look forward to the reaction to it. nick doob and shari cookson, thanks for coming in. appreciate it. thank you, everyone, by the way, check this out, hbo, 9:00 eastern tonight. it's not just statistics folks, it's real stories. thank you for watching everyone. my colleague wolf blitzer starts right now. hello, i'm wolf blitzer, it 150es o'clock 's 1:00 p.m. in away warkswashington 8:00 p.m. in paris. we stewart a new development for the search of two escaped inmates in upstate new york. a law enforcement source says dna collected at a burglarized cabin matches both fugitives. last hour we heard for a police news conference. >> it's a confirmed lead for us. it has generated massive law enforcement response as you can see, and we're going to run this

to ground. we have no definitive evidence we're looking at all avenues at our disposal. neither of them are from this area. that does not discount the fact that they could have had collaboration. >> sara ganim is joining us live from owl's head in upstate new york near where that cabin is located about 30 miles or so from the prison in dannemora. we heard the lead investigators in the search. what l.e.d. them that cabin where they found the dna? >> we know the lead, the tip that led them here came on saturday from someone who was checking on an unoccupied cabin and saw a man leaving, running into the woods through a back door. the cabin was burglarized, they called police police removed certain items from the cabin. our law enforcement sources telling us they were tested for

dna and tested positive for those inmates which is a big break considering that on friday they had -- law enforcement said the trail had gone cold for these two. i want to give you an idea wolf of what this area is like. very rural, in the adirondacks, upstate new york lots of unoccupied cabin, lots of seasonal home lots of hiking trails biking trails. the kinds of things searchers have been looking through when these two inmates disappeared. they've been following more than 2,000 tips. they've been walking hundreds of miles of trials. last night when we got here there were police on all terrain vehicles tactical teams that were gearing up doing grid searches through the wooded area. you can see a police vehicle checkpoint behind me. it's not visible in the street where it's wide open. we know there are searchings concentrated in the wooded areas, zblofl a huge huge

break, the finding of that dna. meanwhile, sara ago second prison worker has been suspended after being accused of playing at least some role in the escape? what do we know about this individual? >> you know he's 57-year-old veteran guard at the prison a corrections officer, he's been there more than 25 years. his lawyer telling us that the reason they wanted to talk to him is because he received a painting that was made by richard matt one of the escapee escapees. we know those paintings have been a focus of the investigation, boston, because joyce mitchell, the prison seamstress who's been charged with helping those two men escape by providing them tool she also got a painting so police searched this man's home this correction officer's home of the weekend, interviewed him for several hours. he's on paid leave. he has not been charged. his attorney telling me that he is cooperating fully, that he believes he has done nothing wrong, that he 100% did not know

about this escape leading it up to it. >> sara ganim reporting live from upstate new york. so now we do have some dna evidence linking the two escaped inmates to the area just 30 miles or so from that prison joining us now here in washington is tom fuentes, our law enforcement analyst, a former fbi assistant director. this is a huge break right now. they found dna of these two guys in this cabin about 30 miles from the prison. >> if that's true it is a huge break. you can tell the difference in terminology. saturday when they had the sighting 300 miles south thereof near the pennsylvania border they referred to it as a sighting from a credible witness but not confirmed. this time the press briefing just given is calling this a confirmed sighting meaning they not only have the visible sighting of an individual deemed credible but they've corroborated with physical evidence, in this case dna.

