unity and it's amazing, it's powerful. >> it is. let's just listen in as you see the crowd. let's listen. ♪ amen ♪ amen

♪ everybody singing ♪ amen ♪ amen ♪ amen >> halleluiah now ♪ >> halleluiah ♪ ♪ amen amen ♪ amen

♪ amen ♪ amen >> and we'll be right back. great job!

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>> then his reasons for starting a new war would have to be good ones. >> and i'm still outside the mother e manual church. i want you to meet reverend john paul brown. you know this church well. you were married in this church. >> 24 years ago. >> and you were pastor to pastor pickering. >> yeah, at st. john amy church in ridgeland. very studious. he helped us in tooeching teaching the young kids in the class.

there was something about him. sports didn't interest him. going outside didn't interest him. he just wanted to lead. that was his demeanor. >> i talked to his cousin the other day. she was saying that his mom kept trying to get him to do sports. finally, he went out and got injured and she said okay, that's it. you can just read. he, through his progression, a young man, 23, 24 years of age, he's a house of representative. and the house 06 representatives and then to the senate, over 20 years. >> i want to ask you about -- you know, we don't -- i don't use the name of the person who committed the mass murder in here. but we know he picked this church in particular. he knows about the importance of this church. can you talk about the importance of this church in the african american community?

in the american history. >> in american history, when the white methodist church dehumanized blacks, that church was assembled in 1818. this became a haven. slaves mile grat here to get away. this was their beacon. their hope. it was zion pres bier teern. they had 4,000. they went to 4,900, they had to find another church. >> and this church was burned to the ground. but to show you the resolve. when you get people like the

person who did what he did, he thought that his effort was going to diminish the church, the work. the irony for him is people who did not know the history and here is anderson cooper sitting at 110 street. because this guy decided he didn't want african american and the stux to have any recognition. well, my goodness. i will say this concerning that person. i don't want the death penalty. i want to do what they did in the clockwork orange. they're going to rehabilitate him. they're going to take every film, every piece of vigil here --

>> you want him to see the image. >> i -- yeah, put him on the room and play it over and over and over and let him see et. >> the pictures tonight and your words tonight would be powerful, indeed. reverend, appreciate your time. thank you. it's an honor. >> one of the messages we've heard so much is despite the hate that we've seen, but, besides, in the face of the horror, one message people have said over and over again is we shall overcome. ♪ we shall overcome ♪ we shall overcome ♪ we shall overcome ♪ we shall overcome

♪ we all walk hand in hand ♪ we walk hand-in-hand ♪ we walked hand-in-hand ♪ we walked hand-in-hand .

some of the incredible power that we have seen here: and that is -- we are seeing that here again tonight. more songs here. our coverage continues with cnn's don lemon. don? >> anderson, thank you very much. an amazing scene here today. this is "cnn tonight" i'm don lemon. relative avenue relative