he didn't want to go into specifics of it but if they have dna linking those two guys were in that cabin and they were sighted leaving the cabin as recently as this saturday it's huge. >> dna has a life span that goes on for several day, right? >> it depends on the environment that it's in. dna can become obliterated in a tropical environment within a few hours or days. in a more colder environment it can last for months forever. they get dna from mammoths in the ice for 10,000 years? what's significant in this case is they found the dna but they had some sort of visual some spotting of these two guys. >> well, the sighting then makes it more recent. if they had just found dna, someone returns to their cabin, they haven't been there in months then you don't know if the dna was put there recently or two weeks ago and that was a passing location on their try somewhere else. but the fact that it was sighted saturday is very significant. now, the other problem with this is how quickly could they get hundreds of police officers on that location once they

confirmed dna. and that's the problem. do these guys slip out of the area again before they could set up the primmer? that's possible. >> tom, don't go too far away. there's other news we're following right now and we'll have more on the search for these two killers but the funerals, we're talking about the funerals that begin this week for the victims of the charleston church massacre as the community warrants and tries to move forward. services were held at the historic emanuel ame church for the first time since people were shot. the reverend clementa pinckney is among those killed. investigators are looking into a web site registered to the gunman dylann roof. it includes a 2,000 word racist manifesto. the site shows pictures of roof spitting and burning american flags. the massacre in charleston has reignited debate over the confederate flag that flies on the statehouse grounds in south carolina. protesters calling for its

removal. they rallied at the capital over the weekend chanting "take it down." that sentiment was echoed at a news conference by community leaders and activists a short time ago. >> it's time to end division in this state. it's time to move forward into the 21st century. there are many who have cautioned us to wait. but those people are part of the status quo. and what we have to do is galvanize galvanize and use this window of opportunity in light of this horrible tragedy and come away with a solution and agenda to rid this state of hate division and racism. >> we'll talk more about the charleston community's road ahead with a man who played a

key role in baltimore as a response to the writing this past spring congressman elijah cummings of maryland is standing by to join us live. also ahead, the president of the united states using the "n" word during a discussion on racism in america. did he cross the line? we'll discuss. i'm caridee. i've had moderate to severe plaque psoriasis most of my life. but that hasn't stopped me from modeling. my doctor told me about stelara® it helps keep my skin clearer. with only 4 doses a year after 2 starter doses... ...stelara® helps me be in season. stelara® may lower your ability to fight infections and increase your risk of infections. some serious infections require hospitalization. before starting stelara® your doctor should test for tuberculosis. stelara® may increase your risk of cancer. always tell your doctor if you have any sign of infection have had cancer, or if you develop any new skin growths. do not take stelara® if you are allergic to stelara® or any of its ingredients. alert your doctor of new or worsening problems including headaches, seizures, confusion and vision problems. these may be signs of a rare potentially fatal brain condition. serious allergic reactions can occur. tell your doctor if you or anyone in your house needs or has recently received a vaccine.

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increased blood pressure, common cold symptoms, urinary tract infection, and headache. take charge by talking to your doctor about your oab symptoms and myrbetriq. find out if you can get your first prescription at no cost by visiting myrbetriq.com president obama delivering a very blunt assessment of race relations in the united states following the deadly shootings in charleston south carolina. the president speaking on comedian mark marin's podcast says the united states has not overcome its history with racism. to make the point, the president used language that a lot of us would consider to be offensive. listen to this. >> racism. >> racism.

we are not cured of it. clearly. and it's not just a matter of it not being polite to say "nigger" in public. that's not the measure of whether racism still exists or not. it's not just a matter of overt discrimination. societies don't overnight completely erase everything that happened 200 to 300 years prior. >> let's discuss what's going on. i'm joined by bacarri sellers, a former south carolina state representative and attorney as well as cnn political commentator charles blow. bacarri, what do you think? should the president have used that word or should he have said as all of us say, the "n" word referring to that very bad world. >> no i think the president was right on point. this discussion about race has to be very very big and broad. this is complex. i think the president in utilizing that taught us all

that we are not worried about those individuals who use this derogatory term as much as we are trying to have a broader, larger discussion in the context of race. supreme a hard time understanding that we are not that far removed from the 16th street baptist church bombing. we're not that far removed from rfk's assassination, from dr. king's assassination, from the orangeburg massacre. now we're having similar shared experiences in 2015. that's the discussion we have to have and it's larger than a singular word. >> charles, what do you think? >> i think it depends on context. the president is basically making the argument that racism does not have to be articulated even in the most blunt terms, including the use of the "n" word but rather it can be structural, it can be very persistent. and he's using in the a very instructive way. and i think that context always is important both because i know that you know whether or not

you -- however you land on use of the "n" word itself it is very much the case that people use language in group that they take -- that was meant to demean them and they defame it by using it in repetition in group. so this happens -- women sometimes discuss things in ways that men should probably steer clear of. people in the lgbt community discuss issues using language that people outside of those groups would probably be best to steer clear of. this happens in religion. this happens in ethnic groups and i think that that is just a fact of how the etymology of language develops and how people appropriate damaging language in order to defang it. that's just something that happens so the president's kind of speaking in group in this moment. what shocks me is not him being instructive about the use of a word that we can not really scrub from the language, i mean i just wrote a book and i used it several times in that book because it's instructive, historical it's a damaging part of the language that must be

used in a way that is instructive. however, i'm shocked when i hear people use it when it is derogatory and the president is not the first president to do so. in the nixon tapes you hear him use it over and over again. you hear lbj using the "n" word in ways that are derogatory. that's particularly shocking because in some ways he's a civil rights hero for signing civil rights legislation but at the same time he's a racist. so when you look at people using this word. and those presidents didn't even know that that language would ever see the light of day. the president is saying it into an open mic consciously as an instructive moment. i think you have to use that context. you cannot take that part away from this conversation. >> bakari only moments ago the white house press secretary josh earnest was asked if the president regrets using that word in that podcast interview. he said the president does not regret it. all of us who have covered the

president know he is very precise with hiss language, with his words. do you believe he deliberately wanted to use that word bakari? >> yeah. i don't understand why so many people are awe-struck by this moment. the president, if i'm not mistaken used the word 14 or 15 times in "dreams of my father." so this isn't something new. this isn't something new to the conversation. but we're missing the message if we get bogged down on his use of that one term. if we look at it globally and at everything he was talking about, to mr. blow's point, he's talking about the back breaking generational systemic institutional racism that people face on a daily basis that's been highlighted in this country. we're talking about a larger issue. we're not talking about a singular word. >> and if i can dig down just a tiny bit on this. i believe he's making a point that a lot of people have tried to make which is that people try to place on to the backs of this president in six years now in

what will end up being eight years the burden of eliminating structural racism that he did not create. they want him to be the janitor and clean it up. and he is basically saying in this moment that is not the way that this sort of hate operates. no one person, no two terms can do that. it on rates over a -- over generations. it operates over centuries and it is not going to turn on a dime and it's not going to turn on one presidency, whether he is black, white, latino whatever. and i think that he's making that point and we should not miss that idea. >> the argument bakari that i've heard since this interview came to light is that it's one thing for the president to use that word repeatedly in his book that he wrote when he was a state senator or state lawmaker in illinois it's another thing to use that word publicly as president of the united states to which you say, bakari? >> well i mean i think that again, we're missing the larger point. i understand the president of

the united states using the term but he has an awesome responsibility on his shoulders. this conversation we're having globally about race is happening on his watch. those nine lives that were lost on wednesday night in charleston south carolina due to a racist terrorist happened on his watch. so he has to provide leadership and context and i'm happy he's not dodging the issue. it's larger than the "n" word. this discussion the about moving the country forward. black, white, hispanic and otherwise and doing what the city of charleston has said a perfect example for, which is coming together and understanding that we've made a lot of progress but we still have a ways to go. >> charles, go ahead, give me your final thought. >> yeah i mean i just want to say -- keep saying don't get hung up on the word. look at the strucktural racism is president is talking about. if you want to be mad at something, be mad at structural race. they allow this is president to be called the "n" word online and in your twitter feed and

facebook feed on a daily basis. if you want to be upset about something, look at that. that's the structural part of that we allow as a society to happen and if you just are going to be mad about what you think may be a faux pas of decorum, a sitting president use the ago word look at all the other sitting presidents that we know of who have used that word and not in an instructive way. >> that's an excellent point. so heart breaking if you follow social media follow the twitter feeds and all of that there are still unfortunately tragically so many americans, unfortunately, who still can't come to grips with the fact that we have an african-american president, an african-american first family living in the white house. that's a serious problem out there and it's important, as the president says, to talk about it and not just sweep it under the carpet. guy, thanks very much, bakari seller charles blow appreciate it. up next, we'll get the perspective of distinguished u.s. congressman elijah cummings talking about the president's use of that "n" word the

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racial tensions in the states because of the baltimore slaughter. elijah cummings has been in the forefront in the effort to confront his state and beyond. congressman, thanks for joining us. let me get your quick reaction to this buzz that's been

generated by the president's use publicly of the "n" word. your thoughts. >> i'm not upset about it at all. i've done it myself when being instructive, as the president was doing it here. i see absolutely nothing wrong with it. i stay away from that word as much as i can, but i have used in the speeches to be instructive. and i think that's all he was trying to do. and i don't want to get distracted with that wolf particularly when there's so many other things going on and the president trying to do the things he's trying to do but, again, i'm not it at all upset about it. not surprised. >> all right, let's talk about what happened in charleston. it's really comforting. this guy, this killer wanted to start a race war and it looks like the opposite has occurred on the streets of charleston and beyond. people coming together. is that your conclusion as well. >> no doubt about it. let me express my sympathy to the family and the people of charleston the family of the

nine victims and the people of charleston and the wonderful church mother emanuel and all its members. wolf you know i'm the son of two pentecostal preachers from south carolina. as a matter of fact from manning, south carolina, in jim clyburn's district and the reaction did not surprise me. one of the things we're taught in our faith is that we can not allow hatred to overpower love. that's what love and forgiveness are part of our religion. i don't want people to mistake that with regard to making sure that we have a major problem with anybody coming into our church being welcomed into the church sitting down for an hour in dis cushion then put downes a bible and picks up a gun. there's a major problem with that and this young man again --

and i don't say his name because i think that's what he was looking for, publicity, but this young man did something awfully wrong and when we look at his manifesto and the things he talked about, clearly he had racist intent and hatred at the same time on his mind. so again, this -- but the fact is that for the families to be able to come and say "we forgive you, i think is very powerful but it does something else too. it draws people to the church. in other words, i think people have looked that the and said wait a minute if you can within hours come out and say to somebody who has murdered your loved ones that you forgive them, that religion must be very very powerful but make it clear that now we must seek justice with regard to this defendant. >> the minister congressman, that delivered this sermon at

emanuel ame yesterday made a point of expressing gratitude to the police there. listen to this. >> finally i want to say thank you to law enforcement. [ cheers and applause ] i got no problem in doing that. i want to thank them. i want to thank them. [ applause ] oh yeah. >> that was a powerful moment congressman, when the minister said that. i know you're working with the police in baltimore to heal the problem. there have been significant problems as you well know. tell us what's going on. what's the latest in your community. >> well, you know, there have been a few police officers here in baltimore who have disguised themselves on air and said we here in the midst of a slowdown and we saw our murder rate go up

substantially and we have all been very concerned about that. >> so what i'm doing is literally sitting down within the hour wolf with about 20 of our police department folks talking to them about how we can make sure that we're all on the same page. and that i want to know what they expect from the community. because, again, the community needs the police and the police need the community to resolve crime. that's always been my position. and so we're going to do that. then tomorrow i'll be meeting with the head of our police union, fop, to try to make sure that the leadership of our union and our mayor and others we have to move forward. we can not have the police on one side of the street and the community on the other talking past each other. so i'm hoping to be the bridge to bring them sergeant to that we can address the issues that we have here. >> good luck on.

that i know you've been a leader in the community in trying to make sure that this relationship between the people of baltimore and the police gets back to being strong and improve that relationship. let me wrap up congressman. we're just learning courtesy acourted to the posted currier in south korea sthak the governor nikki haley will call for the removal of the confederate flag from the statehouse grounds. south carolina. you're almost a son of the south, shall we say. what's your thoughts on this. i assume you welcome this decision by the governor. >> i welcome that. i think this is wonderful. we have got to get past these symbols that bring so much pain to a large segment of our population we have to be able the business wolf of uniting our communities and that flag sends a wrong message and its

placement on the statehouse grounds sends a wrong message. i'm trusting the members of the legislature down there in south carolina will follow the governor and two do the right thing. >> they need a two-thirds majority in the ledge dhour get it done. that may not be easy. >> this is that moment where south carolina who -- the governor has talked about south carolina being compassionate and people uniting together. i think this is taking down that flag could be the turning point to get where you say she says. i believe it will happen and i think with the leadership of my good friend jim clyburn who's been a staunch proponent of taking that flag down and the mayor, i think we'll see it. >> mayor riley has been outspoken on this as well. >> he's been great. >> as usual, thanks so much for

joining us. >> thank you. >> the shooter in that charleston church massacre didn't hide his hatred for blacks as well as other ethnic groups as well. just ahead, the racist online so-called manifesto linked to the shooter and what is being done about hate groups in america. stand by. well, we have 30 years of customer records. our cloud can keep them safe and accessible anywhere. my drivers don't have time to fill out forms. tablets. keep them all digital. we're looking to double our deliveries. our fleet apps will find the fastest route. oh, and your boysenberry apple scones smell about done. ahh, you're good. i like to bake. with at&t get up to $400 dollars in total savings on tools to manage your business. ♪ ♪ food should be good. people should dance. strawberries should sing.

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identity before murdering the nine people at the ame church in south carolina. he posted a picture of himself with guns and confederate flags. he also apparently posted a 2,000 word racist manifesto to the same site that details his frostfy philosophy of white superiority. he talks about how the trayvon martin case "awakened him." here's part of what he wrote. "black people are racially aware almost from birth but white people on average don't think about race in our daily lives and this is our problem. we need to and have to." let's talk about the role of hate groups in america. joining us is richard cohn, the president of the southern poverty law center in montgomery alabama. if you read that so-called manifesto, it sounds pretty typical of these white supremacists these hate groups in america. doesn't it? >> >>. >> the shooter might have been a high school dropout but he is a

good students of white spremty. he knows the ling co- >> and he read up on it and writes about it. >> what was intriguing is it describes his hatred of black bus then he has a chunk there where he goes after jews and goes after hispanics. how unusual is that if at all? >> many hate groups are equal opportunity haters. his comments about jewish people and hispanics are more tempered than one might see in a lot of places. the other thing is significant, if you look at tend of it he says "i might not be worth any more than a speck of dust but i'm going to do something good for society. i'm going to do something' roeic. -- heroic. he is a young man who is down and out, has no skills so what he's done is attach himself to a cause that he sees as larger

than himself and is going to do something of historic significance significance. and that's the kind of trajectory we see with these lone wolfes. >> as far as the jews are concerned about one point he says "jews may look white but the problem is that they -- somehow you have to destroy the jewish identity in order to resolve that problem. as far as hispanics are concerned, some of them look white but they are still our enemies. squots he's pretty blunt there as far as going after hispanic jews. but most of the manifesto deals with black people in the united states. what's the role of the confederate flag in all of this? >> it's a symbol that has been used by hate groups for eons. and you see it primarily in the south but you see in the other places as well. many people use it as an

expression of racial pride. one thing i think that's important to understand is you know many white people on average see race relations as a zero-sum game. if black people run, they're down. so you see this racial resentment simmering, the confederate flag displaying it is often a reflection of that resentment and i'm delighted to hear that governor haley is going to advocate to take the flag down. it's a similar fwhool is incredibly divisive. >> we're just learning that nikki haley, the governor of south carolina is going to call for the removal of that confederate flag from the state grounds and state capital in south carolina. richard cohen, thanks very much for joining us. >> thank you, wolf. still to come, for some it is the symbol of hate for others, the symbol of southern heritage and for a few gop presidential candidates it's an awkward campaign issue. their response on what to do

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. the massacre in charleston south carolina has reignited the debate over whether the confederate flag should remain on the grounds of the south carolina state capital. a little while ago, community leaders held a press conference outside the north charleston city hall to urge lawmakers to

put the flag into a relic room. the charleston "post and courier" reporting the south carolina governor nikki haley will call for the removal of the confederate flag from the statehouse grounds and sources also telling cnn that the south carolina republican senator lindsey graham, who's running for the republican presidential nomination will also call today for the flag's removal. the confederate flag is a symbol of hatred to some. it's also a symbol of southern heritage to others. what to do about it a rather tricky question for at least some republican presidential candidates. >> i think the opinion of people here in south carolina and having them work through this difficulty is much more important than politicizing it. >> what is your opinion? >> for those of us running for president, everyone is being baited with this question as if somehow that has anything do with anything whatsoever as running for president and my position is it most certainly does not. >> jeb bush noting that while he

was the governor of florida, he moved the flag to a museum. let's discuss the political ramifications of all of this with our senior political reporter nia malika henderson and gloria borger. some of these republican gloria they're treading carefully on this issue. >> they're equivocating on it and it's ridiculous. actually i disagree with mike huckabee who says it has nothing to do with running for president. actually taking a firm position on something that is important to an awful lot of people in this country has an awful lot to do with leadership and running for president. i would argue that what these candidates are doing tse kwif kating waiting if the governor of south carolina nikki haley, to come out and say this afternoon as we expect there's been a lot of reporting she might say, okay enough with this flag near the capital, put it somewhere else. but these candidates are afraid of alienating white conservative

voters. >> dana bash our chief congressional correspondent reporting lindsey graham is getting ready to say, "remove flag move it to a museum" or a relic room or whatever they want to call it. that will put pressure. you have the governor of south carolina, a republican, the senator there now calling for getting rid of that flag. it's going to put pressure on these republican candidates who are waffling to take a firm position. >> it is. and i think the question is does it put pressure on the folks in the state legislature to act. they're up for reelection, too, and worried about a primary challenge fnd f they come out and say they want to take the flag down because they're going to get a lot of calls from grass-roots die hard republicans who want to see this flag stay up there. so those are the politics that are at play here and i think one of the things that folks are trying to do now, nikki haley being one of them lindsey graham as well. they're trying to rush this through and ride the emotion of this to see if they can get to that two-thirds vote if they

call a special session, they need two-thirds vote to even call a special section to take it up and then they need a two-thirds of the vote as well to take it down. one of the interesting things in south carolina, the whole statehouse zbrounds a monument to southern history, right? the bad old days of southern history, folks like ben tillman, hi has a statue up there, he was the governor of south carolina he advocated for disenfranchising african-americans and i talked to these people who are proponents of the flag one of their fears is well, if you go after the flag, do you go after ben tillman next? the street names named after john c. calhoun? do you go after the monodwrumt that is a monument to the war dead from the civil war? so those are the raw emotions at play here. >> i also think that in a way a lot of these candidates are waiting for haley to give them permission. >> nikki haley, the governor of south carolina. >> to give them permission to say what they should have said at the outset which is that the flag has no place flying anywhere other than some kind of a museum orel lick room as you put it. . in doing so she will break the

logjam and i bet you'll find a lot of republican candidates coming out and saying well maybe she's right and we shouldn't do it. i also think there's a business consideration. we look at what happened in the state of indiana with religious liberty, right? and people threatening to boycott boycott. people threatening not to bring their business to a state that has a confederate flag flying on the statehouse grounds. they've taken it down from the dome but it's still there and i wonder that would have been -- >> nia, you've been doing reporting, also. this alleged white supremacist that was cited by the murderer in charleston south carolina having donated thousands of dollars to a handful of republicans, most want to return that money or give it away. >> nia love got a couple thousand dollars. >> the congresswoman from utah. >> she's returning that money. others have are doing the same thing. >> ted cruz rand paul.

>> some are donating to the church. so this is the uglier side of southern politics that has its roots in some ways in some of this race baiting and it has been for too long wedded to darker strains of the republican party, something that colin powell talked about so that's what we're seeing now. >> guys we'll continue the fallout, the political analysis on cnn. thanks very much. coming up, the emanuel ame church filled with hymns and hopes on sunday. i'll speak with a local reverend about the community's frame of mind and its path forward. stay with us.

s transformed it back into a place of hope. yesterday, emanuel ame church held its first services since the murderer shot and killed nine members at emanuel and churches all across the united states tried to deliver messages appealing to their congregations.- reverend george mccain is director of the public affairs for the ame zion church. reverend thank you for joining us. what did the people coming to church yesterday hope to hear? >> you just said it. the people coming to church all came looking for a message of hope. they wanted to know about survival they wanted to know about tomorrow how to make it through today but it was all

grounded in looking for a message of hope as well as a word of healing. >> tell us about these relatives. despite this tremendous loss losing their loved ones they quickly said at that bond hearing on friday they were willing to forgive this killer. tell us about that. >> well the christian experience is built on forgiveness. all of us have done something wrong. maybe it hasn't been murder. the commandment says thou shall not kill. they are christian witnesses to the effective and jesus done to us and it was in their hearts. they were clear, it was hurting them but as many of them said more thoroughly more than i forgive you, i forgive you and may god have mercy on your soul. >> reverend, take us behind the scenes in your community. what's going on in the aftermath of this horrendous horrendous

massacre? >> in the aftermath of this massacre i would say not that it was determined to be that way but i think god planned it to be that way, this is a completely different experience. people are praying. i believe some who never prayed before or haven't prayed recently have turning back to that sense of strength and inspiration. their creator, sustainer, their protector. people are bonding together. i've never seen it like this here before where blacks whites christians jews rich poor everyone has come together because they believe it has affected every home and as well as those the homeless. it's affected those that have and those that have not. how can we come together and stand together? people want to be more than just rhyme and reason. they want to be -- putting a walk to the talk. they want an answer that is going to be sustaining. they want a difference to be made and they are willing to be made part of that experience.

lord make me different so i can help make the difference. >> when members of your congregation reverend come to you and ask you the age-old question how can god allow these horrible things to happen to good people what do you say to them? >> robert schuler wrote that book what happens when bad things happen to good people? it's all in god's divine plan. we saw things that happened in the bible that wouldn't go the way we want it to go but why is this child in this situation? did his parents sin? did he sin? no. we trust and we believe that out of this out of this and then after this something glorious will come. not just for the holy spirit or the emanuel ame church but for everybody that has experienced this across this nation. we've got prayer vigils going on across the nation.

new york greensboro, north carolina ame, methodist nominations were just here at the same venue on june approximate3rd banding together trying to make sure that we have a constant and relevant effect and pastor pinckney entertained -- hosted that. >> yeah. i remember that. harold kushner wrote that book when bad things happen to good people. i remember reading that years ago and my dad having read that book. he pointed out to me you know what son, god works in mysterious ways. we don't understand god but we have to keep ongoing. >> absolutely. >> reverend thank you for joining us. reverend george mckain. >> thank you very much. that's it for me. i'll be back at 5:00 p.m. in "the situation room." more news right after a quick break. we do?

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